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EDITOR OF REDSTATE

The GOP Loss In New York Was About New York, Not Paul Ryan

By: Erick Erickson (Diary)  |  May 24th, 2011 at 10:23 PM  | 

RESIZE: AAA

Republicans suck in New York. Period. End of Story.

The GOP lost the special election in NY-26 and the media and Democrats are heralding it as proof that the GOP is getting punished for wanting to reform medicare.

Back when the GOP lost the 2009 special election in New York featuring Dede Scozzafava, et al, the Democrats heralded the GOP defeat as proof that Republican opposition to Obamacare and being the “Party of No” was a clear sign that the Democrats were right on the agenda and the GOP’s obstruction of Barack Obama would be punished by the voters.

That was before the GOP went on to win the Virginia and New Jersey gubernatorial races and pick up Ted Kennedy’s (!!!!) seat in Massachusetts.

To say that this special election defeat of the GOP is a repudiation of the GOP’s efforts on Medicare is laughable on its face.

The truth of the matter is that the Republican Party of New York sucks and has sucked for a while. It is especially terrible at special elections where the out of touch party leaders pick state legislators who everyone hates and runs them.

Jane Corwin is a sitting member of the NY State Legislature, just like Jim Tedisco, just like Dede Scozzafava, and she was handpicked by the party elders. Notice a trend?

When the GOP made major gains in New York State in 2010 they did so by avoiding like the plague Republican members of the state legislature, including a “retired FBI agent, retired colonel, eye doctor, businessman, small town mayor, and an attorney.”

The public is furious at the New York state legislature — both parties — for refusing to pass Governor Andrew Cuomo’s property tax cap, ethics reform and other Christie/Walker/Daniels-style reforms. (The tax cap may finally have broken through just today). Cuomo’s been barnstorming the state for his agenda.

Cuomo cut an ad for Hochul. Hochul’s been blasting Corwin for not supporting Cuomo’s agenda, which amounts to running to Corwin’s right on spending. See here, here, here, and here.

Jane Corwin was not a good candidate, in terms of coming off as too country club for a blue-collar district hit hard by the perennial collapse of the upstate economy. She was not helped by the tea party candidate in the race who had been decisively repudiated by tea party activists. Her baggage was made worse by her legislative career.

Certainly the Democrats made Paul Ryan‘s medicare plan an issue, and certainly it was not hugely popular. But to say that is why Corwin was defeated is spin devoid of fact. Ultimately, for those who think this was a rejection of the GOP’s medicare reform efforts, they’ll have to explain who the GOP candidate and the Tea Party candidate combined got more votes than the Democrat.

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COMMENTS

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  • izoneguy

    The democrats are so afraid of the government cheese running out they see democrats as the only hope for a few more months or years to suck on the government teet. Once it runs dry they will flock to Mass or Jersey and suck what is left there. Just don’t come to Texas.

  • sandbun

    I’m guess that’s what they’ll say when people mention that he and Corwin got more voted when you combine their votes.

    At this point I’m mostly curious what the exit polling will tell us.

  • gekster

    and give them to Corwin, that alone turns the vote deficet from x- to x+.
    I wonder how much the Dems paid Davis to run a loosing campaign.

  • kinghenry

    Jack Davis was one of them:

    http://dailypaul.com/163685/vote-jack-davis-for-congress-may-24th-ron-rand-paul-influenced

  • lukematthews

    This is their gameplan for next year. They will run faux Tea Party, confuse issues, use dirty tricks, hide behind the media, and smear, baby smear us. They’ll use appearance and perception as their smog of war.

  • Kyle-MI

    If Hochul had gotten above 50% then it would have been a clear message of disapproval of the Ryan Medicare plan. If she had won in the low 40′s you could argue it wasn’t about Medicare. If the numbers hold out at about 48%, the message is muddled. It will still make some of the squishy GOP pols nervous. Hochul invested a lot of money attacking Corwin on the Medicare issue. I don’t think we can completely ignore it. We need to be prepared to deal with this in 2012.

  • http://www.usdebateboard.com usdebateboard

    This and the Dede disaster was just what the doctor ordered to force the party to look inward and get ready for bigger and better battles. Democrats can game special elections, but they can’t bankroll 870 candidates (one Democrat and one Tea Party imposter) in all 435 Congressional races,

    Losing stinks, but there are never any expectations in the northeast for Republicans, and Republicans have to live and learn about letting Democrats run to the right of them. Scott Brown is teeing up just this sort of doom, methinks.

    And you can’t let Newt off the hook for the timing of his little fart in the car. He’s a campaign commercial for any Democrat taker now.

  • kinghenry

    all they have to do is get some far-left anti-war zealot to go “Tea Party”, say a bunch of nice things about Ron and Rand Paul and endorse Paul for President and a fraction of the Tea Party will vote this candidate, splitting the vote and giving elections to Dems.

    Thats pretty much exactly what just happened in Buffalo

  • http://www.usdebateboard.com usdebateboard

    with murky or easily obfuscated political connections.

    A Donald Trump mini me in 435 districts to claim loyalty to the Tea Party and split the vote.

  • kinghenry

    businessman, who courted the Paulnuts and other gullibles getting the Dem elected. Checkout the ronpaulforums link above on this one.

    Eric Dondero reported this a month ago or so on LibertarianRepublican.net also

  • http://www.usdebateboard.com usdebateboard

    in protecting its brand, IMHO.

  • http://www.usdebateboard.com usdebateboard

    when it came to defining her opponent on Medicare.

  • kinghenry

    Willaim F. Buckley and Goldwater blackballed Paul’s idol, Murray Rothbard and the Birchers out of the GOP to pave way for a Ronald Reagan to get elected.

    We are doing the exact opposite this time around, Paul should’ve been kicked out long ago. There are irreconcilable differences between Conservatives and Anarchist(what Paul really is). Paul’s closest intellectual ally, Lew Rockwell, considers the Constitution to be a Statist Document and wants to go back to the “Articles of Confederation”, Paul is putting a political face on these underlying views. Some are gobbling his views, and demonization of Conservative Republicans. Especially on college campuses.

  • rightwardmarch

    At the finish line, Jack Davis had no impact on this race. Realize that as Davis’ support melted away over the past few weeks it went as much or more to Hochul than it did to Corwin.

    And Erick, I’m not sure how closely you paid attention to this campaign, but ignoring the importance of the Medicare message here is a huge mistake! The messaging from the Hochul campaign was exclusively about Medicare over the past month. Sure, there were NY specific issues – but if people didn’t attend campaign rallies then they weren’t hearing about them. And unfortunately, its hard to take away anything from these results than the effectiveness of that strategy.

    The “save Medicare” message was electorally potent last election to a degree many don’t appreciate, stemming from the Obamacare debate. Medicare reform is good, but that is not what the public is hearing right now about the Ryan plan. This is a big problem, and ignoring it won’t make it disappear!

  • kinghenry

    more than enough to swing it, all the Dems need in alot of these races

  • http://www.usdebateboard.com usdebateboard

    would be for Republican tastemakers walking back Ryan’s plan even more after this. Some will. Then there will be the smell of blood in the water.

  • Doc Holliday

    We were supposed to have a single tea party in opposition to Obamas statism. It was supposed to be like the Boston Tea Party. I guess people don’t understand that the word “party” has several meanings, and they chose the wrong one.

    So instead of getting less government, we just get another political machine, but one as broken as the Greens, LIbertarians, and Socialists. It seems to me the so called Tea Party is just a way for outcasts to try to be leaders. They spend as much time arguing with each other over who is “IN CHARGE” as they do screwing up Republicans in elections.

  • http://www.usdebateboard.com usdebateboard

    Think of Sean Connery bloodied and crawling on the floor of his apartment in The Untouchables.

    “What are you willing to do?”

  • undaunted1711

    didn’t the craigslist guy win something like 76-24 just a while back? And I thought we were pouring a ton of dough into the race? what happened – where were the red voters? what a bummer

  • http://www.AmericanThinker.com Hammer2008

    First, this was not NY-23, otherwise elite GOPers, like former Speaker Newt Gingrich, etc. would have endorsed the faux Tea Party candidate the way they had Dede Scofazza in 2009.

    Second, what’s the arch-lesson here? Welcome to the big-leagues Tea Party? Considering the oddity of NY candidates being able to run on multiple party lines, why did not the ‘R’ in this race, thus challenging both liberals?

    Do not let another fox in the hen house, just sayin’…

  • rightwardmarch

    Davis’ supporters (he was at nearly 30% at one point) defected to Hochul over Corwin.

    If you just see “Tea party” you might think he represents only lost Republican votes. That is not the case. If he was gone, his supporters go evenly to Hochul and Corwin (at best).

    It is tempting to see this as a Jack Davis special. It isn’t, and for the sake of the Republican majority (and Senate majority *fingers crosses*) we shouldn’t pretend that it was.

  • onemovoter

    If the person running isn’t firm in their support for the party message then the voters who would normally come out for a strong candidate, won’t come out for a weak candidate who won’t stick up for what voters believe in principally. To blame a 3rd candidate for siphoning off votes only shows the weakness of the primary candidate’s support.

    Party insiders and “elitists” who think they know better will eventually fail, just like central planners fail at running an economy of people. Having a long primary contest like the one for President, is actually a good thing in that it shows who can go the distance. Yes politics is brutal and full of backstabbing folks in all parties to a degree, but being able to withstand such strengthens the final candidate. Hence, hand picked candidates usually fail.

  • Doc Holliday

    we can keep trying to explain reality to them, but we can’t MAKE them understand it. Our Founders created a system that RELIES on an educated public, something we do not have. Until we fix public greed and stupidity, our message will always be risky.

    Reagan said “Trust but verify”, and I say “I will trust in the American people to do the right thing in the end, but I will keep buying gold and Swiss Francs just to be sure”.

  • schteve

    Unless you’re seriously suggesting that 100% of Davis voters had Corwin as their second choice, his presence isn’t as impactful as you’re implying.

  • SKully

    The turning point in polls was a horrific attempt by Corwin’s chief of staff to corner Davis in a parking lot, which got a LOT of air time. Corwin skirted this and it was obvious. Repub leaders plastered the video online within MINUTES … and it backfired.
    Another reason this was predicted to be a loss in FEBRUARY… Repub leaders hand-picked Corwin immediately after the Lee scandal, not listening to the shouts for rank and file input. They were almost begging for Davis to get in on the race.
    Also – many were turned off by the Corwin’s negative ads. Lots of them, many from outside the area.
    Medicare was the Dem’s trumpet, but it did not matter as much as national pundit would have you think. NY Republican party leadership sucks!

  • Paul Seale

    It had everything to do with Davis and internal politics.

    There were enough mad TEA party individuals who felt they needed to teach the GOP a lesson over the initial selection process that they decided to vote for Davis.

    That is a fact.

    I fear this will be the mold Democrats use for 2012. There are plenty of people who are dumb (yes, I said dumb) enough to believe the line and vote for the 3rd party.

  • Paul Seale

    The news cast was an attack piece on Corwin. Davis got off scott free after assaulting the camera guy.

    If it was Corwin assaulting the tracker do you think the media would have asked given her snow ball questions allowing her to explain her side of the story without even asking about the assault part?

  • Doc Holliday

    “suck”. We still have a problem when the electorate prefers Democrat statists. It seems to me Repubs in New York and PA have to basically do everything perfectly in order to defeat a Democrat statist. So, should we at least wonder why this is the case and why the people there are so touchy? I mean, if people really want liberty, I don’t think they would sacrifice it so easily.

    summation: the problem lies with the people too.

  • http://www.usdebateboard.com usdebateboard

    A permanent minority seemed like a pretty good gig to him.

  • rightwardmarch

    NY-26ers know who Jack Davis is, he’s the guy that ran in NY-26 as the Dem candidate in 2004/2006/2008!! You think true Tea Party supporters were tripping over themselves to vote for that guy!? And that Tea partiers then left Jack for the Dem Hochul, as his supporters in polls did – Davis supporters defected more to Hochul than Corwin over the past month?

    There were enough mad TEA party individuals who felt they needed to teach the GOP a lesson over the initial selection process that they decided to vote for Davis…That is a fact.

    Uh huh… on second thought, no. I’ll admit that national politics probably look a little different here in NY than they do in more conservative friendly parts of the country. But I also know this, NY Republican votes for Boehner over Pelosi count just as much as those from every other state, and we just lost one and should understand why.

  • rightwardmarch

    NY-26ers know who Jack Davis is, he’s the guy that ran in NY-26 as the Dem candidate in 2004/2006/2008!! You think true Tea Party supporters were tripping over themselves to vote for that guy!? And that Tea partiers then left Jack for the Dem Hochul, as his supporters in polls did – Davis supporters defected more to Hochul than Corwin over the past month?

    There were enough mad TEA party individuals who felt they needed to teach the GOP a lesson over the initial selection process that they decided to vote for Davis…That is a fact.

    Uh huh… on second thought, no. I’ll admit that national politics probably look a little different here in NY than they do in more conservative friendly parts of the country. But I also know this, NY Republican votes for Boehner over Pelosi count just as much as those from every other state, and we just lost one and should understand why.

  • Kyle-MI

    If Davis’ supporters were Dem and you add them to the Dems who voted for Hochul, then how do you explain a Republican winning this seat just last Nov? Where did those GOP votes go? It seems more likely that they split between Davis and Corwin then that the Dems split between Davis and Hochul.

  • silentcal2012

    The one place where the conservative party split and formed its own party. The one place that bought into the constant chorus of Republicans sucking so bad. Why would anyone vote for a Republican, they would just sell everyone out and probably vote for that awful John Boehner. To the hell with Republicans, “real” conservatives should start their own party and be just like NY. It works so well.

  • Joe Cor

    If she really was, that shows the astoundingly low political I.Q. that Republicans still posess. Who would expect the Democrats to do anything but demagogue the Medicare issue? What has been the Democrat default position for 40 years but lies and smears and personal attacks? Yet every time this happens, it seems the Republicans have no clue this is going to happen, and no strategy and even less desire to push back against it. Republican cluelessness is appalling and mind-boggling, and is a tremendous threat to our republic.

  • bigredone

    Rand Paul is my Senator, and he is not the same as his father. In the case of governance, the apple falls far from the tree.

    Rand Paul is incorruptible. It is as simple as that.

  • goodforall

    What is failed to be considered is that a third person ran as a Tea Party canidate and got 9% of the vote (which would gone to the republican). Give that to the republican and the dems lose! I also looked at Obamas plan and his proposal is much harder on medicare and goes into effect quicker than Ryans proposal, but the media simply ignors that quite conveniently. Face it, it’s us versus them and they will never tell the truth when it favors republicans.

  • goodforall

    What is failed to be considered is that a third person ran as a Tea Party canidate and got 9% of the vote (which would gone to the republican). Give that to the republican and the dems lose! I also looked at Obamas plan and his proposal is much harder on medicare and goes into effect quicker than Ryans proposal, but the media simply ignors that quite conveniently. Face it, it’s us versus them and they will never tell the truth when it favors republicans.

  • dajeeps

    Her campaign was a mess. She got distracted by Davis, whom she should have just let the Tea Party deal with, and could not strongly articulate a message of reform. To me, she just looked confused and defensive.

    And about NY: Republicans here, the real ones do not suck, and have tried to get in, but the RINO statists have a monopoly that is not easy to crack. State law is no help either, as it does not allow primaries for special elections. The only way to have a choice is to run a different candidate on a 3rd party line.

    And about that, I would not be surprised if Jack Davis had been bankrolled by Democrats in order to split the reform-mided voters.

  • steve010

    doesn’t matter which party; remember Martha what’s her name in mass. who ran against Scott Brown. Also special elections don’t mean much, two really great reps won in special elections in HI and LA, only to get trounced in the normal election cycle.

  • garhighway4

    …Paladino win this district in the last gubernatorial race?

    That would seem to indicate that the district is “bad-candidate-proof”, since Carl was the candidate from hell and these people voted for him.

    Over-interpreting this election would be a mistake, I agree. But so would under-interpreting it.

  • ciscoguy

    He?/she?d probably pull in more votes than the Democrat.

  • gunslingr45

    That was before the GOP went on to win the Virginia and New Jersey gubernatorial races and pick up Ted Kennedy?s (!!!!) seat in Massachusetts.

    Sorry, but Brown turned out to be a RINO also. Maybe not the liberal that Ted was, but still a RINO.

  • pdawk

    I think some of you underestimate how strong the entitlement culture is amongst senior citizens. The only thing most of the care about is getting medical coverage until they die. What happens to medicare (and our economy) after that is irrelevant to them. It is the same theory as NIMBY. Senior want the government out of their lives and to pay off the debt so long as it doesn’t effect them in any way.

    This issue would have been better to handle if we had control of both houses of congress and the presidency. Probably would have been a bloodbath with seniors killing folks at the next midterm but it would be for the good of the country.

    Of course, a ton of this has been on the inability to sell the issue to the American public. The easiest thing to do in this world is to explain why something won’t work. We have to take on the heavy lifting and explain to seniors why it is the only choice to save our country from financial ruin.

  • pdawk

    A conservative was never going to win that seat. People need to accept that in certain areas (Mass., Vermont, Rhode Island, etc.) it is better to have a RINO that will vote with you 80% of the time than a liberal who will vote against you 100% of the time.

  • ciscoguy

    I somewhat agree with rightwardmarch.

    The reality is, when you?re selling the American people the hard truth, and the other guy?s message is that you?re over blowing the problem, it?s going to be a tough sell. This is why, for all his flaws, Chris Christie would be our best option. He can sell this kind of plan, maybe even better than Ryan can.

    This is not to say we can?t or won?t win with a Romney/Pawlenty/Huntsman (because Ryan?s plan is still going to be the Democrat line of attack, whether or not they endorse the plan in total or in part). The economy is still in shambles, and that will probably be number 1 on their list. But this will almost be certainly number 2 and number 1 for many others. I don?t think this issue is ever going to be a net positive for us on the campaign trail, but if we?re going to go down, this is the hill to die on.

    One thing I do know is that if we don?t have someone who can articulate and defend the plan, we?re going to be in trouble. The GOP needs to prepare to hit back hard. Obama has already started to assemble his Medicare death panel. The public needs to be made aware of this. Obamacare stole half a trillion out of Medicare. They need to be reminded of this too.

    To be fair, I don?t know that this election is completely instructive. A Tuesday in May in a non-election year, in a 3-way race in which the outgoing GOP congressman was having craigslist affairs is not exactly a recipe for victory, but I think we?d be foolish not to get any takeaways from this.

  • kinghenry

    including the Paulist at the link above, and he’s in position to takeover the ‘movement’ and cash donations.

    We’ll find out alot more about Rand Paul when he endorses his Father and then Campaigns for him this year, by extension supporting his dads policies over Conservatives in the race.

    He did afterall do exactly this in 2007/2008 for his dad, adopting wild conspiracy theories and the “blowback” theory. Stuff he ran far away from last yr to get elected.

  • kinghenry

    in 2008, Jack Davis gave this seat to the Dems and created this media narrative.

  • ihateliberals

    I have to part with you on this one. I am a life long Conservative and I have never ever voted for a Democrat nor will I ever but if the GOP insist that they have to do something with Medicare this time around i am afraid the 2012 vote is going to go for the Democrats. I myself just won’t vote as many other seniors I know will do. There are many things that need to be fixed but worrying about medicare in this election cycle is stupid. The Debt is non-issue when you talk about cutting more of my money. i paid into Social Security and medicare alll of my working life. This is not something that is a give away it is mine i own it, i paid for it. I am on Social Security disability and medicare and i am just barely making it if you want to call it that. As long as we are sending Billions of dollars of Foreign Aid out of the country don’t come talking to me about cutting Medicare. or Soc Sec. If paul Ryan continues to harp about medicare he had better be talking about stopping Foreign Aid first.

    The Debt and Deficit arre big numbers. the Debt especially is not and issue because it can never be fixed. If we stopped all spending and I mean cutting the spending we are doing right now and devoted every penny to the Debt it would take 300 years to pay it off. that means that no matter what we do it can’t be fixed. That makes it a non-issue. The deficit is an issue in that it directly affects the ability of our companies to create jobs and get the economy going. We have to get our economy moving before we can worry about any other in the World. Each day the government borrows $16 billion plus some. I am sick and tired of Social Security and medicare being portrayed as Cost. it is not cost it is money that I have paid into the system. It’s not my fault the politicians can’t mange it. if they woul dkeep thiere hands off of it and allow it to draw interest as originally planned we wouldn’t be in this fix. Now do you still think that medicare isn’t going to be an issue in the 2012 elections? believe me it wilt be. alleged great thinkers are passing the NY election off to Quirky new yorkers. I would believe tht if it hadn’t been for the fact this district has been Red since Lincoln was president. this is not a fluke and the GOP had better listen up. they have Pi$$ed off the conservatives anow they are about to do the same to the seniors. if the seniors vote for the Democrats or don’t vote at all then the 2012 wil be a shoe in for the Democrats.

  • YnotNOW

    Sure, every patient knows when they are overweight, but would rather diet on “some other meal” and get some drugs to alleviate the symptoms. It is just too hard to face the real issue and go through the pain and effort to actually get healthy.

    Same with Medicare – many will refuse to face the issue that Medicare is bankrupt and dragging down the economy. They will try to get someone else to pay for it. Refuse to reform or reduce their own benefits – always take it from someone else.

  • YnotNOW

    Sure, every patient knows when they are overweight, but would rather diet on “some other meal” and get some drugs to alleviate the symptoms. It is just too hard to face the real issue and go through the pain and effort to actually get healthy.

    Same with Medicare – many will refuse to face the issue that Medicare is bankrupt and dragging down the economy. They will try to get someone else to pay for it. Refuse to reform or reduce their own benefits – always take it from someone else.

  • YnotNOW

    The Social Security Trust Fund does not exist: http://www.redstate.com/ynotnow/2011/04/04/the-myth-of-the-social-security-trust-fund/
    All of the money you paid into the system was for current retirees at that time – what you receive now is due to a promise from current workers. Us workers intend to keep that promise, but that promise has limits.

    Medicare does not even have that fig leaf: Medicare taxes and the “trust fund” pay for only a portion of “Medicare Part A”. Part B, C and D are totally paid from general revenues – TAXES. You did not “earn” it, it is a promise from future generations to provide for your needs. Again, we intend to keep that promise, but the promise has limits. In particular, the system needs to be reformed so that we can actually CONTINUE to keep the promise in 10 or 15 years.

    This entitlement mentality that “I own it” and “I deserve it” needs to face reality.

  • YnotNOW

    The Social Security Trust Fund does not exist: http://www.redstate.com/ynotnow/2011/04/04/the-myth-of-the-social-security-trust-fund/
    All of the money you paid into the system was for current retirees at that time – what you receive now is due to a promise from current workers. Us workers intend to keep that promise, but that promise has limits.

    Medicare does not even have that fig leaf: Medicare taxes and the “trust fund” pay for only a portion of “Medicare Part A”. Part B, C and D are totally paid from general revenues – TAXES. You did not “earn” it, it is a promise from future generations to provide for your needs. Again, we intend to keep that promise, but the promise has limits. In particular, the system needs to be reformed so that we can actually CONTINUE to keep the promise in 10 or 15 years.

    This entitlement mentality that “I own it” and “I deserve it” needs to face reality.

  • uselogic

    The faux Tea Party ploy might work in traditionally Blue districts and states but will probably have none in traditional Red or split areas. The Dems and Alan Grayson tried that here in Florida and they got their patoots handed to them.

  • uselogic

    “little success” rather than “none”, above

  • uselogic

    “little success” rather than “none”, above

  • Bill S

    Read This Post:

    http://www.redstate.com/ben_domenech/2011/05/25/saving-medicare-visualized/

    and watch the video.

    Then, you need a reality check on the federal budget.

    Look here

    Note table S-3. Note that as of 2013, Medicare is larger than the ENTIRE DISCRETIONARY BUDGET (exclusive of defense). Cutting foreign aid is like cutting Starbucks out of your personal budget – you MIGHT see the difference, but odds are it won’t put a dent in your personal financial problems.

    Will addressing the Medicare and Social Security problems (and they ARE problems – your portrayal of it as “your money” is laughable) cause issues for the GOP in 2012? Yeah, probably. But the alternative is to back down and look like a bunch of hypocrites who only pay lip service to the biggest single fiscal problem this nation is faced with. The alternative is to let the Democrats do it, and you know darned well what their answer will be: jack up taxes to heights never before seen.

    I’ll take Ryan’s plan, thank you.

  • garhighway4

    … being contemptuous of the electorate is not a good blueprint for electoral success. They don’t like that.

    Just sayin’.

    Plus: what’s up with the double posting?

  • Flagstaff

    what else could you think? The key sentence from Erick above is “they?ll have to explain [why] the GOP candidate and the Tea Party candidate combined got more votes than the Democrat.”

    Why do you think the Democrats dug up this guy to run on a “tea party” ticket? To split the Republican-conservative vote.

    I’m sure there were some anti-incumbent votes for the TP guy, but even so, it doesn’t mean support for the Democrat agenda.

    This could end up hurting the Dems a lot if the proper blowback occurs when the TP voters realize that a number was done on them.

  • Flagstaff

    It explains a lot. It’s time to bring back “he who must not be named.”

    As a Tea Party participant myself, I recognize the symptoms in the article: “Throw-out-the-baby-with-the-bathwater” nutjobs. G-d idiots. So you now have a Democrat in the House. I wonder how that will work out for you.

  • ihateliberals

    is that wha tyou say maybe right and actually i don’t disagree with what you say about the trust fund for Social Security etc. BUT and that is a Big But the reality of the matter is that right now for this 2012 election it is not the right time to piss off the seniors. They can and will turn this election into a fiasco for the Republicans. many Seniors are on the Independents list of voters and will swing their vote from left to right in a heart beat. The trught of the matter is that I paid into a system that said I would get X-Dollars out of it. How that was to happen was not my choice as it wasnot my choice to be forced into a failing system. here I am 45 years later and i have to rely on that system for my livelihood because Obama crashed my nest egg I had in housing and staock market investments. So yes i still feel like I am owed back what I was promised by the system. Now if medicare and social Security were to be reformed without affecting the already retired persons that type of reform would fly high with the Seniors and would gain their support. Messing with me after I’m retired is going to give the republicans hell. That’s not just a fact that’s a promise. Right or wrong messing with Seniors is going to cause the Republicasn to lose big time.

  • ihateliberals

    I have news for you i wasn’t old when I was forced to pay into the Social security system and then later on the medicare system. I agree absolutely the these programs are huge problems and need to be fixed but it isn’t fair to penalize those of us who are already on the system and depend on it for our livelihood. Regardless of whether you are right or wrong that money needs to continue to flow to us that have earned it. It is our money and I’m sorry you are the nes that have to keep feeding it to us. The Congress were big thieves when they dissolved the Trust fund and stole my money. Noe the Government still owes me for it. If reform is to come to these programs it can’t come form those that are already using the systems. There has to be a cut off. At some point the youths that are coming into the workforce should have an alternative to the Social Security and medicare programs. Actually not another work under the age of 50 should rely on the tow system or be forced to participate in the systems. That would ultimately fix the problem and not piss off the seniors. Belive me wheni tell you tht we may be kind of quiet but we can be very noise and when we get tht way you need to stay ou=t of our way. If enough seniors vote for the Democrats or don’t vote at all they could swing an election from Republican to Democrat real fast. Don’t forget that I didn’t disagree the systems ned to be fixed but trying to do it now during this 2012 cycle is the wrong time to do it. there aren’t enough young voters to make up for the lost of us old Farts.

  • Bill S

    you’d see that the bulk of these proposals excludes those who are in the programs already or are of age to transition in shortly.

    I’ll bet you a dollar you didn’t even read what I posted. Look at the budget. Cuts like you’re suggesting will accomplish nothing. The only way to put the fiscal house in order is to dramatically cut entitlement spending OR institute a massive tax increase.

  • http://ElectTheRightCandidate.US etrc

    Medicare and SS are 3rd rails of politics. Touch them and you die. Ryan’s Medicare reform is telling future Congresses how to vote. This is stupid. The Republicans ran on cutting more that $100 dollars. This is where they should focus.

  • schteve

    candidates got more combined votes than the first place candidate because that almost always happens in a three-way race.

    But you’re kidding yourself if you think every single Davis vote was as good as a Corwin vote. In the last poll taken before the election, a quarter of Davis supporters were Democrats. Are they all going to prefer the Republican candidate over the Democratic one, especially when the Democratic candidate had more Republican support than the Republican candidate had Democratic support? Let’s be realistic here.

    Look, it might suck that she lost, but she would have lost just the same had Davis not ran. In fact, I would wager that Corwin would have lost by an even *larger* margin had Davis not run; Davis’s declining support as the campaign went on accompanied a greater gain by Hochul, hinting that Davis voters were more likely than not to prefer her over Corwin.

  • ihateliberals

    Problem is that information isn’t getting out. getting out. The Democrats aren’t saying it and the GOP isn’t make it a big issue. The Seniors I know have the perception that they will be affected. Perception is just as good as reality. If that is what they think when they go to the polls the truth won’t help. The GOP needs to make sure that the message of who the fixes will affect gets out there. otherwise they may as well pull up the stakes and take the tent home.

  • ihateliberals

    for medicare. what I didn’t say there is i know that the plan won’t affect mcuh of the already retired people. But that is my point exavtly. Most retired people i know and I know quite a few think they will be directly affected. They thnk the the cuts will take money form them. They don[t kow becasue they ahven’ tread Ryan’s plan. The GOP isn’t dong a good job of letting seniors know what the Ryan plan is all about. the Democrats aren’t going to do it. They want the seniors to believe they are going to lose benefits. If the seniors don’t have this fact pounded into their heads the truth isn’t going to matter when they pull that lever in 2012. GOP we can’t keep overlooking the obvious. You keep Harping about the fact that reform has to occur but you leave out how that reformis gong to happen. The Democrts love it. and the GOP even when they hear the lie bign told don’t raise up in arms and make the correction. Not all seniors are tied into the internet or even the news they only know what they ahve jeard from others and it the rumors aren’t stopped in time 2012 is going to be Custer’s last stnd all over again.

  • ihateliberals

    he got mad at the Republicans and deliberately ran to split the vote. He didn’t care that it cost the good guys the election. The Democrats have to be loving the Tea Party. If Boehner keeps it up the Tea Party is going to run as a third party and bingo 4 more years of Obama.

  • mutantone

    That the supposed Tea Party Candidate was in fact a democrat, running as a Republican under the Tea Party banner just to make sure that the votes were split to allow the democrat to win, this is the ploy that will be showing up in all the coming elections. Be sure that you study the history of the candidates,and vote based on the truth not just because they are in a certain party, the wolves are in sheep’s clothing to scatter the flock.

  • TxCon

    through his own actions. The assist goes to his supporters in previous elections who, for some reason, stayed home yesterday.

  • David123

    5 x 5 – excellent post. Also the Ryan Plan doesn’t change medicare for those over 55, but as you correctly point out that fact isn’t well-publicized.

    http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0511/55477.html

    Social Security and Medicare have been growing problems for a long time and fixing them has to be a gradual long-term process as well.

  • calamityjune

    I wonder how much Davis accepted from the demos to split the vote. I wonder how man tp’ers are going to split votes. This has got to stop!

  • chief1356

    as part of tea party,i know no tea party activists who thought Davis had support of or was part of tea party. Davis hated Republican Party.Ran previously as Democrat. Corwin was an establishment candidate who was terrible on the stump.
    Another opportunity lost not by Tea Party but inept NY Republican Party.

  • YnotNOW

    Because under the Ryan plan, anyone over 55 is guaranteed EXACTLY THE SAME as what they currently have. That is why the “throw grandma off the cilff” scare-mongering is such a total lie.

    The fact is, that the system needs to be reformed for FUTURE retirees (under the Ryan plan, this is gradually phased in for those under 55), so that we can have the same promise as you do.

    If we do nothing, then the system will go bankrupt in 12 years (and that is assuming that the “trust fund” will be able to cash out from US Taxpayers), and no one will be able to keep the promise to you, me, or anyone.

    That is the message to seniors – who I agree are very much up for grabs in the next election. Education needs to be accurate and thorough.

  • YnotNOW

    Because under the Ryan plan, anyone over 55 is guaranteed EXACTLY THE SAME as what they currently have. That is why the “throw grandma off the cilff” scare-mongering is such a total lie.

    The fact is, that the system needs to be reformed for FUTURE retirees (under the Ryan plan, this is gradually phased in for those under 55), so that we can have the same promise as you do.

    If we do nothing, then the system will go bankrupt in 12 years (and that is assuming that the “trust fund” will be able to cash out from US Taxpayers), and no one will be able to keep the promise to you, me, or anyone.

    That is the message to seniors – who I agree are very much up for grabs in the next election. Education needs to be accurate and thorough.

  • Flagstaff

    It does appear that Davis was the “Ron Paul candidate,” unless that’s a red herring too.

    In any event, the third party collecting that much of the vote makes the results a bit harder to analyze than would a two-person race.