BREAKING: Massive Meltdown in Pennsylvania

By Erick Posted in Comments (18) / Email this page » / Leave a comment »

RedState is getting widespread reports of an electoral nightmare shaping up in Pennsylvania with certain types of electronic voting machines.

In some counties, machines are crashing. In other counties, we have enough reports to treat as credible that fact that some Rendell votes are being tabulated by the machines for Swann and vice versa. The same is happening with Santorum and Casey. Reports have been filed with the Pennsylvania Secretary of State, but nothing has happened.

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BREAKING: Massive Meltdown in Pennsylvania 18 Comments (0 topical, 18 editorial, 0 hidden) Post a comment »
Source? by Money

When Swann and Santorum win, I don't want allegations of fraud or abuse. Where is the source here? Is it coming to you directly from the ground?

Unobjective are we????? n/t by LibertarianISH

Don't tread on me.

Hmmmmm... by docj

The Governor of PA: Democrat
The Chief Elections Officer of PA: Democrat
Philly is a wholly-owned subsidiary of which party: Democrat

Yep - clearly a case of rampant voter disenfranchisement by Republicans

-------------
"I don't know." -- Helen Thomas, when asked by White House spokesman Scott McClellan, "Are we at war, Helen?"

The "Paper-Trail" of your vote is a little receipt with a code on it. There is no printout of how you actually vote. As I was explaining to the poll-worker today, I have no way to know how I actually voted today.
So hang onto those receipts, folks. When the recounts happen, you'll probably need to verify that your code matches your votes...

"The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal comfort... has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself."
--John Stuart Mill

As I was explaining to the poll-worker today, I have no way to know how I actually voted today.

You never have. There hasn't been a voting machine in history that would give you the comfort you're demanding of the new machines.

---
Internet member since 1987
Member of the Surreality-Based Community

having a receipt of your vote by LoveThatConstitution

I think having a coded receipt of your vote should be sufficient as it is more than you get with other machines. I understand your frustration: Why cant an electronic machine spit out such basic information? Even my grocery receipt is more detailed.

I am sure the machines are capable of spitting out a name and the voters name. That would remove all secrecy from the voting process. With the thuggery you hear going on by the Ds regarding lying and harrassing voters, is it too crazy to believe you wouldnt have intimidators outside asking their fellow neighborhood residents to "see the receipt"?

It probably makes sense that, in the worst case scenario you could match up the receipt with the vote but how many people actually are going to keep those?

No easy answer yet.

Receipts by zuiko

There is no need for a receipt at all. If we have to use machines, whatever they print out should be stuck in a box and be the actual vote. We absolutely don't want receipts people take with them for this reason:

With the thuggery you hear going on by the Ds regarding lying and harrassing voters, is it too crazy to believe you wouldnt have intimidators outside asking their fellow neighborhood residents to "see the receipt"?

It would also be handy to know if that the guy actually voted for the Democrats before you hand him that pack of Marlboros.
---
"I am a great believer in luck. The harder I work, the more I have of it." -- Thomas Jefferson

...the four now-most dreaded words in the English language.

--furious

"I find your lack of faith disturbing." -- Darth Vader

I just voted by Brandozilla

I just voted in my very rural PA town, had no issues at all.

Sources please? by steve962

Could you provide your sources for such news? I'm seeing none of this (or the earlier post about major issues in certain Philly precincts...) from any news outlet, either nationally or locally.

I'm particularly skeptical about this report in particular - how does one tell if a particular individual vote was recorded incorrectly while the polls are still open? The machines (at least the ones they have in my area) have to be unlocked to read the tallys and that doesn't happen until after the polls close...

I've heard a few reports of nationwide issues (not just PA) with some percentage of machines crashing, or not being able to be set up properly. But nothing so far indicating any serious widespread problems in PA in particular.

. . . is our insistance on being able to know the results now! If we weren't so concerned with knowing, at 9:00 PM tonight, who won, we might have different systems.

My preference would be for a machine which produces a clearly marked, machine-readible paper ballot, one which was also readible to the naked eye. Then you let optical scanners do the quick count, and have easily verifiable paper records in the event a manual recount is required, along with strong standards for interpretation of any non-standard markings on the ballots. (My preference would be that any man-made markings on the ballots other than a write-in vote would invalidate the ballot, period.)

Of course, if we held to the wisdom of the founding fathers, and restricted the franchise to white male property owners, things would be much better! :)

Dana
Common Sense Political Thought

More or less, anyway. The ballots certainly *look* like they're meant to be read by a Scantron or similar device, and the machine I fed mine into before leaving the poll this morning certainly looked like a Scantron (of course, it may have just sucked the sheet straight into a bin, and left the counting for the poll workers or something, too).

Scantron style by Tjos Weel

Yes, we use scantron style (maybe not brand) voting in Louisville. I think they are actually made by Diebold. Not 100% sure though.

Two problems with them:
1. Hypothetically, on a recount, you could get arguments over stray marks, 1/2 bubbled in circles, etc. A touch screen style voting system that then prints out a paper ballot that is read by a scantron style machine would prevent this problem.

2. They dont audit (AFAIK). Recanvasses occur regularly, where they re-add up the #s from the different precincts. But, they dont pull out the paper ballots and match them up with the machines unless a recount is paid for, and that is rarely done, especially in big races (I cant remember it happening). They should pick a small sample of random precints every election and verify that the #s on the paper ballots match the electronic numbers.

I used a Diebold machine in Illinois that printed all my votes in English on a paper tape roll inside the machine for an audit trail. I could verify my vote was properly recorded before pushing the DONE button. I didn't notice any identifier that could connect my vote to me, but I'm not paranoid and didn't look closely. The touch screen was easy to use, even for writing in Randy Stufflebeam for Gov.

FWIW, a printed receipt creates more problems than it solves. Anyone capable of hacking a voting machine can figure out how to print out one answer and tally another internally. I could not agree more that it would also set the stage for intimidation based on a loss of privacy. It's too easy to imagine groups of thugs demanding to see proof of how someone voted, to say nothing of abusive husbands/wives/bosses etc.

Point is, when you go into that ballot booth nobody knows who you voted for but you. I think that's the way the founders intended it, and anything that jeopardizes that is a cure that may be worse than the disease. It doesn't take electronic machines to produce massive fraud -- just look at Acorn, cheating the old fashioned way.

(waves to Brandozilla in passing re: rural PA :-) )

DaMav & Brandozilla: by Dana R Pico

Jim Thorpe, Pennsylvania here!

New machines for today's vote, easy to use, though they offer less privacy than the old booths. Large type makes them very easy to read, and yes, I used the straight Republican Party line option. Unfortunately, I'll probably be 0-4 in my selections, unless Rick Santorum pulls an amazing comeback. My Democratic congressman and Democratic state representative had only token opposition, and my Democratic state senator didn't even have that! :(

Dana
Common Sense Political Thought


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