At The Truth About Cars, Ken Elias posits that though Monday’s announcement of the GM bankruptcy was a bad day for the once dominant U.S. automaker, it was an even worse day for Toyota. His theory is that GM, bolstered with taxpayer dollars and free from creditors’ demands, will come roaring back with bold new products and lower fixed costs, more competitive than ever:
Toyota (or Honda) products have been the default choice. That “Easy Button” is starting to get harder to press for buyers. Yep, Americans will begin to come back to consider Detroit products (at least GM and Ford), and that’s not good for Toyota. And we’ve really never left Detroit for our big pickups and SUVs, while the Japanese are still mostly playing catch up.
Yep, it’s a bad day for Toyota and a great day for America. You can look forward to a new Detroit that will be competitive, if not lead, in cars and trucks for mass market Americans. Count on it
This is pure fantasy. Elias’ equation is missing two critical variables.
The first factor depends on how much government will be in Government Motors. Key decisions for GM and Chrysler are being made by President Obama’s auto task force, a committee of professors, politicians and pretenders who don’t know squat about the car business. Chief among the pretenders is Brian Deese, a 31-year-old law school dropout:
“…who is neither a formally trained economist nor a business school graduate, and who never spent much time flipping through the endless studies about the future of the American and Japanese auto industries.”
It remains to be seen to what degree Deese and his task force colleagues will be influencing product decisions at Government Motors and the Chrysler-FIAT-UAW-Governmental collective. The White House panel, non-transparent and answerable to no one except POTUS, views the problem of rebuilding the two automakers through cultural and political lenses. What sense does the task force have from the perspectives of automotive engineering or marketing appears to be minimal, at best. The cars these committee members think we need have a slim chance of being the cars we want.
Yes, Americans want great fuel economy. They can get it now, and they don’t have to settle for a cramped golf cart in a box to have it. The Volkswagen Jetta TDI, for example, is capable of delivering just under 60 highway miles to the gallon and 44 mpg in combined city/highway driving in the real world, much better than its conservative EPA rating of 29/40mpg city highway. Its near-bulletproof turbodiesel engine has neither the clatter nor the stink of your neighbor’s Dodge pickup with the Cummins engine. The interior is comfortable, reasonably roomy for a compact car and constructed of quality materials. The styling is not that of a drop-dead gorgeous Aston Martin, but it’s far from being econobox ugly. Those who see driving simply as a process of getting from one point to another will be perfectly content with this car. Those who actually enjoy driving will be delighted with it. The TDI is so much fun to drive that the model has its own SCCA racing series. Best of all, the TDI’s starting price point is a painless $21,990. There’s even a bonus. The IRS has to give Jetta TDI buyers a tax credit of $1,300 by virtue of its clean burn diesel engine. If you’re looking for great fuel economy and there’s a VW dealer nearby, this car deserves serious consideration.
The Jetta TDI is just one example of how a car manufacturer met the challenge posed by government-mandated emissions and fuel economy standards, and it was done not by a board of government overseeers calling the shots, but by Germans who know the car business and let engineers do the heavy lifting.
The second factor, another dependent variable, hinges on the way car and truck owners interact with the car companies, and for most of us, that happens at the dealership. For those who live in rural areas and small and medium-sized towns, the auto dealer is just as familiar a stop as is the grocery market and the hardware store. More so than in large cities, these customers are more likely to have their service done at the dealership rather than by a quick lube or an independent garage. In small towns, people know each other by name, and the sales rep in the showroom, the tech in the shop and the person behind the parts counter are likely to be members of a customer’s congregation or their kids’ Little League coach. Take away the dealership, and the entire community sits up and takes notice.
And yet that’s exactly what GM and Chrysler are doing. They are closing their small-town dealerships by the hundreds and putting thousands of former employees of former local, friendly car dealers out of their jobs. Many of their friends and even casual acquaintances will take it personally. They will see it as another stab at their communities, already perceived by those who live in them as under siege. As part of the overall ripple effect, other local businesses from the office supply store to the company that delivers the coffee and stocks the vending machines will feel the pinch. Local governments will take a hit too. Tax revenues will decrease, leading some counties and municipalities to want to raise their tax rates. This usually doesn’t sit well with taxpayers, who are those same friends and acquaintances of the people who lost their jobs. The dealers are also a source of small-scale philanthropy in smaller towns - buying ads in the high school newspaper and yearbook, sponsoring kids’ sports teams, loaning out convertibles for local parades and helping to raise money for everything from church bake sales to the March of Dimes.
Also, marketing research studies have shown that people don’t like to drive 35 or 40 miles to get their cars and trucks serviced. 15 or 20 miles, on the other hand, they can live with. And when deciding which brand of vehicle to purchase, dealer accessibility is a very important factor for many buyers. Brand loyalty isn’t what it used to be in the automobile business, but it seems as if GM and Chrysler are driving a stake through the heart of what remains of it.
Ford, however, is taking a significantly different approach. It began paring down its dealer network three years ago, and the family-owned company has focused on persuading its dealers in larger markets to consolidate, leaving most of its rural and smaller-town franchises untouched. James D. Farley, Ford’s North American sales director, says that the company has shed some 700 of its dealerships since 2005. It has done so at a slower and much more deliberate pace than its rivals, sending fewer and much smaller shock waves through the auto market. Farley is critical of Chrysler’s dealer plan:
“It seems very abrupt and unplanned,” he said. “You don’t orphan 4 million customers overnight without some fallout.”
Some of those customers, primarily those in rural areas, will migrate to Ford dealerships, he said. “It really depends on how GM and Chrysler handle these orphan owners,” he said. “If they don’t give them a lot of attention, it will result in consumers going to other brands.”
[...]
“We don’t think it’s productive to just get rid of rural dealers,” Farley said.
He’s right. Obama’s auto task force, mostly made up of liberals, probably never even considered the fallout the pressure they exerted on Chrysler to close dealerships would have in flyover country. To them, small towns don’t matter. But it was in the small towns and rural areas that Ford, GM and Chrysler first built their respective customer bases and where automotive brand loyalty was born.
Which brings us back to Toyota. Many small towns don’t have Toyota dealers, so the closings of GM and Chrysler outlets in these areas won’t really affect Toyota or most other foreign-owned automakers much if at all. GM and Chrysler dealer closings will help Ford, not hurt Toyota. It remains to be seen whether the comeback of GM and Chrysler will be a success story or the biggest flop since New Coke. The Obama government’s involvement in both does not bode well for the future of either. Even a resurgent GM and Chrysler aren’t much of a threat to Toyota in the long term at all. And Ford will be gaining market share every day, at least in the short term.
Elias’ optimism for the future of GM and Chrysler and his prediction of a stagnant Toyota in the U.S. market is all unicorns and rainbows. Pollyannish Obama fanboys may buy it up, but real car guys remain unconvinced.
- JP

This guy Elias
Leopard1996 Thursday, June 4th at 5:20PM EDT (link)Appears to not know his ass from a hole in the ground. He doesn’t factor people like me saying I won’t buy a bumper sticker from Chysler or GM now since I don’t want to contribute to the delinquency of the governments policies.
I do believe this clown is either looking for a job or is hoping the Obama glow will bless is insipid life.
“The accumluated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the whores and politicians will look up and shout, “Save Us!”….and I’ll look down and whisper, “No”…The Watchmen
Yup, pretty soon, those of us who refuse to buy GM and Chrysler
Vegas_Rick Thursday, June 4th at 5:27PM EDT (link)will find ourselves on government lists of unpatriotic, dangerous, right-wing extremists.
Man I really wanted that new Camaro! And the Challenger is so cool.
Oh well, I like the Mustang and F-150 too.
“Nothing in this world can take the place of persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful people with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan ‘press on’ has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race.” Calvin Coolidge.
Not sure that's much better
Neil Stevens Thursday, June 4th at 5:32PM EDT (link)Remember: the UAW is a partner with Obama in GM. When you buy a Ford you’re also giving money to the same people.
Want to run for conservatives? Give.
There Is No Crisis
Not really.
Josh Painter Thursday, June 4th at 6:02PM EDT (link)Ford’s unionized employees are members of the UAW, but individually they don’t have much say so in how Chrysler and GM are run.
Ford management was able to negotiate their own deal with the UAW before GM and Chrysler. Now with the the union owning the big chunk in Chrysler, many workers are like the dog that always chased cars until the day he caught one and didn’t know what to do with it.
The critical thing for Ford was to get their labor costs down to where they were at least close to competitive with Honda and Toyota. By virtue of the agreement Ford reached with the UAW in March, the company if only about $5 an hour higher than the foreign comptetition which assembles cars in the U.S. And the foreign makers are seeing their labor costs go up while Ford’s is coming down. The deal will save Ford at least half a billion bucks a year.
- JP
“An armed society is a polite society” - Robert A. Heinlein, “Beyond This Horizon” (1942)
The UAW's been arm-in-arm with Democrats for *years*
Neil Stevens Thursday, June 4th at 6:15PM EDT (link)Let them rot. I’d never give one dime for any UAW-made goods.
Want to run for conservatives? Give.
There Is No Crisis
Do you boycott all union-made products
Josh Painter Thursday, June 4th at 6:52PM EDT (link)or just cars?
- JP
“An armed society is a polite society” - Robert A. Heinlein, “Beyond This Horizon” (1942)
I pick my battles
Neil Stevens Thursday, June 4th at 7:25PM EDT (link)I’m fine with making examples of the most terrible unions.
I avoid UPS. I’d never buy a UAW car. If I had kids they’d never see inside an NEA school.
Want to run for conservatives? Give.
There Is No Crisis
For as long as there have been those two, they've been as one
molybdanthan Thursday, June 4th at 7:07PM EDT (link)Like the Greek Phalanx, shields locked, spears bristling, marching in lock-step. Defeating that formation took intense skill, and an entire new set of tactics. I think we’re at that point now. Devising the new weapons and armor that will help carry us through the fight, to victory at the other side.
And for Josh below, I’d start by boycotting the school system. No one has suffered more at the hands of union workers than the children of this country. A Teachers Union meeting probably starts by sacrificing a young goat, also called a kid. Seems fitting, don’t you think.
Home school your kids, people. Or form a neighborhood association and do it yourself. Get them out of the government school as fast as you can. Teach them well, as only their parents could.
Charter schools
JoeG Friday, June 5th at 3:36AM EDT (link)The best way to deal with teacher’s unions is school choice and charter schools.
Some charter schools are union, but the bulk aren’t. I honestly believe that the biggest advantage the charter schools have is the ability to hire and fire teachers as needed.
Charter Schools
readmylips Friday, June 5th at 7:03AM EDT (link)What public schools need is competition. With good old American competition public schools would work and try harder to provide the education our children need.
My children are in a charter school. I’ll admit they don’t get as much gingerbread, (i.e. football, soccer, lacrosse, etc.,) but they do get a great foundation in the academics, learn to actually think rather than just get opinions and information dumped into their brains, and the teachers treat my children as individuals and show excitement for their job.
JoeG there are really several advantages.
mbecker908 Friday, June 5th at 8:40AM EDT (link)Certainly one is the ability to hire and fire teachers at will. But an even bigger advantage is fewer “administrators” mucking up the pie. Combine that with their ability, at least in most places, to chose their own curriculum materials and, again to a degree, set their own curriculum and you set the stage for a winner. Then add in increased parental involvement and you’ve got a winner.
I prefer this
leppard Friday, June 5th at 10:38AM EDT (link)to the money going out of the country.
Concentrated power has always been the enemy of liberty.
Government does not solve problems; it subsidizes them.
No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we’ll ever see on this earth!
But if buying the Nissan, or Honda
Leopard1996 Friday, June 5th at 6:33PM EDT (link)Keeps workers in the US employed, (HOnda plant in Indiana). I think I would rather do that now, then buy a car to put more campaign contributions into the hands of the UAW and into the coffers of the govenment, where they used my money in the first place and give me no return.
“The accumluated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the whores and politicians will look up and shout, “Save Us!”….and I’ll look down and whisper, “No”…The Watchmen
you cant
leppard Saturday, June 6th at 4:14PM EDT (link)tell me that all money goes to the UAW.
My mother was forced to join the union. Money goes to her too and she sent contributions to conservative groups.
Plus the Japanese government supports Whale hunting which I am against.
Concentrated power has always been the enemy of liberty.
Government does not solve problems; it subsidizes them.
No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we’ll ever see on this earth!
You weren't on the list already?
bs Thursday, June 4th at 7:31PM EDT (link)Obviously you didn’t take Erick’s test.
Decorum is fo’ suckas
Dealergate continued: More on Chrysler and Clinton cronyism
izoneguy Thursday, June 4th at 5:31PM EDT (link)http://michellemalkin.com/2009/06/04/dealergate-continued-more-on-chrysler-and-clinton-cronyism/
“When the government fears the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny.”
Thomas Jefferson
Social Engineers don't understand Capitalism
texas214 Thursday, June 4th at 5:36PM EDT (link)GM and Chrysler are now social engineering devices for the Obama administration; cars are bought and sold in capitalist enviroment that they do not understand and cannot completely control.
Ford and Toyota become big winners.
It isn't that they don't understand it...
kyle8 Thursday, June 4th at 5:51PM EDT (link)They could probably give you a good textbook definition of it. It is just that they have been brainwashed to believe that Capitalism = greed = bad. and that Government = compassion = good.
Never mind that actual results.
“Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty”
Kyle
And the Social Engineers will be left scratching their heads
izoneguy Thursday, June 4th at 5:54PM EDT (link)when the new GM (Gimmie Money) fails. But being a government owned entity it has no accountability - just like the post office. It will
keep hemorrhaging money at about 3-5 Billion per month. By election time in 2010 the feds will probably throw another 70 Billion at GM (Gimmie Money) with little to show for it. Before the 2010 elections, Obama will throw his hands up and say it was all Bush’s fault.
“When the government fears the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny.”
Thomas Jefferson
A bad day for Toyota *and* America
briann Thursday, June 4th at 6:21PM EDT (link)This is a bad deal for Toyota and Ford, but Elias has no clue why. Ford & Toyota now have to compete (and make a profit) against competition that doesn’t. GM and Chrysler now run on politics not profits — as long as they deliver support from key constituents, they can keep loosing money and getting more bailouts. So while GM and Chrysler are likely to offer an inferior product at a higher price, they are still likely to dominate in this market.
This is the key problem with most (all?) lefty ideas — they are not economically feasible. Eventually we will all go broke and starve, a la the Soviet Union. That is a much greater problem than any (ill defined) social ill the program itself is supposed to correct.
-Bri
Barney Frank convinces GM CEO to keep his district's plant open
izoneguy Thursday, June 4th at 6:22PM EDT (link)Rep Barney Frank (D-Mass.) won a stay of execution on Thursday for a General Motors plant in his district that the automaker had announced it would close.
No other lawmaker has managed to halt the GM ax. As chairman of the House Financial Services Committee Frank oversees the government’s bailout program, known as TARP. Frank’s staff said the lawmaker spokes with GM CEO Fritz Henderson on Wednesday and convinced him to keep the Norton, Mass. plant open for at least 14 months.
http://briefingroom.thehill.com/2009/06/04/barney-frank-wins-delay-of-gm-plant-closing-after-ceo-meeting/
Hmmmmmm, you think old Barney is worried about his seat in 2010?????? - What a campaign commercial he can make….
I ahhh, worked hard for you to keep your money losing plant open so I could look good for the next election…..
“When the government fears the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny.”
Thomas Jefferson
No plants in New England
George Neitz Thursday, June 4th at 7:00PM EDT (link)HMMM no plants producing automobiles exist in New England. The plant you are referring to is a parts warehouse that ships to all of New England GM dealers.
The last GM plant in New England was in Framingham and was closed because the state and local governments would not bend the rules the slightest.
A nation of sheep will beget a government of wolves. - Edward R. Murrow
It is a parts & distribution center, they keep calling it a plant in all news reports
izoneguy Thursday, June 4th at 8:36PM EDT (link)http://multimedia.boston.com/m/video/22408921/gm-s-bankruptcy-to-shut-down-mass-plant.htm?pageid=7
“When the government fears the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny.”
Thomas Jefferson
We Need To BeSmart About This....
rcov092 Friday, June 5th at 12:54AM EDT (link)there are a great many technocrats with government expereince in running large industries available for hire. All of them late of the great (former)Soviet Union. Why risk derision by pickjing a 31 y.o. holder of a Bachelors degree who has no real expereince outside of school?
“Not One Red Dime for the NRSC or NRCC till they stop trying to elect liberals”
Join the RedState Strike Force
GM: The Fundamentals Stink
jimmuy8 Thursday, June 4th at 6:22PM EDT (link)Not one thing about government money and oversight addresses the core problems at GM. I don’t care how much they subsidize it.
You can’t polish a turd–even with billion dollar bills.
Before everyone started talking about GM failing what were the biggest complaints about Detroit products? 1) Poor quality and 2) poor design. (And gas mileage depending upon the current gas prices.)
I have yet to see one thing put forth that will change the fundamental problem with GM: No one wants to buy their crap.
Price was not and is not and will not be the reason a buyer will choose GM over Toyota or Honda.
The same is true at Chrysler.
Obama will come up with some plan to subsidize leasing of GM and Chrysler vehicles and they’ll find a way to snooker all levels of governments to lease them–then he and his lapdogs in the press will count those leases as “sales” and tell us how great they are doing.
GMAC was also bailed out, so now
The_Rebel Thursday, June 4th at 8:54PM EDT (link)the government can undercut Ford in financing those crap, putt-putt cars that the green machine is going to foist on a stupid public.
Cant Polish?
rcov092 Friday, June 5th at 12:51AM EDT (link)not even with 60 Billion?
“Not One Red Dime for the NRSC or NRCC till they stop trying to elect liberals”
Join the RedState Strike Force
Mythbusters
Pomme Friday, June 5th at 1:12AM EDT (link)Proved you can indeed polish a turd if you have the right kind of turd.
Not saying this is the right kind or not, just saying you can.
“Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views” William F Buckley Jr.
That Poor Quality Directly Related To UAW Contracts
rcov092 Friday, June 5th at 12:58AM EDT (link)all the automakers had to shave costs on the inuts to the car they could control since the ceded control over their cost structurte on the labor side.
So they engineered in brake pads and other parts that would save $1.00 here and a $ 1.00 there but had usable lives far shorter thena the same part on a Toyot or Honda. The intial quality was close, but the life-cycle costs were much higher becasue they were shifting costs on to the consumer that the competitors were not.
“Not One Red Dime for the NRSC or NRCC till they stop trying to elect liberals”
Join the RedState Strike Force
Take the pledge
JustLeaveMeAlone Thursday, June 4th at 7:38PM EDT (link)Never buy a UAW-made car.
“To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.” Thomas Jefferson
Sorry, I'll stick with my Fords.
Josh Painter Thursday, June 4th at 9:45PM EDT (link)Buy anthing with steel in it? Steelworkers union. Fly? Pilots union and several other unions. Drink beer? It was trucked in by the Teamsters, a union with a history as corrupt as it gets.
They all support Democrats. They all donated to and campaigned for Obama. So ’scuse me if I don’t hop on board the outrage train…
- JP
“An armed society is a polite society” - Robert A. Heinlein, “Beyond This Horizon” (1942)
Sorry
leppard Friday, June 5th at 10:50AM EDT (link)I will buy American-made cars.
I would like the new challenger, specifically the 6.1. Obama is trying to get us all into tin cans and I refuse.
I think its silly to buy a from a foreign company. The money goes out of the country. And I dont think all the money goes to the UAW..there is more involved then putting a car together.
On a personal note, my mother was a school teacher for 50 years and was forced to join the union. She hated it and what they stood for but her desire to teach was too great to stop her. Her dues went to the democratic party. She personally donated to the republican party. She was not the only one who did this at her school.
Concentrated power has always been the enemy of liberty.
Government does not solve problems; it subsidizes them.
No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we’ll ever see on this earth!
GM = The New Amtrack
JustLeaveMeAlone Thursday, June 4th at 7:46PM EDT (link)Need I say more?
Amtrack was supposed to lose money for three years and then emerge as a profitable private company, too.
That was, what, almost 40 years ago?
The Rail Passenger Service Act signed October 30, 1970 by President Nixon authorized the National Railroad Passenger Corporation to manage the basic national rail network and operate trains under contracts with the railroads. On April 21, 1971, the President nominated eight people to serve on the corporation’s Board of Directors.
Sound familiar?
It didn’t work then; it won’t work now.
“To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.” Thomas Jefferson
This llifelong American Car Buyer Goes Foriegn....
Blue_State_Refugee Thursday, June 4th at 8:05PM EDT (link)….I might not be able to controll the influence the UAW had in getting the government involved, but the UAW can’t influence me to buy one if its cars. I look for Toyota made in Tennesse or perhaps a Honda made in Ohio.
Blue State by Birth, Red State by Choice
Me too. Grandfather worked for Chevy and I drove mostly
Mike gamecock DeVine Thursday, June 4th at 8:17PM EDT (link)Chevys (First car a ‘69 Malibu 350, great new Berlinetta Camaro in 1988 out of law school, etc) and GM cars with the only exceptions being one Mazda when I moved to ATL and was corp counsel and was given that car. Now I drive a Chrysler.
No more GM or Chryslers in the future.
Mike DeVine’s Examiner.com, Charlotte Observer and The Minority Report columns
“One man with courage makes a majority.” - Andrew Jackson
We're boycotting all UAW products
peg_c Thursday, June 4th at 8:59PM EDT (link)We’re in the process of getting a Mitsubishi Lancer Evo MR with tech and Aero kits - hot, hot, hot and NOT made by the UAW. TAKE THAT, OBAMA.
Pfffft!
The really, really sad thing is what these people - these arrogant know-nothings who cannot run a lemonade stand and dare to presume they can run the American auto industry - are is doing to small-town America. These thugs are trying to destroy the very fabric of American life. We cannot, cannot allow this to happen.
Government cannot be the solution when government is the problem.
"...nor a business school graduate."
furious Thursday, June 4th at 9:10PM EDT (link)giggle
Oh, but their faith in credentialism is so touching. Like there weren’t layers of MBAs at GM helping to run that company into the ground.
–furious
“I find your lack of faith disturbing.” — Darth Vader
Baby steps...
mackbolan Thursday, June 4th at 10:55PM EDT (link)…are needed for those that are saying they won’t buy Ford either because they “won’t buy a UAW made product”. You concern should be with who runs the company. Would it be nice to buy an American car that wasn’t made by them? Sure. Should you go buy a foreign car and cut your nose off to spite your face? No.
I was in the market and was on the verge of buying a Chevy a few weeks ago. But as a result of the insane plan to have Obama(i.e. US taxpayers) and the UAW own GM and ride the sinking ship to bottom of the sea I went out last week and bought a Ford. I’ve owned Fords in the past that were less then impressive vehicles but I have to say that their current line is greatly improved. They should be rewarded for making smart business decisions not punished for operating with the weight of the UAW around their ankles.
If you think you’re sticking it to Obama by shunning Ford and buying foreigns that are “built in Ohio” etc. you’re no better than Obama and the “regressives” that are kicking America while it’s hurting. Shame on you.
We've had Fords, GMs and Chryslers
peg_c Friday, June 5th at 7:19AM EDT (link)in the past 5 years. They are crap.
Government cannot be the solution when government is the problem.
I've had Fords
Josh Painter Friday, June 5th at 9:47AM EDT (link)No problems.of any kind.
Here are the JD Power ratings for my ‘06 Fusion:
http://www.jdpower.com/autos/Ford/Fusion/2006/Sedan/ratings
Fords are NOT crap.
_ JP
“An armed society is a polite society” - Robert A. Heinlein, “Beyond This Horizon” (1942)
Me, too, Josh. All we have here on the farm are Fords.
janis Friday, June 5th at 10:53AM EDT (link)My husband owns a ‘96 F150 and a 2000 F250 as well as a ‘92 Ford Ranger. I drive a Mercury Sable 2003 station wagon. All of them have given stellar performance with only the standard problems that any car has, i.e., replace fuel filters or pumps, etc.
My '90 Ranger is the only vehicle I've ever made money on.
Achance Friday, June 5th at 11:29AM EDT (link)I bought it for $2000 a couple of years ago because now that I’m retired most of my driving consists of hauling stuff to the dump or hauling building and lawn and gardening supplies around, or hauling crab pots to and from the boat. When I was working, I usually hired that stuff done or bought a friend with a pickup a case of beer or something.
So, last December I was driving down the highway minding my own business and listening to Rush. It was pretty icy, but I had studs so I was doing 55 or maybe a little more. I see a blue truck coming up fast in the left lane and have barely time to start to swerve as he loses it, starts fish-tailing and hits me just at the rear of the cab so hard that his right front wheel goes up and over my left rear wheel crushing the bed of my truck. He hit me hard enough that I went around two and a half times before I got it hauled down. Kept it in the road, though, aging reflexes aren’t all gone. He was new to town, still had his Lower 48 plates, and obviously thought that his 4WD meant you could go like a bat out of Hell on icy roads.
Anyway, with repair prices here, any damage to a vehicle that age will total it. So, the book on it was $34-3600. The repair bill was $3400. The guy’s insurance company offered me $3200 and I kept the salvage rights. I said deal and took my trusty hammar to it and beat the side out so it cleared the wheel and it’s still going strong. Uglier ‘n Hell now, but it still hauls trash and crab pots pretty well and it has a killer stereo. My mechanic says I should just take the stereo out and junk it or I’m going to be going down the road one day and suddenly find myself bouncing along the road on my butt surrounded by a cloud of rust. I think I’ll keep it a while longer though because I like the image.
In Vino Veritas
Achance, having a vehicle as ugly as you mention has a real advantage
janis Friday, June 5th at 11:36AM EDT (link)these days: you never have to worry about getting car-jacked. A few years ago, I drove a ‘94 Ford Escort. One day I parked it at the place I was working and accidentally left the keys in the ignition. It sat there like that from 8 in the morning until 4 in the afternoon when I came back and found it perfectly untouched. ( It had gone through a really bad hailstorm in previous years when we only had liability on it due to age, so it had the appearance of an orange peel with all the little pits.)
Hurray for old and ugly!
I'm thinking spray can camoflage is in its future!
Achance Friday, June 5th at 12:00PM EDT (link)I’m working on the perfect white trash/redneck image for it although it really isn’t macho enough. Need a white F-150 or 250 with manual 4WD and a stick shift; that’s a man’s truck unlike all those Cowboy Cadillacs.
It’s still deficient in several ways though; the upholstery is stock and in good shape so I need some of that saddleblanket stuff. The wheels and tires all match. It doensn’t really have any visible rust through spots; there are some but you still have to look for them.
I does have the obligatory gun rack and a Dale Earnhardt “3″ decal in the back window. I also finally replaced my McCain/Palin sticker with a “Don’t Tread on Me” sticker. And, it has a flourescent green “Hootchie” fishing lure on the top of the antenna (looks like a green squid - hook pulled out of this one so I siliconed it on top of the antenna, works better than those little orange balls or a piece of string.)
In Vino Veritas
Needs a Confederate flag to complete the image you're going for. n/t
janis Friday, June 5th at 12:06PM EDT (link)Wouldn't be prudent here. nt
Achance Friday, June 5th at 12:11PM EDT (link)In Vino Veritas
Always had good luck with Fords...
larueladue Friday, June 5th at 11:41AM EDT (link)Put 305,000 miles on an F-150 before I traded it in, and have 198,000 on a Windstar van (yeah, I know: minivan… yuck! But I need it for the dogs…) and it is still going strong. The only vehicle I had that lasted longer was a Mazda B2000 pickup: I put 310,000 miles on it, but i rebuilt the engine at 254,000. The Fords had/have very little work done on them…
Had a Chevy Silverado (traded the F-150 in on it) and we only have it for about 75,000 miles before my wife made me trade it away… Seems the computer in it kept randomly losing its mind and readjusted all the interior seat settings, crushing her into the dash at bad times (like driving down the highway at 75 mph)… She won’t have anither GM vehicle: only Fords or Hondas… so I won’t either….
“Igitur qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum.” - Publius Flavius Vegetius Renatus (Vegetius) in “De Re Militari,” Book III.
Still love my Chryslers.
Achance Friday, June 5th at 10:46AM EDT (link)‘Course they’re both pre-Daimler takeover. I keep looking for a replacement for my 300M and the only thing that comes close has the three pointed star on it and costs two or three times what the Chrysler cost originally or what its replacement costs today. Until the HVAC blower control went out last winter, I had had exactly zero malfunctions in that car in nearly ten years. Since this climate is really hard on HVAC systems in cars (and power windows and windshield wipers) failures of parts like this are fairly frequent no matter what kind of car or where it is made.
My wife’s Sebring is mostly a Mitubishi product and has been a good car. She’s had a little trouble with it, but she’s hard on machinery so I don’t know how much is her and how much is the car.
That said, I won’t buy another one or a GM either. Both brands are doomed to be nothing more than fronts for whatever flight of fancy the greenies are pushing and we’ll subsidize them until we can restore a legitimate government to this Country and just do away with them. Maybe something good will rise from the ashes, though the British auto industry never really recovered from nationalization.
In Vino Veritas
Ive only driven Chrysler
leppard Friday, June 5th at 10:56AM EDT (link)Never had a problem. In our family we’ve had over 25. No problems.
My SRT can whoop any foreign car. Any one who has gone to the free track experience that you get with a SRT will see that they are strong cars that can take a beating.
Secondly, sometimes its the user. It amazes me how many ppl dont change the oil, dont warm the car up, dont check fluids and wonder why the thing has an issue.
Concentrated power has always been the enemy of liberty.
Government does not solve problems; it subsidizes them.
No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we’ll ever see on this earth!
Define 'foreign' car
Neil Stevens Friday, June 5th at 10:57AM EDT (link)The UAW does not represent employees at all car factories in this country.
Want to run for conservatives? Give.
There Is No Crisis
The UAW will be like a leech on GM
bobojake Friday, June 5th at 12:31AM EDT (link)The taxpauers will never get their money back that obama stole.
I’ll keep my Toyota
Only Partially True...
rcov092 Friday, June 5th at 12:48AM EDT (link)remember where that teat is now connected.
“Not One Red Dime for the NRSC or NRCC till they stop trying to elect liberals”
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