Promoted from the Diaries by Jeff.
Under former Governor Mitt Romney, the state of Massachusetts undertook the largest single step towards single payer health care of any government entity in the United States to date. It has created a myriad of problems, chief of which is a massive headache for those who are now forced to pay for insurance that they never wanted or can’t afford. The plan, in a nutshell, requires all Massachusetts residents to purchase a state approved private health insurance plan or pay into a state run plan. This mandatory purchase law, with concurrent restrictions on what qualifies as “insurance”, has lead to the nation’s largest increases in premium.
Instead of recognizing that insurance premiums are rising because of the state’s laws, current Governor Deval Patrick is set to double down on the squeeze that health care costs are putting on his state’s citizens.
Patrick said officials are considering using state insurance regulations to block excessive healthcare premiums.
It certainly doesn’t take a rocket scientist to understand that by “block excessive healthcare premiums” Patrick means that he is going to institute tighter control over premiums [Every state's insurance regulatory body already reviews and approves rate increases annually based on each state's formula for ho much they feel the insurance company has to pay in benefits on each dollar of premium before they are allowed to raise premiums. Note that this formula doesn't take any account as to whether the company is profitable as there are other expenses beside the actual costs of the claims.] The folly of price controls will not solve Massachussetts problems. Price controls will simply introduce new problems [while admittely keeping the price of insurance lower]:
- An environment where a company feels that it cannot make a profit in return for the money it invests in the market will lead to less choice in insurance companies. This will eventually lead to a quasi-state sponsored oligopoly where a few large players, who will have lots of ties to the officials overseeing the industry, will be able to exert control over the entire system. This is very bad for consumers as both choice and quality would decrease.
- Even before enough companies decide that the math doesn’t work for their continued existence in the state, many of them will have begun extremely aggressive measures to reduce their costs in order to remain sufficiently profitable for as long as possible. [There will be a desire amongst most players to remain in the game long enough to become one of the few left standing.] The costs that will most likely be cut are the reimbursements to health care providers. Considering the already alarming trend of the loss of primary care physicians, these cuts would place a great deal of consumers in Massachusetts in the position of having fewer quality doctors to pick from. If they thought their wait times for a visit were long now, wait until more doctors get fed up and leave their practices. This will likely mean that more Massachusetts consumers will forgo basic medical treatment, despite having insurance that covers the visits for a low copay, because the time to wait for the appointment will become to great.
- In countries that have instituted price controls for health care, the have had to step in and exert greater government control over the supply of health care. For example, in Canada you can wait months for a needed surgery [such as life saving open heart surgery]. In Spain, you are assigned a doctor by the government based on where you live. This has led to the same phenomenon we experience in the states with respect to moving into the quality school districts as Spaniards try to move to neighborhoods with the best doctors. How would you like to be the one that can’t afford to move into a neighborhood that has anything resembling a good doctor.
Try as we will, this type of logic will be lost on the most fervent advocates of further increased government control over the health care market. I fear for my friends in Massachusetts. The state was offered evidence that their experiment is failing. As of yet, they have not recognized the warning signs.
Neil Stevens
Steve Maley
Why Again Do So Many Conservatives Love Mitt Romney?
DavidSage (Diary) Wednesday, January 7th at 12:49PM EST (link)Romney single biggest “achievement” as Governor was passing what I consider to be a big step towards socialized medicine. Even Ted Kennedy was on board with Mitt’s health care plan.
Because we do . . .
Steve W (Diary) Wednesday, January 7th at 3:18PM EST (link)Why do so many, seemingly knowledgeable and educated people, want to blame the executive for things that the legislature is supposed to do – or does??
The ultimate determinant in the struggle now going on for the world will not be bombs and rockets but a test of wills and ideas-a trial of spiritual resolve: the values we hold, the beliefs we cherish and the ideals to which we are dedicated.
- Ronald Reagan
Secondly, . . .
Steve W (Diary) Wednesday, January 7th at 3:22PM EST (link)Why are you thread jacking? This very insightful, and thoughtful diary is about the state of Massachusetts medical system and how possible changes to it – by the CURRENT governor/legislators – cannot possibly get the results that they want – NOT about Mitt Romney.
The ultimate determinant in the struggle now going on for the world will not be bombs and rockets but a test of wills and ideas-a trial of spiritual resolve: the values we hold, the beliefs we cherish and the ideals to which we are dedicated.
- Ronald Reagan
Steve...not really a thread jack...
Attack Mode (Diary) Wednesday, January 7th at 3:28PM EST (link)The very first sentence of the diary brings Mitt into the equation.
“Land of the Free and Home of da Whopper” Peter Griffin…Family Guy
conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!
Steel-Belted Radial Right Winger

“I’ll create 5 million jobs from out of unicorn farts and pixie dust” Justatron paraphrasing Obamessiah…yes I love it that much.
OK, sorry . . . n/t
Steve W (Diary) Wednesday, January 7th at 3:39PM EST (link).
The ultimate determinant in the struggle now going on for the world will not be bombs and rockets but a test of wills and ideas-a trial of spiritual resolve: the values we hold, the beliefs we cherish and the ideals to which we are dedicated.
- Ronald Reagan
How could the current administration do anything with this if Mitt
AceInTX (Diary) Wednesday, January 7th at 9:40PM EST (link)hadn’t signed it into law?
I mean Come on!
Oh...and lest we forget...Romney bragged about his "free market health care solution"
AceInTX (Diary) Wednesday, January 7th at 9:42PM EST (link)while he was busy spending his billions kneecapping every conservative alternative to himself and McCain!
He deserves to be brought into this discussion!
Amen...
AceInTX (Diary) Wednesday, January 7th at 9:38PM EST (link)Once again we have a Republican laying the foundation for a socialist scheme to be built upon by successive liberal administrations…and we’re gonn a make this guy president?
As a Registered Nurse this was the #1 reason I did not like Mitt Romney
Elizabeth Christian (Diary) Wednesday, January 7th at 10:30PM EST (link)and I am here to tell you when/IF Obama and his liberal friends are able to get socialized medicine here in the U.S. – I WILL LEAVE the healthcare profession (and I am not alone). I actually have went back to college to get another degree in prep. for this possibility and to pursue my goals.
Why I as a Registered Nurse will NOT work in the healthcare system IF socialized medicine (under any name) is put into place:
1) I cannot ethically and with good conscience stand by and watch people not get treatment because the government decides the financial benefits outway the risks of helping a person.
***example – my 95-year-old great-grandmother still lives at home and cooks and able to take care of herself with slight assistance by our family. Last spring she fell and broke her hip – under our current system she had her hip replaced, went to a rehab center, and returned home to home health (for less time than most of our younger patient’s stay under our care) and back to cooking and able to live comfortably in her home.
***so let’s take this to scenario #2 – under socialized medicine my great-grandmother wound meet one of two fates – either she would have to wait 6 months or more for hip to be replaced and SUFFER with a broken hip and not be able to return to home, OR the most likely scenario she would not qualify for hip surgery, the decision would have been taken out of the hands of my great-grandmother and our family and into the hands of the government – she would have suffered until she dies.
*****THANK GOD we have the system that we have – I know our system has problems but trust me socialized medicine is NOT the answer.
***under scenario #2 – young people (legal or illegal citizens here in the U.S.) would have received treatment at no cost and my great-grandmother who worked in the Mill and raised 4 girls and has always taken care of herself would not have received treatment – see anything wrong with that? I do!!!
As a nurse I would not be able to live with myself and practice under those conditions – Medicare/Medicaid and all of the other government programs have a big enough hold on us now – government is NOT the solution – government is the PROBLEM and if Americans let them take total control of our healthcare system then we will be heading south to somewhere to get our care like the Canadians do now (from their socialized medicine) – if it is so great why do Canadians come to America for treatment? Where would they go if America becomes as foolish as their system?
Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.
~Benjamin Franklin
We already have socialized medicine
zuiko (Diary) Wednesday, January 7th at 10:48PM EST (link)It’s interesting you use someone covered under Medicare as an example of the the free market at work. Medicare/Medicaid/VA… it’s all socialized medicine. We have been operating under a half socialized health care system for 40 years now. Yes, eventually you have to ration because the taxpayers can’t pay the bills otherwise. We try to get by now in the case of medicare by lowering doctor reimbursements below market rates and limiting the ages of those that can get into the program. But mostly writing lots and lots of IOUs to pay for it.
That won’t be enough eventually, then we’ll just have to straight up ration care with lines like other countries do.
Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. – Milton Friedman
I never said Medicare/Medicaid was the free market
Elizabeth Christian (Diary) Wednesday, January 7th at 10:59PM EST (link)I said government (Medicare/Medicaid) is the problem and not the solution. I said the system is not perfect but if it becomes completely socialized medicine we are screwed.
We do still have free market involvement – the minute clinics at the pharmacies – run by Nurse Practitioners are a great example of how if the government gets out of the way the system is successful and much better than the red tape we have to go through when dealing with Medicare and other government programs.
What I am saying is we are close to socialized medicine because of the liberal programs in place – but currently we do not have complete socialized medicine. Our medical system has areas that need to be fixed – mainly dealing with the current government problems like you mentioned – reimbursements, etc…
Massachusetts is the best example out there as to NOT going ahead with liberals plans.
Following Massachusetts plan is like giving a diabetic a candy bar and then a balanced meal and then saying well your blood sugar is up anyways – just eat candy from now on and let us see if that makes it better.
Massachusetts took our problems that we currently have and put those problems on steroids.
We need reform (good reform – not more government involvement).
Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.
~Benjamin Franklin
Well you did use a Medicare recipient
zuiko (Diary) Wednesday, January 7th at 11:08PM EST (link)As an example of how things are working right now and would be working wrong if we were to completely socialize. The only difference between the two scenarios is that in one we have enough people paying for and few enough people receiving benefits from that we can write IOUs to cover the shortfall. If we expanded Medicare eligibility we’d run into the same rationing you describe. Heck, we’ll run into it anyway in 10 years no matter what we do. The system as it is now is not sustainable.
I certainly agree that government is the problem. Starting all the way back with the wage controls after WWII, which resulted in employers providing free insurance, which resulted into nobody paying doctor’s bills any more, which resulted in out of control health care costs.
Minute clinics are good, HSAs are also good, but I am afraid it is too little too late at this point. I don’t see a way back that people would even tolerate politically, much less embrace.
Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. – Milton Friedman
Should a 95-year-old try and get free market coverage now?
Elizabeth Christian (Diary) Wednesday, January 7th at 11:22PM EST (link)I did use my great-grandmother as an example, she is on medicare, but at 95 it’s not like she would be accepted by an insurance carrier – and that is besides the point.
If you take Hillary, Obama, or Romney’s plan and change our current system (flaws and all) and change it to any of their systems you will get what Massachusetts is getting right now. That was the point of my comment.
I agree Medicare is a ponzi scheme just like social security and all other liberals programs but if it were changed to any of the above mentioned plans it would be like giving Medicare steroids – it would completely finish our system off. It would cause rationing as mentioned before.
Sounds like we agree, because I believe in minute clinics (I would use one), HSA’s (I have one) and other free market solutions to our current mess – and you are right it may be too little too late (I pray not).
Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.
~Benjamin Franklin
I don't fault Romney so much for this
Brian Simpson (Diary) Thursday, January 8th at 10:17AM EST (link)Given the political make up of Massachusetts (as DocJ reminded me over on TMR) did not favor a conservative plan. I think, given that makeup, that this was the best that we could have hoped for under a Romney administration. At least for now they aren’t into full blown government control. Given the indications in the article I linked to however, it may only be a manner of time before Patrick takes the final step and institutes a single payer plan.
| My RedState archive |
Important principles may and must be inflexible. ~ Abraham Lincoln
The problem is if Romney had never opened the door
Elizabeth Christian (Diary) Friday, January 9th at 2:03AM EST (link)then this would not be possible. That is the problem – you can’t really play with liberals because of the fact that one day they may be in charge and they cannot leave well enough alone they have to corrupt anything they touch. But in my opinion I agree with Ronald Reagan about socialized medicine under any name is a bad idea – that is what was done by Mitt Romney.
Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.
~Benjamin Franklin
Okay?
Brian Simpson (Diary) Friday, January 9th at 9:19AM EST (link)So you would have preferred if Romney didn’t get involved in the process? The Democrats would have passed an even worse bill (since they have super majorities in both houses). Romney would have vetoed the bill. The Democrats would have overturned the veto before the ink was dry.
At least Romney stalled the slide.
| My RedState archive |
Important principles may and must be inflexible. ~ Abraham Lincoln
I'm not sure
zuiko (Diary) Wednesday, January 7th at 10:58PM EST (link)How requiring people to buy health insurance has anything to do with single payer systems. Are we on the road to single payer government run auto insurance since we require people to purchase that? Don’t get me wrong, I am not a fan of health insurance mandates… but I don’t see what making this into something it’s not really accomplishes.
Health care is a mess in Mass, but it’s also a mess in every other state of the union. I don’t see insurance mandates as the fix for it, but I can’t really say I got a lot of other politically feasible ideas on how to fix the system, either.
Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. – Milton Friedman
The only solution would be to get government out
Elizabeth Christian (Diary) Wednesday, January 7th at 11:28PM EST (link)to phase out medicare, etc…
To me – that guy Madoff that stole the money in the ponzi scheme is no different than Medicare and Social Security – all operate as ponzi schemes – take new investors/tax payers and pay for original investors/tax payers.
It is not something that could be done overnight but it could be done. Fire most hospital administrators and get conservative leadership – ex. Michelle Obama was a hospital admin. in Chicago (does that tell you anything?). She made what something like $400,000/year (after her husband becomes Senator) to teach culture diversity – how many aspirins would that buy? And you wonder why an aspirin costs $50/aspirin. Alot of hospital administrators resemble our Congress and the Big 3 Auto Execs. and AIG – but don’t worry hospitals have been being bailed out by taxpayers for many years – they were the original bailouts!!!
Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.
~Benjamin Franklin
Alone, zuiko, the mandate is not the road to single payer
Brian Simpson (Diary) Thursday, January 8th at 10:13AM EST (link)However when you couple it with the state choosing what qualifies as insurance you get a disaster. The requirements and mandates on policies in Massachusetts are some of the highest in the nation [There is something about those northeastern states and their desire to drive up the cost of insurance as they are all among the worst].
Say for example I was a very wealthy individual living in Boston. I have more than enough money to self insure for basic needs and even most catastrophic care. I want to go out and buy a policy with a $1M deductible and no copays on anything. I can’t do that in Massachusetts. I now have to waste money on a policy that I don’t want. I am required to purchase what the government says I have to or I am penalized.
That may not be “single payer” but it does accomplish the same purpose. Everyone pays at least the same amount for a product that they don’t necessarily want or need.
And yes, the auto insurance market does function the same way. For whatever reason, there isn’t the same pressure on that market to continually raise the standards of what qualifies as insurance.
| My RedState archive |
Important principles may and must be inflexible. ~ Abraham Lincoln
The state determining what qualifies as insurance
zuiko (Diary) Thursday, January 8th at 11:08AM EST (link)Every state in the union does that… so if that is the road to single payer, we are already on that road in all 50 states. And probably a lot further down in some states than Mass is. That’s why you can’t just sell insurance nationwide… it has to be tailored to every state. Every state has a bunch of regulations on what must be covered, how it must be covered, and how it can be priced. Some states even have requirements about what kind of entity can offer the insurance (in MN only not-for-profits can be HMOs). So that kind of regulation doesn’t make Mass an exceptional case.
We can certainly agree that the idea of price controls on premiums is totally idiotic, but I’m not seeing how this statement is at all true:
The Federal government has taken leaps towards single payer (Medicare, Medicaid, VA). Other states have done just as much or more regulating coverage.
Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. – Milton Friedman