when you say some democrats are leaning against a vote on the motion to proceed, that means they are leaning to vote No (i.e. filibuster, right?) or they will not vote, and does that matter?

I’ve read that Ben Nelson, Landrieu and Lincoln have not committed to voting to proceed. But does this actually mean they are leaning against? Nelson, for instance, sounds as if he’s ready to bring it to the floor for a thorough airing–though he wouldn’t definitely commit. Is there some inside information on this? I know I’ve read Landrieu will decide later today (thursday). If she decides to go along with the caucus–that would leave only Lincoln and Nelson. Nelson made noises that sound favorable–not to the bill per se, but to proceeding. That would leave only Lincoln–a slim reed to hang a hope on.

That it’s little future taxpaying Democrats they want us to pay to have aborted. Maybe that will get them to change the language.

I just wrote scathing emails to Webb and Warner. To me these people should go to jail for perpetrating a fraud on the American people. They are acting no better than Bernie Madoff. I wonder if they think we would pay for a car for 4 years before being able to drive that car. Why don’t they fix what’s wrong with Medicare and the VA - it’s because they can’t or won’t so the problems will just get bigger and bigger and more of our money will go out the window. These politicians make me sick.

uphold the filibuster? Since his name isn’t mentioned it sounds as if he’s voting for cloture.

The TRICK is that the Senators will vote to proceed but be allowed to vote no on the actual bill.

They will claim that they only voted to proceed so they could debate it and make it better. They also can tell their constituents they didn’t vote for it. They are lying as they know bringing it to the floor will guarantee it’s passage.

Focus on Sens. Mary Landrieu of Louisiana, Ben Nelson of NE, Mark Pryor of ARK, Blanche Lincoln of ARK., Ben Dorgan of ND, Kent Conrad of ND., Tim Johnson of SD, John Tester of MON, & Evan Bayh of IND. These are the ones Reid wants to vote to proceed & then will allow to vote no on the bill. These Dems are very vulnerable.

Also it can’t hurt to call the all popular RINOS Olympia Snowe and Susan Collins, both of Maine.

Tell them to vote NO to proceed.

Spent my break calling Senators. will you? Tell them to vote NO to proceed on a bill and that you know about their method to decieve Americans.

Something important to look for in the CBO numbers (if we ever get access to the report) is the effect of the bill on state budgets. If the majority of the Baucus Bill survived, then it makes the so-called medicaid cuts by shifting these costs to the states. With 48 of 50 states in terrible fiscal shape, shifting these medicaid expenses to the states will destroy their budgets. The result will be higher state taxes (on top of Obama’s expiration of the Bush tax cuts and new health care taxes associated with this bill). So if the Baucus Bill survived, the upper 2 tax brackets will be paying between 50-60% total income taxes. This doesn’t include any increases in FICA (which they are currently talking about) or a VAT tax. We could be looking at 65 to 70% total taxes before this is over. Very scary times in our great country.

You seriously miss the main point.
US Constitution Article I, Sec. 8 denies the federal government the authority to establish or fund health care.
Amend.IX, X - The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people. This does not leave much to interpret. It seems clear to me that the Several States, Counties, Cities could fund health and they do for public employees. Amend. X reiterates that no authority exists for the Federal Government to create nor fund health care. And, the Su. Ct. has no authority, to decide or create that, which does not exist.

The commerce clause does not give the Federal Government unbridled authority.To argue that point means Article I, Sec. 8. the IX and X Amend.s have no applicable meaning.

This is the most important point. In fact, it is the only point. Good intentions must be within Constitution boundaries. If not, there is no ‘rule of law’ and this is just a exercise in futility.

Also call Lieberman’s office to vote no to proceed. So far he is holding steadfast as he doesn’t want a public option.

Both a public option and a non-profit co-op are in the Senate bill.

Tell him to vote NO to proceed the bill to the floor.

Is it too late, to get a million people, march on Washington in time for the senate vote on Saturday Nov. 21 To let them know, we are watching what they are doing, to destroy our constitutional rights, if they pass this, unconstitutional, budget busting Health-care bill. If they destroy our economy the people will, in fear accept any type of government, its been done before. Takeovers without guns.! or is it more reasonable to see if it gets voted to the floor and then they only need 51 to pass it using an action used only for budget items. I’m not sure of the proper terms but they are using deceit and trickery to enslave us and our children. they are not representing the people or they would have dropped this in the house. but the Marxist in chief ,wants it .
(Support our troops!)
One Old Dog

I asked this question yesterday, but haven’t gotten a reply yet. What exactly does “cloture” mean? I am a newbie here.
Thanks

Leftist ideologues have as much respect for Lady Liberty, as Taliban radicals have for women who want to get an education in Afghanistan (remember their mowed-down bus load?)

We the American people have been flirting with the Socialist Date Rapist for way too long. We finally let him in and he’s screwing the daylights out of us, day in and day out, (with the lame stream media pinning us to the floor) hoping one day we’ll succumb under the Stockholm syndrome, kill our souls and embrace socialist serfdom.

IF YOU DON’T WANT THAT TO CONTINUE, FIGHT BACK FOR GOD’S SAKE!!!! BE A BRAVEHEART!!!

ACTIONS SPEAK MUCH LOUDER THAN WORDS!!!

START BY MAKING THE LIVES OF THESE CONNIVING, SOCIALIST, NARCISSISTIC OLIGARCHS AS UNCOMFORTABLE AS POSSIBLE, EVERY SINGLE DAY, UNTIL THEY ARE VOTED OUT OR OTHERWISE REMOVED FROM OFFICE!!

INSIST THAT AMERICA WILL NEVER ACCEPT THEIR 100% PARTISAN MONSTRUOSITY. WE WANT THEM TO SCRAP THESE BILLS AND START FROM SCRATCH (PREFERABLY AFTER, NOT BEFORE, THEY GET OUT OF THE WAY AND ALLOW THE FREE MARKET TO CREATE REAL JOBS AND PROSPERITY!!!)

Mark Levin’s surge Senators: http://www.marklevinshow.com/Article.asp?id=1595660&spid=32364

Mary Landrieu of Louisiana 202-224-5824
Ben Nelson of Nebraska 202-224-6551
Blanche Lincoln of Arkansas 202-224-4843
Evan Bayh of Indiana 202-224-5623

Here are the e-faxes of a large number of Dem Senators and a letter I used this morning:

To: 2022241152@myfax.com; 2022282186@myfax.com; 2022281229@myfax.com; 4159566701@myfax.com; 2022248858@myfax.com; 2022280012@myfax.com; 2022241651@myfax.com; 2022280776@myfax.com; 2022282183@myfax.com; 2022281371@myfax.com; 2022281264@myfax.com; 2022241193@myfax.com; 2022241388@myfax.com; 2022283027@myfax.com; 2022241083@myfax.com; 2022246020@myfax.com; 2022286326@myfax.com; 2022242126@myfax.com; 2022246747@myfax.com; 2022280325@myfax.com; 2022283954@myfax.com; 2022280400@myfax.com; 2022242417@myfax.com; 2022281377@myfax.com; 2022284054@myfax.com; 2022281382@myfax.com; 2022247327@myfax.com; 2022249787@myfax.com; 2022244680@myfax.com; 2022280380@myfax.com; 2022281067@myfax.com; 2022284131@myfax.com; 2022242852@myfax.com; 2022283997@myfax.com; 2022243149@myfax.com; 2022281373@myfax.com; 2022285143@myfax.com; 2022286363@myfax.com; 2022241724@myfax.com; 2022282856@myfax.com; 2022247665@myfax.com; 2022282193@myfax.com; 2022248525@myfax.com; 2022282862@myfax.com; 2022285429@myfax.com; 2022282090@myfax.com; 2022242207@myfax.com; 2022248594@myfax.com; 2022249750@myfax.com; 2022244952@myfax.com; 2022240776@myfax.com; 2022241100@myfax.com; 2022247776@myfax.com; 2022280282@myfax.com; 2022248149@myfax.com; 2022283398@myfax.com; 2022243808@myfax.com; 2022245301@myfax.com; 2022280514@myfax.com; 2022242354@myfax.com; 2022280908@myfax.com; 2022246471@myfax.com; 2022246295@myfax.com; 2022249735@myfax.com; 2022249412@myfax.com; 2022242237@myfax.com; 2022241933@myfax.com; 2022281375@myfax.com; 2022280359@myfax.com; 2022245213@myfax.com; 2022242499@myfax.com; 2022241946@myfax.com; 2022246331@myfax.com; 2022243514@myfax.com; 2022243479@myfax.com; 2022240238@myfax.com; 2022282981@myfax.com; 2022243416@myfax.com; 2022280360@myfax.com; 2022280002@myfax.com; 2022280604@myfax.com; 2022281168@myfax.com; 2022282197@myfax.com; 2022280378@myfax.com; 2022285417@myfax.com; 2022282717@myfax.com; 2022242725@myfax.com; 2022281265@myfax.com; 2022240103@myfax.com; 2022282853@myfax.com; 2022246519@myfax.com; 2022242693@myfax.com; 2022249450@myfax.com; 2022285765@myfax.com; 2022282190@myfax.com; 2022246008@myfax.com; 2022249369@myfax.com; 2022283261@myfax.com; 2022282577@myfax.com
Subject: Obamacare: The Bottom Line is this..

Honorable Members: United States Senate

We are writing you to express our opinions and suggestions relative to the current healthcare reform legislation.

The Bottom Line is this: After months of haggling over multiple different plans for funding, NONE of the plans presented, including the 2000+ page Pelosi monstrosity, pay for Obamacare without adding to the national debt and to taxes, fees, “fines” and other increased costs paid by the taxpayer.

The new taxes and unconstitutional mandates in these bills including those directed at individuals, States’ Medicaid programs and at the insurance and medical device industries will simply be passed on to the public in the form of increased costs.

The aforementioned, the segregation of the $250B “Dr. Fix”, along with the deferral of benefits within the ten year budget window, is a SMOKE AND MIRRORS attempt at hiding the real long term costs of Obamacare, i.e. the bills use 10 years worth of tax hikes and benefit cuts to fund essentially less than five years worth of benefits.

Simply put, with the economy in recession, 10.2% unemployment, existing current budget shortfalls of $1.4T, $10T already added to the national debt and a shortfall in Federal tax receipts of 18%, the nation cannot afford the Obama / Pelosi vision of healthcare reform.

Instead, more modest, incremental and immediate steps can be taken without a government takeover and without an intrusion on your constituents’ privacies and freedoms, such as:

- allowing the purchase of insurance on a national basis vs. within states only (increased competition = lower premiums, problem solved);

- require coverage of pre-existing conditions / prohibit cancellations (problem solved);

- tax credits or vouchers for the uninsured / poor (everyone can buy/afford insurance, problems solved);

- increased emphasis on Health Savings Accounts (HSAs) for all (everyone can use pre-tax $ for out of pocket expenses, problem solved);

- tax deductions for INDIVIDUALS who buy insurance ( = equity vs. employer-provided coverage, problem solved); and..

- tort reform to reduce the cost of malpractice lawsuits and the cost of defensive medicine. (HUGE savings in systemic costs to all, problem solved..)..

Texas and California have enacted tort reform with the result that insurance premiums dropped by 30 and 40% respectively. Additionally, congress should first pursue the “$500 Billion in waste and fraud” savings that President Obama claims to exist in the current system.

Further, by a margin of 3:1 in a recent poll, Americans want elected officials to concentrate on the ECONOMY and JOBS vs. healthcare reform..

Finally, we do not understand NOR DO WE SUPPORT President Obama’s rush to pass legislation on this important issue (or Cap & Tax for that matter). We have come to view him as deceptive and divisive, prone to using exaggerations and misrepresentations to sell his plans, and as someone who says one thing and then does another; ..pushing to pass RADICAL changes in our country and our laws before the implications are understood, aided by a contrived sense of urgency (”Crisis”) regurgitated by the MSM…and finally aided by a Democratic majority that appears easily intimidated by the President, Senator Reid and Speaker Pelosi.

We as well as a large, nationwide circle of like-minded friends appreciate and will support ONLY those elected officials in the Senate and House who represent the people of our great nation, demonstrate fiscal responsibility and do the right things for their constituents and all taxpayers. For those of you who choose to ignore the will of the people and proceed to support Obamacare, please be advised that we will actively work and contribute to see that you are replaced!

Respectfully,

Name & address

PLEASE GET TO IT RIGHT AWAY!! IF WE SUCCEED IN MOVING EVEN ONE OF THESE VULNERABLE SPECIAL INTEREST AGENTS TO DEFEND THEIR SELF-INTEREST AND NOT VOTE TO PROCEED, WE MAY YET SAVE LADY LIBERTY!!! THANK YOU.

may be playing all of us, by using the Cloward& Piven strategy, by overwhelming the system to deliberately destroy it, they can remake it into whatever their twisted minds want,. hence Rahm Emmauel’s statement about a crisis, is to good to waste. ala O’s bringing up and his associations with the left fringe radicals. They were surprised by the march on Washington , because it was one of their strategy’s except we were not busting things up, and left the place clean. they use our rules against us, to take our country down. Rules of our engagement, you should know your enemy and use his own devices against him. some members of Congress may be unaware they are being played, but there are others who know exactly what they are doing and have been there for awhile. the problem is sorting out who is who, be vigilant.

support our troops!
One Old Dog

Thanks for the reply…………….sorry to have put you out. I guess I’ll not be asking any questions on this site again.