I absolutely agree and have dedicated my diaries to federalism and fighting the federal government. We desperately need defiant, 10th Amendment state legislators and governors. Desperately!

You act as if the party is a minority in all of the houses. Like Mr. Horowitz says above. The sequester cuts happen if we do nothing. Also, any budgets and continuing resolutions have to be approved by the House, so they have to approve of any spending on Obamacare. The excuse of only holding on to 1/2 of 1/3 of the government works the other way too. they are the gatekeeper for spending and they need to use that power for all of its worth.

I WILL NOT COMPLY.

So the moderate Republican, whose “turn it was” to be nominated, who could not even bring up Obamacare and who refused to bring the fight to the Democrats lost the election. And that is a reason to give up our control of the financial processes of government? Not hardly. You obviously are one of the putative Republicans who believe the party has to change to win elections. It does, but not by being more like the Democrats. It needs to change to being Republican instead of wimps.

The question really is – are we willing to shut down the federal govt over Obamacare funding – because that is what it will come to. I don’t think this is the case – and hence I don’t think all this posturing regarding Obamacare funding will go anywhere. It will make some of us feel good – that we did *something* to challenge Obama – but really – did we – when it is clear to all concerned that the challenge will ultimately fail.

Do we have an answer to the question – what is our alternative to Obamacare? Shouldn’t this be our focus?

No House GOP member should cast a Yea vote on any spending bill as long as the sequester is affecting DoD. After all, there is no higher priority for the national government than national defense. Education, health care, infrastructure, etc can all be funded at multiple levels of government and even by NGOs. Only the Federal Government can operate DoD. (State contributions to the National Guard are not financial support of the DoD but of the state’s militia, IMHO)

Non sequitor, as it implies that we admit defeat. Apparently, you suffer from a severe deficiency of moral courage and fiscal responsibility.

House Republicans still control the purse strings.

Federalist 66, Hamilton – “The exclusive privilege of originating money bills will belong to the House of Representatives.”

Now is the time for Republicans to be the responsible adults, starve the beast, eliminate the Democrat’s ability to buy votes and/or preserve poverty for political gain, and finally, put our nation back on its intended track of fiscal responsibility in order to ensure the longevity of our Republic and secure the blessings of Liberty to our posterity.

The problem with defunding Obamacare through the appropriations process is that, at best, it only impacts < 10% of its overall funding. The vast majority of Obamacare, including many of its key initiatives, is funded through mandatory spending.

This means that the government already has full legal authority from Congress, in perpetuity, to finance many of its key programs. This includes the health insurance premium subsidies, the Medicaid/SCHIP expansion, the small employer plan subsidies, the high-risk pools, and other key initiatives. Unless I'm mistaken, I believe this accounts for over 90% of the total funding for Obamacare.

No further Congressional approval is required for this mandatory spending to occur. The only way to revoke approval and funding for the mandatory components of Obamacare would be if Congress and the President enact a new law. That isn't happening.

The rest of the funding is through the discretionary appropriations process. And yes, the House can de-fund this by simply not re-authorizing these funds. But this mostly amounts to grants and various administrative functions, and so forth.

The remainder of the law is funded by mandatory spending, which continues in perpetuity unless the law changes. The House cannot, on its own, do anything to stop those mandatory programs. Only a new law can do that.

Karl, is that you?

So, we should just lie down and play Democrat? Really???

I might say you have a point if throughout history the Dims had acted as you suggest whenever they lost an election. But, they never did! No, they always acted, and sounded, as if they had WON the elections they lost! They never just let us have our agenda, why should we just let them have theirs?

Why do those who claim to be Republicans demand that Republicans roll over and play Democrat whenever the going gets tough? Why do some who claim to be on our side always demand that we change to look more like the other side? Why do so many of those who claim to support our principles demand we abandon them? Why do so many of those who claim they want to win always counsel us to act like cowards? When have cowards ever won anything?

Who throughout history has been the winners? The bold and the persevering! It is time to boldly persevere, not to cravenly put our heads in the sand. We will never win anyone to our side by trying to look like the other side. We will not succeed if we never try. Let us all stop whining about being losers and start thinking about actually winning. To win you must strive towards your goals. Any other action is doomed to failure, and aiming towards failure merely accelerates that process!

You sound like a Lefty. You define the terms and then declare that by definition you are correct. But you are wrong that de-funding is “just theater”! If the House does not pass a spending bill, the money cannot be spent. Period! So, we should take that step if it is the only one left to us. Besides, most polls show that the majority of Americans do not, and never have, support Obummercare!

And, what is wrong with a little “theater” anyway? Isn’t Obummer more theater than substance? Wasn’t FDR a lot of theater? Wasn’t Reagan? Theater can be a very effective way of getting your point across. Why throw away such a powerful tool? In fact, why do so many who claim to be on our side keep insisting that we throw away any of the tools available to us? Some even insist we throw them all away! Why?

Why not refer to or cite the actual body of law the US constitution which Mr Hamilton helped draft. The constituion is the law.
Federalists have no legal authority although as a body of ideas and thoughts the papers rank highly and still explain how things are to work even today.

Once upon a time the Republicans promised alternatives and have never deliveed them in a form we can juingle in our heads. Jon Huntsman may have comer closest to proviidng as Gv Utah cheap insurance.
Some ideas that have passed through the night are let insurance policies pass through state monopolies and let consumers pick from a large pool of plans across state lines to grow choices for price and services.
Not a one size fits all model.

Medical savings accounts and even moving health care to the individual and not having it be tied to employer based coverage and government are ideas once thrown on table without much depth or serious thought.
.
None of that alternative health care funding is tossed out even as red meat anymore.

But you have a good point on that the GOP offers no alternaitves to government run heath care and government regulated insurers, PPACA or ACA

Defunding ACA ot O’ care will offer a void a free market environment can fill with health care options perhaps with patients and doctors in control again, though.

One way to retake Senate is back good people who have something to offer if not everything if that person can grow GOP numbers in Senate.

Rep Shelly Capito nee More, a former governor’s daughter, in WV is running and is strongest Republican to take the now open seat Rockefellar is vacating.

She has coalminer backing and really is opposed to Obama’s war on coal as Rockefellar did not oppose. WIthout checking I am sure she also supports the Second in a way Manchin does not. Democrats are dangerous in WV.

Club for Growth was quite negative about her though in a press release but to date they have not found anyone to run against her in a primary as WV conservatives seem to back her in a John Gizzi report
The war on coal is a major battle front for me as coal built America and offers much for the future. Any fighter for the clean coal industry wins my support just as do defenders of the Second.

But what is the GOP health plan proposal? Fighting to end Obamacare without a real alternative tells voters the GOP thinks the status quo is good enough. That is clearly a losing argument.

I agree with your sentiment on “tactical grounds” but the time is over for all of that Obamacare will be the end of America and must be stopped. We must live or die on this hill now. There is no time left we must stand and fight politically or we will have to fight in more desperate ways. While we have the house we can if we chose we can derail this train now.

> If the House does not pass a spending bill, the money cannot be spent.

That’s not true, Dave. It depends on whether the money is funded through discretionary or mandatory spending.

For programs funded with discretionary spending, you’re right. Every year, the money must be appropriated, or else the money is not spent. As such, the House, alone, can defund a discretionary spending program.

But for programs funded with mandatory spending, it is the exact opposite. Once authorized, the money is spent perpetuity, year after year, unless a new law is enacted to stop it. As such, the House cannot, alone, defund a mandatory spending program.

As I understand it, vast majority of Obamacare is funded through mandatory spending.

As such, most of the funding for Obamacare is already authorized, and that money will be spent in perpetuity unless a new law is enacted to stop it, passed by both chambers and signed by the President. Clearly, that is very unlikely to happen in the next 4 years.

The House can defund the discretionary components of Obamacare, but as I understand it, that is a very small portion of the overall spending. There is nothing the House can do, by itself, to defund most of Obamacare.

BRILLIANT COMMENT +5 +5 +5

Just from reading, no research to back up, USA spends at least 15X more than next nearest nation on military. One would think there would be some extra room for military budget cuts then. But I realize many US jobs are dependent on that. Damned if we do and damned if we don’t.

Because original intent is just as important as the written word, and it leaves no room for moral relativity and obfuscation.

I agree. Coal is important and shouldn’t be left by the wayside. But then again natural gas is putting a dent into coal mining as well, so it could be an endangered product in the next couple of decades. I’m hoping it isn’t, considering abundance of it and fact that it creates some many jobs in WV, KY, TN, and OH, but we’ll see.

I think Capito has a great chance to take back the seat, but I wouldn’t put her in the “shoe in” column just yet. WV might be red on Presidential elections, but state wide, they’re controlled by the Democrats. And I agree with you, the Dems are obviously strong in WV and have a strong tradition, so it may not not be as easy as it looks.

Palestate? Yellastate?

Each time we cave, the weaker we get. The more often we bloody his nose, the weaker HE gets.

rb, Thanks for the citation to constitution and for the link to Hillsdale and its online study on the constituion. I have seen it before and now am motivated to do more.

Thank you for your sanity, trem. I’m glad someone is reality based here or I’m afraid we are setting ourselves up for worse defeats.

As governor palin said on election night, a win is a win, it puts a w in the column. We all must come out of denial and recognize the opposition must fight the battle in the grounds of the enemy until we can regain the field, or, I’m afraid, we WILL lose the war!

Yeah, you give him way too much credit.