“Reform” Means You Pay More for Health Care

Monday, October 12th at 10:34AM EST

25 Comments

From the diaries by Erick.

My full article is here at The Heritage Foundation’s blog.

A major new report confirms the worst fears of many: Health care reform will raise the costs for most Americans—by about 18% on average. That is on top of existing and expected inflation of health coverage.

This exposes President Obama’s fictitious claim that people will save money under his proposal. Only those who receive new government subsidies and benefits will “save.” The rest of us will pay–big-time.

Once the plan is fully phased-in (by 2019), a typical family of four would pay an extra $4,000 each year.

When combined with inflation, costs would rise from today’s $12,300 annual average to $25,900. Of that 111% increase, $9,600 is due to existing factors uncorrected by the legislation, and $4,000 due to additional costs created by the legislation.

For single persons, the differential is projected at $1,500 a year. Premiums would rise from today’s $4,600 a year to $9,600 overall.

Prepared by Price Waterhouse Coopers (PWC), the study was requested by AHIP—America’s Health Insurance Plans. It focuses on the leading plan pending in Congress, sponsored by Sen. Max Baucus (D, MT), which is scheduled for a Senate Finance Committee vote on Tuesday.

The PWC projections track what The Heritage Foundation and many others have said about the legislation: It does not save money. It simply taxes those who have health coverage and uses their money to give care to others.

The White House is said to be furious. After all, President Obama’s claims that he makes care more affordable are exposed as a myth by the new study.

Details and links are here.

25 Comments Leave a comment

Even the Urban Institute agrees

Dan Perrin (Diary) Monday, October 12th at 12:04PM EST (link)

that Americans will pay more for their health care under this government take over of the American health care system — which is why 60% oppose the bill and only 34% support it.

Most liberals don't like the Baucus bill

illinoisconservative (Diary) Monday, October 12th at 12:20PM EST (link)

It has no public option and doesn’t give enough away to Americans who make more than enough to buy their own health insurance.

This study will only strengthen their calls for passing the more liberal bill from the House with the public option. They keep saying the House bill “saves” more money.. To understand how a bill that spends a half trillion more than the Baucus bill “saves” us money, you have to enroll in the “Democratic Math 101″ course.

And thus makes a reason that liberals that don't get there way

Richard Mullins (Diary) Monday, October 12th at 12:33PM EST (link)

can make life just as bad those that don’t like the word “Tax”. I’m sure that by the time this comes up for a vote, there should be enough opposition to this on the lack of Public option and the “taxes” in it.

Richard Phillip Mullins Blog The Squash Satire Site News on Happy Jet Airlines
Rmullins Pics
Rpmullins Twitter

Joe Biden is like a Decrepit Park owner with a Meth lab that happens to not only be a dealer but a user.

Let’s Bankrupt the Democratic paty. Make spend all the money to defend thier candidates.

Let me help Obama in simplifying his Obamacare Plan for the Independents:

Rod_Patrick (Diary) Monday, October 12th at 3:41PM EST (link)

We already know how party hardliners will take his message. No for extreme Conservatives and Yes for Obama worshippers.

Obamacare will aim at offering every American (possibly illegals who will be future legal Americans) an opportunity to MANDATED HEALTH CARE:

Advantage for the Independents:

#1. Very HUMANE. Everyone can be covered.
#2. Very Christian. Those who have means must help the needy.
#3. Obama’s promise is fulfilled. It’s one of his core campaign message that many Independents agreed on when they voted for Obama.
#4. Obama’s Glory is assured. Many independents love the guy, even though they extremely disagree with his policy, especially those still harboring guilt of racism..

Disadvantage for the Independent:

#1. It will entail costs no matter what. You are covering the cost of those who cannot pay for Health Care.
#2. It will entail costs no matter what. You are covering the cost of those who cannot pay for Health Care.
….. and finally,

#1000000. It will entail costs no matter what. You are covering the cost of those who cannot pay for Health Care.

IT WILL ENTAIL COST. NO MATTER WHAT. So every American who still has a job (or still has money in the Bank) will pay the incremental cost of Obamacare.

To Rs and Ds in the Congress. Stop lying and stop pretending. All we want is honesty from the Government.

SO … INDEPENDENTS …. YOU DECIDE.

If you accept Obamacare … FINE. Go for it and make sure Obama has his second term.

If you cant accept the burden of the Obamacare to your own Personal Finance…

JOIN THE TEA PARTY AND START SHOWING YOUR PROTEST.

UNELECT Rs and Ds behind OBAMACARE.

UNELECT Obama by 2012.

Higher costs are unacceptable

keivan Monday, October 12th at 6:46PM EST (link)

Health care costs have already exploded in the last 10 years or so…up well over 100% in studies I have read (Okay-newbie alert…I admit that I am a troglodyte when it comes to posting stuff on the internet, so I do not know how to provide a link, but I will learn how for my next post).

We have to be opposed to anything that will cause the costs to go up additional 111%, because already money spent on health care is money that is NOT being spent on other things that make the economy grow. Right now my employer pays 977.00 per month for my family health care plan. Starting this November, I will pay an additional 288.00 per month to keep that same plan. That means my health care plan alone is $15,000 per year (!)

That 288.00 can easily be seen as a car payment I won’t be able to make, so I can’t help out Government Motors. It is a vacation I won’t take so hotels and travel industries suffer. It is several restaurant dinners I won’t buy, or televisions I won’t purchase, or money I cannot donate to charity. I am a living example of how health care costs are strangling the economy, and unless we get a handle on them, this economy will continue to go down the drain.

Don't confuse health insurance with health care.

illinoisconservative (Diary) Tuesday, October 13th at 2:52AM EST (link)

You and your employer are paying for health insurance. If you never see a doctor all year long, the cost will be the same.

Health care doesn’t happen until you actually see a health care provider like your doctor or get a prescription filled.

None of the government’s plans actually address the cost of health care. We need to address those costs. Despite what the liberals cry, we have the best health care providers in the world. They just cost way too much.

Every time the Republicans are painted with the “just say no” slogans, they need to hit back hard with ideas that actually reduce costs.. like tort reform that can reduce “defensive medicine” that drives up real costs 20-30% by some accounts. Unfortunately, the current set of buffoons leading the Republican party can’t seem to get a coherent message out in a way that the liberal MSM will even cover. The tea party participants have had better luck in that regard!

Excellent point Illionois conservative...

keivan Tuesday, October 13th at 7:32AM EST (link)

It is in fact the high cost of health INSURANCE which is strangling my and many others. According to a study by the CBO at

:http://www.cbo.gov/ftpdocs/55xx/doc5549/Report.pdf

34 states have already implemented some sorts of tort reform, with varying results. The common denominator among the results is increased profits for insurance companies, but there is not a corresponding drop in insurance fees.

Tort reform will help but it is not the magic bullet to solve the spiraling cost of health insurance

keivan, sounds like you are all for Obama's HCR.

penguin2 (Diary) Tuesday, October 13th at 8:52AM EST (link)

You’re saying tort reform is no good, you’re noting out of control health care costs, next you’ll be looking to include all people for health care, no matter what. You haven’t talked about opening up insurance competition state-to-state, which would lower costs.

Your comment about how bad the Health Insurance industry is, is part of the Left’s talking points and arguments to get the government to take over 1/6 of the economy and total control over our lives. Here is the link to the Financial Times via Drudge this a.m. that tell you the cost for insurance for a family will go up with his plan. That is why the administration is fuming. The industry is going to be pointing out some facts, Obama does not want the people to know.

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/65f9a900-b74b-11de-9812-00144feab49a.html

BTW, I saw you in Erick B. diary and what you said there and here, makes me think you are not being up front.

Resistance to tyrants is obedience to God. – Benjamin Franklin
When Good stands up to Evil, Evil blinks. – Vassar Bushmills

Conservative Education: Suggested Reading List

Activists Taking Action: Unified Patriots

not necessarily mutually exclusive..

illinoisconservative (Diary) Tuesday, October 13th at 12:43PM EST (link)

you can agree that the insurance industry has bad practices that need regulating without buying into all of the left’s talking points.

Insurance companies are private businesses out to make a profit, as they should. But when they do it at the expense of people’s lives, they need to be regulated better.

That said, I agree that besides tort reform, we need to open up competition state-to-state.. that, however, has a lot of states rights folks on the right riled up though.

The other reform that could reduce costs tremendously is allowing multi-employer pools. There is no reason except insurance company profit that tens of thousands of people should not be allowed to pool together for much more favorable rates.

Mr. Penguin 2-Illinois republican beat me to the keyboard

keivan Tuesday, October 13th at 7:01PM EST (link)

but I would have replied much the same way. My only expressed point here is that I (and I am a very typical middle class guy) have a health insurance bill that is now 15,000 a year (about $12, 000 of which is paid by my employer). This is a huge amount of money for something for that I rarely use.

I did not say “Tort reform is not good”. I specifically said “Tort reform will help but it is not a magic bullet”. There needs to be more done than just tort reform. You make some excellent points in your reply about opening insurance competition state to state-ANYTHING that leads to lowering cost is good.

I specifically did NOT mention including all people for health care. If I MEANT to say that, I would have said that. I think you and I actually agree on a lot Mr. Penguin, but you seem to think that I am saying much more than I really am, then getting ticked off about it.

Maybe you should try the decaf.

keivan, well first I must tell you I am Mrs. Then we can...

penguin2 (Diary) Tuesday, October 13th at 7:22PM EST (link)

discuss your points. What I took away from your comment regarding the Health Insurance companies, was a negative. You focused on their profits. That is typical for blasting businesses. Second, tort reform “is not a magic bullet,” difficult knowing the results there, because I am not aware of any major tort reform that has been done.

The big one you left out was opening up interstate competition for health care plans, which would drive down the costs. I am in agreement with illinoiscon and you about some reform needed. But not by government takeover of 1/6 of the economy. The government does not run anything very well. Just look at Social Security and Medicare. Obama’s plans will reduce choices for people and will result in rationing.

Do not forget the other unacceptable issues with his bill. Taxpayer funded abortions, general intrusion in our lives, and health care for illegals, etc. I also left you a link that discussed the health care costs, which does not agree with your take on it.

Now I will say I have some concern about your reasons for being here, because of the comments you made in Erick B’s dairy about the “Games Leftist’s Play” I won’t get into that here, but people just want to know up front your political stand. We are a conservative/Republican site, here to discuss and promote causes of same. We are not here for talking points from the other side. I don’t mind waiting and seeing how this plays out. I am open to modifying any misconceptions I’ve had. I’m being up front with you on that.

Resistance to tyrants is obedience to God. – Benjamin Franklin
When Good stands up to Evil, Evil blinks. – Vassar Bushmills

Conservative Education: Suggested Reading List

Activists Taking Action: Unified Patriots

Thanks for your courteous reply Mrs. Penguin...

keivan Tuesday, October 13th at 9:45PM EST (link)

and I apologize for the snarky “decaf” remark. I shouldn’t be so flippant with someone who takes the time to make a very coherent argument such as yourself.

Now…I wasn’t really focusing or bashing the profits of insurance companies. I was simply quoting the CBO study regarding the actual results of tort reform that had been tried in a lot of states.You may be right to speculate that tort reform writ large over the whole country may be more effective-I just frankly don’t see it as being that big a part of an overall attempt to address the damage being done to the economy by spiraling health insurance costs. I happen to think that many of the measures described in your previous posts that will increase competition will be much more successful than tort reform.

Regarding my comments in the other diary-I agree that this is not the place to re-hash my thoughts about that particular diary, but I will say that I am 51 years old and have lived long enough and been successful enough that I am not willing to blindly follow simplistic thinking just because it reinforces my world view. The title and tone of the diary suggested heinous behavior on the part of leftists, but there was absolutely no proof offered, and in fact a comment by Il glock 21 actually disproved the main thesis of the diary. I took the time to comment on that,but it really angered a couple of people. I won’t fight anymore with anyone about that topic, but I will know now that there are some diarists who are not worth reading, and there are some commenters (who I certainly will not call our or name specifically) who seem to think that TYPING in ALL CAPS is a substitute for logic or reason. I can see that these people are not worth reading either.

Once again, thanks for being so open minded and gracious in your response. Throw the decaf away and drink the real stuff Penguin!

Why can't they get that message out?

LDahl752 (Diary) Tuesday, October 13th at 12:45PM EST (link)

Here, how is this?

Tort reform! Tort reform! Tort reform!

Don’t stop saying it until something gets done.

Tort reform! Are they all too simple minded? Too wimpy? Too afraid of the trial lawyers? Heck, they don’t have the support of that group anyway; so, why aren’t they demanding it, in a unanimous, very loud chorous.

Linda D, Henderson NV

Good question!

illinoisconservative (Diary) Tuesday, October 13th at 1:04PM EST (link)

I have no idea why our Republican leadership has been so wimpy about this.

But Obama promised Obamacare would reduce insurance premiums $2,500/family/year.

bk (Diary) Tuesday, October 13th at 3:18AM EST (link)

I’m SHOCKED! to learn he was lying about this.

BHO also said

redpens (Diary) Tuesday, October 13th at 9:23AM EST (link)

if we passed the pork-u-lus package, unemployment wouldn’t go above 8%, or that energy costs will increase by only a postage stamp
if we passed tax-and-destroy

You fail to understand "healthcare reform" is about Obama

Marcus_Traianus (Diary) Tuesday, October 13th at 8:35AM EST (link)

There is no rational or logic which can be used to explain the march towards socialized medicine. Call it what you will, in the end this is about Barack Obama- NOT the American people.

American’s are fairly united that the aggressive measures being preached by Democrats will be destructive to the quality of care, fiscally unsustainable, take away our choices and deteriorate end of life care to be akin with euthanasia. So once again, Mr. Obama opens another front in his battle on individual liberty using Pelosi and Reid as willing henchmen.

Taking a sledgehammer to something which requires a staple has the hallmarks of Mr. Obama’s proclivities. It’s all about HIS priority, not what our democracy vis a vis the majority wants. Tea parties, factual explication, honest debate and opposition have no place in this parochial endeavor. Change is about remaking America in the Obama image and therefore the pillars of our democracy shall be battered down to make us anew in his image- never that is not what this republic is about, and we will never surrender.

For those who say Republican’s have not offered an alternative here it is. Ask yourself why this has not been covered with the same rigor as the Obama, Pelosi, Reid plan.

“Both of our political parties, at least the honest portion of them, agree conscientiously in the same object—the public good; but they differ essentially in what they deem the means of promoting that good. One side believes it best done by one composition of the governing powers; the other, by a different one. One fears most the ignorance of the people; the other, the selfishness of rulers independent of them. Which is right, time and experience will prove.”.Thomas Jefferson

single payer

redpens (Diary) Tuesday, October 13th at 9:26AM EST (link)

That’s what the Demo-commies want, badly. GOVERNMENT CONTROL OVER YOU is what this is all about.

The Truth Hurts

andyd (Diary) Tuesday, October 13th at 8:52AM EST (link)

“The White House is said to be furious”

Yes, for many people the truth can be painful.

Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.

– John Adams

http://politicalfriendsblogs.com
Political debate without the name calling

Health Insurance Reform

dclamage Tuesday, October 13th at 10:22AM EST (link)

Reform shouldn’t cost the American taxpayer a single nickel.

There are plenty of things Congress can do to promote competition in the marketplace. None of those things will cost us anything.

1. Tort Reform — reduces the need for “defensive medicine”, lowers malpractice insurance premiums, eases the pressure on healthcare providers so they can remain on the job and have a reasonable expectation that they will have a profitable life based on the value of their services.

2. Allow all 1,700 insurance carriers to compete in all 50 states and 7 (or so) territories.

3. Enable healthcare providers to computerize, automate and streamline back-office operations. The ARRA actually provided for this, but it’s been a slow uptake.

This is just a good start. But we have to be wary of mandates like forcing everyone to buy the gov’t-prescribed insurance or get taxed, subsidizing illegal and legal resident aliens, and banning insurance companies from denying or cutting coverage for high-risk individuals. There are costs for doing that, that will get passed on to the rest of the consumers.

– Dan Clamage

CONTACT SNOWE, COLLINS AND BLANCHE NOW, TO OPPOSE SENATE HEALTH BILL!

danielbdp (Diary) Tuesday, October 13th at 10:57AM EST (link)

IT’S TIME FOR CONTINUED, DIRECT DEMOCRATIC ACTION. GO TO

http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm

AND CONTACT YOUR SENATORS (particularly the ones mentioned in this Comment title) BY PHONE AND E-MAIL, TO OPPOSE THIS LEGISLATION THAT WILL BE DISASTROUS TO OUR HEALTH CARE SYSTEM!

ALL RATIONAL AMERICANS KNOW WE DON’T NEED THIS!! BETTER SOLUTIONS HAVE BEEN ADVANCED AND ARE BEING WILLFULLY IGNORED AND HIDDEN FROM THE AMERICAN PEOPLE!! WE NEED TO FREE UP DOCTORS AND PATIENTS, NOT SHACKLE THEM!! HEAVY-HANDED GOVERNMENT-RUN HEALTHCARE WILL NOT WORK AND WILL CRIPPLE OUR ECONOMY FOR DECADES!!

You Will Pay More

louesc (Diary) Tuesday, October 13th at 12:44PM EST (link)

When combined with existing inflation, costs would rise from today’s $12,300 annual average to $25,900. Of that 111% increase, $9,600 is due to existing factors uncorrected by the legislation, and $4,000 due to additional costs created by the legislation.

www.AmericanPatriotPrevail.com/Reform_Means_You_Pay.html

Louis

Reject Tyranny and Defend Liberty!

AMERICANS CALLING MAINE: SNOWE JUST BETRAYED US - AGAIN!!!

danielbdp (Diary) Tuesday, October 13th at 2:04PM EST (link)

I TOLD YOU SO…THIS JUST IN FROM “MODERN HEALTHCARE”:

http://www.modernhealthcare.com/article/20091013/FREE/310139944#

ANYONE IN MAINE WITH A BRAIN, PLEASE CALL SENATOR SNOWE RIGHT NOW AND TELL HER NO WAY, NO HOW, NOT EVER!!!

(202) 224-5344

http://snowe.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?FuseAction=ContactSenatorSnowe.Email

I am sure Snowe will be the next one to go democrat

izoneguy (Diary) Tuesday, October 13th at 2:09PM EST (link)

She just lost all GOP support…..

Maybe she can call Arlen for pointers…..

What a bunch of losers.

The point cannot be made often enough: Modern liberalism, as embodied in the Obama presidency, is the defender of the status quo. And the status quo is a road to economic ruin. Political forces cannot redistribute the wealth that the economic system does not produce.

New Blog Post

webmonkeydc Tuesday, November 17th at 3:06PM EST (link)

An Open Letter To President Obama:

http://obamaprayers.blogspot.com/2009/11/open-letter-to-president-obama.html