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Oppose Plan B

By: Erick Erickson (Diary)  |  December 20th, 2012 at 09:02 AM  | 

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Republicans in Congress intend to vote today on Plan B, John Boehner’s fall back plan on the fiscal cliff.

The President says he will veto it.

In other words, the Republicans are going to go on record that they will sell out their last remaining principle — no tax increases — and get nothing from the Democrats in return. Nothing.

There’ll be no Democrat deal on entitlements. There’ll be no Democrat deal on spending. There will only be the GOP’s sell out.

Click here to call your congressman. Tell him to oppose this Republican deal.

The GOP should not go on record willing to raise taxes if the Democrats will not offer meaningful reforms now on spending and entitlements.

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  • westcoastpatriette

    Boehner…leading from behind the leader who leads from behind. Such a noble gentleman. He looks like the worst of cowards through this.

  • rightlane1111

    Wouldn’t you love to play poker with Boehner…I would…I would be rich beyond my wildest dreams. Boehner…or your staff…submit your bill as the people of America want it sent to the president…go home and let him VETO IT. Or…let Harry Reid put it on the shelf. You don’t understand anything about the game and you shouldn’t be leader.

  • mmish

    They need to stand up for their principles…….unfortunately , I’m afraid that’s is what they are doing. Republicans will be blamed no matter what happens. They need to go down boldly fighting.

  • rightlane1111

    Oh…and another thing…you do not…under any circumstances give Obama the right to raise the debt ceiling at any whim. THIS IS OUR MONEY…NOT HIS…NOT YOURS…OURS.

  • rightlane1111

    They need to submit the bill according to their “supposed” principles and go home and let Obama hold the bag. That is that. I wonder who buys Boehner’s cars? Wonder what that last remark was about. How many times have you walked away from a car salesman only to be called back before you hit the door?

  • spinoneone

    Republicans are going to get the blame and the slimestream media will make sure the “low information” voter is convinced. That is O’s game plan and he is sticking to it. So, go ahead and pass the bill. It won’t matter. Just don’t fold on the debt ceiling or any other spending bill which happens to come down from the Senate. Sure, let Reid and company package up anything they want. Just don’t go to conference on it. Pretty soon everyone will have had enough and see that O and his cohorts are the reason we are where we are. Check out, too, the fact that the value of the Euro, even with all their problems, is edging up against the dollar. If you aren’t afraid of inflation in 2013 then you aren’t paying attention.

  • http://llphsecondrevolution.wordpress.com/ spoasteph97

    Freedomworks has put out a press release in support of Plan B:

    http://www.freedomworks.org/blog/dean-clancy/fiscal-cliff-boehner-moves-to-plan-b

    I am now confused. Erick Erickson, Club for Growth, Heritage Action are opposed while Freedomworks and ATR are in support. Some say it raises taxes, others say it lowers them or does nothing…help???

  • rightlane1111

    http://seekingalpha.com/article/1074621-changes-to-the-cola-index-and-the-impact-on-your-retirement-plan-part-2?source=yahoo

  • http://llphsecondrevolution.wordpress.com/ spoasteph97

    I don’t think that today’s vote on Plan B should be seen as a big deal. Of course, we should look at the “No” votes on the GOP side as the ones who are really committed to freedom and lower taxes. But that does NOT mean that everyone in the GOP who voted “yes” are RINOs, sell-outs, etc. We should continue looking at other votes and then look for a pattern in each rep. If this is the only bad vote a rep makes, it should NOT lead to a primary challenge against him/her.

  • commonsenseobserver

    Obviously it raises taxes.

    But that doesn’t matter. Only one thing does: House Republicans are making an effort to keep taxes as low for as many people as possible.

  • rabun1016

    I am actually more apprehensive about John Boehner leading the conservative cause in the House next Congress than I am of any proposed tax plan. Is there a guy who exhibits less persuasive ability in plans he presents? I am sure Obama loves him being right where he is.

  • jaykali

    I don’t think that’s good enough CYA, bc they would still be blamed for holding middle class tax cuts “hostage” according to the media to protect the rich. At least a millionaire tax addresses the “rich” side of the argument while also protecting a lot of small businesses. I mean look this is a high stakes game. To say that the House can call the shots when they are just 1 half of 1 branch is unrealistic. Our leverage should really be in the debt ceiling limit. I would go scorched earth on that.

  • jaykali

    Well its a bit unfair bc certain House members will be “protected”, it really is about who is safe from primary challenges who can vote yes. For example Paul Ryan can vote yes, it’s not bc he is unprincipled, it’s bc he can afford to and I think leadership has determined that they won’t be able to get all the tax cuts extended.

    I mean let’s be real here, there is no way we could get the top rates extended forever, that chance went bye bye when we lost the election. If we can get 99% extended permanently that is probably a good idea.

  • jaykali

    I hope they go scorched earth on this. I am thinking they won’t. My prediction is we will get another crappy deal with fake cuts and a 2 year extension.

  • jaykali

    Look, the problem is that the tax rates expire. It’s semantics as to whether thats a raise or not. I think we can get the Democrats to go 500k or a million which is not going to be the end of the world. Look they won the election, they are going to get some kind of a tax raise bc the tax cuts expire automatically.

  • http://travismonitor.blogspot.com Freedoms Truth

    My position: Support plan B. Pass it, then go home. Be open for further negotiations, but stick close to this position to protect the taxpayers, as many as possible.
    spending cuts? Great if we can get them, but we not out of Obama. Add the Obamacare tax hikes to the negotiations if possible – but its not happening.

    In reality, the only way for the GOP to get anything other than capitulation is to have a strong enough position to be unified on, stick to it, and bend only enough to get both sides on board. If we are divided, then we get the worst deal, one voted on by the Democrats plus some rump # of Republicans willing to get anything passed.

    In reality, there are no meaningful spending cuts and entitlement reforms that Obama will agree to, and we pay heavily for those reforms by proposing more unpopular things in addition to MORE tax hikes than we want.We know this because we know the trajectory of the cliff negotiations. Boehner clearly saw that Democrats are pushing for more capitulation.

    So dont even try, just ask the question: How can we minimize the burden of higher taxes?

    Boehner has already gone some way towards compromise. He already put tax increases ‘on the table’. We already passed the no tax increase bill. To say “oppose this” is to insist on a position of opposing something that protects more taxpayers and is a closer to our position that what Boehner has put on the table in negotiations. This bill in the end gives him some leverage and puts the onus back on the Democrats to come to our position more.

    One can argue, as you do, that we should not go on record without something from the other side. That’s valid, but the problem is that there is nothing from the other side in the way of moving towards anything reasonable. Doing nothing = big tax hike. “Plan A” was boehner’s chats with the President, and its not going well for fiscal conservatism. if Boehner, having put this out there, now fails to win the votes, he will be in a position of not being able to deliver the caucus for a unified position, so ‘no’ is bad for us.

    Its clear that the Democrats will go over the cliff or get their way or close to it. A ‘no’ vote will make it easier for Democrats to (a) blame the GOP for the cliff happening and (b) pass a Democrat bill later and picks off the 2 dozen GOP votes they need from Congress critters in the ‘well something has to be done’ camp.

    In short, we are stronger in unity. This bill is not perfect nor the principled conservative position, but we dont have the political strength to insist on that; it is a more than acceptable outcome given the political environment we are in, so conservatives should feel comfortable with our leaders supporting it in their attempts to get ‘the best deal possible for as many taxpayers as possible’.

    PS. Those who oppose Plan B should really explain the practical path forward to actually winning a better deal out of Obama and Reid. Simply voting ‘no’ and then watching tax increases on all Americans is not a good outcome. How do we WIN?

  • commonsenseobserver

    Difficult for Club for Growth, RedState and others to mount primary challenges for specific reasons in direct contradiction of FreedomWorks and ATR. ATR basically sets the gold standard on Republican tax policy.

  • commonsenseobserver

    Boehner has indicated that he does, in fact, intend to go on holiday after passing this.

  • http://travismonitor.blogspot.com Freedoms Truth

    “To me one of the biggest mistakes is Boehner negotiating with the
    President on anything, bc he is not a serious negotiator. He is the
    worst at grandstanding. There is no up-side to negotiating with him.
    Anything that passes through the Senate & House he will sign.
    Boehner should be negotiating with Harry Reid.”

    This is a good observation. Reid & Obama is a good-cop / bad-cop routine and 2 on 1. It’s impossible to win that game, and Boehner’s not that good (not sure if anyone would be up to it; you cant beat a Democrat President in PR war.)

    I am also with you that the spending cuts are so meaningless and fake that we should just let the sequestration hammer fall and oppose unemplyoment extention. And that’s it. Do the rest of spending cut deals when the budget and debt ceiling rolls around. For now, just one rule: Save the taxpayers.

  • commonsenseobserver

    It’s still a rise, unless we’re going to start praising Obama for his benevolence and generosity in passing tax cuts.

    But, yeah. And I’d prefer the full package compared to merely targeting small businesses with bogus cuts.

  • http://travismonitor.blogspot.com Freedoms Truth

    Often the devil is in the detail, and I believe that we were seeing a LOT of devil in the details of the Obama proposal – estate taxes going up, investment taxes going up, more spending, forcing a cave on the debt ceiling etc. None of those are in this bill. FreedomWorks in their statement in support of this has noted:
    - Does not raise taxes. It is a net tax cut that prevents a $4.6 trillion [ten-year] tax hike on January 1;
    - Permanently
    extends income tax rate cuts for Americans making less than $1 million,
    which protects 99.81 percent of all taxpayers;
    - Permanently
    extends the current estate and gift tax [aka the Death Tax]
    [Specifically, the bill taxes estates valued at $5 million and up at 35
    percent, indexed for inflation, rather than letting a 55 percent tax
    rate kick in on January 1, 2013, applicable to all estates valued over
    $1 million.];
    - Permanently extends section 179 expensing for small businesses ($250,000 and indexed for inflation);
    - Permanently stops the Alternative Minimum Tax (AMT) from hitting more middle class families;
    - Permanently
    extends parity for capital gains and dividend taxes, preventing
    dividend taxes from being taxed at the highest rates; and
    - Does
    not include anything on the debt limit or other non-tax policy items.
    Remember, Speaker Boehner’s rule on the debt limit still applies:
    spending cuts must exceed any debt limit increase.

    The AMT fix is a biggie for millions of taxpayers, and making these rates permanent will lock in protection for a lot of taxpayers. On balance, this is a good bill. No wonder the Democrats oppose it, they were wanting to stuff in a lot of bad stuff in the ‘deal’. This takes it out. FreedomWorks also makes the point that some amendments will be possible that may improve the bill.

  • http://travismonitor.blogspot.com Freedoms Truth

    “They need to submit the bill according to their “supposed” principles and go home and let Obama hold the bag”

    Senate does … nothing. Taxes go up for every American and the GOP gets blamed for it… a Democrat dream. They win.

    The only difference with Plan B is that a) “Obama wanted higher taxes on millionaires, fine, he wins” and b) “Democrat Senate wont pass this. Huh, THEY PASSED THIS BILL LAST TIME!” (yes, they did, it was the Schumer proposal of 2010.)

    Plan B really *IS* the compromise we wish we could get out of Obama, because we surely wont get anything better than that.

  • plh

    We’ve known for many, many years that the mainstream media cannot be counted on to report the truth. The House already passed a full extension bill in August, with a lighter version (“Plan B”) now in the works. If perception is truly the reason we cave all the time, isn’t it time to go scorched earth in this two-front war? Just one example: don’t the RNC and the countless advocacy groups that collected untold sums during the last campaign have anything left over run in-your-face “The Truth Behind Our Plan” ads, with a “What we stand for” and “What the media won’t tell you” theme? [Cue music] “Gotta know when to hold ‘em …”

  • libertynugget

    Unfortunately, I can’t remember when an assault on the media has every really worked. I remember it even actually backfiring on Obama when he attacked Fox News. With those ads every ‘fact checker’ will be coming out of the wood work (regardless of ‘facts) and Pinocchio’s and finger pointing will be the norm.

    The ‘what we stand for’ ads would be great, but unfortunately only people who are interested in politics would pay any attention. Groups like this would praise it, Libs would attack it, moderates/undecideds will watch the Poinsettia Bowl and wonder why they can’t find a job. It would also help if they actually knew what the stood for!

    The only way to purge the party of the Beohner/squishy neo-cons is to vote them out in 2014. Then cross your fingers and pray that one of the new candidates doesn’t start popping off about ‘legitimate rape’ or whatever to bring the whole ship down (cause you know the media will paint them all with the same brush).

  • ThePoliticalHat

    I don’t think that taxes should be raised on ANYONE. However, since Obama wants us to go off the “fiscal cliff” and taxes are going up for everyone anyway, demanding that House Republicans vote know because high earners won’t be included is a practice in intellectual purity that will do more harm than good.

    Voting to to extend the tax cuts for those less earning than $1M takes the accusation that the GOP was willing to tax everyone else to “protect” the rich. The Dems and the MSM would have run with that and they would have likely succeeded in their propaganda (with subsequent victories in ’14). By passing those tax cute for <$1M incomes as a stand alone bill, the GOP can diffuse the Dems most dangerous line of attack and even counter that it is the DEMS that support middle-class tax cuts.

    This is a Kobayashi-Maru scenario, and unlike Capt. Kirk, we can't change the parameters to allow us to win before the new year.

  • plh

    Good point – great portrayal of the moderates and undecideds. My suggestion is clearly not a perfect solution, but if they’re short, well made, and use actors people can identify with, at least we’ll be getting more of our message out there. Defeating the squishy ones in primaries is obviously the best way to go. And if they see the writing on the wall, some of them may just grow some spine and vote to hold the line between now and the next election.

  • libertynugget

    You’re right of course, there should be some means of the GOP to go on “offense” and they should be explored.

    This last election has made my cynical meter peg far into the red. I guess its really hard for me to take it all seriously now that I know there are too many clowns in this circus.

  • cheesycon

    you were pretty accurate. Looks like that’s what happened.

    Obama will veto. We go over the “cliff” and we get to watch more silliness in March.

    I hate to say it but I think Howard Dean was right. The higher rates are here to stay. We have no more leverage.

  • rightlane1111

    The plan that Obama HAD…is exactly what he will not support and you want me to agree that the Senate will stay with their plan. Musical chairs…Submit the bill and let Obama veto it. BTW…if this Plan B were so great…why did the House vote it down.

    How does Harry Reid going home for a Christmas Vacation blame the Republicans? You know in 99.9% of ALL my negotiations…I won…know why…I did not blink…of cry or whatever Boehner does. This is business…and it is the people’s business and it’s OUR money…just like it was my client’s money I was dealing with…I had a fiduciary to my people…something that seems to be missing in ALL THREE BRANCHES OF GOVERNMENT.

    If the Senate does nothing…WHO IS IN CHARGE OR THE SENATE?