« BACK  |  PRINT

RS

EDITOR OF REDSTATE

So What’s the Deal With the Deal

By: Erick Erickson (Diary)  |  August 1st, 2011 at 08:35 AM  | 

RESIZE: AAA

Here’s the deal — I think we should hold out till after August 3rd because I think August 2nd is an imaginary deadline.

I likewise think the super committee is going to raise taxes — and raise them in a big way.

Also, I’m convinced the GOP is lying to itself on this plan.

All that said, we’re not going to get a better deal now. The GOP is scared of its own shadow. At least, however, at least . . . at least we may get some real entitlement reform.

Lastly, the tears of the left on this are delicious. For that alone, I want to support this deal. But because of the foregoing reasons, I can’t support this deal. However, it could be worse.

Were I in Congress, I’d vote against it. All that said, I think this is it, so we might as well get used to it. Just keep track of who on the right votes against it. They’ll be the real heroes.

If we get lucky, it goes down and we fight on. Just don’t hold your breath on that one.

And, in a moment of personal honesty, I have a hard time disliking something Emmanuel Cleaver calls a “sugar coated Satan sandwich.” That sounds so delicious.

Tags:

COMMENTS

POSTING RULES  |  LOGIN TO COMMENT  |  REGISTER TODAY
  • mkozikowski

    the day before Obama’s 50th birthday.
    I am sure this day was picked so he can have his $50K dollar a plate B’Day party/fund raiser with a clear conscious

    .

  • http://www.dhancock.com dhancock

    Arguing the date that the next limit will expire admits a very depressing failing – whatever they raise it to we will be passing it again in the near future.

  • http://todaysasbestos.wordpress.com scotteiland

    when he remarked that Obama “would rather lose a war than lose an election”?

    I sincerely believe that if we DID default and the markets tanked, everyone went crazy, dogs and cats started living together, etc, that President Present would let it happen and point fingers at the right, along with his sheep in the legacy media, causing a Carter-like interest rate explosion (which might happen anyway) and other things that might make things problematic for the REAL solution in 2012.

    We’d be blamed if there was no deal, and the media would repeat its playbook from 1995 – news reports from closed parks, sob stories from “displaced” government employees, and a return of Tom Brokejaw deriding the meanspiritedness of the Republicans and pleading for a return to the Bob Michel days, where the right “knew their place.”

    The idea of another commission makes me physically ill, as well as the expected outcome of all three Democrats insisting on a tax hike,, with the three Republicans holding fast resulting in another stalemate until we get a new President on January 20, 2013 (COUNTING THE DAYS.)

    But are you willing to gamble that the public will be with us in the event of another major “crisis” no matter how manufactured?

    I have no faith in this President to do anything other than what’s politically expedient for him.. I consider him to be a charlatan of the highest order, and don’t want to do a THING to help him get another SECOND in the White House. He needs to go.

    I believe this is the best way to ensure that for us, out of the options given.

    I hope I’m right.

  • tippycanoe

    This is the key. We had limited numbers but did make a difference. Actually, the reaction of the establishment Republicans and Dems is fascinating to watch. This was a victory in a 100-year war, without more of us in office, it they don’t pull an Allen West.

  • cacharlie

    this is encouraging? Last night a self-described old fashioned liberal -he says that means more like a real conservative – agrees with me that there are too many regulations. His concern was all about California being destroyed by torte threats Nevada doesn’t have – yet. He says there are no teeter-totters left in CA. Too dangerous. He laughed when I said the D.C. teeter-totter is the only one that’s ever hurt me (I’m 73)
    He says the war on drugs did us in – referring back to Viet Nam days when heroin got cut and had to be injected to do the job.
    RE: economy, he said gov’t has abandoned “working people.” When I told him Obama turned me off in 2008 by saying he wanted to take care of the Middle Class, he nodded, but said he was afraid too many people don’t understand the rich must pay more. I asked him what he thought about replacing income tax with sales tax and he said that would be a disproportionate burden on the poor. But he didn’t disagree when I said I thought the rich bought a whole lot more than the poor.
    Just wondering – am I too optimistic in thinking there’s got to be somebody out there who can blast through like Reagan to good hearts like this one. It doesn’t appear to me that there’s any other way to get most people out of their ideological comfort zones.

  • Next93

    After seeing how the presidential debt commission’s recommendations were so roundly ignored, I don’t see how anyone could think that any entitlement reforms to come from the super committee will get any better reception.

  • rickdeckard

    The base gave you this majority, which you have squandered. The base has given its unyielding support to you. You give back lies and half-truths, and expect us to go along, and to forget while you take up new business.

    No.

    For Redstaters primary season begins today. We will will be taking names, and we will send replacements to DC in 2013. If you pass this “compromise” tonight, you will be taken out. This fight moves to the precincts.

    The time for clever argument has passed. The people who need to be listening aren’t. The people who will change how business gets done in DC are out here, in the field, waiting to be promoted.

    Primary season begins today. My precinct GOP members meet first Tuesdays, and delegates must be registered at least 12 Tuesdays prior to the primaries. I start learning how it’s done now.

    Anybody else?

  • 4liberty

    Not only is it foolish to pass this awful bill, but to also be acting like victors will prove the depth of their idiocy once all of this blows up in their face. No doubt, we and our economy will be worse off than we are now and the GOP will not be able to deny responsibility.

    Once again, the GOP’s actions will help the Democrats and hurt themselves and us. The phrase “useful idiots” comes to mind.

  • carolina

    The market is pretty flat, and I feel pretty flat myself. All that sturm and drang…… and only a bare beginning towards reducing the size and cost of govt has been accomplished.
    I guess the best thing I can say about the results is the change in the direction of the debate.
    We have to soldier on, even when we are weary.

  • http://www.neoavatara.com/blog neoavatara

    That said, I don’t think hitting the debt ceiling helps us.

    That would be the ONLY way that we could save Obama from his own incompetence. Yes, this is, at best, a piecemeal legislation that will achieve virtually nothing in the long term.. However, the ONLY way to achieve that is to get a Republican in the White House and take the Senate.

    Please, someone show me a path of doing that by waiting for a better deal, or for the debt ceiling to be hit.

    The only result I see from it is having the country unify around the only person left standing…i.e. Obama. We would make him the titular ‘adult’, even though he did nothing.

    This deal is not much, but it gets us through 2012 without increasing the debt. The Defense cuts are not as bad as first thought, as I stated in my recent diary piece.

    You want to get a real solution, get Obama out of office. Until then, the cards are stacked against us.

  • unsk

    This deal is a disaster.

    It simply means:

    ? Higher Taxes- much higher
    ? Huge cuts to military spending
    ? No real cuts to discretionary spending

    It is worse than doing nothing. Much worse. The “Super Congress” idea is a terrible idea. It will be rigged against conservatives because there is sure to be at least one RINO traitor on the Republican side who will cave, and this “Super Congress” will tie the hands of conservatives trying to save this economy.

    This deal is a back door to everything the Democrats want, and could never get otherwise. The Republicans do not need to go for this crap. Only a weak spineless idiot would vote for this capitulation.

    If this passes, say “Hello” to a Credit Downgrade, say” Hello” to a much deeper Depression and say a big “Hello” to a new Third Party.

  • http://aposematic.wordpress.com aposematic

    The D’s get 2.1T through 2012 to finance their reelection campaigns, guaranteed commission increased taxes, guaranteed continued demagoguery of fat cats and throwing granny off the cliff, guaranteed expiration of Bush tax cuts Dec. 31, 2012. The R’s get to demagogue their base. Obama and the D’s are big winners in this deal.

  • http://scottkappler.com scottkappler

    Here is the deal… Wow. http://global.nationalreview.com/dest/2011/07/31/3_7_31_11_debt_framework_boehner.pdf

  • Whacker77

    I’m sorry, but this whining is just ridiculous. For the first time in a long time, conservatives established the concept that spending cuts are the way to deal with deficits and debt, not tax increases. That is a major win considering what has taken place over the last 80 years.

    We’re kicking the crap out of Obama every single day and this deal has shattered his standing with the liberals. All we need to do is keep this up for another 15 months and we will trash Obama in a landslide. Shouldn’t that be the goal? Of course, it should.

    I wish the deal returned spending to 2007 levels, but we got the best deal we could get with just one House of Congress. Some of you act as though we could have done every wet dream idea we wanted in this deal. Get real.

    This hasn’t been Erick’s finest hour at Redstate. To say we should go past the deadline just because he doesn’t think it’s a big deal is crazy. Going past the deadline who lead to a big drop in the worldwide markets and Republicans would get 100% of the blame. We’ve got Obama beat, but some of you seem to want to blow right this minute and give him the upper hand again.

  • http://reaganiterepublicanresistance.blogspot.com/ reaganiterepublicanresistance

    As good as we’re going to get at this point

    Good stuff, linked @ RR…

    The Debt Deal, Simplified:

  • Aaron Gardner

    But don’t let that stop you from flogging this issue for the Dems. I am sure they appreciate your help.

  • kestrel

    In the midst of Obama’s phony August 2 crisis, the GOP has completely lost sight of the real crisis, which is that our spending trajectory is about to cost us our AAA credit rating, not to mention that no one wants to buy our potentially worthless treasury bonds anyway. (And I don’t want my pension fund buying them either, at Barack Obama’s command! — which is what’s about to happen.) Losing the AAA rating means the interest we pay lenders on the bonds is going to spike — a de facto spending increase that will wipe out any cuts that might materialize. Anyone in congress who votes for a “deal” that doesn’t cut the $4 trillion specified to keep our AAA rating is complicit the REAL economic armageddon that is coming if we don’t get off this spending trajectory. Why isn’t the upcoming AAA rating loss and interest spike being addressed? Or did I miss it? Boehner is moving too fast on this, before anyone can sort it out.

    I’m going to seek some specifics on the interest rate increase right now. I think Veronique de Rugy and Jason Fichtner explain it somewhere. Friends, help me. I really feel like cursing a blue streak. You take your eyes off Washington for one day and Republicans sell out the country.

  • rowdydfw

    All of this brujaja over the fake debt ceiling manufactured crisis came at a time when Issa is investigating the White House Gunrunner operation and King is investigating Islamic terror cells in the US. And nobody is paying attention to the youth flash mob terror that are becoming a weekly recurring event on our streets is just very very, convenient.

    With the structure of our Congress and the progressives still having 2/3rds control of our government and we are expecting financial CHANGE is insane.

    And I don’t believe in coincidence! WHY aren’t we papying attention to those much more pressing issues instead?

  • Fla Mom

    Look that one up if you’re not old enough to remember it in first person. Stick around a while, and you too can be a cynic, and for good reason.

    (Aaron’s right, btw, there will be tax increases.)

    Fla Mom

  • cwilson

    I think the leftoids who are truly upset at this deal, whose tears taste so good, are actually uninformed about the magnitude of their side’s win.

    The Dem leadership are crying crocodile tears.

    This locks in the expiration of the Bush Tax Cuts. The commission will simply extend them — which gets scored as a $500B(?) tax cut (deficit increase). Then, they impose $500B in brand new, never-before-seen tax hikes. That way, they are “scored” as neutral on the tax issue: “no new taxes”.

    But out here in the real world, looking at the difference in the tax burden in 2012 and 2013 (after the Committee’s “tax neutral” plan is adopted), we see $500B in increased taxes.

    D.C. is a funhouse mirror — but isn’t any fun.

    The Dems have won — with the collusion of the “republican” “leaders” Boehner and McConnell. Both MUST be replaced.

  • victrola

    The Democrats caved, especially when you consider they actually control the Senate and White House. Take a look around the web, the Left is apoplectic over this deal. I’m not saying you can judge every political event through this prism, but that’s usually a good sign.

    I always thought the gamble some on the Right were willing to make was beyond reckless, with many not even wanting a deal at all. That was the actual goal, default. Had we tried to wrangle in spending by essentially “bouncing checks”, there’s a very good chance the public would have turned against the Tea Party movement in a big way, It would look illegitimate, because it is. The way you truly reform this country’s spending problem is by democratically electing a Congress and White House that cuts spending.

    Now Obama and Obama alone will have to answer if our credit rating is downgraded. The economy and our nations dangerous fiscal situation will be ALL on his shoulders. The chance of making lasting reform is MUCH greater going into the 2012 election with that moral high ground than ANY concession Democrats would have made to get the debt ceiling raised.

  • clintonformccain

    This bill offers two alternatives should Congress chose to ignore the Super Committee plan:

    a) They can pass a Balanced Budget Amendment in both houses and send it tot he states for ratifcation. This would kick in the second round of debt ceiling hiikes without the requirement for additional cuts.

    b) They can simply do nothing and allow the trigger caps to kick in equally between defense/foreign affairs spending and domestic spending.

  • Ausonius

    We will see if he delivers: he claims he will filibuster against the debt deal.

    Messages of support might be of help here!

    InTrade’s confidence in the debt deal crashed today: betting on a deal by the end of August went from above 80% certainty to the mid-30′s as of 11:00 A.M. E.S.T.

    See:

    http://inthearena.blogs.cnn.com/2011/02/16/sen-mike-lee-i-am-prepared-to-filibuster/

  • clintonformccain

    “This locks in the expiration of the Bush Tax Cuts. ”

    No it doesn’t. There’s no support for that anywhere. Even Obama, in his wink/wink talking points to the Dems said that he would veto an extension of the Bush tax cuts on “the wealthy” with a price tag of $1 trillion (compared to $3.5 trillion for letting the entire Bush tax cut expire.

    I doubt that the Republicans are going to push for letting them all expire. So if Obama and the Dems aren’t going to do it and the Republicans aren’t going to do it, I don’t know who will.

    Do I think there will be some kind of smoke ‘n mirrors on “tax reform” over the next couple of years? Sure. It’s Washington. Everything is smoke ‘n mirrors.

  • kestrel

    the other day instead of reading Andy McCarthy:
    http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/273130/against-boehner-plan-andrew-c-mccarthy?page=2

    Kicking myself for forgetting that no legislation is ever posted for 24 hours, let alone 72, despite GOP lip service to transparency.

    Kicking myself for forgetting the pattern of rushing bad legislation through on holidays and weekends and passing it before the public knows what’s happened.

    Kicking myself for…

  • clintonformccain

    Is that the Senate will have to get the 60 votes to clear the cloture hurdle. That’s no big suprise. That’s standard operateing procedure in the Senate. Lee said that he would not road block an accelerated time table.

  • lineholder

    It doesn’t address spending reform or entitlement reform, and we could still lose our credit rating. The failure on the part of both sides, but particularly the Repubs, to ensure that our credit rating stays intact is as irresponsible as it gets. The amount of debt reduced is a drop in the bucket. And the potential threat of any and all tax increases will be hanging over our economy like a dark shroud.

    But I’m sorry, Erick, I don’t agree with you about pushing this past Aug. 2. The reason I don’t is that Obama himself has already admitted that he’s tempted to go this alone, taking powers far greater than he should have into his own hands. His own base is yelling at the top of their lungs for him to do this, which will only add to the allurement of it.

    Just as a Christian, there’s a point where isn’t wise to push someone who acknowledges that they are tempted to do something. That’s how I see it.

  • standingonthewall

    He’s already drunk the Kool-Aid. Now, if he would just eat the sandwich (but he doesn’t deserve the sugar).

    That said, I hope this deal goes down and we have to keep fighting. True, it could be worse. Yes, it will tell us who really has right thinking, backbone, principles – a real conservative. Still, it’s awful and I don’t want that sandwich shoved down my throat by my government!

  • cwilson

    This deal sets the *baseline* for what is considered a cut, and what is not. Rather than use the Ryan Plan or a straight extension of today’s tax structure, it explicitly says that current law controls what the baseline for the Committee’s negotiations are.

    Current law has the Bush Tax Cuts expiring on Jan 1, 2013. Nobody has to “push” for anything. They only need to do what politicians do best: do nothing, while pointing fingers at the other guy.

    Anything the Committee does already ASSUMES that the Bush Tax Cuts go away at that point. If the Committee extends them — or even just part of them — then they get a free trillion-dollar playpen of brand NEW taxes to create — to “offset” that extension.

    Saying this deal has no new taxes is like saying “Don’t worry, we won’t hike taxes, because your taxes are already scheduled to go up. Goody!” The “deal” simply ensures that your taxes WILL go up in 2013: either the Bush Tax Cuts expire, or some other tax will be hiked the same amount.

  • caboose

    we hitched our wagon to losers. Everyone should be screaming about being sold out by McConnell and crying Boehner. But whats worse is the rank and file Republicans have reneged and hypocritically joined the leadership traitors.That makes them traitors. We must go to a third party as much as I hate to. Republicans and Democrats are traitors and republicans are cowards and totally spineless. The notion that “This is the best Deal we can get’ is a total capitulation. Good by America!

  • gekster

    Splitting the conservative vote will get us what.
    Just what will we gain.

  • avgjo

    If there is no credible third party threat, the GOP will continue to take us for granted.( Especially as seeing how our conservative media largely does not hold them accountable, probably out of fear of Obama getting reelected if we’re fighting internally. Thing is, he may well get reelected now because of the cave-in; dispirited conservatives often stay home)

    But a third party is a guarantee of dim wins and republican losses and the country goes down the tubes. Continued tolerance of GOP antics is a guarantee of more of the same, and the country goes down the tubes.

    It’s nasty, really really nasty.

  • audax

    ..nt

  • caboose

    is already down the tubes. We thought that we had sent the message in November that the dem/communist/socialist must be stopped. We even were assured that the Republicans and its leadership would defund the Socialist/communist healthcare.program. They did not even try. Now it is not even mentioned by the congress and whats more depressing, not talked at all on these blogs. Face it, a so called crises lasts about a day or two with conservatives and other republicans, then they cave in and Pi$$ and Moan about something else. Third party may be the answer, because if we would happen to retain the House, Incompetent cowards like Boehner will still be in charge and that is a unacceptable. Fed up!!!

  • runner12

    Give it a rest, clintonformccain. We all know whose side you are on and is not ours.

    You may also want to get your facts straight. Lee et al said they would not be obstructionist just to be obstructionist. Since Sen. Lee has plenty of reason to slow this process down and ” obstruct” given what the details that are emerging, there is a good possibility of a filibuster.