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George S. Patton, Jr., At the Rhine River: Yes, Hillary, Peeing on the Enemy IS an American Tradition.

From the Diary of George S. Patton, March 24th, 1945:

Drove to the river and went across on the pontoon bridge, stopping in the middle to take a piss in the Rhine, and then pick up some dirt on the far side, in emulation of William the Conqueror.

George S. Patton was rather upset by the myth that the likes of TIME and LIFE magazines had built around him: “Old Blood and Guts”, the called him, publishing all manner of pictures of him astride this tank, or that command car. One evening not too long after the Battle of the Bulge, Patton’s son-in-law, Fred Ayers, screwed up his courage enough to ask his Uncle George why he put on all the bravado, the cursing, the pistols.

“Okay, Freddy, you asked, so I’ll tell you. In any war, a commander, no matter what his rank, has to send to sure death, nearly every day, by his own orders, a certain number of men. Some are his personal friends. All are his personal responsibility, to them as his troops and to their families. Any man with a heart would, then, like to sit down and bawl like a baby, but, he can’t. So, he sticks out his jaw, and swaggers and swears, I wish some of those pious sob sister at home could understand something as basic as that.”  Then, he did smile. “And as for the kind of remarks I make, why sometimes, I just, by God, get carried away with my own eloquence.”

Of course, many of the remarks that Patton made weren’t verbal, even if they were just as eloquent. Some were physical. Many were visual, meant to inspire the men he commanded.

For example, at the very beginning of Operation Torch, and the very landings at French Morocco, Patton noticed that the landing craft were having a difficult time debauching their tanks in the heavy surf. Patton, of course, was the creator of the modern armored division, and knew better than anyone how to unload a tank in the heaving waves near the shore. So, he cast off (once the davits had been fixed after a close encounter with enemy fire) from the destroyer in which he’d set up his command post, and motored up in his little landing vessel. Once ashore, Patton set about to immediately demonstrate how to set the massive timbers, how to arrange the jacklegs and so on, and got soaked doing it. Then he returned to his ship. The tanks were unloaded.

We all are likely familiar with the shots from the George C. Scott movie of Patton driving to the front of an advancing column, getting strafed throughout, dodging bullets and weaving about in his jeep (which he always called “peeps”); or of is famous “traffic cop” scene, in which he’d untangle one convoy from another from atop an oil-drum, riding-crop in hand. These scenes, while Hollywood amalgamations of various documented events, were nonetheless true. Patton believed with all of his heart and mind in leading by example, by displays of courage and resourcefulness, of inspiring by action. He never demanded that those under his command do things he couldn’t bring himself to do.

Which is why he pissed in the Rhine River, when, in March of 1945, he finally was granted the unbridled joy of finally crossing the iconic waterway. His Third Army had raced across France in the high summer of 1944, and was within ten days of delivering Berlin into American hands– until he was stopped in favor of Montgomery’s disastrous plan of entering Germany through occupied Holland, called “Market Garden”. This ill-fated blow led, circuitously, to the Battle of the Bulge, and an thoroughly unneeded, long, tough slog that finally reached it’s zenith there, on the pontoon bridge the army had erected over the Rhine. After the death, slaughter, destruction and single-mindedness that I presume only a combat General can experience, he finally relieved himself on an enemy, quite literally, and in a manner he’d often spoken of doing.

Patton had set his mind upon a single goal: Killing Germans, killing them with dispatch, and shepherding thus his own men to safety. All else was politics, diplomacy and a total waste of time.

Hillary Clinton, despite her vainglorious accounts of landing in Bosnia under “sniper fire”, has never been in a war. Neither have I, as far as that goes. But, I have enough deep respect for those that HAVE been in a war to understand that war isn’t a garden party. It has to be mind-bendingly terrifying at moments, and the vestiges of civilization are swept away in those moments when the adrenaline starts to flow. The minutes must be frozen in the ambers of time, and the niceties of rules and regulations must seem as distant as Jupiter.

Hillary, nor her contemptible Commander-In-Chief, has never led by example in battle. She’s never wore her country’s uniform, she’s never confronted a terrifying enemy intent on murdering her. And yet, there she is: The “Sob Sister” about whom Patton so presciently spoke, getting her very large panties all a-twist, concerned again with what polite society might think of our steely warriors.

United States Marines are among our most magnificent Americans; they are absolutely the best our country has to offer. I could never do what they are asked to do, and do it so proudly, so self-sacrificially. And to hear the likes of Dame Hillary upbraid our warriors for pissing on a few corpses, and to do it with such smug outrage, is damnable. I don’t care what the background circumstances might be. I don’t care about the niceties and rules.

George Patton knew damned well that, when he urinated in the Rhine River, that the very image (a once-iconic image, by the way, which was snapped by enterprising Army photographers, and that has hung in years gone by in innumerable VFW halls throughout the land) he was sending, indeed, a message to Greater Germany: I’m pissing on you. And you deserve it, for the horrific slaughter you’ve unleashed on mankind.

In short, he was pissed off. And I’m still pissed off at the “Taliban”.

 

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COMMENTS

  • andystone

    the unofficial hymn of the German army, at the time, was “Die Wacht am Rhein” (“The Guard on the Rhine”), a song about defending the Rhine at all cost. (Hitler’s code name for the Bulge offensive was “Wacht am Rhein”, too.) Any Nazi fanatic would have much preferred that Patton pee on dead corpses rather than on the Rhine.

  • trickamsterdam

    Very good job.

  • aesthete

    offensive and damaging than spraying acid on the faces of little girls because they want to go to school, killing converts to Christianity or Buddhism, and terrorizing Afghani villages and conscripts into submission (all of which the Taliban has done in the past 10 years alone).

    For that matter, it’s a lot less destructive than killing thousands of civilians,

    War is no garden party, and soldiers are human beings who have to cope with tremendous pressure and responsibility. That said, it’s generally been the case that we try to mitigate this tendency: we make a point of avoiding civilian casualties, treating POWs and enemy-affiliated partisans with respect, and strongly disapprove of wartime rape, murder, and wanton sacking regardless of circumstance, context, and nationality. Peeing on corpses doesn’t rank particularly high on my list of horribles — if our enemies suddenly treated our forces humanely, attacked military targets, and peed on our dead soldiers, I would vastly prefer that to the status quo. However, I don’t think that the right tack in this particular episode is to hand-wave and say “stuff happens”, because it encourages a similar response in more serious cases (such as aforementioned wartime rape).

    • Melody Warbington (rwm52)

      When I heard the story this morning, the word used to describe the Marines’ actions was “barbaric.” While I don’t condone the actions of the soldiers and might go so far as to call it “vulgar”, what I call barbaric is the act of beheading a person, or mutilating a person or about a dozen other practices used by the Taliban.

      • aesthete

        by how outraged people are about vulgar, but harmless, actions like these, and how little they regard the lives of others. Even something like a bombing run or targeted killing with legitimate military purpose seems more morally objectionable to me than peeing on a corpse that doesn’t feel it.

        • duramater

          The over reaction by the Obama administration will have to be rescinded. These Marines, it turns out,belong to a religious order and were collectively conducting a ritual anointing of the dead.

          Some religious practices are not well understood or appreciated in all cultures but according to our Supreme Court,it’s all good when considered in the context of first amendment protection of free speech and free expression of one’s religion. Just think of this act as being a variation on honor killing, beheading of infidels, Santoria sacrifices and Westboro protests at American military funerals.

          All you bigots crying foul over this sacred ritualistic act by the Marines are out of line. Now don’t you feel ashamed?
          /sarc

        • conservativecurmudgeon

          …and, I while I disagree that nearly ANY behavior on the part of US Soldiers, Sailors, Airmen or Marines isn’t a necessary flash-point for our enemies (they already hate us, so I doubt it would matter if our armed forces served them tea at white-linen table-clothed bistros would redound well to us– so why bother), I think you have made what amounts to the only reasonable argument against the behaviors in question.

          But, again, I respectfully disagree. The enemy is the enemy, and I care not at all what is done to them: They have no rules vis-a-vis us, so to hell with them. Period. A civilized world is based on a fundamental justice.

      • acat

        of the media using the language wrong, to advance their agenda.

        Mew

    • http://www.theprecinctproject.wordpress.com ColdWarrior

      http://therealrevo.com/blog/?p=64639

      Thank you.

      ColdWarrior

  • Tbone

    our troops would piss on Hillary.

    BTW, does anyone know if they were on fire?

    • aesthete

      that on a planet of 7 billion people, there’s probably someone out there turned on by that scenario.

      • Tbone

        nt

    • No Longer For Perry

      old ptxx33 using some Nazi analogy!

      • acat

        (cheshire grin)

      • pttx333

        also say how the term Nazi was used?

        • No Longer For Perry

          Last night you wrote this: “Easiest place to do so, wouldn

          • jakeofalltrades

            Hint – it ain’t zero.

          • acat

            Note – this is conjecture, guesswork, and should not be treated as serious.

            Mew

          • pttx333

            you’ve been suffering from, being “for Perry” then you’re not, must be getting to you. Indecisiveness is really a problem for some people.

            As for the Paul “family” as you put it, how can you defend the indefensible? Their brand of politics, even though Rand is currently downplaying his beliefs, is very dangerous for this country. There are videos all over the ‘net where Rand is pounding the pavement for Ron and parroting his words. If that is a “conspiracy theory” on my part, you are sorely misguided indeed. Family dynasties are not good; i.e., the Kennedys, the Bush family (with Jeb in the wings), et al. are detrimental to this country. And I voted for both GHWB and W, much to my later dismay, but what was the other option?

            Do not speak negative things about avagreen to me … if you have something to say to her, then contact her. She is a dear lady and you come off as a shrill, shrieking loon with your raving rants.

            Nazi-style train wreck? Yep, that pretty much describes Ron Paul for the most part. You DO protest too much in his defense, so that seems to me that you must have hopped aboard that particular train to nowhere. Good luck with your choice.

          • http://www.changeforrickperry.org louisianapatriette

            My face looks like this ===> :( if it’s true.

          • pttx333

            I DO see her going all over the ‘net posting stuff, though, which is something that a lot of us had agreed to do, and are doing. She is a very good analyst, researcher and funny as everything! No, I do not believe what hysterical folks say … I must see things with my very own eyes and hear with my own ears. Don’t be upset about our friend, sweetie … keep the faith with Ms. Ava also. Okay? Just don’t fret …

          • westcoastpatriette

            Ava mentioned several days ago she was going to go to other sites and defend Perry there as their was too much traffic here. But never did she say she was switching allegiance to Newt — obviously No Longer enjoys acting like an annoying, lying gnat.

          • http://www.changeforrickperry.org louisianapatriette

            So relieved to hear that!

            (BTW, I wrote a post on my blog this morning I think y’all might appreciate with some fantastic quotes from Winston Churchill. Hope it brightens your day and spurs you on! http://formidablecourage.wordpress.com/2012/01/13/our-finest-hour/)

          • No Longer For Perry

            These half dozen quotes from just the last 24 hours shows that she threw in the towel on Perry. Her very last post here was essentially “goodbye.”

            “Newt is like the Energizer bunny…he has been hit and slandered and lampooned over and over but he just keeps on going and going. He certainly does not have the glass jaw it appears that Mitt has.”

          • westcoastpatriette

            1 Large can stewed tomatoes
            1 small can tomatoe paste
            6 cloves garlic finely minced
            1 brown onion chopped in big pieces
            lots of olive oil
            Italian Seasoning (to taste)

            In stainless steel pot, pour enough olive oil to cover bottom of pot and add the can of tomato paste. Turn burner on medium and scorch the paste in the oil on purpose. Continue adding more oil while scraping burnt paste off bottom until all paste is scorched (as in black). Continue adding more oil and toss in garlic and onions until sauteed. Add spices and stir. Add stewed tomatoes and several cups water. Cover and simmer several hours.

            May add meat or mushrooms as desired although you will find this sauce so exquisite that it does not need meat. Splatter on pasta of your choice and enjoy.

          • jakeofalltrades

            :D

          • pttx333

            pinto beans, etc. Uh huh … good stuff is cilantro!

            Good recipe, WCP … you can also throw in some red pepper flakes to desired taste!

          • http://www.changeforrickperry.org louisianapatriette

            8 egg yolks
            1/2 quart heavy cream
            1/4 cup sugar
            1/4 teaspoon vanilla
            Pinch of salt.

            Beat egg yolks in a large bowl, set adide. Scald remaining ingredients in a heavy saucepan (nonaluminum). DO NOT BOIL. Slowly add hot cream mixture in yolks while mixing, being careful not to bear air into it. Set up cheesecloth to strain mix. Pour into ovenproof custard cups (about 4 ounces). To bake: Place in pan filled with water 2/3 up the side of the custard cup. Bake at 350 degrees for 25 to 40 minutes. Chill the Creme Brulee. Before serving spread 1-2 teaspoon of light brown sugar on top. Place under broiler until bubbly and toasted. Variation: use crystallized ginger mixed with granulated sugar for topping.

          • jakeofalltrades

            Thanks!

          • pttx333

            ..

          • jakeofalltrades

            normally he’s a thousand miles away, so we’re gonna celebrate by hitting the pub right after work.

            Not that I have to leave work to drink… I’ve got a full supply of alcohol in the corner on display. Herradura Suprema… yummmmm,

            But I don’t usually indulge here except on special occasions or when a co-worker or employee really needs a drink. I’m not Herman Cain, after all.

          • pttx333

            to do the same thing “to let the traffic subside” doncha know. ;-) Here I am, don’t drink except for a once-every-ten-years margarita or my annual glass of champagne, but sure enjoyed the happy hours and all of the attendant hilarity!

            But, of course, jake, you MUST maintain some “emoticon” of dignity and all that stuff, huh. ;-)

            On my 50th birthday, my boss hired Eastern Onion to surprise me at the office. So here comes the California Raisin with a boom box blaring ‘I Heard It Through the Grapevine” (Marvin Gaye – my favorite song of all time). Man, did we get a conga line weaving all over the floor doing the raisin dance! Woo hoo, that was funnnnneee and FUN. And this at a very proper, very dignified, very uppity law firm! HA, not so much … we had a LOT of fun and worked like dogs at the same time. Great teams ….

          • pttx333

            recipe, I know of an ancient Chinese secret. You simply screw up your mouth into a grotesque shape while beating the mixture, then – VOILA – all of the calories just disappear into thin air (thick air also). Of course, this works for any recipe.

            Also, if you eat only the broken pieces of cookies you will have not consumed any calories since they have all leeched out when first broken. Then there is the one that if you eat alone there are no calories involved … sorta like the old “if a tree falls in the forest and no one is there to hear it, does it make a sound?”

            Just thought I’d pass along my little tips, though I don’t use them much. My theory is to just enjoy what foods you want … for every pound you add, you’ve just fluffed out one more wrinkle, or maybe five or eleven!

          • http://www.changeforrickperry.org louisianapatriette

            Oh my gosh that is SO funny. Those calories are the meanest, nastiest little things! They’re your sworn enemies ESPECIALLY after Christmas. Actually, I think I’m currently beating them into submission, thanks to exercise and being careful of how many cookies and how much King Cake I allow myself this month ;) ;) ;)

          • pttx333

            a book someday on health and beauty tips. Oh, speaking of beauty tips … did you know that if you spray a very fine mist of hair spray on your makeup mirror that you, too, can look exactly like a young Elizabeth Taylor (except for the dark hair, of course) – I discovered this quite by accident, doncha know. Or, as I once explained to my co-workers after arriving to work and being soaked by a thunderstorm: “Dang, when I left home, I looked exactly like Marilyn Monroe. I still look like MM, though … Marjorie Main a/k/a Ma Kettle.”

            Stick with me, kid, I know LOTSA thangs …

          • http://www.changeforrickperry.org louisianapatriette

            and they were rolling with laughter. The thing about the makeup mirror is funny, too! Laughter is so good for the soul, isn’t it? Keeps us from being too depressed by everything around us, and keeps the atmosphere here from becoming too cynical (I’m thinking about HotGas here…no humor whatsoever there, and what humor they have is very dark).

            About you eating banana splits when you were younger…you must be tall. Short people…well, let’s just say we gotta be more careful! There’s not as many square inches to tuck away the accumulated cake and ice cream (and with as many people in our family, that birthday cake adds up over the months…) ;)

          • pttx333

            soothing to my soul, humor/laughter is the big honkin’ battery that keeps the soul charged up and rarin’ to go!

            Nope, not tall … about 5’4″ or 5’5″ … thereabouts, so guess that is about average, though my son is 6’2″ and my daughter 5’9″ (my maternal grandfather was quite tall, as were his brothers!). Just was always a little peanut myself. And I recall that my high school senior class ring was a size 4! Can you believe it? But my Mom was about 5’1″ or so and the cutest little thing you ever saw at age 84 before she passed. (A secret – don’t tell anyone, but I called her Miss Twisty Butt because she would put on her bling and go sashaying down the halls!) She kept everyone on their toes at assisted living and played chickenfoot every single day – her doctor even wrote a prescription to “play chickenfoot daily” – I have that very “prescription” in my possession, one of my prized ones!

          • http://www.changeforrickperry.org louisianapatriette

            We’re on the short side ourselves, though my siblings and I were all big ol’ babies! The smallest one was Lil’ Sis, who was born several weeks early…she was 5 pounds but the doctor said that if she’d gone to term she’d have been closer to 8. What’s funny is another family at our church is also very petite, but their babies are little peanuts. Baby Sis and their baby are close to the same age, but Baby Sis is so much bigger that she often (accidentally) knocks the other baby over while they’re playing. Both of them are little drama queens, so you can imagine what happens when the smaller baby goes splat on the floor.

            I think I’m gonna say “goodnight” to the RedState folks so I can work on some other projects before heading for bed. Keep up the good work, and Lord willing I’ll see y’all tomorrow!

          • westcoastpatriette

            It means “Rolling on the floor laughing my thin butt off!”

          • pttx333

            The vast majority of my life was spent being a beanpole, yet I ate like a vulture. Even used to eat banana splits (though I didn’t particularly care for them) trying to gain weight. I began to gain some ## about 10 years ago and am so proud of myself! Old age has its advantages, you know. However, the gravity part is discouraging – you know, the theory that the longer you are on this earth, the more gravity sets in … dragging everything south in the process. ;-)

          • redmymind

            Just remember, dear friend, there are some who actually generate their own gravitational field!

            One way to get there . . . good ole Korean barbeque!

            1. Marble (good 50/50 fat-to-meat ratio) meat, short ribs, etc.
            2. Dark soy sauce (for added sugar content)
            3. Brown sugar
            4. Sesame oil
            5. Finely chopped green and brown onions

            Marinate overnight, preferably, but not longer than Newt’s been marinating in DC. After all, we’re not in the business of selling thousand-old-eggs!

            Grill away and baste with Kansas City style barbeque sauce for added sweetness, if that’s your preference. It is mine. I love sweet!

            Precise quantities of the ingredients??? Let your taste buds decide. The combination is very forgiving, in case you overdo something.

            Enjoy over a hot bed of steamed white rice, fries, slaw, and/or mashed with gravy!!! This is AMERICA!!!!!!!!!!!!!

            Oh . . . and don’t forget the fozen coke, a la pttx333!!!

            As for gravity, . . . as long as you’re not producing any of your own, you should be fine!

            Dish is best consumed before Mrs. BHO Antoinette “orders” it off limits to normal, hard-working, tax-paying citizens.

            One oriental recipe, I think, is good for today. Let’s hope I won’t have to come to a point where my Korean culinary instincts will have to start charting out what goes into “government-approved” tree bark and tofu salad!!!

            GO PERRY 2012!!!!!!!! . . . and stick with the barbeque!!!!!!!!!

          • pttx333

            revision? My mostest besterest favoritest ribs are pork … can they be substituted for the short ribs with success? Boy, the fixin’s are good too … and, nope, can’t leave off gravy – that is un”Amurican” and certainly unTexan. And the coke a la ME is a given with anything!

            Ya know, red, I just don’t give a big rip what Mitchell Antoinette says, thinks or feels … with a backside like hers, a bod like hers, size 18 feet – ya know if you would put paddle wheels on the back of her shoes, you could launch her on the Mississippi. (Lord, forgive me for speaking ill of her bod and feet – she “cain’t hep it” – but, Lord, she CAN “hep” being a beeeotch! Amen.) ;-)

            p.s. red – Thanks for the pass on the gravity issues!!!!

          • redmymind

            Yes!!! Pork, absolutely!!! In fact, my FAVORITE too! Tender, juicy, and just plain, melt-in-your-mouth GOOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

            Any meat that’s worth barbequin’ works. I just think meat with more fat content is more tender and forgiving, in case overcooked. From “South” Korea to the cool SOUTH!!!

            If, one day, Korea ever ends up the 51st State, we’ll just have to call her . . .
            New Texas!!! . . . In the meantime, I be teachin’ my folks how to pronounce that right!

            BTW, good description of Mrs. Antoinette! Though, for a moment there I thought you were giving the dimensions of a 1996 Buick Roadmaster . . . no insult to the classic, venerable V-8 land yacht, of course!

            Till next, my dear friend!!!

          • pttx333

            a land yacht, ya shoulda seen the 1958 Buick Roadmaster land barge! Sure was a smooooooth ride, though … real comfy it was.

            Yep, be workin’ on the correct pronunciation of the 51st state! There’s a New Mexico, so why not a New Texas?

            Oink!!! is right … love that pork! Love beef, too, but preferably as a big ol’ honkin’ steak, thank ya very muuuuch! Medium well – Texans don’t much like beef that moos when you cut into it! And I DO NOT like being served a whole flounder – how do you eat something while it is staring at you????? My cure is to politely put a napkin over the top part – either that or barf – so I figure it is more polite to just use the napkin. ;-)

          • avagreen

            What a freakin liar.
            No, I haven’t switched to Newt.
            It must be some nut from Politco, or Hot Air that I got under their skin.

            Must mean that I made some points they couldn’t refute and resorted to this.

            I don’t even listen to Rush…….I don’t travel in my car, which was when I did listen to him…….don’t think I’ve heard a broadcast since 2006.

            What hilarity! I’m thinking it’s someone from HA.

            Pooor baby! Wow!

            MY own personal troll!

            LMAO!!!

          • avagreen

            Anyway, your overblown rhetoric is bordering on

          • westcoastpatriette

            but I knew it was a phony lie. Since we hinzed “it” with some recipes, it disappeared.

          • Scope

            this nut case has issues. I knew you wouldn’t leave Perry.

          • http://www.changeforrickperry.org louisianapatriette

            What a horrid nasty person “No Longer For Perry” is. I have a sneaky suspicion that someone that dishonest and that cruel to the rest of the Perry Posse wasn’t much of a Perry supporter anyway. Did y’all see that Ned Reck guy last night? He was downright WEIRD. Haven’t seen him all day, but if he comes back he needs some recipes thrown at him, too.

            Westcoastpatriette was right: when I read what he/she said about you I was horrified, couldn’t believe it was true. I’m so glad it was a big fat lie. Here, let me give you a big across-the-Internet hug!

            P.S. I’ve been in some contact with retire05 on my blog recently, just to let y’all know. She’s still fighting for Perry and sharing information all over the Internet. So thankful for people like her who aren’t giving up on the good Governor!

          • pttx333

            amen and a hearty hallelujah!!! Paybacks are pure hell, aren’t they. I knew damned well that you were out stirring up “stuff” – and you do it perfectly! Toooooo funny! ;-)

          • avagreen

            http://www.abcnews4.com/story/16505904/perry-loses-key-sc-backer-after-attack-on-romney

            It’s a Charleston, South Carolina news site.
            Here I go to register…..

  • Justin_Case

    a great big piss on those Marines, and all others who have served, by contemplating negotiations with the Taliban.

  • Tim Griffin@griffinelection

    http://www.redstate.com/griffinelection/2012/01/13/under-no-circumstances-should-anyone-lessen-the-impact-of-american-soldiers-urinating-on-dead-bodies/

    • http://908StraightSt.wordpress.com/ mbecker908

      Note above the routine actions by the Taliban in particular and Islamists in general.

      …spraying acid on the faces of little girls because they want to go to school, killing converts to Christianity or Buddhism, and terrorizing Afghani villages and conscripts into submission…

      Add to that the practice of female genital mutilation, burying women up to their shoulders and stoning them for adultery (while giving the man a pass), fathers and brothers murdering girls because they’ve defiled the family honor by some action, hanging or stoning homosexuals, etc, etc, etc.

      Those people are barbaric, and our media and the left gives them a free pass while going full monty over pictures from Abu Ghrabe – and calling it “torture”, while again giving Islamists a pass on real torture – and stupidity like this.

      You sir, are part of the problem, not part of any solution. Pathetic.

      • texashistorian

        Everyone (at least outside the Daily Kos/Mother Jones bunch) that complains about Marines pissing on dead Taliban seem to have no problems with the Marines blowing large ragged holes in the same Taliban. It’s okay to kill them in a thousand gruesome ways but if you urinate on them . . .

        I’d say that there is a serious lack of perspective on the part of all those are now engaging in liberal-style hand-wringing over how we’ve “abandoned the principles that make us who we are.”

        • irishgirl

          n/t

      • weyland

        Nuke ‘em all from orbit. It’s the only way to be sure!

  • radicalrighty

    You must drag the bodies behind an old Toyota PU, saw the heads off with a dull, rusty knife, THEN urinate on the headless bodies.

    To hell with Hillary.

    • tracker

      NT

    • Finrod

      .

  • lapert

    With all due respect, and not pretending to know the stress of being in combat as I haven’t myself, by videoing this these Marines violated CENTCOM general order 1b, demonstrated a lack of discipline and put their commanders in the position to have to condemn the behavior. Had this been under Bush’s administration you can bet Rumsfeld, Gates and Rice would have responded the same way Clinton and Panetta did because regardless of how they felt about the behavior, the sake of our mission requires it.

    Let them urinate on the corpses all they want, I have no lingering respect for dead taliban, but to video it, let alone if they had anything to do with distributing it, is unbecoming a Marine and a disservice to their unit and their country.

    • JSobieski

      particularly in the context of the paradise sought by the deceased.

    • lizzie

      really, no excuse for making sure they got their pissing on video.

      Court martial for all four.

      Patton got reprimanded and sidelined for slapping a grunt with shell shock.

      To stage and video a four-Marine pissing ceremony is CONDUCT UNBECOMING – NO excuses. Marines are better than that.

      • Justin_Case

        Captain Medina’s men made when they murdered Vietnamese villagers at My Lai while in the presence of an Army photographer.
        Making a video that is.

        Standing over ones dead enemy causes a tremendous high that is in direct proportion to the devastation one feels while loading a dead comrade onto a helicopter.

        Emotions change in a literal heartbeat.

        We send our soldiers to other countries to perform the task of “humanely” killing the enemy, as if such a thing was possible.

        “No excuses”?

        War is hell.

        • aesthete

          Peeing on corpses for the hell of it =/= raping live women and mutilating, then killing live children and babies for the hell of it

          One is boorish, the other is ghastly and inhumane. The former should be reprimanded as a face-saving measure, the latter should be punished to the fullest extent as a moral measure.

          • Justin_Case

            to reprimand these soldiers. Her shrill rant on this matter disgusts me.

            The participants at My Lai and those who attempted its cover-up did not receive anything that even vaguely represented the “fullest extent” of punishment

            The real tragedy is that these Marines, like the Army at Abu Ghraib, will be cast in the same light as Medina and Calley which will add to our country being unable to protect itself in the future.

          • aesthete

            on all counts.

  • BigRedConservative

    And we apply them to everybody, from the lowest scum in Kabul to the President. And, basically, desecration of a corpse in such a vulgar way is not upholding those laws. I have every respect for the US military, and 99.99% of those who serve in our uniform protect America and the Constitution with honour. But I honestly cannot condone these despicable actions. The fact that we treat all people with basic dignity is what elevates us above the terrorists. To “drag the bodies behind an old Toyota PU, saw the heads off with a dull, rusty knife, THEN urinate on the headless bodies.”, as one of my co-RS-ers says somewhere upthread, is no better than what al-Qaeda did to those poor people captured in Iraq.

    • avgjo

      the people al-Qaeda victimizes are usually innocent.

    • http://www.political-woman.com politicalwoman

      who was a guest on Bill O’Reilly’s show about a week ago. Bill interviewed Chris Kyle, the author, who has the distinction of being America’s most lethal sniper. During the interview, Bill asked him several questions, one being whether he felt any remorse about the killings, and Kyle’s answer was, to paraphrase him, ‘only that I couldn’t kill more of them.’, so that I could have saved more American lives and the lives of innocent civilians.

      Bill looked at him. Kyle went on to say, he saw too much, he saw the savagery and what the Taliban and the insurgents did to their own people. He had no regrets about the lives he took. He had/has no nightmares.

      I understand where your POV, and I wasn’t particularly thrilled by the photos either, but probably more from a perspective of how many more lives may be lost in revenge. The originator of this post talks about Patton and the Germans, and many of us still think in terms that war should be fought with honor and adhered to the terms of the Geneva convention. Al-Quaeda and the Taliban are not the Germans, and those war rules of honor and engagement went out with the Viet Cong.

      We expect better of our soldiers, and we’re a civilized society, I get that. But unlike the American boys who were hardened by the Depression, our young men and women today that we send into battle are light years away from having to endure that type of hardship. So when they encounter the killing and a culture so vastly different from our own Western standards, I think they suffer more and look for outlets to vent their anger, stress and fear.

      So, in my opinion, the soldiers should get a reprimand and our armed forces given a “watch it”. But that’s about it. My resentment is reserved more for the politicians playing politics with this issue and grandstanding for our so-called allies who could give a d**m about our Marines and how many other thousands of lives lost to defend their desert.

      • avagreen

        I agree heartedly with EVERYTHING you said!

        GOD BLESS EACH AND EVERY MAN/WOMAN WHO HAS SACRIFICED THEIR TIME, FAMILIES, AND LIVES SO I CAN SIT IN THE COMFORT OF MY OFFICE AND WRITE THIS!
        AND, HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO GO VOTE TO GET THESE SUCKIN’ TRAITORS OUT OF OFFICE!!!!

        I’ve been trying to reply to your post for the past 20-30 minutes, but it just kept getting hung up somehow.

  • funwithknives

    But….{Big BUT here}, why in the name of Our Republic did they video it? They had to have known it was going to go viral, yet they documented it for all to {possibly} see. Where is the brains nor thought process in that?
    In any vocation nowadays workers {and people of all stripes} are continually reminded of the immediacy and longetivity of the Internet and it’s effects.
    From Sexting to Facebook comments ,to corporate outed E-Mails stuff like this lies in ambush, as we see all the blessed time.
    Their service was ‘Statement’, enough, was it not?
    I submit that they completely forgot who and what they are{Marines, HOO-RAH!} and represent.Now the broad brushing can commence and surely will. T R A G I C .

  • http://www.theprecinctproject.wordpress.com ColdWarrior
    • texashistorian
      • conservativecurmudgeon

        Allen West: This generations Patton, in many ways. What an great American…

        Thanks so much, CW, by the way, for all the kind words and support. ‘Tis much appreciated.

      • jakeofalltrades

        For in this case, it’s targeted at stupid rather than smart.

        • Justin_Case

          and how its use is frowned upon here.

          For instance, the Left uses the term in order to stifle someone who has not worn the uniform and who voices support for our efforts in Iraq and Afghanistan. As one who fought in Vietnam, I can say that ANY kind of support from any of my countrymen would have been very welcome-especially during the “after years”.

          I’ll go out on a limb and say that the much, if not all, of the support and recognition our servicemen receive today is a result of “chickenhawks” understanding the damage that was done to a generation of vets who served during the Vietnam Era.

          While Allen West’s words are harsh, they should appeal to a person’s common sense; that if you have not been in the situation, you have no idea how you would react. The person who has not faced enemy steel has no idea what he would do in a given situation.

          To state that “Americans are better than this” is to deny that we have certain basic instincts such as fear. Basic human instincts experienced in combat are not understood by those attending Civil War re-enactments or by reading books.

          Finally, I want you to understand, Jake, that I am not writing to put you down. Several years ago, in this forum, a soldier who was serving in Iraq posted to this board that his greatest fear was returning to the type of homecoming experienced by Vietnam Era veterans. I promised him that that would not happen.

          My hat is off to him and those who serve and to all who support them.

  • renny

    all over downtown NYC? And defecating? and spitting at police?

    Whether barbaric or not, the people who cut off heads of international journalists while they are alive is surely BARBARIC, but the elimination of bodily fluids is really just bad etiquette and the etiquette of war is more than an oxymoron.

  • Michael M. Keohane

    and the Marine’s actions.

    A river is not a dead body.

    As one who served nine years as an infantryman and, afterwards, fourteen years as an attorney/representative, representing “bad paper” dischargees before Military Review Boards, I agree with the field grade Article 15 and the General’s repremand in the 201 file.

    I think that the “Full Dress Review” is a bit “over the top.”

    • conservativecurmudgeon

      Perhaps, from your viewpoint, you can’t seen a “simularity” (sic); But, I think with a bit of historical and cultural context beyond that with which you may be familiar (I don’t know), maybe you could imagine one. Patton was quite familiar with his enemy, and knew quite well the impact of his action would have. And, it did. Germany remembered it, certainly.

      I just wish we would work up the moral outrage at the actions of the sub-human animals of the Taliban, as we do over this “piddling” non-event.

      These marines should be put up for commendation, not condemnation.