Redstate

That's why they're called "watermelons."

Green on the outside. Red on the inside....

The socialists wanted the economy to grow, but their policies have the opposite effect. Now the greens explicitly want to stop economic growth and this time their policies would actually have that effect.

The Sea Sheppard Conservancy makes George Monbiot look like a teetotler and a deep thinker.

"I believe we must adjourn this meeting to some other place." - The last recorded words of Adam Smith.

Solar for most homeowners is a no brainer from an ROI standpoint. However, it isn't promoted very heavily because its hard to source product. Most of it is going to Germany because of high subsidies.

We will be hydrogen fuel cell cars while most of us are still alive. There isn't much downside with them...

What's too bad is that most of the best minds working on these problems (which will create mega wealth for the second half of this century) are international. If it gets done in China, I believe we will see the US eclipsed as the worlds super power.
I see them and this as a bigger threat than Islam.

Laugh at Kyoto treaty and the greenies all you want - but to me, this is the key to being the dominate world power in the future.

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"If we want to take this party back, and I think we can someday, let’s get to work." – Barry Goldwater

China rising as a superpower does not diminish us as one. We were one when the Soviets were at their peak after all.

And China has no obligations under the Kyoto Protocol, so if what you say is right and China will rise, then opting out was the RIGHT thing to do!

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Right now, I think it's likely that the major energy sources of the second half of this century will be developed in Europe or Japan and manufactured in India or China. This is based on where the research is being done and where manufacturing is being done.

The smartest thing China could do is give lip service to Kyoto - the dumbest would be what we did which was ridicule it.

Of course the US will be involved in the future of energy but not as dominate or - worst case as a major - player, and as a consumer.

If it's just consumer, we will falter as a superpower.

Hell, we already use China to pay for the war in Iraq and our tax cuts. Just like the US did for Europe in the first half of the 20th century.

It's a very scary threat and the I don't share the humorous attitude.

They're investing in solar manufacturing and R&D because they want to be in the position of selling it to other nations (like us).

China Solar Energy Industry Research and Forecast, 2008-2010 Available Now
Reuters, January 8, 2008

China is expected to emerge as one of the greatest solar energy production bases in the world after 2008. Certain fundamental conditions are already in place in China for the large scale development and exploitation of solar energy. These conditions include China's huge potential domestic market and solid resource foundation. China's solar energy industry has already taken shape, and progress has been made in technological development and innovation.

Given the recurrent oil and coal price spikes as well as the power shortages nationwide, energy, and energy uncertainty, is increasingly having a bottleneck effect on China's economy.

...The annual growth rate in the coming years will be maintained at 20 to 30 percent, which means that solar energy industry in China will become a genuine green "gold mine".

This reminds me of how the Japanese used the 70's oil crisis to advance their auto industry at the expense of Detroit.

"Austere, intolerant, well-armed, and blood-thirsty, in their own regions the Wahhabis are a distinct factor which must be taken into account" - Winston Churchill, 1921

How long were they running a net trade of PLA-manufactured goods for Treasury IOUs?

And then there's the whole Tibet thing that just happened.

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"If we want to take this party back, and I think we can someday, let’s get to work." – Barry Goldwater

China is investing in solar power research because they are making a fortune selling solar cells to idiots being forced or subsidized into buying them in the west.

If you notice the company you are so fond of Nano Solar sells most of its product to Germany ? Why the German government is forcing their purchase whether they make sense or not.

Look a bit of friendly advice when reading these puff pieces. The press lies mostly because they don't know what they are talking about and don't want to take the time to learn. Second you need to ask yourself where the money is and why. Third the obvious answer is usually wrong its there to distract people.

So in this one Ask yourself why is china building production capacity for solar when they are building two coal power stations a week ? And they have the three gorges project coming online ? Whats China been doing to raise funds lately ? The export market !! What does china have going for it to let it gain market share ? Cheap disposable labor they can subject to toxic waste without qualm. The ability to dispose of the hazardous byproducts by dumping them in farmers fields.

From the WAPO (What a news source)
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/03/08/AR200803...

GAOLONG, China -- The first time Li Gengxuan saw the dump trucks from the nearby factory pull into his village, he couldn't believe what happened. Stopping between the cornfields and the primary school playground, the workers dumped buckets of bubbling white liquid onto the ground. Then they turned around and drove right back through the gates of their compound without a word.

the byproduct of polysilicon production -- silicon tetrachloride -- is a highly toxic substance that poses environmental hazards.

"The land where you dump or bury it will be infertile. No grass or trees will grow in the place. . . . It is like dynamite -- it is poisonous, it is polluting. Human beings can never touch it," said Ren Bingyan, a professor at the School of Material Sciences at Hebei Industrial University.

The article I linked to is all about domestic (Chinese) sales.

It's only a matter of time before they can undercut the price of anything we can produce, and out-produce us as well. But you're right. We really should let Asia handle all of our energy needs since they're not afraid of technological advances and winning market share. American exceptionalism and ingenuity ended with the 20th Century.

"Austere, intolerant, well-armed, and blood-thirsty, in their own regions the Wahhabis are a distinct factor which must be taken into account" - Winston Churchill, 1921

You are predicting as if it were both.

Second the article speaks in terms of the conditional possibility of china becoming a market for solar tech. This is as opposed to the actual situation where china is a vast market for coal/nuclear/hydro and to a lesser extent other energy sources.

So which would you believe in ? The Chinese reversing everything they have done since Mao kicked the bucket ? Or them telling gullible westerners what they think we want to hear ?

Remember they are doing one thing and they are well known for prevaricating on everything they do.

buying solar cells for electric power. There is simply not sufficient energy density to run a modern industrialized society on photovoltaics. Even if we could lower the cost of solar cells to the point where photovoltaic energy was cost competitive with coal and nuclear, it would not support our electric grid. There is a reason you did not see large scale investment in photovoltaic manufacturing before a number of the world's governments went terminally stupid and mandated that a certain percentage of electricity production come from "renewable sources". Without government mandates, solar would never make sense for grid power. That isn't opinion, it's physics.
If we were managing our government for the sake of the economy versus political advantage, we'd be providing incentives for nuclear power plant construction and coal gassification plants as well as incentives for shale oil production. We'd see a much larger return than we'll ever see for photovoltaics.

Local power and peaking power. Call it what 5 to 10 percent of demand ?

particularly in the South and Southwest, where peak demands are primarily air conditioning loads and the load peaks are during the day. Not so much in the Northern latitudes, which is why we typically see "renewables" at 1- 2% of total load. Although if the government keeps producing subsidy payments, people will keep taking their money.

I doubt that anyone living near Mt. Shasta would see a positive ROI on solar, unless the state subsidies make it so. SLoar is not going to be a major player on a national scale, because outside FLorida , Arizona, So California, New Mexico and Texas, you will not be able to generate enough electricity, to ever begin to give you a positive ROI. Of course, if the Democrats take the white house and both houses of congress and run electricity rates through the roof, all bets are off. At that point you might get a positive ROI even though the economic effects will be catastrophic.

...of updating a promotion notice to note that no offense to ordinary, decent Greens was meant - and particularly none was meant against those willing to make a deal on trading out coal mega-wattage for nuclear. :)

The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!

The study said that the person most responsible for Global Warning was Jane Fonda.

The reasoning was that "the china syndrome" scared people off of clean, safe nukes and into dirty coal etc. plants.

I'm pretty green and have wanted more nukes since the '80s.

I would hold up the greenness of my lefestyle to anyone less crazed than Ed Begley. The bulbs in my home are curly fluorescents, I drive an economical car, I have PV solar panels on my roof and a solar water heater. I did all the above for my reasons though and they had absolutely no bearing on the religious cult of being green. Living in florida and with the tax credits offered the solar options made good sense. Especially since I wanted back up power for my home. The economical car was the same reason and I hate stopping for gas. Curly lightbulbs simply last longer and if you hunt for them you can get them for about a dollar a bulb.

My point is I am fine with green as a personal choice.I break down with it, when it goes all jonestown and everybody has to drink the cool aid. Nukes are the best example. We all suffered for things that didn't and couldn't have happened here or in the west in general.

Being economical is not wrong, it's practical and makes sense.

David Paterson Must Go

I think conservatives need to take back the green message. I really think that is where we have dropped the ball. It should be considered conservative to want to limit waste, reduce excess emissions, turn off the lights when you aren't using them, etc.

Those are all positions of personal responsibility. Those are the areas where we can make a difference as an individual. All the other stuff is just socialist bs.

___________________________________
Two thirds of the world is covered by water,
the other third is covered by Champ Bailey.

Worst case, it's, like, 5 miles to China. No big whoop. In the U.S., you gotta go all the way thru the earth's core.

Duh.

There is more stupidity than hydrogen in the universe, and it has a longer shelf life. - Frank Zappa

soli Deo gloria

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"If we want to take this party back, and I think we can someday, let’s get to work." – Barry Goldwater