[Libertarian]: “Voluntary taxation” = You can choose whether or not to participate in the tax system.
[Liberal]: “Voluntary taxation” = You calculate and send in your taxes, instead of your employer. And, oh, yes, you don’t have to pay taxes on a house if you don’t want to own one.
Watching an example of the former explain the definition to an example of the latter - and watching the liberal completely reject the definition without even remotely understanding it - in the following video will no doubt amuse you. Or make you want to throw a brick through the screen. Or both.
“I really don’t understand what you’re trying to get at…” - An actual quote from our illustrious Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, who apparently really is this… well, dumb is the wrong word. Try “blinkered.” He’s so drawn up in the concept that taxes are of course a fundamental force of the universe that he apparently can’t contemplate the notion that people might be inclined to oppose them on general principles. After all, they’re taxes. You can’t talk about them as if you can just make them go away by wishing hard enough. They’ve got… taxions, or something like that. You can’t destroy taxions, right? Isn’t that a law of physics?
I’m well aware that the GOP has a - somewhat deserved, honestly - recent history of not taking fiscal conservatism seriously, but you have to admit; at least we understood the concept that this is your money that we’re talking about. Senate Democrats aren’t even trying.
Moe Lane
Crossposted to Moe Lane.

well this is good to know, since April 15
RJD Tuesday, March 31st at 2:57PM EDT (link)is right around the corner. This is going to save me a lot of time and effort.
*snark*
is this a recent video? It looks a few years old?
RJD Tuesday, March 31st at 3:01PM EDT (link)I feel for the interviewer - I think he wanted to throttle ol’ Harry a bit, there.
It was put up in April 2008, so not too old. [nt]
Moe Lane Tuesday, March 31st at 3:03PM EDT (link)NT
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Actually, it's been around longer.
NightTwister Tuesday, March 31st at 3:42PM EDT (link)See here.
I thought it was funny that it came out around the time several of Obama’s appointees were found to not have paid their taxes.
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Heh. Penalty of a group blog.
Moe Lane Tuesday, March 31st at 4:09PM EDT (link)No harm repeating it, huh?
Check out my new blog at http://moelane.com/.
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My (blogging-related) wish list.
None at all.
NightTwister Tuesday, March 31st at 7:29PM EDT (link)Please feel free to show the idiocy of Harry Reid as often as you like. I had to listen to it three times because first I couldn’t believe he said it, and second I couldn’t believe the reporter didn’t call him an idiot right there.
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The Difference Between Mental Illness and Sanity
traversecityconservative Tuesday, March 31st at 3:08PM EDT (link)That was priceless. I guess the difference in a voluntary tax system is that we can or cannot voluntarily fill out the form. This man has a mental illness.
Well...
Steph C Tuesday, March 31st at 3:29PM EDT (link)If you consider that people like Harry Reid believes that all money earned is really the government’s rather than the wage earner’s it might make more sense that he thinks taxation is voluntary.
After all, they are volunteering to keep only an arm and a leg rather than both arms and legs and whatever other body parts they’d be inclined to keep rather than give.
/snark
“[I]f the public are bound to yield obedience to laws to which they cannot give their approbation, they are slaves to those who make such laws and enforce them.” –Candidus in the Boston Gazette, 1772
Hillbilly Politics
Of course it's the government's money
ss396 Tuesday, March 31st at 9:55PM EDT (link)They printed it, didn’t they?
If you pay people to sit on their duffs, you cannot be surprised when they do.
They'd really have a problem
Steph C Tuesday, March 31st at 9:57PM EDT (link)If people regressed to the barter system wouldn’t they?
“[I]f the public are bound to yield obedience to laws to which they cannot give their approbation, they are slaves to those who make such laws and enforce them.” –Candidus in the Boston Gazette, 1772
Hillbilly Politics
Reminds me of
Deep_Thinker Tuesday, March 31st at 3:40PM EDT (link)A Monty Python skit I vaguely remember.
To be thick as a brick...
Right_Again Tuesday, March 31st at 3:45PM EDT (link)Or to be dumb as a post. Wow. And this man is the Senate Majority Leader. Put him together with Nancy Pelosi and Barack Obama and we could be in real trouble.
It's not what you do, but what you call it.
Freedomlover Tuesday, March 31st at 4:06PM EDT (link)One more believer that the most powerful position is that of the “Name Giver” He gets by with it - keeps getting re-elected. Funny isn’t it, we used to think the crooks were the guys running the casinos in his state.
Reminds me a bit of a line from a Tom Lehrer song which went, “..Plagiarize, plagiarize, plagiarize. Let no one else’s work evade your eyes. Remember why the good Lord made your eyes. Don’t shade your eyes, plagiarize, plagiarize plagiarize, But remember, of course, to call it ‘research’”
Unfortunately your all dumb....
toddworsham Tuesday, March 31st at 4:13PM EDT (link)You see Harry Reid was exactly right. Income taxes are voluntary in the sense that the government voluntarily chooses to allow you to KEEP some of your money. You see all the money, all the property, all the jobs, belong to them. Think that statement is a little bold, dont pay your car or home property taxes and see how long you have your car or your home. Like your job in the childrens moto cross industry, not any more since we have to protect the kids from lead paint.
We live in their world, their rules, their money.
Get used to it…..
….or get out before then wont let you out.
**The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants**
–An OG American Patriot–
http://www.theotherworsham.blogspot.com
not 100% sure where you're going with that, Todd...
randy streu Tuesday, March 31st at 4:39PM EDT (link)but if you’re going to accuse a bunch of people of being “dumb,” it might help to use the correct version of “you’re”.
“your” is possessive
“You’re” means “you are”
It’s a contraction, see.
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I understand where he's going...
Fred Maidment Tuesday, March 31st at 5:59PM EDT (link)He’s saying that it’s a voluntary system for the government. They volunteer to allow us to keep some of our income and property.
Poorly phrased, but his concept is exactly the thinking of the Left.
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- - Thomas Jefferson, to Archibald Stuart, 1791
yeah... see, that's what I figured.
randy streu Wednesday, April 1st at 12:29AM EDT (link)what bugs me is that it’s not actually any different from what anybody else was saying. Which is why the “dumb” comment seems misplaced.
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They're both wrong in one regard
bk Tuesday, March 31st at 4:17PM EDT (link)The questioner says if you don’t pay your taxes, you go to jail.
Harry says that’s necessarily true, as there are civil penalties that may apply instead.
Well neither of those is necessarily true, as a third alternative is that you end up as an Obama cabinet member.
dang it - s/b NOT necessarily true
bk Tuesday, March 31st at 4:18PM EDT (link)not only that...
Freedomlover Tuesday, March 31st at 4:25PM EDT (link)but if you happen to be “the only man alive who can solve this massive problem” you’ll be given unilateral power to decide what every employee in the private sector ought to earn and to cut his pay or fire him if he is being paid too much.
I forgot a fourth possibility
bk Tuesday, March 31st at 4:20PM EDT (link)Flee to a foreign country and await a pardon from a President like Clinton.
Your right
toddworsham Tuesday, March 31st at 8:29PM EDT (link)Just messing with you there. But you’re right about my grammar it is pretty shoddy, I zoned out during that part in school, my lovely girlfriend edits my diaries, not my comments though.
My essential point is that the average politicians mindset is so warped that, to harry “the body” reid, the “taxes are voluntary” statement makes complete sense. It’s voluntary in the sense you can e-file or just mail it in like grandpa did. All politicians are guilty of this sort of thinking so some degree. Indeed, as time goes on, even the most promising young politicians is often corrupted to the point of no return by operating inside the beltway.
**The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants**
–An OG American Patriot–
http://www.theotherworsham.blogspot.com
I wasn't picking on your grammar
bk Tuesday, March 31st at 9:55PM EDT (link)Not sure why you thought so.
huh? He's pickin' on his Gramma?
JLenardDetroit Tuesday, March 31st at 10:04PM EDT (link)Oh Grammar…..
WARNING: JOKE folks… just interjecting some levity
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+ 0bama Lies & your Bank acct will Die! (4/15 Truthers)
+ Heil “O” Hell No Obamao is NOT MY PRESIDENT! “No U won’t”
+ I want “O” to FAIL (here, here, & whole Diary (Ofail) here, is why)
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Some taxes are voluntary
Deskpilot Tuesday, March 31st at 5:09PM EDT (link)+Tobacco -Alcohol - Luxury Tax - Don’t want to pay the tax, don’t buy it.
- Unemployed merchants=less tax revenue
+ Fuel Tax - Bus, Mass transit
- The great black hole of city finances (UTWU)
+Tolls - use alternate routes
- Roads will not receive adequate repair and maintenance $$$
But don’t tell me that that payroll confiscation of taxes is VOLUTARY.
No W4/1099/1040 , off the to IRS(or lower level authority) judge and jail with you.
Wnat to drive ANYWHERE, you have to pay fuel tax
Want to buty ANYTHING non-food in many states, SALES TAX
Harry may have aged from the original of this video, but with age has come greater insanity, which is why the Wicked Witch(es) of the West lead him around by the Ba^7^7$
(Pelosi, Frankenstein, Water(board)s, Boxbat)
If you can read this, thank a teacher. If you can still read it in English, You’re Welcome
Deskpilot, AM(H)1 (AW), USN (Ret)
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To carry it further
bk Tuesday, March 31st at 9:57PM EDT (link)Payroll taxes (and FICA etc.) - don’t work
Income tax - don’t work; don’t invest; keep all your money under your mattress
Gas tax - walk, ride bike, ride mass transit
The bewildered look on Reid's face...
Fred Maidment Tuesday, March 31st at 6:03PM EDT (link)Video Camera: $279 at Best Buy
Website Registration: $2.99 at GoDaddy
Microsoft Front Page: $149 online
Gas for the round-trip: $5
Bewildered look on Harry Reid’s face: PRICELESS
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“I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it.”
- - Thomas Jefferson, to Archibald Stuart, 1791
This explains the nationalization of private charities
Next93 Tuesday, March 31st at 8:11PM EDT (link)This actually explains a lot. Under Reid’s definition of “voluntary”, people can be required under penalty of law to do “volunteer” service work. It’s NOT slavery, it’s “community service”, and the people in charge aren’t slave masters, they’re “community organizers”. Yeah, THAT’s the ticket!
Did I fall asleep some time in January and wake up in an Orwell novel?
Constitutional limits on the powers of the federal government:
It’s not just the law, it’s a good idea!
Isn't that what Obama has asked for?
Fred Maidment Tuesday, March 31st at 10:43PM EDT (link)Minimum community service requirements to graduate from Middle/High School?
Or am I confusing that with someone else?
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“I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it.”
- - Thomas Jefferson, to Archibald Stuart, 1791
So is the youth work camp a law now? nt
mom2oneson Tuesday, March 31st at 8:23PM EDT (link)nt
sorry
mom2oneson Tuesday, March 31st at 8:31PM EDT (link)wrong thread, I read the post above and posted since I just saw the AP article.
Tax Protestors Rejoice!!
swglaw Wednesday, April 1st at 9:49AM EDT (link)More evidence for the true believers that the tax system is voluntary. Reid’s bumbling about, if widely disseminated, will confirm the mistaken views of lots of tax protestors. Sure, he said you can’t get away with it, but listen to him. His bumbling is so bad, he must be “in the know” and covering up, because he has to. People will go to jail, in part, because of Reid’s failure to a) recognize the distinction between forced taxation and voluntary compliance; and b) acknowledge that the government TAKES taxes whether its citizens think it is a good idea or not.
The phrase “our system is based upon voluntary compliance” has led more people to jail and ruin than any other ever propogated by government. Whoever came up with that ludicrous phrase really ought to be shot, drawn and quartered, tarred and feathered, and forced to listen to an endless loop of Barry Manilow muzak while to chained to a prison cell somewhere in Central America. Of course, what was meant, was that the U.S. relies on its citizens voluntarily COMPLYING with the law, in that it would be difficult to force everyone to comply. This is why we have income withholding. If the taxpayers themselves had to write out the checks to the government every payday, we would have revolt. But you can’t miss what you don’t see.
Unfortunately, some see that “voluntary” language and think, “Well, I’ll just unvolunteer.” And then they incur huge penalties, ruining them financially, tearing apart their families, and possibly even jail - thereby losing their livelihoods and any possibility of paying their debt. And then we have Dingy Harry coming out with a thoroughly pathetic defense of the notion of “voluntariness”. This governmental/political need to try to paint the tax system as less than what it is has caused, and will continue to cause, thousands of people to be ruined personally and financially. But will it ever touch Harry Reid? Will it ever touch the pols who take more and more of the citizens hard earned money? Will the person who wrote that nonsense into IRS forms ever feel anything toward those he or she misled? Will any of them care, or at least notice enough to change it? Of course not.
The power to tax is the power to destroy.