« BACK  |  PRINT

RS

EDITOR OF REDSTATE

Some Thoughts on Rick Warren

By: Erick Erickson (Diary)  |  December 18th, 2008 at 10:59 AM  | 

RESIZE: AAA

Billy Graham is pretty much dead. It’s not nice to say, but there you have it. Franklin does not have the same star power that his dad does and, besides, they’re Protestants so a hereditary Protestant Pope is not Franklin’s to claim.

Therefore, there is an opening for American Protestant Pope and Rick Warren covets the title. He wants to be the moral voice of the moral majority the way Graham used to be and he has a bigger ego to boot. So he’s happy to lay his hands on the new President and have the media give him the legitimacy the media once gave Billy Graham. That the new President is a proponent of infanticide is irrelevant to his resume.

Win – win. He’s not compromising his principles. He’s just giving legitimacy to get legitimacy.

And unlike Billy Graham, Rick Warren is fully committed to the pro-life cause.

P.S. – It also really does hack off all the right people. Much like the LaHood pick will when people remember he sat in the Speaker’s Chair presiding over Clinton’s impeachment.

P.P.S. – Unfortunately, I find Rick Warren insufferable. He’s a book salesman more than an evangelist and does not have the life experiences Graham had that taught Graham humility.

Tags: , ,

COMMENTS

POSTING RULES  |  LOGIN TO COMMENT  |  REGISTER TODAY
  • pwest

    I’m torn here because I don’t see how someone pro-lfe can be on stage with President Obama, but then again, I know we are to pray for our leaders. I have and will certainly continue to pray President Obama changes his mind about abortion.

  • http://www.buzzbrockway.com Buzz Brockway

    I think that when the President calls and asks you to come and pray for him and the county, you do it. Warren would have been crazy to turn down this opportunity and any preacher worth his salt would have jumped at the opportunity.

  • DFLer

    This is yet another installment of Obama following GHW Bush’s and Clinton’s and GW Bush’s leads, insisting that he is a kinder and gentler (insert party name here), is seeking a third way, is a different kind of (insert party name here), and blah blah blah.

    Doesn’t necessarily mean anything.

    Tho I’m sure it will help Warren sell some books, and help PFAW raise some money.

  • Cheetah772

    I don’t really support Rick Warren or even Billy Graham, as I feel they are compromising parts of the Bible.

    I am a member of an Independent Fundamentalist Baptist church, so that makes me a good deal more conservative than most members here on Redstate. I really don’t want Warren or Graham to be the leading voice of the moral majority in America. I would prefer that to be Jesus Christ — the Word of God.

    Unlike most Baptists, I understand the political realities, that we need to have support of every social conservative of any kind — religious or political otherwise. But truthfully, I always cringe every time either Warren or Graham opens his mouth. I think nowadays what is needed is more hell-fire preaching, positive preaching is a good thing…but even Christ preached more on the realities of Hell than on Heaven.

    On a final note….if I may make one major complaint: the font size in comment box is SO SMALL. Can you at least increase the font size in comment box? Please? Thanks

  • http://www.erickerickson.org Erick Erickson

    I put the fun in fundamentalist. I agree with you 100%. But reality is the media wants a Protestant Pope. They can only figure out one religious hierarchy and are too lazy to figure out all the Protestant ones.

    So there you have it. He gets the legitimacy they won’t give Christ.

    But as for you and me, we have no disagreement at all on this.

    On the comment box stuff, Neil??? Where are ya???? It looks fine on my computer. ;)

  • E Pluribus Unum

    I am right with you when it comes to Rick Warren. My thoughts on him and his plastic church ideas are best left unexpressed in this forum.

    But Billy Graham compromising parts of the Bible? I am a Southern Baptist, I understand political realities just fine, and I have Christian apologetics hard-wired into my brain. I will stipulate for the sake of argument that you are more conservative than me. But you need to explain that one. I’m not especially a fan of the mass-evangelistic thingm really, but in what way has Billy Graham been compromising parts of the Bible?

  • http://impudent.blognation.us/blog kyle8

    Or maybe the Protestant Patriarch. Then you could speak for all protestants the way Al and Jesse used to speak for all blacks.

  • aesthete

    I’m with you 100% with Rick (the Dr. Phil of Christian circles, IMO), but what’s what’s your beef w/Billy Graham? If it’s the “salvation only” concentration that he has, I’d contend that a deeper exegesis of Scripture is best left in the local church.

    Would like to hear your thoughts.

  • aesthete

    n/t

  • JustLeaveMeAlone

    Rick Warren sponsored an event during the campaign that was about as fair and evenhanded a format as could be: two candidates answering the same questions without responding to or being influenced by one another.

    (This is simply a fact and in no way reflective of anyone’s feelings about Rick Warren himself, pro or con.)

    So maybe, rather than this being some grand plot, Obama is simply recognizing that fact, saying “thank you”, and maybe, even, thinks this is appealing to Warren’s demographic, which isn’t really included in any other way.

    And let’s be clear: there isn’t any place at Obama’s table for the so-called “Christian Right” other than this.

    Regarding Warren, well, it’s a mistake that the Left makes over and over: trying to stereotype the “Christian Right”. They tried to give us Protestant popes in Jerry Fallwell and Pat Robertson, among others — Rick Warren is just the latest in that line.

    But trying to get the Christian Rght to send up the white smoke is like herding cats. Ain’t happening.

    (And BTW, Rick Warren isn’t the Dr Phil of Christian circles; Joel Osteen is. Now I like Joel a lot; I enjoy his books and even have attended Lakewood Church upon occasion; but I don’t look to him for Bible teaching.)

    I’m glad Obama asked Rick Warren to do this (for any number of reasons), and I’m reminded that God works in mysterious ways :)

  • cump

    While I do not know as much about Rick Warren as I should (yes he wrote a book, has a huge church, and is very vocal on social issues), I am comfortable with him delivering the Inaugurable Prayer. By listening to some comments, on this board and off it, it would appear that prayer to our Almighty God should not even be rendered (due to no one being ‘Holy’ enough). Not rendered due to Obama’s stance on abortion (condoned murder!), or his stance on homosexual rights (wrong again), or his attendance within his prior church, or this or that.

    I, for one, am happy that we wil see on the national stage a Prayer to our Lord and Savior! Not a false God, not an idol, but an honest to goodness Christian Prayer requesting strength for our leaders, requesting a blessing on our nation, and moral backbone (I hope) to our members of Congress. Would I like to see Billy Graham? Yes. Would I like to see John Calvin, John the Baptist, or my local Pastor? Yes…but alas it is not to be

    One reason I am comfortable with this selection is that the left is so much against it. I actually smile a little with that thought in mind. Would any of us stand at the feet of all we despise, hold in our hands the opportunity to Pray in front of all the country, and forfeit it? I hope not, because we need it too much…God Bless this Prayer!!!

  • http://www.erickerickson.org Erick Erickson

    I tend to agree. The question still is, “why Warren?”

    Guess Jeremiah Wright isn’t available that day or Obama just doesn’t need to keep up pretenses of connecting with the black community anymore.

  • http://www.incredibleco.ning.com Incredible

    I pray for our leaders, here and around the world, as instructed. I could not in good consience participate in their official events.

  • aesthete

    Apologies if you’re a fan of Rick, BTW. And yes, I was actually very impressed by his performance in the Saddleback debate.

  • libertylakerd

    http://blogs.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.view&friendID=214724914&blogID=457198706

    Thursday, December 18, 2008

    by: Roger Duval

    An early release of Pastor Rick Warren?s Inauguration Prayer

    “Dear God, Whom I used to know and follow, we come before you today to ask you to anoint a person who is no more Christian than is a steaming pile of Chicago garbage. Deep down, we all know that the best thing for America would have been if Barack Obama’s unwed mother had aborted him as an unwanted chunk of uterine tissue. Today, however, we are stuck with him as our new President. We are so blessed that Barack has chosen not to use his life story as a pro-life testimony, rather he has taken the position that even babies who find a way to slip past the clutches of the abortionist don’t have a chance to live longer than about 20 minutes?the job will be finished thanks to how Barack Obama views abortion rights.

    “We pray blessings on this liar, oh Lord. We know that evil company corrupts people, and Barack can’t seem to name any friends who do not come from evil. We have marveled during the campaign that he can lie better than the last empty suit we had in the White House, the one and only Bill Clinton. Did I say lie better than Bill Clinton? Perhaps I should adjust the order of these two liars and say Barack, you are close to Bill?close, but no cigar. (Yet)

    “When I was writing my book, (Original working title: The Glamour-Driven Pastoral Life), I had in mind that one day I would stand here, on inauguration day, offering up a benediction for a godly president, but hey, when opportunity knocks, we can’t let something as silly as integrity get in the way. I saw an opening to replace Billy Graham as the go-to presidential pastor. True, I was selected today because Barack’s own close pastor can’t be up here praying. Ol’ Rev. Wright might get the wind of the un-holy-ghost and let lose with a sting of expletives damming America, or blaming our government for AIDS.

    “And God, speaking of AIDS, thank you for our outgoing President and the tremendous good-hearted actions he has taken in the area of helping those afflicted with this disease in Africa. (Under his breath he whispers?’Had to get that serious line in God, so I can at least have a chance of repenting from this appearance later.’)

    “We know, God, that our Founding Fathers and our Founding Documents were inspired by heaven. Please anoint Barack Obama as he appoints a team of people who have no clue what those documents stand for and he does his best to take this great nation in a direction that none of our founders would recognize.

    “Also in the audience are people like Oprah Winfrey and a multitude of Hollywood people. Bless them as they consider me for an appearance on the show and help them to choose wisely in selecting who will play me in the movie.

    “In Jesus’s name–who is also mentioned in my book, which is for sale at the concession tables–we pray.”

  • Aaron Gardner

    Wishing that Obama had been aborted, even in jest, is not really how I want to be represented.

  • Cheetah772

    But before I go on, Redstate is focused on political, not religious, issues. So, I have to be mindful of what I am about to type in this comment. I realize that there are members here whose religious views are perhaps different from that of mine. Having said that, I’ll answer your question on one condition: that we agree to disagree and leave it at that.

    Graham does present a clear picture of the Gospel of Christ, and he should be commended for his effort to lead multitudes of souls to Christ. However, after leading souls to Christ, he usually sends converts back to their old churches. For instance, I know a few personal stories of Catholic converts being sent back to Roman Catholic Church, after attending a Billy Graham event. This contradicts the biblical doctrine of separation from the world and old life. This is not about being against Roman Catholicism, but rather that if people were dissatisfied with their old churches and understood the Gospel of Christ, then they should have quit and joined New Testament, Bible-believing, godly churches.

    Furthermore, Graham is breaking down biblical walls between those godly and apostate churches, when according to Romans 16:17, we are to mark those who cause divisions and teaching doctrines contrary to the Word of God. Thus, even though Graham led multitudes of souls to Christ, what he is doing is wrong in the sight of God. This is compromising the letter and spirit of His Word.

    On a final note, it is my personal observation that after many souls are supposedly saved in Christ after a Billy Graham event, there should be some sort of evidence that demonstrates great spiritual growth. There is a historical precedent for this: The Great Awakenings, DL Moody’s revivals, Billy Sunday’s preaching, George Finney, and others. After a great revival that took place, people changed their lives and threw out old lifestyle habits like drinking alcoholic beverages or pornographic magazines, etc. Bars were closed down, even theaters were closed as well. There was a general acknowledgement of the power of God working everywhere. Yet, none of this occurs after a Graham event. Why is this so? I don’t think God is pleased that Graham is compromising parts of the Bible just so that souls can be saved.

    It has always been my view that God would rather that no one compromise the Bible and only a few souls saved in Christ than many souls led to Christ and the Bible compromised spiritually. For God is a holy and righteous God, the spirit of compromise is not in His holy character, therefore all pastors, evaneglists, missionaries, and teachers should follow Christ’s example and the Word of God. I feel Graham failed in this area, and he will be judged for that at the Judgment Seat of Christ in Heaven (in the case you don’t know, the Bible teaches there are TWO judgments: one for the saved and the other is for the lost only — The Great White Throne of Judgement).

    If after reading this comment, you find it offensive and disagreeable, then fine, I’d suggest that we leave it at that. Okay?

  • E Pluribus Unum

    Dude, this shall absolutely be a civil exchange, and I think we are definitely going to disagree. We are certainly Christian brothers, on the same side of 95% of everything, probably 98% of doctrine. Per your terms, we can of course agree to disagree.

    Besides, while I am occasionally nasty to people on RedState, never the regular crew. Except absentee, who speaks ungraciously about my mother.

    Anyway, it sounds like the root behavior from Graham that sets off your beef with him is (a) the Graham ‘machine’ if you will, not doing any followup on salvation (or presumed salvation) experience, but instead (b) ‘sends converts back to their old churches’, (c) some of which are not Biblically sound churches.

    Would that be a fair summation? I am going to operate on that premise. First, I tend to agree that this ‘go preach to a bunch of people, get presumed salvation experiences, out of them, then move on to the next arena or stadium’, is not something I am fond of, nor do I view it as an especially sound approach to the Great Commission – which as we both know, commands us to ‘make disciples’ and ‘teach obedience to the Lord’s commands’. So the Graham approach does not please me. I agree with you in that the great revivals involved camping out, so to speak, on scripture, calling for and getting life changes, and prayer, lots of sustained prayer.

    Instructing them to ‘go back to their old church’, I am sure is an attempt to give the new convert a place to plug in for that discipleship, recognizing that the Graham approach cannot satisfy on its own. The fact that the Graham ‘machine’ is indiscriminating as to the theological underpinnings of various denominations is a bit careless, but to conclude that Graham is ‘compromising parts of the Bible’ I think is an excessive charge. You said that about Graham himself, not just his organization.

    I view the Graham style of evangelism as inadequate, somewhat ill-considered. You take the fact that they are willing to send new converts ‘to church, any church’ as some egregious violation of scripture. I do not. Certainly not what I would do, because in their shoes I would be careful to instruct them as to the difference between plastic churches and real churches.

    So anyway, my 2 cents, Cheetah.

  • libertylakerd

    Just part of the shock and awe of satire my friend. If you strip away all the “women’s right to do what she wants” smoke and mirrors, Obama’s stance is cold and heartless. Perhaps the thought that he was an “accident” and a classic “abortion” situation and grew up to be POTUS might wake up some pro-abortion people.

  • Gizzard

    What’s with Obama and all these religious wingnuts he hangs with? First Wright…now this clown?

    Warren might be the only person I can think of with a bigger ego than “The One”. He writes a popular self-help book and now he’s handing out international peace awards and appearing before the nation on inauguration day? You’re correct in the post…he’s got ZERO humility. And without that, preaching always takes an intolerable air of sanctimony and condescension. I can’t listen to a word that guy says.

  • zuiko

    I didn’t realize that believing “G-D America” invented AIDS to wipe out minorities got you classified as a “religious wingnut” among the dkos crowd.

  • Jaded

    I might just go buy his book to help him make some money….he was unapologetic in his take on gay marriage with NBC it was great and really pissed off the reporter! and every show that has covered it has had a really ticked off liberal railing against Warrens hate speech….Good stuff and I want to thank Obama for making this week a winner for those of us on the sidelines watching liberals and progressive more angier than they ususally are!

    Wonderful show, bravo I am looking for an encore and extended showings!

  • Gizzard

    I like the title of your comment. You caught me! Damn. I didn’t have much luck with that “testing the waters” post. But I’m back for the moment. Couldn’t help it.

    And I’m just messing around. I like you guys (most, anyway). I exaggerated for effect. I knew it would draw some fun responses.

    But I do agree with the original poster here. Warren is a glorified book salesman.

    Just because some guy cloaks his personal philosophy in the “word of God” doesn’t mean I have to take him seriously. And certainly not as seriously as he takes himself. He’s still just some guy.

    I’ll make my own interpretations of one of the great wisdom traditions of this world. I don’t need some dude to break it down and tell me how he sees it.

    And on another note: Please don’t lump me in with the dkos crowd. That’s insulting.

  • Gizzard

    And I couldn’t care less about gay marriage. Some of you people are as bad as the HuffPo crowd with your assumption skillz.

    Oh…and there’s no need for a ‘more’ before ‘angrier’. That it is more than before is implied by the “-er”.

  • JustLeaveMeAlone

    I think both of them are good at what they do. I just wouldn’t classify them as Biblical scholars. But I’ll give ‘em points for the ability to inspire and give hope; and I do believe they both mean well.

    And hey, anyone that annoys the Left as much as Rick is doing has to be doing something right!

  • olsmithie

    plus yours makes three.

    Chew on that a while before you spout off.

    Regards