Hopefully Francis will unite the church, reform the curia, and is able to stem the tide not only away from Catholicism, but from Christianity. He seems very humble, very intelligent, and very close to the people.

So far, he is what I had hoped we would get in a new pope; a priest (a Jesuit, if you can believe it) who has lived in the real world away from the Vatican, and a non-European. Personally, I was hoping for Cardinal Sean O’Malley – as much out of patriotism as anything else. But I have to admit, at this point the election of a new pope, and this pope in particular, is a bit inspiring to me. Looks like I’ll be going to mass with another man to pray for.

His vision is God.

Capitalism is not in sycn with God, in his view.

He sees God, in his own way.

Unless you’re in your twenties, the majority of Jesuits are nothing like what you experienced in high school. By and large, they are overeducated fans of central solutions socialism / social justice, and their approach to doctrine is to parse the heck of it, in favor of the ‘primacy of the well formed conscience’. I know of several instances where Jebbie priests in NYC have taken a morally neutral stance their counsel was sought on crisis pregnancies, and St. Francis Xavier parish in Chelsea, Manhattan completely ignores church teaching on homosexuality (openly gay men in same sex relationships serve as Eucharistic ministers there).

When Innocent III was selected as Pople in the 1100, at the age of 37, the reaction of the laity was “Woe to us – we have a stripling for a Pope”. Traditional Catholics may shortly be replacing ‘stripling’ for ‘Jesuit’ in that formulation.

I believe this is the case.

This ought to get interesting. From Pope Francis I:

“In the Aparecida Document, a document that represents a joint statement by Latin American church leaders but presented by Francis in 2007, the leaders stated, “we should commit ourselves to ‘eucharistic coherence,’ that is, we should be conscious that people cannot receive holy communion and at the same time act or speak against the commandments, in particular when abortions, euthanasia, and other serious crimes against life and family are facilitated. This responsibility applies particularly to legislators, governors, and health professionals.”

Francis is also anti-euthanasia: “Today,” he wrote, “elderly people are discarded when, in reality, they are the seat of wisdom of the society. The right to life means allowing people to live and not killing, allowing them to grow, to eat, to be educated, to be healed, and to be permitted to die with dignity.”
http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Peace/2013/03/13/Francis-no-communion-abortion

ROFL! You irreverent sod you.

lineholder Thanks for sharing. It seems some have made presumptions about the Pope out of whole cloth, the religious order he belongs to, or assumptions based on the fact the Pope is from South America.

I read somewhere else, sorry I don’t have the source, that Francis once called out his fellow priests as hypocrites for refusing communion to single mothers and their children. Frankly, I didn’t know that was something that was being done, but Francis may not be the most hard line guy out there.

The reality is it’s hard to put any of these people into the traditional liberal/conservative boxes that we are used to. Catholic leaders are very conservative on social issues, but they also oppose war, the death penalty and generally support liberal social justice (ie: welfare) programs. Find me a politician with those positions.

No offense to Mr. Stevens, but complaining that the pope is not a staunch individualist is sort of like complaining that the Pacific Ocean is too wet. The Roman Catholic Church is not about individualism. It *is* about a lot of other things, though, and some of them are potentially quite good. Fortunately, the formal separation of church and state means that we can try to marry what we like from the Pope/RCC to our ironclad commitment to individual liberty.

Alright then.

“Social justice” is used as a banner for liberal Catholic groups who support government programs. Many of these groups that use this euphemism are socialist in their political leanings, and often times they also support radical groups such as Catholics for Choice and other pro-abortion pro-gay marriage groups.

Social justice sounds great, and of course the Catholic church supports charity and care for those in need, but it is another one of those terms whose meaning has been completely warped by the leftists inside the church, just like “liberation theology.”

I’ve heard they may have chosen someone older because they don’t want another long pontificate like JPII had, they are looking for something more temporary to ride out the current storm. I’m not sure if this is accurate or wise, but it is plausible.

OK it was baptisms, nice catch.

The Crusades were a disgrace to Christianity. Slaughtering thousands of people in the name of God and forcing people to convert under threat of death. I don’t think the Catholic Church has supported any modern war. At best they’re neutral, I don’t know what their stance was during WWII, but they’ll never bless one army over another.

The Church is opposed to the death penalty pretty universally. Just about every prisoner we execute in this country gets a mercy plea from the Church, regardless of their crimes. And Pope John Paul II personally pardoned the man who shot him.

First off, intellectual property is enshrined in the Constitution – and while one can argue that ‘for the life of an immortal entity’ is not a ‘limited time’, IP is in no way a cause of poverty…. Without it, no individual inventor could ever receive the property of his inventions…

Second, homesteading was not redistributionist, as it was GOVERNMENT land that was granted to individuals, in return for their agreement to perform a service for the government (to develop the land).

That the land did not come with a monetary price is irrelevant – it was still an essentially capitalist ‘trade’ (land for labor)…. The homesteader got land, the government got the benefits of development & economic growth (those homesteaders dug wells, built roads & founded towns in order to make their ‘free’ land livable)….

‘Redistributionist’ homesteading = squatting = trying to sieze private property…. That was never legal.

Viva il Papa! What a glorious day it was for the Catholic Church and those of the faith! We indeed have a new Pope and I celebrate him being from Latin America as an outreach to all Catholics, even though we seen to be a minority here.
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I wish I could understand this statement: “You Catholics just remember this was pre-destined to happen. John Calvin said so.” I guess I’m idiot and don’t understand what Calivn said or did when he was alive back in the 1500′s, other than turn against his Catholic faith. You non-Catholics please explain the meaning as I’m all ears.
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Should we praise those reform-minded rebels against the Church which Calvin eventually became one of in his prime, kinda like the Chis Matthews, Joe Biden and Nancy Pelosi figures of today? The so-called progressive Catholics that know all but legislate against the teachings of their faith in order to grow government? They should all be all be excommunicated IMHO, but I’m not the Pope.
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Today was a great day to celebrate my Catholic faith and needless to say by the many comments here, it’s not shared by all. Maybe we can all celebrate God’s love for all people, regardless of their religion.
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“Toward the end of 1523 Calvin transferred to the more famous College Montaigu. While in Paris he changed his name to its Latin form, Ioannis Calvinus, which in French became Jean Calvin. During this time, Calvin’s education was paid for in part by income from a couple of small parishes. So although the new theological teachings of individuals like Luther and Jacques Lefevre d’Etaples were spreading throughout Paris, Calvin was closely tied to the Roman Church. However, by 1527 Calvin had developed friendships with individuals who were reform-minded. These contacts set the stage for Calvin’s eventual switch to the Reformed faith.”
http://www.calvin.edu/about/john-calvin/

Hey Check, if you look into the causes of the reformation you might agree with the reformers. The Church had gotten pretty far away from Scripture and was completely corrupt. Martin Luther was hoping to “reform” it (hence the name), not destroy it.

I wasn’t trying to argue that your comment was wrong. My point was that it was irrelevant / not really worthy of concern. It did occur to me that it wasn’t the most polite thing to write. I’ll try to be more mindful of thin skin, moving forward.
Seriously, it just doesn’t matter what any Pope thinks about capitalism, nor the reasons behind that thinking. Capitalism doesn’t need the RCC or the pope for support. Which is nice, because its not a very promising place to look for it. What is it about the cultural heritage of non-English speaking countries, especially in the Western hemisphere, that makes them suspicious of capitalism? They don’t have a whole lot in common. One thing – maybe the only thing – they have in common is Catholicism.

Also, there are a lot more non-Catholic English speakers in the word than there are Catholic English speakers.

My agenda is civility.

My point is that, as one of the pillars of classical Conservatism, the Roman Catholic Church is not likely to be a good source of inspiration for political and economic Liberalism. To say that Pope Francis is not an ideal spokesman for economic Liberalism is basically to say that what’s been the case for the past 400 years . . . continues to be the case.

how do you think the Christian heartland of Palestine, Syria, Turkey, and North Africa became muslim? Or is your point that it is fine for muslims to convert Christians by the sword but it is bad form for Christians to defend themselves?

Calling me an idiot wasn’t uncivil? OK.

How exactly did I mischaracterize your comments? You’ve responded to me 4 times now, but you’ve never actually explained it.

To put my cards fully on the table, I’m Catholic. My agenda is to prevent relitigating what I see as old differences that aren’t going away anytime soon. Let there be no suspense: Pope Francis I is not going to be the most reliable friend of capitalism. His successor probably won’t be, either.

I just don’t think it does conservatives any good to focus on it.There are millions of socially conservative, economically liberal blue-collar Catholics in this country, many of them in swing states. Better to make common cause where possible (and there are lots of opportunities) than to re litigate differences. It’s a lot easier to win with them than without them. And we can’t count on the next Democratic nominee doing the job for us by making insulting comments about “clinging to guns and religion.”

I’m not accusing you, personally, of doing that. I was just concerned that that was the direction the thread was headed toward, and so I tried to nip it early. Lesson learned. Next time, I’ll be sure to either make a top-level comment or reply to someone else.

Such “Catholics” have already separated themselves from Catholicism: like every “Catholic” politician who votes to fund near-infanticide, to normalize homosexuality, to push birth control, etc. etc. etc., they have in a sense excommunicated themselves.

In the 1960′s the Left introduced “The New Morality” which was basically
Nietzsche’s will to power as seen in “Beyond Good and Evil,” the title telling you everything you need to know about the philosophy’s attachment to traditional morality.

The joke in the 1960′s was that “The New Morality” was simply “The Old Immorality.” Except it has not remained a joke: the Left is still pushing Nietzsche’s ideas and have succeeded in too many areas.

Those who think ideas of philosophers do not matter except to scholars are ignorant of History.

I have to get in here. I am Catholic. If you are, your middle name and your Confirmation name should be one of a saint. Now…people…don’t go off the deep end…I am not a saint. However, I had to learn about Saint Francis of Assisi to take the name at Confirmation. So, why did this pope choose this name…because of the sentiments espoused in the St. Francis Prayer:

Lord, make me an instrument of your peace.
Where there is hatred, let me sow love;
where there is injury,pardon;
where there is doubt, faith;
where there is despair, hope;
where there is darkness, light;
and where there is sadness, joy.

O Divine Master, grant that I may not so much seek
to be consoled as to console;
to be understood as to understand;
to be loved as to love.
For it is in giving that we receive;
it is in pardoning that we are pardoned;
and it is in dying that we are born to eternal life. Amen

Please go see Repairman Jack’s column with my reply and you will see that Obama’s Social Justice and the word Justice cannot coexist. This you will continue to hear from Obama as the Catholic vote becomes important in the upcoming mid-terms when he tries to sway our new citizens from south of the border.

This is not just about the poor as is reported by the press. This is about fairness…and you will note that this Pope does not see himself as above other people…meaning that he had his own apartment rather than that provided by the Church.

Well…Streiff…I went and read about St. Francis Xavier and it looked like you are right, especially the Jesuit line…however, this is what I read.
http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/opinion/2013/03/14/new-popes-name-latin-and-jesuit-roots-hint-at-how-will-serve/

I was only thinking of St. Francis of Assisi because I think my father wanted me to learn something …i.e., the prayer aforementioned.

If material in the public domain has anything to contribute to economic activity and growth (and it does), the starving of the public domain for a period of decades is a blow to the economy that the rich and the economic incumbents can get around by licensing the IP and the upstarts and the poor cannot.

The idea that government handing out land is not redistribution of wealth because you had to farm it (or today, build a house on it) just doesn’t fly. You’re buying into the idea a priori that there are no capitalist forms of redistribution for no good reason. It isn’t electorally productive and it’s not even traditional. Land falls into disuse, is taken by government, and parceled out again to private interests. This cycle is as old as mass casualty events from war and disease and has nothing to do with socialism. What do you think tax sales do? But sometimes the supply overwhelms the demand.

Look at the wilds of Gary, Indiana or Detroit, Michigan. That land needs to get into private, productive hands but too much of it isn’t because there are no takers.

If by having an agenda you mean “made a coherent argument and responded civilly to being challenged, as opposed to throwing a temper tantrum” then, yes. Guilty as charged. I had an agenda. At the risk of excommunication, it’s rather a shame that you didn’t.