Republicans are going to have a lot of challenges and a lot of opportunities in the 2010 elections. One thing the party needs to do is get our best candidates into races we can win; another is to make sure we hold the easy races and avoid bloody and ideologically divisive primaries in the tough ones; a third is to make sure we can raise adequate funds to support all the races we need to contest; and a fourth is to promote the young stars of the party who will represent its future.
Charlie Crist disregarded all of that when he announced that he was dropping out of the race for re-election as Governor of Florida to enter the primary to replace retiring Republican Senator Mel Martinez. And NRSC Chairman John Cornyn, by immediately endorsing Crist, signalled that he encouraged this sort of behavior. Shame on both of them for putting Crist’s personal ambitions above the good of the party. Let us count the ways in which Crist’s decision is bad for the Florida GOP and the national party:
(1) Crist Is Abandoning His Post.
This is the underreported aspect of what Crist is doing, on the national level - but it’s not going unnoticed in Florida. The GOP has held the Governor’s mansion in Florida for 11 years now, through two highly successful terms of conservative Governor Jeb Bush and now the more moderate Crist enjoying the fruits of the Bush-built party. Crist hasn’t been an especially great Governor, but he’s popular enough and he’s handled managerial aspects of the job (e.g., hurricanes) pretty well. He’d be a very strong favorite for re-election in 2010, likely running unopposed for the nomination and allowing the Florida GOP to put the bulk of its efforts behind the Senate race and the down-ticket races. And holding the statehouse is especially critical, with redistricting on the horizon after the 2010 Census - for the future of the party at the state level as well as in the House, the Governor’s mansion may even be a bigger deal than the Senate, which is saying quite a lot. Anyone with a passing familiarity with how political parties work should know this, which is what makes it so infuriating that the NRSC wants Crist out of the Governor’s race.
The Miami Herald lays out the ramifications down-ticket, where Crist’s maneuver opens up a chain reaction of contested races for Republican-held offices:
Besides Crist and Sink, the other statewide elected officials expected to seek new office are Attorney General Bill McCollum and Agriculture Commissioner Charles Bronson, both likely to run for governor.
Crist’s bid could also leave the Republican Party of Florida in the lurch, putting at risk its control of the governor’s mansion and Florida’s Cabinet. And with Crist running for federal office, he no longer can raise corporate contributions or unlimited “soft money” for the state party. That means that the state GOP, already cutting staffers and facing fundraising challenges with the sour economy, loses its top money-raiser.
“It’s a huge problem for Republicans, and it certainly plays into the other side’s hands,” said Republican consultant Brett Doster of Tallahassee. “It’s going to put the party in a more defensive posture than it has been in a couple decades.”
What’s more, some Republicans are worried about their top contender for governor, McCollum. He has lost two of three statewide bids since 2000. Sink, considered the Democratic front-runner for governor if she runs, won her first and only statewide campaign in 2006.
“Bill McCollum is a great attorney general, but I think sometimes when individuals have run too many times statewide, you have to look at who’s electable in a general election and then everybody needs to get behind that person in a primary,” said Kathleen Shanahan, chief of staff to former Gov. Jeb Bush.
The only party leaders who would encourage Republicans to take this course are Barack Obama and Howard Dean.
(2) Crist Is Throwing His Weight Against A Rising Star
For all the talk about ideas - and ideas do matter quite a lot - political parties win and lose elections with people. And when you have good people on your team, you want them to succeed and advance.
Marco Rubio is one such person. Only 38 years old, the charismatic, Miami-born Cuban-American Rubio - a lawyer and father of four - has risen swiftly in his decade in Florida politics, serving as a City Commissioner for the City of West Miami before entering the Florida House, where he served four terms, served first as Majority Whip during the last redistricting, then Majority Leader and finally Speaker of the Florida House before term limits forced him out of the job in 2009. You can read more here on Rubio, and watch him in action:
And announcing his Senate run:
Rubio is everything older Republicans like Crist should be encouarging: he’s young but already experienced as a leader, he’s telegenic and a good speaker, he’s conservative, and yes, he’s Latino, a demographic that a more inclusive Republican party would be reaching out to, not spurning. Here’s the reaction from the conservative Hispanic Leadership Fund:
We are highly disappointed that the Republican establishment would slam the door on Marco Rubio, who is the kind of candidate that the GOP should be eagerly supporting. We have heard a lot of talk about how the party wants to find qualified Hispanic candidates to run for office but in the end we see once again that this is nothing but lip-service. Additionally, as conservatives, we are doubly troubled that Rubio has been so swiftly brushed aside by the powers that be. Republicans cannot be a governing majority again until they earn more Hispanic votes, and this move certainly does not help them in this regard.
Charlie Crist has talked a good talk as Governor about promoting diversity, but here we have a guy who is every bit as qualified as Crist to hold statewide office as a legislator - and rather than find a way to co-exist with him, Crist bolts his own job to try to stop Rubio. So much for outreach.
(3) Crist Is Picking An Ideological Battle
Florida is one place where the moderates and the conservatives have, by and large, managed to get along pretty well, as illustrated by statewide victories by the likes of Bush, Crist, Martinez and McCollum, men who certainly don’t see eye to eye on every issue. By running Crist for re-election and Rubio for the Senate, Republicans could send a clear message to voters that the state party remains big enough for both groups. Instead, Crist is jumping into a messy, expensive primary race that will split the party into clearly-defined ideological camps and is bound to leave hard feelings on both sides. Moderate Republicans can complain all they want about the Pat Toomey primary challenge to Arlen Specter, but make no mistake: in this race, it’s the moderate picking a fight to muscle out a conservative in a state where there is no serious question that conservatives have won and can continue to win races statewide.
(4) Crist Is Leading The Wrong Way
Finally, to be blunt, Crist is wrong on the biggest issue of the day: whether Republicans should oppose President Obama’s plans to massively increase government spending and government control of health care, banking, energy, the auto industry, and indeed virtually every aspect of the U.S. economy. His embrace of the wasteful $787 billion stimulus package is the first step in a political Jim Jones act, by which Republicans abandon the clear distinctions that give voters any reason to choose Republicans over Democrats. It’s one thing for Crist to be a moderate back home in Florida, where he has to work in a coalition with other Republicans, but it’s entirely another to send him to Washington on a platform of joining the Democratic coalition on one issue after another. The party simply can’t survive if it’s identified with Obama’s agenda, and why would such an opposition party appeal to anybody?
Finally, John Cornyn has proven that he has learned absolutely nothing from the fiasco of 2006, when the GOP lost close Senate races elsewhere after pouring millions into a primary race to prop up Lincoln Chaffee. You don’t cannibalize key offices like the Florida Governorship to recruit candidates, and you certainly don’t do so to poke a stick in the eye of the party’s base by creating a contested primary against a rising star who appeals to a crucial demograpic. It’s a loser move all around.
Why have 40 GOP Senators...
NightTwister Tuesday, May 12th at 1:10PM EDT (link)…when 25 will do?
Get Connected in Colorado.
Great point
tankertodd Tuesday, May 12th at 1:46PM EDT (link)At this point, why trade on the core values? Republicans make lousy Democrat-lights.
And for some of you, core values does not equal party purity. It means operating within the core values. Hard to operate as a tax and spender when the core value is limited government, for example.
———————————
The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race - Chief Justice Roberts
I'll make it simple for them for now.
NightTwister Tuesday, May 12th at 2:20PM EDT (link)Three principles:
1. No new taxes.
2. No new government programs.
3. Let the free market work.
The other stuff we can sort out later, but if they don’t get this right soon nothing else will ever matter.
Get Connected in Colorado.
This will not work...
itdiehard Tuesday, May 12th at 2:28PM EDT (link)One big problem be the level of spending currently being spent…
Cut Spending…
Cut Spending…
Stop mortgaging our grand children’s future, Our children are not our indenture servants…
We can be thankfull for on thing that has happened in the last 4 years...There are two big lies that are being exposed since 2006
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 3:36PM EDT (link)First the so called objective press have exposed themselves as nothing more than shills and propagandists for the Democrat Party and the Obama Administration…
Most importantly the biggest lie is being exposed for all to see that there is any such ting as a Socially moderate, (read liberal), but fiscal and foreign policy conservative.
These people could care less about anything but their own power…what does it mean to be a frigging Republican any more? Does this party stand for anything any more?
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one more item that might sell
kyle8 Tuesday, May 12th at 6:50PM EDT (link)An absolute freeze on government spending. It would be hard for the democrats to demonize this solution.
You get out in front and say, look private companies, families, and state governments are all tightening the belt, why cant the Federal government at least not grow any larger?
“Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty”
Kyle
I'll Gladly Take 25...
IJB Tuesday, May 12th at 3:22PM EDT (link)…If they’re all true conservatives, and all of the moderate squishes have been run out of the Party.
(Note: I didn’t say “out of office”, I said “out of the party”. And, yeah, I meant it…)
Amen brother...it's time for a little cleansing fire!!
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 3:38PM EDT (link)Separate the dross from the molten metal so to speak!
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Can Marco run for Gov??? nt
mbecker908 Tuesday, May 12th at 1:15PM EDT (link)I don't see why not
Dan McLaughlin Tuesday, May 12th at 1:22PM EDT (link)and maybe that is where this ends. But for now, at least, he’s running for Senate.
It would still be a lot easier to run Crist for the job he already has, and much preferable to get a Senator who will fight the good fight.
“No compromise with the main purpose, no peace till victory, no pact with unrepentant wrong.” - Winston Churchill
We need some conservatives in the Senate to provide a backbone and create a loyal opposition....
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 3:41PM EDT (link)A Senator Crist is a nightmare for us….
So much for the national party staying out of local primaries huh?
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No more RINOs
Repubtallygirl Tuesday, May 12th at 1:16PM EDT (link)This conservative from North Florida will be supporting Rubio!
God bless you too, soon-to-be Senator Rubio!
Rod_Patrick Tuesday, May 12th at 2:40PM EDT (link)This is the kind of guy we all need in the Senate.
Young. With Ideals. With Conservative Principles.
The old guard has us by the proverbial jewels and they're just not gonna let go...
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 3:43PM EDT (link)thus was the way of the Whigs and the birth of the Republican Party when the Whigs refused to stand for anything…
Maybe it’s time?
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Exactly, Ace. The Party has to reform or else...... nt
Rod_Patrick Tuesday, May 12th at 11:09PM EDT (link)Well
Darin_H Tuesday, May 12th at 1:28PM EDT (link)We might be moving to N Florida this year (hopefully if everything works out) and you can bet that I’ll be supporting Rubio in that case. Crist is not needed in DC, another go-along. And Cornyn, I like you, but go Cheney yourself.
___________________________________
It sure looks like a scorched earth strategy to me
civil_truth Tuesday, May 12th at 1:30PM EDT (link)Pennsylvania, Florida for starters - it looks like the Republican party establishment want to ride the party to obliteration just so long as they continue to hold the reins.
So far, every state which has a rising conservative voice running for office the RMSP and the establishment are actively running a “moderate” to sabotage their campaign. If the moderate wins, well all fine - and if they lose the general election, it’s the conservatives’ fault for not supporting their choice - and proof that the party needs to move still further left.
And if the conservative wins, well they’ve provided all the amunition for the Democrats while they publically lament how the conservatives are making it impossible for the party to win seats and actively (or passive-agressively) block them from party resources.
In any case, the goal appears to be to block conservatives from holding office while he old guard holds on to the money and perks -even as we approach or even move south of 150 in the House and 30 in the Senate.
Which means that even if the American people wake up in time to want to resist the tyranny fast approaching, they soon won’t have a political outlet to express their views.
Small comfort that our Republican moderates will be the first to the scaffold.
And Rightly So!
We don't now!!!
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 3:50PM EDT (link)I’m about to have an aneurysm my blood pressure is so high right now. When does this end?!
Great point civ….I think you’ve hit the nail on the head….what burns my ass is that every time I get settled down and am ready to go to work they pull something like this to piss me off again.
How many times do you hit your thumb with a hammer before you wake up and realize you should move your thumb…or quit swinging the hammer for Pete’s sake! but here they go again…2006 and 2008 weren’t enough we’ve gotta do it again and hope they learn the lesson this time…
of course they’ll be taunting us and calling us purists and accusing us of wanting a regional party as they lose yet another elect and the Dems march us into the reeducation camps!
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Cornyn and the NSCC *FAIL*
Josh Painter Tuesday, May 12th at 1:31PM EDT (link)to show the the rank and file that the GOP establishment is even pretending to listen. How can the NCNA do anything worthwhile? What good are “listening tours” when the Republican machine pols continue to hod their hands over their ears and shout, “I can’t hear you!”
- JP
“An armed society is a polite society” - Robert A. Heinlein, “Beyond This Horizon” (1942)
Speaking of which...where are those NCNA mtgs?
RedInABleuState Tuesday, May 12th at 1:34PM EDT (link)They want to listen…I think they should hear from us!
The people never give up their liberties but under some delusion. — Edmund Burke
It does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in people’s minds. — Samuel Adams
My message to the NRSC
Darin_H Tuesday, May 12th at 1:45PM EDT (link)Posted on their site endorsement of Crist (supposedly will show up in 24 hours, but I doubt they let it through).
“Why is the NRSC getting involved in an open primary? Are you trying to irritate Republicans? What about outreach to Latinos?
Do you really believe that Crist will work for less government when he was for the $787B porkuluous bill?
Do you need me to spell out why many conservatives don’t bother giving to the NRSC? Did you not learn the lessons of 2006 and 2008? Obviously not.”
___________________________________
I've been frosted about these stupid listening tours since they started...
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 3:55PM EDT (link)they’re just rehashed gimmickry from the Clinton Gore administration where they played at listening to the American people all the while doing whatever they daXX well pleased anyway!
It’s not so bad they’re trying it I suppose but it’s infuriating that they believe Conservatives are dumb enough to fall for it like the Clinonistas did!
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Another self serving "Moderate"...
Aaron Gardner Tuesday, May 12th at 1:36PM EDT (link)they stand for nothing but themselves…just like the weasel Specter.
Crist is probably threatening to withhold his fund raising Rolodex if the NRSC doesn’t back him….what a self inflated jerk.
Cornyn needs to remove his head from his 4th point of contact and greet the sunshine….quickly.
And since Steele decided to get involved in the discussion of Mitt Romney for 2012, maybe ne would like to make a comment on this turn of events….I would *love* to hear his thoughts.
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conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
AG...what's the Steele story on Romney? I missed it apperently...please elaborate nt
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Here ya go Ace...
Aaron Gardner Tuesday, May 12th at 4:03PM EDT (link)Real Clear Politics has the info
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conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
I can't say I disagree with him...
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 5:13PM EDT (link)I share those sentiments with the exception of the Mormon thing which I think is way overblown and has been way over used…
That said…Steele should probably stick to the business of reworking the news that is the RNC and stay off the talk show circuit
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That wasn't the point though Ace....
Aaron Gardner Tuesday, May 12th at 5:22PM EDT (link)the point is that Steele shouldn’t be poisoning the well of 2012 in 2009 that is stupid of him..
As far as what he would think about the Crist situation…I am really interested in which side he would fall on.
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conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
I agree...nt
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 6:23PM EDT (link)House Conservatives Fund
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Just sent this to the Republican Party of Fl
polocruz Tuesday, May 12th at 1:39PM EDT (link)“As a registered Republican, I hope that the state party will conduct itself in an impartial manner with regard to the senate primary.
I’ve already been disappointed by endorsements from the NRSC and Sen. McConnell. Stop force feeding us “our” candidates! ”
I’ve also contributed to Rubio.
Paolo
The National Party
Right Reason Tuesday, May 12th at 1:54PM EDT (link)has no business getting involved in primaries. Let Florida decide who they want to be their standard bearer. THEN the NRSC can back him.
To me, this smacks of the RINO Republican establishment manning the barricades against a conservative resurgence. They see US as the enemy, not the Dems.
Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts.
- Winston Churchill
Well then, we conservatives can just keep...
penguin2 Tuesday, May 12th at 2:10PM EDT (link)our money for ourselves and give to individual candidates that we do support. Electing RINOs will only continue more of the same anyway. I will stand on my principles and not monetarily, blindly support R’s anymore.
Resistance to tyrants is obedience to God.
Benjamin Franklin
Bingo.....
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 3:59PM EDT (link)House Conservatives Fund
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worried about the future!
newred Tuesday, May 12th at 2:07PM EDT (link)I don’t know what worries me more about the future of the GOP: the candidates running - or - the comments I’ve been reading here the last serveral weeks.
care to explain that comment newred?...nt
Aaron Gardner Tuesday, May 12th at 2:19PM EDT (link)Aaron’s Archive
conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
on the one hand...
newred Tuesday, May 12th at 3:08PM EDT (link)we’re got candidates who don’t seem to know why they are Republicans, and on the other we’re got a base who cannot argue for or against GOP candidates on the merits. Is it too much to ask for a candidate to explain why they are running for the REPUBLICAN nomination when they make their announcement? Can GOP candidates be supported or opposed without resulting to gross exaggeration and nonsensical logic?
equally ambiguous...what is your point newred??...nt
Aaron Gardner Tuesday, May 12th at 3:10PM EDT (link)Aaron’s Archive
conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
let me explain...
newred Tuesday, May 12th at 3:48PM EDT (link)My point is that candidates like Crist, although quite popular among general voters, are not bothering to articulate why they are Republicans as opposed to Democrats or Independents That may indicate that they either don’t know what the party stands for, or they don’t know what they themselves stand for. We need candidates that know what the party principles are (at least in theory) and what their own principles are. If they can’t, then they will be weak candidates or weak party members or both.
My other point is that many posts lately have been just silly. Earlier today Erick stated that this FL Senate is a battle for the heart and soul of the party, and its future depends on it, and he could not underestimate it’s importance. Sorry, but putting the criticisms of Crist aside, this is one race out of several that as a group will effect (but not determine) the direction of the party. Erick’s statements were so extreme it was like reading a passage out of Revelations. Dan followed that up with total nonsense about Crist, the sitting Governor, being the fight-pickin’ primary challenger to Rubio, a FORMER state rep, because Rubio announced first. Seriously, this is about running for a Senate seat, not calling “shotgun!” on the way to the car. Posts like these just seem foolish.
ok...that's pretty much what I thought...
Aaron Gardner Tuesday, May 12th at 3:57PM EDT (link)You are playing both sides.
You complain that candidates lack definition but also complain when Erick and Dan and others try to expose those whom you are complaining about as self important jerks who are a detriment to the party.
We are at a definitional crossroads in the GOP right now and every race is part of that battle for defining the party. To think otherwise is naive at the least.
As far as trying to justify Crist’s throwing his own job and the party under the bus in the process, I am not surprised….you tend to side frequently with the so called “moderates” who at the slightest nudge threaten to leave the party.. a la Specter.
Next time you have a problem with a FP’er or Erick you should be man enough to come out and say it instead of relying on ambiguous shots from the sideline.
Aaron’s Archive
conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
I keep catching a whiff of troll, how 'bout you, Aaron? nt
Achance Tuesday, May 12th at 4:12PM EDT (link)In Vino Veritas
I am leanin' towards a yes on that Art...nt
Aaron Gardner Tuesday, May 12th at 4:16PM EDT (link)Aaron’s Archive
conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
now now now, let's give him/her a chance
JLenardDetroit Tuesday, May 12th at 5:31PM EDT (link)KING RULE let’s give the benefit of the doubt, we know if they are a Troll/Moby they will expose themself soon enough. For now let’s just focus on the merits of any points rendered.
(RS:Help) (JLD) (Hollyweird) (Brain-deads) (SPIN-cycle) (Obamaocare) (Party of kNOw) (Conservatism) (TEApeats) (respectful) (Reco) (Quotes) (removeRINOs.com) (RSmas)
+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
Just read his remarks and he reminds me of the one from last night--meme.
janis Tuesday, May 12th at 5:33PM EDT (link)Just wanted to play word games and I don’t think this one is any different. Dancing in circles and giggling while spinning. Waste of time.
do you even know...
newred Tuesday, May 12th at 8:52PM EDT (link)what “playing both sides” means?, because that is yet another nonsense comment appearing here today. Erick and Dan can expose candidates for their faults and weaknesses without relying on gross exaggeration or illogical arguments, though I serious doubts of your ability to do so. You didn’t even bother to refute anything I wrote about, and neither did your followers, just lame attacks about allegedly siding with “moderates” and not being “man enough”. How sad for you. And of course you follow a couple comments later with calling me a troll, as if that’s a substitute for a counter argument.
ok Newred...it's like that...
Aaron Gardner Wednesday, May 13th at 10:02AM EDT (link)You are the one too chicken to just come out and say what you meant.
And if you don’t like the content of the diaries here you could always write one.
That is the problem with people like you….you say that you stand for something…but when it comes right down to it you are too chicken feces to write something down and put it in a diary.
You have insulted diarists on this board consistently calling them worse that “9/11 truthers”. What didn’t think anyone would mention that little tidbit?
As far as refuting your points…to my knowledge you haven’t made a valid point yet so there is nothing to refute their sparky.
Why don’t you just stick to ambiguous shots from the sideline…wouldn’t want yo to get forced into having a straightforward opinion on something.
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conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
Let'sa try this on for size Newred...he're what the party is doing...you tell me of this is a heart and soul issue?
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 4:33PM EDT (link)They’re pushing first for Ridge and now Gerlach to run against Toomey in the purple state of PA after Tomey did us all a favor and pushed Specter out of the party.
They’re pushing Crist against Rubio in the red state of Florida.
They’re pushing Castle who founded the RMSP and is one of only three republicans to vote for all six bills on the Democrats’ “100 hour” agenda in 2007, was the only Republican standing alongside Obama when he signed an executive order in March allowing federal funds for stem cell research to run for Biden’s seat.
In Connecticut, the national GOP has lobbied former Rep. Rob Simmons — who holds a higher lifetime rating from the liberal Americans for Democratic Action group than Specter does against Sam Caligiuri who is expected to attack his moderate voting record in Congress
They’re pushing Mark Kirk another RMSPer to replace Obama in Illinois.
They’re pushing McCain darling Carly Fiorina Fiorina to run against Sen. Barbara Boxer
I can see running moderates in Connecticut, Delaware and California….and don’t object as much in those states except where the party is taking sides…but it has no business challenging Toomey or Rubio…with liberal Republicans!
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The GOP has a creed.
Josh Painter Tuesday, May 12th at 7:29PM EDT (link)It’s called the party platform, and although it has been tweaked here and there over the years, it remains a mostly conservative document.
Compare it to the Democrat Party platform, and the contrasts are striking. Compare the Democrats’ platform to that of the Communist Party USA, and the contrasts are minor.
Some Republicans have been ignoring their party’s platform in recent years, and they need to be held accountable by the rank and file.
- JP
“An armed society is a polite society” - Robert A. Heinlein, “Beyond This Horizon” (1942)
Exactly Josh...Compare the Party Platform with the Party Leaders and the starkness is breathtaking! nt
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What merits newred?
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 4:04PM EDT (link)Crist is a big government, pro choice RINO….be conserned all you want…if you can’t SEE the problem with the way this party is going and has been going for the last 4 to 6 years you are part OF the problem!
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on the one hand...
newred Tuesday, May 12th at 3:08PM EDT (link)we’re got candidates who don’t seem to know why they are Republicans, and on the other we’re got a base who cannot argue for or against GOP candidates on the merits. Is it too much to ask for a candidate to explain why they are running for the REPUBLICAN nomination when they make their announcement? Can GOP candidates be supported or opposed without resulting to gross exaggeration and nonsensical logic?
I look at this site as a conservative site and not a republican site.
ceili_dancer Tuesday, May 12th at 2:30PM EDT (link)The Republican party is currently the best party for our views. But, I personally am tired of voting for the lesser of two evils in the general election. ‘08 had me almost sitting on the sidelines when the standard bearer’s claim to fame is giving my party the finger. If it wasn’t for his choice as a running mate I would have just popped a cold one and cry in it on election nite. I don’t know if the national p[arty is in full on self destruct mode, but I think sites like Red State help to collect news articles and discussion level is well above other sites.
It's both.
Neil Stevens Tuesday, May 12th at 2:34PM EDT (link)Don’t think for a second we’re not Republican. Conservative in the primary and Republican in the general. That’s the way to advance a conservative agenda.
Want to run for conservatives? Give.
There Is No Crisis
5! (n/t)
youthgrunt Tuesday, May 12th at 3:13PM EDT (link).
I agree
Right Reason Tuesday, May 12th at 3:48PM EDT (link)However, now it seems we are being told by the GOP powers that be, by deed if not by word, not to go conservative in the primary. Witness the NRSC support for Specter (until he jumped ship), Ridge (and now, apparently, Gerlach) over Toomey, and now Crist over Rubio. I don’t mind working to advance a conservative agenda. But why should I have to work against my own side?
Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts.
- Winston Churchill
That IS the question isn't it?
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 4:49PM EDT (link)The party isn’t letting us forward a conservative agenda are they? by taking sides and advancing liberal Republicans against the base’s will they are saying they support making the party more liberal not more conservative and they’re working against not for or with us!
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Just curious Neil...if the party continues to force us to choose between conservatism or being Republican, Where would you stand?
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 4:44PM EDT (link)strictly hypothetical question of course…and in all the years I’ve worked for the party at the conventions, i never thought I’d ever even ask that question…but it’s becoming a question I can’t help but chew on at the current time?
I’m not advocating a third party or leaving the party…I’ve asked rhetorically why I am a Republican any more and I’m not considering leaving…but if the question were forced on you…how would you respond?.
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The party isn't forcing that choice
Neil Stevens Tuesday, May 12th at 4:59PM EDT (link)So I don’t know how to answer that question.
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Just think about it...if the choice were forced upon you...which way would you jump?
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 5:06PM EDT (link)you don’t need to tell me…just think about it…I’m not sure either how I would answer…I think I’d leave…but there is a huge part of me that wouldn’t want to let go of the history and work I have done with and for the party…but contrary to your opinion…I think they are forcing the question and it will have to be answered at some point I’m afraid.
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I agree with Neil here...
Aaron Gardner Tuesday, May 12th at 5:07PM EDT (link)The party isn’t forcing that question for real Moderates or Conservatives…the only ones that need worry are the unprincipled rinos who sell out there party not out of principle but out of pure populist pandering and statism.
There is a clear difference that many fail to point out clearly.
Aaron’s Archive
conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
I agree...and don't think I'm suggesting it's forcing that choice yet...
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 6:21PM EDT (link)but I won’t ignore the possibility that it might force the choice at some point…I ask the question out of curiosity more than anything else…what are others thinking…and where they would draw the line…
As with the Whigs and slavery….when does the Republican Party’s refusal to stop helping the Democrats grow the government become so intolerable that we move on without it? Or when does the Republican Party’s refusal to protest the out of control spending in Washington prompt us to consider another path? What about abortion, or gay marriage, or over regulation….Obama is forcing Chrysler to cut spending on their marketing for Pete’s sake…when will the Republican Party’s silence become intolerable enough?
I haven’t reached the end of the line yet…but for the first time I can see that line on the horizon…I’m just curious where that line is for others here?
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We're an activist site, Ace
Neil Stevens Tuesday, May 12th at 6:39PM EDT (link)Hypotheticals like that have no use.
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I cannot agree Neil
kyle8 Tuesday, May 12th at 6:47PM EDT (link)Are we a site devoted to conservatism? Or are we a site blindly loyal to the Republican party? I think you should ask this question from time to time and try to answer it.
“Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty”
Kyle
Conservatism, yes....
JLenardDetroit Tuesday, May 12th at 7:07PM EDT (link)but you can go be Conservative as you like and wander the Desert forever if you think that Conservatives are going to ever get anywhere if it isn’t trying to focus control in/through the Republican Party…
I may not like it at times, but do have to agree with Neil on this.
And for the laughing hyena below… name me one Conservative elected recently through another Party? Blue-Dog Myth aside, as they/some might get elected as Democrats (Blue-Dogs, CINOs, PLINOs, etc) but they only aid the Leftist agenda once elected. All the other Parties are going to continue to amount to ZERO! And I have worked side by side with Libertarians, Tax-Payer Party, Reform Party, etc…. at many times!
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+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
here is where you make your mistake
kyle8 Tuesday, May 12th at 7:14PM EDT (link)you seem to assume that conservatives will put up with anything forever from the Republican party and will continue to support it just because th other guys are worse.
But as a conservative I always have one other place I can go, I can just opt out of the fight altogether, and I already suspect that has happened with a lot of people.
I really do not like this idea that we cannot ever question the Republican party. That goes against the grain of every conservative and libertarian and is a recipe for disaster.
“Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty”
Kyle
Here's where your mistake is
Neil Stevens Tuesday, May 12th at 7:19PM EDT (link)You seem to assume that fighting in politics is unprincipled. You seem to think you’re above that.
You’re wrong. You couldn’t be more wrong.
Also, you miss entirely what a political party is. It’s not a matter of “questioning” it (you sound like a lefty when you say that by the way). It’s a matter of *shaping* it.
A political party is a tool of those who get up and use it. Some high-and-mighty conservatives would rather sit back and moan about how much better they are than the Republican party, and never achieve anything but sprained elbows from patting themselves on the back for how principled they are.
But others are willing to get to work and help steer this party where it needs to go.
I stand where Reagan stood. I will be a party man and in so doing move this party toward where it ought to go.
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There's a problem with that line of thinking Neil...
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 7:42PM EDT (link)First off…no one is a high and mighty conservative from what I can see…we’re stuck because we have a party that won’t listen to us….the other problem is where you say you want to steer the party where it needs to go. That assumes the party is steerable….which is the nub of the issue….We’ve gone to the moderate well 5 times out of the last 9 elections and came up with empty buckets and we’re watching the tin ears in the national party going right back to the same failed strategy.
You rightly say and I believe this is an activist site…but I can only speak for myself on this…but activist toward what? What are we trying to achieve as a site?
Is it to just blindly follow a leadership that has nothing but contempt for the base of this party and the principles we believe in? Is it to sit quietly by while the RNC, the NRSC and the NRCC take sides in open primaries and force candidates on an unwilling primary electorate?
Rubio starts out this race behind the eight ball because the national party is already in the tank for Crist with it’s endorsement and party funds! As far as I’m concerned at the moment, this party is no better than the the Unions who take it’s member’s dues and use it to work against it’s membership’s wishes.
You keep saying conservatives need to contest in the primaries and get behind the nominee in the general…fair enough…on an even playing field, I’d be right there with you…but it’s not an even playing field is it? When the party throws it’s weight behind a liberal candidate in a purple to red state and thumbs it’s nose at primary voters who want a choice in 2010 it’s not an even playing field.
Again, I don’t think the Party is forcing a choice between being a conservative or a Republican…yet…but it’s getting very hard to not see the time when the choice will be forced upon us.
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You do what you want
Neil Stevens Tuesday, May 12th at 7:47PM EDT (link)Some of us have work to do. Within the party.
So while you’re free to agonize about whether you’re going to take your ball and go home, don’t get surprised when some of us are too busy to care.
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I would just like to mention that most of this thread and division was started by newred....
Aaron Gardner Tuesday, May 12th at 7:55PM EDT (link)While he throws out a divisive point and slinks off we all scramble to play this same game….sad…
Aaron’s Archive
conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
Aaron, let me put meat on the bones of my close call for Crist
Mike gamecock DeVine Tuesday, May 12th at 8:00PM EDT (link)Crist makes a GOP keeper easy and even if his more conservative opponent were to win, it would not be the cause of a conservative GOP comeback. That will come as a wave after the electorate pins the great recession of Obama and the Dems and that wave will make Crist vote better.
Mike DeVine’s Examiner.com, Charlotte Observer and The Minority Report columns
“One man with courage makes a majority.” - Andrew Jackson
so you agree he'll be effectively a Red-Dog?
JLenardDetroit Tuesday, May 12th at 8:22PM EDT (link)Which is the ONLY reason I will support him!
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+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
My issue here is the need to draw a contrast to the Democrats...
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 9:06PM EDT (link)Crist actively campaigned for the passage of Obama’s stimulous plan.
My question is this Mike:
When the inevitable backlash occurs against the overreaching of the Democrats whether it be in 2010 or 2012…how do we convince voters we’re a better alternative than the Democrats if we have Crist and people like him in place who helped the Democrats over reach and insisted we go along with the Democrats as they over reached?
I think I know where you are on this other question but I’ll ask it just in case…
Should the NRSC and RNC be supporting a liberal candidate in an open primary?
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thinking - more later - nt
Mike gamecock DeVine Tuesday, May 12th at 11:27PM EDT (link)Mike DeVine’s Examiner.com, Charlotte Observer and The Minority Report columns
“One man with courage makes a majority.” - Andrew Jackson
ok, I'll bite, let's say he/she is a Troll....
JLenardDetroit Tuesday, May 12th at 8:19PM EDT (link)As I said elsewhere in this thread, I am NOT jumping to that conclusion, but for the sake of argument let me put the concept/idea forth this way…..
A Troll/Moby wants anyone/everyone to either Vote DEMOCRAT or NOT VOTE AT ALL (sit out elections) - Is there ANY doubt on that? NO!
So anyone for any reason (accepting any argument why) to NOT VOTE THE REPUBLICAN TICKET - TROLL WINS! Congratulations
Aaron, you know, of course, I’m not saying that to/directly about you — just in general. You just happened to mention the person some others have suggested might be a Troll which made me think of this point is all.
Having said that…. there might be a condition that I might not vote for a Republican — but it has NOT happened yet (at least for the National/Federal Elections) - I’m in a Blue District so often it matters not for Local elections.
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+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
Can you get off the take your ball and go home meme already?
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 8:50PM EDT (link)I’ve given you my bio and you know I’ve worked from the inside in this party. I’m not taking my ball and going home…A question came to my mind based on your reply above and I ran with it…I wouldn’t be here discussing this or doing the research on the RMSP that I’ve done or of the other organizations if I were going to take my ball and go home. to the point that I would change my party affiliation or anything else, it would be to send a message to a party that I’ve sweated and fretted over and I love deep down.
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I'll stop when people get the message
Neil Stevens Tuesday, May 12th at 8:53PM EDT (link)The message being that this is the only party we’ve got, and we should spend less time running it down and more time building it up.
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OK...I get that...but you don't address the problem I raised...
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 9:12PM EDT (link)if the primaries are the place to fight it out and to run conservatives…if the idea is we are to support the nominee no matter what…should the national party apparatus be pushing liberal candidates in purple and read states during an open primary?
It’s not just about running down the party…believe it or not…that’s not my intent…I know it seems like that’s all that I do…but my beef isn’t with the party but with a tone deaf leadership. There is no reason…NONE for the party to be throwing it’s full wait behind Crist in an open primary…we could use the funds elsewhere during the general and let the primary voters decide the matter between Crist and Rubio!
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The NRSC is not the national party apparatus
Neil Stevens Tuesday, May 12th at 9:13PM EDT (link)I suggest you get educated on what the NRSC is.
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most of us aren't that far off
JLenardDetroit Tuesday, May 12th at 9:22PM EDT (link)seems we’re squabbling over minor points rather than focusing on the MAJOR issue of getting back a Majority! Though, understandably, and I and almost everyone else here argues, we need to get more Conservatives in the Party leadership and in the Primaries…. WE AGREE! My biggest problem is with those (and there are some here - again, saying IN GENERAL) that sit out the General Elections — They do NOT help us build a Majority and just keep the Socialist Party.. er… Democrats ….. in Control of the Country.
Sit it (General Elections) out — Trolls/Democrats Win.
Again, though, things vary based upon makeup BY DISTRICT…. There are some very RED districts in BLUE States and vica-versa! Our biggest issue/problem is the Purple areas (Districts within States) and/or Purple States in general, IMO.
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+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
We GOT the message Neil
kyle8 Wednesday, May 13th at 6:52AM EDT (link)the message we got was that YOU are the high and mighty one, and YOU are part of the problem not part of the solution. You are not working to steer the party in a conservative direction, The party leaders will just pat you on the head for your efforts.
You are doing your damnedest to drive conservatives away with your attitude that quite frankly mirrors the attitude of the beltway republicans.
So keep it up, heckof a job there Brownie.
“Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty”
Kyle
General statements taken personally
JLenardDetroit Tuesday, May 12th at 9:13PM EDT (link)Not sure if you’re referring to me (didn’t bother to trace the thread back, but since I have used the line….), but I’m not taking anything here personal, I’m sorry if you have taken any GENERAL statement I may have said personally…. We are and do respond to thoughts sparked by someones comment, some parts of the comments (of course) are directly to/about us, other parts are just General statements …… same way we seem to keep mixing issues between who we back/defend in PRIMARY vs. GENERAL elections - sometimes those are not one and the same. things getting taken incorrectly
You do admit and understand that their are folks like that?
So, again generally speaking - Anyone that sits out the election like a Troll/Moby wants - Democrats and Troll/Moby wins …. just sayin’ …. it keeps the Democrats numbers up counting to Majority…. many fail to want to acknowledge that even the RINOs were useful in providing us a Majority at one point. Now, out of power, is the best time for the purge but we must, IMO, not pass on the election of ANY Republican that helps us toward regaining the majority - and again, fighting to insure CONSERVATIVE VALUES/PRINCIPLES are what the Party defaults to (The Platform does).
(RS:Help) (JLD) (Hollyweird) (Brain-deads) (SPIN-cycle) (Obamaocare) (Party of kNOw) (Conservatism) (TEApeats) (respectful) (Reco) (Quotes) (removeRINOs.com) (RSmas)
+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
can you say Arlen Spectre?
David Hinz Tuesday, May 12th at 7:48PM EDT (link)the
companyparty got behind Snarlin’ Arlen against a challenge from a conservative….The Minority Report — The HinzSight Report — TMRB.tv — MFOB “Miss Tagart, do you know the hallmark of the second-rater? It’s resentment of another man’s achievement.”
and many opposed disreSpecter (How many other Parties have gotten a Conservative Elected?)
JLenardDetroit Tuesday, May 12th at 8:45PM EDT (link)How is that working? Draining away Conservatives from the Republican Party, how well has that worked? How many Conservatives under other Parties are elected (Other than some Blue-Dogs which are just CINOs and/or PLINOs? How well is that working)?
So we should have thrown Arlen out when the Senate was 50/50 rather than Share power!?!?! We should have thrown him out when we had the Majority in the Senate (I might have accepted that argument, I sure as HECK didn’t want him in the U.S. Senate - and would like to see McLame challenged and replaced also) and helped the Democrats to widdle away at our Majority quicker?
Pains me to even consider defending ANY vote for a RINO at any point in time…. but if I’m the only one with the BALLS to do it… so be it….. But am only doing so, of course, within the context of above. RINOs make me sick (which, again RED-DOGS GOOD, RINOs BAD!)
Keep up the good work helping to get Democrats elected. I’m working for Republican control and CONSERVATIVE CONTROL within that!!! If you sleep well with Socialists running the country then good for you — seems you’re more concerned about “FEEL GOODism” like a Liberal. As long as you Feel Good about yourself, whatever….. Shame….. IMNSHO
Or did you vote for Bob Dole and John McCain for President and I owe you an apology? From what I understand your principles wouldn’t allow you to.
With apologies, because that did sound harsh and we need to avoid this. sometimes an occasional statement is gonna come out
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+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
throw him out?
David Hinz Tuesday, May 12th at 8:51PM EDT (link)NO PRIMARY HIM! WE HAD A CANDIDATE who could beat him — who would have been a conservative voice in the senate — but NOOO! The president weighed in and the RNSC and they got Spectre through the primary.
The Minority Report — The HinzSight Report — TMRB.tv — MFOB “Miss Tagart, do you know the hallmark of the second-rater? It’s resentment of another man’s achievement.”
Let's put your question a different way
Right Reason Tuesday, May 12th at 9:06PM EDT (link)How well has pi$$ing off the conservatives worked out for the Republicans?This ain’t a one way street.
Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts.
- Winston Churchill
They'll never acknowledge the simple truth that they could possibly share in any of the blame for any of this
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 9:24PM EDT (link)Conservatives are just impetuous children, crybabies and whiners who are to stupid, petty and immature to win elections or do anything without the Ivy League power pimps and neoroyalists who have the divine right to rule over the rest of us.
It’s always the Conservatives that stay home that are to blame…it’s the fault of the disenfranchised rank and file base of the party who leave that are to blame…it couldn’t possibly have anything to do with the snobs who drove them away!
The fact that we’re still here fighting this same fight with a party leadership that we had in 2006 and 2008 considering the results we achieved in those elections is so absurd that it could be the highest of high comedy if it weren’t so tragic and infuriating at the same time!
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Chicken or the Egg, IMO
JLenardDetroit Tuesday, May 12th at 9:53PM EDT (link)We can have a staring contest with them to see who blinks first… and we ALL continue to lose and the most SOCIALIST of left-wingers control the country.
Morons running the Party have taken us for granted, so have that staring contest and sit it out. They are what have brought us to where we are, no question.
We fight the Primary fights and give our MONEY to CONSERVATIVE PACs (who may also back some we don’t like in the General, as they need to) but I have no problem with-holding it from the GOP until they get the message. We can find the CONSTRUCTIVE, IMO, methods or we can just sit it out and let the Democrats have a permanent majority.
We all have to sleep at night with the RESULTS (RESULTS AND CONSEQUENCES OF THOSE VOTE RESULTS and the 06/08 Election Results are part of those!) above beyond any minor victories some may want to cling to.
We all agree that CONSERVATIVE CONTROL WITHIN THE GOP IS THE PROBLEM now how do we have an effective strategy to accomplish that? rather than whine about our choices (or little choices) on General Election day - and bickering with each other? which is about all this is amounting to.
Now, as it seems some have decided to argue and side based on personalities rather than points, I’ll pass….. AND NO, THAT IS NOT AN ACCUSATION TO/OF YOU!
(RS:Help) (JLD) (Hollyweird) (Brain-deads) (SPIN-cycle) (Obamaocare) (Party of kNOw) (Conservatism) (TEApeats) (respectful) (Reco) (Quotes) (removeRINOs.com) (RSmas)
+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
perhaps we should just have allowed Al Gore then John Kerry be President
JLenardDetroit Tuesday, May 12th at 9:39PM EDT (link)I’m sure we’ll hear how it was different… but Oh, having sat out this one got us Obama! if sitting out elections doesn’t matter after all….
If you’re really that anxious to allow the quicker march toward Socialism.
People sat out (06/08) elections… congratulations on making the whole country suffer under the Socialists you surrendered to.
Primaries are for the principled Conservative fights we want, surrender in the General to the Party of EVERYTHING objectionable has been real helpful. Hasn’t it?
(RS:Help) (JLD) (Hollyweird) (Brain-deads) (SPIN-cycle) (Obamaocare) (Party of kNOw) (Conservatism) (TEApeats) (respectful) (Reco) (Quotes) (removeRINOs.com) (RSmas)
+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
I voted for both to my ever lasting shame! nt
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 9:16PM EDT (link)House Conservatives Fund
Michael Williams for Senate
Toomey US Senate
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at least you answer directly, rather than dance around and avoid the question
JLenardDetroit Wednesday, May 13th at 2:08AM EDT (link)Thanks for the honest and direct response…. others still dance around the question carefully choosing words (avoiding the actual question) giving a non-direct answer…. One voted for McCain in November or they did NOT. It’s a simple question.
I had NO SHAME in voting for either Dole or McCain in the GENERAL Elections, neither of them were my choices in the respective Primaries - but I did what I could to get someone else atop the ticket…. Voting for anyone other than John McCain in that last Election for the President of the United States helped GIVE the Presidency to BHO.
Again, NO SHAME in voting for the BEST AVAILABLE VIABLE CANDIDATE from that General Election rather than openly conceding/surrendering to the Democrats!!!! Yes?
Again, others will dance around the question with their non-answer to the specific question. Next we’ll hear about having NOT VOTED FOR OBAMA, which again is NOT a direct “I VOTED FOR MCCAIN IN THE 08 GENERAL ELECTION” …. All I ask is that people have the balls to stand by their supposed convictions and admit to what they have or have not done. If anyone here wants to sit out elections, will encourage others to do the same, advocates votes for non-viable Party candidates that hand House, Senate, Presidency power to the Democrats - FINE - ADMIT TO IT. They are entitled to have that opinion and think that is a fine strategy. Why not say it straight up then?
I do NOT like many of the Candidates that land up in Republican General Elections - can’t be more plain - they are not as Conservative as I want (and feel we need them) to be! Again, plain language, no dancing around it. BUT, I will also not dance around that I will support a Republican over any Democrat at any time or place - PERIOD!!!! to do otherwise gives us more Socialist Far-Left (Pelosi, Reid, Obama, Dodd, Frank, etc) in the positions of power by allowing the Democrats to control the country!!!!
Take care fellow Conservative and keep up the CONSERVATIVE FIGHT for the Control of the only VIABLE PARTY TO UPHOLD CONSERVATIVE PRINCIPLES/VALUES!
(RS:Help) (JLD) (Hollyweird) (Brain-deads) (SPIN-cycle) (Obamaocare) (Party of kNOw) (Conservatism) (TEApeats) (respectful) (Reco) (Quotes) (removeRINOs.com) (RSmas)
+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
apology accepted
David Hinz Tuesday, May 12th at 9:26PM EDT (link)Dole was a man of integrity and I was proud to support him
mcsame was mclame but at least he had a good running mate — it seems that you have decided on personal attack — I’m done for the night
The Minority Report — The HinzSight Report — TMRB.tv — MFOB “Miss Tagart, do you know the hallmark of the second-rater? It’s resentment of another man’s achievement.”
Since you won't answer the other question - I will: ZERO
JLenardDetroit Wednesday, May 13th at 1:14AM EDT (link)ZERO Conservatives have been elected to House/Senate by any other Party (not counting, again, CINO Democrats and/or PLINOs) So, advocating for Conservatives other than through the Republican Party yields: ZERO!
Sitting out (or advocating others do or just excusing others to sit out) a General Election yields how many Republicans toward reclaiming a Majority? That would again be ZERO!
Seats given away (conceded/surrendered) to the Democrats in ‘06 and ‘08, much larger than ZERO.
Voting for some other Party in a Federal Election - Conservative ground gained - again, ZERO.
Acting like a Liberal and engaging in Feel Good Politics, sitting at home feeling good in your righteous indignation yields - oh yeah, the Election of the great ZERO Obama and a Progressives-Majority working toward a Super-Majority. Sitting out if Crist is the candidate or if Toomey isn’t the candidate in PA, gives us ZERO and yet another Democrat Senator and Super-Majority regardless of the MN fiasco (hmmm, how many sat that one out?)
Good strategy - I’ll call it the ZERO strategy.
Stopping people from voting for Republican candidates, is the goal of the Trolls/Mobies that visit - by advocating people sit out elections you effectively are one and the same as they.
The only thing “personal” here is about your avoidance - It’s OK, I know you just refuse to admit to knowing your ZERO strategy has helped get us Obama and the Democrat majority, but we all know it. And you’ll continue aiding and comforting the Democrats (ultimate anti-Conservative) agenda. Just have the gumption to stand up for the principles of not-voting your more than happy to see occurring and acknowledge the ZERO (worse, Obama) results you’ve help achieve. That’s all! I expect I’ll we’ll get is changing the subject or defelection.
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+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
since you seem determined to attack
David Hinz Wednesday, May 13th at 4:36AM EDT (link)let ME be perfectly clear –
NOBODY HAS TO CONVINCE CONSERVATIVES to sit it out when the Republican party puts up McCain type Democrat-lite candidates. Not me, not Ace, not you!
YOU will go ahead and still vote! I will still vote! Ace will still vote! Why because we are activists!
But the last election showed that millions did not — blame them for President Obama if you want to — blame them for lack of interest in a party that shows little or no interest in them — but THEY AIN’T gonna change.
You can come at me with all the snotty attitude you want — but THEY are not going to show up in droves for someone that they KNOW does not have their interest at heart.
The Minority Report — The HinzSight Report — TMRB.tv — MFOB “Miss Tagart, do you know the hallmark of the second-rater? It’s resentment of another man’s achievement.”
yes, yes we should have campaigned against him
kyle8 Wednesday, May 13th at 6:55AM EDT (link)in the primaries and campaigned for the conservative candidate. In the long run because of people like Specter, we lost the senate anyway. So YES we would have been far stronger without him.
“Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty”
Kyle
Don't forget Linc Cheffee as well!! nt
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 9:13PM EDT (link)House Conservatives Fund
Michael Williams for Senate
Toomey US Senate
SarahPAC
my money is going to go to Conservative PACs
JLenardDetroit Tuesday, May 12th at 7:53PM EDT (link)not the RNC until I see them being more Conservative, but I am NOT going to drop out of trying to push them to do the Right/Conservative thing. Deciding to ignore the Party and wander off elsewhere will yield us NOTHING but the most Liberal of Leadership (in Party, and via Democrats always winning the National Elections).
So again…. I think we are talking degrees here….. We all want to insist the Republican Party must get more Conservative, but we cannot abandon the Party or WE THEN BECOME AS BAD AS A RINO!!!! :O What? Yes, think about it. Sitting out the Election, and letting Democrats have a cake-walk to constant majority, is just as bad as voting with the other side!
(RS:Help) (JLD) (Hollyweird) (Brain-deads) (SPIN-cycle) (Obamaocare) (Party of kNOw) (Conservatism) (TEApeats) (respectful) (Reco) (Quotes) (removeRINOs.com) (RSmas)
+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
My suggestion on donations
Neil Stevens Tuesday, May 12th at 7:56PM EDT (link)Don’t conflate the RNC and the NRSC.
I wouldn’t suggest anyone give a dime to the NRSC. But the RNC does useful things.
So absolutely, divert any money that would go to the NRSC to the Club for Growth or the NRLC, but I’d give the RNC a chance.
Want to run for conservatives? Give.
There Is No Crisis
Thanks Neil, that is helpful info. (nt)
penguin2 Tuesday, May 12th at 8:38PM EDT (link)Resistance to tyrants is obedience to God.
Benjamin Franklin
Like taking sides in open primaries?
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 9:27PM EDT (link)House Conservatives Fund
Michael Williams for Senate
Toomey US Senate
SarahPAC
Cite? (nt)
Neil Stevens Wednesday, May 13th at 7:08AM EDT (link)Want to run for conservatives? Give.
There Is No Crisis
The NRSC has endorsed him and the RNC
AceInTX Wednesday, May 13th at 3:03PM EDT (link)In Shift, Cornyn Endorses Crist
Conservatives May Buck Charlie Crist
House Conservatives Fund
Michael Williams for Senate
Toomey US Senate
SarahPAC
THE NRSC IS NOT THE RNC
Neil Stevens Wednesday, May 13th at 4:54PM EDT (link)THEY ARE SEPARATE ENTITIES WITH SEPARATE LEADERSHIPS, SEPARATE CHARTERS, SEPARATE PURSES, AND EVERYTHING.
Want to run for conservatives? Give.
There Is No Crisis
Hey Neil....
JadedByPolitics Wednesday, May 13th at 5:11PM EDT (link)The RNC gives money to the NRSC in that when you donate to the RNC you are defacto donating to the NRSC….it’s true!
Whoever has his enemy at his mercy &
does not destroy him is his own enemy
Conservative 527's
JLenardDetroit Wednesday, May 13th at 5:27PM EDT (link)I want to support the RNC, I really do, BUT since my resources are limited more than normal lately (and whose aren’t) I will be giving to the Conservative candidates in the Primaries that I feel have the best opportunities to go on and actually win the General Elections. Then other Conservative 527’s beyond that. Once I am more comfortable with what/where Steele is going to be able to get the GOP to do, then I will give to the RNC. I understand and appreciate Neil making the distinction, and you (Jaded) for reminding us that some funds trickle.
My favorite was NeverFindOut.org / LetFreedomRing organization…. McLame would NOT make some of the arguments and push the right buttons, in many of our opinions, so I went to where/who was willing to step up and do it!!! I will be looking for/to 527’s that will be pushing the ideals and candidates we Conservatives understand we need - and encourage them to help out some others in those Blue States that will deserve our support in order to work toward regaining Republican majority.
(RS:Help) (JLD) (Hollyweird) (Brain-deads) (SPIN-cycle) (Obamaocare) (Party of kNOw) (Conservatism) (TEApeats) (respectful) (Reco) (Quotes) (removeRINOs.com) (RSmas)
+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
If you read the article it gives a different impression.
AceInTX Wednesday, May 13th at 7:20PM EDT (link)It’s poorly written and reading it again Greer is apparently talking about the Florida Republican Party…that’s not the way I read it first time through and would like to know the RNC’s position on this.
House Conservatives Fund
Michael Williams for Senate
Toomey US Senate
SarahPAC
it's about the $$$$
JLenardDetroit Wednesday, May 13th at 5:40PM EDT (link)so, do we kind of agree that this may be more an matter of CONVENIENCE and the opportunity to toss someone in place with the War-chest (more about looking forward to the General Election fight)?!?!? As that was the way I saw the Crist thing immediately, not the rush to “they wanna reward a squish” argument.
I think there were alot of folks that wanted Romney for VP just for the $$$$$$$. That, of course, is a whole different Diary.
(RS:Help) (JLD) (Hollyweird) (Brain-deads) (SPIN-cycle) (Obamaocare) (Party of kNOw) (Conservatism) (TEApeats) (respectful) (Reco) (Quotes) (removeRINOs.com) (RSmas)
+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
EXACTLY, Ace
Right Reason Tuesday, May 12th at 8:55PM EDT (link)At what point do we stop thinking that we can make the driver go east and realize we’re just on a westbound bus?
Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts.
- Winston Churchill
no-one said you can't question the Party...
JLenardDetroit Tuesday, May 12th at 7:31PM EDT (link)The LOYALTY THING goes both (or all) ways… rather, it has to start going both/all ways around. Conservatives showing up for Republican Party and vica-versa - now if both sides are going to have a staring contest to see who goes first —- FAIL, FAIL, FAIL, FAIL, and we may as well appoint Obama King.
Questioning the Republican Party…. I do all the time…. The point was/is that Conservatives MUST do more to control the Republican Party…. but completely abandoning it in “Take My Ball And Go Home” fashion … well…. thanks for ‘06 and ‘08 and getting the complete Socialist majority you helped yield to! I’ve served on Party committees (cover that, in part, in my Profile info here at RS) and worked for Conservatism within (don’t know who else has or hasn’t, just sayin’ alot are just whiners that do nothing but complain about it - even around here).
Take Ball And Go Home…… Well, maybe not you per-se’ (of course) you should get the point or you’re just looking to be argumentative like someone else I suspect in this thread (but I digress and have to remember to take my own advice and follow the site be respectful rule
)
By all means, continue to sit out the Elections and/or go Third Party…. you’re going to keep Democrat majority for the foreseeable future that way - and that was/is my point and where I agree with Neil.
I understand fully and have lines I won’t cross (RINOS v Red-Dogs, til I’m blue in the face around here lately)…. but some are ready to sit out a vote if they don’t have some 100% candidate - which, IMO, is just plain STUPID! Again, not saying that is you - just speaking in General (don’t take things personally). I have been out-spoken against RINOs yet also out-spoken about Republican Cannibalism.
(RS:Help) (JLD) (Hollyweird) (Brain-deads) (SPIN-cycle) (Obamaocare) (Party of kNOw) (Conservatism) (TEApeats) (respectful) (Reco) (Quotes) (removeRINOs.com) (RSmas)
+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
The 100% candidate line has no bearing here and is a red herring at best most of the time
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 7:52PM EDT (link)the discussion about Crist doesn’t have anything to do with someone wanting a 100% candidate any more than it had a bearing on Arlen Specter when he was supposedly a Republican…or Snowe, or Collins.
If Crist were the only choice we had and the only person that could win Florida I’d vote for the man in a New York Minute. but he’s not the only choice is he? But the Party has decided he’s their man and the rest of us be damned…as they’re doing first with Ridge in PA…and now Gerlach…. and on and on…it’s what had us so perplexed in 2004, 2006 and 2008 as they took sides in the primaries
House Conservatives Fund
Michael Williams for Senate
Toomey US Senate
SarahPAC
what makes you think you have a right
David Hinz Tuesday, May 12th at 8:01PM EDT (link)to choose a candidate when the
companyunionparty has already made your choice for you?The Minority Report — The HinzSight Report — TMRB.tv — MFOB “Miss Tagart, do you know the hallmark of the second-rater? It’s resentment of another man’s achievement.”
Put the stick away, Dave :) <nt>
Jeff Weimer Tuesday, May 12th at 9:25PM EDT (link)“We stand at once the wonder and admiration of the whole world, and we must enquire what it is that has given us so much prosperity. This cause is that every man can make himself.” - Abraham Lincoln
“Cowardice asks the question, is it expedient? And vanity asks the question, is it popular? But conscience asks the question, is it right?” - Martin Luther King, Jr.
Yeah...how could I be so stupid!!
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 9:29PM EDT (link)House Conservatives Fund
Michael Williams for Senate
Toomey US Senate
SarahPAC
Your attitude is a recipe for continued Democrat dominance
kyle8 Wednesday, May 13th at 7:02AM EDT (link)Our nation is a conservative nation and was even more so many decades ago. But for nearly fifty years before Ronald Reagan conservatives just did not vote, They were not involved in large numbers and the Democrats ran nearly everything.
The reason was that before Reagan, the Republican party was just a bunch of blue blood wall street types who were socially liberal and not much different than Democrats on other issues.
This is where we are headed again and like a sick individual you want to blame the victims. But guess what? no amount of whining about take my ball and go home will make a bit of difference so might as well get it through your head.
If the party is not conservative, especially on fiscal matters then both conservatives and independents will not see it as a viable alternative to the democrats and it will lose. It’s just that simple.
“Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty”
Kyle
Both
Neil Stevens Tuesday, May 12th at 7:16PM EDT (link)We’re a site dedicated to winning primaries as conservatives and winning elections as Republicans.
Want to run for conservatives? Give.
There Is No Crisis
bwahahahaha
David Hinz Tuesday, May 12th at 6:54PM EDT (link)hypothetically speaking, that is
The Minority Report — The HinzSight Report — TMRB.tv — MFOB “Miss Tagart, do you know the hallmark of the second-rater? It’s resentment of another man’s achievement.”
Leave it to you to get a grin out of me when I'm ready to scream Dave
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 7:02PM EDT (link)House Conservatives Fund
Michael Williams for Senate
Toomey US Senate
SarahPAC
I understand that....I won't pursue it further...I'm just frustrated beyond measure right now...
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 6:57PM EDT (link)It’s obvious from polls that there are people refusing to self identify as Republicans any more while the percentage of self identifying conservatives has risen and at least remained steady depending on the poll. There has to be a reason and I’d be curious to know where the rest of the RS members are on the question…might make for an interesting poll.
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Nation First, Family Second, Party Third..Principle
rcov092 Tuesday, May 12th at 7:36PM EDT (link)constrains all and needs no labled validation. The GOP needs to recognize the fall off in people self-identifying as GOP is related to the lack of principles exhibited by the GOP.
People identifying in increasing numbers as “conservative” is evidence that people are getting razor focused on what is really important. The GOP needs to drop the consultant and focus groups and pollsters (who only tell them what they want to hear). Thy ywill turn the tide, and save a ton of money in the process.
“Not One Red Dime for the NRSC or NRCC till they stop trying to elect liberals”
Join the RedState Strike Force
I hope it is really family first, then nation and party
AKSteveB Tuesday, May 12th at 8:43PM EDT (link)Above all else, I think (hope) that conservatism is about allowing us to take care of ourselves and our families. We are nothing, if we don’t put family first. For the religious, I understand God being first but that is it.
Hell is other people - Sartre
IMO, it's all the same (God/Family/Country)
JLenardDetroit Tuesday, May 12th at 8:57PM EDT (link)if it is right by God then it is best for Family and Country. But that’s just me.
(RS:Help) (JLD) (Hollyweird) (Brain-deads) (SPIN-cycle) (Obamaocare) (Party of kNOw) (Conservatism) (TEApeats) (respectful) (Reco) (Quotes) (removeRINOs.com) (RSmas)
+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
Well said...nt
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 9:31PM EDT (link)House Conservatives Fund
Michael Williams for Senate
Toomey US Senate
SarahPAC
yes, goes to show we must do more shaping the Republican Party
JLenardDetroit Tuesday, May 12th at 7:42PM EDT (link)we have to keep at it and keep on them…..
Things matter depending on ones location…. It is a Heck of alot easier to be so definitive and stomp our feet about principles and values in the Bluest or Redest of States…. in a sense, your Vote doesn’t count anyway if you sit out an Election and it is likely to go RED or BLUE the way it would have otherwise with or without you (again, not YOU per-se’, speaking in General (relation to anyone/everyone) terms). Agree? Does that make sense? It is the Purple areas that matter most and those who sit-it-out in those areas have given us the 06/08 Election results.
(RS:Help) (JLD) (Hollyweird) (Brain-deads) (SPIN-cycle) (Obamaocare) (Party of kNOw) (Conservatism) (TEApeats) (respectful) (Reco) (Quotes) (removeRINOs.com) (RSmas)
+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
Florida is Purple if not marginally red yet the party bosses have decided to back a left wing horse!
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 7:56PM EDT (link)Crist is the party’s pick and we can all go fly a kite…that’s the problem here. We were told the days of the party taking sides in primaries were over when Steele took over….so much for that I guess!
House Conservatives Fund
Michael Williams for Senate
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Be True to your Conscience
antisocial Tuesday, May 12th at 8:35PM EDT (link)The best we can do is vote our conscience in primary and if we can’t vote support the candidate we think is fit (I would think Marco).
There are two choices after the primary:
1>Vote/Support the primary winner.
2>If Crist trumps Marco boycott and sit out. Why carry a burden for getting another Spector/McCain in Senate? If Crist loses other democrats in the party will get a strong message. Cleansing you know.
Lot of people may end up supporting Crist just like they supported McCain.
I am for being true to conscience.
No you can’t - Moe Lane
——————————
The Emperor has no clothes!!!
——————————
Republicans who lost the Crap-and-Raid fight in the House -
Mary Bomo Mac (CA-45)
Mike Castle (DE)
Mark Kirk (IL-10)
Frank A. LoBiondo (NJ-02)
Chris Smith (NJ-04)
Leonard Lance (NJ-07)
John M. McHugh (NY-23)
Dave Reichert (WA-08)
I sat out last year
AKSteveB Wednesday, May 13th at 2:47AM EDT (link)and trust me, there is a lot more shame in having even a tiny sliver of responsibility for the current mess, than there would have been supporting a very flawed but not unAmerican candidate. We can have all the internecine struggles we want, but if/until the Democratic party *as a matter of governing policy* stops trying to force us into being Western Europe and stops trying to eliminate the last vestiges of the 10th Amendment it is straight ticket for me. This isn’t a game anymore.
JL, do you think Crist is a Red Dog or a RINO?
Hell is other people - Sartre
I'm not sure, and that worries me
JLenardDetroit Wednesday, May 13th at 3:43AM EDT (link)In a word: conflicted or unsure.
He has seemed to me to be loyal, but I’m not so sure of the tests he’s been through to make that determination. There are certainly plenty of folks here now trying to convince me/us that he would be a RINO. I said elsewhere though, I am not sure where they are coming from either - I’m concern some are falling into hard-lines drawing based on Identity Politics. I thought he’d be a Red-Dog, but again his willingness to cash in on the Stimulus things I’ve seen from him would belie that — but, of course, he can’t alienate all of the potential Moderate voters! I think ACORN will be targeting FL and we’ll have even more votes to over-come, as I know you know what I mean.
What I fear most, I guess, is another one of these WE HAVE NO CHOICE situations. Another fight seems brewing and setting up yet another NO WIN situation. Another time that everyone lands up pissed off and sitting out handing the seat to any Democrat regardless of who lands up as the General candidate for whatever reason (Primary challenged or not).
I am on the fence about almost all of this right now. I do NOT want to react Emotionally on it all, as yet I fear again I’m seeing from some. This is NOT to me clear like the Toomey situation where I clearly back him because he has been there and stood up for Conservatism against disreSpecter before. The other guy may be too new and not well enough known to convince anyone of anything (whereas a better known longer standing Conservative, in Purples, can/could convince people the Conservative message/direction is the only way to go).
I’m torn with whether him needing to stay Governor, hasn’t been that long, and whether or not he could really be a Shoe-in for a Senate run — if he isn’t beat the crap out of by a Primary. At any given moment I can be slightly pulled either way.
We have time, of course, it seems some are in such a hurry that this has to be decided YESTERDAY!!!!!! I hope we can get people to calm down and discuss it all on all the merits of Positions, overall strategy, whatever….. Again, many have the “My mind is made up and it is My way or the Highway - I’ll sit out and let the Democrat win” again. People - can we take a few weeks to hash these things out for the election not coming until 2010?!?!?
Just what %-er is Crist if everyone agrees he isn’t the 100%-er (and I don’t think anyone is going to suggest he is)? Will he be loyal to the Republican Party Conservative Platform (Red-Dog) or indeed an opportunist that will turn out to be a RINO.
(RS:Help) (JLD) (Hollyweird) (Brain-deads) (SPIN-cycle) (Obamaocare) (Party of kNOw) (Conservatism) (TEApeats) (respectful) (Reco) (Quotes) (removeRINOs.com) (RSmas)
+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
I don't know where that line is for me...
rcov092 Tuesday, May 12th at 7:42PM EDT (link)I only know, at my age I do not have many more cycles to lose. If the GOP leadership is content with “rebuilding” over the next 25 years, I am out.
“Not One Red Dime for the NRSC or NRCC till they stop trying to elect liberals”
Join the RedState Strike Force
Maybe not, but the Party
Right Reason Tuesday, May 12th at 8:43PM EDT (link)sure is putting its finger on the scale. Allowing the rank and file to make the choice means no endorsements in the primary. But somehow, the party always seems to come out for the “moderate” candidate.
Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts.
- Winston Churchill
the only way we will ever get anything done
JLenardDetroit Tuesday, May 12th at 5:25PM EDT (link)With the exception of an absolute disdain and unwillingness to back RINOs anymore….. Red-Dogs, OK, but not RINOs/CINOs!
(RS:Help) (JLD) (Hollyweird) (Brain-deads) (SPIN-cycle) (Obamaocare) (Party of kNOw) (Conservatism) (TEApeats) (respectful) (Reco) (Quotes) (removeRINOs.com) (RSmas)
+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
I'm Conservative
Right Reason Tuesday, May 12th at 8:32PM EDT (link)I vote with and support the Republican Party to the extent that it furthers the goals I espouse as a conservative. Notice that I did not say that I support the Republican Party as long as it’s one nanometer to the right of the Democratic Party. When it becomes clear that the Republican Party will not be a vehicle for attaining conservative goals, I will cease to support it. THAT’S the way to further the conservative agenda. All you party first guys think that conservatives are nowhere without the Republican Party. But the truth is, the Republican Party is nowhere without the conservatives. And if we do part ways, there will undoubtedly be a period of darkness, but it will be the conservatives emerging from the other end, NOT the Republicans. Because it is becoming apparent that while we have the ideas, the Party has only ambition.
Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts.
- Winston Churchill
Thus the Whigs and the Republican Party when the Whigs refused to deal with the Democrats and their excesses...nt
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 9:34PM EDT (link)House Conservatives Fund
Michael Williams for Senate
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Fascinating Discussion
youthgrunt Thursday, May 14th at 11:21PM EDT (link)regarding being Conservative or Republican and what our alternatives are.
Neil quite accurately points out that Conservative activists should be about trying to direct the Republican Party to become more conservative. What interests me are the various visions of what that means: one comment talks about who the Republicans run for President–an important thing, but it is not what really determines the direction of the party. Others comment on the various slates of candidates that run or what the various party organizations do. These are also important, but more symptomatic than they are the problem.
What do we do? It seems to me that a Conservative Activist needs to somehow become involved in the LOCAL Republican political structure. We need more Conservatives in Precinct Committeemen positions. We need Conservative Republican City Council members–and mayors–and State Representatives. We need Conservatives running and providing the background support for Conservative candidates. We need Conservatives running for County GOP Chairmanships.
It seems to me we are focusing too much on the primary and general election and forgetting that there is a Party Organization that must be won first.
Worst case scenario
suzieQ Tuesday, May 12th at 2:22PM EDT (link)As the old saying goes, we hope for the best but we have to plan for the worst. What is the over/under on the republican party losing BOTH - the governorship, and the Senate seat to the dems?
“It’s finally happened: Abortion stopped a bleeding heart.”
- Ann Coulter, January 25, 2006
“My concern about the role of the federal government is that an intrusive government, a government that says, ‘Don’t worry, we will solve your problems’ is a government that tends to crowd compassion out of the marketplace, that too often in the past people said: ‘Somebody else will take care of the problem in my area. Don’t worry. The government is here.’”
- George W. Bush October 31, 2000
“Had the decision belonged to Senator Kerry, Saddam Hussein would still be in power today in Iraq. In fact, Saddam Hussein would almost certainly still be in control of Kuwait.”
- Dick Cheney
Another R Obama will Campaign For
jimmuy8 Tuesday, May 12th at 2:24PM EDT (link)Isn’t that great? Isn’t it wonderful, this big tent we have?
Why bother with the Republican Party that seems intent upon letting the Democrats pick who we run, who we vote for, what we stand for and who speaks for us?
Hey...what about running Conservatives where they can win?...
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 3:27PM EDT (link)What about Conservatives pushing us to a regional Party? what about tolerance and going along to get along? What about party unity and playing to win?
It’s not enough for the squish establishment to just run moderates in blue states…It’s not enough to make us sit down and shut up when they run squishes in CA and Mass which makes sense…but we’ve also got to stand aside while they attack conservatives in Red states where we can win…
2010 is shaping up as a potential backlash year for people fed up with the Democrat’s over reaching and Cornyn and the party bosses are working overtime to erase everything we have to distinguish ourselves from the Democrat Party!
House Conservatives Fund
Michael Williams for Senate
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The Real Question Here Is Whether Republican Primary Voters Will "Man Up"
IJB Tuesday, May 12th at 3:28PM EDT (link)That’s the real issue here.
Republican primary voters have *failed* in the 2008 Presidential Primaries. And they’ve *failed* in states like SC and AZ, sending squishes and career politicians back to office again and again.
To me, this race (and some other races in places like PA) are a test of Republican primary voters. (The Republican political leadership has already been tested on these, and *FAILED*.)
So, I’m down to banking on rank-and-file Republicans - if they fail me going into 2010, I may very well be joining AceInTX in looking to go out the door and start looking for greener pastures…
I'm not heading for greener pastures yet lBJ...
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 4:53PM EDT (link)I’m looking up from the parched brown grass I’m choking on right now…and admiring the grass in the next pasture at the moment…I’m not ready to make a run at the fence yet…but I’m daydreaming about it to be sure at the moment!
House Conservatives Fund
Michael Williams for Senate
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SarahPAC
Can someone please tell me why Crist is so popular?
its_a_right_wing_thing Tuesday, May 12th at 3:57PM EDT (link)I am trying to get confirmation from friends in FLA as to why Crist seems to be so popular.
Based on what I can tell, what little I know about him he seems to be a true RINO i.e. a “moderate” (over-used term) yet he’s supposedly still so popular. My guess is he’s fiscally responsible and fiscally conservative which all voters can appreciate. This is the philosophy that got a Mitt Romney elected Republican Gov. in Massachusetts. People seem to be more comfortable with a Republican running the purse strings (prior to the Bush Admin that is). Of course this is the same state the not only elected and re-elected Jeb Bush but still publically defend him on this site over and over saying “he’s not as bad as his brother and was actually quite popular even today”. Not sure how true this is.
With Crist running, he’ll get most of the transplant/moderate/liberal Republican vote and many swing voters but you are also going to hear rumors of him being gay which he never seems to confirm or deny.
Here are some quotes from readers on the FOXNEWS.com article with this announcment:
Typical Crist quotes one can expect to read. I think it pretty much sums up his chances (sadly quite good in diverse FL. He’ll likely win and continue to shift FL to the left at best. I think its McCain II or Specter II.
FOXNEWS.com readers seem to think that when the gay issues come out “he’s toast” or “he’ll be a lap dog for the Democrats” or “Specter II”. The base isn’t gonna like this and I wonder if he’d even be able to get the nomination. FLA barely banned gay marriage in 2008 so its probably a real swing issue still in a very diverse state where most people aren’t native (lot of NYers, retirees, etc who will love his non-committal stance on anything and very open views on a wide variety of issues).
by woody72 Florida [May 12, 2009 2:09:07 PM]
by swede588 Florida [May 12, 2009 1:37:07 PM] I live in Florida, with Crist you never sure what side he is on, he change his views on everything depending on which way the wind blows. ///////////////////I don’t think that’s a fare statement, Crist happens to to do what is best for Florida first, most of the time. And that doesn’t sit well with the lunatic fringe in the republican party. You must be doing something right to have the special interests on both sides mad at you.
by worriedamerican [May 12, 2009 1:34:32 PM]
This is one Floridian who is NOT a Crist fan and will support his opponent. He threw us under the bus when he supported the “porkulus” package and thanks to his last-minute endorsement of McCain, Republicans once again put up a candidate destined to lose. Crist has his eye on the White House, that is the only reason he’s running for senate. He’s a politician first, foremost and forever - and has his own best interests at heart.
by pumafox [May 12, 2009 12:57:29 PM]
Thanks, Gov. Now we’ll have two Democrats running against each other for the same Senate seat. Welcome aboard. After Senator Franken is sworn in, you’ll be our 61st Democrat. Gray skies are going to clear up, put on a happy face. Wipe off the clouds and cheer up. Put on a happy face
You Will Have To Ask The zerO...
rcov092 Tuesday, May 12th at 4:19PM EDT (link)Crist is Obama’s favorite Republican, but he is not the favorite of conservative Republicans in Florida. He thought he was McCain and Lindsey Grahamnesty’s favorite Republican, but he was just not quote liberal enough for them.
Since he saw the strategy fo Obama’s victory in Florida, he has focused his efforts on a similar strategy (hence he appoints a liberal judge to the Supreme Court from Orange county). He is very popular with liberals. He talks of big government programs and then tries to curry favor with the conservatives when he needs them by pulling in his support for additional taxes. Make no mistake though, at his heart he is a Republican cut from the same cloth as Schwarzenegger.
Everyone keeps repeating the mantra “he is so popular” . Well, it is said that figures lie and liars figure. Analyze those polls closely and I think you will find enough swiss in them to start to erode that theory. I am quite certain in stating that if he was running today, he would not carry a great many of the conservative rural need panhandle counties that he did in the election, they have grown wiser.
I for one do not care in Mitch McConnell or John Cornyn do endoree him, my money is on Rubio. Neither of those two gentlemen have shown any real grasp of the reality of what it is to run a race on principle (versus focus groups) .
This is the first year I am involved in GOP party politics. I am now a member of the REC in my county and I will tell you that yes there are Crist supporters there, but there are also a great many new faces because of the debacle in November and most of the new faces are there to take back the party from principles sake. This will be the first battle.
If Crist is the victor in the primary, then yes I will vote for him, in the meantime, he has an uphill battle with ma and the conservative base in Florida. He may emerge victorius, but we will make him write his positions in blood to get there.
In the meantime, Rubio can expect the first of my donations next week.
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I'd like to know the same
JLenardDetroit Tuesday, May 12th at 4:30PM EDT (link)I’ve had dealings with his office while he was AG, but never a conversation directly with him. He has had, from being the AG, the Public-image of “How Much He Cares” - which is, of course, one of those IMMEDIATE RED-FLAGS for us as it is that usual Lefty-loon front that they play/ploy on voters. That is NOT to say he doesn’t genuinely care, of course. Nor does it mean he doesn’t believe in some Conservative values, BUT his failure to oppose the Stimulus (in fact said some good things about it) GIVES ME GREAT PAUSE/CONCERN!!! However, I am holding out hope (and do really believe) that he would, in the Senate, be a RED-DOG rather than a RINO (Red-Dogs, RINOs, CINOs, DINOs, PLINOs, and Blue-Dogs, oh my… The Political Zoo - what/who are they?) which is an important distinction I’ve been trying to get into the lexicon all across RS.
He may indeed be the best opportunity in FL and I’d rather see him over Jeb Bush (for the obvious campaign commercials reasons, though they will even link Crist to the Bush Family [obvious why they can]). I’ve heard of another contender coming from a more Conservative position (attacking Crist on his Stimulus position) and I would tend to lean toward that person just for being more Conservative. However, I fear Crist is a certified SHOE-IN for the Primary and that the Primary Challenger would just damage Crist and give us the Democrat in the General.
I’m gonna catch it for this, but…… And let me remind everyone that I steadfastly DEMAND the Natl’s keep out of PA and leave Toomey (the better Candidate for the General Election there, IMHO) alone in PA! I want the same in FL, let them be…. I will be supporting Crist for the Senate in FL…. I do, of course, reserve my right to be persuaded otherwise as I learn more about the new challenger as I ALWAYS PREFER A MORE CONSERVATIVE CANDIDATE but we MUST have the win in FL and Crist is the most likely Candidate for that.
Each and every Race has to be examined on its own merits and greatly depends on the State (Red, Blue, Purple). I make Zero apologies for my unabashed desire for any/all Republican candidates to be a Conservative first and foremost, but I will NOT apologize for my willingness to back a RED-DOG though either, I just have had it and am done with RINOs (retire Mr. McCain, you have crossed the line too many times and have majorly screwed us this last election)! Nor the fact that I will NOT allow another Bush a chance to disappoint me.
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Crist is a good candidate and good for the NRSC
ajgop Tuesday, May 12th at 4:34PM EDT (link)I’m just as conservative as the next guy and landing Crist to run for Senate is a home run for the NRSC and John Cornyn
If we are ever going to return to becoming a Majority Party we need to find the BEST candidates to run for office. I like Marco Rubio and at 38 has a very bright future ahead of him. (why not run for Gov)
Here are the facts -
Crist has almost universal name id in Florida
Crist has very high favorable ratings
Crist has run and won state wide.
Crist can raise a ton of money.
Those are all good things in looking for a candidate. Even more importantly is this fact - With Crist in the race the NRSC will likely not have to make much if any investment in the race. This will save them millions of dollars which they can thus spend in other races.
This is how you win majorities. This is the type of tough calculation the Democrats have been making and winning.
I wish Crist well and feel like we are finally making the smart decisions that will begin our road back to becoming the majority party.
Blah..Blahh Blahhhh!!
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 5:03PM EDT (link)House Conservatives Fund
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"This is how you win majorities."
Tbone Tuesday, May 12th at 7:23PM EDT (link)No. This is how you elect Republicans who become Democrats when the mood suits them.
Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.
Yeah...and that strategy worked real well in 06 and 08 didn't it?
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 9:36PM EDT (link)either you’re for us or against us!
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Majorities for whom?
Neil Stevens Tuesday, May 12th at 7:25PM EDT (link)Linc Chafee and Arlen Specter?
Want to run for conservatives? Give.
There Is No Crisis
weighing all the factors, I would lean (barely) for
Mike gamecock DeVine Tuesday, May 12th at 7:34PM EDT (link)having Rubio run for governor.
Mike DeVine’s Examiner.com, Charlotte Observer and The Minority Report columns
“One man with courage makes a majority.” - Andrew Jackson
What We Really Need Is For Rubio To Beat Crist...
IJB Tuesday, May 12th at 8:10PM EDT (link)Unfortunately, I suspect the FL GOP electorate is more like SC’s and AZ’s than not, and will robotically vote for Crist.
But I’d like to see some polling before we consign Rubio to running for Governor instead…
Won't happen IBJ...If Crist loses the party bosses will make sure Rubio is so bloody...
AceInTX Tuesday, May 12th at 9:39PM EDT (link)there is no way he’ll beat the Democrat so they can stand back later and point the finger and say, “see, that’s what all you 100%ers get. Conservatives can’t win and this proves it”!
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I Don't Think Those Guys Call The Shots Anymore (nt)
IJB Tuesday, May 12th at 9:58PM EDT (link)What do you mean they don't call the shots any more?
AceInTX Wednesday, May 13th at 12:54PM EDT (link)They’re the ones who pushed Crist and they’re the ones using party funds to support him!
did I misunderstand who you’re talking about or Visa Versa?
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I'm Saying *We* Don't Do What They Tell Us Anymore (nt)
IJB Wednesday, May 13th at 12:57PM EDT (link)OK...I misunderstood...We need to stop doing what they tell us anymore...but to many still do IMHO nt
AceInTX Wednesday, May 13th at 2:56PM EDT (link)House Conservatives Fund
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we will all see the results the way we want to read them
JLenardDetroit Tuesday, May 12th at 10:55PM EDT (link)we will never convince the more Liberal Republicans and they sure as Heck are NOT going to change our minds. Neither of our “sides” is worthy of anything if we keep Cannibalising each other and beating the Heck out of each other to the point where we (sit out and concede/surrender to) insure the Democrats win.
Some are convinced Crist is a RINO while some of us think he will be, not with us 100% but at least a Red-Dog…. We cannot be sure yet - but I certainly have great concern/pause (as I said elsewhere) over his Stimulus rhetoric. Whether it was concern for pandering to in-state constituents wanting the money or what?!?!? How will he BEHAVE/ACT at the National level. Since we have no crystal ball - that is the hard call to be made. The other candidate being more Conservative would be wonderful, but (limiting the discussion JUST ABOUT FL) whether or not he can win is a discussion I want people to have before the Primary date does get here.
Everything is MOOT as long as we remain in the Minority. STRATEGY is where we haggle…. again, who is best depends on where, IMO.
I will certainly be supporting whomever comes out of the Primary.
It is hard balancing the arguments of Crist hasn’t been Governor long so he should stay put, while we were more than happy to have Palin leave AK for the VP or Senate (yes, it was only the most odd-ball of shots that would have happened - not gonna revisit all that). Consistency isn’t a requirement, but would be nice - who can will win the General?
Again, I don’t think most of us are far apart in the “What we’d prefer” positions, it is how we squabble beyond that. Many are picking/choosing minor points out of whole comments to run with (normal human behavior, of course).
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+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
All I want at this point is for the national party to stay out of open primaries and stop supporting liberal candidates with my money against conservative candidates
AceInTX Wednesday, May 13th at 12:56PM EDT (link)House Conservatives Fund
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double-edged sword and/or double standard?
JLenardDetroit Wednesday, May 13th at 4:42PM EDT (link)OK…. WE (Conservatives) want the GOP National support and money when it is OUR Candidate, but they should not help fund someone if they are not at least an 85% (?) Conservative?!?!?
Can we, at least, acknowledge the double-edged sword and/or double standard?
It would be best if they kept out of the Primaries completely - is the basic and easy reply….. HOWEVER, monies put into a Primary (as touched on elsewhere) are not just about the Primary but about laying a ground-work for the General Election. Can we get an agreement/acknowledgement on that too at least?
Again, we are not far apart…. WE would prefer the GOP ONLY supported and put forth Conservative Candidates (except for in the most Blue of Blue States, most agree there has to be some give there)….. The trouble (and no-one wants to admit) that those who are arguing with me are doing so because I am at times willing to be a bit more pragmatic!?!?!? That is the problem most have with me and my positions in regard to this matter. I have no problem with differences if someone states them out-right (again, this is now a GENERAL COMMENT and not an accusation toward you) is direct and honest about it. Some may take offense - but if the shoe doesn’t fit, why put it on and parade around in it?
lol (I go into most of these things in Be respectful Diary)
Thanks for your spirited debate/discussions… Glad to know we are all attempting to move toward the same things…. we sometimes differ on strategy and degrees of support/dissent.
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+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
Noy what I said at all....
AceInTX Wednesday, May 13th at 7:26PM EDT (link)Speak for yourself…the national party and their affiliates in the House and Senate need to stay out of open primaries…period!
I don’t care what a candidate’s positions are on this subject…let the primaries play out and let primary voters decide who they want to represent them and stop cramming candidates down our throats by swamping Conservatives under mountains of party cash!
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so we just throw away the ground-breaking to General
JLenardDetroit Wednesday, May 13th at 7:42PM EDT (link)I guess you just are willing to let them do it on the cheap, whatever budget they manage to throw together on their own - and then have the need for a major influx of Cash, support, name-recognition building, etc… in the shorter time period between the Primary end and the General Election date…. I look forward to yet more Contrariness.
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+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
no...I want the party to do what it says it will do...and represent the principles it says it represents!
AceInTX Wednesday, May 13th at 8:47PM EDT (link)Who was worse The British who were engaged in a war to keep us under their heel and payed Benedict Arnold to betray us…or Benedict Arnold for selling us out. Obama is the enemy and I oppose every single thing he’s trying to do…but I’m supposed to tolerate those in my party who are actively engaged in helping him do it?
I’m a SoCon and I’ve been pounded for years for standing up for my beliefs by the party and those in power to sit down and shut up so the party can concentrate on fiscal, smaller government and national security issues. Well…here we are in 2009. Social issues are off the table now because we’re disparately trying to save what’s left of our liberties and fighting for the very existence of the free market…and now I’m being told I need to sit on my libertarian fiscal conservative and limited government tendencies so we can win back the majority with people who have no interest in protecting any of the above. How long before the party is pushing weak on foreign policy anti military spending squishes on us cause that’s all that’s left…and those seeds are already planted…Lugar and Hagel being the most recent examples!
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Oh...and stay out of the PRIMARIES...let the voters decide without buying an open primary for a squish with my money! nt
AceInTX Wednesday, May 13th at 8:49PM EDT (link)House Conservatives Fund
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bravo Ace
kyle8 Wednesday, May 13th at 8:52PM EDT (link)you tell it! You know, I don’t even have a very high threshold of who I will support, he or she just has to be right of center and not ACTIVLY work to undermine the party!
“Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty”
Kyle
this is the discussion I'm looking to have
JLenardDetroit Wednesday, May 13th at 4:52PM EDT (link)Open discussions based on OVERALL BEST STRATEGY to move forward in each location/State. Most of this thread has been people having already made up their mind and having picked a side and the GENERAL DISCUSSIONS as to the whys/wherefores bypassed. Thanks for interjecting.
I too am concerned over the direction of FL voters the last decade, which is why (seemingly like you) I have pause jumping either way immediately.
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+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
Mike you want to elaborate?
antisocial Tuesday, May 12th at 9:22PM EDT (link)I understand the need for getting conservatives in local politics but at what cost? Remember at national level we are are in trouble. And the biggest problem is a lack of conservative leaders. And we will end up with same “compromise” Senators.
Crist WILL kick us in the teeth repeatedly if he gets elected. Don’t say later that you were not warned
No you can’t - Moe Lane
——————————
The Emperor has no clothes!!!
——————————
Republicans who lost the Crap-and-Raid fight in the House -
Mary Bomo Mac (CA-45)
Mike Castle (DE)
Mark Kirk (IL-10)
Frank A. LoBiondo (NJ-02)
Chris Smith (NJ-04)
Leonard Lance (NJ-07)
John M. McHugh (NY-23)
Dave Reichert (WA-08)
I would if I weren't so ill, but I am persuadeable on this. I am no Crist fan.
Mike gamecock DeVine Tuesday, May 12th at 11:24PM EDT (link)more later
Mike DeVine’s Examiner.com, Charlotte Observer and The Minority Report columns
“One man with courage makes a majority.” - Andrew Jackson
{{Mike GDV}}
mom2oneson Tuesday, May 12th at 11:30PM EDT (link)Hope you feel better
Here is some chicken noodle soup and homemade bread.
Sorry to hear you're under the weather. nt
AceInTX Wednesday, May 13th at 12:57PM EDT (link)House Conservatives Fund
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former Crist luke-warmers now Crist haters (Identity Politics?)
JLenardDetroit Tuesday, May 12th at 11:38PM EDT (link)is what is surprising me…. I had always thought of Crist as going to be Party loyal (Red-Dog rather than RINO as anti-social seems convinced he would be at a National level) with his Stimulus rhetoric giving me concern (but that may have been in-state constituency pandering - still, of concern)….. I will be supporting either candidate. If the other Candidate were more widely known/recognizable I would not hesitate to jump on the bandwagon and support him first and foremost…. I’m just not automatically going to have a knee-jerk (Liberal Democrat) like reaction I fear some of my fellow Republicans are here over all this. Glad to see you too are for calm deliberation, wish we could have the calm discussion on it. I hate when Conservatives act like Liberals (Emotional). I fear too, that some are falling into the IDENTITY-Politics of the backgrounds of those being considered…. No-one will, of course, admit to that openly but I suspect it is factoring in!!!!!!
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+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
There was nothing "emotional" in my post
antisocial Wednesday, May 13th at 10:03AM EDT (link)I also don’t get your identity politics theory. The past of a politician is an indicator of his mindset and is the most clear signal of where he will be headed in terms of policy.
Otherwise how do you suggest a politician should be evaluated?
No you can’t - Moe Lane
——————————
The Emperor has no clothes!!!
——————————
Republicans who lost the Crap-and-Raid fight in the House -
Mary Bomo Mac (CA-45)
Mike Castle (DE)
Mark Kirk (IL-10)
Frank A. LoBiondo (NJ-02)
Chris Smith (NJ-04)
Leonard Lance (NJ-07)
John M. McHugh (NY-23)
Dave Reichert (WA-08)
JLenardDetroit...about the kneejerk business..
Aaron Gardner Wednesday, May 13th at 12:26PM EDT (link)I hope you understand how subjective that term is…..what you might see as knee jerk could be well reasoned and thought out opinion that had not previously been expressed.
I have opposed Crist for quite some time myself because he has always been a squish in my eyes. So my reaction is hardly knee jerk.
Now I am not accusing you of saying that either…I am just cautioning you on the overuse and applicability of the term knee jerk.
Respectful enough?…;^)
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conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
Thanks Aaron, and I think some are confused
JLenardDetroit Wednesday, May 13th at 2:24PM EDT (link)or not distinguishing the distinctions between the Primary and the General.
I have stated several times of my concerns about Crist, that seems to get lost when I’m willing to say that I’d support him IF he is the General Election candidate. I don’t need much convincing he isn’t the best FIRST choice. I think many are upset (and I’m not a big fan of this bad policy) of the ‘he seems to be the next ready in line’ for this next big job. It’s great when it is someone we want/like but throw-out the Loyalty thing we demand when it is asked of us.
Where the
argumentdifference of opinion is, is what to do when we don’t have that more Conservative candidate. Some people want to subscribe to the completely let the Party die so it can be reborn (which we are pretty close to already anyway) with the sit-it-out even before campaigning has begun. Let the Democrats win (even if they themselves will still vote, they are doing little to help get other votes to the Polls). It is understandable that people really don’t want to work for the candidates we aren’t so enthused about. I certainly didn’t do much for McCain, but I did try to get some voters out for him.I just want acknowledged (which won’t ever come from many because they won’t admit it to themselves, let alone to others) they are fine with letting Democrats win elections ….. As a reach analogy I’ll say, it is like the Esteem thing in Schools - the Kids results are often less than stellar, but they feel great about themselves - that it is ok to coast because the environment allows it.
FL specifically, like PA, I do not think it has gone so far off the deep end that a Conservative candidate can/will not be able to win a General - we’d sure better make damn sure he can/does if Rubio (that him? don’t know him) wins the Primary. I am certainly NOT asking him to stay out of the Primary, yet people seem convinced I’m for Crist 100% because I defend the need to work for him IF he is the General election candidate.
Take care friend.
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+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
JLenard...I hear ya...
Aaron Gardner Wednesday, May 13th at 2:34PM EDT (link)I wasn’t sure of your stance so I tried to stay away from and accusation or assumption. Now knowing your stance I can respond a bit further.
It is my opinion that Crist should not enter the race because it is an unneeded run by Crist. Crist should remain as governor instead of creating a devision where none should exist.
Crist is the antagonist in this scenario because he is doing this for no reason other that ego or ideological, either of which is a lowball play in this case.
That said if I lived in FL and Crist won the primary…well he would bet my nose holding vote…the party is a tool like Neil said…whoever decides to pick it up and use it will ultimately control where it is steered.
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conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
not me I would actively campaign against him
kyle8 Wednesday, May 13th at 2:41PM EDT (link)I would rather have a liberal Democrat than a liberal republican for the reasons I listed above.
“Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty”
Kyle
er below
kyle8 Wednesday, May 13th at 2:42PM EDT (link)here
“Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty”
Kyle
well then you are just as self destructive as Crist...only in different circumstances...nt
Aaron Gardner Wednesday, May 13th at 2:44PM EDT (link)Aaron’s Archive
conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
no, read my reasoning below
kyle8 Wednesday, May 13th at 2:47PM EDT (link)I am making the most sense in this. Let me ask you this question. Like Dr. Phil might say, “How has supporting liberal republicans been working out for ya?”
“Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty”
Kyle
you said you would actively campaign against him in the general....
Aaron Gardner Wednesday, May 13th at 2:52PM EDT (link)what I would do is suck it up and vote for him in the general and then lean on him as a constituent so hard that he couldn’t ignore me…and then if he went off the reservation I would do everything I could to unseat him in the next primary because that is the system we have.
I wouldn’t support a democrat because all that does is get turned into fodder for the MSM with their constant drivel about the death of the Republican party.
What everyone should be doing is putting their nose to the grindstone for their guy in the primary and then the party in the general and make changes in between at the levels possible.
It takes work…but that’s patriotism.
Aaron’s Archive
conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
i understand your point but
kyle8 Wednesday, May 13th at 3:01PM EDT (link)the way I see it, having real liberals in the party ( I am not even talking about squishes, I mean a real liberal like Christ) is so harmful to the party and the movement you have to be prepared to do anything to defeat them.
“Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty”
Kyle
That's why we have primaries...Rubio needs to win it and tell Crist to STFD....
Aaron Gardner Wednesday, May 13th at 3:08PM EDT (link)S=Sit and D=Down…I will let you figure out the rest.
Aaron’s Archive
conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
Slow down, let the rest of us Play ;-) lol
JLenardDetroit Wednesday, May 13th at 3:48PM EDT (link)Did either of you remember to breathe? lol
NOTE: my patented process of attempting to interject a moment of levity during very serious conversations.
(RS:Help) (JLD) (Hollyweird) (Brain-deads) (SPIN-cycle) (Obamaocare) (Party of kNOw) (Conservatism) (TEApeats) (respectful) (Reco) (Quotes) (removeRINOs.com) (RSmas)
+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
don't agree, but respect/appreciate your directness/honesty
JLenardDetroit Wednesday, May 13th at 3:21PM EDT (link)more than we’re getting from some others. Again, with you on some things but not others.
and I think Aaron now has a full appreciation of where I’m coming from and we are on the same page. lol
As for your comment about Democrats getting the complete blame for How Obama’s FAILURES are the country’s SUCCESSES - since we have to spell it out — that would be nice, BUT WE KNOW DARN WELL…. That the MSM will spin it as Republican obstructionism and/or sabotage and brain-dead Democrats and far too many Moderates will buy that…. YOU KNOW IT!!!! They will NOT get the blame!
(RS:Help) (JLD) (Hollyweird) (Brain-deads) (SPIN-cycle) (Obamaocare) (Party of kNOw) (Conservatism) (TEApeats) (respectful) (Reco) (Quotes) (removeRINOs.com) (RSmas)
+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
Sorry AG...got to part ways with ya on that one!
AceInTX Wednesday, May 13th at 8:27PM EDT (link)Leaning on them hasn’t worked and will never work because in most instances they don’t listen at all or outright thumb their nose at us…and in the few instances when we beat them back…they slink away…cower in the corner till we’re not paying attention…and work their mischief on us with some hidden Amendment in some obscure bill or pass it at 2:00am when we’re all asleep one night!
Our problem is the fact that the people at the top can keep pushing the Crists and Gerlachs against our conservative candidates against our will because we can be counted on to knuckle under and fall on our swords after they’ve forced a squish on us using the national apparatus and the funds from the national party affiliates! They do what they are doing because we keep taking it.
To the extent of your point that we shouldn’t work directly for Democrats against Republicans I agree with you…we should never work for any Democrat under any circumstance…I just extend that to apply to Republicans that might as well be Democrats anyway.
I won’t actively work for a Democrat…but I won’t vote for a squish again either…McCain was my last compromise on that point and I’m ashamed that I made it. Never again may God strike me dead if I ever do it again!
I agree with this wholeheartedly…but I’d like to have my guy given a chance without the party bosses coming in and destroying him in my name!
House Conservatives Fund
Michael Williams for Senate
Toomey US Senate
SarahPAC
I go much further than you
kyle8 Wednesday, May 13th at 8:43PM EDT (link)i will dare to say that if you support a liberal like Crist in the general election you are being used and laughed at by the beltway republicans who will continue to do this until we stand up to them.
And you should ACTIVLEY work for and support democrats when they are running against liberal Republicans (except maybe in just a few of the bluest states). Because if we have any more than two or three of them in the party they literally tear us apart, embarrass us, and screw us over with the public, again and again.
“Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty”
Kyle
That's a bridge too far fo me!
AceInTX Wednesday, May 13th at 8:52PM EDT (link)House Conservatives Fund
Michael Williams for Senate
Toomey US Senate
SarahPAC
but it is tactical
kyle8 Wednesday, May 13th at 8:56PM EDT (link)if you believe in your convictions you have to do whatever it takes. right now let me set this straight. the main enemy of the conservative movement is NOT the democratic party, it is the failed country club leadership of the Republican party.
I am not saying you do this for every candidate you don’t like, But I am saying you do it for dyed in the wool lefties like Crist.
“Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty”
Kyle
preference for Crist to remain Gov
JLenardDetroit Wednesday, May 13th at 3:12PM EDT (link)I have said that too…. alot is/has being/been said in this very active thread…
1. Crist has just had the Gov post handed to him (more or less), even done so by some of the same folks here that really didn’t want him as the first choice for that post either. So he was good enough to settle for as Gov but not Senator - OK.
2. If he is indeed a RINO as some are portraying, then why would they want him Gov?!?!? Why, because he is better than the alternative, of course, which is the whole argument about voting for him for Senate if he does come out of the Primary as the winner. — 2.B — The other side of this is that most of us were willing to jump up and down for Palin, though SHE wasn’t in the Gov long either but would have been happy to see her leave for VP or Senate (with the remote possibilities that chance was, not going to go over all that again).
Is it wrong for me to point out BOTH SIDES? I’m in this whole meandering thing because I can and do see points from both sides, which means no matter who I acknowledge I get hate-mail from the others
3. Neil, bs, and I are - seem to be getting the heat for - saying work for the best Primary candidate but support the winner - we must help them. Loyalty is a two way street. If we have a staring contest with the more Liberal side of the Party over these things WE ALL LOSE.
4. We want those in the Leadership we don’t like to stay out of the Primaries, but those who bring prestige and/or money we like we certainly wouldn’t rebuke. (double-standard?) Yes? I know, I know, I know, I am frustrated by it all too. —- 4.B. —- However, the Primaries are NOT just about the Primary - they allow spending on/as “getting to know the candidate” (though it can be said people in FL already know Crist, the other guy is the one that needs the Primary as the “get to know me” strategy/lead-in) as a lead up and hopefully momentum to/for the General Election. And the way I understand it Crist has a ton of dough and doesn’t need the Party or any GOP committees for it - and that is probably some GOP people want him - he has the war-chest already!?!?!? Again, not the best way to choose a Candidate, but I believe it is in their thinking!?!?
5. Is again that do we sit-it-out or still hold our nose and vote but NOT provide much real support to help win the election, hence giving it away to the Democrats.
6. I am FINALLY seeing some details (confirms many of my suspicions, but I wanted to hear/see some specifics) from folks about why they are against Crist, rather than just “he’s a RINO” (which is about enough for me, but I want to know points why he should be known as a RINO)….
Aaron, you are convinced he would be a RINO (defect often from Rep. Party Platform) rather than be a Red-Dog (disagree, but, at least mostly, provide a loyal Republican vote when push comes to shove)???? Again, I do NOT need someone to be with me even 75% if I know they will come around when the tough vote is needed AGAINST the Democrats rather than… you know….. His (Crist) support of the Stimulus (again, gives me great pause) and seems to be the biggest contention against him in that if he were in the Senate he would have been a Snow, Collins, or disreSpecter - I’m not convinced he would have gone that far as others are quick to say it is a given. He was certainly willing, as a Governor, to say - yeah, I’ll take some Federal handouts - that is NOT in dispute at all.
I have not been and do not see this as an all or nothing discussion…. People can be with me in part on some points and not on others….. But because I give Crist some slack, I don’t seem to get any
(RS:Help) (JLD) (Hollyweird) (Brain-deads) (SPIN-cycle) (Obamaocare) (Party of kNOw) (Conservatism) (TEApeats) (respectful) (Reco) (Quotes) (removeRINOs.com) (RSmas)
+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
I understand where you are coming from JLenard..
Aaron Gardner Wednesday, May 13th at 3:24PM EDT (link)It is a fie line to ride…but the reality is Crist as governor is limited to his state right now…Crist in the Senate is much more personal power for him and national influence…I don’t think he should be trusted with that considering his record. He didn’t do anything to push drilling of the coasts of Florida….nothing effective at least. He hasn’t done anything economically that would be consider fiscally advantageous, at least not to my knowledge…so with that i don’t want him as Senator but I can stand him as the more limited Governor.
Then in the general things just change…you support the party where and how you can, and each person has to find their own comfort level.
Aaron’s Archive
conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
well reasoned, IMO, and therefore... well... reasonable
JLenardDetroit Wednesday, May 13th at 4:18PM EDT (link)I just need to see more about/from Rubio to get a comfort level on whether I think he might be able to win a General Election fight?!?! Any word on the potential Democrat opponents? that would/does matter?? Those are the ONLY things that have me from fully committing to your position(s) in these matters but have been heavily leaning that way from the start.
Again, my willingness to give Crist ANY slack, has meant that I haven’t been getting any
I”m being treated, in some cases, as if I’m trying to fast-track him to the next Presidential nomination. People are reading into my willingness to discuss all aspects as a 100% PASS/FAIL (which made me think and have gone back and added a section on that near the end of the Be respectful, or be banned Diary.
It is IMPOSSIBLE for people to remember other stands people have made. Like my standing for Toomey vs. Specter, if they remembered that they might give me a tad more slack. I want more Conservatives in any/all positions of the GOP and as our candidates - that often gets lost (or tossed out the window) when I make just one “I’m willing to consider” point - bam, duck and cover
lol
(RS:Help) (JLD) (Hollyweird) (Brain-deads) (SPIN-cycle) (Obamaocare) (Party of kNOw) (Conservatism) (TEApeats) (respectful) (Reco) (Quotes) (removeRINOs.com) (RSmas)
+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
JLenard....it's all about relationships..
Aaron Gardner Wednesday, May 13th at 4:28PM EDT (link)A lot of people just comment here or just write diaries…some of us actually try to make relationships where we take the whole into account.
It is what it is….I try to limit my disdain for the newbie trolls and the outright morons…no offense to trolls or morons….;^)
Aaron’s Archive
conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
there-in is the rub of online-ism
JLenardDetroit Wednesday, May 13th at 5:12PM EDT (link)No relationships… we do not see one another… we never really get to know one another…. I sure wish I could get to the GA gathering….
All that about mood and tone that doesn’t always get conveyed properly or interpreted right….. we don’t get to know each others background well enough and that leads to assumptions… etc…. etc…. etc….. guess I should consider putting a brief note on these points in the respect Diary too — or someone adding it as a comment
hint, hint, hint, 
lol
There are a few I’m coming to know and greatly respect, trust, etc…. and I count you among them. Of course it doesn’t mean I won’t beat up on one of your points occasionally,
lol - as we’ve discussed, it’s about the points not the personalities.
Take care my friend
(RS:Help) (JLD) (Hollyweird) (Brain-deads) (SPIN-cycle) (Obamaocare) (Party of kNOw) (Conservatism) (TEApeats) (respectful) (Reco) (Quotes) (removeRINOs.com) (RSmas)
+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
I will admit it
kyle8 Wednesday, May 13th at 2:34PM EDT (link)I don’t have a problem with Democrats winning elections if it means they will get the blame for when liberal ideas fail.
I have a big problem with liberal Republicans because it muddies the water and leaves conservatives holding the bag when liberal ideas fail.
The big for instance is how so many people actually beleive that the current economic crises was caused by a failure of the free market, just because Bush was a republican who gave lip service to free markets. They don’t know or care to understand the roll played by The community Reinvestment Act, Sarbannes-Oxley, or Mark to Market accounting.
The average person just knows Bush was president, republicans are for free markets, therefore free markets failed.
That has gone on long enough and I don’t want it anymore. We are FAR FAR better off in the long run (maybe not too long the way the obama administration is screwing up). If we are the party of conservatism, period, and they are the party of liberalism.
“Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty”
Kyle
Democrats getting blame for Failures, are you serious?
JLenardDetroit Wednesday, May 13th at 3:31PM EDT (link)Democrats getting the complete blame for How Obama’s FAILURES are the country’s SUCCESSES - since we have to spell it out — that would be nice, BUT WE KNOW DARN WELL…. That the MSM will spin it as Republican obstructionism and/or sabotage and brain-dead Democrats and far too many Moderates will buy that…. YOU KNOW IT!!!! They will NOT get the blame!
(RS:Help) (JLD) (Hollyweird) (Brain-deads) (SPIN-cycle) (Obamaocare) (Party of kNOw) (Conservatism) (TEApeats) (respectful) (Reco) (Quotes) (removeRINOs.com) (RSmas)
+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
Crist is anti SoCon and actively campaigned with Obama for the porkulous bill...he's a one legged republican at best!
AceInTX Wednesday, May 13th at 12:58PM EDT (link)and the party needs to stay out of the frigging primary!
House Conservatives Fund
Michael Williams for Senate
Toomey US Senate
SarahPAC
Will look forward to your analysis...
antisocial Wednesday, May 13th at 12:42AM EDT (link)I will point out my reasons for being against Crist:
1>He is not fiscally responsible
2>He “Campaigned” for Growthulus package with Obama!!!
3>Supports Cap and Trade.
4>Believes in Government Control of healthcare. At least he has shown he is certainly a vulnerable vote.
All of them against the very grain of GOP. Why would somebody not vote for a democrat on those positions instead of Charlie Crist? I think Dan and Erick got this right.
Take care of your health… Again will look forward to your analysis
No you can’t - Moe Lane
——————————
The Emperor has no clothes!!!
——————————
Republicans who lost the Crap-and-Raid fight in the House -
Mary Bomo Mac (CA-45)
Mike Castle (DE)
Mark Kirk (IL-10)
Frank A. LoBiondo (NJ-02)
Chris Smith (NJ-04)
Leonard Lance (NJ-07)
John M. McHugh (NY-23)
Dave Reichert (WA-08)
I think you just provided the analysis I need! - nt
Mike gamecock DeVine Wednesday, May 13th at 10:50AM EDT (link)Mike DeVine’s Examiner.com, Charlotte Observer and The Minority Report columns
“One man with courage makes a majority.” - Andrew Jackson
Right! He is a Democrat in disguise
kyle8 Wednesday, May 13th at 10:55AM EDT (link)Haven’t we suffered enough at their hands? If the conservative loses then at least let a Democrat be identified with all of those horrible issues that will sink our economy.
“Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty”
Kyle
Yes, I am persuaded - I can't stomach Crist - nt
Mike gamecock DeVine Wednesday, May 13th at 12:05PM EDT (link)Mike DeVine’s Examiner.com, Charlotte Observer and The Minority Report columns
“One man with courage makes a majority.” - Andrew Jackson
He will also Vote For Crap & Trade Global Warming Tax.
rcov092 Tuesday, May 12th at 7:39PM EDT (link)n/t
“Not One Red Dime for the NRSC or NRCC till they stop trying to elect liberals”
Join the RedState Strike Force
That is reason enough not to support him
izoneguy Tuesday, May 12th at 7:40PM EDT (link)n/t
“When the government fears the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny.”
Thomas Jefferson
Barack Obama had all of the above as well
Right Reason Tuesday, May 12th at 8:47PM EDT (link)We were so STUPID for supporting tha guy McCain!
Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts.
- Winston Churchill
No, no we weren't (nt)
Neil Stevens Tuesday, May 12th at 8:48PM EDT (link)Want to run for conservatives? Give.
There Is No Crisis
Missed the Point
Right Reason Tuesday, May 12th at 9:16PM EDT (link)Notice what was missing from ajgop’s list of qualifications? How about ANYTHING dealing with what he stood for. As though that were some sort of an afterthought.
Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts.
- Winston Churchill
In the primary, you vote for the ideal candidate
bs Tuesday, May 12th at 10:15PM EDT (link)In the general, you vote for the best candidate that remains.
Decorum is fo’ suckas
and failure to do so, sitting out
JLenardDetroit Tuesday, May 12th at 10:31PM EDT (link)yields the worst of the candidates getting elected…. many of us seem to agree on that point. Glad someone else (beside me) decided to join me in Neils defense
lol
Some cling to the PRIMARY argument only as if the General Election matters nothing if their first choice wasn’t the Primary winner. I will never grasp their willingness to allow (concede/surrender) victory to the worst of the Democrat lot.
(RS:Help) (JLD) (Hollyweird) (Brain-deads) (SPIN-cycle) (Obamaocare) (Party of kNOw) (Conservatism) (TEApeats) (respectful) (Reco) (Quotes) (removeRINOs.com) (RSmas)
+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
Still doesn't refute my point
Right Reason Wednesday, May 13th at 9:01AM EDT (link)Barack Obama had everything ajgop says that Crist has. So, assuming he supported McCain, why did he do so?
Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts.
- Winston Churchill
and keep the party out of open primaries! nt
AceInTX Wednesday, May 13th at 8:54PM EDT (link)House Conservatives Fund
Michael Williams for Senate
Toomey US Senate
SarahPAC
Neil's right.
bs Tuesday, May 12th at 8:53PM EDT (link)Now if we supported him in the primary (which most here didn’t), we could have been considered stupid. But supporting him in the general was absolutely the right thing to do.
Decorum is fo’ suckas
depends what you mean? Again, Primary and General are 2 different things....
JLenardDetroit Tuesday, May 12th at 10:39PM EDT (link)If you mean in the Primary…. then I agree if you supported him I do NOT think it was the best choice and very unwise (to stay polite about it), but he was some peoples choice….. Part of the problem with this discussion is that we aren’t touching on the whole need for CLOSED PRIMARIES!!!!! That added to the problem.
If you mean in the General Election, then I wholeheartedly DISAGREE with you.
This is part of the problem with this whole discussion… Some are SOLELY going on and on about Primary. Distinctions between Primary and General Election makes a big difference. It is making some argue with those they actually otherwise agree with… The need for MORE CONSERVATIVE CONTROL in the Republican Party….. and whether sitting-out elections accomplishes anything beyond (conceding/surrendering to and) getting ULTRA-SOCIALISTS elected.
(RS:Help) (JLD) (Hollyweird) (Brain-deads) (SPIN-cycle) (Obamaocare) (Party of kNOw) (Conservatism) (TEApeats) (respectful) (Reco) (Quotes) (removeRINOs.com) (RSmas)
+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
“The first Liberal was Satan” - a Rush caller (other Quotes)
...smart decisions that will begin our road back to becoming the majority party.
mbecker908 Tuesday, May 12th at 10:57PM EDT (link)Heh.
And I’m just thinking about giving up 32+ years of sobriety contemplating on the great things our “majority” status gave us.
* NCLB and a permanent Dept of Education.
* Med Part D.
* No action on social security or other entitlements.
* A complete logjam in the US Senate so conservative judicial nominees sat waiting for a floor vote for 5+ years.
* Handing the bully pulpit over the the minority party on national security and military matters.
* A total lack of control on spending.
* A complete blind eye and unwillingness to fight the federal bureaucracy (Fannie Freddie etal).
I could go on all night but I won’t. Obama is only marginally worse than Bush. Crist is in their mold having never met a government program he didn’t like or a problem that couldn’t be solved with federal (or more federal) money.
Crist can go on a sightseeing tour of the swamp and get eaten by alligators for all I care. And if he could be convinced to take John McCain with him I’d pay for the gas.
LOL...pay for the gas my rear end...
AceInTX Wednesday, May 13th at 8:59PM EDT (link)I’d pay of a first class trip on a private 747 catered by Hooters and pay for their favorite Broad Way musical to be performed for them on their trip to the swamp!
House Conservatives Fund
Michael Williams for Senate
Toomey US Senate
SarahPAC
all true,
kyle8 Wednesday, May 13th at 9:20PM EDT (link)unfortunatly
“Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty”
Kyle
You forgot to explain
Dan McLaughlin Tuesday, May 12th at 11:14PM EDT (link)why punting the Governor’s race is a good idea.
“No compromise with the main purpose, no peace till victory, no pact with unrepentant wrong.” - Winston Churchill
What can we do to get through to these hacks?
redware Tuesday, May 12th at 8:40PM EDT (link)It may be that the only way for conservatives to regain control of the GOP is to let it fail,and then rebuild it.It is eminently clear that the national leadership of the party does not believe that we have the backbone to follow through with our angry blog posts and e-mails.If they were truly listening,John Cornyn and his pals at the NRSC would never have dared to endorse another moderate at the expense of a viable conservative candidate.They believe we will do what we did in ‘08 and surrender our principles again.
And they get away with it because there are so many of us ready to do just that,I read their posts in these diaries all the time.Support the conservative challenger,but if they lose then be a good soldier and vote for the moderate in the general.And just how has that benefitted us?It hasn’t!All we get are party hacks and weasels who would sell their political souls for an uptick in their latest approval rating.They abandon us on every crucial vote that comes before them.Crist will do what so many moderates do-he will criss-cross Florida touting himself as the pragmatic conservative alternative(I heard tripe that so many times from Lindsey Grahamnesty here in South Carolina I wanted to find the dang closet he is hiding in and drag him out to face the truth of what he really is.)Then if he is elected,you won’t hear the word conservative uttered by the man for six years.
How stupid can we be?The election of moderate Republicans does not advance our conservative principles.It advances the ability of the progressive-socialist agenda.It insures the continued dominance of unprincipled leaderdship at the national level.It prevents us from increasing the leverage we need to advance our agenda via the GOP vehicle.How long will it take for us to stop deluding ourselves?They know we will ultimately support their choices,begrudgingly opening our wallets and casting our votes.And they will snicker about us behind their cloakroom doors and rightfully call us fools.And we will come to this site to weep, wail, and gnash our teeth.And keep on losing.There is but one way to get through to these unprincipled hacks-let them fail.Close our wallets to all but principled conservative candidates,and if you are unfortunate enough to reside in a state where a liberal or moderate republican is on the ballot-stay home!Will we be blamed by the leadership and the elitist punditry?Of course we will!But their stranglehold on the GOP will be over-and we will once again have a platform from which to advance a conservative agenda for America.
You want to know what you do
Neil Stevens Tuesday, May 12th at 8:47PM EDT (link)Step one is to start going to your local party meetings.
Then you get to know who’s in charge of your local party.
Then you find out who’s good and who’s bad.
Then you work to replace the bad guys with more good guys.
Then you do the same for local candidates and officeholders.
If enough RSers do this in enough places, then the party starts to change from the ground up. And that’s the only way to get meaningful, long-term change.
Want to run for conservatives? Give.
There Is No Crisis
Neil thanks for the guidance :) nt
mom2oneson Tuesday, May 12th at 11:31PM EDT (link)Long way before we hit bottom....
Stephen Halsey Tuesday, May 12th at 9:41PM EDT (link)The NRSC decision to preemptively endorse a RINO like Christ is continuing proof of how out of touch the GOP is with their constituents and everyday middle America. I can’t say that I’m surprised after contacting my congresscritter’s office this week who is Eric Cantor. After patiently listening to my weekly rant questioning why there is not continuing daily rebukes by GOP leadership of the Marxism being shoved down our throat daily by Chairman Obamao, this poor staffer directed me to the NCNA website which, after spending time there, complete with Jeb Bush and Juan McShame as ‘National Leaders’ appears to be nothing more than the same lame people and the same lame watered down Democrap-lite that got us into this mess in the first place. Throwing the weight of the party establishment behind Crist so early is further demonstration of just how out of touch the party establishment is with Americans and how they really aren’t listening on these ‘listening tours’.
And it’s is yet another example of how this party has not hit bottom yet. Being a part of a family with several recovering alcoholics, there is no recovery until you hit bottom. We simply aren’t there yet.
What will it take? 150 in the House and 25 in the Senate? The US officially declaring bankruptcy? Wake up Cornyn. As I say to my kids, ‘turn on your ears and listen’. We’re speaking loud and clear. Either support principled conservatives or continue to see your party numbers dwindle.
Hit hard. Hit fast. Hit often.
http://theadmiralsbridge.blogspot.com
http://twitter.com/stephen_halsey
You called and lowered me
civil_truth Wednesday, May 13th at 12:06AM EDT (link)I’ve been writing 150 H and 30 S as the bottom - you’ve bid for 25 Senators.
Anybody want to lower to 125 in the House?
And Rightly So!
Let's send em all home first and sart out with a fresh batch after Saint Barak has proven what we all know all by himself! nt
AceInTX Wednesday, May 13th at 9:02PM EDT (link)House Conservatives Fund
Michael Williams for Senate
Toomey US Senate
SarahPAC
Looks like the listening tour is not working....
antisocial Wednesday, May 13th at 12:58AM EDT (link)NRSC doesn’t get it. Neither does NCNA.
No you can’t - Moe Lane
——————————
The Emperor has no clothes!!!
——————————
Republicans who lost the Crap-and-Raid fight in the House -
Mary Bomo Mac (CA-45)
Mike Castle (DE)
Mark Kirk (IL-10)
Frank A. LoBiondo (NJ-02)
Chris Smith (NJ-04)
Leonard Lance (NJ-07)
John M. McHugh (NY-23)
Dave Reichert (WA-08)
so true
kyle8 Wednesday, May 13th at 7:29AM EDT (link)so true
“Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty”
Kyle
Time Magazine thinks we need Crist
Finrod Wednesday, May 13th at 1:10AM EDT (link)While the title is accurate enough — Crist’s Senate Bid: Too Moderate for Florida Republicans? — I’m pretty sure that Time Magazine doesn’t have our best interest in mind; therefore take these paragraphs from the end and reverse it to get our best course:
Note the attempt to link him to Reagan, who was the conservative to Ford’s moderate in 1976. Time is more honest when it points out that Crist has never ran for re-election in his career; he just keeps jumping to higher office.
What we need is Rubio, not the RINO Crist.
—
Finrod’s First Law of Bandwidth:
A picture may be worth a thousand words, but it takes the bandwidth of ten thousand.
Note to self:
Karina Wednesday, May 13th at 4:36AM EDT (link)do the opposite of what Time mag wants and the country wins. If more people took that advice, we’d be way ahead!
Stop confusing me with the facts, I’m making up my own imagination. ~My grandmother who voted for Obama
That's like N.Y.Times endorsing McCain in primaries.
penguin2 Wednesday, May 13th at 4:50AM EDT (link)Bad, bad sign. The liberal rags couldn’t know what we want or need. Aren’t we all foreigners to them? They think we come from another planet and have to be assimilated into their way of thinking and what better way to do that then pick our leaders for us?
Resistance to tyrants is obedience to God.
Benjamin Franklin
yep! like a third world thugocracy
David Hinz Wednesday, May 13th at 4:59AM EDT (link)where they pick both candidates from their own acceptable list, they get to frame all of the news, they count the votes, and then they tell you what a fair election it really was…
….and of course, the election is verified by former president Carter as fair…
The Minority Report — The HinzSight Report — TMRB.tv — MFOB “Miss Tagart, do you know the hallmark of the second-rater? It’s resentment of another man’s achievement.”
That says it all doesn't it?
AceInTX Wednesday, May 13th at 9:04PM EDT (link)If the NYT thinks he’s what we need….doesn’t that tell everyone here something?
House Conservatives Fund
Michael Williams for Senate
Toomey US Senate
SarahPAC
Correction: Time Magazine nt
AceInTX Wednesday, May 13th at 9:05PM EDT (link)House Conservatives Fund
Michael Williams for Senate
Toomey US Senate
SarahPAC
anytime the oldstream media is telling US that we need someone...
JadedByPolitics Wednesday, May 13th at 9:09PM EDT (link)THROW THE BUM OUT!
Whoever has his enemy at his mercy &
does not destroy him is his own enemy
So long as incumbents and rich condidates don't need the Party,
Achance Wednesday, May 13th at 10:11AM EDT (link)the elected leadership is going to be the “get along, go along” type. The Republican Party has little meaningful “ground game” other than GOTV. Precinct organization is sadly lacking, district organization in many places, and in some states there isn’t even an effective state organization. You can’t tell me there aren’t some districts in even the Bluest NE states that we can’t build powerful Republican enclaves with which the communists must compromise.
The Republican Party functions on a “who you know” basis. If you establish yourself as acceptable to those in power, you become a part of the power group and are supported by the Party for jobs, contracts, appointments, or as a candidate for elected office. It is the rarest elected or appointed official who is a rock-ribbed conservative or a rock-ribbed anything for that matter. Once you actually hold office, your political life is predicated solely on the art of the possible. If you know that the only thing you have to answer for back home is having enough money to get yourself re-elected, most anything is possible and elections are won in the National and state capitals rather than back in the districts and states.
It is this structural infirmity that keeps conservatives/Republicans in exile if not outright hunted to extinction. That’s why I constantly argue for conservatives and Republicans to learn something about the nuts and bolts of running a Party and a government and implementing programs in office. Philisophical discussions about what a conservative is and who is a conservative are simply mental masturbation.
Very, very few people give a tinker’s damn about the fine philosophical points so many here like to argue. Sure, a majority will self-identify as “conservative,” but conservative relative to what is a meaningful question. I assure you that a “conservative” in Alaska has some very different ideas on State spending than a “conservative” in Texas. All you have to do with regard to Florida is look at the demographics; a dramatically aging population dependent on SS and medicare or badly damaged retirement savings. Yeah, you’re going to win with them by advocating eliminating departments and slashing entitlement programs! I suspect Crist is popular because he seems to be a competent administator and his government runs along uneventfully. That inspires confidence and if you inspire confidence, you get elected and re-elected.
GWB and the Congressional Republicans didn’t bring this Party to the brink of the abyss because of their stand on issues or because of not being enough or being too much of a conservative. They took us to the brink of ruin because they totally lost the public’s confidence with what was perceived, too often rightly, corruption and incompetence. Yes, I know, much of it was Democrat propaganda, but like any good lie, there was some truth there. Add that to the fact that neither the Administration nor the Congressional leadership lifted ONE FINGER to try to defend itself or its policies because they felt that they needed to be “collegial” with their “friends” on the other side. They worry about their “friends” in the other Party because they know that as incumbents, many of them rich incumbents, they don’t have to worry about the folks back in the district. If we are to get out of the wilderness, we need to make candidates and especially incumbents worry about the folks back in the district and state more than they worry about DC and statehouse lobbyists.
In Vino Veritas
Note That Everything You Just Said Applies Equally To Democrat Politicians
IJB Wednesday, May 13th at 12:48PM EDT (link)There’s a reason the DKos’ers and DU types always get so frustrated - it’s not like Dem politicians are any more ideological than GOP politicians.
Basically it boils down to the type of character defects you tend to find in those who get their rocks off on running for office. The political class truly is a class all unto itself and separate from everybody else - it’s all about the ‘ego boost’ to those types: nothing more. Like actors and musicians, what they grave most is the ‘high’ of “winning” the adulation of the crowd (in their case, by winning elections, and getting legislation with their name on it passed).
But, by and large, they don’t really stand for anything at their core - after all, people who really do stand for something have no real interest in running for office. (Translation: “Public service” is for *suckers*!)
Only if you're honest is it for suckers.
Achance Thursday, May 14th at 10:10AM EDT (link)I’ve had plenty of time to reflect on how stupid I was for not sticking my hand in the cookie jar one of the many times that I could have. I’d have a nice confidential numbered account somewhere and wouldn’t be worring about the Communist in Chief deciding my retiree health insurance is imputed income or deciding to nationalize all employer retirement plans or worring about when the guy from ACORN is going to show up and tell me how many families will now be living in my house.
In Vino Veritas
Maybe Republicans do need this fight-
redware Thursday, May 14th at 6:01AM EDT (link)Now that the NRSC has endorsed Crist,followed by endorsements from McCain,Graham and Martinez,will we see some conservatives who would like to be President take a stand as well?This could be a great chance for conservatives to show who is really the boss in the GOP.If Rubio wins the message that will be sent to the national leadership will be clear-you are out of touch with the base of the party and you may be next to go.So how about it Sarah,Mike,Bobby,Mark ,Jeb and Mitt?Since the moderates have injected themselves into a state race,so can you.You want our support?Let’s see who is more than just a conservative in name only.