Dear Senator Ensign


When you sleep with another man’s wife, you deserve what you get from that man. If he wanted you to pass special legislation adding his grandmother to Mt. Rushmore and buying him a new pony, you shut your $@^@#! mouth and you do it.

If he wants the rest of us to hold you down while he beats the ever living crap out of you, you consent.

You have no business attacking this man’s integrity, character, judgment, or intentions.

Now go find a dark hole somewhere, climb in, and we will tell you when you are allowed back out. Until then, shut the hell up and give the man and your own wife whatever on earth they demand.

In the meantime, I’m going to go throw my branding iron with the letter A in the fire to get it hot.


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A hypothetical situation

gioraffe Saturday, June 20th at 5:22PM EST (link)

What if he demands that Senator Ensign pass special legislation legalizing same-sex marriage and late-term abortions?

Just throwin’ that one out there.

Or, What If?...

IJB Saturday, June 20th at 5:56PM EST (link)

The cuckolded husband is a wife-beater?

Just sayin’ that these situations aren’t always so cut-and-dried…

Let's not play casuistry games here, okay?

civil truth (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 6:09PM EST (link)

Erick was making a basic point here – with a certain amount of hyperbole – that rises above situational nitpicking.

Which is that having slept with another guy’s wife, you’ve surrendered your moral credibility to publically judge the actions of those you’ve offended.

It doesn’t mean that anything they say or do is justifiable or right, just that your moral authority to publiclly criticize has been shattered. Thus, it’s up to others to sort out the rights and wrongs of the aggrieved parties’ responses, not you.

And rather than to publicly mount a high horse, you need to quietly retire to a penitential cell.

The greatest evil…is conceived and ordered (moved, seconded, carried, and minuted) in clean, carpeted, warmed, and well-lighted offices, by quiet men with white collars and cut fingernails and smooth-shaven cheeks who do not need to raise their voice. Hence, naturally enough, my symbol for Hell is something like the bureaucracy of a police state or the offices of a thoroughly nasty business concern. -C.S. Lewis

http://www.gmsplace.com/

5

6eorge Jetson (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 6:13PM EST (link)

And I'm Not Willing To Conceed The Point

IJB Saturday, June 20th at 6:13PM EST (link)

I don’t think perpetrating a “wrong” suddenly makes you unable to judge a greater “wrong”, or impedes your credibility with others to that point either. (Sure, it may damage your credibility with others, but it doesn’t necessarily destroy it.)

 

5.

Erick Erickson (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 6:20PM EST (link)

.

Who will stand on either hand and keep this bridge with me?

 
 

yes they are...what about Ensign's wife?

AceInTX (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 4:06PM EST (link)

and just because her husband may be a wife beater or whatever, it’s still wrong for Ensign to have an an affair with her no matter what the circumstances!

The “Big Tent” analogy isn’t the correct one…the correct one is a MAGNET…we need to be a MAGNET that draws these independents in who are sick and tired of what’s going on in WashingtonFred Thompson

Whoosh

Neil Stevens (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 4:09PM EST (link)

The point isn’t whether the affair was appropriate. The point is whether Ensign should turn his Senate seat into a grab bag of favors for the other guy.

RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
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I got that...and the obvious answer is NO!

AceInTX (Diary) Monday, June 22nd at 12:19AM EST (link)

and I think he was wrong for resigning his leadership post though I don’t like him because of his work on the 2008 elections.

I was replying to a specific point…that being:

Or, What If?…

The cuckolded husband is a wife-beater?

Just sayin’ that these situations aren’t always so cut-and-dried…

my point was simply that just because the guy might be a wife beater it doesn’t excuse Ensign’s indiscretion…

The “Big Tent” analogy isn’t the correct one…the correct one is a MAGNET…we need to be a MAGNET that draws these independents in who are sick and tired of what’s going on in WashingtonFred Thompson

Kowalsky....

AceInTX (Diary) Monday, June 22nd at 12:21AM EST (link)

specifically I was pointing out it is cut and dried…Ensign was wrong for having an affair with another man’s wife….period…

Everything else that goes on beyond that is debatable and I laid out my position on that in numerous posts below

The “Big Tent” analogy isn’t the correct one…the correct one is a MAGNET…we need to be a MAGNET that draws these independents in who are sick and tired of what’s going on in WashingtonFred Thompson
 
 
 
 
 

I don't understan this diary at all

Doc Holliday (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 8:20PM EST (link)

it would be best if we all held fire at this point. No man should do what another asks as a threat, ever. If the husband wants to fight the man, do it fair and square. Blackmail (I am not saying that happened) is a crime and wrong.

I think commentary on breaking news can be dangerous, as the first “facts” always seem to be wrong. As far as a know, adultery is not a crime, certainly in Nevada, although it is morally repugnant. Blackmail of a public official is a crime. I am not saying that happened, I do not know the facts; but to me this diary is confusing and premature.

I know if someone tried to “brand” me, they would have to be ready for a fight.

Molon Labe!

I could be wrong

leftylurker (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 8:21PM EST (link)

But I’ve read that the blackmail charge is bogus.

I think we should give the husband the benefit of the doubt here.

Where have you read

Neil Stevens (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 8:23PM EST (link)

And what was the source?

RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
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The Las Vegas Sun was where I read it

leftylurker (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 8:31PM EST (link)

And the source was the husband’s letter to Fox news that was sent before the Senator announced his affair.

I’ll concede that this could have been a ploy, but I haven’t seen any evidence of the blackmailing either.

TheLas Vegas Sun is Nevada's version of the NYT

Vegas_Rick (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 11:02AM EST (link)

All the news fit to distort to suit liberal constituencies is contained in the Las Vegas Sun. This liberal rag is so pathetic that it has to be distributed inside a fairly balanced paper; the Review-Journal.

Puh-leeease!

“God is great, beer is good and people are crazy.”- Billy Currington

“Nothing in this world can take the place of persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful people with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan ‘press on’ has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race.” Calvin Coolidge.

 
 
 

i never said he did blackmail

Doc Holliday (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 8:48PM EST (link)

I just found the diary odd. We conservatives tend to eat our own when they make human mistakes. You libs just say “it was only about sex” and move on. This may be why we are in the minority. This also may be why I constantly say we need to limit the influence of government in our lives. I don’t need perfect people running my life, I need them unable to run my life because I know they have failings and don’t want them to land on my head.

Molon Labe!

We Are A Bit Too Harsh; And The Liberal Media Exploits It

Swamp_Yankee (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 9:06PM EST (link)

Especially when there is no real crime. Ensign made a personal mistake. I dont care. Conservatives sometimes care too much.

But the worse is that liberals dont understand that you can set standards; support standards; not live up to them; and that okay. That is the entire essence of a moral society.

The is a difference between knowing the path and walking the path. Conservatives set the bar high and try to reach it knowingl that they may fail.

Liberals dont want any guilt, shame or responsibility, so they set the bar at their ankles and antime they hop over it, they expect a prize for doing something they should be doing all the time.

Libs and the press will use this as evidence of hypocrisy. As if anyone whose ever swore has to support causal swearing; that anyone whose ever smoked weed has to support legalized drugs; anyone whose ever lied cant criticize lying; anyone whose ever cheated cant support tradtional marriage.

Its such a stupid standard but some combination of self-righteous conservatives and nitwit liberals makes that the reality.

A conservative didnt personally live up to the views he espouses publicly. Big deal. That not hypocrisy. That’s humanity.

The worse thing is how the liberals are able...

penguin2 (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 9:23PM EST (link)

to beat our side over the head with these shortcomings, yet glide under the radar, with the help of the MSM, when it comes to their human failings.

Man is not perfect, but why is it our side that perfection is demanded of (in the game of politics), and not theirs? It is a PR battle we must turn around.

Resistance to tyrants is obedience to God. – Benjamin Franklin
When Good stands up to Evil, Evil blinks. – Vassar Bushmills

Conservative Education: Suggested Reading List

Activists Taking Action: Unified Patriots

They Dont Care About Their Human Failings ...

Swamp_Yankee (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 9:29PM EST (link)

… Because they dont have any standards. It’s all mush to them. Why should conservatives beat up ourselves, because we set high standards and sometimes fail to live up to them.

 
 

yes

Doc Holliday (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 9:24PM EST (link)

I agree with all you have said here. Yet I am glad we try to support morality. The left wants us to abandon any judgment. That is a bridge too far. But those supposedly on our side who revel in taking our own guys down have their own self defeating malignancy.

Molon Labe!

 

Great point re: hypocrisy

leftylurker (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 9:27PM EST (link)

There’s a good discussion along your lines in a Neal Stephenson book called The Diamond Age. It’s a nice piece of Sci-Fi.

 

I wouldn't say he shouldn't be fogiven...or that he can never speak to moral character again...

AceInTX (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 4:25PM EST (link)

sometimes the best advocates against adultery, drug use, or any other sins are those who’ve experienced the pain and suffering that sinful behavior reaks upon them and those who love them…

What’s at issue here is that Ensign needs to shut up…he’s under the gun and for the moment at least he’s disgraced himself..I’m one that always believes in fighting back and not taking things lying down…but there is a certain decorum involved in this sort of situation and antagonism isn’t the best stance in this situation…

This is a time for Ensign to show some humility, introspection and repentance…not throwing out invective and accusations at the aggrieved husband…If the guy really did try to blackmail him, Ensign needs to report it to the authorities and let them handle it instead of airing it out in the public eye and keeping the damaging story front and center for the foreseeable future…

IU would ad…he’s hurting the party by airing his dirty laundry like this.

I’ve deliberately tried to keep my moth shut about his indiscretion but if he can’t shut up and keep this out of the public eye…then why not lay it out there?,

The “Big Tent” analogy isn’t the correct one…the correct one is a MAGNET…we need to be a MAGNET that draws these independents in who are sick and tired of what’s going on in WashingtonFred Thompson
 
 
 
 

Good points Doc...

AceInTX (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 4:11PM EST (link)

and if the offended husband committed a crime, he should be prosecuted…by all means.

But that doesn’t negate the fact that Ensign needs to shut his filthy mouth and take his lumps because no one forced him to betray his own wife…or assist his mistress in betraying her husband…

The “Big Tent” analogy isn’t the correct one…the correct one is a MAGNET…we need to be a MAGNET that draws these independents in who are sick and tired of what’s going on in WashingtonFred Thompson
 
 
 

Moe and the gang will "just" throw you out as well.

SoFiMil (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 5:32PM EST (link)

n/t

www.suvstrategery.blogspot.com

And it's not going to be "hypothetical"

SoFiMil (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 5:39PM EST (link)

.

www.suvstrategery.blogspot.com

They like to live dangerously, don't they? nt

TNJim (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 5:40PM EST (link)

Activism: What to do after the TEA party rally. Unified Patriots

 
 
 

I can't agree with this

Neil Stevens (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 6:00PM EST (link)

Once the guy started lusting for money he lost that innocent victim status. He fell just as Ensign did.

I can’t put one over the other once he went from the guy whose wife betrayed him, to the guy trying to blackmail a Senator.

RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
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In fact...

Neil Stevens (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 6:17PM EST (link)

OInce this bozo decided to try to blackmail a Senator, he became the enemy of all honest Americans, trying to subvert our government for his personal whims.

I don’t care what Ensign did. Lock the other guy up in federal prison.

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That's exactly the point, Neil

civil truth (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 6:34PM EST (link)

If the husband was committing a crime of extortion, then Ensign needed to go to the DA and report the crime and cooperate in the investigation.

Instead, by going public like this, Ensign has ruined any case against the husband, and he arguably could be viewed as having obstructed justice.

And he did so for some strange calculation that raising this charge publicly would enhance his position in the eyes of the public. Once again he put his personal interests above that of the public interest – here the public interest being that justice carried out and as a warning to future extortioners.

(Just as in the adultery he put his personal interests above the interests of his constituency and supporters and the interests of those of his fellow Republicans and organizations like Promise Keepers who stand for tradtional marriage values whose credibility he has thus damaged.)

If the husband did this, then he’s slime too. But this doesn’t take any stain off of Ensign.

The greatest evil…is conceived and ordered (moved, seconded, carried, and minuted) in clean, carpeted, warmed, and well-lighted offices, by quiet men with white collars and cut fingernails and smooth-shaven cheeks who do not need to raise their voice. Hence, naturally enough, my symbol for Hell is something like the bureaucracy of a police state or the offices of a thoroughly nasty business concern. -C.S. Lewis

http://www.gmsplace.com/

H ow has this ruined the case?

Neil Stevens (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 7:26PM EST (link)

I wasn’t aware our justice system required secrecy or docile victims.

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It eliminated the chance of catching the blackmail on tape - nt

Mike gamecock DeVine (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 8:56PM EST (link)

Mike DeVine’s Examiner.com, Charlotte Observer and The Minority Report columns
“One man with courage makes a majority.” – Andrew Jackson

That's a point there (nt)

Neil Stevens (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 9:04PM EST (link)

RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
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It makes Ensign look like a politician who's smearing the husband to cover his own indiscretion

AceInTX (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 4:39PM EST (link)

and it keeps this out there in the public eye because the press loves these tabloid stories…especially since it is a Republican who is involved.

civil truth says all that needs to be said here:

he did so for some strange calculation that raising this charge publicly would enhance his position in the eyes of the public. Once again he put his personal interests above that of the public interest – here the public interest being that justice carried out and as a warning to future extortioners.

(Just as in the adultery he put his personal interests above the interests of his constituency and supporters and the interests of those of his fellow Republicans….

The “Big Tent” analogy isn’t the correct one…the correct one is a MAGNET…we need to be a MAGNET that draws these independents in who are sick and tired of what’s going on in WashingtonFred Thompson
 
 

How about

anotherindyfilmguy (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 10:26PM EST (link)

Lock up the blackmailer… Shove the Senator out of office? Kind of a win-win for everyone…

To me they both lose on the morality part.
The blackmailer because he’s committing a felony of blackmail instead of doing something physical, painful and possibly lethal to undo the stain of being cuckolded*…

The Senator for being… well… an overplayed egotistical bastard who acts like he has no moral limits instead of trying to do something to make up for disgracing himself…

Santorum? Well, at least he’s not Romney…
http://www.zazzle.com/enemy_of_the_statist_tshirt-235977043035297478

 
 

As bad as adultery is,

jeffreywturner (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 8:29PM EST (link)

It isn’t a crime in the US (unless you are in the military, or one of those states with antiquated, unenforced laws still on the books).

Extortion OTOH is.

“Life is too short, can’t we all just eat pork and kill some terrorists?”

 

I agree with you on this Neil...

AceInTX (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 4:32PM EST (link)

Where I would draw a distinction however, is where Ensign is engaged in publicly trashing him. It’s a problem from a tactical standpoint if for no other reason because gives the blackmailer a pass and Ensign ends up looking like a cad for the reasons stated…like he’s shooting the messenger instead of reporting the blackmail…

He should let the authorities handle the blackmail and shut up to take this off the front page

The “Big Tent” analogy isn’t the correct one…the correct one is a MAGNET…we need to be a MAGNET that draws these independents in who are sick and tired of what’s going on in WashingtonFred Thompson
 
 

Apropos to my comment above regarding the Ensign issue

civil truth (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 6:24PM EST (link)

I don’t think that Erick is saying that the Ensign’s adultery gives her husband carte blanche for extortion, if I get the gist of what Erick’s getting at.

Rather, Erick’s complaint is with Ensign – that Ensign by his actions has surrendered his standing to go public about it. The husband’s response (right or wrong) doesn’t mitigate Ensign’s culpability for his adultery.

And there’s certainly no justification for Ensign (or his political operative) to have gone public with this charge as some kind of explanation why he went public with the affair.

Ensign just needed to make his public confession, resign his leadership position, offer penance, and then say no more about it – certainly not to shift responsiblity for going public about the affair by a public accusation of extortion against the husband.

If Ensign though the husband was committing a crime, then he needed to go to the DA, not the press. And if he didn’t think it a crime, then he had no reason to raise the issue in the first place.

And just from a strict political perspective, this going public against the husband with an extortion charge turns a manageable episode into a much bigger and uncontrollable spectacle that will last much longer as this extortion charge triggers a lot more questions that easilty could do unrepairable damage to Ensign’s political career..

The greatest evil…is conceived and ordered (moved, seconded, carried, and minuted) in clean, carpeted, warmed, and well-lighted offices, by quiet men with white collars and cut fingernails and smooth-shaven cheeks who do not need to raise their voice. Hence, naturally enough, my symbol for Hell is something like the bureaucracy of a police state or the offices of a thoroughly nasty business concern. -C.S. Lewis

http://www.gmsplace.com/

Erick seemed to be saying just that

Neil Stevens (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 7:28PM EST (link)

If he wanted you to pass special legislation adding his grandmother to Mt. Rushmore and buying him a new pony, you shut your $@^@#! mouth and you do it.

Emphasis added.

I think Erick is totally wrong here. I will not have my government turned into a private playground of one man twisted by his wife’s betrayal.

Let this two-bit criminal go to the divorce courts like everyone else. Leave me and other Americans out of it.

RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
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I'll let Erick speak for himself here but I took that as Sarcasm

AceInTX (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 4:49PM EST (link)

not that Ensign should bow to the blackmail…I’m not sure the whole post wasn’t sarcasm and hyperbole directed at those dragging Ensign through the mud…

I agree with most of what Erick said here…I’m just unclear if he meant it…or if he was making a sarcastic case as to why those Republicans who are asking for Ensign’s head on a platter are wrong…I agree with the latter as well…

The “Big Tent” analogy isn’t the correct one…the correct one is a MAGNET…we need to be a MAGNET that draws these independents in who are sick and tired of what’s going on in WashingtonFred Thompson
 
 

Bingo!!!

AceInTX (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 4:42PM EST (link)

And just from a strict political perspective, this going public against the husband with an extortion charge turns a manageable episode into a much bigger and uncontrollable spectacle that will last much longer as this extortion charge triggers a lot more questions that easilty could do unrepairable damage to Ensign’s political career..

The “Big Tent” analogy isn’t the correct one…the correct one is a MAGNET…we need to be a MAGNET that draws these independents in who are sick and tired of what’s going on in WashingtonFred Thompson
 
 
 

Its Vegas; They all look normal n/t

Swamp_Yankee (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 6:10PM EST (link)

The point?

bnb614 Saturday, June 20th at 7:04PM EST (link)

Enjoy this site, enjoy reading your opinion Erick, but think this post is not your finest hour. What is the purpose of the post? Ensign is disgraceful for his actions, but that doesn’t mean he should roll over when someone is blackmailing him, or that the other guy has carte blanche to ask for whatever he wishes. Ensign can still condemn another persons action, but he condemnation should be viewed by others through the perspective of what Ensign did and what credibility he has.

 

Well said

MG Saturday, June 20th at 7:19PM EST (link)

Someone had to say it. Well done, EE

It’s not that our liberal friends are ignorant; it’s that they know so much that isn’t so.

 

What about the wife????

Kayla Saturday, June 20th at 7:33PM EST (link)

Why is she getting a pass in all this? She helped create this mess. She was a married woman who slept with the man her whole family worked for. Hardly a beacon of virtue.

The wife is NEVER culpable!

Vegas_Rick (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 11:06AM EST (link)

Only the male politician has any ‘splainin’ to do.

“God is great, beer is good and people are crazy.”- Billy Currington

“Nothing in this world can take the place of persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful people with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan ‘press on’ has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race.” Calvin Coolidge.

 
 

Sorry Erick, I Disagree

almom Saturday, June 20th at 7:50PM EST (link)

From what I have read, Ensign was separated from his wife at the time when the affair began. So, we have a woman that did this of her own will…. was this a plan? I don’t trust anybody or anything right now. Then we have a husband trying to take down Ensign and mentions Coburn in his letter. He also tries to drag Fox News into it. I smell something funny here and the sick smell of Dingy Harry. Sorry, Erick, I like you and am registered for Atlanta, but I disagree with you on this one. If I were Ensign I would tell everyone to mind their own ……. business. You keep doing this and we are whimps.

At what point did adultery

Adjoran (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 9:27PM EST (link)

become a justification for blackmail, extortion, or the like? OR, worse yet, even if it were legal, the larding up of public legislation for private benefit?

Some blue noses putting their personal moral codes above the law, and seeking to impose their rules on everyone, provide the very targets the Democrats and media love to have among conservatives.

I recognize the Commandments as God’s own Law, but the very idea the taxpayer needs to pony up for private misconduct, even by a public official, is noxious to me. And Jesus was pretty clear on my role in judging others’ sins . . .

If some people are so darned anxious to stone some sinners, perhaps they should move to Iran and join the Guard.

Noone says the husband's blackmail should be excused

AceInTX (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 4:57PM EST (link)

but Ensign shouldn’t be taking this out into the public and drag out the story….the longer this goes on./..the more damage he does to himself…and worse…the Party…not that Ensign seems to care based on his miserable performance as chairman of the NRSC

The “Big Tent” analogy isn’t the correct one…the correct one is a MAGNET…we need to be a MAGNET that draws these independents in who are sick and tired of what’s going on in WashingtonFred Thompson

Ace. Who is Noone? nt

mbecker908 (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 6:08PM EST (link)

OK...I shouldn't speak for others...

AceInTX (Diary) Monday, June 22nd at 12:24AM EST (link)

but the points being made in this thread go more to Ensign needing to clam up and let this die down instead of shooting off his mouth and keeping the circus alive!

The “Big Tent” analogy isn’t the correct one…the correct one is a MAGNET…we need to be a MAGNET that draws these independents in who are sick and tired of what’s going on in WashingtonFred Thompson

Ace. Deep breath. :shake head: Deep breath. nt

mbecker908 (Diary) Monday, June 22nd at 10:46AM EST (link)
 
 
 
 
 

Well said Erick

leftylurker (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 8:20PM EST (link)

Political sex scandals piss me off. Especially when they involve people in power sleeping with* people that have power over.

I believe in giving people in power a large benefit of the doubt, but then nailing them to the wall if they mess up.

*or whatever is included in not having relations with *that* woman. Bastard. She was in intern. And that Foley perv…gah…

So you favored impeaching Clinton, right? (nt)

Neil Stevens (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 8:22PM EST (link)

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At the time, no

leftylurker (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 8:24PM EST (link)

But after I read the book The Power of Procedure in law school, I did. Not for sleeping with an intern, but for lying to a federal judge.

 

And that's not easy for me to say

leftylurker (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 8:26PM EST (link)

I LOVED Clinton until the Lewinsky scandal.

And it made me sooo mad that he messed up like that. He had so much potential…

What else could he have accomplished?

jeffreywturner (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 8:33PM EST (link)

He was already 3/4′s of the way through his time in the WH when that scandal broke.

It isn’t like there was a “higher office” he could have run for, and most of his agenda had already been addressed.

“Life is too short, can’t we all just eat pork and kill some terrorists?”

I was referring generally to the constant stream of scandals brougt about by his inability/unwillingness to keep it in his pants

leftylurker (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 8:35PM EST (link)
 

yeah

Doc Holliday (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 8:54PM EST (link)

and you must have felt like a red headed stepchild since the left did not care, hell, America did not care. Yet Repubs go down every time they do this, people think they are hypocrites. So if you are a lib and stand for nothing, anything goes. It is the lowest common denominator, why should anyone stand for any morals?

Social cons have this party constantly in turmoil. When the left has a scandal the circle the wagons. When the right has a scandal, the circle the wagons and shoot inward.

Molon Labe!

and I am so serious

Doc Holliday (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 8:57PM EST (link)

I am saying Ensign will likely resign. If it were a Dem there would be no chance, but I think it is actually likely in this case; after a long drawn out scandal.

Molon Labe!

 

Leave it to you to dragSoCons into this Doc...

AceInTX (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 5:06PM EST (link)

I haven’t heard anyone sermonizing on this or saying Ensign should go based on the affair alone…as a SoCon, I don’t even think he should have resigned his leadership position….

The issue here is….having admitted the affair…he should be trying to stay out of the public eye, not throw gas on the fire by airing all this out in public….

If the aggreived husband tried to blackmail him…report it to the authorities and make sure he’s prosecuted…but shut up and keep it out of the papers…

You don’t have to be a SoCon to see the simple common sense of that last part and you be-clown yourself by using this as a chance to forward your own anti SoCon Biases!

The “Big Tent” analogy isn’t the correct one…the correct one is a MAGNET…we need to be a MAGNET that draws these independents in who are sick and tired of what’s going on in WashingtonFred Thompson

sorry Ace

Doc Holliday (Diary) Monday, June 22nd at 7:07PM EST (link)

If you read my post clearly, I supported the goal of moral politicians. I just stated the empirical evidence that Republicans take their own people down when they screw up. The list is enormous. I have not seen that Ensign is doing what you claim, that he is trying to stay in the limelight.

I am not anti-Socon, I am against the belief in big government and that we are so shocked when people in government do stupid things like people not in government do. Ensign may not be fit to serve, but I know those who want government to control our lives are not fit to serve. And I know our party has a history of leaders and supporters that fold every time there is a scandal. I also know the Dems never quit until they are lead out by the police or voted out of office.

Molon Labe!

Fair enough...if I misread you...That said...

AceInTX (Diary) Monday, June 22nd at 11:26PM EST (link)

Social cons have this party constantly in turmoil.

Sounds a lot like a condemnation of SoCons to me…surely you can see the reason for my reaction from this quote for what it is.

I have not seen that Ensign is doing what you claim, that he is trying to stay in the limelight.

I wouldn’t argue with that had I said Ensign is purposely trying to keep this all in the spotlight…but that’s not what I’ve said. wanting this to stay in the limelight would be so colossally stupid to be beyond belief…What I am saying here goes more to incompetence and a total lack of self control in this situation because Ensign’s actions do him harm and help him not one whit!

Ensign may not be fit to serve, but I know those who want government to control our lives are not fit to serve. And I know our party has a history of leaders and supporters that fold every time there is a scandal.

The point I’m making over and over here…and most of the folks On Erick’s side of this post has nothing to do with Ensign not being fit to serve…it’s simply the analogy that when you find yourself in a hole…the first step to getting out is to stop digging. It’s really that simple.

I think I can speak for most of us by saying the issue isn’t whether Ensign should have even resigned his leadership position in the party over this…let alone whether he should be forced from office. The issue is simply that he needs to shut up and let this story die and stop digging himself deeper by continuing to throw around accusations in public whether they have merit or not because he appears to be the bully in this mess in the public’s eyes!

The “Big Tent” analogy isn’t the correct one…the correct one is a MAGNET…we need to be a MAGNET that draws these independents in who are sick and tired of what’s going on in WashingtonFred Thompson
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

Sorry Erick, I can't get on this bandwagon.

Tbone (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 9:26PM EST (link)

Everyone should have kept their mouths shut about it. But, it serves no real purpose to judge adult behavior as long as its private behavior. When the public purse gets involved, its a different matter.

Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.

 

Here we go; kicking another Republican to the curb

Achance (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 9:37PM EST (link)

over something nobody even notices when a Democrat does it. I don’t know about you, but I’ve been around a fair share of politically ambitious women; a fair share of them will trip you and try to beat you to the ground. And with a fair share of politically ambitious husbands, the wife’s “virtue” is just trade goods.

In Vino Veritas

That was my take on the husband's behavior, Achance.

janis (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 10:39AM EST (link)

He didn’t come across so much the wounded husband as he did the pissed off pimp who didn’t get his cut.

555! Well said janis! nt

Vegas_Rick (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 11:08AM EST (link)

“God is great, beer is good and people are crazy.”- Billy Currington

“Nothing in this world can take the place of persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful people with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan ‘press on’ has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race.” Calvin Coolidge.

Thanks, Vegas Rick, but having said that, I don't

janis (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 11:17AM EST (link)

for a moment excuse what Ensign did. His behavior was incredibly stupid and selfish. Given that he and his wife were separated, I don’t judge him harshly on having another relationship, but to choose someone in your own office who is married to another person in your office is beyond insane. There’s a reason why the old saying, “Never dip your pen in the company ink” is still valid.

The bottom line here for me is that he spent 8 months lying and deceiving people and you’ll never convince me that that didn’t affect his ability to do his job as proficiently as he could have otherwise.

Ensign is my Senator

Vegas_Rick (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 11:32AM EST (link)

and I am as disgusted with this as anybody. We’re all human and we all make mistakes. But those who represent the people have to hold themselves to a higher standard. Especially Republicans.

But the other half of this imbroglio should not be without significant blame. And they should not be canonized as victims. They are not victims. Well, maybe the husband. A little.

“God is great, beer is good and people are crazy.”- Billy Currington

“Nothing in this world can take the place of persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful people with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan ‘press on’ has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race.” Calvin Coolidge.

 

That's the part that deserves condemnation;

Achance (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 4:13PM EST (link)

in today’s world you have to be just plain pig stupid to have an affair with someone who is even in your line of supervision, no matter how far away on the org chart. It is a prescription for a sexual harassment charge or political or economic extortion.

I’m batting less than .100 on the Ten Commandments, but one sin I’ve never committed was even laying a hand on a subordinate female employee while she worked for me. See, I can do Clinton-speak too.

In Vino Veritas

I'm really hoping that you've never made a graven image...

leftylurker (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 5:12PM EST (link)

Cuz if not I’m going to have to remember not to smart off to you.

=)

I've certainly done my share of idolatry.

Achance (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 5:51PM EST (link)

Different things assume importance in your life at different times and places. I’ve never killed anyone but it wasn’t for lack of wanting to and in a couple of instances trying to.

In Vino Veritas

 
 
 
 
 
 

I don't doubt that Art...but there is another issue involved here...

AceInTX (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 5:18PM EST (link)

First…It’s not just about the affair…and as a SoCon…I’m willing to extend grace where it’s proper. First Ensign’s confession affords him some grace as far as I’m concerned…even if he had no choice because it was going public anyway…

But having admitted it…he needs to shut up about it and stop dragging out the story by throwing accusations at the husband…what he’s saying may be true…but the public isn’t going to look at that…they arer going to see it as Erick framed it here…

“Ensign is the powerful politician using his power and access to the press to smear a middle class guy who is a victim of Ensign’s infidelity with his wife…”

By going public with the blackmail accusations and using his press operation to do so…all of a sudden the focus is off the scumbag and his blackmail…and on Ensign as a cad and a politician willing to do or say anything to protect his perks and power.

The “Big Tent” analogy isn’t the correct one…the correct one is a MAGNET…we need to be a MAGNET that draws these independents in who are sick and tired of what’s going on in WashingtonFred Thompson

You've gotten my point exactly

civil truth (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 5:30PM EST (link)

Just another example of a political scandal where it’s the politician’s response, not the original action, that’s setting off a media circus.

By now you’d think politicians would have learned the first rule of holes*…

But no, they just can’t drop that shovel.

*when you’re in one, stop digging

The greatest evil…is conceived and ordered (moved, seconded, carried, and minuted) in clean, carpeted, warmed, and well-lighted offices, by quiet men with white collars and cut fingernails and smooth-shaven cheeks who do not need to raise their voice. Hence, naturally enough, my symbol for Hell is something like the bureaucracy of a police state or the offices of a thoroughly nasty business concern. -C.S. Lewis

http://www.gmsplace.com/

Well of course I got your point exactly...

AceInTX (Diary) Monday, June 22nd at 12:26AM EST (link)

Sometimes I think you’re my doppelganger!

The “Big Tent” analogy isn’t the correct one…the correct one is a MAGNET…we need to be a MAGNET that draws these independents in who are sick and tired of what’s going on in WashingtonFred Thompson
 
 
 
 

Count me in the "I disagree" column, when it comes to trashing Ensign publicly

smagar (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 9:51PM EST (link)

Maybe if we had 60 Senators, we could indulge in publicly horsewhipping one of our own who’d screwed up. But we don’t have 60 Senators, do we? We have 40.

What’s the goal here? Horsewhip Ensign to the point where he crawls into a hole? David Axelrod says thanks.

What was the point in this, Erick? Just because you COULD say something didn’t mean you HAD to.

What do you want to happen? Have Ensign resign? Can the Rs hold the seat if he does so? Are you 100% sure?

You’ve basically said that John Ensign is a crappy person. OK—crappy persons shouldn’t be Senators.

What next?

“Who will stand/On either hand/And guard this bridge with me?” (Macaulay)

Wht's Next?

Swamp_Yankee (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 9:57PM EST (link)

If crappy people cant be Senators, there’s about ninety more that need to be ran out of town.

 

We have bigger things to worry about right now

smagar (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 10:06PM EST (link)

Off the top of my head…

1) Stopping the evisceration of our national health care system.
2) Stopping Card Check
3) Ensuring Sotomayor gets a thorough vetting
4) Stopping the spending of my son’s money by an out-of-control federal government.

Kneecapping one of the few troops we have left fighting for us is, IMO, not wise. Personally, for now, I’d rather think about my son’s future than the purity of the GOP Senate corps.

I wish Nevada had elected John Wayne, but they didn’t. They elected John Ensign instead.

If we insist that states send us GOP Senators that meet our exacting standards…maybe those states will send us Ds’ instead. (See Allen, George; Burns, Conrad and Dole, Elizabeth).

Democrats beat us because they are excellent political tacticians. We, on the other hand, revel in Pyrrhic victories.

“Who will stand/On either hand/And guard this bridge with me?” (Macaulay)

Give me a break...this isn't about RINOS and Conservatives...

AceInTX (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 5:38PM EST (link)

or even adultery at this point…it’s about the simple minded stupidity of dragging this scandal out in the press by making public allegations against a husband whom you’ve aggrieved by sleeping with his wife…

The guy may in deed be a scum bag…and he could well be guilty of blackmail….but instead everyone sees a Rewpublican Senator using his power and perks to cover up sleeping with a subordinate and smear her husband’s honor using his press operation.

Simple common sense should tell Ensign he should shut up and get this out of the press as soon as possible…but instead we’re going to be treated to months or years of charge/counter charge in a salacious tabloid worthy story involving a powerful Republican Senator who was in leadership attacking a poor underprivileged husband by falsely accusing him of blackmail!

I’m not saying the above is the case…but it’s the way it’ll be played!

The “Big Tent” analogy isn’t the correct one…the correct one is a MAGNET…we need to be a MAGNET that draws these independents in who are sick and tired of what’s going on in WashingtonFred Thompson
 
 

So...if we have 59 Senators and one is caught read handed raping a little boy

AceInTX (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 5:29PM EST (link)

Maybe if we had 60 Senators, we could indulge in publicly horsewhipping one of our own who’d screwed up. But we don’t have 60 Senators, do we? We have 40.

We should just excuse everything and act like it didn’t happen?

You guys who think there is ever any reason to criticize a Republican under any circumstances because “We need to win”….or “We need a big tent” etc sicken me…

is their nothing you guys won’t excuse in the name of winning?

As to what we want to have happen…Ensign should just shut the hell up and not drag this out by making public accusations using the power of his office and his access to the press thus keeping this scandal front and center for the next how many months or years!

The “Big Tent” analogy isn’t the correct one…the correct one is a MAGNET…we need to be a MAGNET that draws these independents in who are sick and tired of what’s going on in WashingtonFred Thompson
 
 

Ensign violated his vows to his wife, not to us.

GregInFla (Diary) Saturday, June 20th at 11:51PM EST (link)

No crime committed against the public trust, just against his wife’s trust (maybe since they were separated). I agree with Doc and Neil on this one, Erick.

Besides, it’s Nevada. Let his constituents decide whether by doing this he really is representing the people there (where prostitution is legal and what happens there, stays there (except if you’re a US Senator).


– A true evolutionist would let endangered species die off. Think about it.
– The sign outside the courthouse said no signs allowed. So I took it down.
– Atlas Shrugged is now on the non-fiction aisle at Amazon.

 

My issue in not the adultery, but why the allegations of extortion got publicly aired

civil truth (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 12:10AM EST (link)

The way this should have gone down was that 1) Ensign makes a public admission with due remorse, 2) resigns his leadership post, 3) keeps quiet while the media play the story for a few days and makes no more public statements to feed the fire, 4) things quiet down as the fire burns itself out for lack of fuel, and 5) Ensign serves out his term. No need to kick him to the curb: rather his colleagues and party officials stand behind him against demands for resignation and don’t feed the fire ourselves with intemperate comments. Let the voters decide in the next primary/general election.

What turned this affair into theater was when some anonymous aide of Ensign leaked to the press that Ensign was confessing at this time because the husband was trying to extort hush money. Of course this turned things into a media circus, with the husband making his public statement denying the extortion charge and putting his spin on the matter, followed by Ensign himself repeating the charge on the record. Now we have a story with legs, as the press gets into looking for evidence, and we await others jumping into the fray.

The point is that the spotlight has now shifted froma case of adultery (which is not a crime) to an allegation of a serious crime and behind it the question “is Ensign telling the truth about this extortion charge”.

So again, I do not understand why Ensign dragged in this extortion charge against the husband. Either (as I stated earlier) Ensign should have gone quietly to the DA when the extortion attempt began and set up a wire/tape of the transaction, or Ensign needs now to go to the DA with evidence (and hopefully he has some evidence besides one-on-one conversations with the husband).

Otherwise it looks like Ensign was trying to throw dirt elsewhere to distract form his misconduct – and that is neither appropriate behavior nor good damage control.

So once again, as with other such cases that blow up, the sexual misconduct itself is a relatively minor and managable problem compared with the consequences of the behavior afterwards (in this case the leveling of extortion charges against the husband) that makes this a much bigger production than it needed to and rises letting things spiral out of control.

I don’t see any reason at this time for Ensign to resign nor for Republicans to push him out of office – the voters can determine this. Nonetheless Ensign has been damaged more than necessary.

If this extortion charge turns out to be bogus, then its a different ball game. But unless that happens, we do need to cover his back.

I’m not pleased with the way Ensign has handled this matter to date.

The greatest evil…is conceived and ordered (moved, seconded, carried, and minuted) in clean, carpeted, warmed, and well-lighted offices, by quiet men with white collars and cut fingernails and smooth-shaven cheeks who do not need to raise their voice. Hence, naturally enough, my symbol for Hell is something like the bureaucracy of a police state or the offices of a thoroughly nasty business concern. -C.S. Lewis

http://www.gmsplace.com/

 

I interpreted Erick's remarks to mean that Ensign should just stop talking about it.

centrist1968 (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 1:32AM EST (link)

Go away, take a vacation or something until this whole thing blows over.

He has 5 1/2 years until re-election. The less he talks about it, the better.

It’s too bad; I actually thought he had a shot at national office someday.

Yup -nt-

civil truth (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 1:43AM EST (link)

The greatest evil…is conceived and ordered (moved, seconded, carried, and minuted) in clean, carpeted, warmed, and well-lighted offices, by quiet men with white collars and cut fingernails and smooth-shaven cheeks who do not need to raise their voice. Hence, naturally enough, my symbol for Hell is something like the bureaucracy of a police state or the offices of a thoroughly nasty business concern. -C.S. Lewis

http://www.gmsplace.com/

 
 

I interpreted Erick's remarks to mean that Ensign should just stop talking about it.

centrist1968 (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 1:32AM EST (link)

Go away, take a vacation or something until this whole thing blows over.

He has 5 1/2 years until re-election. The less he talks about it, the better.

It’s too bad; I actually thought he had a shot at national office someday.

 

I think Erick was hoping to provoke exactly the

zeebeach Sunday, June 21st at 6:27AM EST (link)

response he did from those of you disagreeing with his post. Wise men don’t deal lightly in moral judgement. There’s a lot we don’t know about in this story. We don’t need to know. These people need to go away.

So, are you saying this was an exercise in sarcasm on Erick's part?

smagar (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 8:43AM EST (link)

I think Erick was hoping to provoke exactly the response he did from those of you disagreeing with his post.

I doubt that…for that would mean that the leading light of Redstate was toying with us.

No, I suspect Erick was talking straight with us.

“Who will stand/On either hand/And guard this bridge with me?” (Macaulay)

 
 

What I said was what I meant

Erick Erickson (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 9:34AM EST (link)

Ensign should shut up and take it like a man.

Who will stand on either hand and keep this bridge with me?

 

John Ensign

eldstenorge Sunday, June 21st at 10:41AM EST (link)

It seems even Red State will censor what they do not like, anything based on religious conviction or morality.

What we need to remember here is that we are all human. I am not going to defend Sen. Ensign, however, we do need to consider some facts here. 1) It takes two to tango, both a married man and a married woman were involved here, and it was also consensual. Both are to blame. 2) Sen. Ensign and his wife were separated at the time. The woman and her husband apparently were not. 3) Since all of this, at least something good has come of it: The Ensigns are back together and Mrs. Ensign says the marriage is stronger than ever now. That says a lot, and I am not defending Sen. Ensign on this, it is just we always look for the bad, the negative, the way to hate and criticize others, instead of the Gospel principle of REPENTANCE, which all of us are in need of.

Would I vote for Sen. Ensign? I honestly do not know. It would depend if another strong conservative ran against him or not. He is a Senator people, he is not the Messiah. This is one of the big problems we have in America today. We look to our political leaders and government for the answers to everything, to be our SAVIOR. They are not! They are just like us, human, with frailties. Sen. Ensign has repented and made it right with his wife. That is what the Savior has asked of each of us. Let’s get bush working on it.

As I remember, there is a scripture which says: “Let him who is without sin cast the first stone.” It looks like we have a lot of perfect people here.

5! nt

Vegas_Rick (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 11:13AM EST (link)

“God is great, beer is good and people are crazy.”- Billy Currington

“Nothing in this world can take the place of persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful people with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan ‘press on’ has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race.” Calvin Coolidge.

 

Sorry I stopped reading after the first sentence

Neil Stevens (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 12:07PM EST (link)

I just can’t take you seriously, sorry. You sound like a lefty on dope.

RS contributing editor, technical administrator, and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
Read the RedState Posting Rules

Unlikely Voter: Poll Analysis, Election Projection.

“I rejoice that America has resisted.” – William Pitt, the Elder

 
 

Ensign was a failure at the NRSC, is a failure as a sitting Senator

AceInTX (Diary) Sunday, June 21st at 4:04PM EST (link)

and a failure as a husband, Father and overall Human Being…

Bum
Scum Bag
loser
creep
cretin
slime ball

just plain trash!

The “Big Tent” analogy isn’t the correct one…the correct one is a MAGNET…we need to be a MAGNET that draws these independents in who are sick and tired of what’s going on in WashingtonFred Thompson