Ok, I don’t like the title either. It implies that healthcare needs to be “saved” as if the government can do it. I don’t believe that the government is capable of saving anything except for the jobs of government employees. Perhaps a better word would have been “fix”. Regardless, here is something I have thought up. Please comment with your thoughts.
1.) Everyone in this country is required to have a certain level of health insurance (i.e. insurance with emergency care with a deductible of no less than $5,000 or something like that). I don’t want government mandates either and I don’t like that… but if the fact is that the uninsured are costing everyone else a ton of money by getting free care at the hospital which translates into higher costs for you and me, then this would end up saving everyone money and would keep the government from taking control of healthcare. This should be a “soft” requirement of some kind based on #3 below. I don’t think the government should be jailing people for not having insurance, just telling them they are out of luck if they go to the hospital without insurance and without any way of paying for care.
2.) To make sure this is affordable for everyone, every person gets a tax break (a “refund” if you will) in the amount that they pay in health insurance each year. In other words, if you would be paying the government $20,000 in taxes this year and your health insurance cost you $5,000, your tax burden would be lowered to $15,000. This should also be applied to HSA’s. If you have a $5,000 deductible plan and you put $5,000 into your HSA this year, that’s an extra $5,000 that you don’t have to pay to the government that year. This would encourage more people to get high decuctible plans with an HSA and would save a lot of money in healthcare costs because when people are paying out of their own bank account (even an HSA) they actually ask about the cost and necessity of care before undergoing any tests or treatment. They’re less likely to get an MRI just because they felt a twinge in their back even though there is no radiculopathy or anything that actually merits an MRI. When your insurance is picking up the tab you tend to not care about costs or necessity as much so the doctor/hospital can (and often do) order tests that aren’t necessary. This would really save a lot of money in healthcare costs. It doesn’t take a genius to figure out which is the better option and I think the overwhelming majority of Americans would agree.
3.) Absolutely, under no circumstance, is a person without health insurance and without the money to pay for the services to be treated for free. If you decide not to get insurance and you don’t have the cash to pay for care, you’re out of luck. If you’re too poor to pay for any health insurance whatsoever, we already have a program in place for you. It’s called medicaid. Sure it isn’t as good as what the CEO at a fortune 500 company gets, but you can’t afford that insurance. I shouldn’t have to pay a boatload of extra taxes just because there are fewer doctors accepting Medicaid than there are that accept Blue Cross and you’re upset that I’m not paying for you to go to whatever doctor you want. You’re getting free insurance. Be thankful that the rest of us are picking up the tab for your welfare insurance and stop bitching about it.
I believe this plan would save a lot of money in healthcare costs and would keep the government from having control over healthcare decisions. The counter-argument as I see it would be that people would be deducting so much money from what they are paying to the government right now because of the extra tax breaks that the government would either have to cut spending or raise taxes (and we all know which option they would choose). However, whether we’re talking about paying money to the government and having them pay the doctors or doing it this way where the money never makes it to the government and we pay the doctors, it seems to me the only difference would be in who has the control. In this model, the citizen has the control whereas in the socialized medicine model, the government has control.
One of my biggest fears about the healthcare debate going on in this country is that while the majority of Americans don’t favor socialized medicine, they do seem to think that the healthcare system needs to be reformed. Unfortunately I am not seeing any plan whatsoever by the republicans to help the situation other than to fight the democrats’ plan. While it is important to fight their terrible ideas to save us from the horrors of socialized medicine, I believe we as republicans need to have a counter offer to the American people on how we would fix the problem of runaway healthcare costs. Your thoughts are appreciated as always.

Your diary is mean spirited and inaccurate
mom2oneson Sunday, June 14th at 7:56AM EDT (link)You assume many of the uninsured pay taxes to benefit from a tax break.
There are plenty of tax breaks already given to hosptials. The non profit ones are required to write a portion of their care for the uninsured to charity already.
Do you plan on repealing EMTALA?
For your medicaid solution, it’s very easy for a child or a pregnant woman to be covered by medicaid. The income limits are much lower for adults. For adults without children it more difficult. It varies from place to place but you should look at the medicaid guidelines more before you say what you did.
“but if the fact is that the uninsured are costing everyone else a ton of money by getting free care at the hospital which translates into higher costs for you and me, then this would end up saving everyone money and would keep the government from taking control of healthcare”
You are putting too much blame on the uninsured without looking other issues like DRGs, the cost of billing depts, litigation, and all sorts of other things.
"Mean-spirited?"
Neil Stevens Sunday, June 14th at 7:59AM EDT (link)Let’s not start using Democrat code words!
Argue on facts, not feelings. Calling people mean spirited just makes you sound like a lefty attempting to tear down the opposition,a nd won’t persuade anyone.
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There Is No Crisis
Neil I didn't know that is what lefties say
mom2oneson Sunday, June 14th at 8:03AM EDT (link)I think his diary had a mean tone to it, specifically:
“Be thankful that the rest of us are picking up the tab for your welfare insurance and stop bitching about it. ”
and
” I don’t think the government should be jailing people for not having insurance, just telling them they are out of luck if they go to the hospital without insurance and without any way of paying for care”
I apologized if I used lefty jargon, I would never do that knowingly in 1000 years.
Well now you know
Neil Stevens Sunday, June 14th at 8:06AM EDT (link)They call us that all the time because we don’t support a totalitarian state. Think of the children! Clean water! Open borders! No profits for business! Living Wage!
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some good stuff here
Doc Holliday Sunday, June 14th at 8:20AM EDT (link)but like everything, it is very hard to get it exactly right when there are so many problems because of so many malignant institutionalized free market barriers.
One could argue that insurance increases the costs as much as the uninsured. Just think how much less a doctor would have to charge if they realized they had to actually get the money from the patient directly. People were treated before there were outlandish insurance costs, waste, and fraud. For example, if a doctor might charge a wealthy person in hard cash, but someone poorer in barter. But now with almost everyone insured, somehow the cost of aspirin in the hospital can reach $10 a pop.
There is so much to this issue but the only clear issue running through all of this is the lack of free market forces. Even you slipped into authoritarianism when you said:
“Absolutely, under no circumstance, is a person without health insurance and without the money to pay for the services to be treated for free. If you decide not to get insurance and you don’t have the cash to pay for care, you’re out of luck”
the fallacy is that we can’t stop a doctor from treating someone for free if he chooses to do so. But he better not ask us to pay him, that is what you meant right?
Molon Labe!
Yes
jfpurdue01 Sunday, June 14th at 11:53AM EDT (link)Yes, that is exactly what I meant. I didn’t mean that government would forbid doctors or hospitals from offering free services, but rather that it would no longer be required of hospitals to treat a patient for free if they show up without insurance or any ability to pay. Of course, there are companies out there like GE Health Plan (a.k.a. “Care Credit”) and Chase Health Financial that offer no-interest financing for people who have to pay cash for a service they can’t afford at that time (used often by dentists, chiropractors, plastic surgeons, etc). I just wouldn’t want to see hospitals required to treat patients whithout insurance who can’t afford care. If they have insurance and a patient shows up with insurance, but their deductible is $5,000 and the patient has a hard time paying that $5k, at least a $50,000 surgery would get the hospital 90% of the cost rather than putting them out $50,000 and transferring that cost to the people who are insured. I would also add to my plan that I would cap malpractice lawsuits. That would also help to lower the costs. I believe if that happened and the plan above were to be implemented, the cost of purchasing a simple health insurance would be greatly reduced. Nothing is perfect, but the general perception out there is that SOMETHING needs to be done and my biggest fear is that we’ll end up with socialized medicine because the republicans can’t offer their own alternative.
The truth mom2one is that of the "49 million" unisured....
JadedByPolitics Sunday, June 14th at 8:23AM EDT (link)1/2 of those are ILLEGAL and 1/4 of those are young people who choose NOT to pay for insurance out of their paychecks to have more money and the other 1/4 are covered under programs like SCHIP which includes ADULTS up to 30…. the rest of us responsible citizens who pay out the ying yang to have insurance that we RARELY use should be expected to help those who won’t help themselves NOR deserve it because they do NOT belong here is the first place is beyond the pale.
If the government could RUN healthcare they could start with fixing Medicade BUT THEY WON’T because this is NOT about insuring every citizen this about POWER and if you cannot recognize that you are spending way to much time thinking of your own personal circumstance as opposed to the larger issue!
Whoever has his enemy at his mercy &
does not destroy him is his own enemy
A giant 5 to you Jaded.
ocleverone Sunday, June 14th at 8:30AM EDT (link)You read my mind this morning.
To me, “consensus” seems to be the process of abandoning all beliefs, principles, values and policies. So it is something in which no one believes and to which no one objects … There are still people in my party who believe in “consensus” politics. I regard them as Quislings, as traitors … I mean it. — Margaret Thatcher
amen Jaded - govt participation in health care should be limited
Mike gamecock DeVine Sunday, June 14th at 8:38AM EDT (link)to catastrophic, elderly and limited for the truly needy.
Mike DeVine’s Examiner.com, Charlotte Observer and The Minority Report columns
“One man with courage makes a majority.” - Andrew Jackson
you need to learn to extricate yourself
David Hinz Sunday, June 14th at 8:31AM EDT (link)from the notion that government is the answer to anything. I have read your posts without comment for some time, and you appear to be conflicted between Conservative principles and “I want mine.”
We all know how hard life can be, and most of us have suffered misfortunes. That most of our misfortunes are of our own making does not make them any less misfortunes. That government lending a “helping hand” does nothing to actually “help” does not make them any less misforunes.
Yes, there are single mothers, raising children on little money, who feel they cannot afford health insurance [being able to afford something is known only to the person affected] I know young people who cannot afford health insurance, who nonetheless drive cars younger than mine [2006] enjoy cable television [with HBO and Premium channels] and high speed internet, and spend an inordinate amount of money on trendy clothing and athletic shoes, and [expensive] prepackaged foods. That is their choice — and if and when they get sick, they bemoan the fact that they cannot afford health insurance — and we need some sort of nationalized [free] system.
I close friend just went into the hospital and had quad-bypass surgery. It came as a complete shock that he had heart problems because he has always treated himself “holistically” and never carried health insurance. He is well off, and will no doubt be able to pay his medical bills [eventually] although he will probably be wiped out.
Should I feel sorry for his plight? Certainly! But as mean spirited at it might sound, he could afford health insurance and chose not to carry it — it is not society’s problem to pay for his mistake.
As a side note, when I was young and dumb, I moved to North Carolina without already having a job lined up there, and a few months later when my son was born, realized that I was going to have to pay the hospital costs out of my own pocket! SURPRISE! It took a few years — those were lean years — but I made payments and eventually I got title to him. [there was always that hope that they might repo him but they didn't]
Free healthcare is not a right — and universal healthcare [government run] is not an answer. Methinks this is your hotbutton, and blindspot.
The Minority Report — The HinzSight Report — TMRB.tv — MFOB “Miss Tagart, do you know the hallmark of the second-rater? It’s resentment of another man’s achievement.”
bravo Dave, as HinzSight shows that reliance on government over time
Mike gamecock DeVine Sunday, June 14th at 8:44AM EDT (link)creates more hardships and misfortunes exponentially.
Mike DeVine’s Examiner.com, Charlotte Observer and The Minority Report columns
“One man with courage makes a majority.” - Andrew Jackson
whoa, a little over the top
pilgrim Sunday, June 14th at 8:54AM EDT (link)Perhaps you have missed some of her posts where she has argued against the big government push to force kids into schools where they are not going to be taught, and should be schooled at home instead.
I am not enough of an anarchist to believe that the government has not got the answer to anything. A government must have the answer to providing a common defense against a Nation’s enemies for one thing.
It is a great advantage to a president, and a major source of safety to the country, for him to know that he is not a great man.Calvin Coolidge
pil, where did I say the government shouldn't provide defense?
David Hinz Sunday, June 14th at 9:09AM EDT (link)not sure what post you were reading, but my post discussed healthcare — not defense - not schools - but healthcare.
did you take that leap of faith from “…the notion that government is the answer to anything…?”
I don’t know why I wasted all those other paragraphs if you were going to stop reading after the first line. I’ll simply shorten my posts from now on…
The Minority Report — The HinzSight Report — TMRB.tv — MFOB “Miss Tagart, do you know the hallmark of the second-rater? It’s resentment of another man’s achievement.”
I read your entire post and agreed with most of it
pilgrim Sunday, June 14th at 9:17AM EDT (link)It’s Sunday, a good day for leaps of faith, and extricating one’s self from the notion that government is the answer to anything did seem a bridge too far for me.
As to health I would prefer that it could resemble auto insurance, and the government could just be an umpire instead of a major player.
It is a great advantage to a president, and a major source of safety to the country, for him to know that he is not a great man.Calvin Coolidge
I like the concept of umpire
David Hinz Sunday, June 14th at 9:25AM EDT (link)[as long as they don't act like Stanley Cup Final refs]
The Minority Report — The HinzSight Report — TMRB.tv — MFOB “Miss Tagart, do you know the hallmark of the second-rater? It’s resentment of another man’s achievement.”
Dave, let's just be thankful after Plymouth Rick, pilgrim is not
Mike gamecock DeVine Sunday, June 14th at 9:55AM EDT (link)a double-negative anarchist
let’s play the “glad” game of Pollyana
great movie btw
Mike DeVine’s Examiner.com, Charlotte Observer and The Minority Report columns
“One man with courage makes a majority.” - Andrew Jackson
thanks pilgrim
mom2oneson Sunday, June 14th at 9:32AM EDT (link)Scope called me a welfare mom last week because I was writing about the POV why we want to give extended UE to laid off people without any hesitancy when they may be very well educated and not have dependents vs our attitudes about TANF recipients that may not even be literate, have a marketable skill and have obviously have dependents. I’m not sure why or how I’m coming off as a I want mine in either of these threads.
mom, you have discovered the dilemma of Rush Limbaugh
Mike gamecock DeVine Sunday, June 14th at 9:56AM EDT (link)and the selective sound bite!
good company
Mike DeVine’s Examiner.com, Charlotte Observer and The Minority Report columns
“One man with courage makes a majority.” - Andrew Jackson
David
mom2oneson Sunday, June 14th at 9:57AM EDT (link)How did you get the I want mine from any of my post? The only post of mine that would maybe reflect that was the minimum wage thread and I was asking lots of questions there. I never said universal healthcare is an answer. I never said any type of gov paid for insurance like medicaid or medicare should exist or is even an answer.
Good story about your son! I remember one of my teachers telling us he paid the last on his son’s delivery bill he was officially his now LOL!
I ask the same question I asked McCain
ColdWarrior Sunday, June 14th at 4:02PM EDT (link)about the so-called GIVE Act (the $5.7 B os spending on special interest “civic volunteering” act like AmeriCorps — read the papers about the fraud, waste and abuse in THAT program and Teleprompter Boys illegal firing of the Inspector General overseeing that bureacracy, but I digress):
What particular words or clauses in Article I, Section 8 of the Constitution gives Congress delegated power of do ANYTHING in the area of “healthcare” for individuals not in the military? That should be the starting point of any discussion over any federal role over “healthcare.”
Here it is:
>>>>>
Section 8. The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts and excises, to pay the debts and provide for the common defense and general welfare of the United States; but all duties, imposts and excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;
To borrow money on the credit of the United States;
To regulate commerce with foreign nations, and among the several states, and with the Indian tribes;
To establish a uniform rule of naturalization, and uniform laws on the subject of bankruptcies throughout the United States;
To coin money, regulate the value thereof, and of foreign coin, and fix the standard of weights and measures;
To provide for the punishment of counterfeiting the securities and current coin of the United States;
To establish post offices and post roads;
To promote the progress of science and useful arts, by securing for limited times to authors and inventors the exclusive right to their respective writings and discoveries;
To constitute tribunals inferior to the Supreme Court;
To define and punish piracies and felonies committed on the high seas, and offenses against the law of nations;
To declare war, grant letters of marque and reprisal, and make rules concerning captures on land and water;
To raise and support armies, but no appropriation of money to that use shall be for a longer term than two years;
To provide and maintain a navy;
To make rules for the government and regulation of the land and naval forces;
To provide for calling forth the militia to execute the laws of the union, suppress insurrections and repel invasions;
To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the militia, and for governing such part of them as may be employed in the service of the United States, reserving to the states respectively, the appointment of the officers, and the authority of training the militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;
To exercise exclusive legislation in all cases whatsoever, over such District (not exceeding ten miles square) as may, by cession of particular states, and the acceptance of Congress, become the seat of the government of the United States, and to exercise like authority over all places purchased by the consent of the legislature of the state in which the same shall be, for the erection of forts, magazines, arsenals, dockyards, and other needful buildings;–And
To make all laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into execution the foregoing powers, and all other powers vested by this Constitution in the government of the United States, or in any department or officer thereof.
<<<<<
http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/constitution.articlei.html#section8
Even FDR admitted in a speech he gave while Gov. of New York, before becoming president, that the Constitution would have to be amended before the federal government could do things he and the Congress later did, thereby usurping power from the people they delegated to the federal governent:
“As a matter of fact and law, the governing rights of the States are all of those which have not been surrendered to the National Government by the Constitution or its amendments. Wisely or unwisely, people know that under the Eighteenth Amendment Congress has been given the right to legislate on this particular subject, but this is not the case in the matter of a great number of other vital problems of government, such as the conduct of public utilities, of banks, of insurance, of business, of agriculture, of education, of social wel[are and of a dozen other important features. In these, Washington must not be encouraged to interfere.”
I urge everyone to go here to read the entire discussion of the subject:
http://lexrex.com/enlightened/AmericanIdeal/aspects/prohibited_powers.htm
This is an online copy of one of my favorite books on our system of government: “Your American Yardstick: Twelve Basic American Principles,” by Hamilton Abert Long (Your heritage Books, Inc., Phila., PA 1963).
If there’s any role for the government to be involved in “healthcare,” that should be at the State level, not the federal. That’s the law. Period.
Thank you.
American first, conservative second and Republican precinct committeeman by necessity.
http://www.theprecinctproject.wordpress.com, so you can say, “I became a precinct committeeman before it was cool.”
“Elections have consequences, my friends.” — John McCain
You're right
jfpurdue01 Sunday, June 14th at 11:00PM EDT (link)You’re absolutely right. It doesn’t meet constitutional muster. The question then is this: other than being “the party of no” how do we stop the democrats from ruining our country by socializing medicine? I guess we would just need to encourage the states to do something like this.
Good start but somewhat exactly what we already have
gretchens Monday, June 15th at 10:15AM EDT (link)The big difference is that you are now asking the Federal Gov. to fund your insurance premium 100% with a tax credit. Even if you put it in an HSA interest bearing account of about 2% (this is your only choice right now) that money can only be used for medical expenses- ever. In reality this amounts to just another bailout for banks courtesy of the Feds and in increase in the national debt..
Hardly a RED STATE ideal!
Red State ideals aren't your problem. Why are you still here? nt
Achance Monday, June 15th at 10:18AM EDT (link)In Vino Veritas
The plan
molybdanthan Monday, June 15th at 10:26AM EDT (link)Insurance companies currently want 70% of a company’s employees to participate in a health plan. But once the Obama administration starts taxing people’s health care benefits, people will jump on the fed plan, without thinking about the consequences. This will drive the insurance companies out of business.
That’s the intended result. It’s a ’salt the earth’ program. Once there’s no other way to get insurance, or health care, except for the government, then we’ll have to start everything back up again. A nigh impossible task.
Ask yourself why the Canadians are trying to change their system back to how it was before the gov took it over. And, why are some fools here determinedly going down a path that’s been proven time and again to be the wrong one.
Oh, because it’ll work this time. We’ve got the smartest socialists ever to come along. Keep dreaming.
Given that you called us "dim-witted thingys_ yesterday,
janis Monday, June 15th at 10:31AM EDT (link)I will have to assume that you make it a point to hang out where you are neither wanted nor liked. How sad is your life that you find that enjoyable?
Hi Troll....enjoy your time here. nt
Aaron Gardner Monday, June 15th at 10:33AM EDT (link)Aaron’s Archive
conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
G'bye
Neil Stevens Monday, June 15th at 10:44AM EDT (link)Your side doesn’t get to have an attitude here.
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There Is No Crisis