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Romney and his supporters need to answer this, if he wants support from the Base

By: Finrod (Diary) | April 12th, 2012 at 11:15 AM |

RESIZE: AAA

I keep seeing Romney supporters saying how we need to get behind and support Romney so we can defeat Obama in the general election. The problem I’m seeing is that pretty much it’s the only reason they’re giving, and while it’s a respectable reason, it’s not a motivating reason. Romney has spent the entire primary season burning his bridges with the Base, and it’s our fault we don’t want to swim the river to go support him? Do his supporters need reminding of the nasty ads that Romney and his PAC put out against such good men as Rick Perry, Newt Gingrich, and Rick Santorum? What’s said is said; you cannot unring a bell.

My challenge to Mitt Romney and his supporters is this: Give us a reason to support him that isn’t “we have to get rid of Obama”. More specifically, the following:

Give us one reason to support Mitt Romney over Barack Obama that would not also apply to supporting Hillary Clinton over Barack Obama.

That shouldn’t be that hard, should it?

Tags: 2012 election, Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton, Mitt Romney

COMMENTS

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samcoastie

you might try mittromney.com. I recommend starting with his op-eds, because that’s the stuff he put out there for everyone to see and if you look at it you don’t have to worry about anything being taken out of context. Mitt also can’t claim he mis-spoke or anything. He’s got to stand behind whatever he put out there in print.

If you simply don’t believe anything he says, then you’re still too bitter to move forward. He’s performed some flips in his life, but his platform has been pretty steady since 2007.

Finrod

For starters, you can try answering the question I asked (why Romney instead of Hillary), instead of answering the imaginary question that you want to answer. Where did I question Mitt’s honesty? Was Mitt being honest when he was trashing other candidates more conservative than he is?

It’s up to you to make the case for Mitt Romney here, since I don’t exactly see him posting here (unlike Newt Gingrich and Rick Santorum, most recently). So far your response is made of FAIL.

Ann_W

I remember there being some good op-ed’s so that seems like it is a reasonable answer to what you are asking.

But naturally my reasoning is faulty as I support him, too.
samcoastie

He posts to the whole country in the form of op-eds. Why would he limit himself to Redstate readers when he can submit to the nation? That’s why I suggested you look there.

I do think there is inherent unfairness in the fact that Romney is able to put out an op-ed and get it published nationally. He’s been doing it since 2008. I don’t believe Santorum had that level of access. If he did have access I find it hard to believe he wouldn’t have used it, instead of posting here.

That said here’s a link to a July 2010 op-ed opposing ratification of the START treaty by Romney that he took a lot of flack for from both sides of the aisle at the time. It should meet your criteria of something that makes him a better choice than Obama that couldn’t also apply to Hillary.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/07/05/AR2010070502657.html

I didn’t like the negative campaigns run by any of the candidates and their PACs. I had varying doubts in all of the candidates, which I won’t go into here. Because of that I decided to save my limited coin until a candidate had been chosen to go against Obama. I didn’t want it wasted attacking other Republicans, I want it to be used against Obama.

streiff

is increasing by the day. If you have doubts about what that means ask the Larsen whelps why they aren’t posting here.

evictobama

Not people who support the GOP nominee. Obama is the one who is blocking any hope of economic recovery, either now or in the future.

I can’t wait to see the day that Obama leaves Washington for good and I hope that Mitt is the guy who puts the boots to him.

grapenephi

1. He’s not Hillary.
2. He’s not a hothead.
3. He actually has a plan that will work for our economy.
4. He has very strong conservative values, even if it did take him a while to be able to articulate them.
5. American will succeed again under his leadership.
6. He obviously has the support of a majority of conservatives, and it is the vocal minority, like yourself and pretty much all of Redstate that pitches such a fit about him. Grow up.
7. He is going to make appointments that conservatives and the country can rally behind.
8. Too far to the right is not just unelectable, it isn’t even good sense. Sure, people want to see others who are as close to them as possible be put into high positions, but someone who is a bit more middle-ground on some things will have a better chance of getting the really important decisions to pass Congress and public opinion.

Are these answers direct and non-dodge-like enough for you?

garfieldjl

1. The fact he isn’t Hillary isn’t a reason.
2. As far as not being a hot head, he was losing his temper in an interview with Bret Bauer (sp?) from Fox News. I could see losing one’s temper with Keith Olberman, Chris Matthews, etc. But Bret Bauer (sp?), good grief.
3. What plan? Romney has yet to show any plans, no bold initiatives, nothing. I know Newt has a plan that will work to get our economy going, heck he probably has at least 4 back ups if that doesn’t work. I really don’t think Romney has much of a plan tbh.
4. Romney is not a Conservative, at best he’s a moderate. Is Romney more conservative than Obama, probably, but then so is Hillary Clinton.
5. How can he do that, when he apparently doesn’t have a plan. If his plan was a good one, he wouldn’t have needed to smear everyone else in the race.
6. No, he quite honestly doesn’t have the support of a majority of Conservatives, people have just given up and are voting against Obama. People aren’t that enthusiastic about Romney.
7. Romney’s record would indicate otherwise, if he’s really changed and become more conservative that’s great, but I consider what someone has actually done to be a better indicator that one’s rhetoric to get elected.
8. Actually, I think Romney’s being a moderate at best could cost us the general election. He doesn’t present a clear enough choice between himself and Obama. He acts like an idiot to keep getting bogged down in the class warfare rhetoric.

The primary isn’t truely over, and Obama is already leading Romney around by the nose. Romney should have slammed the media for continuing the argument about Romney’s dog, and said there were more important issues.

Has he done so? Nope.

Gingrich has though, and has slammed Obama yet again.

We can’t afford another term of Obama, if we don’t have someone that is firmly committed to turning things around elected, we are not going to have a country. That means we can’t have someone in there content to just let things slide.

If Romney is going to be lead around by the class warfare attacks, and a bunch of other distractions, we’re going to lose and lose badly.

You have to sell Romney on his actual record, we all know the media is going to nail him on any attempt to re-write history otherwise you are just handing Obama ammunition to use against Romney.

grapenephi

Mittromney.com is a great place to read his plans. He definitely has good plans; plans that will work.

Here is the main problem behind your thesis: America isn’t concerned that he’s a “moderate.” As far as moderates go, he isn’t even that moderate. You, and other like you, project your extremism onto everyone else, and you draw the conclusion that it will cost us the election. That is incorrect. Someone who can connect with more people, rather than being divisive, is going to reel in more votes.

I’m not sure what rock you’ve been living under, but the primaries are over, my friend. He is going to be the GOP candidate. What crybabies and sore losers are going to do is cost us the election by continuing to give Obama more amunition. If the Obama camp can continue to say, “Look, he can’t even unite his own people (you know, because of people like you perpetuating that idea),”then we are going to hand over the election on a silver platter.

garfieldjl

If you want to use falsehoods to try to promote Romney, fine. Just don’t come whining to me when you cause Romney to lose and lose badly.

My pointing out that people are playing loose with the facts, isn’t going to affect Romney one way or the other, cause the information will come out whether I point them out now or not. Actually the situation will be a whole lot worse if I don’t point it out to you guys now, because right now you’re having someone that doesn’t want Obama to have 4 more years point out the mistake you’re making. If you want to end up causing Romney to implode, because of people overselling him, then go right ahead.

Talk is cheap, this will be an extremely dirty election, and handing Obama ammunition by way of puffing up Romney’s record, and all Obama would have have to talk a small sewing needle and prick the balloon that is Romney’s campaign and well you can imagine the results.

If you want to sell Romney, you have to use rock hard facts, not a bunch of hot gas. The MSM will be looking for anything they can exploit to destroy Romney’s credibility, that’s why we have to make darn sure that we don’t give them one. So stick to the facts and the facts only.
grapenephi

Tell me how Romney’s record does anything but better his position? Are you going to thump the tired drum of “Romney Care?” That was a state-centered plan. It was what the people of MA needed, and what Romney supports is health care being in the hands of the state, i.e., small government. Are the RedHate people against that now?

Don’t talk of facts when the biggest source of hot air is coming from the man in the mirror.
garfieldjl

Government does not have the right to force us into contracts with private entities simply because we are breathing. In my opinion it is a violation of the 13th Amendment to the US Constitution.

The fact you call us the RedHate people, shows why so many Conservatives can’t stand Mitt Romney and his supporters.
gekster

Isn’t that stereotyping.

You and a few others who support Gingrich are so anti Romney it borders on hate in itself, so we shouldn’t support Gingrich because of that?

At the least I gave you more credit than that.
Now I will have to rethink my opinion,

Oh, wait. I see. You must know that Romney called him and told him to say that.

Baaad Romney..
Very baaad Romney.
grapenephi

Mitt Romney will rebuild the foundations of the American economy on the principles of free enterprise, hard work, and innovation. His plan seeks to reduce taxes, spending, regulation, and government programs. It seeks to increase trade, energy production, human capital, and labor flexibility. It relinquishes power to the states instead of claiming to have the solution to every problem.

Any American living through this economic crisis will immediately recognize the severity of the break that Mitt Romney proposes from our current course. He is calling for a fundamental change in Washington?s view of how economic growth and prosperity are achieved, how jobs are created, and how government can support these endeavors. It is at once a deeply conservative return to policies that have served our nation well and a highly ambitious departure from the policies of our current leadership. In short, it is a plan to get America back to work.
garfieldjl

You want me to trust someone cause they simply spout off a bunch of rhetoric.

Gingrich had a record, and presented plans as to why he could be believed.

Perry had the record, which is why he could be believed.

Cain had the record of being a business manager, he ran businesses as a CEO, President, and Manager.

Santorum has a record on social issues.

Romney has a record of Bain Capital. Worse, his record as Governor is of him doing the opposite of much of what he’s saying he’ll do. Why should anyone believe Romney? Your insulting conservatives instead of trying to make the case to demonstrate why Romney should be believed, demonstrates to me that you are either:
1. Either an Obama shill, that was pushing Romney to try to make sure Obama won in November.
2. That you are a Mittbot that can’t handle the fact that there are some serious issues your candidate will have to address if he’s going to be the nominee.
grapenephi

Again, Trible, it’s not hard to find, if you actually look for it.

Management consulting
Romney was heavily recruited and chose to remain in Massachusetts to work for Boston Consulting Group (BCG), thinking that working as a management consultant to a variety of companies would prepare him for a future job as a chief executive. Romney was part of a 1970s wave of top graduates who chose to go into consulting rather than join a major company directly. Romney’s legal and business education proved useful in his job, and he became a rising star while applying BCG principles such as the growth-share matrix.
As Governor
Romney stated that Massachusetts finished fiscal 2004 with a $700 million surplus. Official state figures said that fiscal 2005 finished with a $594.4 million surplus. For fiscal 2006, the surplus was $720.9 million according to official figures. The state’s “rainy day fund”, more formally known as the Stabilization Fund, was replenished through government consolidation and reform. At the close of fiscal year 2006, the fund enjoyed a $2.155 billion balance.
Romney successfully closed the largest deficit in his state’s history without raising taxes.
As a result of the fiscal turnaround, Romney repeatedly pushed the state legislature to roll back the state income tax from 5.3% to 5.0% (Massachusetts has a flat income tax). He also proposed a “tax-free shopping day”, a property tax relief for Seniors, and a manufacturing tax credit.

There are issues for every candidate to face if they are going to be nominee, especially when they are continuously torn apart by their own supposed allies. There will come a time, in the very near future (since you’re waiting for the inevitable) where all good republicans will have to put aside their differences and come to this mans’s side. Stop being a baby, grow up, and stop trying to do Oblamo’s job for him.
garfieldjl

He left Massachusetts in the hole, the only reason it looked like he left them with a surplus was that states like Texas, Indiana, Ohio, Maine, Florida, etc. we on the hook to pay for Romneycare courtesy of the Federal Government.

northeastred

There’s only one way to look at Mitt Romney with regard to the dog incident. Romney is an A**hole. No two ways about it. This time, we have an A**hole as our nominee. He’s not a guy you’d want to have a beer with. He’d be polite, but all the time he’d be staring at your dirty shoes, or your fat belly and he’d be counting the seconds until he could get away from you and the rest of the unwashed Republican masses.

McCain was a guy you’d have a beer with. Same with W. And they were both disasters for Republicans. So lets give this “one of the guys to have a beer with” thing a rest. We need an A**hole to run against Obama, not a regular guy. Romney is our A**hole. But in a good way. He’s no Dick Cheney.

northeastred

He’s trying to get elected. This is a man who was governor of Massachusetts. He wants to be a Republican president. Of course he’s going to shift his past stances. Once he’s president, he’ll be conservative. He won’t be able to strike out on his own and start imposing his more moderate beliefs through policy. Frankly, I don’t care if he privately detests the severe right, Nascar, gun-loving, evangelical base. The great thing about Mitt Romney is that he’s goal oriented, and he won’t allow his beliefs to get in the way of becoming president.

natek58

Bitter doesn’t begin to describe me and others like me. To dismiss us a simpy “too bitter to move forward” is a total insult.

We are ENRAGED by the situation we now find ourselves in. With Romney we do not have a reasonable alternative to Obama. He IS Obama-lite. He IS NOT a conservative. Anyone that spends his entire political life being something other than a conservative should not have the temerity to come out claiming to be a conservative when that becomes the dominant political theme.

Romney has hijacked the conservative banner, and since Santorum dropped out, he is already moving to the left. He is now officially taking us for granted . He doesn’t think that he needs to pander to us anymore, and he is going to try to convince people in the middle that he isn’t truly all that conservative. Why shouldn’t we be enraged? After accomplishing what we did in 2010, for the party to throw us under the bus is more than just insulting. It is gauling, it is infuriating, it is ENRAGING.

The only thing that he can do at this point to get us on board is to select a real true conservative as his running mate. Santorum, Palin, Perry, even Gingrich would be acceptable – but that isn’t going to happen. Nope, he’s going to go with a moderate because that’s where he thinks he needs to go to get enough votes.

acat

A conservative veep nom is, as McCain proved, a meaningless gesture. I’ll pass on repeating the Palin fiasco and ending up with another young conservative getting their career truncated by a squish.

I want conservatives in the *cabinet*.

Let’s start with HHS. Norm Coleman is un-effing-acceptable. Period. He wasn’t that great a Senator, he couldn’t figure out that Stuart Smalley was going to cheat the election, and he doesn’t have a problem with Obamacare. He needs to be gone from the Romney campaign.

Bolton needs to be at State or the U.N. Don’t care which.

I’d like to see Daniels back at OMB, although he could fit in almost anywhere and do okay.

Put a warrior in charge of DoD, and then *listen* to him. What’s Petraeus up to these days?

That, far more than wasting a conservative in a pitcher-of-warm-spit job, will be convincing.

Mew

natek58

We need a good cabinet too. At this point the message of the VEEP selection will be huge. It will be a signal of where he intends to go with the campaign.

We need to keep the pressure on right now to make sure he doesn’t go Moderate on us (but he already is).

acat

It’s pure symbolism.

Tell me what impact any of these veeps or veep-candidates had:

Spiro Agnew
Nelson Rockefeller
Dan Quayle
Jack Kemp
Dick Cheney
Sarah Palin

Seriously. It’s a pitcher of warm spit* position.

Mew

* technically, John Nance Garner said it’s “not worth a bucket of warm piss”, but we gots to be polite…

rightlane1111

Dick Cheney…I think that his previous experience helped Bush. Cheney ran a lot of operations behind the scenes.

Sarah…well, Kitty…who did the people REALLY turn out for when McCain was winning? Who…right now, has more star power than Obama…Sarah. I think people at that time would have wanted Sarah more than McCain.
acat

Seriously.

I don’t want the veep slot, I want the cabinet.

Mew
rightlane1111

on Cheney or Palin. Quayle could not have dragged Mr. Globalist anywhere. I agree with the above choices with the exception of Cheney and Palin.
acat

but because he couldn’t run himself (heart issues) he also squashed the chance of setting up a proper succession.

I fully expected Cheney to retire in 2005, for Bush to nominate a relatively conservative governor (Jeb or Perry may have been a bit too nepotist… Sanford, at the time, may have fit) who could run in 2008 as successor.

Mew
rightlane1111

This is what W should have done. However…give it up…Sarah will change our political viewpoints to the RIGHT as long as she lives…forgetting McCain. Quite frankly…had the Left not smeared her completely…she has more common sense and courage than all the candidates running today. Is she unelectable…I hope not…but then we have to wish that our electorate were more intelligent.

I will not argue…point taken on the rest, Kitty
redeyes

Rarely brought up but oh so true. Politically calculating, but showing no concern for the future!

Xasteius

director of the CIA.

Ron Paul for executive hatchman (kills the part of government we don’t want). Newt for Press Secretary or Sec of State.

samcoastie

First off, what have you seen to indicate that Mitt is moving to the left now that Santorum has ended the primary race? Or that he is going to chose a moderate for veep?

I have 5 kids aged 11 and under. I know how to deal with them when they are “enraged”. “Too bitter to move forward” was clearly not accurate. It would have been more accurate to say the following:

If you can read the numerous op-eds that Romney has put out and still find yourself unable to find a single reason to support him that would not also apply to Hillary Clinton, then you are clearly throwing an irrational and childish fit. Put yourself on time out and don’t come out until you have calmed down.

xymbaline

And there’s probably good reason that you didn’t.

gekster

You’re a poor excuse for a tribble.
arc_utah would be ashamed of you.

xymbaline

We notice these things.
evictobama

You got a mouse in your pocket.

You only speak for yourself.

You tribbles just don’t get it. Post your anti-Romney rants on some other website please.

http://908StraightSt.wordpress.com/ mbecker908

a strategy to stop Romney. Put up or STFU.

xymbaline

No text. Too busy laughing.
evictobama

You have nothing positive to say about anything.

Take your negativeness elsewhere.

Kyle-MI

Granted, his MA record is not clean as the driven snow, but his current positions seems to be pretty much in line with conservative ideals. Maybe you don’t believe him, but that is hardly a case of Romney burning bridges with the base.

Here is a crazy idea that just might work, give him a chance. Criticize him if he steps out of line, but, until he does, keep on open mind.

Finrod

Mitt Romney has done precisely that for yes the entire primary season. Something like 91% of his ad budget has gone to trashing other Republicans, instead of telling us why he’s the best candidate.

If you don’t think Romney hasn’t burned his bridges with the base, you’re looking in the wrong direction.

Finrod

If you DO think Romney hasn’t burned his bridges with the base, etc.
Kyle-MI

He is not suppose to attack his primary challengers, and they never attacked him?

And attacking his primary challengers is burning bridges with the base?

Finrod

Romney outspent his challengers up to 50 to 1 in tv ads, with over 99 percent of them being attack ads, often making questionable assertions or misleading statements.

If you don’t understand how that nukes Ronald Reagan’s Eleventh Commandment from orbit, you never will.

Kyle-MI

So now Romney is not suppose to spend money trying to get the nomination? I am sure you would criticize any of the other candidates if they had a money advantage and had the audacity to actually use it. You do know that politics isn’t a game of bean bags, don’t you?
garfieldjl

http://melissablogs.com/2012/02/29/mitt-romney-supporters-to-rick-santorum-supporters-submit-fools/

I suggest people read it, and Romney supporters should take note.

[quote]No, the problem Romney faces is that his campaign and his supporters have run such a foul campaign.

Think of all the negative things said against other candidates by Romney and his supporters. Did they give a damn how their words would be played back against Newt or Santorum if either of them were the nominee?

Did the editors of National Review worry in December about the Marvin the Martian cover being used against Newt? Did the Romney campaign worry how its attempt to portray Newt as crazy would be used against Newt?

And how did Romney get to this point that he is the presumptive nominee?

By going massively negative on everyone else and using his campaign wealth to smother others. His carpet bombing of Newt in Iowa and Florida is the only thing that kept Romney from the abyss. I still see non-stop anti-Santorum ads on TV.

Romney has embittered a large segment of the people he will need to rally around him. Profound and historic dislike of Obama is the only thing that will prevent a third party movement or a massive stay-at-home movement.

And it hasn?t stopped. Romney supporters have shown themselves to be sore winners, and there?s nothing worse than sore winners heading into a general election.
[/quote]
http://legalinsurrection.com/2012/04/if-romney-loses-to-obama-it-will-be-because-of-his-supporters-not-his-opponents/
xymbaline

Outspending your opponents 20 to 1 with 93% of the ads being personal attacks is something honest people don’t need to do.

This is what political vipers do when their case has no merit.
http://908StraightSt.wordpress.com/ mbecker908

Please lay out a plan to stop Romney on a state by state basis, explain your strategy and assumptions and where the money to compete comes from.

The group of you – and especially garfield – haven’t produced either a rational thought or a plan to stop Romney. All you do is come in here and whine relentlessly.

Produce a plan. Then you’ve got a basis for discussion. All you, and your ilk, have done this far is engage in mental masturbation.
gekster

tribbles.

They continually slam one, and only one candidate.
They do not show, or give reasons to, support any other candidate.
Thier main goal is to try to tear down thier targeted candidate.

A little leftist, don’t ya think.

(another tribble has stated supporting Gingrich, but as of date has not stated any reasons as to why. It’s called trying to deflect. )
xymbaline

of respectful discourse?

Projection.
http://908StraightSt.wordpress.com/ mbecker908

It’s really not that hard if you understand the process and can do some research. It would be a great starting point for a discussion. In fact, what you and your ilk are doing is avoiding any discussion of reality and engaging in mental masturbation. You can stop at any point and produce a plan that we can discuss.

I did it before Santorum dropped out. garfield and his buddies didn’t want to – ore more likely couldn’t – deal with it. So produce please.
nepanyrush

Garfield already stated previously that if Romney were the nominee, that there would be a 50% chance he would vote for Obama.

You are aguing with someone who should would actually vote for Obama should his coin flip come out that way.

I don’t even know why he posts here unless he seeks to try and drive up support for Obama or disiullusion Republican voters. Just think about who you are arguing with: someone who might very well vote for Obama if you trust his own words.
nepanyrush

nt
xymbaline

As I’ve said later on, it’s like playing “I got your nose” with a two year old.
gekster

What is ?The Hinz Rule??
This ?rule? originates from a diary by RSer David Hinz, where he encouraged us to not ?feed the trolls.? When someone invokes the Hinz Rule, it says ?OK, folks, that?s enough, let?s not encourage this troll-like person to continue?. But what?s a troll, you ask? ?Troll? is a common term used to describe Internet message-board troublemakers.
samcoastie

it could get your candidate the nomination is called politics. Poor attacks usually hurt the attacker more than the attacked. See Newt’s attacks on Mitt regarding Bain, for an example. Long term they hurt Newt, not Mitt.

Attacking another Republican when it will not benefit anyone except the Dems is vengeful and unwise.

With that said, if Romney does anything from here forward to indicate a drift to the left we should all sound off about it. Support doesn’t have to mean trust.
Finrod

Ronald Reagan got the Republican nomination in 1980 without trashing his Republican competitors. In fact, he coined Reagan’s Eleventh Commandment: Thou Shalt Not Speak Ill Of A Fellow Republican.

Mitt Romney has taken Reagan’s Eleventh Commandment, poured gasoline and napalm on it, dragged it out to an open field, and torched it with a flamethrower.

And you’re applauding him for doing it.

This is why people like me loathe and despise Mitt Romney and his apologists such as you.
http://conservativemormonmom.blogspot.com ew88

It’s the liberal media who paints him otherwise. There are plenty of true conservatives who chose Romney over Santorum and Gingrich because they both contributed to the growth of government and the deficit. Each and every time I’ve heard Romney speak I’ve been impressed with his candor, sincerity, and desire to help the people in this country. Listening to his explanations erased all remaining doubts I had about his record. Ann Coulter is a staunch advocate, and she puts numbers and history behind her analyses. Just because the liberal media has targeted him as the front-runner doesn’t mean they’re accurate. I’ve got quite a few posts up about the topic over at
www.conservativemormonmom.blogspot.com. Feel free to check it out.
ceili_dancer

Wasn’t she the one who said we had to go with Christie, because he was the only one who could stop the liberal Romney? And as soon as Christie bowed out and endorse Mitt, she changed her tune quickly and announced that Romney care is the conservative alternative to Obama care.
Kyle-MI

But go ahead, be the noble man and vote for Obama. I am sure he will respect you and won’t run any mean, nasty ads against Republicans. Maybe he will grant waivers to the 50 states and work to repeal Obamacare. Maybe he will appoint originalist judges. Maybe he will cut federal government spending. Maybe he will reduce federal regulations. Maybe he will remove the constraints to domestic energy production. And even if he doesn’t, at least he will be nice to his opponents.
gekster

Reagan followed this “commandment” during the first five primaries during the 1976 Republican primary against incumbent Gerald Ford, all of which he lost. He abandoned this approach in the North Carolina Primary and beat Ford 52?46, regaining momentum and winning a majority of delegates chosen after that date. Former Texas governor John Connally speculated that Reagan’s attacks weakened Ford in his contest with his general election opponent and eventual successor, Jimmy Carter.[1]

(I know it isn’t the 1980 election, but what the heck)

Now since I’m “trolling” on your diary by saying something contrary to a poster, albeit you, hit the contact link and complain.
Martin Knight

What can Romney and his campaign say or do that will make *you* support him? I’m not talking about the base now but you personally.

If Mitt Romney were standing in front of you now and asked you; what can I do to win your support? – what would your answer be?
Tbone

NT
acat

Veepstakes are nice, but we saw how that worked out with Palin and Quayle.

I want to see some commitment where it counts.

Mew
snowshooze

Never gonna happen.

grapenephi

I love how you single out Romney for negative campaigning. It’s funny, when you do a simple Youtube search for “romney negative ad” and the like, you know what you get? You get a bunch of negative ads ABOUT Romney from the other hopefulls, and a bunch of news clips talking about Romney using negative campaign ads. What Romney did do that could be considered “negative” was sooo far under the negative bar when compared to his competition. However, everyone latches on to this B.S. about Romney and his negative campaign ads.

Romney had to spend a lot of money defending himself and clarifying things because of what the other guys were doing. He never lied, and just because what he says about the other guys might hurt their case to prove they are the better candidates doesn’t make it negative, nor does it make it untrue.

avgjo

I’m going to vote for Romney. I’m going to work on DOTV (Drag out the Vote) for Romney. Not because I like Romney. Not because I believe its patriotic or smart (how is voting for someone who will keep the seat warm for the next dim president either?). I’m doing it because I do love my country, and while I think a Romney presidency would be a disaster, at least the damage would be slowed down and that buys us precious time to figure something out.

All this said, I wish the Romneybots would drop the sanctimonious, condescending, very liberalesque malarkey about ‘unity’, ‘we need to band together’, ‘you need to get on board’, etc. etc. After the various insults to conservatives from both Mitt and his supporters, the least they could do is say ‘please’.
Ender

Romney himself gives the reasons over and over – he would cut the deficit, reduce the size of the government, cut taxes where they should be cut, improve our military, make our world standing stronger, be tougher on China, be a good friend to Israel, be friendly to business to grow our job market, move us towards greater energy independence, etc etc. What’s the point of us repeating it if you automatically either don’t listen or don’t believe him?

All those things are reasons to vote for Romney over Obama and do not apply to Hillary. I am sure there will be more of these types of diaries because nothing Romney says would satisfy some people.

garfieldjl

They are often 180s from each other.

Obama also said he would cut the defict, remember.

Part of it is that Romney doesn’t acknowledge he made mistakes when he was a Governor, and continues to defend Romneycare.

gekster

I hate Romney I hate Romney I hate romney
I hate Romney I hate Romney I hate romney
I hate Romney I hate Romney I hate romney
I hate Romney I hate Romney I hate romney
I hate Romney I hate Romney I hate romney
I hate Romney I hate Romney I hate romney
I hate Romney I hate Romney I hate romney

You’r special. I only gave the other candidates two lines
Finrod

Of those things that Ender says that Romney has said, well, Obama said most of those too.

Romney has also said a lot of things about the other Republicans that either is an outright lie (e.g. claiming he’d never seen an attack ad that had ‘My name is Mitt Romney and I approve this message’ in it) or gross incompetence on his part, so you need to understand that whispering sweet nothings in our ears doesn’t have the appeal that Romneyites seem to think it should.
Kyle-MI

(I am not saying that Romney is saintly.) There are tons of other people throughout history who have changed, Paul is just the one that came to mind first.

aesthete

after his conversion — in fact, during his first missionary trip, it was Barnabas who was in charge (Paul, as you might recall, was compared to Hermes, the loquacious messenger god of the Greeks, while Barnabas was compared to big daddy Zeus).

So I take it that in invoking this analogy, you support Mitt Romney as the VP of a conservative President — after a few more years of seasoning, of course.

Kyle-MI

So I wouldn’t mind Romney as a VP, but those darn pesky primary voters had other ideas. Democracy can be messy.

And I wasn’t trying to make an analogy. Just saying that past performance is no guarantee of future returns. I would rather have someone with a more conservative record, but I am not going to line up the firing squad before he commits a crime.

Finrod

Because it hasn’t happened yet, and people like you don’t want it to happen.

jon11

but ok, i’ll play along.

reasons to support romney over hilary…

1)The ryan plan. You know, that thing newt called ‘right wing social engineering.’

Im pretty sure hilary ain’t for that.

Need more?

2)Immigration. Romney isn’t for amnesty.

More?

3)Supreme court justices. Doubt he and hilary would have the same people in mind.

More?

4)Mitt’s worked in the real world. Built a business. Signed the front of a paycheck. Created jobs. Hilary never has. Nor has Santorum or Newt, for that matter.

More?

5)He has great hair.

Im going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that you’re actually joking about this and that you’re just a tit angry and needing to vent.

Remington_Steele

.
Finrod

If you don’t understand by now why former Perry and Gingrich and Santorum supporters are annoyed at Romney, you’ll never get it.

The Ryan plan: so give me the details of Romney’s support for this. Take as much time and space as you need.

Immigration: not likely to be a major issue in this election, since the sour economy has slowed the flood to a minor trickle.

Supreme Court justices: Romney must have a sterling record of this in Massachusetts for you to bring up judges, right? Compare Romney to Bush Sr., who may have given us Clarence Thomas but also gave us David Souter. That’s not really positive for Romney.

Real world experience? Jimmy Carter had that too. Look at how it turned out for him. In any case, this is something that’s more of a “Yeah, and?” than something that will inspire conservatives to work for him.

Great hair? Are you serious? Conservatives are going to turn out and vote for Romney because of his hair? John Edwards had great hair too.

The fact that you made a decent effort here, though, puts you ahead of every other Romney supporter on this thread.

samcoastie

texastaxpayer is, too. He is also rational and ready to join the real fight.

I hope you can find your way there, too. I am sure you are an ally in the war against Obama and the progressive left. You would be a more effective ally if you pointed all your guns in the right direction!

Remington_Steele

best argument on the whole page.
xymbaline

if ‘rational’ means “I just tied my brain behind my back so I could be a true Romney Zombie.

samcoastie

admitting that while you detest Romney, Obama is the clear and present danger.

Rational means admitting that while Romney has many weaknesses there are areas where he is clearly better than Obama.

Rational means admitting that while you can and SHOULD continue to support the candidate of your choice, Romney will be the nominee of the republican party. Even Newt has said Romney will be the nominee.

Irrational is what you are doing. Bashing Mitt now means helping Obama, not giving your candidate a chance.

jon11

and your challenge was to give one reason romney would be better than hilary.

i gave 5.

The details of his support of the ryan plan? He has formally endorsed the ryan budget:

http://www.politico.com/blogs/burns-haberman/2012/03/romney-endorses-ryan-budget-118079.html

And paul ryan has formally endorsed him.

What do you want him to do? Build an alter to it and offer up sacrifices?

Endorsing it is as much as any R did in the primary. Gingrich savaged it before he realized the political consequences, and santorum kept calling for zeroing out taxes on manufacturers, something ryan and every conservative economist in america panned as govt ‘picking winners and losers.’ same thing the left likes to do.

Santo certainly wasn’t any more in favor of the ryan plan than romney.

Perry has been irrelevant for so long i can’t remember what he was for.

I understand why former perry and gingrich and santo supporters are upset.

They wanted a culture warrior first and foremost…and they didn’t get it.

I wanted a guy who could turn around the economy, get us off the glide path to becoming Greece…someone who’s created jobs… and could potentially beat obama.

I got it so I’m happy.

But the fact that you are seriously grappling with this ‘romney is no better than hillary’ malarky shows a deep disconnect from reality and as such you’re not likely to find any fact based argument persuasive.

I can understand how you feel in some sense because even though id have voted for santo i’d have hated to. A guy who will vote against right to work but doesn’t mind govt. opining on what people ought to be doing or not doing in the bedroom seems the worst of both worlds, from a conservative viewpoint.

But bad as he was he’d still be better than hilary, or obama.

I liked Newt, but as they say, his baggage had baggage and he just didn’t have a chance
Martin Knight

I doubt you’ll be convinced even if somehow Romney gets elected and ends up slashing taxes, cutting the debt in half, downsizing Govt and pushing Miguel Estrada unto the SCOTUS.

So why should any Romney supporter bother? You cannot and will not be convinced anyway … so why are you bothering with this yourself?

garfieldjl

Looks like a self-fulfilling prophecy, no you guys won’t convince anyone if you don’t even bother to make an attempt.

If it were Gingrich in the lead right now and you all were holdouts, I’d be trying to convince you to get on board, by pointing out Gingrich’s record, what his plans are on getting this country fixed, etc.

I wouldn’t be calling it a lost cause and bully you, nor would I try to silence you.

I can make a case as to why Gingrich would be a good President, can you make a case for Romney?

gekster

I hate Romney I hate Romney I hate romney
I hate Romney I hate Romney I hate romney
I hate Romney I hate Romney I hate romney
I hate Romney I hate Romney I hate romney
I hate Romney I hate Romney I hate romney
I hate Romney I hate Romney I hate romney
I hate Romney I hate Romney I hate romney

xymbaline

n/t

gekster

Could you answer the queston I posed to you.
http://908StraightSt.wordpress.com/ mbecker908

.

Finrod

I’d rather not get the moderators involved, but if you post that same crap one more time, I’m sending email to contact@redstate.com.

gekster

They’ll stick it in the two filling cabinets on me.

And my response was to garfield the tribble.

(and it’s not like they havn’t seen my postings already, if I’m doing something wrong, they would surly let me know. They have before)
powertothepeople

I have gotten more contact complaints than anyone else on this board other than maybe MBecker.

Wish they kept a running count………..
APA Guy

Grow up…this is a blog, not your personal Romney bash-box. We all get challenged in these diaries. Very few of us go crying to mods when we do.
Finrod

.
powertothepeople
APA Guy

Take it to the bank.

FYI…never said I approve of what you subjectively coin “trolling”. I disapprove of the crying game you are engaging in.
powertothepeople

man your whining was amusing. Guess someone had to take the job from Doc.

Me on the side of Gekster, man hell has frozen over…………..j/k gekster, do not tell on me………….
Finrod

..
powertothepeople

but I find it funny you think you have your own section of the site that must remain free from dissent. And I find it even funnier that you not only call Gekster’s debate with the idiot trolling and that you publically whined and threatened to tell mommy.

Get a life!
Finrod

You’re the biggest bloody whiner I’ve seen on this site, and you have the gall to call others whiners? I’d be surprised that there is any intact glass within a mile of you the way you whine. Your intellectual rigor couldn’t support a feather and pet obedience school trainees have more class. The day you registered here, the average intelligence dropped several points, and site quality noticeably improves when you don’t post for a while.

Stick it where the sun don’t shine.
powertothepeople

Sticks and stones and so on.

But I bet you are still mad you do not get your way………….

But I am so sad you said such mean things about me and that we are not friends. Gosh, what am I to do?

Send that whiny contact message yet?
JSobieski

Would sign, not veto, Ryan-style reform of Medicare
Would sign, not veto, tax reform that lowered rates and reduced loopholes (Clinton might also do this, but Romney is more certain)
Would NOT push ways to publicly fund abortions
Would NOT push ways to shackle US foreign policy to the UN
http://impudent.edublogs.org/ kyle8

During a horrible primary in which we saw virtually all of the candidates resort to the worse sort of crass ad hominem bashing, and in which several candidates used left wing issues and talking points to attack each other,

Romney was the only one I heard making a clear defense of the free market, and of making profits.

grapenephi

Real conservatives wouldn’t “hold out” just because their guy didn’t get the nomination. I’ve been a Mitt supporter through and through since 2007. If Newt had been the guy, I would stand by him. Same goes for Santorum. Either of those men would have been a better choice than status quo. Same goes for Bachman, Perry, Paul, or even John Huntsman, for whom personally I held the least bit of excitement and/or optimism, even though we’re the same religion. While it would be good to have my cake, I would rather be able to eat it when the time comes to rally behind who the majority of republican voters have chosen.

snowshooze

I cannot tell you how sick I am of that drivel.

garfieldjl

I thought Romney was simply Obama wearing make-up, or was it Obama is simply Romney in a halloween mask…

Seriously, Romney has behaved just like Obama would all through these primaries.

I know Romney isn’t Obama, but I don’t like the fact he behaves like Obama.
snowshooze

Heck, I’d do it. If you ain’t cheating, you ain’t trying.

Finrod

If Romney does what you say, I’ll be the first to give him a standing ovation.

It’ll also be the first time in his entire political career that Mitt Romney has acted like a conservative, so I’m not holding my breath.

Why should you bother? Do you want the support of the base to help evict Obama, or don’t you? Do you really think Romney has a whelk’s chance in a supernova without the support of the base?

I want Obama gone, and Romney has no chance of doing that without the support of the conservative base. Unfortunately he doesn’t give a flying copulation in a rolling donut about the base, and from the looks of this thread, neither do his supporters.

Martin Knight

Here’s my challenge; what can Mitt Romney and his campaign say or do that will make you support him?

Anything at all.

aesthete

but only just: what is a capital gains tax cut (or other, extremely marginal areas where Romney has been uncharacteristically specific) in the face of our deficits, broken/contradictory/vague foreign policy, entitlements crisis, ObamaCare, and over-regulation?
David123

I expect President Romney to nominate judges with a more originalist philosophy than either Barrack Obama or Hillary Clinton would.

I expect President Romney to be more supportive of Israel than either Barrack Obama or Hillary Clinton would.

I expect President Romney will rein in the EPA and the NLRB more than either Barrack Obama or Hillary Clinton would.

zachv

Another term of Obama may push us to a 5-4 liberal court.

My big thing: I expect President Romney to put us on a path to reducing the deficit and paying off the debt, which is something I do not expect from wither Obama or Clinton.

xymbaline

After all this time, even his diehards aren’t clear about what he’ll do or not do.

Very telling.

http://908StraightSt.wordpress.com/ mbecker908

..
zachv

But, I apparently CAN expect you to gladly partake in the efforts to undermine conservatives and Republicans at every chance.
EyeOnThePrize

With the election 7 months down the road what languaging do you expect to see?
Keying in on the words “expect” and “hope” is grasping at straws — or straw men.
What the real deal happens to be is that you are throwing crap against the wall just to see what sticks. Are you suffering from a pervasive developmental disorder (as garfield admits ) as well or are you just tribbling for fun/waste of time?
samcoastie

is what you fear.

Mitt has been speaking and putting out op-eds like a conservative, without varying his positions, for 5 years now. Is it possible he has been lying all this time? Yes. But it is also possible he isn’t.

Romney is not a passionate idealogue. I believe a conservative approach is the best path for our nation both logically and morally. I hope Mitt has truly been convinced, at leat logically, that the conservative way is the best, but I don’t know it for a fact. I believe it may be true because Romney is more logical than idealogical and I believe the Conservative view is inherently sound and logical and the progressive view is not. While Romney is not a natural “core consrvative” I believe logic has led him here.

I hope you will acknowledge there is nothing more he can do to convince you he will do what he says except becoming President and actually doing what he says he will.

There is cause for hope with Romney. With Obama there is none.

You don’t have to ‘trust’ Romney and I would name you a fool if you did. But to say there is no reason to vote for Romney over Obama is not resonable.

Seedyrom

Romney supports the Ryan plan, though he didn’t go into detail. Fact is he’s not going to go into detail and give free ammo to Obama nor will Obama share the so called Grand Bargain. Best guess, like any politician, Romney will cherry pick the portions of the Ryan plan he likes and add his own ideas and sell it to congress.

Immigration, he’ll go for the Dream Act if the legislature wants it even though he downed the program. As for the border, the plan is to close it and push people out with EVerify. Don’t be surprised to find another McAmnesty like bill because both sides are flirting with it whether they say so or not. As well, the cost to deport one illegal costs over a 12 thousand dollars and goes up with legal, medical, fixed costs/ variables and transportation bills. While I’m against it, we have to remember that ICE deportation costs over $5 billion a year. Both parties want to win over latinos as some predict by 2050 they will be the majority voters.
http://cnsnews.com/news/article/feds-estimate-deportation-costs-12500-person

SCOTUS the party will bend him toward a likeable candidate. If the gop wins the senate then the process will be a little easier. I don’t see Romney going for a moderate nor a pro gay type. Sure he’s unpredictable but we’re stuck with him so read up on the facts and if he loses then the so called establishment control freaks lose far more because they will all deserve to be wiped out in 2014 and beyond.

Sooner we purge the animosity and focus on the end game the better. We’ve been given a gift of TIME to prepare for November. Romney will screw up and its up to us to push him while supporting him all the way!!!

xymbaline

“He’s not going to go into detail and give free ammo to Obama”?

Very convenient, isn’t it?

Keeps you from having to answer all those annoying questions.

I see why you like it.

gekster
http://908StraightSt.wordpress.com/ mbecker908

State by state. Thanks.
Seedyrom

choice or more idiotic rants. Run like a child.

Viet71

Note how xmbaline, in some of his/her comments, refers to to conservatives as “you” or “you’re” or “you guys”. In doing so, xmbaline reveals his or her true colors.

As xbabaline would say, wise up.
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Seedyrom

the movement. He is going to campaign the way he does because like Erick said in several dairies. His campaign cronies have also made it clear what you see is what you get.

The real question is, would you prefer Barack Hussein Obama or Mitt Romney win 2012? Romney knows this and its one reason why he has not swayed the way you or anyone else wants unless it benefited him.

Yes he lied and demonized other candidates and led a Carthage (salted earth so that nothing grows) campaign at times with certain candidates. Most of us didn’t like it either but life goes on.

I hope he handles Obama in a tougher, more astute way because if he does Romney will win but it will be different than the primary. Trust me, the Hillary Clinton supporters had to eat it far more than conservatives will.
Finrod

Congratulations, you completely missed everything, thus proving my point precisely. Hillary Clinton would be better than Barack Obama, too.

Care to go for Double Jeopardy, where the scores can really change?
Seedyrom

over the fiction in your head. I could care less about Hillary because she lost and so did better candidates than Romney. I missed nothing. Fact is, there are reasons to vote for him that have been discussed and many are on the campaign site. He’s not my choice either but do you think he cares knowing independents and the anyone but Obama crowd will push the Red Button regardless?

Fyi, the mods are trigger happy. I think streiff is loading JDAM’s to drop on the anti-Romney bunch. No telling when Shock and Awe shall begin. Just a heads up.
xymbaline

You guys are making it quite clear that there’s little difference between you and the Left.

You can’t make the case for your ‘boy’, so you castigate everyone who questions him.

Well, pounding the table is only what people do when they have no evidence.
Finrod

Romney has stuff up on his campaign site.

Big fat hairy deal.

So did Barack Obama, and they were many of the same things, a bunch of vague crap that anyone could write and claim they were ‘conservative’. Barack Obama wanted to reduce the deficit too, didn’t you know?

Actions speak louder than words, and Romney’s actions in the primary have been to take a BFG9000 to good conservative Republicans. There is absolutely nothing he could post on any campaign site that would make up for that.

And please don’t make me laugh regarding the moderators. In case you haven’t noticed, streiff has already posted on this thread, expressing his displeasure with Romneybots.

This line you posted gives it away:

do you think he cares knowing independents and the anyone but Obama crowd will push the Red Button regardless?

That’s PRECISELY the problem. Romney is flipping the middle finger to the base, and many of them will decide to go watch football games or go on picnics in September and October instead of bothering to campaign for a candidate that despises them. And it’ll be his own bloody fault, and the fault of worthless supporters like you that think he’s doing the right thing, despite the obvious fact that no Republican ever gets elected President without good support from the Base.

If you want to ensure Obama’s re-election, you’re going down the right path.
http://908StraightSt.wordpress.com/ mbecker908

Do it on a state by state basis with projected delegate counts and show us where the opposition gets the money to compete.

Or go back to InfoWars.

You have no plan, you have no idea how the process even works. Lay out a plan and stop pissing on the carpet.
Seedyrom

and what a feminine screen name. Keep on ranting like a liberal while running from facts. Coward!
xymbaline

of respectful discourse?

Speaks volumes about them.
gekster

you do support, and please give at least three different reasons as to why you support that particular candidate.

And again, with no mention of Romney.
This should be easy for you.
http://908StraightSt.wordpress.com/ mbecker908

What part of that concept is foreign to you. Oh, all of it apparently.

You and your buddies are trolling around here wailing and throwing proverbial ashes in the air with absolutely nothing substantive or substantial to say.

If you had a plan, on a state by state basis as I’ve requested several times today, then assumptions could be discussed and a discourse could be initiated. As it is, you’re just stomping your feet on the carpet and screaming for the sake of hearing yourselves. This has been going on for several weeks. Prior to Santorum quitting I challenged garfield to do the same. I published a plan, showing my assumptions on a state by state basis with delegate counts – both committed and uncommitted – of how Romney would get to 1144. I referenced it numerous times for garfield and I doubt he even looked at it, let alone muster up a comment. Only one person managed to arrive at any sort of comment an we had a brief discussion until he determined that he couldn’t come up with a competing scenario.

Now then, you want respectful discourse? Produce a rational plan and we can have a discussion. Running around insisting Romney is some spawn of satan or that he “owes” voters something is simply non-productive and stupid.
xymbaline

For once, you’ve given me a quote I can live with.

Thanks.
http://908StraightSt.wordpress.com/ mbecker908

…
xymbaline

is like playing “I got your nose with a 2 year old.”
gekster

…..
evictobama

He supports Obama because he likes Obamacare, taxing the rich (and the middle class), and preaching global warming gospel to the non-believers out there.

He is just here to stir the pot and the mods won’t get rid of him because he’s as anti-Romney as they are.
gekster

I think he was quitly swept under the rug this morning.
gekster

He started off as a loser and went downhill from there.
Seedyrom

or go vote for the Bucket List guy name Paul. People like you are the ones insuring Obama wins and that’s the real problem. Romney will develop a strategy to garner right wing votes when he figures out how to sell himself without giving Obama a chance to take the middle. The middle is Romney’s strategy, only fools, the desperate and the angry will cost us 2012. Don’t be one of them, its over for the primary thanks to weaker fools and idiots, now 2012 is all that matters or we end up with up to 3 SCOTUS replacements, Obamacare and a whole new round of spending and god knows what else. People like you said no to McCain. Sometimes you have to bite the bullet rather than wet your pants over things you can’t control.
Seedyrom

Childish tool no doubt.

RS

MEMBER DIARY

Romney and his supporters need to answer this, if he wants support from the Base

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