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The 800lb TSA Agent In The Room. What Is Not Being Discussed In The Groping Debate.

OK, So…it’s a couple weeks since the TSA’s invasive searches began and since I haven’t a lot of time to blog, I haven’t weighed in on the subject yet.

I was originally thinking everything has been said that could be said…but today…while listening to a week old Podcast of the Rush Limbaugh Program…The thought occurred to me…that not everything has been said on the subject…unless of course Rush has said something in one of my as of yet un-listened to installments.

So…What hasn’t been said?

Well…let’s wait for the answer for a moment…and put some context on my thoughts…

I’ve been preaching at my Mom who is staying with us at the moment about the intrusiveness and over the top nature of the way the TSA is going about this…On the one hand…you can opt for the equivalent of a strip search…or you can opt for what we used to call in my military days a combat pat down.

This is when you cover every inch of a suspect’s body including anatomy with your hand squeezing…checking every crack, crease, and crevice for items taped, inserted, or otherwise concealed in the folds of an individual’s skin or musculature.

Oh…ADD moment…a word on the Combat searches…and the groping of people’s bikini area…I know why this is being done…and I can speak from experience that it’s important to grab and grope the crotch area. When I was a young Airman in the Security Police, We regularly participated in exercises to train us how to deal with flight line threats and unauthorized breeches of high security areas.

As such…we would have to combat search our fellow SPs. Being the shy country boy I was at the time…I was constantly in trouble for avoiding the crotch area when doing my pat and squeeze searches…I always thought I had covered the area well enough to not miss anything and couldn’t bring myself to touch a fellow airman’s “junk” until one night I was doing a search on my Flight Chief…I started with the left arm and worked to the belt line squeezing first the chest muscles,,,then the back muscles and then down the sides…repeating on the right…I did the belt line and then the buttocks thoroughly and then proceeded to do my usual “close enough” groping of the crotch region, first from the front…then from underneath and behind…at which point I proceeded to work down the legs…

This requires an officer to squat and bend down losing sight of the upper half of the suspect’s body…

Well…imagine my surprise…as I’m bent down with my face all but buried in my flight chief’s side I find myself staring directly into the barrel of a life sized replica of a Colt .45 Army issue automatic pistol which my flight chief had pulled out of the crotch region I had considered to be “close enough”.

Those of you who have held a colt automatic know how big they are and the fact that I had missed it taught me to never be shy again…something that served me well in my later years working corrections.

I lay all that out to say…I understand the reason for the grabbing and squeezing…and all the “Junk touching” as a necessary evil…and I support it…in the appropriate context…I’ll explain the appropriate context as we get further along… end ADD departure and let’s get back to the 800lb TSA Agent in the room.

As I was saying…I’ve been preaching at Mom…because she sees nothing wrong with what’s going on in this area…I’ve gone down the Ben Franklin Road quoing him:

They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

To no avail.

I’ve quoted the Forth Amendment:

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Again to no avail….

So…how to drive home the over the top nature of what is being done here?

I mean…could the Forth Amendment be any clearer? What probable cause do the TSA and the government have to justify violating traveler’s “Persons”?

It doesn’t seem to me that wanting to get from point A to Point B by flying the friendly skies provides probable cause to justify doing a virtual strip search of a person…or doing a combat pat down of what we USED to call suspects when justifying the search…

All because Mohamed Atta and a group of America hating murderers decided to destroy this nation and everything she stands for by flying planes into buildings? (Maybe they succeeded in doing far more than they believed possible that day given what we’ve surrendered as a result?).

So…Here’s the 800lb TSA Agent in the room everyone is missing.

What happens at some future date…when a group of America hating extremists walk into a crowded theater…or a Hanna Montana Concert…or some gathering of people in the tens of thousands on the DC Mall…or a football game…or…name your venue….what happens when this group of men walk amongst a tightly packed crowd and blow themselves up along with a couple hundred screaming fans watching the Spurs win their next championship…(heh…couldn’t resist).

What will America be like in 20 years…when you are forced to choose between a grope and squeeze pat down or a virtual strip search in order to attend a professional sporting event…Would you want to live in this country if every time you went into a mall, or large shopping center, office complex and/or business center you were to be treated to this kind of invasive search? How often would you stay home rather than be violated that day?

Are you ready for such an America that requires you to showcase your “Junk” at every turn?

For what? To prove you are worthy of trust? To prove you are innocent of any evil intent when you’ve done nothing to justify suspicion to begin with?

“Ahh Ace”… you say? “You’ve lost your mind…it’ll never happen in America!”

Yeah…that’s what I was told in the 90s…when the Dems were going after “Big Tobacco” adding punitive taxes because of the extra burden cancer puts on the Medicare and Medicaid systems…I said then…that if they could do it to tobacco…they could do it to McDonalds…

Well look at at em go in California…more specifically San Fransisco would ya?!

So…What is it I advocate? When do I think it would be OK to do the combat pat searches or virtual strip searches?

Like the Forth Amendment says…when and only when they have probable cause.

Do as the Israelis do. Watch for behavior. Pull those acting suspiciously aside and observe and question them….make them go through layers of security like an Onion being peeled as I’ve heard their system described…

Arm the pilots…as El Al does…and have armed guards on every single flight….Terrorists go for soft targets….harden the target and you defeat the terrorist…

Believing every American who flies is a suspect simply because they decide to travel by air is lunacy!

There is a reason we haven’t had another 911 since we put Air Marshals on our planes…and we’ve had passengers willing to take action rather than passively letting terrorists have their way.

It stretches our resources too thin searching innocent people, frisking Grandma and the 3rd Nun in line looking for the items identified in the terrorist’s last attempt while leaving them to attack in a way we haven’t thought of yet because we’ve been so busy reacting to them instead of beating them to the punch!

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COMMENTS

  • George Neitz

    is being planned by the people that brought you obamacare and this foolishness at the airports. Soon if they have thier way small men with trenchcoats and little mustaches will be on every corner demanding PAPERS NOW, the only thing these rats understand is a bigger fist than the one they have backing them up.

    • AceInTX
  • JadedByPolitics

    It is the treating of ALL Americans as criminals while not treating the identified enemy as criminals that is unacceptable. I have always said that PC’ism will be the death of America and this is one more rung on that slippery slope!

    • AceInTX

      if this is allowed to stand.

    • edintexas

      Jaded wrote: “It is the treating of ALL Americans as criminals while not treating the identified enemy as criminals that is unacceptable.”

      I am forced to disagree. What is unacceptable is treating ALL Americans as criminals, regardless of how we treat any identified (or potential) enemy, or actual criminal for that matter.

  • http://hillbillypolitics.com Steph C

    plus the lack of professionalism on the part of those doing the screening, plus the lies (images won’t be saved)… and for what? Not much good.

    • AceInTX

      It’s taken them 9 years to get to this point…yet somehow we’ve managed to survive without it…

      Let’s look at it this way…If they manage to take down one plane every ten years if this was done away with…which is preferable?

      of course that”s an unnecessary question because with the right screening…and guards on the planes…they won’t take down any….

      Israel is the number one target on the planet for these guys…and they have the safest system in the world when it comes to air travel.

      But then;…they know who the enemy is…and they aren’t so caught up in political correctness that they can’t call a spade a spade!

      • http://www.examiner.com/x-1597-Charlotte-Law--Politics-Examiner Mike gamecock DeVine
        • AceInTX
  • Scope

    I heard a report on local news yesterday that Amtrak will be deploying additional security personnel at the train stops, and on the trains. They will also be using dogs to check the luggage. If they find anything suspicious, additional screening will be done on that passenger. They are doing this because of increased traffic on their trains.

    I had suspected that they wanted more people riding their government subsidized trains, rather than flying, which the scanners and pat-downs have caused. For now it is only additional security personnel, but, I think you are correct. The scanners and/or pat-downs will follow soon enough.

    I tried to find the article again at wchv.com, but, it’s gone. It was literally yesterday’s news.

    • AceInTX

      question is…when is enough enough?

      No body is asking where this stops…I hear a lot of outrage about what’s being done to fliers….which is great…I’m as outraged about it as well…but how long will it just be confined to fliers?

      Take any argument you can make to justify what is being done at airports…and apply it to any place Americans gather…it’s all the same…and it will expand from here…I guarantee it.

      One other thing I didn’t point out in the article is that TSA is creating a terrorist target with this because by creating a choke point and making travelers congregate in large masses they are creating the perfect scenario for a terrorist to waltz in amongst them…holler Allah Akbar and send dozens to the great beyond

      • lineholder

        Get these security measures in place on mass transit, then some “crisis” comes along where gas goes sky high??? Or some environmental policy is passed where we can’t drive our cars because of emissions? Or maybe even both?

        For my own part, I think TSA and several policies that are coming into play right now are all about “acclimating” us to the “new environment” of the “fundamentally transformed USA”.

        Acclimation is a scientific principle. And progressives are suckers through and through for science. It lets them feel “intelligent”, strokes the vanity, and feeds the ego.

        • AceInTX

          Glenn Beck quotes someone on the Obama team whose name escapes me at the moment who talks about how you get people to do what you want without passing legislation to force them…by “nudging them in a certain direction…making it so burdensome to do something you don’t want them to to that the naturally chose what you are trying to get them to do…

          This would fit a pattern like that…driving green cars…using AmTrack etc.

          Make flying a rich man’s game…we don’t need all this riff raff flying

    • acat

      Trains are not like planes – once the door on a plane closes, it’s a sealed box until it gets to its’ destination city.

      Amtrak trains stop periodically to let passengers smoke (no smoking on board) and security at most of the rural stations is nonexistent.

      Increasing security using the same pat-downs-and-scanners regime would involve either attaching TSA agents and a mobile scanner to each train to check passengers as they board, or stationing agents and scanners at every one of the thousands of whistle stops and middle-of-nowhere depots. (some architecturally significant, some built by the WPA or CCC…)

      Lots of new costs for Amtrak, which is already deep in the red… sounds like we need to watch our wallets.

      Mew

      • AceInTX
        • acat

          They’d have to make flying a lot more inconvenient for the train to start to look good… Chicago to L.A. takes 2 days. Chicago to Dallas is over a day… and all the train cars are 1980s vintage at best.

          I think that, even if they wanted to make the train more appealing than flying, that they’ve got a long way to go.

          Mew

          • AceInTX

            My dad doesn’t like to fly because of an inner ear problem…(That’s what he says…I think he’s just scared and won’t admit it…heh)…and when they came down here from back east or my wedding…it was going to take 3 days because they had to lay over in Chicago for 24 hours to wait for the connecting train to San Antonio…so the likelihood of TSA getting people to travel AMTrack does pose a problem…but then again…we ARE talking about the government here aren’t we?

            There are other possibilities however…what about trying to increase demand for these high speed rail systems the libs seem to be so in love with?

            like I said…I don’t want to get off into conspiracy land…this can all be explained as the zealotry of power hungry bureaucracy loving nuts in policy positions pushing their view of a just and ordered society on us….that’s all the farther we really need to go here.

          • acat

            Take Europe for example – where the cities are much closer together. Rail works for them. It also works in the bosnywash megalopolis (the name given to the urban sprawl stretching from Boston to New York to Washington) because – again – they’re all very close together…

            I really don’t like to say “trains make no sense” .. instead, I like to look at what the right solution for each region is and make sensible choices…. see above. Europe, and parts of the Atlantic corridor, rail works. Otherwise – Chicago to Detroit or Houston to San Antonio … – not so much.

            And if the parents are laying over in Chicago,at least there’s plenty to see. This time of year, cab over to the museums.

            Mew

          • AceInTX

            probably not the best thing around.

            Is this TSA groping a cynical ploy to get us to support high speed rail or to travel Amtrak?

            I doubt it…it’s an interesting discussion point…but beyond that…I’ll stick to the idea that the TSA is a bureaucrat’s wet dream and the overreach is a result of the government’s natural inclination to force itself on it’s citizens.

          • acat

            when a bureaucrat is given power.

            Recall that all of the TSA citizen-facing jobs were private security slots before 9/11. I remember the irony of security at one of the Chicago airports winning an award for being a good place for ex-cons to work …

            Ever since these separate and private firms were federalized, they’ve had to justify their existence, like any other federal parasite (erm, bureaucracy) and they’ve done that by telling scary stories.

            “Bombers have binary liquid explosives! Ban all carry-on liquids!”

            “Hijackers used box cutters! Ban all sharp pointy things!”

            “Bombs hidden in diapers! Pornoscan everyone!”

            Compare this to the history of OSHA or the EPA or even your local health inspector.

            “Mr. Restaurant Owner, I need you to take that pegboard wall out of your kitchen. Bugs could crawl through it.”

            “But it’s been there for 20 years, Mr. Health Inspector.”

            In both cases, the government agents are paid, in part, to always find something new. It’s not a plot to get us all to take Amtrak, it’s a plot to keep their jobs… Not sure how we’ll ever get rid of them if they unionize…

            Mew

            p.s. Regarding trains, suburban feeder systems work fairly well – they reduce the number of cars trying to get into the urban center, reducing congestion and wasted gas.

            Yes, there are trade-offs – can’t come and go as you please, but for most working stiffs, they’re not a bad option.

            The main problem we get is a liberal one-two punch – first they resist raising fares to pay for running the system “because it hurts the poor”, then they turn the railroad into a quasi-government agency “because it isn’t profitable without help”.

            The CTA is a prime example – Chicago’s El system could make a profit if fares were allowed to float up to what the market would bear… even if the CTA were required to give out free tickets to everyone whose income is below the poverty line. That approach would make sense, though …

  • Joe_Schmo

    I can seriously see the day coming when I meet up with a nice, attractive girl, and want to take her to the local sporting event for a first date, and the thought of what she’ll have to go through is enough to have Ms Right turn and walk the other way.

    • AceInTX
    • Alone_in_the_Dotte

      To go to a sporting event or concert at the Sprint Center in Kansas City, MO, one gets to empty their pockets and walk through the metal detectors. No pocket knives, nail clippers. The one time I went to the place, I saw $200 pocket knives get trashed because the owner didn’t want to have to walk 13 blocks back to his car. (They built a nice area with no place to park.)

      I’ve not felt the need to return.

      There’s a big show outside, too, for delivery trucks. They get a walk-around by a guard with a rolling mirror.

      Yet, with all that “security,” they still sold beer in bottles…

      • Alone_in_the_Dotte

        Oh, yeah, at Sprint Center, women get the privilege of dumping their purses into a basket, too.

        • Joe_Schmo

          That’s the way it goes. You can’t yank all personal liberties in one fell swoop, so it’s done in a chipping away at it approach.

          • AceInTX

            seems they may have slipped and turned it up a few notches too far this time though

          • Joe_Schmo

            The secret to the whole process is to not be quite so visible about it.

            They have our attention now.

          • edintexas

            for that sort of heat. For many things, for that matter. I gave up on flaying (that’s a Freudian slip I decided to leave in) when I left my boots off, wearing sneakers so I wouldn’t be hassled for the metal shanks in the boots. So they told me I had to take off my sneakers and put them on the belt (I had already retired and no longer was flying regularly). I completed that trip, and decided that I no longer had the need to fly (with exception for close relative’s funerals).

  • aesthete

    The slope done slipped, and America hardly noticed.

    • AceInTX
  • wennejunk

    That is a country full of people of all races – light skinned Muslims, dark skinned Jews, Arabic speaking Christians and many, many more. There is no ‘racism’ in the profiling process.

    Profiling works. I’ve had several interesting ‘discussions’ with Airport security, almost to the point of smiling at the level of detail in their questioning, curiosity about everything unusual when they search your bags.

    I feel absolutely secure flying out of Israel.

    I hate flying in the US. The BS theater in the screening lines does nothing to make me feel safer.

    As long as we continue to look for the means of executing terror rather than look for those who would execute it we will have this silly charade continue.

    • AceInTX
  • mirac777

    Cause fear through terror and create chaos. Then Big daddy gov’t can swoop down and impose their tyrannical will onto the people. Look at S510, the bogus “Food safety” bill. They created a non-existent crisis. They used 3 instances of food problems to pass this bill. Did millions of Americans die during these “massive outbreaks” as Harkin called them? NOPE The people of Iowa, when they see how the massive FDA power grab collapses small farms with undue regualtions, should hold Harkin and Grassely accountable.
    Like in the old days when this kind of tyranny was tried. Tar and feather them and run them out of town. Some wern’t that lucky. They got strung up in the nearest tree when they were caught over-stepping the boundaries of our Constitution.

    Tom Dashle is facing life in prison, for simply funneling campaign donations to other parts of the GOP. It wasn’t stolen money, or from drugs or other Mafia rackets, yet they charged him with… Money Laundering! Rangel “forgets” to pay his taxes for 7 years, yet has ZERO charges against him today in court for income tax evasion. Holder needs to do hard prison time for crap like this.

    My point here is we need to set some real world examples of theseTyrants. Force them to do prison time, and take all their stolen tax dollars they recieved as bribes from lobbyists pushing illegal leglislation. They want terrorists to have public trails, then the same should go for the corrupt politicians. A couple of life sentences in real world prisons with real criminals is what these tyrants deserve, nothing less.
    Until then , lunatics like Pelosi, Reid , Rangel, Waters, Boxer, Harkin, Kerry, Lieberman, Napolitano, and the head Anti-American Tyrant, one Barack Hussein Obama will continue to destroy America and all she stands for.

    • AceInTX

      This is just proof of that

    • edintexas

      I know you knew Daschle is a Democrat, and Democrats never (well, almost never) get prosecuted for “political” misdeeds.

      One of these days Texas will take away the Travis County DA’s sole venue over politicians in the state. It might have made sense (in a strange sort of way) to have the county with the State capital be the venue for criminal prosecution of politicians. But now that Texas is no longer a single party state (well, verging on a single party Republican state outside of Harris County [Houston], Travis County [Austin], and parts of Dallas county [pretty much solely the city of Dallas and not the rest of Dallas County] and “the Valley”]. There is little doubt that Austin is the most Left leaning place in Texas (we used to call it Moscow on the Guadalupe). I believe DeLay was correct, there was no probability of his getting a fair trial in Austin.

  • http://www.nighttwister.com NightTwister

    If you want to go skiing in Steamboat Springs, you and your possessions are going to be searched.

    • AceInTX
  • 6eorge Jetson

    On 9/11, we had four airplanes that became missiles. Fortunately, the passengers of the one over Pennsylvania shot that one down.

    Another crucial measure was our taking it to the terrorists in their back yards. I doubt that was the payoff that Osama was expecting.

    If the terrorists want to kill a couple of hundred people, there are innumerable ways to do that. And in regards to the Christmas day bomber attempt, has anyone installing the scanners and promoting the patdowns stopped to consider that he got on the plane in Amsterdam? I fail to see how searching a Grandma in Toledo would have stopped that.

    • http://www.examiner.com/x-1597-Charlotte-Law--Politics-Examiner Mike gamecock DeVine

      we should insist that pat downs cease and also insist upon full body scanners that mask detail of body parts.

      • 6eorge Jetson

        since 9/11.

        I’m guessing in large part due to the profiling that’s done outside of the airport lines. Our govt just can’t bring itself to appear to be profiling in public.

        • http://www.examiner.com/x-1597-Charlotte-Law--Politics-Examiner Mike gamecock DeVine
  • http://UnitedConservativesofVirginia Cargosquid

    at the airport, the TSA said, “Take the bus.”

    Now they’ve started at the bus stations.

    http://gatewaypundit.rightnetwork.com/2010/12/wow-that-was-quick-obama-tsa-deploys-scanner-checkpoints-at-bus-stations-video/

    I have no words to describe this level of stupid.

    • http://www.examiner.com/x-1597-Charlotte-Law--Politics-Examiner Mike gamecock DeVine

      that order hash browns.

      • http://impudent.edublogs.org/ kyle8

        I always thought that if Waffle house only had biscuits and gravy they would be perfect. And now they got em!

        Damn I love my waffle house!

      • rbdwiggins

        scattered, smothered, covered and chunked.

        You’re likely to withdraw a nub…

        • http://www.examiner.com/x-1597-Charlotte-Law--Politics-Examiner Mike gamecock DeVine
  • romeyers

    there was a proposal yesterday by Homeland Insecurity that scanners and pat downs be instituted at bus and rail stations. Malls and stadiums were also mentioned.

    Merry Christmas

    • acat

      Airlines? They’re already in trouble.
      Amtrak? They’ve been losing money since … whenever.
      Malls? Online shopping is decimating ‘em. (http://www.deadmalls.com …)

      Stadiums would have been dead if the teams hadn’t figured out how to blackmail local governments.

      The only business TSA is going after that seems to be doing okay is Greyhound/Trailways …

      Mew

  • jackbenimble

    The TSA apologists in the media keep trying to remind us that they would rather us be x-rayed or groped then be blown up on an airline. What they fail to mention is that the TSA inspection process in itself creates a prime terrorist target.

    In some airports like Denver for example the lines waiting to be inspected are very large and very dense. At busy times, there are probably a couple of thousand people standing in line waiting to be harrassed. They make perfect targets. You could roll an entire carry-on sized suitcase and a knapsack packed with explosives and shrapnel into the center of this crowd and detonate it BEFORE security got a chance to look at it. If you have no intention of smuggling it past security, the bomb could be huge and deadly to far more people than a single airline full. And further, it would force the TSA to totally remove the inspection process from all airports because they would be revealed for the useless measures that they are. It would be a complete victory.

  • Flagstaff

    The parallel example is “what do we do when the first terrorist has the explosive deep in a body cavity, one that can be spotted by scope or grope?”

    Will we then demand PET-scans, CAT-scans, or DOG-scans of every passenger, or X-rays?

    Your example, and this one illustrates the error in looking for the weapon instead of for the terrorist.

    Think about this as well–If YOU were the terrorist, and your targeted enemy was doing everything in his power to thwart any attempt to repeat your LAST attack, would you make another such an attack your priority? Of course not. You’d figure out a completely different venue and method. Why do we think OBL isn’t as smart as we are?

    The attacks we’ve stopped since 9/11 have had different targets. Military bases and personnel, Los Angeles, Seattle, Times Square and others I can’t think of offhand. The airplane-centric attacks have been attempts by independent actors, trained by terrorists, perhaps, but not central to OBL’s war. They have been essentially Hail Mary passes. If they’d succeeded, OBL would have crowed, but he wasn’t invested in their success or concerned by their failure. They were still effective just because they keep us frantically looking for ways to protect the same target and “fight the last war, ” and those ways are simultaneously a waste of resources and a wedge being driven into the unity of purpose of the American people.

    It pains me to believe that our professional security experts haven’t had these same thoughts. They MUST have had them. They MUST have made this case to the President and his lackeys. Surely they are actually concentrating on preventing the next attack, not preventing the last one. Surely they are letting this flap continue to misdirect OBL as he attempts to misdirect us. Surely.

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