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Yes, She Can? ON Sarah Palin and 2012

Matthew Dowd Looks Ahead

Bush pollster Matthew Dowd looks at why he thinks it’s possible – not likely, mind you, but possible – for Sarah Palin to win the White House in 2012. (H/T) Along the way he reminds us that John Kerry was one of the few challengers in memory to lose a race against an incumbent that may actually have been winnable:

Gallup polls over the past 60 years show that no president with an approval rating under 47 percent has won reelection, and no president with an approval rating above 51 percent has lost reelection. (George W. Bush’s approval rating in the weeks before the 2004 election hovered around 50 percent.) The 2012 election will be primarily about our current president and whether voters are satisfied with the country’s direction.

Who the Republican candidate is, and his or her qualifications and abilities, will matter only if Obama’s approval rating is between 47 and 51 percent going into the fall of 2012. Interestingly, in the latest Gallup poll Obama’s approval rating was at a precarious 49 percent.

As an aside, historically, the single biggest factor suppressing a president’s approval rating is a high unemployment rate. That’s bad news for the Democrats in the short run, as most economists expect double-digit unemployment to persist through Election Day 2010 (economists are not always right about these things, but that’s what they’re seeing now). Some natural improvement in the economy is already underway (even with some downward revisions, GDP grew by 2.8% last quarter) by natural operation of the business cycle, but it’s unlikely that Obama will be able to resist doing more to interfere with that, like jacking up taxes. My guess is that he’s going to end up just openly adding a lot of people to the federal payroll to try to reduce unemployment.

Dowd also notes that Obama is already the most partisanly polarizing president in recent years, an astounding accomplishment given the rancor that surrounded his precedessors:

The gap between Obama’s approval rating among Democrats and among Republicans is nearly 70 percentage points — a higher partisan divide than either Bill Clinton or George W. Bush experienced. Obama’s agenda and actions this year, and some mistakes, have solidified this divide.

Anyway, getting back to Palin, I’m not sure Dowd really put much effort into making the case that she can win over independents in a general election beyond the obvious observation that if Obama’s in enough trouble, he can be beaten (there are counterexamples to this in lower-level races: I recall Gray Davis’ approval rating was around 24% when he was re-elected in 2002). It seems to me that if you think that Obama will mostly win or lose the election himself, you either (1) pick the person you’d most like to see be president regardless of electability (that would argue for somebody like Mitch Daniels or Haley Barbour) and/or (2) pick the lowest-risk candidate (that may be Tim Pawlenty). It would not counsel picking the most electrifying, polarizing, controversial, high-risk candidate in the field.

Dowd’s suggestions for Palin’s path to follow are a mixed bag. It’s strange for him to criticize her for too many public appearances after she spent months doing little in public view but updating her Facebook page – and contradicts his next point about getting out more – but I agree that at some point she has to start doing serious, substantive appearances to sell people on her grasp of the issues. Like it or not, even if voters don’t understand complex issues themselves, they do want to know that the president does, and they will need reassurance if Palin runs that she genuinely knows what she’s getting into. That may be doubly true if the impression continues to solidify that Obama has screwed up as a result of his inexperience. I’d add to his list that if she wants to run, or even to have an ongoing role in national poilitics, she’s sooner or later going to need to find people outside Alaska that she can trust – policy advisers, people to help her organize and communicate, etc. My advice, at least, is one of the lessons I took from watching Bush: pick people who are loyal to the conservative movement and its goals, not people who are mostly personally loyal. In the long run, loyalty to ideas is more enduring and a better guarantee of quality work.

Personally, I haven’t picked a horse to back yet (I’m probably more enthused about Daniels than anyone right now, and I use “enthused” advisedly), and continue to caution against others choosing up teams before November 2010. I still go back and forth on the two related key questions: do you try to beat Obama with a candidate who comes at him from above (i.e., a more sober, experienced and modest leader), or below (i.e., a fiery populist who rebels against his desire to use government to change America rather than the other way around)? The former would be likely if the election’s mainly about foreign affairs, the latter if it’s a rebellion against Big Government. Palin is obviously in the latter camp. Do you confront his pop celebrity status with a candidate who exudes some glamor or excitement of his/her own (again: Palin), or do you try to counter-program with a candidate who is deliberately dull and stolid and promises less drama and fewer grand ambitions? The available personnel will probably be the biggest driver in the decision anyway, but how people want to answer those questions will go along way towards deciding whether Palin, if she runs, has a chance of being the nominee.

COMMENTS

  • http://dezignworx-ae.com tsquare

    Dowd tell you what he thinks Sarah should do to make the Beltway folks feel… better… that she was listening to them.

    She won’t do it.

    IF…if… Palin runs she will run against the media and against the inside the beltway elites. The next GOP candidate running against Obama will try and do this. Palin is in a very good position to run this way.

    Can she? Hell yes

    Will she? Who knows…

    • malbis

      I really don’t think that Sarah Palin has a ghost of a chance of being nominated in 2012 as the head of the Republican ticket–and I don’t think that she’d willingly take the VP slot again after what happened last time.

      However, here’s a scenario to make everyone on both sides of the aisle in DeeCee shudder. Sarah’s popularity continues to grow, poll numbers of both Democrat and Republican members of Congress continues to stay at historic low numbers, and the sort of dissatisfaction that led to Hoffman running the anointed GOP candidate out of the race in NY-23 continues to seethe.

      Glenn Beck fans the flames of the Tea Party movement and that conservative unrest with his next book on local political activism, and his series of “Conventions” across America–and the August, 2010 DC rally and September 11 “March on Washington” he already has scheduled to start a “new political movement” features Sarah Palin as main speaker.

      And then, after the GOP 2012 Presidential candidate is firmed up–Sarah Palin announces that she is going to run as an independent because neither party represents core American conservative values. And she announces that Glenn Beck has accepted her offer to run as Vice President with her.

      Possible, yes? Likely, no.

      At least, not now. But I’m not so sure it will look quite as unlikely this time next year. And who would have thought that the situation in NY-23 was likely to happen even a few months before it happened.

      From the 1940 feature film Ghost Breakers, starring the late, great, Bob Hope and Paulette Goddard:

      Scientist: “It?s worse than horrible, because a Zombie has no will of his own. You see them some times, walking around blindly with dead eyes, following orders, not knowing what they do, not caring.”

      Bob Hope: “You mean, like Democrats?”

      • SteveLA

        For the following reasons:

        Palin is much taller Ross Perot
        Palin has much smaller ears than Ross Perot
        Palin does not have Ross Perot’s money
        Palin can’t say “Let me finish” with that same nasal twang

        Before one of the usual suspects have a cow, it’s a joke.

        • malbis

          …and I myself said that it wasn’t a likely scenario. You left one thing out of your list:

          Palin (and Beck) could very well pick up on the same anti-incumbent , neither Party gives a hoot about us, we’re being taxed too much and the economy is going to hell in a handbasket sentiment that made Ross Perot a viable third party candidate and catapulted him to the national stage.

          The real difference here is that Palin — and Beck — are already on the national (and international) stage. Palin — and Beck — can handle themselves in front of a microphone, a camera and an audience (Beck especially). And as NY-23 showed to anyone with an ounce of the “common sense” that Beck always talks about, there is a lot of voter dissatisfaction out there.

          Think….Ross Perot with a lot more media savvy. And a lot more attractiveness.

          From the 1940 feature film Ghost Breakers, starring the late, great, Bob Hope and Paulette Goddard:

          Scientist: “It?s worse than horrible, because a Zombie has no will of his own. You see them some times, walking around blindly with dead eyes, following orders, not knowing what they do, not caring.”

          Bob Hope: “You mean, like Democrats?”

          • SteveLA

            malbis

            NY 23 had no primary, selected to run not elected.

            Let’s wait until this fall and see who actually wins a Republican primary in the district before drawing too many conclusions. I predict that Doug Hoffman will not be the nominee as a result of real primary.

          • Achance

            to elect WJC. Having been on the receiving end of Republican/conservative/libertarian fratricide a time or two, I don’t recomend it.

          • Dan McLaughlin

            and it’s not gonna happen.

          • AKSteveB

            thinks it is best for Sarah to run as a third party candidate she will, the country be damned. Even those who like her must have at least learned by now that loyalty is not her best quality.

          • Leopard1996

            It was freshman year in college, and I knew Clinton was a POS, but Bush I also pissed me off as too much of a squish, and Perot made sense to me at the time.

            I agree, that as a Libertarian, you can’t sit here and say that the 10 -20% that I don’t agree with makes me vote against the person that I would agree with 80 – 90% of the time.

    • jakehalsted

      I could care less about what she stands for…it’s Sarah’s butt I really like! Go Sarah! Woo hoo!

      • mschmitt
      • Richard Mullins

        because I’m not quite getting it.

      • JadedByPolitics

        or this leftist WOMAN HATING TROLL would be GONE by now!

        It is always so easy to pick the TROLLS AKA LIBERALS out because they demean women and yet there are STUPID, PATHETIC liberal women who follow them over a cliff. It will be Sarah Palins entree into politics that will spin what feminism is on its head and change the dynamics for those old bitter bitties in the NOW organization.

        I as a woman am proud that the new face of FEMINISM is a Conservative and it KILLS you doesn’t it TROLL….doesn’t it? I hope you have nightmares of the juxtaposition of Conservatism and Feminism and would wake up in a sweat SCREAMING….now go home to kos and “pretend” to give notice to women because there is some dirty disgusting liberal woman ready to believe you!

        • penguin2

          Finally, someone we can tell they are truly losers and have no idea what they are talking about. Don’t worry Halstead, someone will be along and put you out of your misery.

          Your’re right Jaded, the Left hates a strong Conservative woman, because they really represent what the word feminine was meant to mean.

          • http://www.ssce.net/Web-Articles/Web-articles-indexed-authors.html#authors-l JLenardDetroit

            I paid dearly to purchase that Little Rascal ;-) lol

            Get it?!?!? ahhhhh never mind ;-) lol couldn’t resist. The degree of stupidity I’ll stoop to for a bad pun often even amazes me!

            Palin and EITs are Troll bait they just cannot help but bite upon.

    • sharonh

      Will she? No, she doesn’t really doesn’t like to work or think–it makes her head hurt.

      • http://www.hakubi.us/ Neil Stevens

        Don’t be so openly envious of her ability to succeed without losing her femininity.

  • Wing Zero

    I wonder how long it will be before Yosemite Sam, I mean Achance, will be in on this post ripping Palin. My guess is within 11 posts.

    • http://dezignworx-ae.com tsquare

      The over and under is 11 I’ll take “over”

      The holiday don’t you know…

      • Wing Zero
    • Section9

      But he was absolutely right about her relationship with the Alaska Republican Party. There was none to speak of. And while Art, I suspect, may not lay as much of the responsibility for that at the foot of the deeply flawed Alaska G.O.P. as he should, he is absolutely correct in pointing out that Palin made her own bed with regard to her relationships with Alaska legislative Republicans.

      It was Palin’s responsibility to lead the Alaska G.O.P. after 2006 and mend the wounds of the Ricky Reuderich affair. She did not do that. She was too busy trying to get AGIA passed and that ethics law done. These are commendable, but without your own party to back you up when the chips are down, at some point, you are done.

      We can make fun of the Jaybird all we want, but at some point, one even needs Jay Ramras in your corner.

      When she came back from the Campaign, she had none, no, zero, zip, nada allies in the Alaska GOP (well, some in the State Senate, but they were the legislative “Minority”). So when the State Democratic Party decided to take her out using her own ethics law, she had no allies to fall back on (I always suspect, along with others, that the national Dems were involved with this effort, but that doesn’t alter the fact that Palin was on her own, and shouldn’t have been.).

      I suspect this is a lesson she has learned the hard way, and will apply on the national level.

      • Achance

        http://www.redstate.com/achance/2009/11/23/a-non-partisan-look-at-sarah-palin/#comment-2551

        She has lots of political talent of the getting elected sort, the governing sort, not so much.

        • Section9

          At worst, I think she can be accused of being a “politician”.

          The advantage you have is that you’ve been around her more. I look forward to reading that volume.

      • Warrior

        Yes, but weren’t the Alaskan Repubs as corrupt as the Dems? Isn’t that why she wanted to pass the ethics law? How do you get the support of people against whom you are passing an ethics law?

        Please accept these questions in the spirit they are asked. I like Palin a lot. However, I want to avoid a Ross Perot moment at any cost.

        Achance, if you’re reading this, plese respond as well…

        • Achance

          Most of you would love to have politicians as “corrupt” as the ones she had a hissy fit about. Randy was misbehaving, but it could and should have been handled inside the administration. What I believe happened when the Deputy Commissioner, the Department’s Ethics Supervisor, came to talk to her about her charges against Randy is that she jumped to the conclusion that since he was a friend of Randy’s, she was being kicked to the curb so she blew him off and told him there was no issue. See her account at pgs 96-97 in “Rogue.” I think that whole four or five pages shows how off her perceptions of who was who and who did what were. I’m sorry, but anybody who knows ANYTHING about high levels of government knows you don’t write letters about internal problems unless you just want them on the front page of the newspaper. If you have problem with the political members of an Administration, you discretely go to the boss and whisper, “We have a problem.” She had no responsibliity for ethics issues in AOGCC beyond informing the Department of Administration’s Ethics Supervisor. As far as I know, she never did that. She went outside the chain and up to the COS and the Governor who then sent the issue back down where it belong, at the Deparment. When we tried to deal with it, she said there wasn’t a problem then resigned and played kiss and tell. Most activist Republicans who didn’t throw in with her back then will NEVER forgive her for the damage she did to Murkowski, Ruedrich, Renkes, the AG, and the Republican brand in Alaska.

          Then when you get to the FBI, you find some genuine though small time corruption centered on the private prisons deal that Democrat activist Bill Wiemar tried to put together. Bill is now in jail. Bill is his own very interesting story but for another day. It also involved Democrat appointee Frank Prewitt, Deputy Commissioner of Corrections, later lobbyist for Cornell Corrections who heard the footsteps and turned state’s evidence. I had smelled a rat about some of that and through some circuitous circumstances wound up having a chat with the FBI myself. One legislator got caught red-handed in that one. On the rest, the FBI managed to make convictions on the post hoc, ergo propter hoc fallacy. A legislator took a contribution from Veco/Veco supported certain legislation/That legislator voted for that certain legislation/Therefore, that legislator voted for that legislation because he took a contribution from Veco. Were they tawdry about some of it? Yes, Are some of them not nice guys? Yes. But between the FBI’s leaks and rumor mongering and Sarah’s harping on it, it came to be perceived as something worthy of New Jersey or Louisiana. Concerned citizens in those states would give our “corrupt old boys” good governmetn awards.

          I’m not proud of how some people looked in all this and I simply became disgusted with the “I’ll get mine while the getting is good” attitude that overtook the Murkowski Administration in its waning days. So much so that I simply quit and took my retirement rather than ride it down. But it isn’t the fact that she was working on an ethics bill that got everybody twisted at her. Hell, the Legislature had tried to pass a very comprehensive one a couple of years before but it broke down over a gag provision if you filed one so as to keep people from filing frivilous complaints and making screaming press release for political gain. Bet she wishes that one had passed now! I enjoy the irony of she who came to prominence on her ethics act complaints now whines that she was chased from office by ethics act complaints. There’s some justice there.

          So, there was some penny ante corruption. You can never defend corruption but on the executive branch side, it could and should have been handled inside the Administration and Sarah is the one who most profitted from its not being handled inside. You be the judge.

          • Warrior

            And, as much as I hate to get deeply into recent Alaskan political history, I have to ask about this section of your post:

            “She had no responsibliity for ethics issues in AOGCC beyond informing the Department of Administration?s Ethics Supervisor. As far as I know, she never did that. She went outside the chain and up to the COS and the Governor who then sent the issue back down where it belong, at the Deparment. When we tried to deal with it, she said there wasn?t a problem then resigned and played kiss and tell.”

            Are you saying Murkowski sent it back down to the Department? If so, what happened then?

            And what does it mean when you say, “When she tried to deal with it…”? Do you mean as the Governor? And what did she do?

            And if, as you say, she then denied there was a problem and ran, what was all that “Palin Takes on Alaskan GOP Good Ole Boy Network Over Ethics” we kept reading about for so long?

            And finally, are you saying she purposefully manufactured the “culture of corruption” type meme for political gain by making a stink out of pedestrian malfeasance, or that by incompetence alone she inadvertently caused it by going outside the chain of command, then just tried to capitalize on the whole mess out of rank opportunism?

            I apologize if these are tiresome questions, but you’re right. If I’m going to support her, I guess I need to understand an insider’s take. And few were more inside than you were…

          • Warrior

            “When WE tried to deal with it, she said there wasn?t a problem then resigned and played kiss and tell.?

            So the question should be, how much time elapsed between when the Govenor sent the “issue back down” and her resignation.

            I mean, if Murkowski was govenor, how much time elapsed beteen him sending it back down and her election as Govenor? And what was done “to deal with it”?

          • Achance

            Hope you had a pleasant Thanksgiving too. I did, friends, family, food, and football rather than the RS Palin peeing contest yesterday afternoon and evening.

            I don’t remember exactly but the whole thing couldn’t have been more than a few weeks. Alaska’s government is structured with 14 departments each headed by a Commissioner who is appointed by the Governor and confirmed by the Legislature. Departments are structured into divisions headed by a director. Some departments also semi-independent agencies and boards attached to them administratively so that the semi-independent agency or board can use the department’s infrastructure rather than have its own. Directors report either to a Deputy Commissioner or directly to the Commissioner. Commissioners technically report directly to the Governor but usually report through the Chief of Staff. AOGCC was a semi-independent agency attached to the Department of Administration. It had/has three politically appointed “Commissioners” who head the Agency. While they are called commissioners and are confirmed by the Legislature, their authority is limited to their discrete agency and for infrastructure needs, e.g., budget, finance, personnel, procurement, etc. rely on and are subordinated to the Department to which they are attached. I was a director in the Department of Administration and on the org chart reported to the Deputy Commissioner who was also the Ethics Supervisor for the Department. He is the one she refers to in her book. I was good friends with the Commissioner since we had worked together when he was in the Legisltature so the org chart reporting relationship was more of a formality. Also, neither Deputy Commissioner had any real government experience and the Commissioner had no Executive Branch experience, so I was involved in most anything that came along either on a formal or informal basis. The director of personnel and I were both longtime ‘crats who had designed the personnel and labor relations administration programs for the Administration, so one the other or both of us had some involvement in ANYTHING that was personnel related in the government, not just in the DOA.

            I knew that there had been some improper political stuff going on between the DC and Randy and both the director of personnel and I had had some harsh words along the lines of, “How bad do you want to be on the front page of the ADN?” with the DC. About the same time I heard from either the Commissioner or the DC that Sarah had complained to the Governor’s Office about Randy. I don’t know how long it had been since she had gone to the Governor’s Office about it or exactly who she said what to over there. Within days of my learning that, the DC came to me and laid out the complaints and told me he had been tasked to deal with it. I advised him to do it as formally as we would for a classified, unionized employee so that we could document having dealt with it because these things always come out. I don’t know that he had or ever saw a letter to the Governor from Sarah, but I can’t tell from her accounting in the book exactly when she did that either. We decided that he was going to go interview Sarah and use that interview as the basis for a formal complaint against Randy which we would then investigate and either clear or charge him. He went to Anchorage to see Sarah and when he returned, he told me that Randy and Sarah had talked it over and worked it out and there was no longer a problem.

            Here’s the most charitable explanation I can come up with: the DC was good friends with Randy and had in fact been the Republican Party, and thus Randy’s, attorney in the huge fight over reapportionment after the ’00 Census, when the Democrats, who still had the Governor’s Office, tried to apportion Republicans out of existance. When Sarah saw that the DC, Randy’s friend, was the one handling her complaint, she assumed she had been kicked to the curb and simply clammed up; sort of a precursor of what she says happened in her interview with Katie Couric – she got angry and just didn’t talk. I don’t know that I believe that explanation in either case, but it is plausible. The next we all hear of it is when Sarah resigns and we’re reading about it in the ADN. Suffice it to say that we were VERY unhappy with Sarah Palin.

            My experience with two sets of Republican appointees, Hickel’s and Murkowski’s, is that almost all of them are incredibly paranoid about government and government employees. They don’t know where the light switches and rest rooms are and are so paranoid they won’t ask anybody. Sarah went on and on at the time and in her book about how concerned she was for the integrity of the AOGCC and for its reputations. Well if Sarah had kept her mouth shut about it all, nobody would have known a thing about it and it could have been handled. Seamount was a Democrat appointee there and he might have whispered to somebody, but if it’s coming from the Democrats, it is easy to deal with. At that time, there probably weren’t more than a couple hundred people in Alaska that even knew what the AOGCC was or had a clue what it did

            Did she contrive it? I don’t know. I can, as I did above, come up with an explanation based on ignorance and paranoia. I can also look at her political history and see that she has always picked somebody to be her bad guy and her target to run against. She couldn’t be more predictable if she was quoting Saul Alinsky; she picks somebody and some issue, personalizes the issue to that person and runs against them. She did that to Nick Carney when she was on the Council, to John Stein when she ran for Mayor, and to Ruedrich and Murkowski when she ran for Governor. As I’ve said before, there is a trail of poltically dead bodies of people, mostly who had helped her, that she has vilified on her way up. One of my political mentors told me to always remember that every butt you kicked on the way up, you were probably going to have to kiss on the way down. Well, she seems to have escaped that by bailing on the Governorship and going for the book deal and celebrity – for now.

          • Warrior

            more or less venal than the average ploitician? Say, compared to Murkowski, McCain or Romney for instance?

          • Achance

            I’ve never seen any evidence of it. There were some rumors but with the scrutiny she’s had, there must not be anything to them. She can be influenced all too easily I think; see her pivot from courting former Gov. Hickel and backing the instate gas line to the 180 switch to backing the Canadian route that she’d so criticized Murkowski over. She’s fundamentally an “aginner,” and when she hooked up with Marty Rutherford, she embraced Marty’s ideas about the Canadian route going into her Un-Murkowski act – a deriviative of the Democrats’ “we can do it better” act.

            What she is is totally ruthless and is loyal only to her family and clan; you are an insider or a total outsider. I don’t know the early political history of McCain or Romney very well but as far as I know neither has the trail of bodies behind them that she does. She does have in common with McCain that she made her most noted strides politically by working with the Democrats and against her own Party. He calls it being a maverick, she calls it being a rogue, I call it being disloyal and untrustworthy.

            I don’t know if it is pridefulness or insecurity but she has a special mental file for every perceived slight and holds grudges forever. First you are frozen out and then you feel the cold steel in your ribs – or if you see the freeze out in time, you keep a safe distance from Sarah Palin – I fall into the latter category. She also will not accept any responsibility for anything that goes wrong – a trait she shares with many politicians, however. John Bitney is an experienced legislative hand with a good enough reputation that even after she fired him, he was picked up by the Speaker of the House. Sarah Palin had never worked with the Legislature except in the role of supplicant when she was on the Council and Mayor. But guess who caused all her problems with the Legislature and look at how she is at pains to trash Bitney and blame him in her book.

            And there is a streak of unmodulated nastiness in her. I’ve never had a polical boss that didn’t have a list of people in his/her head that he thought the State would be better off without; I have one myself. If you’re at the top of HR/LR they let you know who they’re interested in and you let them know if it is doable. I know every one of the people who would have been advising the Administration on the Wooten-Monegan Affair and I know every one of them would have told the Administration that it couldn’t fire Wooten and that if he could attach a bad motive, they’d even have trouble firing Monegan. I know they were told because Frank Bailey was working in Administration at the time at issue. Yet, not only did they not accept the advise, they kept bedeviling the situation and trying to get Wooten to the point where she wound up firing a powerful and well-connected commissioner and immersing her administration in scandal. She dodged the bullet on it only because Frank Bailey stepped in front of the bullet for her, but you will never make me or anybody else who knows this government beleive that Frank Bailey all on his own set out to make things right about the Governor’s former brother in law.

            And the thing with the per diem is just a jab at Juneau, something, in true Mat Valley fashion, she never misses and opportunity to do. So, just to make sure everybody in Juneau knows how she feels, not only will she not stay in the Governor’s House or in the Governor’s Office on the Third Floor of the Capitol, she makes her office in Anchorage and commutes from Wassilla to work but since the Governor’s duty station is Juneau, she keeps herself in travel status and pays herself per diem while sleeping in her own home every night – and was open and defiant about it. She got away with it because her appointed subordinates who are the rule keepers on this stuff covered for her. On numerous ocassions during my career we disciplined classified, unionized employees and even appointees for collecting per diem or other travel allowances while staying in a home away from their duty station that they owned or otherwise had access to. There is even a specific rule brought about by a controversy involving a former commissioner that requires you to declare one of your residences to be your principal residence for travel purposes and does not allow you to collect per diem if you have a residence that you are staying in in the place to which you are travelling.

            I could go on about stuff like that but suffice it to say that Sarah was special.

      • jakehalsted

        Sarah is good looking. That’s what counts…common!

        • SteveLA

          Two years registered, few comments, a few in the past, what one day and they are resoundingly sexist.

          What is this the movie Telephone and you’re Charles Bronson or something? You’re not that special.

        • JadedByPolitics

          perhaps in your liberal world where you USE women to move your agenda ahead instead of working with them as the Conservative Movement does. I know you all just cannot stand how brilliant and polished and knowledgeable Sarah is so you go straight to her appearance but the FACTS REMAIN and she is beautiful on top of ALL OF THAT! How lucky is her husband? VERY….you not so much TOOL!!!

        • http://www.hakubi.us/ Neil Stevens

          Just because you harbor sick fantasies of beating up on your mother, you shouldn’t come and troll here, moby.

    • Achance

      at all so long as it isn’t Governor of Alaska again. I’m liking her being a celebrity on YOUR stages rather than ours; too much drama.

      I really only respond to the hagiographies usually. Sarah’s self-serving press releases and sound bites deserve some objective response.

      • Scope

        because she didn’t dance with the one that brung her.

    • http://www.hakubi.us/ Neil Stevens

      Calling out users is against the rules. Don’t be a troll.

      Consider this a warning.

      • Wing Zero

        Sorry Neil.

  • proudmarinemom

    explain why he needs three or four months to decide whether to send more troops to Afghanistan. He has said on several occasions that he wants a resolution soon and does not want to pass the problem of Afghanistan on to “the next administration.”

    There’s something in his voice and demeanor when he says this that suggests the he is aware that he is a OneTermer. Strange — maybe he knows something or expects something to happen before the next General Election.

    Just an observation.

    • jen2001

      The Acorn document dump, the email hacking of the climate folks debunking the data and its coverup, the cracking of the healthcare efforts and his sinking approval ratings across the polls.

      Americans are waking up to him. I think his internal polling numbers terrify him.

    • ciscoguy

      Obama cares about #1 and that’s it. Everything he does is a political calculation, and he’s not even very good at that (at least as president).

      There is no way his ego allows him to think of serving anything less than 2 terms. There is no doubt in my mind he has and will always choose political expediency over doing the right thing.

      He couldn’t give a damn about administrations to follow, only to the extent they might make him look better or worse by comparison. He likes to project the appearance of concern for the welfare of this country through his words, but his actions speak otherwise.

      Look, this guy is a career politician – as short as it may be. He is obviously more aware of the polls than he likes to let on, but don’t think for a second he doesn’t think he can’t rescue himself politically. Chicago politicians don’t go quietly.

      • Warrior
  • dhorowitz3

    I always like to present the following challenge to those who say that Palin’s negatives are to high to be a viable candidate:

    Name me one other person who will be able to rally conservatives and be as effective in attacking the liberals who will not garner as much of a visceral response from the media. It is a matter of Newtons Law of motion. Every action will be met with an equal counter action. There is currently no person out there who is as conservative and has the same star power to take the fight directly to the left.

    This does not mean that nobody else can come along one day and equal Palin in this respect. However, my point is who can accomplish this without soliciting the same reaction from the vermin in the media. So fine, Palin has to much negative baggage so we will look for another solid conservative candidate who doesn’t have “the baggage”. But it will be a viscous cycle. By virtue of them being successful conservatives and viable threats to the liberals they will be given that baggage within a matter of a few months of their emergence on the national stage. The only way that the media will not go all out against our candidate is if they are not a threat. So either way we have to stand and fight. We are not going to sneak in a solid conservative in the likes of Palin but “without the negatives”.

    • Tbone

      Anyone the media wouldn’t go after is a bucket of warm spit or Mitt Romney.

      • dhorowitz3

        I’m sure the media will be pissing in their panties over a Romney/Scozzavafa ticket.

    • Warrior

      Anyone who comes close to being a loyal conservative will be excoriated by the legacy media long before election day.

      The legacy media still make a fuss over her firing (or influence in firing) an Alaskan State Trooper who TAZED AN ELEVEN YEAR OLD BOY. Can you imagine anyone else being ridiculed for such a firing? Neither can I.

      And that’s why I think we need not mention bogus ethics charges, the exploits of Levi Johnson or any other media circus distraction when discussing Sarah Palin.

  • Third Street

    (HAH! Made you look!)

    • Scope

      not to mention your coming on every Palin post to only incite. The 2 month wonder boy has been given a voice, and by dang he is going to use it.

      • Third Street

        And by the way, shove it. You’re a venomous, humorless pile of crap and I’m getting tired of you following me around to snipe. With friends like you Sarah Palin doesn’t need enemies.

        • Jack_Savage

          Who posts only to provoke, instead of discuss. I am beginning to see Scope’s point.

          Reasonable people here differ on Palin, but I grow tired of seeing her attacked as mercilessly by her “friends” as she is by her enemies. We all should be careful of overzealousness on either side.

          • Third Street

            (Right, Scope?)

          • JadedByPolitics

            …..

          • Jack_Savage

            I am glad we still have lots to give thanks for.

          • Scope

            you are what keeps the site blanaced from those that want to tip the balance.

          • JadedByPolitics

            see notes above sweetie…my week was WAY NICER upon reflection of what is TRULY important….and this isn’t. 2010 is a coming a WE got some some BIG FISH to fry (that made me nauseous to say I ate to much today) :) Lets meet up in the other diaries and let us provide some GREAT diaries!

        • Scope

          “be respectful, or be banned.” Yet you are still here even with your comment that I am a “venoumous, and a humorless pile of crap.” It once again proves that you are here only to incite on any Palin diary, which is all you have done.

          • Third Street

            Heh.

  • http://wadebutler.com artman

    Don’t put much stock it what Obama’s approval ratings are today. Remember, the moderates out there wash back and forth, back and forth; many cannot make a decision. An uptick in the economy and job numbers on the rise next summer and the wishy-washy moderates will simply slide back over to the other side like they’re on a ship in a storm. Moderates have no mooring, no anchor. There is not a principle they will not abandon for their own perceived self-interest.

    That is what has been lost in America. Education, the media, entertainment and the diminishing of religious faith for a generation have resulted in the “moderate surge” that has been so devastating to conservative values and political success. The liberals have a better line and recognize that the average Joe can be swayed by false compassion and selfishness. Republicans used to be elected based upon “we will leave you alone.” But Republicans have now seen that they will lose elections on that premise. So we see that Republicans have gone the way of the Democrats; not because that is what they want to do; but because they must compete with the Democrats or go home. Term limits are the only solution. But it will never happen.

    Liberals always use a false crisis when possible to get elected. They were able to use a real one to get Obama elected. It will take a train wreck with liberals in charge to swing us back far enough to be beneficial. And that may happen. If it doesn’t then don’t expect the moderates to swing back to conservatism.

    • http://www.theminorityreportblog.com/blog/loren_heal Socrates

      Bill Clinton beat him (with Perot’s help). That, and Bush’s “No New Taxes!” broken pledge.

      Obama is going to break his nebulous tax-cutting promises.

  • http://www.theminorityreportblog.com/blog/loren_heal Socrates

    A) We’ve got 2010 to worry about.

    B) All of this strategizing over who we should run is counterproductive. We should back whoever wins the primary, regardless of Obama’s approval rating. He can be beaten, regardless of how people talk to a pollster.

    C) Anyone can win. Asking who “can win” is poisoning the well.

    • Achance

      The Obama commitment is so irrational and emotional and people are really going to be struggling over whether they’ll be racists if they kick him to the curb. Unless he really steps on it, I think he’s all but unbeatable in ’12 and we should do what we’ve historically done best, run states and have at least one body of Congress. I also think that Sarah Palin is at least as smart as I am and a lot more self-interested and she can figure that calculus as well. She ain’t gonna damage that image of hers with a Quixiotic run against The Messiah. She might take on Begich in ’14, but if she still has ambition after her book millions, she’ll be focussed on the open Presidency in ’16. Maybe by then she’ll have some idea how to run a government and have developed a thicker skin.

      • malbis

        Just 39% of whites surveyed now approve of Obama’s performance, a very sharp drop-off from the over 60% white approval he had in January. That represents a rather staggering loss in a very short time, with more bad news to come next year on the economy, the War, and who knows what else.

        The idea that white voters will vote for Obama in 2012 because they don’t want to seem racist is contrary to facts. If the polling bias still exists–and it probably doesn’t based on the last election–then Obama has even less white support than 39% (probably around 2 to 1 against him. And it isn’t based on race. It is based on poor performance and ultra left-wing policies.

        The Messiah is dead. And it is going to take a lot more than three days (or the three years he has left in office) to resurrect him.

        From the 1940 feature film Ghost Breakers, starring the late, great, Bob Hope and Paulette Goddard:

        Scientist: “It?s worse than horrible, because a Zombie has no will of his own. You see them some times, walking around blindly with dead eyes, following orders, not knowing what they do, not caring.”

        Bob Hope: “You mean, like Democrats?”

        • Leopard1996

          But let the MSM and all start broadcasting how it is imperative to heal the racial damage the U.S. has to elect Jackass to another term, and all the squishy white guilt sufferers will vote for him in droves. Unless their lot in life is 10x crappier then it was before he and the useless congress critter dems took over.

          Just as info to the KOS kid trolls, I am one of the 10% of Black Americans that is in the Strongly Disapprove category of Obama’s presidency. If he was a “moderate” he ain’t showing any balls fighting against the far left, and if he is a “socialist” then he is driving this country into some serious irreparable damage.

          • mschmitt

            … a deficit killing budget hawk who rescued us from the brink of economic disaster under GWB; kept us safe from terrorists yet still managed to make the world love America “again”; while simultaneously providing candy canes, lolly pops, and free health-care to all the children of the world.

          • Section9

            Axelrod and Plouffe were spooked by the fact that Christie and McDonnell killed Obama’s candidates, especially Christie. MD was expected to win.

            They are leaching Indies.

            The clown shoes party (that would be the GOP) needs to keep hammering Obama on the deficit, the National Debt, and Jobs. Don’t let him get away with it!

        • jeffreywturner

          They straightened up right before the election last year for show, so they ended up only overstated Obama’s margin by about 1% on average, but the bias definitely still exists.

      • Wing Zero

        is that while you’ve had your problems with her in the past, you do think some growth and seasoning will make her a viable “governor” (not in the state gov sense, in the governing sense.)

        • Achance

          A hyper-thin skin and a mentl Rolodex for people you have a gruge against are not conductive to governing. You actually do have to get along with people you don’t like well enough to get things done. You also have to pick staff for their ability rather than their relations with you and you have to be willing to listen to them. Sarah doesn’t even want to hear analysis or advice contrary to whatever she has her mind set on and won’t tolerate people around her who tell her things she doesn’t want to hear. That’s why she went through so many COS and Leg Liasons as well as communications directors. Those are the positions that are going to tell a governor things they don’t want to hear most often. She settled in with Mike Nizich as her COS, but Mike, who is my marina neighbor in summer, has worked at the appointee level in the Governor’s Office through many, many administrations, Democrat and Republican, you don’t stay on from administration to administration in a job like that by crossing governors or telling them things they don’t want to hear.

      • Richard Mullins

        they’ll do everything they can to kick Obama to the curb. I’m really sure on that. I also think that the longer Hillary Clinton stays connected to this admin(unless she finds a really good way to distance herself), she will not be asked to run 2012. Simply put, being like this is going to get the party anywhere and dems know how to though anyone under the bus.

        • Leopard1996

          That Obama was nothing more than someone to put a black face on white Berkley Liberal policies, and I can see him outlasting his usefulness, and getting ash canned by the extreme left when they still could not get their utopia.

          • Richard Mullins

            is too starting thinking of point to throw him under the bus. Obama is starting to look like the National Version of Gary Mauro(insert any leftist in your area) and will get his butt end handed back to him. I’m really hoping at this point the DNC becomes like the Democratic Party of Texas and is to the left of Stalin. Really, I hope for that all the time.

      • Section9

        However, if the dollar collapses and UMP remains above 10% through 2011, then all bets are off and this guy looks like Carter.

        Secondly, you underestimate the Suicide Kings in the Jihad Wing of their party-there are genuine antiwar people in that party who are against the Afghan Commitment. The AQ know this-they get that Obama is half-hearted, that he’s not like Bush at all.

        Where Obama is vulnerable in ’12 is the witches brew that killed Johnson along about 1967-the clash between protracted war and the ambitions of the Great Society. Johnson didn’t see Eugene McCarthy coming up on him until it was too late, and then Tet broke his will to fight, even though he won in New Hampshire.

        Obama’s ego and ambition are writing checks his party can’t cash (sorry all you Top Gun fans, but I had to use that line). There has to be a breaking point because he is attempting too many things at once. Unlike Bush, who was more of a hedgehog, Obama is like a fox, always moving to and fro, but never staying on one thing to complete it. Too many irons in the fire.

        It may break him-and that may give Palin the early opening. If it doesnt’, then she’ll go at the Boy Senator.

        • Richard Mullins

          Obama and everyone is cabinet are going to be tossed under the Democratic party bus in 2012. Really, if their best shot screws up, no one will be allowed back(one really good reason for a work on 2010). I’d really like the national Democratic party to keep looking like the Texas Democratic Party and stay to the left of Stalin. Simply put,we never should let our guard down.

      • AKSteveB

        Most of the current “recovery” is b.s. It should be a lot more apparent by then. I wouldn’t bet the farm on it, but as long as a Repub isn’t Palin or tied to Dubya, it will be a referendum on the economy,

      • Alberta

        Unbeatable in such a strong word. If the boy pres continues down the path he is on now?

        He is floating balloons out there about repealing the Bush tax cuts a year early (Via Jimmy P). He has cap and tax, Obamacare, ect. Thats going to hurt the white uppercrust the most. Rich & White also likes to think of itself as smart, and its no doubt noticed his ditherings on matters of importance and his rush to pay back political contributers. Jews are starting to abandon the guy (I can only back this up anecdotally, I have no idea if a poll has been done, I should look). KSM in Manhattan? And God forbid a situation erupts vis a vis Iran, or AQ attacks again. Or if he wastes our militaries efforts in Afghanistan.

        The only thing I can think of for Barry is he structured the stimulis to kick in around the start of his re election campaign. That and im sure he will benefit from the bunker mentality of his followers (they will no doubt rally around him to save their face and protect their pride). I must be missing some attribute that would help him get re elected.

        I dont know, Barry doesnt seem unbeatable. But, your older and wiser than I am, and have been to more rodeos.

      • Alberta

        Unbeatable in such a strong word. If the boy pres continues down the path he is on now?

        He is floating balloons out there about repealing the Bush tax cuts a year early (Via Jimmy P). He has cap and tax, Obamacare, ect. Thats going to hurt the white uppercrust the most. Rich & White also likes to think of itself as smart, and its no doubt noticed his ditherings on matters of importance and his rush to pay back political contributers. Jews are starting to abandon the guy (I can only back this up anecdotally, I have no idea if a poll has been done, I should look). KSM in Manhattan? And God forbid a situation erupts vis a vis Iran, or AQ attacks again. Or if he wastes our militaries efforts in Afghanistan.

        The only thing I can think of for Barry is he structured the stimulis to kick in around the start of his re election campaign. That and im sure he will benefit from the bunker mentality of his followers (they will no doubt rally around him to save their face and protect their pride). I must be missing some attribute that would help him get re elected.

        I dont know, Barry doesnt seem unbeatable. But, your older and wiser than I am, and have been to more rodeos.

  • notreallyrepublican

    Bout time we had the White house back in it’s proper hands, isn’t one year of a Jihadist-in-Chief enough?

    If only the ticket last year had been flipped in respect to top and bottom :(

  • DavidSage

    Just like in the last Presidential election, just about anyone with a (D) next to their name was going to win the White House. In any other election, an inexperienced, left -wing radical like Obama would not have had a chance, either would a polarizing figure like Hillary Clinton, but the environment was so hostile to Republicans, it was the Democrats to lose.

    If things are really, really bad by 2012, Palin can win. So could a lot of otherwise unelectable Republicans. The question is, is she our strongest pick? Is she more likely to blow it and give Obama four more years?

    I personally cannot think of a more polarizing figure on our side, she’s essentially our version of Hillary Clinton. Just like Republicans were drooling at the prospect of running against Hillary, I think Democrats are drooling at the prospect of running against Palin. There’s only two figures I could see blowing a “gimme” election for Republicans, and that would be Palin or Huckabee,

    I like Palin on a personal level, and I love that she drives the Left bat crazy, but I think her role is best suited as a conservative activist. The fact that she was unable to finish a single term as Governor of Alaska really turned me against her as a serious elected leader.

    I understand that liberals were being unfair to her, but you had better buck up and get used to that level of intensity if you want to be President. There’s more to leadership and the Presidency than just an ideological checklist, otherwise why don’t we talk about nominating Ann Coulter for President? She’s far sharper and tougher than Sarah Palin.

    • Tbone

      “The fact that she was unable to finish a single term as Governor of Alaska really turned me against her as a serious elected leader. ”

      Hard, but not impossible: “Ann Coulter for President? She?s far sharper and tougher than Sarah Palin.”

      Your momma has some cookies for you upstairs.

      • DavidSage

        Instead of being insulting, tell me.

        Just because someone is a conservative doesn’t mean we should ignore reality. I’m done carrying water for someone just because they have an (R) next to their name.

        Palin can’t handle the pressure of being Governor for 2 years, so she can handle the White House? Her excuse for stepping down is ridiculous. You really think that’s the mark of a solid statesman that can lead the free world?

        Palin went to 5 different colleges in 6 years to get a degree in journalism. I wouldn’t hire someone to be my secretary with that sort of resume. I’ve seen her in interviews. She couldn’t answer basic questions like what newspapers she reads without clutching up. Again, we get excuses why she was unable to answer that. She’s has shown repeatedly that she’s a flake.

        I would be far more comfortable with Ann Coulter in the White House than Sarah Palin. Coulter is far more intelligent, and doesn’t run when liberals go after her.

        Why can’t we have a conservative leader that at least has some gravitas? I can understand someone pushing Newt Gingrich (even though I think he’s also unelectable) Whatever you think about him personally, he’s unquestionably an intelligent conservative (except for his NY-23 move) and actually has accomplished quite a bit in terms of public policy. Probably more than any other Republican except for Reagan. What has Palin done in her illustrious career as Governor?

        I’m not looking to elect a President just so I can display some cultural middle finger to liberals. That really seems to be the only thing Palin has going for her, that liberals hate her. Sorry, that’s not enough to win the White House.

        At the end, it really doesn’t matter to argue any of this, her following is a cult of personality that will make fools of themselves following her off a cliff.

        • mbecker908

          Sarah Palin is the equivalent of AGW as far as the “believers” are concerned.

          • Tbone

            That does make me feel good.

        • mschmitt

          As one of those nasty Palin supporters; let me see if I can try to apply my Palin-bot, cult-like, ignorance to address your points.

          Palin can?t handle the pressure of being Governor for 2 years, so she can handle the White House? Her excuse for stepping down is ridiculous. You really think that?s the mark of a solid statesman that can lead the free world?

          It’s not qualifying, nor is it disqualifying. I’m likely to be swayed by the argument that she fled from her own ethics violations; I’m not swayed by the boring lefty assertion that she’s a quitter (note: not accusing you of being a lefty, just that you’re blithely adopting their assertion).

          Palin went to 5 different colleges in 6 years to get a degree in journalism. I wouldn?t hire someone to be my secretary with that sort of resume.

          Regardless of whether they’d be a good secretary or not?

          She couldn?t answer basic questions like what newspapers she reads without clutching up.

          She mishandled two or three questions during the campaign while trying to toe McCain’s line and not say anything controversial during hostile interviews. She didn’t handle a couple of basic questions, and it blew up on her (couldn’t name papers? come on…). The line of attack re: papers was always intended to show that she didn’t read. Do you actually believe that Palin doesn’t read, or do you just want to latch onto another lefty talking point since it suits your thesis?

          Again, we get excuses why she was unable to answer that.

          It’s a laughably flimsy line of attack. We should just mock you when you use it, rather than try to explain it to you.

          She?s has shown repeatedly that she?s a flake.

          It seems like you’ve been told repeatedly that she’s a flake, and you swallowed the hook.

          I would be far more comfortable with Ann Coulter in the White House than Sarah Palin. Coulter is far more intelligent, and doesn?t run when liberals go after her.

          That’s fine, but there are a ton of reasons why commentators don’t become politicians; for example, they don’t need to run when liberals go after them because they have nothing to lose politically.

          Also, your assertion that Coulter is “far more intelligent” is totally subjective, unless you have access to some cognitive tests or something that the rest of us don’t have. Coulter is a Palin supporter, by the way (she’s the one who aggressively adopted the she is only a heart-beat away retort to the she is only a heart-beat away lefty attack during the campaign).

          Why can?t we have a conservative leader that at least has some gravitas?

          Simple: because you rely on the media to help you define gravitas.

          I can understand someone pushing Newt Gingrich (even though I think he?s also unelectable) Whatever you think about him personally, he?s unquestionably an intelligent conservative (except for his NY-23 move) and actually has accomplished quite a bit in terms of public policy. Probably more than any other Republican except for Reagan. What has Palin done in her illustrious career as Governor?

          He’s not unquestionably conservative. Some might question whether he is simply a career opportunist; and yes, I question that. Regarding your other point, I suppose that Palin has accomplished roughly as much as any governor accomplishes in two years before running for veep.

          I?m not looking to elect a President just so I can display some cultural middle finger to liberals. That really seems to be the only thing Palin has going for her, that liberals hate her. Sorry, that?s not enough to win the White House.

          Fine, so help elect a conservative President — Palin still has that going for her, last I checked.

          At the end, it really doesn?t matter to argue any of this, her following is a cult of personality that will make fools of themselves following her off a cliff.

          What can I say? I’m just a gosh darn cultist who supports like minded people for higher office, regardless of what other people tell me I should think.

          • mschmitt
          • mschmitt
          • DavidSage

            I don’t think your lengthy explanations have proven that my assertions about Palin are wrong.

            Do I think the liberal media was unfair to Palin? Absolutely. Does that mean conservatives should rally around her out of spite? Of course not. The media is going to be unfair to every conservative, that’s what they do, but even a broken clock is right twice a day.

            If Palin has trouble even winning over like-minded conservatives because of her personality issues and drama, she’s DOA when it comes to the voters she has to win over who aren’t part of the conservative base.

          • mschmitt

            … saying that we ‘Palin-bots’ (or whatever the latest favorite term is) never respond to your points, and it’s not even worth trying to communicate with us.

            As this post and others proves, when we do take the time to respond to your sides’ ridiculous assertions (so you don’t believe that Palin reads, then?); you dismiss or ignore our rebuttals.

          • Tbone

            You did very well. However, as you see, you can’ fix stupid.

          • mschmitt

            … because you’ve got a couple of guys like Achance who know a heck of a lot about her, and can bring a lot to the conversation; but he’s also got a lot of baggage seeing as he was tied up in the administration that she mauled in 2006. Obviously, it’s hard to debate somebody’s personal knowledge about somebody if we don’t know them personally.

            As a result, we have to be cultists or ignorant if we try to engage in the conversation.

            Is first hand knowledge always correct, unimpeachable and non-debatable? No! What if one of Ronald Reagan’s closest friends suddenly decided to pee all over him, would we allow it to go unchallenged?

            On the flip side of the debate, we’ve got a growing number of bozos like this that parrot Achance/mbecker’s arguments and/or the lefty press and the best they can do is “you can’t prove me wrong to me, therefore, she’s DOA” (or equivalent).

          • Scope

            It’s why I asked above to stop the Palin diaries. I know it’s free speech, and everyone has the right to speak their minds. But, every time the word Palin is in a diary, the war, here at Redstate, starts all over again. I said the other day, that if anyone speaks positively about Palin, they are labeled Palinbots, Palinistas and every other name that connotes negativism. These diaries are nothing more than firing squads. If you’re for her your damned, and are immediately subjected to ridicule. You answered someones comments above, and took the time to present a counter argument. If you don’t post a laundry list of Palin accomplishments, ones that have been defined by the anti’s, you are an idiot, unintelligent, don’t know the “real” Palin and you have bought into a pack of Palin lies, and your responses are attacked, even as they are saying that no one responds. It’s not good enough to believe that Palin is a conservative, to believe that she will put country before personal aspirations, that she can attract large crowds because so many see her as one of them. It doesn’t matter that so many women and young girls see her as a role model, rather than the old feminazis of the 60′s. I honestly wonder what the antis here would be saying about Palin if Achance didn’t fill pages and pages of the way he sees things, up to and including that Palin is a liar, she is an opportunist and that when the budgeting in Alaska got tough, she bailed out and choose to write a book and make big bucks. The only reason I can see for the constant attacks is to insure that every new member knows who Palin “really is” as interpreted by a few. The sad part of it is that 2012 is a long long way off, and no one knows if she will even run for any elected office again at any time. The few just have to be sure that you know that she is just another Obama, and, that is a direct quote from one of the antis.

          • Achance

            for Alaska: http://fin.admin.state.ak.us/dof/financial_reports/cafr_toc.jsp

            Here is the Alaska Revenue Source Book: http://www.tax.alaska.gov/programs/sourcebook/index.aspx

            Now you can do something that I’ve never seen any evidence of a Palin supporter doing; you can actually look at the records of her spending and her vaunted budget cuts.

            Now I’ll sit back and await enlightenment.

          • Scope

            and, in fact, I responded to your links this morning, and, after more than an hour of typing my response, when I hit post, I was thrown out because of a 500 internal server error. I did not have time or the patience to sit and retype my comments. I have not ignored your replies to me, as I do appreciate your time.

            The most simple overall picture of the revenues vs. expenses for all years back to 1998 I believe, is on page xi (19 in the pdf format). On that chart, in the 2002 and 2003 FY, the expenses were somewhat significantly higher than the revenues. In FY 2006 and again in 2007 the revenues began to increase above expenditures. In FY 2008 the revenues skyrocketed by approximately 6%. The expenses seemed to be flat for a few years before 2006, and have increased by what appears to be about 1% in each year since then. The increase in expenses in 2007 were no more than the revenues in 2006.

            From what I am seeing the petroleum revenues in 2008 increased by approx. 17.8%, the non-petroleum revenues decreased, for the same period, by approx. 6.6%, which indicates a net gain of approx. 11.2% in all revenues. The note’s to this section include-

            “The state’s major source of revenue is petroleum related. The price of oil has had it’s ups and downs over the years, and 2008 was a good year. The Department of Revenue projected an Alaska North Slope West Coast price of $85.73 per barrel in its FY 2008 spring forcast. Actual ANSWC prices were $5.39 per barrel over that, averaging $91.12 per barrel for the fiscal year. Record high oil prices were again set in May 2008, with a high price of $132.57 set in May 2008. Oil price volatility continues however, and price fluctuations will persist as economic uncertainty, geopolitical tensions, and supply constraints exert pressure on world crude markets.

            With the state so dependent on petroleum revenues, the price of oil and gas is always a critical element of budgeting After passage of the Alaska Gasoline Inducement Act in June 2007, the administration initiated a competitive process to select a licensee to build the gas pipeline. On August 1, 2008 the twenty-fifth legislature passed Chapter 3, 4SSLA 08 which authorizes the issuanc of a license to Tran Canada Alaska Company, LLC and the Foothills Pipe Lines, Ltd.”

            Achance, you seem to have a problem with the License for the pipeline, and, it appears that you are accusing Palin of accomplishing nothing with this venture. If that is the case, then you must also hold the entire 60 member twenty-fifth legislature responsible as well. The legislature is made of of both Democrats and Republicans, and, if I am not mistaken they are elected, not selected.

            Looking at the expense side of the financials for FY 2008, the last year posted on the site you referred me to, the expenses are listed by Department. Without drill down information, I can only go by Department expenses. The Department of Administration expenses increased by approx. 6.5%. The only other Department with an increase is the Department of Revenue. All other Departments expenses were decreased by insignificant percentages, but, as a whole the decreases were enough to bring the total increase in spending to approx. 1% from the previous year.

            In looking at the notes for the increase in the Administration Department the following statement is made-

            “The total expenditures charged against the General Fund appropriations during FY 2008 amounted to $7.8 billion, an increase of $1.1 billion from FY 2007. This increase is mainly attributable to the Department of Administration for the on-behalf payment to the pension funds for employer relief, and the Department of Revenue for the permanent fund dividend payment. ”

            Achance, while I understand that the entire expenditures in the Department of Administration are not all union legacy costs, they seem to be a significant portion of the budget expense increases. As I’ve said before, medical insurace premiums have increased in every state, and I would think that the Cadillac plans that union retirees enjoy, can get pretty costly. Is that the reason for the significant increase in the Administration expense budget. Weren’t the legacy costs what brought down GM and Chrysler? Aren’t the government union legacy costs breaking the backs of alot of states, such as NJ. It seems to me that if the most significant increase in expenditures is highlighted in the notes to the statements, an explanation was called for.

            As stated above, from the Alaska financial statement notes, the major source of revenue for the state is petroleum revenues. Achance, you have said that Palin increased the taxes paid by the oil producers in the state, to the point that you would almost call it a “windfall profits tax.” I’m not so sure I can square with that thinking as we are talking about the states main source of revenue. The state owns the resources, and the oil companies are making a profit from those resources, even after the tax structure, or they would stop operating in the state. Is it very different than another state selling leases to an oil company to produce profits, after the lease fees are paid. Actually Palin tied the number of barrels, and the going market rate per barrel to the amount of tax owed. In a lease situation, they would be paying the same lease rates no matter what the price per barrel on any given day. Is there anything wrong with that? Isn’t that free market capitalism at it’s best?

            Achance you have claimed that when the going got tough, Palin got going, and, quit the Governorship role. I’ve looked at your second link briefly, and, no question that the numbers are looking more bleak in the coming years. Wouldn’t that have happened to anyone that was the Governor of the state? I have no doubt that Parnell, just as Palin would cut the expenses, as the projected revenues were forcast downward. By looking at the financial information for Alaska, I am more convinced that Palin gets it where energy is concerned, and how the US can not only be independent from foreign sources, but, we can open a wide and far reaching job market, and, in all the states that are fortunate and blessed enough to have those resources underfoot. We should also be building the infrastructure to refine our own oil and gas resources, which would open up yet another major source of jobs for Americans. We always here about energy independence. Independence from the foreign countries that are using our need for oil as a means of control. Wouldn’t you love to tell Saudia Arabia and Venezuela to shove it. Wouldn’t you love to be able to sell our oil, at our price, and have the consuming countries buying our product. Hell, we could probably wipe out our entire debt with China with oil exports in lieu of interest and principal payments. That of course would be if we had a rational, reasonable president and majority Congress. Instead we sit on the most abundant reserves of fossil fuels in the world, because if we use them, they could kill you.

          • mschmitt

            The process of either confirming our suspicions (that Palin is a strong minded conservative lady and leader who isn’t afraid to put on a pair of hob-nailed boots and step on a few toes when necessary) and/or the detractors version of events (that she is a mindless faux conservative and/or a self-serving and self-centered prima donna) is going to be a long road to hoe when said detractors are sitting in the same camp and wanting the same things (principled, conservative leadership).

            I hope that you don’t get yourself banned; I don’t want to have to read all of this s*** by myself! Even more than that, I hope we can get this issue resolved quickly — in the end, it honestly can’t be that hard to prove whether Palin governed as a conservative or not.

            Achance has not shown himself to be an illogical man (even though he disagrees with me, and that’s usually enough — ha!). If there are underlying minor league issues, I hope they can be resolved. If the problems are truly with Palin’s conservative/leadership credentials, then I hope we can find a way to establish once and for all whether those concerns are valid or not.

            Honestly, I’m not comfortable taking things like that on faith, when people who have opinions we otherwise trust/respect are telling us not to fall for it.

            The only way to do that is to poke through budgets, read old press (before she was “the” Sarah Palin), and try to find some first hand accounts from people who don’t necessarily have a strong disapproval of her.

          • aesthete

            as a diary in a more legible and organized fashion, please? It looks like you’ve put a lot of legwork into this, but I honestly don’t understand what points you are trying to convey in your post. Citations would also be nice as well, it it wouldn’t be too much to ask.

          • mschmitt
          • Scope

            He provided links for me to the financials, and the forecasts. He asked that I look at them, and I did. Unless you had the financials in front of you, what I said would not make much sense. I did the best I could. I ask others to do the same. I’m sure we must have some CPA’s here that could also take a look, and come up with their comments, based on the financial information alone.

            My overall opinion is that yes spending increased, but not that significantly, and, the major spending was in the Department of Administration . It would be hard to determine what the individual costs were that make up that number, unless you go to the details that list what appears to be state House or Senate bills passed for funding that bill. It would take me a month to go back and look up each bill in order to see what spending was passed by the legislature. The audited financial statements always include notes, which I quoted a few above. They explain any major increases or decreases in spending. I guess the biggest point I am making is that the Governor, and any other single person doesn’t control what is spent, it comes from the legislature that is made of of 60 Democrats and Republicans. I’m sure Palin has a “slush fund” so to speak that she can tap for her own reasons, but, I doubt it contains serious money. I would think that whatever she can tap would be in the Department of the Governor. That spending area in the 2008 financials was actually cut. It is my understanding that Palin didn’t take the pay raise that she was actually entitled to. I don’t believe that any Governor has that much control over the budgets. They can make recommendations, or request that certain projects are passed, but, with a legislature made up of both parties, they will finally decide if that project gets funding or not. The Alaska legislature does not appear to be overwhelmingly a majority of one party or the other, as is the case in Washington today. I don’t think they can ram things through because one person asks them to. I may be very naive, and, I am aware that shannigans can take place in any state, but, I am just not seeing it in the financials. What has been made to appear as hanky panky, if it does exist, is on a small scale, according to the 2008 financial information. Yes spending increased, just as it has every single year as shown on the graph (page 19) in the 2008 financials. Many Governors of states are busy slashing budget items, and in many cases even essential services, in order to balance their budgets. It appears that Alaska has not had to do that because they have been frugal , have passed legislation in order to insure that funding doesn’t happen without the money being there to spend. It seems to me that every year things cost more. I can’t buy a loaf of bread for a buck anymore. The increase in spending in Alaska seems to reflect that.

            Yes, in 2008 the petroleum profits shyrocketed from previous years, and, that was from the time period when we were all paying close to $4 for a gallon of gas. The state of Alaska, Palin, and no one in the administration sets the price per barrel as traded on the stock market. As noted above, petroleum is Alaskas major source of revenue. I don’t think anyone can dispute that. It seems fair to me, that in the Palin administration, the legislature passed a taxing law on the petroleum producers in the state. They tied it to average price per barrel, and as we all know that the price is volatile. I personally don’t see that as a “windfall profits tax” as has been said. Palin did not set the tax rate, she may have made recommendations as to the rate, but, the legislature passed the rate and the law. Isn’t this all about how sausage is made. Everyone likes it, but, no one wants to see how it is made. They only care about how good it tastes or doesn’t.

            As to the pipeline project, that much has been said about, again, the twenty-fifth legislature all played a part in that. If Palin was wrong for supporting it, then also to were the entire legislature.

            I have no intention of doing any diaries that include the name Palin. In fact, I do agree that things need to be ironed out, and, each one of us has to look into the information for themselves. I’m sorry if someone doesn’t have accounting knowledge, but, look at it kinda like your checkbook. Money goes in (revenues) and money goes out (the checks you have written). I will not participate in any name calling, flaming, attacks or anything else. I am willing to participate in rational discussions that include factual information, such as the financials. I have no interest in anyone’s personal opinions, they are what seem to make diaries blow up. About this Achance is correct, no one seems to want to do the research.

          • mschmitt

            When you put the time into researching something as obtuse as budget records, let’s make sure it doesn’t get lost in the middle of a comments thread — that’s all we’re saying.

          • Vladimir

            “Yes, in 2008 the petroleum profits shyrocketed from previous years, and, that was from the time period when we were all paying close to $4 for a gallon of gas. The state of Alaska, Palin, and no one in the administration sets the price per barrel as traded on the stock market. As noted above, petroleum is Alaskas major source of revenue. I don?t think anyone can dispute that. It seems fair to me, that in the Palin administration, the legislature passed a taxing law on the petroleum producers in the state. They tied it to average price per barrel, and as we all know that the price is volatile. I personally don?t see that as a ?windfall profits tax? as has been said. Palin did not set the tax rate, she may have made recommendations as to the rate, but, the legislature passed the rate and the law.”

            Was she governor or not? (She was.)
            Did she sign the new tax or not? (She did.)
            Was it designed to “share” “unjust” profits with the State? (It was.)

            Q.E.D.

            Palin supporters need to figure out how to paint her support of a windfall profits tax as something other than what it was.

            Good luck with that.

          • Scope

            http://aklegislature.com/stories/101607/leg_20071016014.shtml

            It seems that there are always 2 sides to a story, but, only the facts matter, not the spin. Maybe this person writing this article is not being honest, but, there are facts in there that can easily be verified. For example, go to the link provided by Achance that listed all state financials for the past several years. If you read the notes in the 2005 financials, you will see a clear statement from The Honorable Frank Murkowski stating that he has increased the taxes on the oil producers. Just sayin’ ,as they say. I only want to know the truth, not anyone’s political spin on things be they Republicans or Democrats.

          • Achance

            her criticism of Murkowski’s tax legislation, called PPT for Petroleum Production Tax, I think, was that it didn’t tax them enough. That was the whole “corrupt old boys” meme that Murkowski and the Republican legislators had given a sweetheart deal to the Industry.

          • Achance

            Here again is the link to the State Fiscal Year (SFY) 2008 Financial Report: http://fin.admin.state.ak.us/dof/financial_reports/resource/08cafr.pdf

            That is for the period July 1, 2007 through June 30, 2008. The previous year’s budget was prepared largely by the Murkowski Administration, but her Administration had the opportunity to amend it and it was enacted under her Governorship. The SFY 2009 Financial Report will be out next month and it will show even greater increases in spending and revenue, including her $1000 per capita pander payment in the fall of ’08 in addition to the almost $2K Permanent Fund Dividend. The SFY ’09 budget is available at the Office of Management and Budget: http://www.gov.state.ak.us/omb/

            Under Alaska law, the Governor must propose a complete budget to the Legislature, which may accept it or amend it at its pleasure. The Governor’s proposed budget is normally due about the second week in December and the Legislature convenes the second week in January for, now, a 90 day session. The session was 120 days until last year. In a gubernatorial election year, the Governor is sworn in the first week in December and the Legislature convenes two weeks later than usual so that the new Governor, if there is one, has more transition time and more time to work on the budget before submitting it to the Legislature.

            I am not offering this as a criticism of the spending; I’d have spent more actually, but I would have spent it differently. I, especially, would have either spent money or foregone revenue to make Alaska-refined oil products available to Alaskans at a lower price in that period of extraordinarily high prices. High oil prices are a boon to the State government but a brutal tax on Alaska’s people in the rural areas who are dependent on oil for both heating and electricity as well as transportation.

            This is however offered in rebuttal to those who tout her as a budget cutter, which even Scope cannot now claim she is though scope tries to minimize the increases in taxes and revenue as well as spending. The only budget cuts that Gov. Palin EVER did were minor line item vetoes for show and for retribution against legislators who didn’t support her. If you don’t want to wade through the long CAFR and Revenue Sources Book, just look at the graph of revenues and expenditure through SFY 08 on page xi of the 2008 CAFR linked above.

            You know, Democrats can read too. If Sarah Palin is going to run for office as an energy expert, and fiscal conservative and budget cutter, she’s going to have to explain how she proposed and got enacted a huge tax increase on the oil industry, how spending went up significantly while she was Governor, why she was for the so-called bridge to nowhere in Ketchikan before she was against it. And then there’s why she was against a gas line through Canada before she was for it and gave TransCanada a half billion dollars in seed money. Along the way she can explain why the person most responsible for her changed position on the gas line and the architect of her AGIA scheme once worked for TransCanada.

          • Warrior

            And what, exactly, is “drama”? Even stodgy old Bush ’41 was accused by the lamestream media of having an affair way back when.

            Does anyone reach candidacy for national office without some kind of “drama”, manufactured or real? Somehow I doubt it.

            And the fact that she didn’t kow tow to Katie Couric is a point in her favor, just like when Fred refused to raise his hand for the 22 y/o j- school grad moderating a so-called “debate” during the last presidential election cycle.

            And finally, she is not a person of great financial wealth. It costs money to defend one’s self against a bevy of phony “ethics” charges. The gubmint has an endless supply of time, lawyers and money — Sarah Palin does not. I absolutley see nothing wrong in her attempts to keep her family solvent by resigning the governorship and writing a book.

            Besides, even without the financial burden of heavy legal bills, who here at RS would pass up a chance to make a few million legally?

            I remember a cartoon of Reagn made up as the “devil” with horns and everything. Many conservatives have now forgotten the degree to which he was villified by the left. He could easily have been described as “devisive”, “polarizing” and all the rest. And likely some one with personal knowledge found him displeasing. Fortunately, we didn’t listen to all that junk back then…

          • Achance

            at her record as governor. I’ve only been in the same room with Sarah Palin a couple of times since she quit the Murkowski Administration in ’04 or ’05, can’t remember and I’m too lazy to look it up for these purposes. Before that, I saw her in a lot of Monday morning staff meetings but had little to do with her. The AOGCC administratively resided in the same department, but it’s employees were non-union so I had little to do with them. Frankly, I viewed AOGCC commissioners the same way I viewed members of citizen boards; they were somebody to vote on and sign the work done by the professional staff. AOGCC Commissioners really had only one qualification: Friend of the Governor.

            What I rely on is personal knowledge of what has actually happened in Alaska, most of which I got from the State’s website and from the Juneau Empire or Anchorage Daily News. Even allowing for some bias, well actually a lot of bias on the ADN’s part, they do report what is going on.

            Now what I’ve never, ever gotten from any Palin supporter is any citation to facts or even contemporaneous accounts in support of their claims and their oppostion to my statements. If you controvert anything that most Palin supports say, they just start screaming loudly.

            Now, there are arguments on either side about whether ACES was a good thing. I don’t think it was, but I’ve never heard an argument from Palin supporters about how ACES was good. Sarah says it was good, so it’s good, and if it’s bad, it is somebody else’s fault. I don’t think AGIA was a good thing and I know that AGIA flew in the face of her promises to get an in-state gas line started. I have yet to hear an argument from a supporter about how AGIA was a good thing or why She should have abandoned Gov. Hickel and the others who supported her because She backed an in-state gas line.

            I think she let the ‘crats have their way and spend all sorts of money often in unwise ways yet I hear Palin supporters raving on about what a fiscal conservative she is. Well, she says she is, but all you have to do is look at the budgets. She talks about her budget cuts, but they really were only line items, most of them political paybacks, in budgets that were huge increases from prior year. Now the States Annual Financial Reports are all on line and I’ve given the link lots of times, likewise the Revenue Sources Book. Now, when a Palin supporter can come on here and cite to the State’s budget documents and prove me wrong, after I recover from fainting, I’ll be happy to admit I was wrong.

            From everything I’ve seen, her support is just as emotional and unfounded in either facts or programs as was Comrade Obama’s. I’m waiting for someone to show me what she did as Governor and demonstrate how it was unequivocally a good thing. Then they can tell me what her plans and programs are that make her the conservative champion she’s made out to be. I think her record as Governor shows her to be a populist panderer, but somebody is welcome to point to aspects of her record that I might have missed and prove me wrong.

            Frankly, I never knew or cared much about her one way or the other. She was a patronage hire in what was generally considered a backwater in terms of how the government actually operated. Let’s just say she had greatly enhanced the AOGCC’s role in policy making. She only came to my attention in any meaningful way when she pitched her fit about Randy Ruedrich. I was seriously concerned about those allegations because I knew some bad things had gone on, but was confident we had stopped it inside our department, but it crops up again involving somebody we had administrative responsibiity for. I was involved in planning how we’d deal with it but I was not there when the Deputy Commissioner talked to her. So there is room for a he said-she said controversy. That said though, I believe the DC when he said she blew him off and told him it was taken care of. We knew how vulerable we were. We were a Republican Administration following eight years of a Democrat. We were surrounded by holdovers and a hostile, unionized workforce. It was dogma that we didn’t say or write ANYTHING that we didn’t want to see on the front page of the ADN. We were not going to whitewash anything that we knew the facts on because you can’t keep secrets in government. So, that is where I parted company with Sarah; you dance with who brung you and rather than dealing with the situation inside the Administration, she looked after Sarah by quitting and playing kiss and tell and going on to trash the AG as well. So, when somebody can come here and tell me all about how this was a good thing, I’ll listen. This is the one area where I have personal knowlege that others don’t and really can’t have but they can certainly analyze her account in “Rogue” and see if it makes sense; I’m willing to listen. To me, her history shows that unless you’re family, being close to Sarah Palin is about the most dangerous place you can be in politics, but I’m willing to listen to rebuttal.

          • mschmitt

            … I respect what you have to say and I take your viewpoint at face value. You’ve never tried to hide who you were or why you have the viewpoint you do; and honestly, it’s an extremely valuable contribution.

            I’d like to learn more about Alaska politics — and I certainly want to know if Palin’s conservative credentials aren’t legitimate — but outside of this (metaphorical) room, the people who are attacking Palin are attacking her because she is a proxy for conservatism.

            If she is a phony or whatever, then of course we need to know; otherwise, if the problem is only that she has built up an image bigger than her britches, well, I’m just not going to be one of the guys running out to cut her back down to size. There are, in any given generation, very few suitable “champions” to send into combat. Goldwater was one. Reagan was one. Maybe Palin is one — maybe not; but in reality, the media has already declared her one (whether we like it or not).

            In that sense, it does us no good to point out to the enemy that that one of our Hectors has a weak left jab.

          • penguin2

            Achance has been able to do. I have come to respect him for the facts and data he is able to present. Though it is a disappointment that an individual that we have “needed’ to be more than human, has flaws, it is better that we know them, then to be blindsided. The true issue for me, is when our friendly fire becomes ammunition for the Left, and I think that must be what you are referencing with the Hector analogy.

            I hope some of this storm blows over, so we can focus on 2010. Any candidate we get in 2012 is going to have pros and cons, just the next time around, I hope we will pick one that will actually act like they want the job.

          • Achance

            the slings and arrows of partisan politics are really, really hard on them.

            I just want her ardent supporters to know that she has serious liabilities as both a candidate and as an executive. Is she better than Comrade Obama? Of course, ideologically she is. Is she a better executive? Maybe, but Obama has shown far more ability to use, and abuse, also a necessary skill, staff than she has ever shown. You do not cross Sarah Palin, you don’t even argue with her or express a contrary opinion. You can’t be that way and govern effectively. The single most telling thing about her administrative ability is her keeping Frank Bailey after it became evident that he directly pressured a Trooper Lt. in the Wooten matter. He was one of her Wasilla gang and she took all sorts of hits over giving him what was essentially a paid vacation rather than fire him. I took some grief in my time for being unduly solicitous of my staff, but I’d have kicked Bailey to the curb so fast it would have made your head swim to watch it, and I’d have done it even if I’d have told him to make the call. Sometimes your job is to fall on your sword and your reward will be in Heaven. Anyway, any fool should know that all listed Trooper numbers are recorded; fire him for the lack of mission security if nothing else.

          • mschmitt

            … wasn’t Wooten kind of a s***-bag?

          • Achance

            In fact, when it first came to light that his discipline had been reduced by a resolution with the union, I had an “Oh, s$%t moment” and called one of my former subordinates that was still brave enough to talk to me and said, “please tell me my name isn’t on that grievance resolution.” Turns out it wasn’t. Literally days after I retired, the Department of Public Safety trotted over with a proposed settlement and my successor, who probably should have questioned it, but I can see why she didn’t, signed off on DPS’ recommendation. The back story is the long-time appointee, like many of us, thought Knowles was going to win the election and she was trying to curry a little favor with the Troopers’ union. It’s an object lesson in what that will get you anyway. That particular appointee didn’t last long after Palin took her hand off the Bible.

            And, yes, he was and is a scumbag, but I don’t think I’d have backed firing him on the original complaint. Old, self-interested complaints from family members on a Trooper in the middle of a nasty divorce ain’t the sort of thing I want to stake either my State’s money or my reputation on. I’d have given him the full thirty day suspension without pay or benefits that is the steepest discipline short of dismissal we did and I damn well wouldn’t have resolved it down; that’s why the whole thing stayed in Public Safety until after I left. They’d have NEVER stuck that resolution under my nose.

            Disciplinary standards in AST had dropped badly during the Knowles Administration and it isn’t so much a Democrat thing; Democrats are generally hard on misbehaving LEOs. Trouble is, Democrats can’t say no to their union friends, so when they discipline a cop, the union whines, and the discipline gets reduced or goes away altogether. The Troopers’ contract doesn’t allow the union to grieve a letter of reprimand, so DPS started giving reprimands for things that should have gotten big suspensions. When we tried to ramp up the discipline levels in Murkowski, the union would just come in and slap down the reprimands for other Troopers on similar offenses and that would be the disciplinary standard. Consequenltly, we’d get our discipline reduced on disparate treatment grounds. We were making progress, but it was slow because arbitrators would bite on the disparate treatment. By the last year though, politics was dictating everything, so I’m sure charming old John Cyr just breezed into the DC’s office and said, let’s just get this smelly thing off our plate now that Art isn’t around to say no. The rest is history.

          • mschmitt

            You say that she is brutal on her staff (doesn’t allow dissent, etc.), self-centered and self-interested, etc., so on and so forth (combining what I understand you to have said across several threads, now).

            I have to admit, I’m not sure I understand how what you’re saying about her management style differs from “running a tight ship”; but I can assume for a moment that it does. Though here, at the same time, you also say she should have curbed Frank Bailey in order to save her own skin.

            How exactly do those points square? I get that you’re making the point that she lacks political savvy, but it seems like you’re actually making the point that she sticks up for her guys even when it’s inconvenient to do so… Or are you also saying that she plays favorites with her staff?

            I understand your point and agree that the phone record re: Wooten (and separately the Yahoo email account) speak to a level of naivety, but it’s still boy-scout level s*** on the Bill Clinton scale of ethics. And, from what I could learn about the Wooten case (though maybe I didn’t get the unbiased scoop, who knows), he should have been fired about 5 times over.

          • mschmitt

            I know you’re probably not claiming that she lacks ‘political savvy’, but whatever you’d call that (not firing a guy who makes you look bad).

          • Warrior

            “I?m waiting for someone to show me what she did as Governor and demonstrate how it was unequivocally a good thing.” I think you will be witing a long time. I don’t remember anyone saying she or her governorship was “unequivocally a god thing.” I don’t believe, short of Jesus Christ, it can be said about anybody.

            Besides, what champion of conservatism do you have in mind as our standard bearer? Huckabee? Romney? Newt? All have flaws and failures and so will anyone we choose. So what?

            I’ve said it many times before — a Republican white man will not win in ’12. Maybe we can run Michelle Bachmann? Naaahh, probably has flaws too…

          • Achance

            because all the praise is both uninformed and unequivocal. Many of her supporters are absolutely convinced that she is Sarah the Perfect and will brook no questioning of her. I have yet to meet more than a handful of politicians that I even liked and none that I could worship; good enough works for me.

            But if she’s being touted as a conservative standard bearer, some people had better be able to point out what makes her a conservative other than on abortion; there’s graphic evidence there. And I rely on little inside knowledge in my criticisms of her record. I haven’t exchanged more than half a dozen words with her since she left the Murkowski Administration and even people that I know well who were inside her administration were very, very tight-lipped for fear of retribution if something got out.

  • smitch61

    She may run, or she may just be a huge factor in choosing the next nominee. If she runs, she will run… period…As a conservative living in Liberal Michigan as I do, the Palin talk among many democrats I know, or come in contact with at the workplace is very positive,, very positive… she runs, she wins.

    • mbecker908

      Kerry and Dean.

  • jyalai

    support her. If she cannot bring the independents back to the Republican party, she will not have enough impetus to carry us to a win. Independents will support her, if she keeps focused on limited government, fiscal responsibility, and ethical governing. The media will attack her relentlessly. The independents have a bad habit of letting the media sway their vote.

    Truthfully, this focus will work for almost any of our Republican candidates.

    • SteveLA
  • Finrod

    My advice, at least, is one of the lessons I took from watching Bush: pick people who are loyal to the conservative movement and its goals, not people who are mostly personally loyal. In the long run, loyalty to ideas is more enduring and a better guarantee of quality work.

    The other advantage of picking fellow conservatives instead of friends is that fellow conservatives will in general be much more understanding of resigning to ‘take one for the team’ when someone needs to resign because the circumstances dictate that the Administration will be better off without them than with them. Friends are more likely to take it personally.

  • cjohnson

    Now she can get the photos of her and Mayor Bloomberg that he was hiding:
    http://winstonscat.blogspot.com/2009/11/bloomberg-hid-photos-of-him-and-palin.html

  • Menlo

    At this point, I am not interested in 2010, let alone 2012. NO future election will matter one whit if we can’t defeat this health scare bill!

  • Scope

    I have not read a comment here, but, I ask, please stop with the Palin diaries here at Redstate. They are very volatile, divisive, argumentative, and very destructive to the Republican party as a whole. Those that have a need to educate/remind people how bad Palin is are destructive to this site. If you think about how many people out there support Palin, and I promise they are in the thousands, come here and read Palin bashing, they are gone. You don’t have to be a Palinista to get really turned off by the bashing. The sad part of it is that’s it’s only by a few, and, they remind us at every mention of Palin, again, and again, and again.

    • Streiff

      of saying “bite me” but I can’t come up with one so I won’t say anything.

      • Scope

        and, I noticed you don’t have anything else here to contribute that asking me to “bite you.” It’s not nice to hold grudges with those that have disagreed with you in the past.

        • Streiff

          I just want to make a couple of points here.

          First, I don’t recall ever having disagreeing with yoiu. What I do recall are instances, like you did on this thread, of you swooping in to disapprove of someone else’s work. News flash: you have to have credibility to do that and you get credibility by contributing. I checked your archives and you’ve written two posts in the 1+ year you’ve been a member. Check Dan’s archives, or mine, which are strung over three different locations and comprise about 1,000 posts each.

          Second, I don’t know what your problem is but I am the guy who can fix it. If you don’t think so, just keep it up.

          • Scope

            “Second, I don?t know what your problem is but I am the guy who can fix it. If you don?t think so, just keep it up” So, have you been appointed the head of the comments section of Redstate? Just asking.

          • Finrod

            Since Streiff is a front-pager, the place to take questions about him is to email the contact address. It’s pretty much always a bad idea to try asking the kind of question you just did in comments. I’m guessing you didn’t realize he’s a FPer?

          • Scope

            “Second, I don?t know what your problem is but I am the guy who can fix it. If you don?t think so, just keep it up” So, have you been appointed the head of the comments section of Redstate? Just asking.

          • Jack_Savage

            Drop this, and take some time to enjoy yourself. Believe me, I have been involved in some things here that peeved me off to a point that it affected other areas of my life. The people that post here wouldn’t post here unless they had strong opinions. Sometimes it gets personal (like some unnecessary taunting recently), then it cools down. Hopefully Streiff will check out Third Street’s posting history and call offsetting penalties, then you both will hug somewhere down the line. Or not.

            BTW, Streiff CAN make you disappear. Don’t make him.

            I strongly recommend “Night At The Museum” which will be on very soon, or the FSU basketball game which will come on at 9:00 pm tonight. That’s where I am heading.

          • janis
          • penguin2

            This is Thanksgiving. A truce called by all parties concerned would make this RedState soul happy.

            This community needs everyone’s good input. I am appreciative of that on this day.

          • Scope

            Achance has posted links to me for looking into Alaska state budgets. I looked at those links, and, had I not, I was being accused of not appreciating the info that Achance provided, and that I was ignoring him. You are asking me to ignore what I have been challenged to do. If I ignored him, it would have been caise for still another attacks against anyone who has the first thought of Palin support. Why aren’t you asking that Achance, and the anti’s stop their attacks on those that have done nothing more than post any positive support of Palin. I agree that when any Palin diary is posted, that everyone ignore the diary, and, make no comments. It seems to be at the point that people are posting Palin diaries, because they get alot of comments. If you choose to advise anyone, I would ask that you choose to advise everyone. I asked for that early in the diary, and, was told immediately, by Strieff, that I should “bite him.” Then he said that if I had any problems, he would be the guy to take care of my problems. Somehow, I do have a problem with believing that because someone asks to stop the wars, and then being told to “bite me” for asking that is a qualifier for a “bite me”omment. And, to be told that he is the guy that will “fix my problem” is even remotely rational? If Strieff wants to ban me, have at it. I didn’t do anything wrong, and, I don’t appreciate being told by someone that I shouldn’t make a plea to stop the Palin Wars. And, if “bite me” is the reason I get banned, hey, as they say, I’ve been trown out of better bars than this. Thanks Janis for at least recognizing that I exist.

          • Tbone

            or a Redstate Moderator. Just sayin’.

          • Jack_Savage

            Here is what I am saying. This discussion is way past the point where anyone on either side will be swayed. I admire your dogged persistence and defense of Sarah, but today is Thanksgiving, and you have better things to do than continue down this path. It has gotten personal with you, as it has at times with me (we happen to be on the same side), and I am telling you that you are at the point where some time away from this issue would do you some good. I speak from experience. Take a look at some of my comments on Sarah and you will see.

            I appreciate you looking at Alaska’s financials, and your analysis was interesting. I am going to look more closely in the days to come.

            I am 100% in agreement with you on the Palin wars, and my advice for right now is to be the change you seek.

          • JadedByPolitics

            You are correct but you will not win this fight with Streiff because even though I have NEVER seen a FP’gr utilize that language he is a FP’gr so my suggestion to you is walk away. You of course attempted to do something and it is obvious to anyone who watched the whole thing unfold that something was a suggestion to STOP the Palin diaries for awhile because there are about 30-40 who LOVE her and about 5-6 who HATE her and lets be serious they HATE her.

            So take my advice NONE OF THEM are worth a damn dime of your time. Don’t enter a Palin diary hell you can do this battle at KOS where at least they say I HATE HER!!! The other 95% of the diaries are fun and interesting and can use your insight.

            Sarah Palin isn’t going ANYWHERE and she doesn’t need you or me to do battle for her on Redstate! She NEEDS you and me to do battle for her against the LEFTIST press as does EVERY Conservative. Lets ignore what is said here and devote our time to KICKING the crap out of the LEFT! It does make for a more enjoyable day.

          • mschmitt

            this is where the fight for the future of our party is occurring. It’s why I got involved at RedState. Now, and for the foreseeable future, the talking heads and disembodied voices are taking their cues from us.

            There may be thousands of readers here who love Sarah Palin, but if the 2 or 3 vocal ones of us shut our lips, RedState will soon treat Palin as Paul (as you’re starting to see).

            If we (RedState) don’t back her, then eventually no one will; and that would be a travesty if (as it appears to me) she deserves our support.

          • JadedByPolitics

            These petty sniping isn’t worth OUR time. It is a sad state of affairs that Palin is treated this way ANYWHERE let alone on a Conservative site but she is. They can treat her as Paul but she is NO Paul. She is so much bigger her base is so much more REFINED and the thing people on the left and RIGHT fear most FEMALE. She will hold her base of MILLIONS no matter what is said here. I am sure you belong to her facebook page her ning page her PAC…right?

            If you value Redstate and I do and I was here during the primary wars then you will see that by IGNORING the haters they eventually have NOTHING to hate. I am telling you that those 5 are NOT changing their minds. The minds that will be changed are the thousands who view this site daily and see the HATE. They perhaps will NOT come back thinking this site is anti-Palin when the truth is IT IS NOT. So by feeding the frenzy of those 5 or 6 the eyes that view this site get a BAD picture of Redstate.

            They are not the small enterprise they were just a scant 3 yrs ago and I would rather they grow then LOSE those who have great respect for Sarah NO MATTER the reason they respect her. I am just saying do you really think that those of us who like her need to do battle with a few ankle biters? really? come on WE have better things to do.

          • penguin2

            staying out of the Palin diaries, because there seems to be several things going on. I understand Achance, as I have said before I respect his input because he actually brings some facts and info. But there are some others that just seem to show up, as I called out Third Street above in this diary and another one two days ago, who deliberately make snide remarks. Those individuals who come into a Sarah diary to do just that make things ugly, trying to start a fire and trouble. Instigators.

            Somehow there has to be a reasonable line between attacking the issue vs attacking the person making the comment. I understood why Scope made the request she did. She was referencing the terrible acrimony that had occurred in “that’sright’s ” diary on Sunday. The one where the moderator had to step in and shut it down. Can this be good for RedState?

            Personally, I hope this can be set aside for now and we can focus on 2010. I do not want RedState to appear anti-Palin, but neither do I want people to think we are Palinbots deserving of scorn. Most of us are quite objective and I can be supportive of a number of people and in the end will do just what Becker said somewhere in this thread, we’ll go for who we want in the primary and all get behind our candidate in the general.

            And now I have done what I had said I would not do, get involved in a Palin diary. :)

          • Richard Mullins

            but it never means I’m blind to things that she has done wrong. I like her to a point and don’t want to be seen as a bot. We she needs defending, I’ll defend her. Right now her charisma is something in dire need.

            Never think of me a hater, just of me some that’s looking at both sides of the issue.

          • penguin2

            I’ve seen you reasonably questioning, and if you are snide it has gone over my head. Because in general, I don’t see you making snide remarks. Nothing wrong with respectful disagreement or just questioning. There just seems to be such vitriol surrounding any discussion of Sarah and it is disturbing to see it. I mean last Sunday, if Sarah or her staff had read RS that day, I think they would have thought we were the Left. Maybe I am taking it too seriously, but I don’t think so.

            I think one of the things that sets off these fires is how things are said vs what is said. And gratuitous snide remarks in Sarah diaries just seems wrong. Again, you and there others who do not do this, but I tracked at least one and have seen what is going on.

            There are strong personalities and passion here, which is needed. Just sometimes people forget and cross the line and forget we are all here for the same reason. I really don’t have any good answers.

          • mschmitt

            … I’ve stopped recommending Palin-related diaries because I’d prefer to focus on 2010.

            But, for when they do pop up, it’s up to us to make sure we’re informed and ready to debate. If we’re supposed to read the budgets, then let’s read the budgets. If we’re supposed to research pipelines, let’s research pipelines. They’re either (A) right (and we’ve been sucked in), (B) honestly mistaken, (C) misogynist, or (D) being petty and sniping because they don’t personally like her.

            Until I know for sure which it is, I’ll keep right on sticking my nose in there. I have some strong suspicions, and they vary from person to person (By the way, Scope and Jaded: I also think that the misogyny complaint is probably true in general — eg., in the lefty press — but probably not for the major players that we’re debating here — at least, not from what I’ve seen/heard; and I actually agree with them that using that as an argument is not helpful — it’s certainly a diagnosis that must be made by exclusion.).

            I think it’s worth continuing the debate. I know I’m trying to get myself more educated and more involved in the argument.

          • penguin2

            That’s what it is all about. And yes, I believe Art has given us infor that is disappointing to me about Sarah, but it is best not to have blinders on. OTOH, I can’t think of any other candidate right now that doesn’t have some baggage, and it should come out on them as well. In the end, we hopefully will have a good, decent and strong candidate for 2012. As much as I like Sarah, at this point I don’t want her to run. There is too much stuff that needs clearing out to be done from 2008.

            We are thinking alike, mschmitt, we want reasonable discussion and information. Maybe, everyone will back up and think about it, and go that route.

          • Third Street

            And instead of responding to me there, you simply take shots at me elsewhere. I’m not impressed.

            The acrimony in the diary you cite came mostly from Palin’s supporters. Some of them here are truly angry and venomous, attacking anybody who might question their girl. It’s enough to make one wonder whether Palin is in the wrong party.

            I’m sorry some of SP’s fans are so thin-skinned that they can’t engage in an honest discussion about her and instead decide they have to wage war against anyone who speaks up to say that she might not be The Messiah after all. But that’s not my fault.

          • penguin2

            It just has been something I observed and because all of this is coming out tonight, I brought it up again. If I am wrong, fine. that’s the difference I have no problem willing to look at things and adjust my thinking. I believe snide remarks are made in Sarah dairies and that sets up fires. Some people take things personally and then it is off to the races. Everybody loses.

            I like Sarah, I am learning about her. No, she isn’t perfect, but I am not worried about that right now. Again, as I said above somewhere, it is not so much what is said, but how it is said.

          • Finrod

            I mean, stuff like ‘And by the way, shove it. You’re a venomous, humorless pile of crap’ sounds like angry and venomous to me.

            If that’s your idea of an ‘honest discussion’ then I think you need to read a dictionary.

          • Third Street
          • Finrod

            Frankly I’ve gotten tired of the flamewars here over Sarah Palin, so I’m trying in this post at least to tamp down both sides.

            You’re the only one that’s responded with rancor so far. What does that say about you? You write decent stuff and make your own contribution here when you’re not talking about Sarah Palin, but when it comes to her, you seem like an old-fashioned Dr. Jekyll/Mr. Hyde.

          • Third Street
      • Scope

        and, I noticed you don’t have anything else here to contribute that asking me to “bite you.” It’s not nice to hold grudges with those that have disagreed with you in the past.

    • Tbone

      go to church camp.

      Personally, I enjoy watching idiots bash Palin because she is “unqualified”, and I enjoy watching idiots try to convince us she has great qualifications.

      The current fact is that she is the only Republican that can draw a crowd bigger than the high school gym in Podunk, USA. If this stays true and she spends the next two years growing a little grey hair on her temples she’ll beat Hillary in 2012.

    • Section9

      People can praise or bash Palin to their hearts content.

      Events will take care of themselves.

    • Third Street

      Her book just came out, probably the most anticipated book of the year; she’s everywhere promoting it; she’s there every time you turn on the TV; she’s a hot topic right now. It follows that she’s going to show up in RedState diaries more often.

      But if just talking about her is “very volatile, divisive, argumentative, and very destructive to the Republican party as a whole”, what’s going to happen if she runs for President?

      • penguin2

        diary earlier today. Every opportunity, you guys come around and make a snide remark. And yes events will take care of themselves, but circular fire is destructive. For now, It would be nice if you all could find something or someone on the left to unleash so much of this energy on.

        • hbgconservative

          Bashing Sarah Palin. The pathetic (and laughable) thing about it is, they think it’s getting them somewhere. It’s not; they just look more and more foolish with each vicious attack. Keep it going, boys, you can’t make a dent on her. lol

        • hbgconservative

          They have yet to put a credible argument together, too. Don’t hold your breath, though.

        • Third Street

          …factual statements and legitimate questions aren’t “snide remarks”. I mean, come on: Palin’s our best hope for President, but we can’t talk openly about her or it’ll blow up the party? Wha-a-a?

          • hbgconservative

            have posted nothing but facts, as well as passionate, heartful feelings on this site. We post them numerous times, but you still accuse us of being “Palinbots.” (Coming from you, though, that’s a compliment). It doesn’t matter how many times we post them; you’re obsessed with hating Palin and you always will be. But there is something you can’t get past, no matter how many angry rants you post: Palin supporter/fans outnumber you 10 to 1. haha.

          • Achance

            talking points from Palin’s press releases. You were stupid enough in a post in another thread to go on about how much good the gas line had done for Alaska. Fool, it ain’t built yet! The only place that gas line has done any good is in Canada where they’ve been busily spending the half billion dollars Sarah foolishly gave them.

            She makes a good lightning rod on the National scene these days and it is good to have somebody to attract the Ds ire, but don’t come on here talking about what a great goveror of Alaska she was. She was a lousy governor who splintered the Republican Party here, was instrumental in giving the Ds a federal office held by Republicans since the ’60, caused our Republican Senate to become a coalition Senate giving great power to liberal Democrat senators, including Elton and French who led the TrooperGate investigation.

            And now she writes that book reopening all those old wounds and once again trashing everybody around her. It is always the good and true Sarah, Alaska’s Polly Perfect, and everybody around her is venal, lazy, stupid, or just wrong, and Sarah has to step in and set it right. Lots of people don’t see it that way.

          • Richard Mullins

            Trans-Canada is going to take that Half a billion and do nothing at all. I’m sure of that and the fix was already in and Sarah just made sure she keep up with her promise. Self serving idiots are people I don’t like. I never knew that the Democratic Party of Texas’ plant in Alaska would be so helpful(major snark on my part).

          • Achance

            Sarah Palin ran against the evil Murkowski Administration’s gas pipeline deal with the North Slope producers. She went on and on about how Murkowski’s deal was giving Alaska’ s share of the revenue to the producers, our natural gas to the Lower 48, and most of the pipeline construction jobs to Canada. She sought and got the support of former Governor Hickel almost solely on the basis of her support for an in-state gas line to terminate with an LNG plant in Valdez and have spurs to supply natural gas for heating and electricity for the Railbelt (ANC to FAI). Her support for an in-state gas line was one of the things she used to most strongly distinguish herself from Murkowski and much of her support was from the Railbelt on the basis of her promise to bring NS gas to them (Cook Inlet gas to supply the ANC area is running out and the rest of the Railbelt is on expensive oil or dirty coal).

            Then, in her quest to be the Un-Murkowski, she hooks up with Marty Rutherford and the rest of the Department of Natural Resources gang that had quit the Murkowski Administration over the gas line deal Murkowski had negotiated. Once she was in office and had appointed Marty as Commissioner of DNR, later she moved to Deputy, I think, and she brought back Tom Irwin, Murkowski’s commissioner of DNR who had quit, never a word was said about an in-state line again. They cranked up the AGIA (Alaska Gasline Inducement Act) and threw it out to seek proposers. It was written specifically to pretty much exclude the NS producers and might have been shortened to “Is your Company’s name TransCanada?” and everybody has pretty much over looked the fact that Marty had worked for TransCanada.

            So, you pick it Richard, she was either stupid enough to have been led down the primrose path by her appointees into a deal that flew in the face of her campaign promises or she was disingenuous enough to court Governor Hickel’s support and run on the promise of an instate line and immediately and willfully turn her back on that promise and on Governor Hickel’s support; there is no Door C.

            And you don’t have to believe me, it’s all public record and was in the news all through the campaign and the legislative debate on AGIA. If you know enough of the background to read between the lines, she even admits as much in her book although, of course, everything that didn’t work out or which hasn’t yet borne fruit is somebody else’s fault.

          • Richard Mullins

            so it didn’t matter one bit if Murkowski was around or not. Idiots and glad handing politicians always looking to give money away. Just because Frank Murkowski was in the way, only proves power lust was there from the get go(Sarah Palin is more like Carol Ketton Etc than anything else[working to tear down the incumbent from the inside]). At this point, it doesn’t matter at all.

      • Tbone

        She will win and you will vote for her. What’s your point?

  • Richard Mullins

    comes to our main target,BHO, Really, we need to focus like a laser beam on the commissar in chief and not get side tracked. 2008 was the election of the trial balloon in the form of Barack Obama. If we can remind the electorate of that up until November, 2012 it should work out well for us. Otherwise we as a Nation are doomed. All guns need to be fixed in the right position(and don’t forget the Political Nukes that need right now).

    • Scope

      n/t

      • AKSteveB

        One thing supporters and detractors both realize is that she tends to leave a lot of bodies in her wake. She doesn’t seem to wear well on a lot of people. If this happens again, where are her followers going? Emotional movements just don’t last that long and when honeymoons are over, the divorce is often close behind.

        We do need her followers. They are a demographic that the Repubs have mostly paid lip service to while not doing much about their issues (admittedly the Dems just hate them!). They do a lot of the real work in campaigns and a lot of the real work in this country. I worry about where they go if she does follow her past pattern and burns out.

        • Third Street

          Sarah Palin could be the Ron Paul of 2012. I know a few Paulians who would likely have otherwise voted for McCain, but were so bitter that Paul ultimately never went anywhere that they just stayed home.

          Paul was basically a fringe movement, though. Palin could be another matter and have a bigger impact if she doesn’t get the nomination.

          • Richard Mullins

            RP is just like Andre Marrou(his brother just had his last news sometime back), a Hard core Libertarian that doesn’t care about anything but himself. Cults of Personality make this work in the wrong direction.

        • Richard Mullins

          but the politician does come off strong with her. She has charisma but so does Joel Olsten. I really want her to go though a speaking class to get rid of that accent before 2012(accents have no place as far as the Presidency but so does no more nasal drip talk). Her Charisma is needed more than anything else at this point. No hate from me on SP but cautious though about her.

      • Richard Mullins
  • smitch61

    Whether she runs or not is not really the issue. She speaks her mind and tells it like it is. She can speak to the individual that does not pay attention to politics. The Dem’s speak to this group, and the GOP are not good at countering the argument. Take regulations for example: During the campaign the individuals that I worked with who drank the Kool aid would always say ” John McCain wanted to do away with REGULATIONS so it is all his fault”,,, the GOP should have jumped on that bandwagon and explained that regulations are federal government control. I don’t care if she runs, I care that she speaks.

    • Richard Mullins

      but I don’t she would have run for office. It seems that Sarah Palin is more like Ma Ferguson(part of the Ferguson clan of dueling governors), than anything else. I she wants to help, do it with going out and speak for the Conservative base instead of running again. I don’t any losing lackey to be out there in 2012. I want fresh faces then.

  • Rod_Patrick

    I disagree with the analysis of Dowd that the Republican nominee has “to do nothing … and just wait for Obama to SELF-DESTRUCT.”

    This is the strategy being followed by Huck, Mitt, David Frum, David Brooks, and others. This is a lazy and very precarious strategy and is outrightly wrong, IMHO.

    Dowd is still living in the past. He’s still BLIND that the Democrats’ machineries have greatly advanced since 2006.

    MSM is just an example of these advanced warfare by the liberals. Dowd doesn’t factor the difference between the news media during the Bush era and the news media today. We have practically a “State-Run Media” at present.

    Even if Obama completely destroys the economy, at least 40% of the Americans will still continue to ADORE AND WORSHIP him. Thanks to the liberal bias of the MSM. I hope that I’m wrong but Obama’s approval numbers may never drain like what happened to Dowd’s former boss, GWB. So, I think that Obama is typically assured of a second term.

    For me, to win 2012, all Republican/Conservative hopefuls must START HIS WAR against Obamaoism … NOW and NOT LATER IN 2011 primaries. The need to invest time and money now. Yes, it can be costly, knowing that fact that only one will actually take the Republican/Conservative Banner. But these hopefuls must realize that “Defeating Obama in 2012 requires the highest Order of sacrifice”.

    In exchange for their sunk investments, consider this as “sure” return:

    An Free America for all our children and future grandchilden.

    To date, Palin is doing that kind of investment, which is good. De Mint and Pawlenty are also doing that, but not enough to create a bandwagon. I hope the rest will follow Palin’s lead. Doing everything in her power to fight Obamaoism.

    Nevertheless, I still believe and support Fred Thompson for 2012. I will support whoever Fred decides to support on 2012. I still trust him, not any Bushite. If Fred supports Palin in 2012, then PALIN IT SHALL BE.*

    *The funny thing is this: FredT seems like coaching Palin for her 2012 run. If Fred really thinks that Palin is the one who can potentially defeat the Socialist Obama, I hope that he’s doing his best in preparing her.

    A MUCH MUCH TOUGHER CANDIDATE IS NECESSARY TO FIGHT OBAMA.

    Palinites should realize that. Can Palin further toughen herself? Well, I’m a very eager observer.

  • phototiger

    Although I can appreciate the desire to have Mitch Daniels lead our nation when ability and qualifications are seriously lacking in our current president, Daniels has said repeatedly that he does not plan to run for that office. I realize that many politicians have said that and then did an about-face, but I doubt that Daniels would do that because he is a man of his word and he gained the trust of voters in my state of Indiana with his honesty and his ability. There is no question in my mind that he could do the job, but I think that he doesn’t want it and I can’t blame him.

  • AKSteveB

    why not just go through the records. Look at articles about her on the Anchorage Daily News site. If you don’t trust that (the ADN is left), try the Fairbanks News Miner (which tends toward center right). Read her book, then compare.

    • aesthete

      When they have a politicians’ memoirs (which are, of course, known for being one of the great founts of truth) to go on?

      • Scope

        you equate all conservatives to those who only rely on a single book by Palin in what they believe and think. That is beneath you from what I have seen you post. Why do you need to go there?

      • Scope

        you equate all conservatives to those who only rely on a single book by Palin in what they believe and think. That is beneath you from what I have seen you post. Why do you need to go there?

        • aesthete

          hbgcon, Gary, and Josh Painter, who are, in fact, completely deluded when it comes to Mrs. Palin. Though Jaded and you have been involved in supporting Palin, and though I think you guys are wrong, you definitely don’t fall into the Palinbot category, IMO.

          • mschmitt

            … I think there is possibly some Palin mobying going around, as well, IMO.

          • aesthete
    • Scope

      on Palin. I am not sold on Palin, but, the last thing I would do is to rely on any newspaper articles about her. They are all written by authors with a personal bent, for or against. I prefer to not rely on any one persons opinion.

    • Scope

      on Palin. I am not sold on Palin, but, the last thing I would do is to rely on any newspaper articles about her. They are all written by authors with a personal bent, for or against. I prefer to not rely on any one persons opinion.

      • AKSteveB

        Yeah, there is bias we know that. If you do take the time to go through them from the time she was in the AOGC until post McCain, you’ll find an interesting pattern that won’t match your expectations. The ADN (again left wing for sure) actually liked her a whole lot, until McCain picked her. I’m just saying you will get a better perspective on the big picture.

  • Scope

    Did Palin increase any taxes. I believe that Alaska does not have a state income tax, but, did she raise any taxes in Alaska, and if so, what were they for.

    Did Palin increase the government beauracracy by adding more departments, divisions, or anything else that added more state employees to the states budget.

    I understand that Alaska doesn’t have a big illegal problem. How were the illegals handled in Alaska, if they were found.

    Did Palin ever cut the budget for essential services such as police, fireman etc.

    Did Palin ever cut the budget for the military presence or support in Alaska.

    Finally, what did Palin do wrong for the Alaskans. There is so much about Palin not accomplishing anything, but, what did she do to harm any Alaskan. That should be the starting point for Palin rather than what she didn’t accomplish. I would be interested in seeing what any Republican Governor did to help their state that Palin falterd on.

    You can bring on any financials you want. How about that we have a side by side comparison of every other Republican Governor as a fair comparison.

    • Achance

      your lack of understanding of both the Alaskan political and economic systems or the roles of the state and federal governments, but I’ll give it a shot.

      One of her hallmark legislative endeavors was a dramatic increase in taxes on the oil industry. So, much so that both the instabilty of Alaska’s taxation regime and the high taxes, especially, at high prices act as a disincentive to badly needed oil development in Alaska. If a Democrat had done it, it would have been widely decried as a “windfall profits tax.” The real issue is that the easy oil has all been found and it takes high prices to justify development of ever more remote and difficult fields. Thus, only when prices are high is there any incentive to develop Alaska’s more difficult fields. Palin’s ACES tax regime is pretty much confiscatory when prices are over $70-$80/bbl., and many believe are much too low at low prices.

      Depends on who you ask and how you count them. She didn’t add any departments, but we have all the federal model departments and some of our own as well. There will always be some incremental growth in employees when you increase spending but she made no dramatic increases in the number of employees at the State level. All the State transfers down to the polisubs and out to contractors however resulted in dramatic increases in the number of employees at that level. State spending is the primary reason that urban Alaska has one of the lower unemployment rates in the Country even in the recession.

      The State of Alaska has no enforcement responsibility regarding illegal aliens. We’re not a “sanctuary” state and I don’t think we have any de jure sanctuary cities, so, if they find one, they call ICE. ICE fairly routinely makes show the flag raids on the fish processer and canneries, the hot spot for illegals and from time to time the sex trade gets roughed up a little to keep them below the radar.

      The only police and fire the State has are about 400 State Trooper and a couple hundred Airport Police and Fire Officers at the ANC and FAI airports. The APFOs are largely paid for out of program receipts from landing fees and concessions at the airports so I don’t know of any changes during her tenure. One of the big beefs between her and Commissioner Monegan was that he wanted more money to recruit to fill his many vacant Trooper positions. When I was there, Trooper vacancies were bordering on critical and we simply could not adequately staff many areas and many shifts. Troopers had languished during Knowles because Ds aren’t much interested in law enforcement and there was neither any money nor much love in the Legislature for the Troopers, whose union had tried to take out some prominent legislators. When the price of oil started to tick up during Murkowski, we threw some money at them but not enough to have a dramatic effect. The State was rolling in money, Monegan wanted to hire Troopers, and the Gov’s office wouldn’t let him. So while she didn’t cut, she willfully allowed an already bad situation to get worse.

      I don’t know of anything she cut the budget for on a year to year basis, the budgets went up and up from ’05 – ’09 and SFY ’10 declined a bit because of declining revenue. She likes to brag about her line items but they’re on reductions in the increases and were almost exclusively political paybacks. You can go look at the budget books for specifics, I’m not going to do your homework for you.

      Alaska has no responsibility for or authority over the military presence here. We welcome it, we support it, but we don’t pay for it. We also don’t pay for the National Guard that she likes to style herself the CIC of except in the rare ocassions that we put them on State Active Duty for fire fighting or disasters, and even then they get paid out of our largely federal disaster and firefighting funds.

      Trying to keep this at the “all Alaskans” level rather than “Alaska Republcans” level:

      Because Sarah began in ’06 to vociferously criticize Murkowski’s gas pipeline deal, it never really even got legislative consideration. Her objections weren’t the whole of the opposition, everybody running for governor had their better idea, but more than a year was lost. She ran as a proponent of an in-state gas line but abandoned that almost immediately, so now four years are lost towards an in-state line. Her AGIA scheme completely and willfully excluded the people that own the rights to North Slope gas and set up a “competition” where TransCanada was the only competitor. So far, they have done nothing except spend some portion of the half-billion dollars she gave them as an “incentive.” Consequently, four years have now been lost on a gas pipeline to a Canadian hub and the Lower 48. Frankly, I don’t believe my children will see a line to Canada and the Lower 48. An in-state line to an LNG plant at Valdez would both catch Hell from Congress over exporting the resource AND not have a US West Coast market because the NIMBYs won’t allow LNG terminals. So, what Alaska really needed to do was start figuring out how to get gas available for instate use and use the competitive advantage of low energy prices to attract more diverse economic endeavors to our state, but that would have required thinking past the bullet points.

      Her ACES taxation scheme has incensed the oil industry and they have all but abandoned Alaska as a future source of oil development. The TAPS is carrying only about a third of its capacity now and is reaching the end of its economic life at current production levels. If there is no more production available to the TAPS, when it becomes non-viable, it must be disassembled and the right of way restored. The remaining oil and gas reserves on the North Slope are then stranded and oil and gas production in Alaska comes to an end. That taxation scheme was populist pandering, pure and simple. She knew that Alaskans were PO’d at Exxon for fighting the Exxon Valdez awards and she glommed onto those sentiments and said, I’m gonna get those greedy, mean, corrupt oil companies. If a Democrat says that stuff, Republicans excoriate them. Guess it’s different if you’re Sarah the Perfect.

      She did essentially nothing to address the critically high cost of energy in rural Alaska beyond bring a CARE package out with Franklin Graham. There were things that could and should have been done, but she chose a photo-op. There has yet to be any intelligent discussion of that issue at any level that can do anything about it.

      Now that’s as far as I’m going with your gotcha game. You go to the State’s very transparent records and make your opposing case. You can read budgets, right?

    • Achance
  • Scope

    http://www.americanthinker.com/2009/11/the_wilding_of_sarah_palin.html

    What I have taken from this article is that some men,who are not the most secure in their maleness, have a problem with women that have gotten to the positions that they should never have gotten to, because by damn they are only women. No doubt that some are resentful because they have not reached the pinnacles that a few women have. The real men are not sexist and understand that sometimes women are as valid as the male sex.

    • Achance

      any criticism of The Won is met with a charge of racism. With you, jaded, and several others, any criticism of Palin is met with a charge or misogyny, or following that article, worse. Both are devices to cut off any meaningful discussion of the person’s character, philosophy, knowledge, skill, and ability.

      Never once have you or any other Palin supporter responded subtantively to criticisms of her. You almost militantly won’t look at her record. I gave you the cites to Alaska’s budget and revenue documents yesterday and you responded with a bunch of questions that principally indicated that you didn’t know a thing about Alaska or her record or even what the responsibiities of various levels of government are. I responded supstantively, though I’m pretty certain it was a waste and not a word from you or really any of the other regular Palin supporters.

      If you’re going to be a mind-numbed follower, perhaps you’d be happier as a Democrat.

      • Richard Mullins

        and I read her response to me like Helen Thomas(very bad picture indeed). Simply put I am not a supporter of SP[I'm going to use that from now on] and do see a Power hungry person. I think I should ask her to get rid that accent before running again.

        • Achance

          to the way West Coast women talk. Hers is sorta the Alaska version of that with a little of Todd’s family’s Yupik accent on top of the West Coast, which makes it sound a little clipped. Give me two weeks or a month in The Bush and I come back sounding like I’m half Yupik. It’s an easy accent to pick up because the dialect is so rhythmic.

          • Richard Mullins

            and since I do my best to pronounce things without a lisp or the Obama tone(I hated it from day one). I thought since your from Georgia that your accent is unbreakable. My late Grandmothers West Texas accent was unbreakable too. Anyways, I can’t stand to listen to 3 more years of Long breaths in the middle of talking.

        • Scope

          what tou said above. Your post is unreadable. I have considered that possibly your eyesight is not great, or, that you may be dislexick (sp). I do understand the small portion that you managed to type correctly in saying that my response to you was like Helen Thomas. Above, I responded to one of your posts by saying that “No one is making Palin the annointed one.” I should have been more clear in saying that no one commenting in this thread is saying that Palin is the annointed one. To compare me to Helen Thomas is beneath my dignity to respond to.

          I have begun to view your comments, as they go downthread, and the ones that are readable, as nothing more than jumping on the bandwagon of pile on. In other words, let me throw my punches out also, just because others have started it. You really have added nothing to the discussion, and, you’re knowledge of Palin obviously comes from those that have already expressed their negative opinions of Palin. I can buy a parrot that will say whatever I teach it to, with no knowledge of what they are saying.

          • Richard Mullins

            Yes, I wear glasses and if I don’t have them on I can’t see. I think I need to rephrase that portion about Helen Thomas and say it reads like her kind of speech mannerism. I’m not saying that your anything close to her, so please take the baseball bat out of your hands.

            I’ve already said that I don’t mind her and I don’t obsess with her. I don’t think you understand that. If you can’t understand reason, I don’t what hope there is for you. So please stop while you’re ahead.

  • Scope

    http://www.americanthinker.com/2009/11/the_wilding_of_sarah_palin.html

    What I have taken from this article is that some men,who are not the most secure in their maleness, have a problem with women that have gotten to the positions that they should never have gotten to, because by damn they are only women. No doubt that some are resentful because they have not reached the pinnacles that a few women have. The real men are not sexist and understand that sometimes women are as valid as the male sex.

    • Third Street

      Victimhood. Fingerpointing. Sneering accusations of sexism. Rank, ugly identity politics.

      Palin 2012.

    • Achance

      There is nothing about her life that I would want. Her life is a contrivance driven by insecurity and ambition – a trait she shares with a lot of politicians. The only work-related thing she has ever demonstrated any ability at is getting elected to public office. For those of you who’ve never worked in governmetn at that level, elected officials don’t do much. Other people do a lot of work and the most the elected official does is choose which body of other people’s work to go with. If you actually do the work of a government, the only thing the elected officials, and most of the appointees, are is overhead and inconvenience.

      Sarah has had that winning combination of good looks, ruthless ambition, and luck. It has now made her a lot of money, but you’d have to be her to have that money. I’ll take my life and my family, and my somewhat more meager money any day. I’d say for the uninitiated that it has something to do with looking in the mirror every morning but that is the naive perception that so many have; it doesn’t bother the fakes to look in the mirror, they know they look good.

      • hbgconservative

        You have been obsessively bashing her for days…and before. Not resentful my butt. Keep it going, my friend, you’re providing great comic relief. HAHAHA!!!

        • mschmitt

          Whether wittingly or not, your posts have come across as very moby-ish; and in this case, unnecessarily confrontational. He doesn’t like her; I get it, you get it; and sure, it can be frustrating when people don’t see things as you do. This is a site about Republicanism and Conservatism; in principle, we’re all fighting for the same thing. Within that umbrella, we’re welcome to disagree about our candidates. If Palin is who she claims to be, then I’ll fight for her for years to come. If Art’s right and she’s a “blow-up doll” (I assume that’s the equivalent of an empty suit, but with more lipstick), then we have no use for her; but the debate has to go on.

          Now, if you wish to challenge (for example) his assertion that her life is a ‘contrivance driven by insecurity’, then go for it (by the way, Art: her life is a contrivance? I wouldn’t even say that about my actual enemies) — then heck, I’ll be right there to back you up.

          If you’re true to who you say you are; then, on behalf of other Palin supporters here, may I recommend that you raise your level of dialogue and kindly refrain from poking the bears.

          Sincerely,

          • Achance

            NOBODY can be right all the time and everybody around them be wrong. That book is all about how nothing that didn’t work out was Her fault. Everybody around her is always venal, stupid, incompetent, self-interested, corrupt, and she’s Sarah the Perfect. I’ve never been an admirer, but I thought one Helluva bunch better of it before I read that screed.

          • mschmitt

            Though I always have trouble getting all the way through any autobiography (and no, David Sage, it’s not because I can’t read)… If you’re characterization is even remotely correct, I might not make it past the cover. ;)

        • Achance

          Right behind dwarf tossing. Thinking you’re both, an idiot dwarf.

          Still waiting for that one post of yours that has one scintilla of factual information in it or was derived from something other than a press release.

        • Finrod

          As harsh and rude as Achance can be, he’s contributed a lot to this site; go back and read his past diaries if you doubt me on this point. By engaging him in a urination contest, you’re mostly just going to make yourself look bad, since you’ve been here, what, a week, and don’t have any record of contribution to the site that would cause anyone to engender good will towards you.

        • http://www.hakubi.us/ Neil Stevens

          Stick to the topic or I may have to disable your account.

          If Sarah Palin can be defended from Achance’s criticisms, then you do her a disservice by flipping out and attacking her critics instead.

          Don’t be like the Obamanauts. Seriously.

      • NHConservative0227

        to say “The only work-related thing she has ever demonstrated any ability at is getting elected to public office” I think is disingenuous at best.

        Are you going to tell me that Wasilla didn’t become a bustling economic city when she was mayor? That she had absolutely nothing to do with it?

        On the surface I always thought that she had done a great job as governor since the state a surplus and I believe Palin had an over 80% approval rating right before she accepted the VP nomination. I would think that she would have to been doing something right as governor.

        However, you do raise some interesting points. The two things you mentioned that stand out the most to me are that she didn’t do hardly anything to establish the gas pipeline and that the budget didn’t really decrease that much under her watch.

        I intend on doing some more research into those items. I’ve only read just over 100 pages in the book, I’ll comment more once I’ve finished it. However, I do think it’s a bit much to simply state that the only thing she’s ever been good at is getting elected. From what I’ve read, the book doesn’t seem like a witch-hunt to me. Palin seems to be honest about what really happened from her perspective. She clearly states her main principles as a free market conservative and talks about taking on corruption within the GOP. I’m not really so hung up on the way she did it (writing letters as opposed to speaking to the next higher in the chain of command) . The main point is that she stood up to the corruption when today it is so rampant where most politicians are either on the take or too cowardly to do anything. I don’t think it would’ve mattered much either way. This is a guy in Murkowski who didn’t appoint Palin as US senator because he was worried about the toll it would take on her as a mom and then turned around and gave the position to his daughter Lisa, a mom with two young kids.

        Besides, I would think the book must be pretty accurate given the fact that the AP sent 11 fact-checkers to try to tear it apart and they only had very little to show for it.

        • Achance

          Anchorage is hemmed in by theChugach National Forest, Elmendorf AFB, Ft. Richardson, and the Pacific Ocean (Cook Inlet, Turnagain Arm, Knik Arm) so there is little room for further developent except at very high cost or on unstable “muskeg” soil. Consequently, all the growth in Southcentral Alaska in the ’90s and early ’00s was from Eagle River outward into the Matanuska-Susitna Valley and the Palmer – Wasilla Area. I guess she could have pulled a Juneau and put in a mass transit system, a city owned ski area, and a city back theater company and doubled property and sales taxes and driven the growth elsewhere, or at least out of the city limits. She did increase sales tax either while in the CC or as Mayor and the sports arena built on her watch has had a fair share of controversy.

          As to the State, oil prices started up significantly in ’04. Alaska is governed by a simple formula: Revenue = Price X Production, and the price skyrocketed in her first two years. You like all the other Palin supporters seem to have steadfastly refused to go look at Alaska’s actual budgets to which I have repeatedly linked, so I’ll stop wasting electrons on that. The budget skyrocketed in Murkowski’s last year and her first two. She sent her third budget over in Dec. ’09 for SFY ’10 based on totally unrealistic oil price projections, the legislature balked and she had to revise the projections downward, but she forced the Legislature to make the cuts, further eroding her already bad relations with the Legislature.

          People make such a big deal out of Alaska running a surplus, but Constitutionally, it has to. The only times Alaska hasn’t had a surplus is when oil prices fell dramatically below the level on which budget projections were based as was the case in 1986. Even then the State had enough reserves that it didn’t have to borrow. Alaska also has several different forms of savings accounts on which it can draw, principally the Constitutional Budget Reserve, but also various accounts style sub-funds of the General Fund that function as Executive Branch savings accounts. And as a last resort the State has the Permanent Fund, which at the time she took office had about $40 Billion in it. The principle requires a vote of the People to tap, but the earnings are available for appropriation after the Dividend is paid. The sub-funds are of dubious Constitutionality but are tolerated by the Legislature. It is telling that when projected revenue was below projected expenditure for the SFY ’10 budget rather than making the ‘crats give up their sub-fund savings accounts, she forced the Legislature to go to the CBR. Republicans usually resist going to the CBR if at all possible because it requires a three-quarters vote and gives the minority disproportionate power. So, you can tell tthat the holdover Democrat ‘crats made that call and she either didn’t care or didn’t know.

          I’ve never called her a liar because I believe she believes her version of events. However, I and many others who were in and around some of those events have a very different version.

  • NHConservative0227

    Do you give her any credit for the success that Wasilla has had?

  • Achance

    The State dramatically improved the Glenn and Parks Highways in the ’80s which made it possible to commute, sorta, from Eagle River and then Wasilla to work and shop in Anchorage. Also, after Alaska did away with its income tax, many oil field workers stopped commuting from TX, OK, LA or wherever and moved to Alaska. Not being much on actually supporting the community they lived in or paying any taxes, they moved out into the largely unincorporated Mat-Su Valley and to low tax, low service Wasilla. When the state maintains the roads and the Troopers provide most of the law enforcement, what little there is, you don’t have taxes and when almost all the outlying areas are essentially unincorporated, you don’t have all those nagging building codes and zoning ordinances. Fast forward ten years, Wasilla has a little more of a city government and a small police force but it still relies mostly on the State for all governmental functions but because of low taxes and lower building costs it has now attracted a mall and some big box stores but still is little more than a bedroom community for ANC and the North Slope. The surrounding area is essentially lawless and is crime and drug ridden, its long-established marajuana growing industry now supplanted by meth cooking as a source of revenue and crime.

    Juneau is too much the other way, over-taxed and over-regulated but at least I don’t feel like I need to carry all the time. So, if growth alone is the measure of success, it has been successful, but in terms of quality of life, it sure ain’t my kind of place. As to Palin’s role, well, she was there and didn’t do anything to slow or stop the sprawling growth, so I guess she gets credit for that.

    • Achance
  • Scope

    The war is still being waged bewtween the anti-Palin people, and, the people who have not bought into the arguments that Palin is a no goer. This is exactly why I had posted earlier on this diary that we have a moratorium on Palin diaries. We have our resident anti-palinistas, and, they have made their opionions as well as those that are still looking. It always comes down to hateful posts from mostly those that are anti-Palin. They ask that we look into her record, and, appeal to everyone’s faith and belief that if you look into her record, you will be an anti also. I posted a long comment today on what I saw in the budgets, financial statements, coming to the conclusion that Palin didn’t do anything wrong. We are all asked to look into her record, and the facts will drive you away. You can look at the financial records and see if you agree.

    I am so sick and tired of the detractors putting a litmus test on Palin, even though most of those detractors have not looked at the first bit of financial information provided in the links above by Achance. Before you choose to attack those that have a wait and see look, please look at the budget, financial statement information and see if you think she is an idiot. Achance apparently has banked on no one looking more closely into the financial info. If Palin did decide to run for any office again, how many people would look at the line by line items that make up the state financials? I guarantee not very many.

    I asked Achance a few questions in a later comment, such as, did she raise taxes, did she grow the Alaska government. They would be the questions on the minds of the voters, should she decide to run for any office in the future. How many will drill down into the Alaska financials? No one, I promise. There is nothing in the financials that could harm Palin. I promise if you looked at the financials of every other ste, and, in particular those states run by Republicans, they would have a heck of alot more to answer for than Palin.

    Achance, you have no great argument against Palin, other than your own personal annimosities against her. Again, that is an emotional issue at best.

  • Scope

    The war is still being waged bewtween the anti-Palin people, and, the people who have not bought into the arguments that Palin is a no goer. This is exactly why I had posted earlier on this diary that we have a moratorium on Palin diaries. We have our resident anti-palinistas, and, they have made their opionions as well as those that are still looking. It always comes down to hateful posts from mostly those that are anti-Palin. They ask that we look into her record, and, appeal to everyone’s faith and belief that if you look into her record, you will be an anti also. I posted a long comment today on what I saw in the budgets, financial statements, coming to the conclusion that Palin didn’t do anything wrong. We are all asked to look into her record, and the facts will drive you away. You can look at the financial records and see if you agree.

    I am so sick and tired of the detractors putting a litmus test on Palin, even though most of those detractors have not looked at the first bit of financial information provided in the links above by Achance. Before you choose to attack those that have a wait and see look, please look at the budget, financial statement information and see if you think she is an idiot. Achance apparently has banked on no one looking more closely into the financial info. If Palin did decide to run for any office again, how many people would look at the line by line items that make up the state financials? I guarantee not very many.

    I asked Achance a few questions in a later comment, such as, did she raise taxes, did she grow the Alaska government. They would be the questions on the minds of the voters, should she decide to run for any office in the future. How many will drill down into the Alaska financials? No one, I promise. There is nothing in the financials that could harm Palin. I promise if you looked at the financials of every other ste, and, in particular those states run by Republicans, they would have a heck of alot more to answer for than Palin.

    Achance, you have no great argument against Palin, other than your own personal annimosities against her. Again, that is an emotional issue at best.

    • mbecker908

      The so-called “anti-Palin” people to whom you refer will – to a person – oppose her in any national primary and if she wins will support her in the general.

      You are the absolute equivalent of a blind squirrel supporting RonPaul. You’re about to find that the Moderators won’t have anything to do with diaries about Palin because as soon as you post, no one else will. We are tired of feeding the Trolls. In your particular case, it’s bad enough we’ve thrown you hay, but you didn’t even eat it. You just filled your empty head with with it.

      • Richard Mullins

        I’m going to start using the Hinz rule instead of my wack-a-mole technique on idiots. Every time I say some thing that’s not going about SP, I get wacked by Scope. I don’t hate her at all and see things abjectly. I’m sure she doesn’t need this kind Ronulan tactics to be employed.

      • Third Street

        I’ve made clear my intention to support Palin if she is the nominee. I wish I could be confident that her supporters won’t stay home in significant numbers if she isn’t.

        I too will begin adhering to the Hinz rule because every so often I allow some of these people to goad me into saying something that makes me look no better than they. But until and unless RedState institutes rules and guidelines regarding comments on Sarah Palin, I have no plans to keep quiet about her if I have something to say.

        If SP is the candidate her supporters think she is, she will be able to stand up to the scrutiny. If not, well, maybe it would be best to close down the Palin diaries, close ranks around her, paper over anything questionable, hope the voters don’t notice her supporters tend to foam at the mouth a bit, and pray that’s enough to get her over the line in ’12.

        • mbecker908

          And Scope is a ‘bot.

  • Scope

    every time any diary is about Palin, it becomes a war.

    • Aaron Gardner

      Maybe instead of closing down the comments, you should just take a break from adding to them.

      • Richard Mullins

        and no one is taunting her, it just that things are bit more on the bad side than good.

      • Finrod

        If we’re talking unique posts, anyways, since Scope seems to have a horrible case of Dread Double Post Disease.

    • Richard Mullins

      that keeps getting in the way. You need to sit back look at things correctly(or you can borrow my glasses). Most of us are looking at this with pre conceived ideas of SP[that all I'll say when I talk of her] and some things are great for her. My problem with SP to a point is what a Power hungry person her seems to be. Many people come into office with quite noble ideas. She doesn’t seem to be that way about her. I really don’t like power hungry people and I’m the furtherest from that.

  • Scope

    every time any diary is about Palin, it becomes a war.

  • AKSteveB

    One you need to check on the double posting. Seems to be a problem using IE on Red State.

    Second, I actually thought this thread had a good amount of substance along with the pissfest. My point in particular is just to try to push people into evaluating Gov. Palin as they would any other politician. I have my own opinions and they are mostly negative, but they don’t come from an agenda other than having lived in the state she governed.

    This whole thing is a weird combination of political movement and Oprah-ish celebrity thing. I see no reason not to talk about it. It’s the major noise in the Conservative movement at the moment whether we like it or not (I don’t). We just can’t lose site of the main goal, which right now should be setting up for 2010. I saw some of the excitement over Marco Rubio when I was in Florida a couple of weeks ago, and it was pretty darned cool.