Redstate

I'm glad to know there are others (even a majority) like myself. Even though you would think it were the rarest thing if you were to believe blogs.

I find myself thinking we are no less or no more safe by leaving Iraq. Would it become a terrorist haven, maybe. First and foremost, it will be a place all the different brands of terrorists and other regional factions will fight each other for. I think they would be fighting themselves more than anything. Eventually, an extremist faction would likely end up in control. Does that make it any easier for them to get to the US? I don't happen to think so.

Secondly, so what if it becomes a sanctuary? Al Queda and Bin Laden haven't seemed to have much trouble finding safe havens we aren't doing anything about. What's one more going to change? They have plenty of safe havens now, so I can't really say that more would make us less safe.

The only real tragedy, IMO, to us leaving would be the civilians caught up in the mess. But the way I see it, they have been and are still being given ample chance to take their country and lives into their own hands. It seems like something they just aren't willing to do. I for one don't have the patience to watch them squander our lives and money by not doing so for much longer.

They don't want us to leave, yet they don't take charge and stop the terrorists. They don't want us to rule them, yet they refuse to rule themselves. I guess at some point, you have to push them out of the nest and make them fly or fall.

It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems just with potatoes.

that if we pull out of Iraq Al Queda will leave us alone. They will take over Iraq and then they will make plans to attack us again.

Anyone who thinks that they will be safer if we pull out of Iraq are fooling themselves.

As far as the Iraqi's not pulling their load, they have taken control of a number of provinces and are running the whole operation. We just need to give them time to get stronger.

The terrorists are doing the car bombs to get us to pull out so they can take over.

First, very interesting post and stats. This confirms my suspicion that everyone has a little common sense.

But, shouldn't it read "Less than a quarter agree?" Or did I read something wrong? When I read "Almost a quarter disagree" I thought "so what? That's not a whole lot of division nowadays." But, the article actually says much more than that. Just a thought.

There are lots of other "factoids" in the survey, some of which would be disagreed with very strongly on here on RS.

I won't quote them as what's the point, people can click through themselves, but the point I would make is that September will be a very interesting time that no amount of "Spin" is going to cover up.

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None of the Above !

If I may paraphrase it (and please correct me where my memory fails me), his point was that the war is going to end in the near-term future and we need to come to grips with it and plan for it, instead of arguing over whose vision of the future would hold true if given endless time and endless resources. The fact is, the majority of voters have basically decided that enough is enough and that we have to find a way to wind this thing down. The point of pressure is the presidential election just over the horizon. Ifchange does not come before the election, it will surely come after the election because it will be the main issue for most voters.

If the Republicans decide to run on a platform of continuing the war as-is into the next presidential term, they will surely lose. If they run on winding it down, they have a chance (although I think Bill Kristol is wildly off base in his enthusiasm for the place that the Republicans are in). Democrats will surely run on a platform of winding down our involvement. The only question is what platform the Republicans choose.

So while it may feel good to chastise the majority of the population for their short-sightedness, it is unlikely be a winning position in the coming election. Elections have consequences. So Republicans will have to choose between accepting the inevitability of the beginning of the end-game in Iraq and getting completely clobbered in the next election, which puts all Republican candidates and priorities at risk.

My apologies to Leon. I can't begin to do justice to his well-reasoned and thoughtful post. I thought it was a courageous post and I would like to it if I knew how.