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Placing Marco Rubio as VP Would Not Bring the GOP enough Latino Votes

The general election is upon us, and in case you have not noticed, it is upon us.Santorum has made a valiant attempt at becoming the nominee, but for all the hyperbole coming from his camp these days, there is little chance that he stops Romney at this point.

Therefore, it is time to start talking about the general election.Today we will talk about one of the issues that is bound to come up, and sooner rather than later. This issue would be the Latino vote.

Some of the pundits in the media have conjectured that Romney should put Marco Rubio (R-Fla) on the ticket as VP because the GOP needs to reach out to Hispanic voters if it wants a chance at beating President Obama this November.The second half of this statement is surely true.The Latino vote is sure to be an Achilles ’heel for the GOP now and well into the future consider the way population trends are moving these days.

Latino’s accounted for 6.6 million of the votes in the 2010 mid-term elections, which was a record for the mid-term.They were also a larger share of the electorate that ever before coming in at 6.9% of all voters, which is up from 5.8% in 2006.According to the Census Bureau, 50.5 million Hispanics were counted by the 2010 Census, which is up from 35.3 million in 2000. Bottom line is this voting block is growing fast, and to exacerbate this for the GOP is the fact that many of these voters live in important electoral swing states: which includes Nevada, Florida, Colorado, and New Mexico. According to the Pew Hispanic Center, Barack Obama won the Latino vote by 36 points in 2008

Some people believe that this is why having Marco Rubio on the ticket with Mitt Romney would be a good thing.Romney had this to say about Rubio: “Marco Rubio is living proof that the American dream is still very much alive.”

This is very true, and it alone is reason enough to place Rubio on the ticket with Romney. However, it would be spurious to place him on the ticket thinking that alone who garner enough Latino support to win election. One should expect this proud people to see right through this.

Listen to Rubio talk about what it means to be an immigrant:

“To me, the story of immigration…the story of the Hispanic community, is the aspirations for a better life.” He then states “The sacrifices so that your children would have opportunities you didn’t have. I didn’t read about in a magazine article. I’m surrounded by it every single day of my entire life.”

Rubio gets it, but sadly, the GOP and many conservatives do not get it.

The most veracious way that I can put this is to say, that the only way the GOP is can consistently win the Latino vote is to show some empathy when dealing with issues that affect the Latino community. Something Romney has not done well in the last few presidential election cycles.

One example of this would be the DREAM ACT, which allows young people who arrived in this country as children, and graduated high school in the U.S. to become U.S. citizens.Under the provisions of theDREAM ACT, qualifying undocumented youth would be eligible for a 6-year long conditional path to citizenship that requires completion of a college degree or two years of military service.

Earlier this primary season Romney was very critical of Texas governor Rick Perry for signing a Texas state version of the DREAM ACT.Of course, this was being used as a club against someone that team Romney viewed as a threat, but Perry was right to defend the law.States are required by law to help people who cannot help themselves, why not allow the children to become contributing members of the state if they are already doing everything they can to better themselves.

This is not only the moral thing to do; it could also be seen as the conservative thing to do.Think about it this this way, how many people are complaining that immigrants are getting things free while everyone else has to work for them?This bill works towards allowing these young people to contribute to a society that often times they did not choose to live in.

Rubio is also working on an alternative version of the DREAM ACT that would allow children of illegal aliens who came into the country at no fault of their own to stay here legally and get in line to become citizens.

In the above Fox News Latino interview, Rubio also said, “What I have found, unfortunately, in my time here in Washington is that this is a very powerful issue and that, in fact, there are those that maybe don’t want to solve this and would like to leave it there so they can use it in the elections.”

If this is true, that is even more reason for Republicans to take the weapon away from Democrats.

The Hill reportedthat Sens. Jon Kyl (R-Ariz.) and Kay Bailey Hutchison (R-Texas) are also working towards getting a bill done, but are not expected to release details until after Mitt Romney has clinched the nomination.

That is probably because Romney will come out in support of this bill, and then be called out by Santorum and Gingrich for another flip-flop, which in Romney’s case will likely not matter. If you were not going to vote for Romney because he has a flip-flop problem, then you likely already came to that conclusion.

Putting Marco Rubio on the ticket because he would help attract Latino voters is a fool’s errand.The GOP does not have to back track on it strong border issues stance, but they should rethink their views on what to do with those who are already here.These people only want to see their children grow up in a better world, and that is what American represents, a better future for all people. It is hard to blame them for wanting to leave their host countries, which are likely not a pleasant place to live. Closing the border needs to be a top priority, but so does dealing with those who are here already.

When discussing Latino issues in the video above, Rubio states that for these people this it “is a personal issue — you’re talking about their mother, their father, their brother, someone they love” and “It’s hard to make an economic argument to people who think you want to deport their grandmother.”

Rubio is already doing more for the party by talking out about this than just putting him on the ticket.Even though it would be nice to have him on the ticket, doing so may look shallow.Besides, if Romney loses, we will want him to be fresh for the 2016 campaign: just saying.

COMMENTS

  • krish

    Romney will do & say anything to destroy other republicans & once that job is done….pivot to the left. There will not be any major difference between him & Obama by the time election comes around……

    This is just the beginning of the flip flopping….watch out for the bigger issues. If Supreme court does not save the country by striking down Obamacare & you think Romney is going to do it, you are a brainwashed Rombot …need a brain transplant!

    Question for those that had reluctantly moved to support Romney – if Romney now supports all the positions that he opposed such as immigration issues (Perry on dream act & Newt on allowing people who had been here for 25 years or more), contraception (abortion pill & catholics), lower tax (15% flat tax by Newt – Romney said it will creat deficit), …..I would like to hear from Newt, Perry & Santorum supporters…….

    This is his MO …right from the days of MA senate campaign (saw it first hand!)……have been in Non-Romney camp from those days…..

    • http://www.timothy-bladel.com/ center77

      only that this was a economic issue that can be handled better by both sides. Rubio once supported it, and is now trying to water it down to support it. I was with Perry all along on the issue, it makes no sense for us not to keep people who we have already invested so much in. If they are hear, grew up here, are going to college or serving in the military, why not reward them for it.We should close the border for sure, but I don’t blame people for wanting to come here.

    • evictobama

      Primaries get ugly. To his credit, Romney didn’t react to a lot of the baiting that went forth from candidates like Perry, Gingrich, and Santorum on the issue of whether or not Governor Romney is, in fact, a Christian.

      The super-pac’s got involved, the media got involved, rank-and-file Republicans got involved, a lot of ugliness was circulated.

      But Romney stayed on top, largely by distancing himself from any and all attacks. He never questioned any other candidate’s race, gender, or religious beliefs, nor did he tolerate anyone in his campaign doing so, thus separating himself from many of his opponents.

      I’m very glad that Romney is about to lock up the nomination and I’m even happier that Obama will not be allowed to become a repeat offender.

      • Scope

        why didn’t you tell me all this sooner. Here I was stupidly thinking that Romney, through his surrogates, PAC, Fox, Drudge, and staff were the ones spending millions and millions on negative campaigning. Had I only known that Saint Romney stayed so far above the nasty fray with attacks on every candidate that threatened his march to the nomination, I would have gotten me one of them there train conductor caps, and boarded his high speed rail to the nomination long ago. I never knew that Romney’s staff were not allowed to talk bad about the other candidates. Glad you set me straight here. Oh thank you, thank you for the enlightening post, I can now throw out my nose plugs, and replace them with a Pogo stick, and put a bounce in my march to the voting booth in November.

        Sarc in case anyone thinks I’ve had one too many.

      • http://www.timothy-bladel.com/ center77

        which is how its done I guess.

        • Scope

          that is how it is done, but, not to the lengths Romney’s campaign took the carpet bombing. I agree with the many that have said, they never saw anything so nasty as this campaign season. I laugh when I hear Romney supporters on the TV or in print saying that Romney is being hurt as the eventual nominee, because of all of the negative campaigning, but refusing to admit that it is the Romney campaign that is causing the destruction of our eventual nominee, whether it is Romney or anyone else, with their chosen campaign tactics.

          Romney should have just stayed with his moderate title, and he should have been honest with the voters, rather than flip flopping on every single issue, just to try to pander to the conservatives to get elected. No one flip flops on every single issue, every one. When Romney, or his surrogates say he is a conservative, most know he is lying. I’m tired of those that buy into the meme that conservatives can’t win in liberal states. If someone is a conservative in their heart, no one is forcing them to live and run for election in liberal states. They can move to a state that more closely fits their values, and then run for office from their. If holing elective office, and gaining a title is more important than someone’s values, then say that and let the people judge them by their records.

          This is exactly why I will do what I have to to get Obama out of the WH, but I will never go full bore ahead to help Romney get elected. He doesn’t need my money, and I would be lying if I tried to write glowing articles or comments about how wonderful he is. The architecture for Romney’s campaign was likely drawn up during the 08 campaign season. I have no doubt that the Roves/Bushes were a part of the design. It has been nasty and divisive. No wonder why we have what so many are calling the weakest field of candidates ever. Some of the better people most likely knew what was coming and stayed out. If Romney and his people can pull this off, it will set one of the worst precedents for future campaigns. We will watch billionaries jumping into the ring simply because they will know they can buy the nomination/election. I want no part of that, and I will do nothing to further it along, thank you very much.

          • romansdaughter

            Oh yes we should be calling #Mitt …St. Mittens! He and Obama r perfect! One is “god” and the other is “saint”.
            Center thanks for the article. Hey I have a question…I have been given some articles in the past that plainly show that Rubio can’t be VP or POTUS cause he is not naturally born. Of course that didn’t stop Obama from being elected. What is the scoop on that? Do you know?

          • Scope

            I have no clue if Rubio is qualified for the Presidency or Vice Presidency or not. Rubio keeps saying that he has no desire to become the Vice President, and I take him at his word.

            It would seem to me that it would need a SC decision if Rubio is qualified or not. The SC has made decisions on individuals with respect to very narrow individual cases. I have no clue if Rubio has researched if he is in fact qualified or not. I’ve read that Bobby Jindal is questionable with respect to his qualifications. I really have no clue.

            I would think that because the Obama presidency has been deemed qualified, that the candidates mentioned above would have standing on their cases to be in fact qualified. Is it right, wrong, or indifferent, I have no clue.

      • snowshooze

        Hey, a bit of humor is needed at times around here…
        Thanks!

  • krish

    who were originally supporters of other candidates & now are thinking about throwing their support …….

    wanted to know how they felt ……

    Poor innocent Mittens …he has never attacked anybody…it is the evil PAC that is smearing his good friends who are runnign against him!

    based on the comment by evictobama…..it is not just liberals but Romney camp & Rombots also think that conservatives are idiots & ignorant hicks that live in south/midwest states & who can be had with outright lies!! WIth this attitude by Romney camp & his eventual move to left…..there will be some southern states in play!

    • http://www.timothy-bladel.com/ center77

      but there is a part of me that cannot fathom voting for Mittens.

      • snowshooze

        I held my nose with McCain.
        With Mitt… I can’t disagree with him all the time, because he has always agreed with me on everything, sometimes before he disagreed, sometimes after. That is the only stable thing about hs plank, he is unstable and an opportunist. Devoid of personal conviction.
        You won’t know what is in him until you elect him.
        As a conservative, I am a bit conservative… and we generally are a bit conservative in our decisions.
        And when we are faced with an absolute uncertainty, we tend to be conservative, and shy away…
        I do not want to purchase whatever is behind door #1 without seeing it, even if the price is free.
        Romney could be the white elephant. You might not be able to make him work for you, but you are going to have to feed him and clean up after him.
        I ain’t sure I want to do that.

    • clintonformccain

      But, even if you can bring yourself to support the Republican nominee, it might help further “party unity” if you stop calling those of us who plan to vote for him “Rombots”. Sheesh.

      • Scope

        When someone posts some of the most horendous claims that Romney is a saint that has stayed far above the fray of attacking his opponents that threatened his march to the nomination, he deserves the name “Rombot.” It is to try to deny what has been right in front of our faces. Where do you think the widespread term “carpet bombing” came from? It would the same same thing as Debbie Wasserman Shultz claiming that Obama has stayed above the fray, has not attacked his opponents, and has been a class act all the way.

        If you are on the Romney train, and are excited about him becoming the nominee, great, just stop trying to tell everyone that they really aren’t seeing what they really have seen. Dishonest and lying doesn’t get anyone anywhere near a good place.

        • clintonformccain

          There are barely any Romney supporters on Red State. You seem to think you are so put upon, but I haven’t seen it. If anything it would seem that the Romney supporters have simply quit posting here for the time being. I assume that will probably change as we get into the general election.

          • Scope

            RS very regularly clinton. The original Romney supporters are here, as well as those that have even more recently jumped on the Romney bandwagon.

            I think you know exactly what my point was, and that is that at least be honest when promoting Romney as the candidate. To say that he has stayed above the fray, and that he has not attacked his opponents is just ludicrous, and that is exactly what evicyobama has implied.

        • clintonformccain

          I thought it came from bitter Santorum and Gingrich supporters…

          • garfieldjl

            Romney did resort to carpet bombing fellow Republicans, at a level that we have never seen in a Republican primary before.

            That is something that Romney will need to make amends for to try to repair the damage so he has the base in the general (assuming he is the nominee and the longer the primary continues the less likely Romney will be the nominee).

            The Santorum and Gingrich supporters have every right to feel bitter, they are entirely justified to be angry, that is the thing that Romney supporters really don’t get.

            If this primary is over, why continue to trash Gingrich and Santorum? Why continue to anger Gingrich and Santorum supporters by insulting them?

            The reason I was on the fence for so long and made no bones about it was Romney’s behavior and his supporter’s behavior. Romney will get 0 support from me in the primary, all he can currently count on is that I plan to vote Republican in November.

            I’m honestly hoping for a brokered convention because I absolutely do not want Romney to be the nominee for multiple reasons including the fact the MSM had been shilling for him and serving as his attack dogs to take out his opponents.

            As you recall that MSM left McCain alone in the primaries in 2008, while trashing everyone else. People have said that we walked into a trap in 2008 by choosing McCain to be the nominee, okay well if that’s the case why are we falling for the exact same trap in 2012? The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result.

            Sure Romney will put up more of a fight than McCain, but I don’t think Romney will attack in the right way.

            The Democrats try to win with using lies and smears.

            Traditionally Republicans like Reagan, won elections using facts, ideas, and truth.

            Problem for Romney is he will not be able to pull the same stunts in the general that he has in the primary, the mainstream media will call him out on every trick he tries in the General.

            Our best way of beating Obama in the general is confronting Obama on his record, using facts and truth, calling the press and Obama out on his and their lies.

            I’m not posting this to try to smear anyone, I came across some stuff that convinced me that even Romney is better than Obama. I’m posting this, because I am convinced we are walking into the same trap in 2012 that we walked into in 2008.

          • clintonformccain

            I would be angry, too, if my guy had run such a pathetic campaign, with no fundraising, no advertising, no national infrastructure, and not even managing to get on the ballots. Heck, I was angry with my guy Perry for running such a pathetic campaign. To borrow a phrase, I feel your pain….

            I don’t know why you are so upset with Romney. He didn’t do anything but exactly what you are supposed to do. This wasn’t a dirty campaign. Heck, nobody even got accused of fathering an illegitimate black baby this around.

            You ask how Romney has won the nomination? Easy. He had the only competent, professional, national campaign out of all the Republican contenders.

            Once Perry flamed out, the nomination was never really in doubt, notwithstanding the fact that the media and the very conservative wing of the party had to make it look like there were serious challengers. Herb Cain, Gingrich, and Santorum never had campaign infrastructures capable of winning a national race and never had any serious fundraising. That’s not Mitt Romney’s fault.

          • annie54

            so he knew what he had to do and has a paid staff of lawyers (65, I believe) who took care of the rich, spoiled boy with the silver spoon in his mouth.

            It’s too bad that we really don’t know him. But hark! We’ll find out when he’s in the oval office. Change you can believe in and all of that. . . . . . . . .

          • http://908StraightSt.wordpress.com/ mbecker908

            a new name on the door to the Oval Office.

            I really dislike Romney, but there is absolutely no issue he won’t be an improvement on Obama.

          • http://908StraightSt.wordpress.com/ mbecker908

            The fact that Santorum has been confronted on his record is why Romney will win.

            The “problem” is that Romney will be the nominee, Santorum certainly won’t be stopping him. Like it or not, we’ve got a whole field of people who simply ran lousy campaigns and Romney was able to capitalize. There were three and half people in the race who could lay claim to real accomplishments as a conservative leader. Pawlenty, Daniels and Perry. The half would be Gingrich as an elected official.

            The remainder have never drawn a conservative breath, Santorum most of all. At least Romney as executive experience, which is small consolation, but it’s vastly more in terms of qualifications than Santorum.

          • acat

            McCain didn’t hit via proxies, he didn’t speak of grand plans or proposals; he didn’t fight dirty. Even when he made a very solid proxy his veep nom, he didn’t use her to anywhere near full advantage.

            What makes you think Romney – whose campaign you describe as “carpet bombing”, who is acknowledged as a “dirty” fighter – won’t attack “in the right way” ?

            What *is* the “right way” to you? To me, with President Obama having high personal approval ratings but low performance ratings, having Romney saying Obama’s a nice guy but is over his head – while we and others on the right point out that Romney is in error, or Romney is too polite to call Obama out for the #Fail he is seems like a pretty decent approach.

            This isn’t anything great – Romney’s an uninspiring guy, he’s not noticeably inspirational, and he lacks a military record – name the last GOP POTUS who didn’t serve – but I don’t see him making nearly the same mistakes McCain made.

            McCain didn’t know how to go on the offensive against Obama .. not sure what he was afraid of, but something stopped him and got him to muzzle Palin.

            I don’t see Romney, even though I agree he’s a lousy candidate, backing away from the fight he so desperately wants to have.

            Mew

          • cheetah2

            If only, only he gets out and fights! Before the primaries started my feeling was that I wanted to support the candidate who would fight Obama the best. I thought that was going to be Perry. :( I just hated the way McCain pussyfooted around with Obama.

          • acat

            He seemed to think he could just present his maverick credentials and win…

            Mew

          • texastaxpayer

            :(

          • Scope

            was before the Citizens United decision by the SC. The old fool McCain, even though he seems to be marginally supporting Romney, is still railing against the PAC’s which were birthed mainly because of that same decision.

            Romney, in an earlier debate, refused to call Obama a Socialist. There was something else I read a good while ago where Romney said that he was not going to attack Obama, or some such. Maybe he won’t attack Obama personally, for his seeming ideology?

            Something I found interesting reading articles today, Romney’s campaign spokeswoman, Andrea Saul, said that the campaign decided to not air the negative attacks against Santorum in PA, “out of deference” to Santorum suspending his campaign over the Easter weekend, because of a personal reasons,” not that the Romney was going to stop the attack ads because they had any sentiments for Bella Santorum, but because as they claim he was “suspending” his campaign. Andrea Saul said that the campaign would be reverting to a “positive” Romney ad. Santorum already said that he would not be campaigning over the Easter weekend, and then unfortunately Bella was hospitalized on Friday. Many have not noticed that Romney went back to his CA home over the Easter weekend, and spent time with his family there. There are pictures with one of the Romney sons in wetsuit and surf board, having fun at the Romney CA home. So Romney can just disappear from the campaign trail for a few days, spend time with the family, but that is not considered “suspending” his campaign?

            There is no question that the Romney camp sent out the “suspension” notice to incite people into thinking that Santorum was possibly rethinking his campaign. There’s been no shortage of that even before the Bella incident.

            I know you are not a Santorum supporter by any stretch, but, is their any excuse at all that Romney’s camp can or should get away with the obvious contorted and false messenging, when S didn’t do much different than Romney?

            This is what many people have a problem with Romney for.

  • bobmark

    There is a very deep flaw in the Dream Act concept. If these children are the innocent victims of being brought here illegally, then it’s obviously not their dream. So whose dream are we talking about? Their parents, obviously! Our society has always espoused that crime committed for a “worthwhile cause” is still illegal and not to be excused. If we set the precedent that all you have to do is hideout in the parts of the country where you won’t stand out till your kids are in school and you’re in home free, what are we signalling to all the folks who want to come here.
    If we build it they will come!
    To take it to the absurd, shouldn’t we let Bernie Madoff’s grandkids keep the money? They didn’t take it, afterall, it wasn’t their fault.
    I believe Rubio is spot on with his view of the problem.

    • http://www.timothy-bladel.com/ center77

      We would rather not have people sneak in, but I can say with certainly that if I lived in Mexico, and had. A family, I’d seek the greener grass. As a nation, we should at the very least understand why people are coming. Now the reality of the situation is the Latino vote could swing the election, and will have a larger impact as time goes by. Since we do not have a closed border, we need to close it, while realizing that we will never deport 11 million people. Its not politically readable to do that. Texas decided to at least make the best out of a bad situation by educating these children to make them self sufficient. There is a economic argument here, and there is a practical argument. It would go a long way with an important voting block. Now the bottom line is that if the Democrats continue to dominate the demographic, they will likely retain power for decades to come. They will do more than educate and give citizenship to those who are working, going to school, or serving in the military. I think it best to take this powerful issue out of Democrats hands. We can close the border, use those here that we can benefit from, and have earned the right to say they are bettering themselves. Its two for one.

    • http://www.timothy-bladel.com/ center77

      When discussing Latino issues in the video above, Rubio states that for these people this it

      • acat

        who is incapable of thinking about immigration in terms larger than a bumper-sticker “send them all back”.

        Look, I’m a pragmatic cat. I want to – as Perry put it – put boots on the border. I want to reduce the flood to a trickle, and to go after the drug mules and human trafficers and scum.

        That said, once the border is sealed, we have to do something about the people who are already here… and there’s no way Arizona- or Alabama-style anti-immigration laws are going to pass or be enforced in all 50 States. (I note that Cali has a similar law on the books)

        We’re going to need to come to some sort of a mix of amnesty and deportation – after the border is sealed – and ignoring that is courting defeat.

        Show me how that fits on a bumper-sticker.

        Mew

        • http://www.timothy-bladel.com/ center77

          which is impressive since I tend to babble on. Wonderful comment.

          • acat

            This ain’t my first goat rope.

            Mew

  • krish

    “you wouldn’t know what is in him until you elect him”……should be Romney’s plank! Remember it worked for Obamacare when Pelosi said …”vote for it to find out what is in it”…..

    “hope & change” worked for everybody & your line along with “etch a sketch” should bring everybody in……

    “MITT ROMNEY – HE CAN BE WHATEVER YOU WANT HIM TO BE” – should be the campaign slogan

    Mitten sould be paying us – for the first time he will have a positive message!!

    • snowshooze

      I cannot figure out why anyone would possibly back him.
      Really…it escapes me entirely.
      Gutless, spineless and totally devoid of conviction or policy..
      All he has is money and Daddies second generation political machine…
      I don’t need any of that.

      • http://www.timothy-bladel.com/ center77

        and believe you me, Romney was only above Paul as my choices. Right down with Romney were Newt and Santorum, which both were mistakes for the base to get behind. In fact, Perry and Huntsman were the only ones worth caring if they won, and both would have been better than Romney by a long shot. Thank you Rove, thank you Fox, and thank you conservative base with our competing factions. That’s how Romney won. Conservatives went to Santorum cause of Newts baggage and social conservative liked the tad bit extreme pro-life statist named Santorum.

        Bottom line now is Romney is it.

  • bobmark

    I admit that there’s no way to just toss however many million people out of the country, But let’s not get all squishy about “dreams” and children who are here through no fault of their own. If it’s not their fault, then whose fault is it?

    What so many people are forgetting is that Reagan made his amnesty deal with the understanding that it was a one and done scenario. Now 25 years later, things are worse, not better, and people are arguing that it’s too late and we should just accept it . Immigration reform is one thing, pandering for votes is completely different.

    I see this as akin to the concept of the “attractive nuisance”. If I don’t put a fence around my pool and my neighbor’s toddler wanders over and falls in and drowns I’ll be held liable. Same applies here. If you provide free stuff, no questions asked, why should anyone be surprised that people take it? I live in a 70+% hispanic town with a lot of recent arrivals and I see kids with North Face jackets and iphones getting out of nice cars to go in for free breakfast. Why, because mommy uses a different last name than daddy on the paperwork, My kids think there’s something wrong with us because we have less nice stuff then their friends but we don’t get free breakfast and reduced lunch. How do I explain to them that we’re putting out almost $1000/month for health insurance and they either use the e.r. or are on Medicaid? When you have broken several laws to get here, how many more will you break to stay? Think about the example that’s being set. These children are being taught from an early age about gaming the system, and that honesty is NOT the best policy, they’re almost predestined to being democrats..

    I just cannot wrap my head around opening my arms to criminals and thieves and saying “Welcome to my home, glad you could make it.” And I bet if you asked the folks who waited their turns, did it legally, and are committed to becoming Americans rather than just coming for the free stuff, they’d agree with me.

    • http://www.timothy-bladel.com/ center77

      and since they have at least tried to do something while here, were some of our own are perfectly fine with government handouts.

      You missing the point, we don’t have to like it, but the majority here are going to get amnesty, citizenship or something. Its a matter of who the legal ones are voting for. If the GOP comes down to hard, Democrats will run this country for decades, and the damage done will far exceed the damage we may get by letting hard working children become productive members of society.

      You seem to not even know what the dream act is, they are not thieves, and you seem to think there is a way for all these people here to get in line now, there isn’t, the system a mess. No, we have to stop the flow, and then start sending the criminals out, but you think you will ever see grandma deported, nope. If Romney run on what you just said, Democrats will hold all three branches and in the coming decades, legal Latino population will be swinging election towards the Democrats at rates we’ve never seen.

      You sound bitter, I get it. But the amount of people we are talking about here is not 70% of any town. I don’t blame people for crossing the border and coming here. But short of a Nazi style round up, and a electoral bloodbath, this is not something you will ever see. Texas did this for a reason, and they would not be run by Republicans if they didn’t, Florida, Rubio, these people don’t get to win talking like that. The numbers are staggering, Latinos are growing faster than most know. The republican Party is not going to like what happens unless it softens its positions. That just reality.

      • bobmark

        When I said If it’s not the kids fault whose fault is it? I’m blaming the pols who put out the honey pot to entice their parents to come here. My bad for not clarifying it more. Thought it was clear that the kids were blameless, but that that doesn’t mean that all is forgiven. Hence the Madoff analogy.
        I agree with Clinton below that this isn’t an issue that should be pushed now and I’m being more lenient than the Pence plan in Scope’s post. We all have to be very careful to target the behavior, not the ethnicity of the people doing it.

        Don’t think I said anyone should be deported, except for serious criminal behavior while they are here. I do consider entitlement fraud serious criminal behavior. It’s rampant, and anyone who lives around it knows it.
        Never said there shouldn’t be a path to citizenship for the kids, just that it needed to be more than just going to school.
        I do agree with Rubio that serial immigration is a serious potential consequence. I’ll up that and say the concept of the “anchor baby” needs to be revisited. Whenever you read one of these bills and it says “the citizen”, substitute “the infant” and you’ll understand the true meaning.
        Go back and listen to Rubio again, he gets it that the legal immigration process is broken, and so do I. The guy next door is Colombian, pretty sure his daughter was born here, he’s a great guy and I’d like him to be able to stay. I think he’s legal, but that’s one of those questions you just don’t ask around here.
        I do not begrudge most of my neighbors success now that they are here. I do have a problem with the ones who say “I’m here, now give me stuff.” And I REALLY have a problem with the ones who game the system and take advantage of the generosity of the American people.
        All I’m saying is that we can be fair to everybody without giving away the farm. Like I said, give’m a work visa, let them stay and let their kids go on with their lives, but they certainly shouldn’t be given special treatment. Talking with folks over the years I’ve learned that some of the legals do have a problem with all the illegals. They think they make them look bad, that whites think every hispanic they see is illegal. How would you feel if you had gone to all the effort to come here the right way, only to see the folks who snuck in be rewarded for it?
        Bet you don’t let people cut line at the checkout, how about at the freeway exits? Get it?

        • http://www.timothy-bladel.com/ center77

          I think that we have to talk this issue because if we don’t Democrats will bash it over our heads. Bush won 30% or more of the Latino vote, but Obama won it by 35% or maybe 36%. Because of the Latino populated swing states, this issue will matter some. Democrats did not do anything when they had all the Congress and President. They can lose this vote if Republicans make a move to attract these voters.

  • clintonformccain

    I strongly suspect that a candidate on the national ticket who, as you point out, “gets it”, regarding Latino issues would push the Republican message in that direction and would, indeed, increase Latino/Hispanic vote in November.

    What would help the Republican party immensely is a lower profile for the extremist fringe who keep saying things to bring wedge issues like immigration, contraception, and so forth to the forefront of the political discussion. Very few Republicans are “against contraception”, but the extremists allow the party to be beat over the head about it. Same thing with some of he more extreme immigration stances.

    It’s the economy, stupid!

  • Scope

    Back when the debate, and loud protests were taking up all the oxygen, with the McCain/Kennedy immigration plan pushed by a liberal and a liberal lite, backed by the compassionate conservative president, I doubt many even saw or knew about the Pence plan. He proposed it as an alternative to what the masses saw as an amnesty plan.

    Here is a shorter write up on the Pence plan. Back in 06 when the McCain/Kennedy plan was being pushed, and yes I was one of the voices shouting against it, the waters had already been muddied so badly that no alternative plan could even be discussed. Those on the right that did look at Pence’s plan, immediately tagged it as an amnesty plan right along with the McCain/Kennedy plan. That was funny, because at the same time you had those on the left screaming that the Pence plan made the illegal immigrants leave the country. Thta’s true, it did, but not by rounding them up on busses, or in semi’s to take their butts back across the border. That is in fact something that any one with any brains knows will never happen.

    In an interview with Pence, someone asked what would happen to the children born in this country to guest workers, who are here legally. He brings up the point that it would also be a good time to broach the birthright citizenship laws, and he suggests treating those born here to be treated with the same guest status, where they are not given automatic citizenship.

    I liked Pence’s idea of guest workers not being eligible for welfare, medicare and social security. They would pay the same taxes as all legal american citizens, but the medicare taxes collected from them would go to hospital emergency rooms, where the uninsured illegals show up for medical care.

    That debacle happened in late 06, and McCain jumped into the presidential race just a few months later. I remember his campaign not getting off the ground at first, because of the bill, and I saw a picture of him pulling his carry on behind him through an airport, headed for a coach class seat, because his campaign was so broke. Just as some of us are perplexed at how Romney with his Romneycare could have become the likely nominee, I too wondered how McCain with his push for an amnesty bill could have gone for him as the nominee.

    Speaking of attracting latino/hispanic voters, just listen to what even the legal hispanics say about the Republicans. They are extremely offended by the rhetoric used by way to many on the right, which sounds to them like they are less than human beings. They are no better than the useless eaters that the liberals want to flush from the country, and the world actually. Look at Herman Cain’s language when he was still a candidate. He said he wanted to put up a 20 foot high electrified fence, with signs in english and spanish, saying if you touch this you will die. In a comment above, someone asks “if it isn’t the childrens fault for being here illegally, whose fault is it”? That is offensive to me, and I’m not a hispanic. So a 5 or 10 year old is supposed to, abandon their family, and walk back across the border, and go home?

    I know the Pence plan will never be taken off the shelf, and dusted off, from it’s dark hiding place in some closet, while the liberals are still in control. Heck the DHS just deemed the prisons to full, and to stop arresting the illegals because we don’t have enough beds to house those arrested. With the right R administration, it is my opinion that the Pence plan would be a very good starting point on the road to immigration reform. What do you think?

    • bobmark

      Thought it was clear that the kids were blameless, but that they didn’t get here by accident and “somebody” had to be accountable for it. In my own defense I never said any non-criminal had to leave. Just that the adults shouldn’t be allowed to become citizens or to vote, and that the kids had to do more than just go to school. I think military service is a good starting point.

      I hadn’t heard about the Pence plan, thanks for posting the link.
      I think their paragraph on entitlements in section two parallels my point about those who come here expecting to be given stuff, and the others who are gaming the system beyond that.

      I agree that everyone should tone down the rhetoric and keep the issue on the behavior and not on the ethnicity of those performing it.

  • krish

    is who is/are going to articulate the solution in such a way that they do not get savaged by the media as reacism

    Of course, Romney will not touch this with a 100 feet pole once the primaries are over!

    That leaves Rubio/Gov Martinez/ may be Ted Cruz (hope he gets elected to the senate from TX) & few other Hispanic republicans who should/must do this! They should first get the Hispanic Americans in their corner about what is really happening in the states especially border states! What are the econmic costs for every legal american citizen….If Rubio can take the lead on a meaningful immigration reforms…he will be the POTUS in 2016!

    You get my drift..if he takes the VP slot for Mittens, he can kiss goodbye to his chances to become the POTUS!!

    • http://www.timothy-bladel.com/ center77

      and I get to conversations with his media director about what to do while I’m in college. This team on his, and Ted have really been great to me. I’m super stoked about hi. Being a senator, and if he is not elected it would be a horrible thing. He is a star in waiting.