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Is Syria Really “Different?”

While the recent increase of attention to the ongoing carnage in Syria is a welcome change from the Obama administration’s collective state of denial over the past ten months, signals remain mixed, and our policy is unclear if not non-existent.  This week alone, for example, we got the welcome news that the Pentagon is preparing military options on Syria for the President, but at the same time White House press secretary announced those options will not be exercised.

The waters have been further muddied by the President’s insistence that there is no parity between the situation in Libya last year and what we face now in Syria. In Libya, the threat to civilians and opportunity to topple a vicious dictator were sufficient cause for Mr. Obama to engage the U.S. military, even without a pressing national security interest at stake.  While it can be argued that once the U.S. engaged in Libya it might have been preferable to lead from the front to secure weapons stockpiles and guard against al Qaida encroachment, the fact remains that the world is a better place with Colonel Qaddafi gone, as Mr. Obama routinely reminds us.

Meanwhile, as many as ten times the civilians killed in Libya before NATO’s intervention have died in Syria over the last year.  Bashir Assad is no less cruel and repressive a tyrant than Muammar Qaddafi. The threat of Syria’s unknown stockpiles of WMD falling into bad hands demands our urgent attention.  And, above all, the United States has a clear strategic interest in toppling this vital ally of Iran.

But Syria is somehow different, and not worthy of the same sort of military assistance we offered to the Libyan rebels.

Rather than taking decisive action in the form of military aid through our purported ally Turkey (perhaps in August when the President issued a statement calling for Assad’s ouster on his way out of town for vacation), the U.S. has remained on the diplomatic equivalent of a hamster wheel.  From the ill-advised resumption of “normal” relations with Syria last January through the pathetic failure of the Security Council resolution this weekend, our efforts to resolve the situation have been futile wastes of time and energy as the slaughter in Syria goes on to the tune of 100 people a day.

In dealing with Libya and Syria, consistency need not be the hobgoblin of little minds but can rather be the hallmark of a consistent and coordinated foreign policy.  There are equivalencies to be drawn between the two crises, and once these are recognized we should take equivalent action.  It is not a decision to be taken lightly, but we would not be alone and the cause is just.  We have the unified support of our European and Arab allies.  We have moral and strategic interests at stake.  Rather than whining about the shocking moral turpitude of the United Nations, the President of the United States needs to remember his responsibilities as the leader of the free world–and lead.

COMMENTS

  • Ender

    1. Russia has a naval base there and maintains luke warm support of Assad. Helping Syrian opposition militarily has a bigger chance of antagonizing Russia on a higher level than anything we did in Libya.

    2. Assad is stronger militarily than Qadaffi ever was. 200,000 career soldiers, 300,000 conscripts vs Lybian 25,000 career and 25,000 conscripts.

    3. Proximity to Iran and a likelihood of Iranian military help in case of US involvement.

    4. Segments of Syrian society do support Assad, especially Alawites.

    5. Syria is more densely populated – higher potential casualties in an all out war.

    That said, I do support helping Syrian opposition, including militarily, but it is a potential bloodbath unlike anything we’ve seen in Libya. Unfortunately Alawites comprise 70% of Syrian career soldiers. Makes it tougher to get big chunks of military to defect.

    If a full blown war erupts with 10s of thousands dying, what should we do then? Invade with our allies?

    • Academic Elephant

      About Russia, but I don’t see that relationship being improved by appeasement. And of course beginning any military engagement is not something to take lightly. But we also have an opportunity here to do some damage to Iran, and that has to enter the calculus.

    • Dave_A

      In Lybia, there was a tribal rift that could be exploited, resulting in a shadow government & mass military defections once Quadaffi’s grip was loosened…

      Syria is closer to 2002 Iraq, in that the ethnic minority from which Assad hails (Similar to Saddam’s Sunni-Arab ethnicity in Iraq) is heavily represented in the organs of power – the military, security services, etc… To the tune of 70%+. They also know that if Assad falls to anything BUT a US/NATO ground campaign (where we will stay and prevent reprisal attacks in the name of ‘winning the peace’), the Alawite minority will be on the chopping block, and thus their loyalty is a matter of survival.

      This means that action to ‘resolve’ Syria would require a full military commitment, not just the dropping of bombs and/or a ‘no fly zone’…. With no chance of mass defections to a new ‘people’s government’, the only way to win is the way we did in 03…

      While Assad’s army is formidible when they’re shelling rebellious villages off the face of the earth, when faced with conventional combat against a western mechanized force (vis-a-vis the IDF), they have been utterly defeated every time…

      So while it’s militarily doable (using the same forces we withdrew from Iraq no less), politically Obama cannot politically survive starting his own version of Iraq…

      So he sits on his hands, and both allows an ongoing massacre of civilians, and ignores an opportunity to hobble Iran.

    • aesthete

      All the same factors that existed in Libya which all but guaranteed a bloody and inhumane “winning of the peace” on the part of our darling rebels exist in Syria, as well: the Alawite and Christian minorities which have generally done well in Assad’s secular dictatorship will undoubtedly be persecuted by the rebels, who are both thoroughly Muslim and thoroughly p*ssed at those two demographics.

      If it’s another “strategic” war against a power whose WMD capabilities are dubious, I would think that a serious acquisition of nuclear power or a serious nuclear program would have gained Syria more than its current status of sometimes-lackey to Iran.

      Exactly *what* is the aim of intervention in Syria, how many resources are to be dedicated to it, and is there good reason to believe that we can obtain this aim with the resources that we’re willing to expend?

      • spainishirish

        nt

  • wennejunk

    Merely occupying the chair makes you no more a leader than going to church makes one a Christian.

    Great article though.

  • funwithknives

    of Sunnis in the 80′s. He sees that it worked and it took little imagination to think it would fail this time.
    Add in the fact BHO is The Weak Horse in this scenario, and seemingly everyone is now testing our resolve {THANKS BARRY!} and sees us wanting, Russia and China’s Veto was foregone.
    Look to what the PRC is doing in the South China Sea and similar.
    A seemingly injured/cowed animal at the pack’s {or herd’s} edge is always a goner. Our Current Administration’s “Policies”, are black and white proof of this truism.

  • snowshooze

    I have never seen anything so thoughtless and stupid in my entire life. It may get us all killed.
    Things were bad to start with, but to turn it all over to the Muslim Brotherhood is the worst possible move one could make.
    And that is exactly what we are doing.
    How is this going to help? Bombing Isreal off the face of the earth is a good thing?
    Our only friends in the entire region?
    Being friends with the US is looking like the kiss of death.
    Isreal will now have to bomb Iran all by their lonesome.. for two reasons. Self defense, and Self defense.
    First to eliminate the immediate threat, and second, to show they have guts.
    Apparently, we do not.

    • Dave_A

      As good as the IAF is at tactical combat, they don’t have the weapons or the aircraft required to destroy Iran’s nuclear facilities with conventional weapons.

      The heaviest penetration (Aka ‘bunker buster’) bomb that they can deploy, with the heaviest lifting aircraft they have (F-15) is 5,000lbs.

      It’s also the exact weapon that the Iranians built their nuclear facilities to withstand, as it’s a weapon we developed in the 90s to deal with hardened Iraqi bunkers (you know, back when Clinton ‘knew’ Saddam was still making WMD).

      The Iranians watched, learned, and built deeper/stronger…

      So deep, and so strong, that the USAF built a new penetration bomb (Called ‘MOP’ or Massive Ordnance Penetrator), in the 30,000lb range, to deal with Iran. The problem? An F-15 can’t pick it up – hell, not even a B-52 can… The only aircraft WE have that can deploy it, is the B-1B (last I’d heard, they were working on B-2 delivery)… Israel doesn’t have anything like that.

      This is why Israel hasn’t (And won’t) bombed Iran, and has resorted to sabotage and assassination instead… It’s the only card they have to play.

      If Iran is to be stopped, WE will have to do it. And MOP or not, I wouldn’t count on the USAF being able to get it done without ground forces… Iran built their program EXPECTING to be bombed, and it’s too easy to miss ‘just enough’ facilities for them to eek out a bomb or two, when all you have to work with is satellite footage & what you can see from 10,000ft (since we tend to be not-so-good at the ‘spying with actual spies’ business, and overly reliant on electronic intercepts & satellite cameras)….

      • snowshooze

        What goes down doesn’t ever have to come up again.
        Consider it a coffin project.

        • Dave_A

          Requires impeccably precise targeting, perfect intelligence, and requires the Iranians to be dumb enough to not have multiple ways in/out, camouflaged from aircraft observation…

          You’d have to hit every entrance/exit, emergency escape tunnel, and so on…. And do so under fire, in very NOT-stealth aircraft, that are very much vulnerable to radar and IR-guided defensive fire…

          Remember: The IAF doesn’t have B-2s and F-22s (the USAF has retired the original stealth fighter, the F-117)… Their strike aircraft ARE far more vulnerable to SAMs and defending fighters. They’d lose a good number of aircraft & pilots on such a raid (yes, the Iranians would lose more – but that’s small consolation), requiring it to be a first-try success.

          It won’t happen. We are the only ones who can stop Iran.

          • snowshooze

            You do have to know where. Roughly.
            A shock wave of a decent size may cave access in.
            True, they can tunnel miles, and are probably at it still.
            The way Obama launches missiles… I am sure we could carpet bomb half of Iran cheaper than the money he launched at Libya to help instill the Muzlim Brotherhood…
            For a guy that hates the Military, they sure come in handy.
            When you live in a hole in the ground, little things like air all the sudden become a bit more important.
            I don’t think it is as difficult as you portray it.
            However… I am not a Military Man.
            Just happy to make the point that they may be building the most expensive grave known to man.
            I am pretty sure Israel has been considering this with great thought and care.

    • demsaresatanic

      these “Arab Spring” uprisings morph into Muslim Brotherhood winters.

  • andystone

    with Colonel Qaddafi gone, as Mr. Obama routinely reminds us.”

    Qaddafi might have been crazy and nasty, but when we discuss whether the world is a better place we have to also consider the replacement. I don’t think a regime that allows mass torture (>100 people in a single hospital that happened to be monitored) and that can’t control the export of weapons to various Al-Qaeda affiliates is any improvement.

    • Academic Elephant

      To start being sorry Qaddafi is dead. But as I said in the post, once we decided to engage we would have done better to lead from the front and guard against al Qaida encroachment, not to mention bad guys poaching the weapons.

      • andystone

        that a haphazard intervention is worse than no intervention at all. Human rights abuses are as bad as anything Qaddafi did (and that’s saying something), law and order have collapsed, and the international security threat has gone from “none” to “quite worrying”. I see nothing for Obama to brag about here. If the simple killing of dictators solved anything, we’d have won Vietnam in ’63.

      • Dave_A

        ‘Lead from behind’ is the O administration saying ‘Winning the peace is too hard, so we just won’t try’….

        Doing things the ‘old fashioned way’ would not only have been faster and possibly less expensive (cost of several months of air ops, vs cost of 2 weeks of combined air/ground ops), but would have given us some level of influence on the aftermath…

        If you’re not willing to commit to that level, then the inevitable result of a ‘lead from behind’ operation, is a power vaccum & all the disasterous results that come with it…

        • aesthete

          between 2004-2006? Perhaps we just plain suck at forging civil societies through pure military fiat.

          • Dave_A

            Because it was our back-stabbing betrayal of the Shiites in 1991, when we chose the UN over the people of Iraq & ended the first war short of Baghdad, that was largely to blame for that situation…

            Thanks to that idiotic decision, we had to win over a population that fully remembered how we encouraged them to rise up, and left them to be slaughtered when they did. It took until 06 for us to start gaining trust, and for Al Queda (the principle Sunni insurgency was, by that time, a foreign-led campaign to expel us from Iraq and turn the country into the first Al Queda ruled nation-state – they called their fictitious nation-state the ‘Islamic Emirate of Iraq’) to lose it through brutality & Saddam-like dictatorial rule over insurgent-held territory….

            The rest was incredibly poor initial decisions, such as extending ‘de-baathification’ to the working ranks of the Iraqi Army, thus driving them into the open arms of the original (Saddamist) insurgency (I say original, to separate it from the Queda & Iranian-fueled movements that took hold later on)…

            Further, Iraq was a battle between the US and Al Queda – a battle we eventually won…. AQ doesn’t have the resources for another Iraq in Lybia or Syria, largely thanks to what happened to them in Iraq, and what we’ve done to them in Pakistan and Yemen…

            None of the above applies to Libya, where the concern of a ‘proper’ operation would be (A) getting the shooting over with quickly, (B) securing weapons to prevent them from being sold to terror groups, and (C) preventing retaliatory genocide…

            Further, Iraq or anywhere else, it’s far more effective to achive a definitive, ground-based solution, than the ‘drop bombs & make news footage’ strategy of the Clinton era, that Obama is continuing….

          • aesthete

            Ethnic and religious strife only existed in 2004, and in 1991 the Sunnis and Shia were all singing kumbaya by the fireplace. The Kurds have never desired independence and their (rightful, IMO) share of the oil that is so rich in Kurdistan, and resource management would not have presented a problem in 1991. A dissolved Sunni Iraqi army producing well-armed unemployables in a Shi’ite Iraq, “de-Baathification” producing a similar phenomena for experienced civil servants, and marginalized Sunni and Chaldean Christians would never have been problematic in 1991 — only in 2004. Oppressed Shi’ites in 1991 wouldn’t have gone bananas at the prospect of power, and by no means would they have gone full metal Islam. An inexperienced, weak, and emergent Iraqi National Congress would have done just fine managing these (and other) complexities, which took even large, well-financed countries like the US by surprise. Gee, I guess those Iraqis really hated GWB — kind of petty of them to, all of the sudden, have all these proximate causes and deep hatreds that led to the state of affairs from 2004-06.

            The only advantage that I’ll concede vis a vis regime change at an earlier date than 2003 — and it’s a thoroughly Machiavellian advantage, so I doubt you’ll find it such — is that, if we had deposed Saddam following the 1991 uprising, we could have left without the damnable “pottery barn” doctrine being shoved in our face after the inevitable meltdown occurred. I still have no idea what benefit would have accrued from us invading, who would have supported us, or how that would have done anything but further enable Iran (which is reaping dividends from the deposal of a secular, aggressive neighbor in favor of a weak, Shia-majority and religiously-tinged government).

            See, I don’t blame Boooosh for not being the Kwizatz Haderach — I don’t expect a governor with little prior foreign policy experience to predict the future in Iraq or manage a war with great success. I find the idea of the Clinton team (which was quite hawkish about the war) avoiding these problems and managing the war with excellence absolutely ludicrous. I do find fault with fools like Bill Kristol, who — having lived through the experience of unsuccessfully shilling for a continually-deteriorating Iraq — have learned nothing about the experience. They still think that societies bounded by a medieval religion (and not much else), and with very few positive civil institutions, or experiences with secular, democratic governance, are going to do anything but revert to Hobbesian existence when given the chance. It took Europe and the US 500 painful years to go from burning witches to electing them in a Republican primary. Centuries of shared cultural experiences, and hundreds of years of successful cultural and religious traits and taboos, undergird democracies in the developed world. How many failed states must the US taxpayer pay for before the Kristols of the world realize the differences between the Western world (and their pupils in the East) is yet vast? I don’t know about you, but I’m tired of US taxpayers and soldiers babysitting countries with 400 years of barbarism, and no internal desire to change.

          • JSobieski

            and not someone born and living in the ME.

            If the evidence wasn’t clear in 2004, it is clear now:

            Elections in the middle east elevate groups like the Muslim Brotherhood and Hamas.

            There is only one Islamic counter example to that rule, and Turkey is becoming more Islamist every day.

            People who want the state to execute apostates aren’t going to cooperate with an attempt to bring western style government.

            The West always underestimates the influence of strident Jihadists.

            We were surpised that Hamas won elections.

            We were suprised that the Muslim Brotherhood won so many votes in Egypt, and that an even more strident party was #2 in the voting.

            We were surprised that the Libyan rebels had strident Jihadists.

            We were surprised that in the Iranian revolution, the violent Islamists took control, and that western-leaning doctors, lawyers, and other professionals became irrelevant.

            We were surprised that elections in Lebanon became a mechanism for Iranian influence.

            At some point, we would have to be complete idiots to assume anything but a worst case scenario when it comes to ME cultures.

          • aesthete

            when they find that a top-down approach to civil institutions doesn’t work.

            Unsurprisingly, most people don’t change their views on their own civil institution unless pressed to it, or unless they are pre-disposed to reject them due to strong personal conviction. Most of the latter are more open to the idea of immigration or becoming attached to political entities that better match their views (which explains in part why American immigrants from broken countries tend to be superior to their folk back in the mother country). The rest? Well, they don’t change unless pressed to it. Turkey (the high water mark of Islamic-majority democracies) was the result of vigorous, homegrown, and painful secularization on the part of a national hero, Kemal Ataturk, and his followers, and the cultural movements that preceded it. It was borne of the unique situation in Anatolia (which was directly ruled by the Ottomans), and the trade which passed through Constantinople and the rest of Anatolia.

    • aesthete

      against a regime which is not threatening our country, and which abandoned its nuclear program at our urging, is a world where hostile actors and belligerents have a strong incentive to pursue nuclear weapons as a deterrent against such regime change.

      Deposing Gaddafi is a mistake which makes us and our allies unsafe.

      • Dave_A

        Even if we go full-on-Ronulan-appeasment, they will still want nukes for the regional power such weapons bring…

        Such desires are a reason to monitor such regimes & be prepared to remove them BEFORE they get nukes…

        Not a reason to tolerate the existence of evil, where it is in our political, military, or economic interest to destroy it.

        • aesthete

          Your boy Bush was thrilled when Gaddafi abandoned his nuclear program, and cozened to him henceforth. I have many, many criticisms of GWB, but this isn’t one of them: having positive incentives in place for regimes that don’t pursue nuclear proliferation, or that abandon previous attempts at same, is not appeasement — it’s common sense. We understood this in the Cold War, where every bloody-minded despot who aligned himself with the US on foreign policy was supported by us. If we had adopted a high and mighty policy, these tyrants would have had every reason to go scurrying to the Soviet Union, which was more than happy to “spread the wealth”, as it were.

          It is only in this latter day that this policy — a policy which is a “no duh” in a world where we are constrained by limited resources and a mostly hostile world — is seen as foolish, and that invasion in all places and all seasons (something we can ill afford, nevermind implement successfully) is seen as enlightened. It’s no wonder that the Iranian nuclear program has broad support among both the secular and the religious in Iran — if I saw that abandoning a nuclear program didn’t even get Gaddafi’s regime ten years, and that N Korea’s regime (and Pakistan’s sort-of regime) seem to have indefinite shelf lives, I’d be plowing full speed ahead towards getting a nuke, myself, were I an Iranian despot. Creating the incentives to let a thousand Pakistans bloom in the Middle East was ill-conceived.

        • JSobieski

          Being tough on Libya may have made sense when they were trying to develop nukes or were engaged in terrorism.

          Libya did a bunch of things that we wanted, and as a reward we went out of our way to depose Gaddafi.

          The only lesson despots will learn from that is safer to have the US as an enemy.

          Our policies in Libya and Egypt made absolutely no sense. We will also likely find that any good we did in Iraq will be short lived.

          You can’t have a functional democracy in places where a majority of the population believes that apostates should be executed by the state.

          • aesthete

            Over 85% of the newly-elected Egyptian parliament voted to restore the death penalty for apostates.

            Democracy in action, folks.

          • Repair_Man_Jack

            “everyone must get stoned!”

  • moonmad

    -When waiting for some one else to lead you will be surprised when those who end up taking action don’t do what you want

    -It’s the way of the despot to be tough on those who are the smaller non- threat and to ignore threats that are more capable and real.

    - Just when you think you’ve bombed all the holes closed another one will open up. See Monte Casino, Iwo Jima, Peleliu and Chu Chi and others.

  • robobbob

    There is NOTHING happening in Syria that is ANY of Americas business, nor was Libya our problem.
    At what point are conservatives going to wake up to the fact that our ideas of a strong national defense are being used to further the agendas of a bunch of globalists and big corporations, and have been for decades.
    Who benefied from killing Kaddafi? Italian banks who owed him money? European oil companies who were getting Chinese pressure? The central banking system who got to set up shop? The great SAM giveaway? Yet another door opened for al Quida and the MB?
    And now we’re being drug into yet ANOTHER war?
    Stop and ask yourselves. Exactly since when has Obama or Hillary ever done one thing thats in Americas interest? And now they’re demanding action in another far flung, unwinnable, cesspool? The Russians and Chinese have made their positions entirely clear. There is absolutely nothing in Syria that benefits the American people. Do you really think those protests and fighting are spontaneous? Egypt tried rounding up those international NGOers for a reason.
    Think about it conservatives. You are being used. Do not support this war.

  • ariyosef

    The Obama administration for “change” in Mid East,
    and European allies are part of a rather NAIVE
    World Elitist plan to “occupy the Mid East” with
    Western & European Control of OIL.

    HOW can such Brilliant minds overlook ISLAMIC political power and the rapidly re-emerging
    Medo-Persian Empire of Biblical Prophesy?
    Turkey is the final piece of the puzzle!

    The way is being paved for TURKEY &/or IRAN to lead this Final Military Confrontation with the entire Western and Free world.

    Turkey is alone stronger than All Nato combined, excepting only USofA and our forces would not, even now, be sufficient in full conflict BEFORE the all-knowing “messiah BHO” decimates it from within.

    Ultimately, we will be blackmailed and Europe too into turning against ISRAEL after they do what must be done.

    Neville Chamberlain?s Spirit rules today’s Western world politics.
    The spineless will soon capitulate regarding Mid East and Israel,

    Sadly they will really believe they are doing the right thing.

    That is when THE ALMIGHTY ONE of ISRAEL will intervene…
    but only saving a REMNANT of Humanity….
    as we all learn
    whether living or dying…
    that
    Only the ONE Creator, rules as GOD of this Universe.

    Scripture is clear: in that day ” All will know that I AM is God.”

  • ariyosef

    ADL’s Abraham Foxman, was reported in NEWSMAX today as saying:

    Turkey and Israel: ?Turkey?s relationship with Israel has gone from the example of a Muslim country being able to relate to both sides to one where I believe [Prime Minister Recep] Erdogan is playing a role to become a leader of the Muslim world.

    ?That has already undermined the Turkish-Israeli relationship. It may undermine the NATO relationship. If Turkey continues to build its relationshipwith Iran, how can the United States share its codes, its secrets with a NATO ally when there is a possibility it may be handed over to our enemies??

    Read more on Newsmax.com: ADL’s Foxman: Obama Has ‘Improved,’ But Iran Situation ‘Serious’

  • kenchely

    Muammar Qaddafi was an outcast; nobody really wanted to have to deal with him. Even the terrorists didn’t like him because he was unpredictable; one day he would give them bombs, the next he would round them up and shoot them.

    Assad, on the other hand, has serious allies, namely Russia and Iran. They will not sit by quietly if we intervene in Syria. To be sure, they won’t send combat troops to fight us. Russia doesn’t want a straight-out war with us, and Iran doesn’t want one yet. Instead, they’ll retaliate with something else somewhere else. That’s what the administration is afraid of.

  • zeprin

    Just who decided that the poor innocents on the receiving end of Assad’s wrath are ‘The Good Guys’?
    While Assad is a brutal thug. He is also a SECULAR brutal thug.
    Who see’s his mission to keep the radical Islamists in their place and away from the throats of his fellow Alawites, Baathist’s the Arab Christians, the Druze and the Ba-aha’i and all of the other religious and ethnic minorities.
    This ‘Poor, honest Peasantry’, that is being shelled, is the home of the Muslim Brotherhood, Al Quida and all the other poisonous Islam Uber Alles groups. So who decided these are the Good Guys that need our Blood and TreaSURE?

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