Did Obama Refuse To Aid Our Men In Benghazi?

By: streiff (Diary) | October 27th, 2012 at 07:28 PM |

RESIZE: AAA

In the month and a half since our consulate in Benghazi was sacked and our ambassador and three other staffers killed the Obama regime is no closer to presenting a coherent, truthful narrative of what happened before, during, and after the incident than it was when it uttered its first deliberate lies and misdirections on September 12.

Right now we are being treated to the vision of the highest level of the ongoing criminal enterprise that governs us playing the equivalent of a game of musical chairs.

About a week ago, the political branches of the regime decided to finger the intelligence services as the culprits. We’ve been told over and over how there just wasn’t sufficient intelligence provided to either anticipate the attack or to determine the identities of the attackers. Of course, we now know that both those stories are unmitigated falsehoods.

The newest question is who allowed the four men to be killed in Benghazi, or conversely who forbade any attempt to save their lives. This decision seems to reach all the way into the Oval Office.

What we now know is that the attack was monitored, in real time, in the State Department, the Pentagon, the White House, and at Africom HQ in Germany. We know there was a Predator drone overhead and we know the consulate provided live audio feed of the attack until the end.

An important fact is buried here.

Predators don’t just magically appear on the scene. They have to be launched and they have to have a mission when they are launched. A Predator UAV has a range of 675 miles with a max speed of 135mph. The UAV almost certainly had to have been launched from the US facility at Signonella in Sicily.

This means that the UAV was launched over three hours before the attack began and the operation order issued some time before launch. This implies that hours before the attack was launched there was sufficient concern about something in Benghazi that a UAV was tasked to be on station.

The administration is also fond of referring to the attack being at night. While that is true, what they are trying to do is create the illusion that the attack happened in the middle of the night in Washington. It didn’t. The attack began around 2pm EST, right in the middle of the duty day with everyone who was needed to make the required decisions on hand.

President Obama met with Defense Secretary Leon Panetta and Vice President Biden in the Oval Office at 5 p.m. ET, a little more than an hour after the onset of the attack. The Pentagon began moving military assets:
– Eight from Special Operations were sent from Tripoli.

– A “FAST team” (Fleet Anti-terrorism Security team) of Marines from Rota, Spain, were sent to guard the Embassy in Tripoli.
– A Special Operations force was moved from central Europe to Sigonella Air Base in southern Italy, just 480 miles from Benghazi.
– F-16s and Apache helicopters remained parked and unused at Aviano Air Base in northern Italy.
– Two Navy destroyers already in the Mediterranean Sea were moved off the coast of Libya on the day of the attack but were never used.
Asked why the U.S. military did not do more, Defense Secretary Leon Panetta said Thursday the first rule in such a situation is not to deploy troops into harm’s way unless there is a clear picture of what is happening.

One doesn’t know what to make of Panetta’s statement. You never have a “clear picture” of an evolving combat operation. This is what Clausewitz referred to as “friction” and the “fog of war.” It seems that a reasonable observer would conclude that real time video feed plus real time audio communications with the people in the consulate provided as close to a “clear picture” as possible in the absence of a Vulcan Mind Meld with the terrorist leader.

So we have a rescue force staged in Sigonella. We have the people on the ground begging for help. And we seem to have had an AC-130 gunship in near proximity to the action. And a decision was made by someone that caused the death of these four men just as surely as any action by a Libyan terrorist:

Fox News has learned from sources who were on the ground in Benghazi that an urgent request from the CIA annex for military back-up during the attack on the U.S. consulate and subsequent attack several hours later on the annex itself was denied by the CIA chain of command — who also told the CIA operators twice to “stand down” rather than help the ambassador’s team when shots were heard at approximately 9:40 p.m. in Benghazi on Sept. 11.

Former Navy SEAL Tyrone Woods was part of a small team who was at the CIA annex about a mile from the U.S. consulate where Ambassador Chris Stevens and his team came under attack. When he and others heard the shots fired, they informed their higher-ups at the annex to tell them what they were hearing and requested permission to go to the consulate and help out. They were told to “stand down,” according to sources familiar with the exchange. Soon after, they were again told to “stand down.”

Woods and at least two others ignored those orders and made their way to the consulate which at that point was on fire. Shots were exchanged. The rescue team from the CIA annex evacuated those who remained at the consulate and Sean Smith, who had been killed in the initial attack. They could not find the ambassador and returned to the CIA annex at about midnight.

At that point, they called again for military support and help because they were taking fire at the CIA safe house, or annex. The request was denied. There were no communications problems at the annex, according those present at the compound. The team was in constant radio contact with their headquarters. In fact, at least one member of the team was on the roof of the annex manning a heavy machine gun when mortars were fired at the CIA compound. The security officer had a laser on the target that was firing and repeatedly requested back-up support from a Spectre gunship, which is commonly used by U.S. Special Operations forces to provide support to Special Operations teams on the ground involved in intense firefights.

Pay special attention to the last graf. The security officer was painting a target with a laser designator. You don’t do that unless the AC-130 is close enough to acquire the target.

Not long after Jennifer Griffin filed the report quoted above, CIA Director David Petraeus issued a statement:

“No one at any level in the CIA told anybody not to help those in need; claims to the contrary are simply inaccurate. ”

What it doesn’t say practically screams at the reader. He is clearly saying that someone denied help but it wasn’t anyone in the CIA. He doesn’t even deny that the CIA passed on the bad news.

Now the White House has said it wasn’t them:

The White House on Saturday flatly denied that President Barack Obama withheld requests for help from the besieged American compound in Benghazi, Libya, as it came under on attack by suspected terrorists on September 11th.

“Neither the president nor anyone in the White House denied any requests for assistance in Benghazi,” National Security Council spokesman Tommy Vietor told Yahoo News by email.

The White House statement really doesn’t mean anything. First and foremost, this White House lies just to keep in practice. They’ll lie about what cereal Obama had for breakfast so lying about something akin to manslaughter is hardly unsurprising. As we parse the statement, keep in mind the White House doesn’t actually command military forces. Any order from the White House would be relayed by way of the Secretary of Defense who is increasingly looking like the guy with no chair nearby as the music stops.

Panetta’s weaselly “clear picture” statement gives the impression of a man with a guilty conscience. He is the guy who exercised command authority over all the resources available to attempt a rescue and he is the guy who would have told them to not respond. But the idea that the President of the United States just abruptly left the situation room and did no participate in the decision is ludicrous on its face.

The facts now seem fairly clear. Forces were positioned to effect a rescue of at least some of the men who are now dead. An order was given by the Secretary of Defense to not launch a rescue attempt either by the reaction force staged in Sicily or by an AC-130 gunship orbiting over head. The White House had video feed and audio feed available presenting them with a clear picture of the situation on the ground. And the President of the United States decided four dead Americans was a small price to pay for preserving the political fiction of the Arab Spring.

COMMENTS

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beach91

This is incredibly sad to me and the lack of leadership in the white house is pathetic. I cannot believe America elected this person to the office and am embarrassed for this country. I hope a big flushing sound occurs on Nov 6th!
DerKrieger

This administration, and Liberalism in general, is a disgrace. An administration that loved this country would have annihilated the attackers and then dared anyone to complain about it. US interests should always be placed above the interests of any their nation, something this traitorous administration clearly doesn’t believe.

I can’t wait for the behind the scenes books when Obama is kicked out of our house. They should prove to be very revealing and confirming.
ctredstater

Far worse than Watergate. Dead American heroes. A cover-up involving the President, The VP, the Secretary of State, Susan Rice, the Press Secretary, etc. One of the most craven acts in American history – to try and prop up a failing presidency and gain re-election by brazenly and repeatedly playing “the video card” – at the UN, internationally by Hillary Clinton, etc.

.

Because I believe in God, I believe that a type of justice will occur here. I have to believe that this will be part of what will sweep this administration out of office – and give the country a sense of relief and renewal. My heart breaks for the family members of Ty Woods and the others who lost their lives. Woods will go down in history as a hero of this generation. I pray for those directly effected, and believe, as Reagan did, in the wisdom of the American electorate.
beach91

The truth will get out and obama will be on the hook for this. He is a complete dolt and truth will prevail.
fightnright

“They’ll lie about what cereal Obama had for breakfast so lying about something akin to manslaughter is hardly unsurprising. ”

There is no functional or moral difference to Leftists between a lie or the truth if it is in service to The Cause. The basis of political correctness is that any statement that furthers the cause is real, and any statement that discredits the cause is false.
Ausonius

“But the idea that the President of the United States just abruptly left
the situation room and did not participate in the decision is ludicrous
on its face.”

Sorry, no, this idea is not ludicrous. We are talking about BIG BRObama, a man who often voted “Present” instead of Yay or Nay. I can easily believe that he voted “Not Present” and foisted all responsibility off on Panetta or someone else and left the room to shoot hoops or hit a bucket of golf balls.
barleycorn

Excellent summation. It looks like Leon Panetta is in line to go under the bus next. The question is, will he go quietly?
rbdwiggins

The brazen attempt by the administration to provide plausable deniablity for President Obama by using SecDef Panetta as a cut-out won’t hold water. Since Ambassador Stevens held the equivalent rank of a Four Star General, the Commander-in-Chief is the only person that can make the decision to go, or to stand down.

It’s my understanding that the transfer of SA-7′s left behind after the fall of Muammar Gaddafi from Benghazi to Turkey, and subsequently to Syria, played a role in the decision. (H/T Catherine Herridge)
westcoastpatriette

I don’t buy that this was simply incompetence. It smacks of planned assistance from within U.S. intelligence and or military command. Obama has a way of intentionally sabotaging American goals.and tacitly assisting enemies. Despicable. But with so many sleazy operatives working with Obama, how will we ever get to the whole truth? This dizzying pass the buck and changing of stories is pathetic and infuriating. I hope whistleblowers on the ground come forward with enough evidence to indict those responsible. I am sick of government malfeasance being overlooked and ignored.
rbdwiggins

The CIA, DOD and State have a case of whistles on hand, and the box is emptying at breck-neck speed. The career officials at the agency and both departments will not go down with this sinking ship.
jpkoch

The President will now have an impossible time getting people to believe he and his staff were out of the loop. As a matter of fact it appears his WH staff spent more time worrying about how to spin this disaster (ie the U-Tube video) than they did giving guidance to the people in Lybia. The question remains, why would Panetta order the “Stand Down” when the President was in the loop? In the end, it is the President’s decision and not Panetta’s. That’s the way things look from here.
The responsibility remains with the President irregardless of whether he was in the WH Situation Room. If he did in fact leave it to “others” and went about business as usual the President is guilty of gross dereliction of duty at best, or criminal negligence at worst.
But, this information now puts the President in the same league as RM Nixon (all though Nixon’s crime didn’t involve dead ambassadors and SEAL operatives). He, along with his Press Secretary, The VP, Sec of State Clinton, and Ambassador Rice flat out lied to the people for over 2 weeks. I don’t know what they were telling Congress; but, the PR disaster of this tragedy is huge. And the MSM refuses to even recognize this.
If any more daming information that comes to light will cause a collapse of this administration of historical proportions. It will also be impossible for the MSM not to be severely damaged.
This is an unbelievable situation. To make matters even more dire. we now have a situation where either the Muslim Brotherhood or Al Qaida now have firm holds of significant territory in North Africa. Tunesia, Algeria, and Morrocco are now in danger. It isn’t inconcievable that Jihadists could be at the gates of Gibraltar in a few years.
skorrent1

The last para stretches things a bit. We don’t know the outcome of actions not taken. For that matter, we don’t know the precise arrival time of the drone at the mission. Nevertheless, with due regard for expressions of anger and disgust, the fact that no formal effort was made to assist Americans under attack, nor even to exact retribution, is simply inexcusable.
raginpatriot

I just posted a diary on this (“Painting lasers in Banghazi”):

Multiple reports are stating that the victims of Obama’s stand down orders were “painting” targets around the consulate in Banghazi. Military personnel in a defensive position at risk of being overrun by superior forces WOULD NOT be wasting time and limited battery power to “paint” targets unless they were under the impression that there were aircraft on scene, or about to be, that could place ordinance on the “painted” target. AND unless someone told them that “help was on the way” and/or “imminent” they would not have just assumed that such aircraft were on route at all, much less close enough to take advantage of “painted” targets.

THIS AT A MINIMUM IMPLIES (AND I SUBMIT ABSOLUTELY SCREAMS) THAT SOMEONE IN THE CHAIN OF COMMAND TOLD THESE PEOPLE THAT HELP WAS ON THE WAY AND/OR IMMINENT.

IN TURN THIS MEANS THAT PERHAPS THERE WAS SUCH HELP ON THE WAY, AND THEN IT WAS TOLD TO REVERSE COURSE AND ”STAND DOWN” … OR FROM THE BEGINNING THESE BRAVE AMERICANS WERE DELIBERATELY DECEIVED BY THEIR SUPERIORS WHO ARE SUPPOSED TO HAVE THEIR BACKS, AND INSTEAD STABBED THEM IN THE BACK!
gnelson

If this doesn’t fit the definition of “high crimes and misdemeanors” as reason for impeachment, I don’t know what does. Nixon was impeached for Watergate; next to the Benghazi fiasco, Watergate was a tea party. Obama should be impeached, then tried and jailed for his crimes against humanity in general and America in particular.
Dave_A

Likely waiting to see what happens in 2 weeks….

If Romney wins….
evilbloggerlady

http://evilbloggerlady.blogspot.com/2012/10/there-was-ac-130-gunship-over-benghazi.html It was either willful or incompetence. Take your pick.
rbdwiggins

The election notwithstanding. They’re not waiting for two weeks. They’re coming out of the woodwork so fast that Catherine Herridge can hardly keep pace. Congressional Republicans can only dream of having as many sources within the bowels of the federal bureaucracy.
veritaseequitas

Every time I read about the unfolding events in Benghazi and realize that the Americans who died there were betrayed by those at the highest levels of government, it makes me nauseous. These “leaders” whom America has trusted with our national security are nothing more than self-serving charlatans. It starts at the top with Barack Obama and goes down through the ranks. I wish there were a way to immediately make them vacate their positions – something akin to locking them out of their computers, cleaning out their desks and changing the locks on the doors. They are a shameful embarrassment to our country, and history will remember them as the craven and immoral individuals they are.
tankertodd

The statement that “the first rule is not to deploy troops into harm’s way unless there is a clear picture of what is happening” is 100% antithetical to the military professional ethos. As I think on my military training way, way back in the long, long ago I can’t recall that ever being remotely the case. For example, we trained extensively in movement to contact, which is exactly that: drive in a certain direction and find the enemy. You don’t know where they are, how many of them there are, or how they’re situated. You may catch them unawares or you may drive straight into a battalion-sized ambush that would make the famous Iraqi Road of Death look like a minor scrape on the interstate.

The entire mission of the cavalry is to find the bad guys. If our policy was to never deploy troops into harm’s way then the cavalry wouldn’t exist as a type of military organization. The cav rides way out, screening the main body, preventing it from being caught unawares. Our scout platoons in training died more times than the average Chicago voter. Their whole purpose in life (and death) was to scout way ahead of safety, looking and listening for bad guys. There are a lot of wonderful but slightly crazed scouts in Stetsons and spurs who are chortling at the SecDef’s absurd statement.

Custer seems to be the source of the quotable order to “ride to the sound of the guns.” That doesn’t seem to fit either. Panetta is either lying or is grossly unqualified to be the Secretary of Defense.
inperlmuttersdistrict

While I agree with the sense of what I believe you are getting at. We shouldn’t lose focus as to the circumstances of the issue at hand.

The administration acted in an undeclared war and bombed the country where Benghazi is located back to the stone ages. (So to your point – we did annihilate them and dared everyone to complain about it.) After which this administration used the State Department to run guns through said country to arm a group of rebels – who have previously declared themselves to be our sworn enemies – in order to covertly over throw a neighboring sovereign state. Thus in doing so destabilizing the entire region of the world and thereby increasing the mortal threat to our closest ally in the area.

What we are witness to is a pattern of destabilizing communities across the face of the planet. Obama has done almost exactly the same thing in Mexico, Egypt, Syria, Libya, the south Pacific, and I would argue in many communities throughout the United States. As regrettable and sad as this particular case is, it is just another data point in a long list of examples of how this president has acted in complete negligent dereliction of the duties of the office of which the people have appointed him to.

In short – this is our fault. We have the government we have elected.
DerKrieger

I heard Rush relay a conspiracy theory that someone had e-mailed him. Don’t know if there’s any truth to it but with the new info regarding the repeated orders to stand own, I could almost believe it.

According to the e-mail Rush received, the goal of the attack was to kidnap the ambassador and then exchange him for the blind sheik. Supposedly Obama wanted to hand the sheik over to Egypt but with the election approaching he couldn’t simply hand him over so he, and his lieutenants, cooked up the kidnapping scheme with the Muslim Brotherhood. They were to take the ambassador and give him back in trade for the sheik.

So, when the former SEALs wanted to help the ambassador they were told to stand down so as to not screw up the kidnapping plan.

Since they refused to stand own they blew the plan and wound up getting everyone killed.

May not be what actually happened but it’s at least believable knowing Obama.
jpkoch

Ride to the sounds of the guns originated with Fredrich the Great. Otherwise, you made some outstanding points.
runner12

I believe that the families of the men who died and the American people are owed the truth. We all know that this administration repeatedly lied about what happened in Benghazi. Now there is clear evidence that they refused aid to these same men in their hour of need. It is time for the Obama administration to be exposed for the dishonest, corrupt, liars that they are. All it takes is one courageous whistleblower to bring down this house of cards.
jpkoch

I think the author made it clear that for the drone to be on station at the time of the action it had to have been launched at least 2 hours before hand, as the closest American base that can launch the drones was in Italy. We do know the drone had images of the action from the beginning. In other words, military and civil administrators had to know something was amiss several hours before hand. In that case, Panetta’s explaination falls apart immediatly.
kipling

The current administration is worse than the Carter administration. At least Jimmy Carter attempted to rescue the hostages. Obama could not even be bothered. Panetta is an incompetent political hack. It is time for the whole lot to go.
jpkoch

Another rumour floating around is that Stevens was facillitating a gun running operation out of Lybia in order to supply Syrian rebels with everything from ammo to SA-7s that are currently in Lybian warehouses. Those rebels are Al Qaida. That is, Obama has been arming Al Qaida in both Lybia and Syria. Stevens had just met with Turkish intelligence leaders who would take posession of the weapons and then transport them to Syria. Rumours abound when the government covers things up. Of course if the rumours are ture, the President and several of his minions would be going to jail if the story came to light.
DerKrieger

But why then the orders to stand down? How does that fit?
kipling

Panetta will crawl under the bus willingly. But it will not end there.
Dave_A

All of the above indicates there was a ‘Something Else’ going on in Lybia at the time.

AC130s are not common assets (eg, we don’t have alot, they are special-ops aircraft)… While I was in Afghanistan, I saw one used ONCE (my unit was called in after the fact, to do a follow-on mission once the ‘special’ types were done)… To contrast, other air assets were a ‘ask and ye shall receive’ sort of thing – there was generally ‘something’ flying & armed to the teeth somewhere in the area…

Similarly, drones are very, very slow moving aircraft… They take a while to get where they were going & are rather valuable assets…

Now, I’m not a high-ranking kind of guy, but from a ‘had boots on the ground at one time’ perspective, I’d say that the aircraft discussed here were diverted from ‘something else’ that the DOD/CIA were doing in the area…

A ‘fast response’ would have been fighters from Italy, or from a carrier if we had one in the Med at the time…

This was the remnants of some other op, re-tasked…. The question is, IF there was an AC130 in the area, why didn’t they engage (either in support, or immediate retaliation) – and who gave the order not to… Also, was the drone unarmed (Predator-A or Global Hawk)? Armed but not cleared to fire? Formerly armed, and re-tasked after it had already expended it’s ordnance?
Dave_A

Undeclared war is abjectly Constitutional… There is no Constitutional requirement TO declare war, only a requirement that Congress do it IF it is to be done.

And Ronald Reagan also bombed Benghazi & Tripoli, over the German disco-bombing…. Also without a declaration of war.

Qaddafi’s regime supported Al Queda against us in Iraq, and had the blood of American Citizens on their hands from the 80s… Why do you think he was so ‘cooperative’ after 03? He knew that he would be another easy target, if he didn’t throw us some bones…

We are better off with him gone… And the Libyan people seem to agree & actually ARE grateful to us for the act… This is a MAJOR point – the Libyan people themselves (civillians) are, to date, the ONLY people to retaliate for the Consulate attack (said retaliation against the Jihadis was an actual spontaneous demonstration, btw – and an explicitly pro-American one at that).
Dave_A

Panetta will wait out the election…

Since Romney will likely appoint someone else as SecDef (My personal vote is Gen (Ret) McCrystal)…. It doesn’t much matter…

There will be too much going on after Obama is out of office, to engage in investigations… Too much to get done…

Now, if Obama wins, then Issa will probably grab this ball & run with it all day long…
The_Rebel

The Carter analogy is quite apt here. By this time next week, I expect Obama to get much the same news from his internal pollster as Jimmy Carter got from Pat Caddell in 1980.
kipling

Panetta’s fate depends on how desperate Obama gets in the final days before the election. No matter what happens, Panetta is done as a political operative. Unless he implicates Obama as the final word in denying the request for help, no one will touch him with a ten foot pole. If Obama wins re-election, Panetta will be the fall guy in an attempt to bring the issue to a close.

I agree that there will be much to do in the event of a Romney victory; however, the deaths of four Americans – including an ambassador – caused by the negligence of an administration is simply too much to sweep under the rug. The new administration owes the families and the American people an impartial investigation.

There are much better choices for SecDef than McCrystal. The SecDef should not be a former member of the military but a civilian who can transcend the inter-service rivalry and force the military to conform to the objectives set by the administration.
kipling

Two references to Clausewitz in two separate posts – are you bucking for Colonel, streiff? I had the same thought when I read Panetta’s “clear picture” comment. The only way it could have been clearer was if he had a script. The real problem is that Obama did not have the brass to make the gutsy call and save our people.
gunnyg2002

Panetta is a traitor as well as a far left twerp. He was unqualified to run he CIA, he is unqualified to run the DoD, and in the end, may he end up in prison with Obama and Eric Witholder as cellies.
jamesmpratt

Well developed and written.
shermantank

Typical Obama-speak. Like the tourist t-shirts with fingers pointing in opposite directions, “I’m with stupid.” The guy in the WH, Mr. Cool, is a sociopath, devoid empathy, devoid any feeling for human life, devoid any understanding what his policies have done to Americans across this America. Like that Seal’s father said, he “wants to know who killed my son!” Yes, the Nation too, wants to know who killed your son, AND, who in the WH allowed your son to die. Hillary Clinton has a lot to answer for, and everyone allowing this idiot in the oval office to continue his own personal brand of horror on us, should be held accountable as well.
inperlmuttersdistrict

Interesting… I’m not sure I would consider the highest law of the land as abjectly. I’m not sure I would consider a single military response to an unprovocated military action as waging war or even an act of war.

It is common in most nations to have factions. We have many here in the US, for example – democrats and republicans. It is common that factions within a state will not have or act in cohesion without a structured government in place. So I’m not optimistic that the entire civilian population of Libya is all too happy with us although I am sure some percentage certainly are. This is obviously the case … Some of the people in Libya were shooting at us to cause the pictures we see above.

To stay on topic, Obama engaged in a prolonged and sustained attack lasting much longer than a single bombing raid in Libya. It has destabilized the country. We are witness to the resulting chaos from that action. Libya is one of many countries that Obama has done this to. Obama has – throughout this period – lied about the facts regarding his actions in the matter. And I find it somewhat interesting that George Soros publicly made references to Qaddafi in the past tense well in advance of our governments actions in the area.
inperlmuttersdistrict

Agreed – I’m rather bullish on the stocks of whistle manufactures right now.
Dave_A

My declaration of war comments were in-re the original ‘lead-from-behind’ campaign.

Based on a literal reading of the Constitution, that campaign was A-OK, because the Constitution does not require a declaration of war for anything other than the quartering of troops in civilian homes.

Libya has gone from a state-sponsor of terror (Both in providing foreign-fighters for AQI, and directly carrying out terrorism via it’s intelligence agencies in the 80s) to a headless-chicken…. Basically what Iraq would be right now if we had caught Saddam in early 03 and pulled out…

Obama’s strategy is flawed, but the world IS a better place without Qaddafi, and the Libyans are actually grateful to us for eliminating that menace…

The Benghazi attack was done by a terror group that existed prior to Qaddafi’s fall, and likely would have done the attack even if he was still in power…
Dave_A

I don’t know – I may be biased, but after a succession of ‘whiz-kids’ running DoD – Rumsfeld & Gates in perticular…

A more conventional leader is needed… Someone who actually understands what different elements can and cannot do…

As opposed to the whiz-bang ‘Green Berets & Smart Bombs – cut everything else’ view that’s prevailed at DoD recently….
pigfish

I wrote a speculation piece about this on the 21st of Sept. I reiterate, these guys were abandoned!!! They were sacrificed by the administration. As Harry Reid would say… “Prove me wrong!”

Imagine the hours Oblunderer would have to put in, to campaign, collect money, and do his job all at the same time if a real shooting battle broke out in Libya. Too many conflicts of interest here mates!!! The lives of his countrymen are a small price to pay for his reelection as far as he is concerned.

I see this as a pure political percentage move. Deal with it after the elections, if you get caught. And with the Centralized media covering for you, what is the likelihood? With Mitt’s numbers up and the possibility of a real investigation becoming imminent, the rats are scurrying off the ship and this stuff is leaking cause no one wants to be the bag man for this one. Those leaks are probably right from Mrs. Clinton’s office. She too has ambition and as she has indicated, she is stepping down in January, regardless who wins in November.

There is one other item worth mentioning here. The authoritarian type command structure which Obama would love to emulate, with their centralized power models don’t allow for commanders to make political decisions on the fly. Thinking that the President was not informed is contrary to all his leanings and his behavior. This is an imperial presidency. Webs of lies and scapegoats must be coordinated if the system is to function. The play book is blame and lie about losses and take full credit for victories. Everyone in the administration pulls plays from the book. No one steps out of line. The chain of command is therefore very important to the centralized power model and that is what Obama supports. The man never talks individualism. That is unless he is blaming someone!

Don’t think for a moment that he was unaware of the situation.

Over the past 4 years I believe that I have heard very few “truths” coming from this man’s mouth. When he said in a recent debate, that this was his responsibility, I think he may have actually told the truth for once!!! Hell, he was off teleprompter!
sengokunadeko14

It was so weird to see this issue mostly ignored in a debate that was supposed to be all about foreign policy. Romney should have gone on the attack then.
trutexan

“Predators don’t just magically appear on the scene.” Prescicely. I’ve been asking co-workers since we first heard of the drone, “Who put the drone there, because somebody did.”

Last year I had the privilege of taking a tour of the “Drone School” at Randolph Air Force Base in San Antonio, Texas. The unclassified portions of the school we were allowed to see were facinating. I learned that drone pilots are already seasoned trained pilots in the US Air Force. When they are accepted to the drone program, they attend an actual FAA school in Colorado so they learn the rules and ropes of flying in the civilian world. We were told there are 12 drone sites in the US that fly these things all over the world, the closest to Randolph is near Houston. Those sites are manned on 12-hours shifts with a pilot and navigator who is usually an enlisted troop. Due to a 4-second time delay with satellites, drone pilots at the launching and landing location handle that portion of each mission and after the drone is in the air, there is a “hand off” of sorts to the pilots back in the US until it’s time to land and then the hand-off takes place again to bring the drone safely to the ground. The time the drone can fly is determined by its size and fuel capacity but some can fly 20-22 hours at a time (if I recall correctly). It’s not unusual for pilots in the US to change shifts while a drone is still in the air. It is the enlisted troop who relays lasar site info to approaching air artillary. Oh, and these individual have TS clearances and are forbidden from discussing anything they do at the office or risk having their clearance stripped from them, discharge, and never finding a job again to feed their families. They didn’t tell us that last bit on the tour but after serving 28 years in the USAF, I know the drill.
And now it seems the Admiral in charge of the US fleet in the Mediterranean has been removed due to a bad judgement decision of which we are not being told. He better get out of the way of that bus.
streiff

I think that is wrong in most every regard. If you consider waging war without a declaration of war you have effectively declared most of our history to be unconstitutional. Both George Washington and John Adams waged wars without a declaration of war. The president manifestly has the authority to do so and if Congress doesn’t like it they can impeach or they can withdraw funding. No one outside Ron Paul’s bumflossers believes a president can’t commit troops to combat.

We are obviously not better off with Qaddafi gone. Qaddafi was not only providing us very useful intel on al Qaeda he was working hard to suppress them in the Maghreb and in sub Saharan Africa. He wasn’t a good guy and he was doing what he was doing out of enlightened self interest but the number of time al Qaeda sacked our diplomatic facilities in Libya under Qaddafi = zero.

I find it utterly astonishing that anyone can look at either Egypt or Libya or Tunisia and say we are better off with radical islamist regimes holding the whip hand than we were last year. Just freakin unbelievable.
streiff

Don’t know how you come to that conclusion. Sigonella is 435 air miles from Benghazi, not a big distance. To be diverted from something else you have to posit what the something else is. In particular the drone would have had to be within a very short distance of Benghazi as it was on station there when the attack started. This is why I think it is pretty obvious that it was put on station in Benghazi as a direct response to the intel reports that an attack might be coming. The AC-130 could, theoretically, have been transiting the area en route to Mali or some place in that region and been diverted. I think it much more likely, given that the AC-130 didn’t allegedly arrive until the consulate was smoking rubbish and the CIA station under attack that it was deployed for the purpose of aiding the people in Benghazi. It is only 1.5 hrs from Sigonella to Benghazi for an AC-130.
Ausonius

Proof that the MSM is ignoring this scandal can be seen by what e.g. NBC is showing on “Today” this morning: at 8:30 A.M. E.S.T. the stories are: Hurricane Sandy, followed by 5 minutes on an obese dachshund, followed by another story on a collector of classic toys.

The CBS website does have a story about the Libyan witnesses to the attack, but nothing specifically about who called for a “stand-down” of the rescue during the chaos.

Zero about it on the ABC news website.

FOX News of course is touting the story since they are airing a Special Report on it at 3:00 P.M. and at 10:00 P.M. today.
fightnright

Last night I mentioned the dynamics of the MSM blackout of Benghazi: http://www.redstate.com/2012/10/26/monday-morning-quarterbacks-bother-poor-leon-panetta/#comment-694262856

It’s disturbing to realize how much would be hidden from the American electorate if not for Fox News, the Internet and talk radio. Here near the NJ coast, I’m wondering how the coming storm will affect Fox coverage of the election, especially if there are widespread and/or long-term power outages along the Atlantic seaboard.

Even Fox usually does local 24/7 coverage of major weather events – what we ~don’t~ need right now is another window of opportunity for left-wing media to seize upon in the final week of the campaign…
raginpatriot

Good question, since she appears to be the de facto POTUS.
msctex

At some point, gross incompetence on the part of a politician or President has got to become criminal, as it does for a lawyer or doctor, where a provable tort or damage of whatever kind has taken place. All we are seeing here is their fundamental mindset applied to military matters. There is no situation — none — where if allowed to think about it long enough, their response will not be passive inaction. None. They will always arrive at “do nothing” as their safest, most pragmatic response, because it is they themselves that are always their primary concern.
jerseygalnny

Excellent commentary, and list of events! I applaud those in Congress who are demanding answers now. To have a ‘stand down’ order three times is appalling. I am not given to conspiracy theories, but wow…in the aftermath of this, they made the claim that it was too dangerous for the FBI to get in and investigate, but CNN slips in and finds a diary? So now, what, if any, evidence, were they trying to hide? It is just a question, and a feeling in the pit of my stomach… I posted this on FR http://fundamentalrefounding.ning.com/forum/topics/obama-still-lying-he-knew-within-minutes-drone-video-is-damaging along with many related stories about this.

Well said also, at the end, and I agree. Politically, he needed the narrative things were much safer, much more stable across the Mideast and northern Africa. The media may ignore this, and the mainstream is, but ‘we the people’ are well aware, and are voting out the incompetence and ineptitude of this ‘president.’
paladin1

And now today, in the Washington Times: http://www.washingtontimes.com/blog/robbins-report/2012/oct/28/general-losing-his-job-over-benghazi/
Are we ever to be rid of this troublesome President? I think we are, come November 6!
jerseygalnny

I agree.
spinoneone

Don’t forget that the WH Staff has just about as much authority within the Administration as the President him/herself. They “speak in his name and with his words” so whatever they tell people farther down the chain of command is accepted immediately as bona fide and “truth.” So, if 0′s ‘Rasputin’ in the form of Valery Jarrett told someone at any leadership level that military support was not appropriate, that military effort would have been stopped immediately. It would also be utterly reasonable to assume that 0 simply told his staff to “handle it” while he prepared for his Vegas sojourn.
paladin1

And also, from the Washington Times: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/oct/22/the-real-reason-behind-benghazigate/
If there is any truth to this, no wonder the White House is scrambling to lie, decieve, obstruct, and cover up this debacle and these calculated deaths of Americans. They cannot afford to allow this out before the election if they hope to have any hope of surviving Nov. 6.
willopine

Obama put more effort into saving Big Bird than he put into saving the 4 Americans that died in Benghazi
bk

I’ve come to believe that Obama so feared images of any collateral damage in the last month of his reelection campaign that he was willing to sacrifice these guys on the ground – especially when there was a convenient excuse they could use to explain it away.

That really explains everything. He was unwilling to take any chance of video popping up of some dead Libyan kids that he could not cover up. Trying to get reelected trumped all else.
Tbone

Ya know Dave, it is your type of head up the butt intellect that has the Country so screwed up.
texfella

Now I’m reading that there was an AC-130 gunship orbiting the consulate at the time, and they refused permission to engage- Outrageous!!!
westcoastpatriette

Not one word on Benghazi on Meet The Press this morning with the exception of Carly Fiorina bringing it up while the discussion was supposed to be focused on economic strategies of the presidential campaigns. She was promptly cut off by anchor David Gregory and told they would be discussing that later but later never came. Disgusting.
benson1

The last paragraph describes it clearly and the last sentence says why it was done.

This regime and it’s enablers in the press and Congress (of both parties) is not just corrupt. They are criminal and devoid of any empathy for the suffering and death they’ve caused. Not just in this instance but the policies and edicts foisted on Americans which have turned many peoples lives upside down and for the worst. The punishment needs to be more than just job loss.
benson1

Congressional Republicans with few exceptions have been enablers instead of protectors of the American people and the Constitution. Until we change the House leadership I expect they will let this all die a slow death rather than indict anyone for anything. Their counting on the usual American amnesia after they think just one election has solved the problem. Ridding ourselves of Obama is only the beginning.
joecurran57

obama knew. There’s no way he didn’t know. I agree this is much, much
worse than Watergate. Nobody died during Watergate and yet Nixon was forced to
resign.
If obama had one shred of honor and decency in him he’d do the honorable thing
now and resign. Resign immediately. He can’t blame George W Bush for this one. Whether he actually made the decision not to send help or not he’s at the top, the responsibility lies with him and him alone.
It’s been obvious for almost four years that this man is grossly
incompetent, weak and unfit to lead the greatest country in the world. He needs
to resign. Now.
benson1

It will take more than whistle blowers, it will take an active enraged electorate willing to clean house in the next election after this one.
rbdwiggins

benson1, my advice to you is simple. Organize and fund your own steering committee to find like-minded Republicans who are willing to sacrifice and put their lives, their families, their careers, their livelihood and their fortunes on the line to go Washington in order to effect the change you desire. Then work tirelessly to raise the funds needed to get them elected. Otherwise, you’re just blowing smoke on a thread that is discussing the national security failures of the Obama Administration which clearly and directly lead to the death of an American ambassador and three other brave Americans.
skorrent1

We do know that security cameras at the mission provided (ground) pictures of the attack as it was unfolding. I have not seen drone (air) pictures of the assault from the beginning. If you have, please give cite. We have been told that sometime during the eight-hour attack on the mission and the CIA house, drones were overhead. Let’s not get too deep into conspiracies before we know the timeline.
Dave_A

As to which part?

The grammatical fact that a literal reading of the Constitution does not require us to declare war before fighting one?

Or that Lybia was a case of ‘a stuck-clock being half-right-once-a-day’ (Obama being right on ‘Qaddafi has to go’, but not so right on lead-from-behind implementation & thus having no input on the outcome), and thus while I don’t support the President’s policies generally, I do support the removal of an anti-American A-hole dictator with US military & civilian blood on his hands….. Even if it happened while Obama was President.

Or my distaste for the ‘Soros is an evil puppetmaster’ schtick (and it’s Libby-counterpart, ‘the Kochs are evil puppetmasters’)…..
Dave_A

@redstate-b3a96cb8648f4a6e4e1551221eec06f0:disqus

Given that a large portion of this will be covered by Executive Privledge (for real, not faux-EP a-la Fast & Furious) I doubt you’ll see much investigating if Romney wins. You may see some people more willing to talk to the press – especially if they think it will give them a chance at keeping their jobs in the new admin….

The President is legally able to make stupid military decisions (withholding adequate air cover in Mogadishu, for a past example), and legally allowed to lie to us about them (if it’s not under oath) and the only available remedy is to fire his butt in the next election…. Which seems to be a ‘likely occurrence’, fortunately….

IMHO, the best possible result, is that it gives Romney a reason to clean house at State (similar to how BJ fired all the US Attorneys when he came into office)….

The ‘investigation’ tack will only be used if Obama wins…
Dave_A

Indeed…
Granted, my specialty is on the ‘Ok they’re found (scouts are either observing, or hauling ass back our way), now grind them to dust’ side (Armor)….

I would also point out that UAV eyes-on isn’t exactly ‘not knowing the battlefield’, and that the Air Force generally has little to fear from Lybian militiamen…

2 F-16s could have broken up that attack with a few low passes, and maybe some 20mm cannon fire… If there really was an AC130 overhead (or nearby)… Well, then I wonder who denied permission to engage….
Dave_A

The rebels in Syria are NOT entirely Al Queda – and would not be Al Queda at all if the US had moved to support them earlier.

It should be pointed that ‘Our Guy’ will be arming them, too….
Dave_A

The cowardice theory fits best….

EG, ‘I don’t want an international incident this close to an election – what if they make it worse’?
citadelveteran

Each day I read something new that trickles into the public conscience from the events in Libya. Each day I find myself more shocked and offended than the day before thinking, how can this be? Each candidate says that the primary duty of the presidency is to serve as commander-in-chief and protect the American people. I listened to Barak Obama rant and rave about his service in this area during the third debate. However, as he has repeatedly shown during his tenure, talk is cheap and actions speak louder than words. Robert E Lee wrote, “Duty is the sublimest word in our language. Do your duty in all things. You cannot do more. You should never wish
to do less.”

Did Barak Obama do his duty? What is his duty? Duty to whom? Webster’s Dictionary defines duty as obligatory tasks, conduct, service, or functions that arise from one’s position (as in life or in a group). My question is who is Obama serving? The American people? Wasn’t it just a few weeks ago he was waxing on about be president of ALL the American People and not the 53% he claimed were the focus of Romney? Let’s set aside the words he speaks and look at the actions off prompter. Obama serves Obama and only Obama. His duty is to himself and keeping his butt on Air Force One. To serve himself and his peeps at a fundraiser in Vegas or the folks he placed in harm’s way? It certainly is not to the folks out there in harm’s way in our out of uniform. This whole episode reeks of foul political calculus gone awry. He knows that the folks who care wouldn’t have be voted for him anyway and there is zero percent chance that the main stream media will hold him accountable. These are the times when he would love to be back in the legislature where he can just vote present.
sayoung80913

The most epic smack down of obama,panetta,and clinton’s (left uncapitalized to show disrespect for cowards)handling of Benghazi. This show aired last night on Foxnews and my God she must have been one heck of a prosecutor before she became a judge! http://theothermccain.com/2012/10/28/judge-jeanine-rips-bho-over-benghazi-and-there-is-a-larger-problem/#disqus_thread
kowalski

One thing I’m really sick of is people adopting George Lakoff’s term “narrative” to describe what should be a coherent and truthful account of events. Narratives are for storytellers, which is what Lakoff has created in our political discourse – the idea that everything is just a story, it’s just one story against another story, as though we were all reading from fairytale books written by consultants.

I don’t care what the Obama Administrations “narrative” is. The “narrative” isn’t what the American people need to hear.
Michael M. Keohane

strieff : You and I know that the “boots on the ground” types would have gone in on even less information. Our people in trouble? Grab your gear and get aboard. I am proud to have served with officers & men who would have charged Hell in a pink tutu with two buckets of gasoline to save our people. Get a platoon size group of SO’s on the ground and they could re-enforce the embassy personnel until a larger force could arrive. This is a “top down” failure.
inperlmuttersdistrict

I never said Soros was a boogeyman, only that I found his choice of words — interesting, particularly since it has been established that the two men knew each other, not just of each other. My statement wasn’t meant to imply anything.
gunnyg2002

Michael, you got that right. Back in 1979, when I was a PFC, we began to gear up to attack Iran and rescue those hostages come hell or high water. We stood down thanks to KGB Karter whom I loathe and despise almost as much as I do Obama. Many of us geared up in the First Gulf, without being asked, when the Iraqis hit Khafji and Marines were pinned down because that is what Marines do.

The failure is all Obama’s and it flows downhill from there.
runner12

True.
Viet71

Let’s forget about the administration cover-up and keep attention on the verifiable facts.

Which are essentially that the consulate was under attack for a prolonged period; the president and his top advisers were aware of this at the time; and no one in authority ordered in rescuers. The persons in authority were Panetta and Petraeus, subject to Obama’s command.

Take your choice: Obama was incompetent or Obama didn’t really care about the American lives in peril. Those are the only two non-conspiracy possibilities based on the verifiable facts.

My guess: Obama decided to sacrifice four lives rather than risk losing an indefinite number more. He didn’t want a replay of Blackhawk Down just weeks before the election.

If this is the case, even his supporters should vote NOPE on November 6. Bet Obama understands this too.
Ausonius

From FOX News Sunday on the Benghazi Attack/Stand-Down Story:

“HUME: One of the problems we’re having here is, that
it has fallen to this news organization, Fox News and a couple others
to do all the heavy lifting on this story. And the mainstream organs of
the media that would be after this like a pack of hounds if this were a
Republican president, have been remarkably reticent. And there has been
some good reporting, but nothing like on the scale and to the degree of
specificity that you would expect by now.

Normally, the big news
organizations would have this thing out there. And we would know a lot
more than we do about – about what the president did, what he knew, when
he knew it, and what when he made what order he made and on what basis.
We still don’t know that, and to some extent, a lot of the media who –
who are a combined potent force have not done their job.”

See:

http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/fox-news-sunday-chris-wallace/2012/10/28/key-senators-presidential-swing-state-showdown
swanman823

Thanks for keeping this story alive. Usually in Washington the cover-up is worse than the crime. This is criminal negligence at best. 0bama is not qualified to be commander-in-chief or POTUS. American blood on 0bama’s hands, he is a criminal and will be disgraced once this story is told. Even the MSM (aka the 0bama SuperPac) is starting to pickup on this.
Tbone

All of your posts that I read seem to qualify. In fact, the broken clock has you down 2-zip.
jpkoch

According to Fox source on Friday there were images of Ambassador Stevens meeting with a Turkish official just minutes before all hell broke loose.
ipeduto

The question of whether or not people would vote if they knew what has happened begs an answer. That depends upon what they want to happen in America. If they are anti-American or any of the abhorrent groups who support this administration or if they consider themselves to be partisan or if they are union believers, MSM believers, environmentalists, etc. they answer is still – yes. They are hopeful that America loses its standing because that is their agenda. Only people who are not biased or are open-minded, or fearful for the future of this country because their progeny will suffer don’t need Benghazi to know what has to happen to save America & Americans. I pray we overcome those who would see America undone.
http://www.ajharaldson.com lakeworthcane

I smell a rat. I have smelled a rat in this story since it broke: since NPR’s on-the-scene reporters interviewed rioter after rioter in Egypt, Libya and the Sudan who knew nothing about any Internet video.

They didn’t know why they were rioting. All they knew is that everybody else was rioting, so they joined in.

I was in the US Navy and, even though I wasn’t in special forces, I saw the standard special forces operating procedures: how entire squads of ships and divisions of regular infantry are moved around in strange ways to facilitate special ops. Politicians, commanders and other behind-the-scenes powers routinely move heaven and earth to create a format–a “cover”–for something else. It happens all the time.

We might get the whole story someday–maybe many years from now–and we might not. But the more the facts emerge, the more it looks like the American Ambassador and the men with him were not victims of a terrorist attack but, in fact, deliberate “hits.”

One of the men was an ex-SEAL who’d been investigating the flow of weapons from Libya into Mali, where Islamic terrorists have been armed and have taken over about two thirds of the country since Libya’s “liberation.”

Nobody has said much about the other guys who were killed or what they were doing with the ambassador that night. For all of that, nobody has said much about what the ambassador was doing that night. But to me it looks like they were doing something that somebody in the Obama administration didn’t want them to do, and about which the Obama administration didn’t want others to know.

Who were they working for? What were they doing? Why did the Obama administration, from all appearances, have them hit?

This stinks. It stinks, it stinks, it stinks. Something other than what we hear in the news is going on in the Middle East and in Africa, where Isamic military groups have become active since the so-called “Arab Spring.”

It’s not cool, and while the individual events are being reported in the news, what they amount to–the bigger picture–is not.

The news companies are spinning it. MSNBC reported that a terrorist had driven a car bomb into a church and killed 13 people. FOX reported that an ISLAMIC terrorist had driven a car bomb into a CATHOLIC church and killed 13 people.

Africa is a mineral-rich continent ripe for exploitation. Obama doesn’t like the United States and has worked to decrease its power. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton’s top aide–who never leaves Clinton’s side–has all the appearances of an Islamic activist. The aide’s husband–a Jewish New York congressman–has been discredited by a–you guessed it–”sex scandal.”

Obama has done nothing to prevent this “sequestration” thing, which will severely decrease US military funding, and he has supported this “Arab Spring” movement since its inception.

This all might amount to nothing if the Obama administration didn’t now seem at least complicit in–and perhaps the prime motivator of–the murders of four US personnel, at least one of which was on an intelligence-gathering mission in the area.

Again, it stinks, and something other that what we hear in the news is happening. We’re getting the individual events as they occur: new governments in Libya and Egypt, a civil war in Syria, four US personnel murdered in Libya, Islamic military actions in Mali, Kenya, the Sudan and Nigeria, a car bombing in Lebanon that killed a top intelligence official, and Iran is making a nuclear bomb.

But we’re not getting the bigger picture. Something is going on. Powerful but hidden forces are at work re-aligning boundaries and changing power and control. Somebody is making a move.

I think this is what Romney and Ryan are talking about, but this is what they cannot specifically say.

Romney knows more than he’s saying. He knows about that up to which Obama is. (Sorry about waxing Churchill-esque; couldn’t help it.) He’s made a couple of statements in his campaign, about “prairie fires,” and about a strong US military presence in the Middle East, that indicate his knowledge of more than he can say at this time. Perhaps he will never say.

It looks like Romney will win, unless Obama and Axelrod pull one of their signature slimey election stunts.

If Romney wins, he’ll quell this. If Obama wins, we’ll see something entirely different. It’s all going to play out in the next few years.
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