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Florida Must Say Yes To Amendment 8 (2010)

By: BigGator5 (Diary)  |  July 29th, 2010 at 10:00 AM  | 

RESIZE: AAA

The last time I talked to you about a Florida Amendment, I said we must say “no”. This time, I say we need need to vote “yes” on Amendment 8: Florida Class Size

In 2002, Florida voted for Florida Reduce Class Size, Amendment 9 which limited the class sizes that would take effect Fall 2010 (this school year). High school classes would be limited to 25 students; fourth through eighth grades to 22 students; and pre-kindergarten through third grade to 18 students. There was no flexibility and at the time, we were in the middle of an economic boom which we thought would last forever.

However forever has come to an end. Times are bad and we come face-to-face with the fact that money doesn’t grow on trees. We have to balance our budget here in Florida and according to The St. Petersburg Times:

“Florida TaxWatch has estimated the savings, and they are substantial: Up to $1 billion annually. That is a lot of money that could be better spent on real education reform, not just counting heads in the classroom. Amendment 8 won’t eliminate Florida’s smaller class sizes; it will just make the voter mandate far more manageable.”

Indeed, class sizes would still be small. However the new amendment “would allow school administrators more flexibility by allowing up to three additional students in pre-kindergarten to third-grade classrooms and an additional five students in grades four through 12. Gaetz said the amendment, which must be approved by a three-fifths vote of the Legislature to get on the November ballot, ‘keeps class sizes at a level where teachers can teach and children can learn.’”

It would also stop a hellish “school rezoning, double sessions and the elimination of elective classes, such as art or music, as schools try to shuffle students and teachers to meet the limits in each classroom.”

I still support small class sizes in school, but let’s give schools the flexibility they need in this terrible economic times. A hard cap at this time will only burden the schools and the children we need to educate.

[Cross-Posted On Practical State.com]

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  • ralatredstate

    You said – “Let?s see: Unions, environmentalists, and cities who already have a local version of the law, know this will be a disaster waiting to happen. Only special interests would like to see this become law of Florida. For once, I am happy about the bipartisan opposition to this amendment. We can all agree that this is a bad idea.”

    I can see why you favored the class size amendment – most unions and environmentalists did.

    Your support of McCollum makes a lot more sense in this light.

    • ralatredstate

      nt

    • BigGator5

      You want to know why I support small class sizes? Because small class sizes work in charter and private schools. However I voted against the original amendment, because I didn’t support the hard cap.

      This is why I support this amendment. We get the small class size with the flexibility.

      • http://www.examiner.com/x-1597-Charlotte-Law--Politics-Examiner Mike gamecock DeVine

        the salaries demanded by teachers/unions
        the number of unnecessary admin personelle in education
        the recession

        • BigGator5

          Honestly Mike, did you read my entire article or just the part where I like small class size and stopped there?

          I don’t like a hard cap on class sizes, still don’t. I supported this amendment because it fixes the flaw of the 2002 amendment. It gives us small class sizes, which I like, with the flexibility we need.

          RalatRedstate also took a comment I made in another article to make it sound like Teacher Unions support this amendment, which they don’t. Both Rick Scott and Bill McCollum support this amendment and hates the Fourth Amendment that I talked about earlier, so his comment about my support for McCollum doesn’t make sense in this context.

          • http://www.examiner.com/x-1597-Charlotte-Law--Politics-Examiner Mike gamecock DeVine
          • http://www.examiner.com/x-1597-Charlotte-Law--Politics-Examiner Mike gamecock DeVine
  • acat

    Remove marriage entirely as a legally recognized institution?

    And not just to replace it with a “civil union” – I mean completely remove it.

    If Joe and Jane choose a traditional church marriage, it means nothing legally. If Adam and Steve choose to declare themselves married, it means equally nothing.

    My view, for what it’s worth, is that marriage is a religious term that was appropriated by the government – and that returning it to a purely religious term has some merit.

    Mew

  • acat

    The problem with saying “no more than 18 +/- 3″ is that each administrator is likely to say “Okay, no more than 21″ and proceed accordingly. That is, this doesn’t increase flex, it increases the number of students in the classroom.

    What would actually help put more teachers in the classroom is actually spending the education budget on teachers.

    Instead of limiting the number of students, the good citizens of Florida would have been better off limiting the number of bureaucrats.

    Why do we need all these bureaucrats? What’s their, in business terms, “value add” to the education of a child? Why not say something like “The school district shall have one administrative position per five teaching positions”.

    The bureaucrats will immediately welcome smaller class sizes as they mean more teachers, eh?

    Mew

    • BigGator5

      So, do you think we should vote against this amendment?

      • acat

        I’m not a Floridian.

        I am of the opinion that this amendment addresses only part of the problem – and is going to immediately be abused by the administration.

        I don’t like it because it’s not addressing the real problem – there aren’t enough teachers because administrators’ salaries are sucking all the oxygen (money) out of the system.

        Until the problem is looked at that way, all this amendment will do is let the bureaucrats save their own hides by cramming an extra couple kids into each classroom.

        Mew

        • IJB
        • BigGator5

          The point is, Florida voters already approve a small class size amendment in 2002! It takes effect this school year! Voting down this amendment will do nothing to stop that!

          Supporting this amendment, will allow a flexibility in class sizes instead of a hard cap! I agree that school administrators’ salaries are way too high, but that has NOTHING to do with this amendment!

          • acat

            This just loosens the limits, i.e. from 18 students to 21 students. It allows some flex, but it does not appear significant. Also, I fully expect all of the “flex” to be used up within the first year. Watch and see what happens, eh?

            Mew

    • Achance

      If you’re going to get the special ed money you have to have all the testing and counselling as well as all the Individual Educational Plans and all the other stuff that goes with it. EEO puts all sorts of data collection and reporting requirements on schools. HR and LR issues are another contributor.

      I think the World was a better place when the local school board was the highest authority over education, though that had its problems too, especially in The South. I don’t think I was ever in a class with less than 28 – 30 kids in it, but there were desks in rows, kids in them, and a teacher with a paddle to keep it that way. Schools now are just moving riots. The number of kids in the class is an administrative abstraction; they don’t even know where the kids are at any given time in most schools.