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EDITOR OF REDSTATE

Barack Obama’s Denial Does Not Hold Water

By: Erick Erickson (Diary)  |  September 1st, 2008 at 04:23 PM  | 

RESIZE: AAA

On a personal note, several credible, reliable people have told me that Obama staffers have been forwarding out the story about Sarah Palin’s youngest son not being her own. In fact, the New York Times vaguely referenced the story the other day. They would not do that if lowly bloggers were pushing the story. It had to be a connected Democrat.

Barack Obama says his staff has not been pushing these stories.

But let’s delve into the heart of this matter.

When Hillary Clinton supporters started questioning whether Obama actually was born in the United States, who published the birth certificate? Daily Kos did. Barack Obama sent it to Daily Kos to get it out there. They have a close relationship, the campaign and website do.

When Barack Obama wanted to reach out to the netroots, where did he go to blog? At Daily Kos.

What site does Barack Obama have in his RSS reader? Daily Kos.

Barack Obama himself admits he reads Daily Kos.

We know from Ben Smith at the Politico that Democrats are pushing out the story about Sarah Palin’s support for abstinence only education. They were doing it before the announcement and now they are really doing it.

So today Barack Obama says he’d fire people from his staff who are pushing stories about the Palin family children.

Maybe he needs to start looking into his staff.

The pattern is clear: Obama’s campaign pushes information to Daily Kos. Daily Kos then spreads it and gets it into the media (probably because a lot of reporters are also diarists there). Given all the other ever changing statements from Obama, how exactly can we really believe his denials now, given his pattern and the connections?

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COMMENTS

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  • hunter

    on family values abundantly clear: they have none. They are, at heart, the pro-death, anti-child party.
    This, plus their reactionary, obvious inability to recognize or appreciate character and achievement only makes Obama look even shabbier.
    For a man who has literally only won to elections to pretend he is more qualified than a sitting Governor is laughable.
    But ridiculousness is at the heart of the Obama campaign.
    I said after his demonstration of stupidity Church forum that his wheels are coming off.
    Attacking a mother and family over this issue only shows how far from controlling the agenda Obama is, and how empty of issues Obama is at his core.
    Obama’s sole claims to fame are, as Biden said, his being an ‘articulate black’, and that he is not Bush.
    Neither will win him the WH.

  • Jaded

    Barack Obama bought and paid for by George Soros just as Kerry was before him…..he owns the Democrat party.

  • redneck_hippie

    operates this way: any means necessary.

    I’m used to this. Remember the Clintons?

  • weave

    I read the story, and it was a diary entry. Now I’ll admit I don’t frequent the site and don’t know which diaries are among the top brass of the site, and which ones are just regular users, but most of the comments I saw condemned the rumor.

    So the theory that Obama’s staff pushed this might be true, or it might not be. Just sounds like creating a conspiracy theory to explain another one.

  • IL_Glock21

    …as news.

    They then went to the analysts. One of whom was Bill Bennett who was furious.

    Bill Bennett said several times that CNN just violated everything we just praised Obama for.

    Disgusting. That’s one to catch on youtube later though.

  • phred

    S.O.P. is giving them credit for even having a plan. Based on my observations, *destruction of targets of opportunity seems to describe the behavior more accurately.

  • NightTwister

    1. Caught them off-guard. They of course project the blame onto McCain by saying he didn’t properly vet her.

    2. Made them go scurrying around to find some dirt, and when they couldn’t, they had to make it up.

    3. Made them furious because McCain stole their convention thunder.

    Sarah Palin, like John McCain are reformers that want to weed out corruption in government. It’s a theme that resonates with many Americans, who are tired of the same old politics.

    That, more than anything else scares the hell out of them. All the way up to the very top.

  • exitsfunnel

    Your ‘evidence’ absolutely doesn’t lead to to your conclusion. It doesn’t even suggest it really.

    -exits

  • kilimanjaro

    This is a losing issue for Democrats.

    Most people recognize that human beings are autonomous, imperfect creatures. As Barack Obama points out, his mother became pregnant with him when she was 17.
    What was Barack, himself, doing at 17? As he has admitted, “booze”, “weed”, and “a little blow”.

    When people are young and dumb, they do young and dumb things.

    As a Catholic, I was raised to believe in the belief of original sin – that none of us our perfect. The mark of a Christian is how one responds to the adversity created by sin. Do you get help and back on the path of Christ? Do you make the right CHOICE about a life that you have produced or do you literally bury your mistake?

    While Bristol’s pregnancy is unfortunate, conservatives recognize that she is making the right choice as a Christian in taking responsibility for her actions.

    The Palin family reflects the struggles of Christian America. Before Dems rejoice in their trials, I would suggest that this issue will simply give Sarah more credibility with voters facing similar issues across the country, particularly Catholics in the heartland.

    And while Dems will ridicule her support for abstinence, it will help us illuminate the extremism of Barack’s “born alive” positions.

  • olderthangandalf

    The Trig story was all over the net in record time, and on all kinds of gossip blogs as well as political blogs.

    Blog owners ought to share the IP addresses of the posters. There might be some interesting information there.

  • Molten

    …a story about Sarah Palin that is unbelievable and horrible…so unbelievable is this story that Sarah herself feels she must tell the truth about the matter so as to stop the ridiculous untruth from spreading any further..

    She confides in the American people that her 17 year old unmarried daughter is pregnant and will keep the baby and marry the father..

    Case closed…horrible Kos story stopped in it’s tracks..

    But those Demoncrats don’t like being bested…and they counter with a truthful statement about Sarah Palin and her strong support for “abstinence only” programs…Then they tack on the speculation that had Sarah been a better mother and not so damn politically ambitious, she may have been able to actually convince her 17 year old daughter to abstain from sex, and to actually live up to the values she claims to embody..

    Sounds like fair game to me…politics aint beanbag…right?

  • QueenOfCups

    Look at how well it is working for them.. they are too stupid to realize the tactics of attacking a woman and her children.

    That doesn’t play in Peoria.

    Actually, even last night, before this morning’s announcement, I was thinking this is working so well, watching their melt-down this must be a Rovian plot! OR better yet, Kos is an undercover member of the VRWC!

  • cw23

    forget about the fake pregnancy story….
    but are all of you 100% confident that we properly and completely vetted Palin?

  • ConservaGeek

    Let the MoveOnMedia try to attack a young lady and watch ordinary Americans rise up in disgust and vote for the other side in protest.

    Please, keep it up, Kos, you’re doing a wonderful job of turning away the very people you need.

  • Rod_Patrick

    No one is a fool to believe that he is innocent of Bristol:

    So today Barack Obama says he’d fire people from his staff who are pushing stories about the Palin family children.

    Comm’n, BO is LYING again.

  • NightTwister

    Really bothers you that McCain caught you totally off guard, doesn’t it.

  • QueenOfCups

    We will help with that heavy lifting!

  • NightTwister

    that you have to resort to this type of stuff, huh.

    Abstinence educations reduces teenage pregnancies vs. other methods. The science is in, and it’s clearly proven. You know that, but that’s not why you’re here, is it.

    You’re here because your candidate should be up by like 30 points right now, and even with the Republicans not having a convention you’re still barely treading water, in an election you clearly should’ve walked away with if you’d nominated any decent candidate.

    Bummer, dude.

  • ConservaGeek

    Here all of 15 minutes and already you’re part of “we”?

    I may be one of the newer conservatives here, but at least I waited a few days before considering myself a “real” RedStater.

    It really bugs you when we don’t live up to your cardboard-cutout stereotypes of conservatives, doesn’t it?

  • QueenOfCups

    and find out for yourself.

    You have NO idea what you are up against!

  • SteveLA

    All sorts of things were done:

    Chicken entrails examined, head bumps measured and astrology charts were drawn up.

    Fully vetted by the only one that counts, John McCain. He’s going to be the President, El Jeffie, the Big Cheese, man in the big chair, Commander in Chief, Don McCain. In short, I trust his judgment, even if you don’t.

  • dbecraft
  • Martin_A_Knight

    .

  • cw23

    goodness…sorry…just meant “we” as in the republican party…

    thought I had come across a good site here…why does everyone attack me like this?

    just asking a question that seemed reasonable…i guess it wasnt reasonable….please accept my humble apology

  • Vegas_Rick

    that this whole Bristol pregnancy is going to seriously help McCain/Palin and seriously hurt Obama/Biden.

    You guys either will never get it, or will never admit it.

    MOST AMERICANS AGREE WITH US ON STUFF LIKE THIS. They may not say it out loud and they may even deny it. But when they get in the privacy of the voting booth, their conscience and common sense take over.

    Didn’t you idiots learn when W. beat Gore and Kerry? How could that happen? The same way this one will happen. Lefties are, in the final analysis, the minority.

  • ConservaGeek

    …they didn’t consult the Obamamessiah for his decision on McCain’s Veep.

    That’s probably a part of what has them livid… darn it, the Obamamessiah is supposed to run every portion of everyone’s lives, even his opponents’!

  • ConservaGeek

    ..then please try to stay away from using the already-worn-out DailyKos talking points.

    When someone shows up and in the first 15 minutes posts the same tired meme that we’ve heard over and over and over again here, well, we kinda assume that you got it from the same place the others did.

    Good day, sir. I said, good day!

  • SomeYahoo

    Oooh. Credible sources? Nice reporting Erickson. Way to blow the lid off this story . . . Did those same sources tell you Obama is really a Muslim? Or that he sprouts wings when the sun goes down and sleeps in the tops of trees?

    Your argument is cartoonish and intellectually pitiful.

    If you actually looked at the diaries on DailyKos regarding this Trig story, you’ll find that a few dumbasses were being lambasted by the vast majority of the DailyKos community for their baseless allegations. The DailyKos community wasn’t very kind to those throwing around this stupid garbage about Trig’s maternity.

  • cw23

    what is dailykos?

    i m not much for the internet…but a friend told me to check this place out.

    it really was an honest questions hoping for honest, thoughtful responses….but the vitriol that came at me reminded me why i have avoided all of this blogging type stuff…

    again, sorry to have come here, having not already been part of this “we”

  • cw23

    what is dailykos?

    i m not much for the internet…but a friend told me to check this place out.

    it really was an honest questions hoping for honest, thoughtful responses….but the vitriol that came at me reminded me why i have avoided all of this blogging type stuff…

    again, sorry to have come here, having not already been part of this “we”

  • nunya

    McCain is acting much more presidential than Obama. McCain’s “take off our republican hats, and put on our american hats” was more impressive than anything that has come out of Obama’s mouth.

    An open letter to Obama:

    An open letter to Barack Obama

    Since you are applying for a job, for which your resume is a bit sketchy, I thought that I would offer some suggestions on how you might flesh out your resume. As a
    potential employer of yours (a taxpayer).

    You claim to be in favor of change and reform. However, there is nothing in your current history to show that you have attempted any reform in Chicago, where
    you have been a representative for a number of years now. Chicago has a reputation of having one of the most corrupt political machines in this country, (the Daley
    political machine). Which has nurtured and supported you throughout your political career. I would suggest cleaning up the dirty politics in Chicago would
    go a long way in convincing many people of your sincerity in wanting change.
    Then there is the issue of the $200,000 a year raise that your wife recieved after you got a bill passed giving her employer an earmark of $4.5 million. This
    sounds to me like a political payoff (graft).
    There is also your long-time association with Tony Rezkin whom you have obtained several government grants for.
    There is also your connection to Jeremiah Wright, the hate spewing minister that mentored you for 20 years, and who quite obviously hates this country.

    I do not dislike you personally, I just don’t believe you. You have done nothing whatsoever to show that you are really in favor of change. Have you even tried
    to stop the political corruption in Chicago? NO you have not. In my opinion your talk of change is just a bunch of jive talk.

    My advice to you, go back to Chicago and straighten things out there, before trying to straighten things out in the entire country, then we might take your candidacy serious.

  • ConservaGeek

    …then perhaps you should have checked out the multiple links supplied by Erick in the original story?

    I really don’t think I am buying your protestations of innocence or ignorance, sorry.

  • Flagstaff

    are 100-1 in favor of your assertion.

    If they push this story, they’ll regret it.

  • GregN

    A long-term, congressionally mandated evaluation of top abstinence-only programs in the US recommended to cut funding of the programs, stating that the “programs had no impact on desired behavioral outcomes”.

    On the other hand, considerable scientific evidence demonstrates that programs that include information about both abstinence and contraception can work to help teens delay sexual activity, have fewer sexual partners and increase contraceptive use when they begin having sex.

    By the way, good job sandbagging Obama. This has always been a close race; he was never expected to lead by 30 points.

  • LibraryLady

    Mark Okeson, the assistant Principal has answered that Wasilla School (where Bishop attended until recently) has a Comprehensive Sex education class and is not abstinence only.

  • ConservaGeek

    Let’s see a link to your study, GregN. I wanna investigate the particulars of exactly how the study was done, the better to determine if the data is accurate.

    Or, alternately, you can just spin and demonize me for asking for evidence.

    Your call.

  • Molten

    Abstinence-only education has been criticized in official statements by the American Psychological Association, the American Medical Association, the National Association of School Psychologists, the Society for Adolescent Medicine, the American College Health Association, the American Academy of Pediatrics, and the American Public Health Association, which all maintain that sex education needs to be comprehensive to be effective…

    On August 4, 2007, the British Medical Journal published an editorial concluding that there is “no evidence that abstinence-only sex education programs reduce risky sexual behaviors, incidence of sexually transmitted infections, or pregnancy”..

    Abstinence education doesn’t work…and you know it…but that’s not why you replied to my comment, is it?

    You want my opinion of a 44 year old woman who has five children, one of which is an infant with special needs, another who is a 17 year old pregnant girl, and another, a young son about to go to war…right?

    Well, I think that sounds like a family that is going to need their mother to be actively involved and present for the forseeable future..

    Lets see…true family values?…or political ambition?…hmmm

  • civil_truth

    I mean, it does seem like everyone assumes that Bristol was exposed to an “abstinence only” sex education program because her mother supports such programs.

    If Bristol in fact had a “comprehensive” sex education program, that makes her mother’s views on the matter totally immaterial.

    (Not that attempting to blame Bristol’s pregnancy on her mother’s views of sex education is a reasonable line of argument in the first place, but this fact would totally nail shut this line of attack.)

  • CitizenHank

    I know it wouldn’t be very [vice-] presidential (and I do think that trying to paint Bristol’s pregnancy as a negative for Palin is a strategy that will backfire on its own if the Obamatons and their agents in the press continue to pursue it), but is anyone else having a similar fantasy:

    “As many of you may have heard, I’m going to be a grandmother.” [applause] “And if the #@^$(#@ liberal media has a problem with that, BRING IT ON. [thunderous applause, fire-breathing crowd] Speaking of institutions in need of reform….”

  • Rod_Patrick

    Agree 100%.

  • GregN
  • Achance

    program, so much so that it makes some of us who a quite secular cringe. Parents can opt out of having their kids take sex ed classes, but even so, it ain’t like Alaska kids are sheltered little house plants.

  • hotnoggin

    We shouldn’t have to take one off to put the other one on. I kind of thought McCain was having a moment with that comment. Glad you were inspired…not me.

  • ConservaGeek

    I just stuck dinner in the oven, I shall look it over after I dine. It looks like a large report, so it may take some time for me to go through it all.

    I’m sure some of the other RS regulars will also be looking through it.

  • ConservaGeek

    Registered just to say that, did ya?

  • Molten

    “If Bristol in fact had a “comprehensive” sex education program, that makes her mother’s views on the matter totally immaterial.”

    …”her mothers views on the matter totally Immaterial”??

    Huh??…I don’t know about your family, but every family I know has a mother whose opinion is never “immaterial”

  • streiff

    the actual report. And no multivariate analysis has ever said any sex ed program is better than another.

  • civil_truth

    How about dealing with the substance of my comment – which is about disconnecting Bristol’s pregnancy as somehow representing the end result of abstinence-only sex education. Do you have any problems with disconnecting the two?

  • The_Rebel

    Erick’s sources are the credible ones, not your lies. If you check around the web, you’ll find countless references to the unhinged tsunami on Kos. Here’s an example from Michelle Malkin today:

    “Ever since John McCain announced his VP pick, the Daily Kos ? the self-declared ?New Center? of American politics ? has been an out-of-control incubator of deranged conspiracy theories and attacks on GOP Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin?s family. Will a single Kos Democrat stand up publicly and specifically denounce the madness on the left side of the Internet? Or do they agree with the Kos smear merchants that monitoring Palin family pregnancies and jeering about 17-year-old Bristol?s situtation ? as Kos himself does here in this post now featured on the front page of the site ? is ?fair game?”

    Maybe you need to peruse RedState a bit more frequently than once every 2-3 weeks. You might just learn a few things that will free you from the dark side.

  • NewEnglander

    Campbell Brown won’t let it go. They’re playing the pregnancy issue more than the hurricane.

  • 4BordersPundit

    Check out this interesting URL… by the Discerning Texan (no affiliation). It shows a link to at least one Obama defender who is spreading this junk:

    http://www.discerningtexan.com/2008/08/caught-obama-anti-smear-website-caught.html

    Question is, who funds Fight The Smears? Well, Obama’s campaign does, of course. Which means, Obama does.

  • 4BordersPundit

    Check out this interesting URL… by the Discerning Texan (no affiliation). It shows a link to at least one Obama defender who is spreading this junk:

    http://www.discerningtexan.com/2008/08/caught-obama-anti-smear-website-caught.html

    Question is, who funds Fight The Smears? Well, Obama’s campaign does, of course. Which means, Obama does.

  • Jaded

    You see they think if people don’t see the great love of America going on down at the Republican Convention than they will be helping the socialist get into office….but being stupid commies they forget that new media will be the answer for those who want to watch the convention….oh and by the way they will be pissing off a lot of families with teenagers with their holier than thou attitude towards Gov Palin.

  • randolph

    According to the government official in charge of that study, it doesn’t mean what you think it means. At a recent abstinence educator’s convention in Orlando, she explained in an address why studies of this type cannot be used to show that a particular program is ineffective. Her address echoed the concerns in this article:

    >
    After years of fighting funding for abstinence education, liberal groups are heralding a new research study on several abstinence programs. The Department of Health and Human Services has released a report by Mathematica Policy Research, Inc. on a handful of Title V, Section 510 programs.

    >
    Its findings, which have been radically exaggerated in the media, suggest that changes must be made to select abstinence programs to make them more effective. Tracking four elementary and middle school programs –less than one percent of the 700 abstinence programs that receive federal funding–Mathematica found little improvement in the percent of students who delayed sexual activity as a result of the curriculum.

    >
    While liberal leaders are salivating at the chance to replace abstinence funding with more dollars for Planned Parenthood’s empire, the research has obvious limitations. The four programs that Mathematica evaluated (beginning in 1999) have already been revised and improved, and they are by no means representative of abstinence education as a whole. They also included no high school component–so one logical conclusion is that to achieve the greatest effectiveness, programs must be intensive and long-term, so that the knowledge, attitudes, and skills needed to reject sex before marriage are constantly reinforced–particularly in the pivotal high school years.

    >
    Abstinence programs have faced the challenge of improving the services they deliver, and fortunately most have done so. A recent HHS-sponsored conference in Baltimore unveiled evidence from more than two dozen other studies that abstinence programs are producing positive outcomes for youth. For every study that disparages the abstinence approach, there are many others that point to its success and suggest that effective, long-term programs should be given more funding–not less.

    Here’s more: sources

    This nonsense about abstinence education being proved ineffective has been debunked for quite some time. I’ll be charitable and suggest that those who reject abstinence education while claiming to be interested in what research says on the subject are entirely misinformed.

  • dbecraft

    I guess that those that have had extensive condom education never get pregnant. It does not matter what Sarah Palin’s beliefs were, her daughter got pregnant.

    Cause and effect of education seems a bit dim since more teens get pregnant with condom education than without… Geez..

    Love this kind of silly argument… Yea, it really reflects on the parents beliefs.

  • mom2oneson

    LOL I don’t have a tv but sometimes I see it at the laundromat. Communist News Network LOL so true.

  • rbdwiggins

    Since they’re Republican, there’s no political angle to exploit.

    Move along, folks…

  • Mahler

    You guys REALLY want to attack a woman for having a career in addition to having kids? Really??

    Um, have fun winning those Hillary voters back.

  • Molten

    If Sarah supports abstinence only programs for other children…I would expect that she would convey those beliefs to her daughter well before the age of 17…Parents usually like to pass along things like that to their children…especially fundamentalists..

    Of course you can’t blame the mother for the daughters actions…some things stick, others don’t…kids will be kids..

  • Molten

    the last woman candidate for a presidential ticket that has 5 kids under the age of 20..

  • JackLeary

    So Barack Obama reads the DailyKos. How this is exactly relevant to the campaign is beyond me. If DailyKos is the far-left blog, what does that make this site? It’s not like RedState.com is the model of centrist politics in the blogosphere. And besides, this kind of aggressive tabloid investigation of a candidate’s background, family, friends, associates, third cousins twice removed, first boyfriends, ect. is to be expected, and its terribly short-sighted to claim that this kind of information of Sarah Palin’s son or grandson or whatever the hell it is would be broken solely by a leftist blog or the opposing presidential campaign or the both of them in cahoots. This is the media in action. If I had a nickel every time I saw all the stories about Obama that have already been proved dreadfully false (he’s a Muslim, attended madrassa, ect.) I would be a rich man. And the Palin story actually looks to be true. What does that say about the media? Don’t get so upset. At least the media doesn’t purposely lie about her.

  • ConservaGeek

    You covered most of the points I was going to hit.

    If I can summarize, a study on a certain subset of programs can’t necessarily be extrapolated to all programs, especially in an area–like this one is–where the programs differ to a significant degree.

    Heck, if I wanted to, I could prove Biden’s comment about Indian accents in Dunkin Donuts right… just visit Dunkin Donuts in neighborhoods with a high Indian population in various cities. Then I could sell it to CNN as “A study of Dunkin Donuts in several cities,” while not mentioning how selective I was on the neighborhoods.

    We have no way of knowing whether the study’s authors picked only the worst performing programs they could find or not… therefore, the study is so much waste paper.

  • Molten

    It depends on how good a parent you are I suppose…

    Children are still capable of learning values from their parents, aren’t they?

    I like to think they are…but you obviously think that what a parent believes doesn’t matter at all in the life of their child..

    That’s kinda sad..

  • dbecraft

    does not use profane language for a start… We also do not make up stories about the opposite party..but do discuss facts. Talk about differences…

    Ah well, if you post such nonsense, you aren’t reading any factual information anyway… If you did, I’m sure you would dismiss it as propaganda anyway…(not within your view point).

  • NewEnglander

    That means he can’t attend their conventions, or else he’s a hypocrite.

    Am I the only one who feels this will backfire on the Dems? I sense some major blowback coming from mothers across the country — the very swing voters Obama needs.

  • jimmuy8

    is that they have just started. What we have seen is just the warm-up act. This is going to get real nasty.

    If Hillary couldn’t tie the smears back to the Obama camp, can we? And even if we did have a lead-pipe lock, the Edwards affair shows how far they will go for a non-messiah Dem–they’ll pour ten times the effort into making sure the ties to the Obama campaign stay hidden.

    Bottom line: now that McCain camp can’t take further donations, who can we give money to to fight this? Every kos kid, every media kool-aid drinker has dirty laundry, who will dig it up and expose it? Who will let them know that the glass-house rule?

  • Rod_Patrick

    His short tounge is saying “Stop It”. But his long tounge says “Go Ahead, Make My Day!”.

    It’s obviously planned massacre of Palin because everything has been done in a very deliberate and “systematic” fashion.

    Obama must fire himself! He knew it all along.

  • Jack_Savage

    “If I had a nickel every time I saw all the stories about Obama that have already been proved dreadfully false (he’s a Muslim, attended madrassa, ect.) I would be a rich man.”

    On this site? Try again bud.

    And the point of the matter is that Barack Obama is getting Daily Kos to do his dirty work for him, plain and simple. It is not that hard to grasp, and it is not that hard to see.

  • bk

    1) If she had chosen to abort her last baby as soon as she found out it would be a Downs baby, and
    2) If she had convinced her daughter to abort her baby since she was an unwed teenager,
    then clearly the left would say she has demonstrated the judgement and temperament they desire to see in the White House.

  • NewEnglander

    That means he can’t attend their conventions, or else he’s a hypocrite.

    Am I the only one who feels this will backfire on the Dems? I sense some major blowback coming from mothers across the country — the very swing voters Obama needs.

  • Sped

    NT

  • Rod_Patrick

    They would laud Palin if she decided on the reverse.

  • Jack_Savage

    “…you’ll find that a few dumbasses were being lambasted by the vast majority of the DailyKos community for their baseless allegations.”

    Oh YES – those noble Kossites! Cutting down baseless allegations against conservatives Wherever They May Be Found!

    The mask has slipped entirely off, buddy, and say thanks to your pals that attacked the Connecticut delegates for putting words into actions.

  • dbecraft

    in facts, but will partake in Democratic spin wherever it comes…

    What you don’t understand is that Conservative commentators do have biases but only report the facts. You can of course take those same facts and distort the meaning (Kos). Politics are lovely, are they not..?

  • Jack_Savage

    Now back to your new diary “Why Bush Didn’t Bomb The Levees This Time”.

  • dbecraft

    Sarah Palin is way too honest and has Integrity. She could never be a Democrat!

    What are you thinking?

  • JackLeary

    show me on a paystub where kos is getting paid by the obama campaign and id be happy to listen to you. until then, hes just a left-wing former soldier on a computer running a website.

  • civil_truth

    The chain of argument in dispute is the implication that Bristol got pregnant because she didn’t know about contraception because she was denied such information in her school’s sex education program because that program was abstinence-based because supporters of abstinence-based programs had succeeding in enacting such programs.

    This chain of alleged causation is then being adduced as an argument against abstinence-based sex education programs and condemnation of supporters of such programs.

    This was the chain of reasoning that I was refuting because in fact Bristol did receive a comprehensive sex education program at school. Gov. Palin’s personal views has nothing to do with discovering what was the actual program that Bristol received at her school.

    (Since I don’t base arguments on anecdotal evidence, I did not attempt to proceed to use this pregnancy as evidence favoring abstinence-based over comprehensive – that determination requires proper statistical evaluation.)

    However, now you’ve moved the goal posts from sex education to consideration of the influence of parental values on children – and of course that has a great influence on children. But that’s not the topic I was discussing.

  • CJB68

    (n/t)

  • dbecraft

    Let the folks be and get on with your life for goodness sakes! You are trying to make mountains out of ant hills…

  • speciallist

    n/p

  • Sped

    by Rod Patrick.
    “His short tounge is saying “Stop It”. But his long tounge says “Go Ahead, Make My Day!”.

    It’s obviously planned massacre of Palin because everything has been done in a very deliberate and “systematic” fashion.”

    Mr Patrick has not one shred of anything resembling proof that Obama approves of this silly attention Palins pregant daughter is getting. It simply suits the prevalent RS mentality that takes every opportunity to paint Obama as some sort of all knowing evil creature who controls the blogosphere.

    Ok Moe…tell you what..I’ll go jump back on the pile now. I have had my monthly visit to your increasingly pathetic self reinforcing site here.

    This actually brings to mind how much Redstate has gone downhill. There once was a time when Flyerhawk or even BrooksRob would keep the more rabid of Redstaters honest, and they would provoke impressively sound arguments from people like Trevino, Augustine, or even Gamecock on a good day. These days you have the likes of Erik pontificating about 20 year old parking tickets or (Gasp!) the size of the printing on campaign buttons. Sad Erik-really.

    So…back to the pile until around the end of October, then I will be back to point and laugh at the whaling and gnashing of teeth that will be going on around here over the November election results.

  • ConservaGeek

    So…back to the pile until around the end of October, then I will be back to point and laugh at the whaling and gnashing of teeth that will be going on around here over the November election results.

    Whaling hasn’t been a major part of any political party for many years, if ever.

    Perhaps you meant wailing?

    You’ll forgive me if I discount the opinion of one who doesn’t know the difference between those two words.

  • marywhite

    This from today’s New York Times:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/02/us/politics/02vetting.html?ref=politics

    Disclosures on Palin Raise Questions on Vetting Process

    “Aides to Mr. McCain said they had a team on the ground in Alaska now to look more thoroughly into Ms. Palin?s background. A Republican with ties to the campaign said the team assigned to vet Ms. Palin in Alaska had not arrived there until Thursday, a day before Mr. McCain stunned the political world with his vice-presidential choice…

    At the least, Republicans close to the campaign said it was increasingly apparent that Ms. Palin had been selected as Mr. McCain?s running mate with more haste than McCain advisers initially described…

    With time running out ? and as Mr. McCain discarded two safer choices, Gov. Tim Pawlenty of Minnesota and former Gov. Mitt Romney of Massachusetts, as too predictable ? he turned to Ms. Palin. He had his first face-to-face interview with her on Thursday and offered her the job moments later.

    ?They didn?t seriously consider her until four or five days from the time she was picked, before she was asked, maybe the Thursday or Friday before,? said a Republican close to the campaign. ?This was really kind of rushed at the end, because John didn?t get what he wanted. He wanted to do Joe or Ridge…

    In Alaska, several state leaders and local officials said they knew of no efforts by the McCain campaign to find out more information about Ms. Palin before the announcement of her selection, Although campaigns are typically discreet when they make inquiries into potential running mates, officials in Alaska said Monday they thought it was peculiar that no one in the state had the slightest hint that Ms. Palin might be under consideration.”

    I initially thought Palin was a great choice. But are we certain the McCain camp thoroughly vetted her? Are there some surprises that might come up? I hope not but this New York Times report has some high ranking Republicans worried. Should we be?

  • Mary_Contrary

    Maybe his campaign staff, but I doubt it’s coming from him.

    Considering his own parents were “married” on Ground Hog Day of ’61, and he was born in early August, this isn’t an issue he’s likely to pursue.

  • ConservaGeek

    And you completely missed the other Kossack posting this drivel earlier today in this very thread.

    If ever we needed evidence that this is a pre-manufactured talking point from the left, you just provided it, marywhite.

    Good day, ma’am. I said, good day!

  • BrianH

    She’s a tough successful woman who fights corruption.

    Nuff said.

  • marywhite

    I am just worried that McCain’s people may not have done their homework. Why isn’t that a legitimate concern to raise?

  • dbecraft

    and hard to find in politics. Of course that is my feeling based upon her prior performance.

    If she turns out different, we all lose…

  • speciallist

    n/p

  • Tim_Schieferecke

    n/t

  • ConservaGeek

    As I said, that concern has been raised by others before. I even gave you a link. Obviously you didn’t bother to read before posting, either your first comment or this one.

    Combined with the short amount of time between your registration and your first comment, and we have presumptive evidence that you’re a troll from Kos.

    If I say good day again, will you leave? Good day!

  • dbecraft

    or your advertisements… Where have you been?

  • Molten

    …that the influence of parental values on children is as great as those of sex ed teachers?

  • speciallist

    n/p

  • danvillain

    Initially my wife and I were elated about Palin. She’s the rising star in the GOP and clearly compliments the ticket with the issues that JM wasn’t bringing to the forefront as much as we would have liked.

    I’m now wondering if this gamble was worth it. The national spotlight from the liberal media has exposed some aspects of her career that could potentially put us in a much worse situation than a Ridge, or Romney (both of whom would have secured the election in my opinion).

    We wouldn’t need the Hillary voters if we had the complete ticket rather than someone with potential. Basically, I don’t want a first round draft pick as our second string QB when she hasn’t seen NFL action.

    Thoughts?

  • civil_truth

    You’re speaking with someone who believes they’re worth no more than a bucket of cold spittle. So you’ll find no disagreement from me that parental values and example are far more influential than sex education instructors or their courses.

    But if you’ve ever raised teens, I think you’ll have to agree you can’t judge parents on the basis of their teens’ behavior. All sorts of other factors weigh in, many of which the parents have no control over.

    I know wonderful parents who have rebellious children, and parents with dubious values whose child turns out just fine.

    There are no guarantees in life, but care and constancy are vital, especially when things take a turn for the worse. For that reason, I commend how the Palin family is handling Bristol’s preganancy.

  • Martin_A_Knight

    … it’s a well-known fact of life that they can make stupid mistakes no matter how well they’re taught, especially as emotionally immature hormonal teenagers.

    The argument you’re trying to make, Molten, stripped and shorn of all the tip-toeing is that Sarah Palin is a bad mother.

    We’re certainly hoping the Obama Campaign and his acolytes in the media (Wolf, Keith, Katie, etc.) go along with that.

  • Juggernaut

    McCain hardly knows this lady.

    She was certainly not vetted properly, and the rash announcement of her teenage daughter’s pregnancy and claim of knowledge on McCain’s staff’s behalf just screams inner turmoil and confusion.

    She has very little experience and nobody, in any way, can claim that she’s ready to be so very close to the most powerful position in the world. The 25th amendment cannot be ignored. She has zero foreign experience, minimal executive experience – especially when compared to the other possibilities for the Republican VP ticket.

    Playing the “she’s a good mother” card is asinine and invalid. First of all, it’s completely arbitrary, and as such with her Daughter’s situation should be a non-issue and in no way impact a person’s vote.

    For the record she has been Governor for 18 months, Obama has been a State Senator for 3 years. These are the facts.

    And Alaska isn’t exactly “connected” with the rest of the country. It has a completely different culture and economy than all other states, and the population of an average midwest city.

    So the experience card certainly falls short.

    She’s a great person, regardless of all the media coming up about her, but she is simply not, in any way, shape or form, ready to be VP.

    Perhaps if everybody had a shot to get to know her sooner, and not 2 months before election day. Maybe if she ran for a federal job, or even for President just to get recognized.

    But as is, unfortunately, this whole situation is completely fail.

    Good luck in 4 years, unless the Republicans make a quick switch-a-roo.

  • dbecraft

    She is honest, she is a maverick (ring any bells) she has integrity. She will perform above McCain.. You should be worried that she outshines McCain and should be at the top of the ticket.

    This is what America has been waiting for – An honest politician (geez, please help me – I don’t believe it myself).

  • simpson316

    thing a little off. She is also pro-contraception

    Palin said last month that no woman should have to choose between her career, education and her child. She is pro-contraception and said she’s a member of a pro-woman but anti-abortion group called Feminists for Life.

  • speciallist

    n/p

  • danvillain

    There’s no question to her straight-shooting approach and how valuable that is. Not to mention how much it scares the libs!

    Again, call it buyers remorse, but there’s too much room for surprises that at the end of the day hurt us. Yes, I’m still very disappointed it’s not a Mccain/Ridege ticket, but the more aspects of her operating history that are surfacing the more worried I am that what I thought was our Ace in the hole, could turn in to our Achillies heel.

    Without question she has electrified our movement, but this is starting to seem like a gamble in a situation where we cannot gamble!

  • bs

    blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah

    You and your leftist co-conspirators are broken records. We’ve heard it before. We really don’t care what you think. Go back to Kos and rally with rest of the swine.

  • mom2oneson

    nt

  • dbecraft

    don’t get involved with the MSM as they will continue to either turn you or at the least make you question your decision.

    You can NOT believe anything they say on TV or for that matter in the news.

    Please do not mistake your beliefs for those that are proffered on TV. They are biased toward the Democratic party and will not give truthful news.

    Specialist… Still wondering what your specialty is?

  • Rod_Patrick

    That boy is “sinless” and “perfect”.

  • stang

    They come here to lord their imagined intellectual and moral superiority over us, tell us what and how we should think, and then vanish.

    These anonymous cowards wouldn’t know ethics or integrity if it jumped up and bit them on the …er, nose.

    ?What a fool cannot learn he laughs at, thinking that by his laughter he shows superiority instead of latent idiocy.?

    Marie Corelli

  • Neil_Stevens

    Who are you that you know anything about the vetting process?

    What’s your source?

  • dbecraft

    Do you really think that this can change the normal persons views! You’ve got to be kiddin… (that’s slang for the South)…

    I think most people look at the current situation and see politics as usual… I look at this and see a new beginning.

    No more grey areas, no lies, no pretense, no more adding to the bottom line… This will be a drastic change in politics and it won’t come easily. I’m still hoping that it happens.

  • Juggernaut

    Mine would be - Link -.

    “A Republican with ties to John McCain’s campaign says the team assigned to vet McCain’s running mate, Gov. Sarah Palin of Alaska, had not arrived there until the day before McCain announced his vice-presidential choice.”

    What’s yours?

    Calling her “straightforward” does not qualify her for President.

    Let’s get some substance here. No silly adjectives or “broken record” ignorance. Honestly, some substance.

  • Neil_Stevens

    Erick is alleging that Obama staffers are pushing the story, the same way it’s alleged that Obama staffers pushed the “Ferraro is hysterical” story, and the “HRC can’t be President because they get ‘down’ sometimes” story.

    If true, the facts that the stories are posted as diaries and that ‘genuine’ Daily Kos posters shout it down don’t disprove his argument.

    In fact they may even support it, that the people wirting about this aren’t really part of the community, but are shills.

    Shills stand out. Just like you do.

  • speciallist

    because I’m good at everything, but I speciallize in Nothing…

  • bs

    The home of Keith Olbermann? You must be kidding. That’s like citing a Pravda article to support the benefits of capitalism.

    Try this one, which points out that the vetting began in FEBRUARY. At least the AP article cites real people as sources, versus “a Republican with ties to John McCain’s campaign”. Heck, I’M a Republican with “ties to McCain’s campaign” (I attended his rally and talked to his local campaign people)

    So, you have about as much knowledge of the vetting process as we figured – nada.

  • dbecraft

    I just assumed that you must be specializing in a particular field – hince the moniker.

    Oh well… I was hoping that you were a specialist in the programming field (where I could reasonably argue – oh well).

    I guess that I will have to just ignore you from now on….

  • stang

    .

  • danvillain

    For the last 12 years my field of expertise is the aqcuisition of private companies (the main reason Bo’s tax plan makes me sick).

    Mccain sending people to Alaska today doesn’t mean that he didn’t enough information to make a well-informed decision. The highest returns come from moving fast in a situation like this. Of course there are going to be problems that weren’t discovered in the initial evaluation, but rest assured the critical criterion to make this decision was met.

    However, if this were a decision where the future of our fund depended on the success of one major acquisition, I personally would have played it safer.

  • Neil_Stevens

    As noted, MSNBC has made a strategic choice to be anti-Republican.

    To cite them is either the height of stupidity or ignorance.

    Either way, expect people to point and laugh in your general direction. And learn to post better.

  • Neil_Stevens

    Are you a Republican? You sure don’t sound like one, so I’m curious.

    thanks,

  • Juggernaut

    You guys get baited waaaay too easy.

    MSNBC was only linking the article.

    It was from the New York Times.

    Seriously, at least RTFA before you ignorantly spout your madness.

  • Juggernaut

    “Stoking the notion of a rushed examination, a timeline issued by the campaign indicated that McCain initially met Palin in February, then held one phone conversation with her last week before inviting her to Arizona, where he met with her a second time and offered her the job.”

    Meeting for the first time is not “vetting”.

    Not to mention there is no evidence of ANY further communication between her and McCain or McCain’s staff until last week.

  • bs

    You think the NYT is any better? Try again, bub. They’re both equally worthless.

    Again – you know nothing about the vetting. So your opinion is worth nothing. And your presence here is contributing the same. So now the Hinz Rule is in effect.

  • Juggernaut

    You got owned in the reply below this one.

    Regardless, I imagine the Hinz Rule is where you cover your ears and shut your eyes and ignore reality.

    Besides that, you can’t just say “anonymous article is worthless” when they come from major networks and revered national papers and claim talking points from Fox News as cold, hard facts. This is what we call “double think”.

    It’s okay to wake up, and stop being a drone. Honestly, it’s okay…

  • Bluestatebastard

    Now that Gov, Palin is the V.P. pick she has to try and make her daughter an honest woman. Apparently this is all Obama’s fault. It has nothing to do with parenting. Obama has ordered the media to cover this and only this story, and it’s working. There is nothing else to watch except the scandal. Anderson Cooper and Geraldo are hanging out in front of an Alaska High School at this moment looking to interview rotund teen coeds.
    Get real, this is what happens when your candidate doesn’t do his homework. Don’t blame the liberals for this mess. It is all yours.

  • Juggernaut

    about loony conspirators…

    “The pattern is clear: Obama’s campaign pushes information to Daily Kos. Daily Kos then spreads it and gets it into the media (probably because a lot of reporters are also diarists there). Given all the other ever changing statements from Obama, how exactly can we really believe his denials now, given his pattern and the connections?”

    Aside from the fact that Kos is designed to push articles that are popular based on How many people read them, this nonsense is so tightly wrapped in tin foil that by just reading the article without any alarm bells ringing is a sure sign that you might want to sit down and actually think about things, logically, based in reality.

    There’s much you can learn if you just open your eyes and look outside the box.

    That’s all for tonight, however. God bless and good night.

  • danvillain

    If my NFL comparison put my political affiliation in doubt, I apologize. As a social and fiscal conservative and lifelong Republican, my number one concern is if our ticket in the best position for victory. Is it not reasonable to think that a Ridge VP appointee maybe have put us in better posture for what is going to be a tight race? Again, Palin has egnited our base, but I have legitimate concerns over the this decision that should not put my dedication to the party in question.

  • Rod_Patrick

    This time Speciallist, I’m certainly correct on this.

  • Neil_Stevens

    Tell it to the Directors, and make sure to send along the “They BANNED me for OUT-ARGUING them” post. Moe collects those, and if I get more than he does it’ll really give me bragging rights.

  • Neil_Stevens

    Ridge…

    … would not win us a state
    … would lose us at least as many votes as the drunk driving thing lost us in 2000 (and which gave Gore the popular vote as you may recall)
    … would do permanent damage to the coalition
    … would possibly trigger a third party pro-life run, handing whole states to Obama.

  • Neil_Stevens

    It wasn’t the NFL thing that made me ask that I assure you.

    It’s mostly that we’re getting pounded today with lefties who are posting like their brains are full of prions.

  • danvillain

    Not to mention his national security experience could help us with a well-rounded to strategy to attach BO’s lack thereof. His DUI dent is seemingly miniscule in comparison to what we’re having to address with SP. Just sayin…

  • Juggernaut_2

    [Apparently he thought he could call himself Juggernaut_2 but pretend that he's not Juggernaut.

    I don't think so. Homey don't play that.]

  • stang

    Readin’ up kinda late tonight. Are we doing auditions for the circus tonight?

    I must say it’s been interesting. Heh.

    Thanks for watching over us while we sleep.

  • Macker

    Should I refer to the other party as Demo?rats? Or should they be Demo?rats? Help me out here.

  • Neil_Stevens

    Kerry’s competitiveness in the Carolinas was not altered by Edwards for example.

  • kyle8

    nt

  • Neil_Stevens

    Since you’re clearly only here to troll the Palin threads, I’m just going to deactivate your account now.

  • danvillain

    but I still think the Pawlenty or Ridge would have locked this up.

  • Flagstaff

    What’s sad is that your parents raised you to be a worthless tool.

    Obviously they were bad parents.

  • Flagstaff

    was pretty clear and sensible.

    It’s Molten that needs an infusion of brain-power.