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EDITOR OF REDSTATE

The Oppo Dump on Herman Cain Begins in Earnest

By: Erick Erickson (Diary)  |  October 30th, 2011 at 11:09 PM  | 

RESIZE: AAA

Hours after the Politico’s Roger Simon accused the GOP of being racist, the Politico begins a sincere effort to destroy the black guy running to be the GOP’s Presidential nominee. The opposition dump on Herman Cain has begun in earnest. Before getting into the details, let’s pay attention to what this means.

It means for certain that Herman Cain’s lead in the polling is real — very, very real. People are taking him seriously. Mr. Cain is about to spend a week in Washington answering questions and giving speeches. Someone wanted to make sure he has a miserable week.

The allegations are pretty straight forward. At least two women complained of sexual harassment by Herman Cain when he ran the National Restaurant Association. How did this play out? Well, the Politico says it learned about the allegations and then began putting together a roster of board members, etc. Someone tipped them off obviously.

The Politico also says it was not widely known, even on the board. It also says “The first woman was identified to POLITICO by a former association board member and her identity was confirmed by two additional sources.” The board member learned about it all in 1999 during an event in Chicago.

The hunt will now be on for who that board member is, among others. Even now I’m sure there are people cross referencing National Restaurant Association board members from 1999 with other campaigns.

But who ratted out the information is far less consequential than if it was true. We’re going to see a few things happen I suspect.

First, a great many liberals who defended Bill Clinton will come forward to express outrage. Second, a few conservatives who went after Bill Clinton will defend Herman Cain. Third, many people will quietly brace for more to come out.

The Politico did not release names nor a lot of information. If there is a there there, more will trickle out and each trickle will weigh down the Cain campaign, taking it further and further off message.

We have never seen a candidate publicly vetted before like this. The closest comes with the rise of Mike Huckabee in 2008, when we witnessed what seemed like a never ending media attack. It was, in reality, the other campaigns running as quickly as possible to the media to pour out all the dirt they’d rapidly accumulated.

But Mike Huckabee rose only just before Iowa. The media and the campaigns were caught off guard. This time, people don’t want to be caught off guard. They want to make sure Herman Cain cannot become Mike Huckabee for 2012.

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  • Xasteius

    I don’t support him. but no one deserves this.

  • citizenkh

    I heard some of this from an attorney friend in Atlanta who is friends with several members of Cain’s church. It was put to me as, “They are not impressed with his morals.” I expect much more to be revealed in the near future.

  • westcoastpatriette

    I hope this ends quickly…for everyone’s sake.

  • acat

    The worst part to this cat is that Cain’s family and friends will be undergoing the media rotor-rootering that Joe the plumber went through.

    The second worst part is that there will be few who recognize the irony of the liberal media doing this to a black man.

    Mew

  • Money

    But unless there are sources willing to be named or other evidence to be released, this smacks of just another liberal media attack on a black conservative.

    I’m far more concerned with Mr. Cain’s pro-choice stance on abortion and would prefer the media to explore that and whether his economic policy positions are best for America.

  • Doc Holliday

    sounds solid to me. I am amazed anyone is surprised by this, all of our candidates will get their turn.

  • http://www.planettron.com NickDeringer

    Whether this is real or not, it throws Cain off pace for any serious win in Iowa. Cain’s guy just dodged and dance around the question on Geraldo. Not good. This may not end his campaign, but it will cripple it just when he needs to be at his best.

    It will come down to what it has always been: a two man race between Perry and Romney.

  • westcoastpatriette

    and call the left the phony hypocrites that they are.

  • bk

    Not by the MSM. They’re perfectly happy with anonymous accusations.

  • gator_hoo

    My initial reaction was to think that this is more dirt like Perry’s hunting rock, but instead of confronting and explaining what happened, they have gone into blaming the media for raising the story, and the official statement did not appear to contain a denial.

    If they don’t want this to blow up in their faces, they need to say what they know or issue a clear denial.

  • kinggold

    It’s the seriousness of the charge.

    The MSM told me that.

  • lineholder

    I’m not about to just write this off as being meaningless. If there is any truth at all to the charges, then it needs to be addressed.

    But I do think the left will do anything and everything in their power to discredit Cain, not just because of his current position in the political race, but also because they probably consider him to be the catalyst for a few thing that are starting to happen in the black community. Like the group Raging Elephants (black conservative) putting up billboards, one of which reads “GOP Is The New Black”.

    I do think they are beginning to see him as a serious threat in societal context, Doc.

  • http://www.vote4buzz.com Buzz Brockway

    The AJC recently ran a story about how folks in his Church like him even if they don’t agree with his politics.

  • retire05

    “We have never seen a candidate publically vetted before like this.”

    Nah, there has been no other GOP candidate that the left wing tried to smear. No stories of rocks in small rural areas where ranchers lease out their land for deer hunting. No seeking the GOP candidates former school chums to see if they knew about the rock and were willing to say unfavorable things about the candidate. No reporters descending on a small town in Alaska, digging through the trash, talking to anyone who even knew of the VP candidate (personal knowledge not necessary).

    Here is the bottom line: if the story is false, and cannot be proven (and believe me, proof will be demanded) it makes Politico look like nothing but political hacks willing to tell any lie to destroy a Republican candidate and it will backfire on Politico. But if, and I am saying IF, the story is true, Cain’s campaign is dead.

    There are two things that people will not accept in a candidate: racism, as the WaPo tried to imply about Perry, only to wind up looking bad, but which no doubt hurt Perry’s campaign, and sexual harrassment. Those things are taboo in today’s political discourse.

    And as I said earlier, if these two women decide to go public, even though Politico reports they signed confidenciality agreements, what is the National Restaurant Assoc. going to do? Sue the women and keep the story in the headlines for the next 12 months? I don’t think so.

    I don’t care for Cain and am not going to vote for him. But I hope this story doesn’t have legs and Politico winds up with egg on its face.

  • sayoung80913

    I live near Savannah and a member of our tea party said something along the lines of ” Cain’s baggage makes newt look saintly”-I don’t know the guy personally but do know he is from the Golden Isles area and some kind of a retired business guy-construction I think. I take all of these rumors and allegations with a grain of salt, especially since we are a military family who has watched this kind of crap destroy the careers of good soldiers and officers. I would hazard a guess that maybe 25 percent of these charges have any basis in fact and the rest are either a mis- understanding or a person’s act of revenge. That is just my opinion. I sincerely hope that even though Cain s not my candidate that he makes fools out of the gotcha media with this one, or, if there IS any basis in fact here that he does NOT pull an Anthony Weiner and try to act as if he has been smeared. This primary is already contentious enough without more shades of Clinton or Edwards brought into the mix.

  • http://www.theprecinctproject.wordpress.com ColdWarrior

    Wow! According to the Associated Press “reporters,” as set forth on The Washington Post’s web site, “The [Politico's "reporters'"] report was based on anonymous sources and, in one case, what the publication said was a review of documentation that described the allegations and the resolution.”

    Hmmm. Where have we heard that before?

    They reviewed documents from anonymous sources that described the allegations and resolution and then ran with the story.

    Sort of like what happened in Rathergate.

    http://www.bernardgoldberg.com/a-lost-fact-in-the-rathergate-mess-part-1/

    I sure would like to see those documents.

    Thank you.

    ColdWarrior

    http://archive.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2005/…

  • tngal

    I work for lawyers, but they’re not up now so I’ll ask you.

    Consider that both women in the Politico story “received separation packages that were in the five-figure range” after Mr. Cain alledgedly made “sexually suggestive behavior”.

    Five figures. What kind of figures? If it was over 90,000 Poltiico would have run the head with 100k settlement. Why do I get the feeling its much less.

    How much would it cost to actually play this out in court? Lawyers fees, filings, stenos, on and on. A bunch. But the women agree to leave with a seperation package.

    Settlements on serious harrassment cases can run in the 6-7 figure range. Why so low.

    I believe the burden of proof of harrassment is really pretty low. We use to have twice a year meetings when I worked in radio on how not to to accidentally come on to a co-worker or make them feel uncomfortable. But maybe I’m misreading it as a low bar.

    Wondering lawyers, what tthe burden of proof might be and what can be surmized from the numbers.

    http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1011/67194.html#ixzz1cKIrVD3o

  • Doc Holliday

    sure, I don’t know if the allegations are true or not, heck, we don’t even know what the allegations are. I do know that the drive byes and professional left will do whatever they can to destroy EVERY ONE of our candidates before this is over, they do it every election.

  • http://www.doctor-bob.biz rsklaroff

    …because it will be anticipated that data will be released–if from nowhere else–from the Restaurant Association.

    As I noted elsewhere…
    http://www.redstate.com/moe_lane/2011/10/30/chris-wallace-calls-out-mitt-romney/#comment-57516
    …the only substantive defense [NOT from the Cain Campaign, BTW] has been the possibility that settlements were effected rather than fighting unfair accusations.

    Nevertheless, the bottom-line is that Cain will FINALLY be asked tough-questions, for the atmosphere for puff-pieces has vanished.

    He won’t be able to avoid providing specifics, and it is not inappropriate to project a quick-retreat thereafter if ANY deviations from absolute-truth are subsequently unearthed.

    As is often the case, the problem often is the “cover-up,” and awareness of this dynamic must be appreciated IMMEDIATELY by the Cain-advocates.

    [I still think that Rick will rise as Cain and Romney slip but, particularly regarding the latter, it couldn't happen to a more-deserving guy!]

  • Doc Holliday

    .

  • http://www.doctor-bob.biz rsklaroff

    …with this statement by Nick Deringer:

    “Don’t beat the Perry horse too hard, we may need to ride it in November.”

  • lineholder

    Little by little, I’m learning about the ways of politics. There’s a lot about politics that I just don’t care for all the much…too much scheming and conniving, and it get vicious, and people act like that behavior is “normal”.

    I’d think the left is likely to be particularly vicious, to the point of being malicious, this electoral season. So much of their hopes and dreams rides on Obama getting a 2nd term.

  • retire05

    And actually, since sexual harrassment cases are usually a “he said/she said” case, the bar is set pretty high. If the company or organization has suspects a high probability the claims are true, most companies just try to make the case go away because it is cheaper than litigation which can take years and the rist of a higher settlement, if claims of harrassment are deemed true, stand to be much higher with litigation (often in the millions). And ususally, the women making the claim have found some lawyer who will handle the case on a contingency fee basis so it costs her nothing to go to court.

  • gator_hoo

    Cain’s spokesman went through hoops to avoid a denial. That doesn’t mean that there is anything to the story, but it does mean that it isn’t going to go away quickly.

  • abeldred

    That even those who post here as conservatives assume the worst of Herman Cain. This smacks of the Anita Hill/Clarence Thomas smear job plain and simple. The dems cannot have a black man rising up as a challenge to their black (ish) guy…they know who’ s the real deal. The whole thing is disgusting and our side seems too blind to see it at least here at Red State…I will vote for Cain and pln to continue to give $$ too.

  • sayoung80913

    That is the real question. Hmmmm. How much do you want to bet that whoever leaked it tries to pin it on Perry? Oppo research this early-no way, it comes from a republican insider and one with the apparatus to get deep into background, off the record stuff. That has to be Rove working behind the scenes for the Romney camp. But why would they want to get rid of their stalking horse so soon? Could it be that recent polling shows Cain trouncing their golden boy? Guess we’ll just have to wait it out to see

  • westcoastpatriette

    If you look upthread, I said this is extremely sad…whether it is true or not. We have no choice but to wait and see how this plays out now. But we have all seen this so many times that we hold our breath to see what happens next.

    My prayer is that it is all false and Politico suffers as a result.

  • retire05

    in a remote part of Texas? Who would have been in a position to know about that rock from his association with Rick Perry? Ummmm?

    But I think throwing false accusations of sexual harrassment against Herman Cain is not something even Karl Rove would attempt. If it turns out to be a false story, Rove’s career is OVER.

  • Raven

    of the last few weeks. Cain’s “pro-choice” position was proven to be a farce and was very well documented.

  • lineholder

    I meant to point that out as well. Cain is very pro-life.

  • macbookben

    they tried to stick the “pubic hair on the Pepsi can” story on Judge Thomas during the senate’s SCOTUS confirmation hearings. Looks like these sexual harassment allegations against Cain will only succeed if the electorate falls for this Democrat playbook tactic. It will be a high-tech lynching indeed if Perry, Romney, and the rest do not come to his defense on this matter.

  • gator_hoo

    Doubt there is much to the story (although Cain’s spokespeople being quick to respond, but not to deny, is exactly the wrong way to make this story go away), but I am curious, abeldred, whether you were similarly disconcerted when Cain jumped on the Perry rock story?

  • Doc Holliday

    they will got after someone you care about soon enough.

  • westcoastpatriette

    …

  • tngal

    If it was 99,999 Politico would of ran the headline with 100k.
    That’s what it does. It sensationalizes.

    That was why I specifically wrote “if it was over 90,000 Poltiico would have run the head with 100k settlement”. Oh, it could have gone with “Woman Get Near 100k each in Cain harrassment scandal.” its a short headline but a big bold number. You always round up to bigger for the most shocking effect.

    If there was any serious merit, I suspect their severance packages would have been much higher.

    So far I’ve not seen anything of groping or grabbing or even unwanted kissing. I saw the word inuendo….and the word gesture.

    If that’s all they got, that’s lame.

    They act like he’s a reincarnation of Kennedy.

  • http://www.doctor-bob.biz rsklaroff

    …because the follow-through tomorrow should be fact-driven,

    Absent proof, I have avoided bashing those who allegedly have been favoring other candidates [e.g., FNC's alleged support for Mitt]; this would have been a distraction.

    It would be advisable if such discipline would be followed by others; it is possible, simply, that Politico acquired the story…researched it a bit…and then ran with it.

    I saw “Ides of March” this-p.m., and I noted that the NY-Times Reporter [Marisa Tomei] was dismayed when events did not supervene as anticipated. That is why it is preferable to ensure Red State remains focused on truth-telling.

  • wacowboy

    Herman Cain is going to get the full anal vetting that our current president did not receive.

    Sadly, it seems that Mr Cain’s biggest crime is being a conservative.

    For his sake, hope the story isn’t true.

  • defendtherepublic

    will be of a personal nature. The lack of government wheeling and dealing leaves his opponents to focus on personal attacks like this. They have yet to go after his business practices or his experience in leading the National Restaurant Assoc. or his time on the Fed. Why don’t they run the story about how Cain gave a big government contract to a company with a CEO who bundled money for his campaign? Because he’s not running for reelection. But Politico has championed the Solyndra and Fast&Furious epsiodes, right! Can you imagine Obama bringing this up in a debate or running ads – how will that win the future?

    How about the part in the article…”There were also descriptions of physical gestures that were not overtly sexual but that made women who experienced or witnessed them uncomfortable and that they regarded as improper in a professional relationship.” Let me be clear, the language used is very open to personal impressions and opinions-very subjective in nature. The latter of the article states many people who were very familiar with Cain’s time there were not aware of this.

    If we run away from support because of this anonymous soruces story, what will we do when we have a nominee we can’t run from but has a weaker stance on our conservative issues. Politico has already done more research on Cain than they did on Obama during the entire 08 election cycle. Congrats. If these allegations are true, and if Cain knows, then He should address them quickly and firmly. Lingering issues like this feed the liberal national media ego towards their despise of conservatism. This with a media spin will hurt him politically with women the most. If this could be a general election issue, he could look to have a female VP: Martinez, Brewer, Palin, Bachmann, Haley…Yes, they think of things these ways. Kind of like McCain picking Palin so he would actually get a vote (she had all the cred he lacked being a conservative).

    Is this story a trick or treat? Happy Halloween!

  • hisgirlfriday

    for settlement negotiations is a lawyer will look at what they’re entitled to and then multiply that times the percentage of likelihood that a jury would find for them at trial.

    Like if they were entitled to 150,000 in damages and there’s a 50 percent chance a jury will rule your way, then if the other side offers you 75,000 or more you go ahead and settle.

    I don’t know what you can read into the settlement amount in this instance. It could be that the employees were not making much to begin with or they didn’t work long with the company so no need for high monetary damages from them having to leave the company. It could be that Mr. Cain had a really good attorney and got a really good low settlement in the negotiations. It could have been that the most important thing to Mr. Cain was to make these allegations go away quietly and there wasn’t much too them but he paid that amount to make the problem go away.

    The thing with a story like this is we will never know and we are not supposed to ever know. Just like we will probably never know who leaked this.

    I don’t think it’s Obama people leaking this so early. If the Obama people knew about it they would wait until the primary was over. I know Rick Perry’s team is pretty hard-core and it would seem like he would benefit from Cain’s campaign stumbling, but I also wonder about Rove pulling something like this for Romney’s sake. Unfortunately we’ll never know.

  • lineholder

    would settle out of court if possible, even if the charges are false, especially if it costs them loss to settle out of court than go through litigation. They don’t want to have to deal with the public perception problems (and possible damage to market share) that can come about as a result of taking these kinds of cases to court.

  • http://www.doctor-bob.biz rsklaroff

    …because this is a potentially-radioactive issue; the other campaigns should respectfully decline from issuing ANY comments…as the database emerges.

  • gator_hoo

    Cain himself is very pro-life, I am certain. But immediately after releasing his “I am 100% pro-life” statement, he told Fox & Friends that Abortion should not be a part of the political discussion. Now he has a new statement saying he does support exceptions for rape and incest.

    I don’t think we can genuinely know where he stands on abortion as a governing, rather than a personal, issue.

  • hisgirlfriday

    false accusations.

    Not everyone accused of something fights it in court because an allegation like this is so messy.

    So the allegations could be false, but the settlement could be true and that’s where a Karl Rove covers his butt.

  • gator_hoo

    You make an unsubstantiated allegation that Perry or Romney is behind the release. All righty then.

  • lineholder

    the Politico article:

    “Cain was ?extremely professional? and ?fair? to female staffers at the restaurant association, recalled Lee Ellen Hayes, who said she ?worked fairly closely with? Cain in the late 1990s, when she was an executive at the National Restaurant Association Education Fund, a Chicago-based offshoot of the group.

    Cain?s treatment of women was ?the same as his treatment of men. Herman treated everyone great,? said Mary Ann Cricchio, who was elected to the board of the restaurant group in 1998. She said Cain left such a good impression on the organization that when he spoke at a group event in January of this year, as he was considering a presidential bid, ?he had unanimous support in the room.?”

  • Xasteius

    no text

  • onemovoter

    It’s very bad the way some people will act. I came across the backstabbing that goes on even those within the same party.

    rsmcain who is a Cain backer has some extra info on the story along with several character witnesses of the same time.

    http://theothermccain.com/2011/10/30/merely-part-of-a-smear-campaign-meant-to-discredit-a-true-patriot/

    I can see conservative bloggers looking for who leaked this story. Accusations will then start flying based on motivation but no facts.

  • citizenkh

    That means someone seriously wants to take Cain out. It will run all week long. Not like a Friday news dump.

  • hisgirlfriday

    i have no idea where the release came from and I was just speculating.

    Unfortunately I don’t know how you discuss this story from a political standpoint without speculating so I’ll just quit now.

  • lineholder

    I’m not about to accuse any of the other candidates for taking this kind of action. There is no basis on which it would be remotely substantiated at this point.

    Surely none of the other Republican candidates would be that stupid, would they? If the truth came out, it would backfire on them in a heartbeat.

  • BlueLandRed

    Cain stepped into the big leagues and to expect that he isn’t going to get “hazed” by everyone (left and right) is utterly naive. Better now in the preseason. Cause if he can’t handle this he’s way too weak to handle whatever slim the left comes after him once it’s too late to pick another candidate.

  • http://www.doctor-bob.biz rsklaroff

    …nor will any confidentiality clauses; Cain will be forced to come-clean.

  • gekster

    ….

  • lineholder

    I’ll have to try to find the link, but Cain has basically stated that he is very pro-life but he’s also a strong believer in the Constitution. He doesn’t believe that making a decision on banning abortion should be mandated or dictated by the President of the United States. It would have to go through the due legal process, meaning that if it gained enough support for the legislative branch to set something in front of him, he’d sign it. And he’d make use of the bully pulpit to try to encourage that type of decision-making as well.

  • lineholder

    But by saying “come clean”, it sounds like you are assuming guilt. The truth could just as easily prove innocence.

  • lineholder

    is “if the electorate falls for this Democrat playbook tactic”. I’m not so sure that they will. Sometimes, reading the responses to an article can provide a lot of insight as to how people are responding.

    http://campaign2012.washingtonexaminer.com/blogs/beltway-confidential/cain-responds-sex-harassment-allegation

  • drfredc

    As if the left really has nothing new in it’s play book, they are taking a page out of the Clarence Thomas Senate confirmation by trying to take a conservative black man out with (false) allegations of sexual harassment…

    Oh gag me… Another rerun… Like the first one worked out so well for liberal Democrats…

  • joayn

    speculations. From my perspective, and maybe someone with some legal experience (Gamecock?) can add some information here.

    From what I know about these kinds of settlements, while there is no acknowledgement of guilt and a settlement is made, all parties are legally bound by the confidentiality agreement.

    So it’s possible that Cain, as the named party, may not be legally able to give any information regarding these allegations since he’s bound by the agreement.

    Any lawyers out there who know about stuff like this?

  • onemovoter

    A statement of anything on this. Doing so before the whole story is flushed out will sweep you into the story itself which you do not want to happen.

    I saw a Perry backer on Twitter crack a joke related to this story and even linked the politico story. I sent them a tweet back saying I would recommend they don’t touch this story with a 10 foot pole. I haven’t seen anything from them after that. I think they were just trying to be cute by half but then realized it was in bad taste.

    I hate stories like this because it’s personal. We should all be debating policy instead. But that’s politics for you.

  • inwarresolution

    You know Herman Cain is being taken seriously when stories like this start crawling out from under rocks. If he wasn’t a serious candidate, no one would bother reporting it.

    One can never tell with things like this, but if the past is any guide, Herman Cain will shrug it off, keep doing interviews, keep smiling, and keeping moving up in the polls. He’s indomitable. He seems to have no fear of engaging people and the media, and it’s rather refreshing in comparison to the calculating and equivocating alternatives. http://bit.ly/vU6f0i

  • tngal

    or at least his 2011 counterpart.

    The money paid out was relatively small. But why do I get the feeling bigger money was used to uncover it. – Look at these poll numbers! Spare no expense. Find something on this guy now. Before Iowa! -

  • onemovoter

    EE> Were @THEHermanCain to channel Steve Jobs, his comms director would be sending out resumes tonight.

    He then linked to the Heraldo show video

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gclK_CYyspE&feature=player_embedded#!

  • lineholder

    Or someone could have been holding onto whatever information they’ve been able to find, planning to release it at a strategic moment.

    Politics really is hyper-dramatic, far more than it helps us as citizens for it to be, because all the drama detracts from focusing on the issues that need to be addressed.

  • joayn

    divorce papers of Jack Ryan and leak them to the press? Ryan had to drop out of the race and Obama won. Isn’t that how Obama won his senate seat?

  • txpat

    It is better for these things come out now than later if he were to get the republican nomination.
    We don’t need a scandal later in the process.
    Later would be a gift wrap present for Obama.

  • lineholder

    BTW, did you read down through the comments? Interesting information there.

  • defendtherepublic

    Bachmann gained and we heard of migraines.

    Perry leaped ahead and we learned about a rock.

    Cain rose to the top and we learn about anonymous accustations of potentially crude actions.

    Romney campaigns for years and we get non-stop, “Romney leads or tied in most of the polls.”

    The media goes harshest in the early phases after the targets they fear the most; saving the easy negative dirt for the foe they hope will challenge Obama in the general.

  • sethellis

    I understand the skepticism, but I doubt this is just a fabrication. Based on the article they did their homework. My bet is that there was a settlement, but only because Cain wanted to put it to rest quickly. The complaint might have been over something minor. Still, sexual harassment is a serious matter, and you don’t want to play the he said she said game.

    On one hand if it was me I would just cut my losses. It always seems that the more it drags on the worse it gets. On the other hand if anyone could fight this and win it’d be cain

  • http://pocketchangeproductions.net/ anotherindyfilmguy

    I’m very skeptical about the whole thing… if it was true the MSM would have likely trotted out the whole story with aggrieved witnesses etc right from the bat. The fact is if there were “allegations made” and if an out of court settlement was reached (whether the allegations were factual or not) the persons who accepted the settlements may be breaching their settlement agreement in bringing up the topic after dropping it waaaaaaay back when (if they did). These alleged persons may be reluctant to breach a settlement agreement that could cost them their cushy settlement package and leave them open for litigation etc. (this could be why no one is named as accusers yet or why they won’t talk if the story is legitimate etc)

    My gut says it smells to much like the Thomas/Hill “controversy” that the left tried to smear Thomas with. What really ticks me off in this sort of thing is that I heard about the whole Gennifer Flowers controversy years before Bill Clinton ran for POTUS and was quite disgusted to watch her smeared by the press back in the day. Yet the press won’t name sources or the alleged victims in four pages of what seems to be essentially a democrat attack add masquerading as news.

    In the 1990′s “sexual harassment” was a huge litigation wave that made lots of trial lawyers rich and many people nervous about what they said around co-workers etc lest they be named and the company sued etc. I’d be less skeptical if they named the alleged accusers.

    This is only the tip of the iceberg – not so much about Cain as what it will be about Cain, Perry or anyone else the MSM/left doesn’t want nominated in the primaries.

  • http://pocketchangeproductions.net/ anotherindyfilmguy

    “Senator is it true that you beat your wife?”
    “What? No!”

    Headline:
    Senator denies that he beats his wife…

  • fotophun

    this is why they are called “the drive by media”
    set out to ruin someone’s reputation
    whether it is true or not…

    and oh after the campaign is over
    oh well it was not true
    only to sear the accusation in people’s minds forever

  • macbookben

    …could potentially happen to Herman Cain, that is, the contents of the settlement may be leaked, or they may disclosed by the courts. More likely we’ll get an anonymous leak. Either way, I’m sure HC will play this true to form as the straight shooter I believe he really is.

  • fotophun

    it is is so sad
    that when a real story comes along
    and the facts are true
    the media looks the other way
    how long did it take for the media to reveal the Weiner story
    some people even get reelected

    it did not matter much with Clinton, a known womanizer
    and possible rapist
    and we know Lewinsky was the real thing
    all of this was a plus for the Clinton resume
    truely some people have no shame

  • gekster

    I would rather see him get beat on policy then on a false smear.

    disclaimr:
    I’m not saying his policys are wrong, I would just rather see all campaigns are judged on the merits.

  • macbookben

    I should have kept reading. But that’s pretty much what happened:

    Ford, Liam. ?Some Ryan divorce files should be unsealed?, Chicago Tribune (2004-03-30).

  • fotophun

    I think possibly this is VERY phony
    if it was real they would have this as some Oct surprise if he won the nomination
    sort of like what Brown did to Meg Whitman
    here in Calif
    the left never plays by the rules
    destroy your opponent
    because you have no foundation or ideas to stand on

  • macbookben

    ..whom shall you trust to report this story in an accurate, non-biased and solidly journalistic fashion, regardless of how it will look for Mr. Cain?

  • redmymind

    then Cain has nothing to worry about. If true, it’d be pretty hard to classify Cain as the “victim.”

  • phelbin

    Interesting point from a few of those commenters. If the leak is proven to have come from a rival GOP camp, it’ll be really damaging to that campaign and not to Cain. And apparently Perry’s supporters have been bragging for a couple weeks about having major dirt that would finish him off. Clearly the Perry camp is really desperate after his meteoric freefall and, if the leak did come from them, the whole thing could really backfire on Perry.

  • phelbin

    And what true conservative doesn’t agree that the Constitution should be the true arbiter on every legal matter, including the issue of abortion? This is not the job of the POTUS.

    BTW, Cain spent $1 million of his own money on an anti-abortion ad campaign a few years ago. Doesn’t that alone prove once and for all that the man really is pro-life? This isn’t a Romney-style flip-flop, he misspoke. Can’t we move past it?

  • hisgirlfriday

    Blair Hull, some random millionaire running in the dem primary, had sealed divorce papers involving spousal abuse.

    The Tribune or somebody sued to get those (probably at prompting of Axelrod) and after the court unsealed them it was revealed about a month or two before the election that he had some spousal abuse allegations, Hull was no longer the frontrunner.

    Then when the general election came along and Jack Ryan had sealed divorce papers they wound up suing to get those too and Ryan was pressured to resign the nomination when the stuff about him came out.

  • rightwingmom52

    before feminists decided what was considered harassment (sexual or otherwise) and everything had to be reported through H/R or tell another female co-worker.

    I recall how shocked the powers that be in the law firm where I worked were during a “training” session on sexual harassment and hostile work environment at a question I asked. After droning on and on about how many options we had on how to report a situation, I asked if there was any problem with handling things myself as I had always done. You know, by telling a guy he was out of line and to knock it off. Or the proverbial slap in the face.

    Now, I don’t doubt there are some real live cases of harassment in the workplace, but it’s a real shame when men are afraid to be alone with a female co-worker for fear she will infer some non-existent intent from something he said or did because some feminist or liberal told her so. To then get monetary gain and smear someone’s reputation is truly despicable.

  • phelbin

    It’s funny. I keep hearing about the inevitability of Romney and Perry from the MSM, 98% of whom are democrats. I don’t understand why any Republican would believe a word they say, let alone take their advice on who to nominate. It makes no sense! They know that we want so badly to beat Obama that they’re pushing candidates (Romney and Huntsman) who are basically democrats.

    Romney has been stuck at 25% (give or take a few points) for 6 months now, and no doubt a large portion of his supporters – such as Ann Coulter – have succumbed to the electability nonsense. The other 75% of Republicans can’t stand the guy, and I don’t see how that’ll help us in the general election.

    Perry had a meteoric rise, followed by an equally dramatic fall. So, why hasn’t anyone called him the “flavor of the week?”

    Gingrich could be poised for a run in the next couple months.

    Cain, on the other hand, has steadily risen in the polls despite near-universal dismissal from the MSM. He was supposedly the “flavor of the week” two months ago, and has only risen in popularity since then. This attack proves that the democrats and GOP rivals are taking him seriously. It’s time that we do so as well.

  • phelbin

    Apparently a few Perry supporters have been bragging quite a bit on Twitter the last couple weeks about pending campaign-ending dirt on Cain. It’s not proof, but…

    And you’re exactly right. If this was indeed leaked by any of the rival GOP camps, it would probably end that campaign. Most of us are already nervous about the amount of dirt flying between the GOP candidates, because we’re bracing ourselves for a very very ugly general election. Very!

  • phelbin

    The originator of the leak likely doesn’t care whether it’s true or not. They’re hoping for the negative residue of the story to diminish people’s impression of Cain. People have short memories, and Gallup shows his favorability ratings to be much higher than anyone else. It’s a MAJOR threat.

    But if it’s proven that the leak did come from one of the rival GOP camps, I’d think it would be more damaging to that candidate than to Cain – provided it isn’t true or was blown out of proportion. Hypothetically speaking, if Perry’s camp leaked it (and I’m not saying they did, although there has been a lot of recent online bragging from his supporters about campaign-killing dirt on Cain), it shows their desperation, and makes them seem really petty. GOP voters, who are already worried about the dirt we’re throwing on each other ahead of what will likely be the dirtiest general election ever, would likely leave that candidate for someone else.

  • phelbin

    Isiah Thomas and Madison Square Garden settled out of court with his accuser for $11.6 million! Clearly this is not in the same league.

  • http://whattoreadtoday.blogspot.com/ Paula

    They know Romney and Perry will spend the biggest chunk of their war chests on media buys, much of that going to TV ads. Who wants to be treated to lunch by Some-Guy-From-The-Mailroom when you can have dinner with the CEO?

  • rick554

    And Poliyico in particular? Typical liberal, non-Obama-vetting BS. I want to see some proof, and not annonymous “sources” or I take Cain at his word.

  • Adjoran

    they are surely dead in the water upon discovery – if for no other reason than entrusting their confidenitality to known leftist propagandists and charter members of the manage-and-massage-the-news effort to preserve The Narrative secretly, the Journ-O-List.

    But with anonymous sources and anonymous confirmation, this shouldn’t be story. If Politico were journalists in reality, it would be a breech of ethics. But being the leftist toadies they are, it’s all in a day’s work.

    When the leftist punks defame a conservative on their own site, why assume it has a Republican source? It’s been their modus operandi since Anita Hill.

  • phelbin

    As conservatives, we don’t just have to fight the democrats, we have to fight the leadership of our own party. The Republican establishment has always been hostile to the Conservatives who make up the solid base of the party.

    They attack us using similar language and for the same reasons as the left…we are a threat to their power. Don’t forget what they almost did to us in 1980. They hated Reagan so much they actually ran John Anderson as a third party candidate.

    In fact, this is why, despite an electoral college blowout, Reagan only received 50.1 percent of the popular vote in 1980. Though it wasn?t even close, one has to wonder if the GOP elites real agenda was to bleed off enough votes to give Carter a second term, rather than see Reagan, a real reformer come to power. And I can’t help but wonder if we’ll see history repeat itself this time around. If Cain is nominated, they’ll be fighting us just as hard as the democrats. Why else would we keep hearing so much about Huntsman? He’s utterly irrelevant, until they need him to run as an independent.

  • phelbin

    He was supposedly the “flavor of the week” about two months ago, and he’s done nothing but rise in the polls since then. The left and the GOP leadership really hated Reagan as well, and for the very same reasons people like him so much. I’m not necessarily saying Cain is the 2nd coming of Reagan, but I do see parallels in the groundswell of support despite fierce opposition.

  • phelbin

    I’d argue that this would help Obama as well. Right now Cain is the biggest threat to the media-created inevitability of Romney, and Obama really wants to go up against Mitt. After OWS, Obama really needs to dodge his irrefutable connections to Wall Street, and the only way to do that is to campaign against an actual Wall Street insider.

    Further, the liberal base is deflated this time around, and the conservative base is hyper active and excited right now. But a Romney nomination would suck the air right out of the Tea Party, and maybe even spawn a conservative third party candidate, both of which would really help Obama.

  • phelbin

    Yup…the MSM is throwing softballs at Romney because contrary to the “electability” nonsense they’ve been peddling for the last couple years, they know that he’s the most beatable of the whole GOP field. 75% of Republicans can’t stand him, and his record (i.e. constant flip-flops and direct Wall Street ties) would be so easy for Obama to run against.

    I really wish conservatives would finally recognize that his supposed inevitability is a myth. 98% of the media are democrats. Why on earth would we listen to them about who we should nominate?

  • center77

    inverted people. Cain, piled on Perry when this happen, well karma has reeled its influx head. We can’t afford to run Romney or Cain. Period, and I have no idea if its true, but range, ten days.

  • http://www.doctor-bob.biz rsklaroff

    …that the candidate [and his spokespeople] don’t respond to direct queries as did his evaders last night on Geraldo…claiming this was a typical political accusation.

  • davesinsanantonio

    the titillation factor.

    A supposed sexual scandal is much more interesting to the masses than a monetary scandal. So, that is usually what they throw out to attack someone, ala Clarence Thomas.

    Of course, they ignore actual sexual misconduct by leftists if they can, and only take it up when the perp is sure to be take down by it, Or, when the perp is not as important as their own darling. E.g. they did not go after Edwards until it became necessary to clear the path for Obummer.

  • davesinsanantonio

    they have to run with it.

  • potato

    …started when he began talking. I can’t figure out why conservatives are for this guy.
    -2nd Amendment is a states rights issue (weak).
    -Wants to increase taxes on most Americans.
    -Defaults to “I’ll figure it out when I’m elected” with foreign policy issues.
    -Supports Romney so much I can’t figure out why he’s running against him.
    -Supports the Patriot Act.
    -Supports TARP bailouts.
    -Clueless on the economy. Think back to September 2008, weeks before the housing bubble crashed and the economy took a nosedive, then read this: http://004eeb5.netsolhost.com/hc126.htm

    It’s simply stunning this guy is polling higher than 1%.

  • renl57

    It’s already obvious that taking down Cain makes Perry the big winner.

    Perry lost a lot of Republicans to Cain, judging by the polls.

    And that makes the Perry camp suspect, just on that basis.

  • lightspeed

    What you heard was a third-hand rumor, nothing more than gossip. The validity of the charges against Cain remains to be seen. Unless you have something substantive to add to the discussion, shut up.

  • renl57

    “Sexual harassment” used to mean something definite: A boss demanding sexual favors from a subordinate in exchange for reward (a raise, a promotion, etc.)

    But feminists wouldn’t stop there. They so expanded and debased the term that just about any boss or senior level employee is guilty before proven innocent.

    Nowadays, any behavior that “makes a woman uncomfortable” or “contributes to a hostile climate” is called sexual harassment. Obviously these things are totally subjective.

    I was in that situation myself. I was a senior level engineer and I had become very fond of a female entry-level engineer. She had become fond of me too. There was no direct sexual harassment; in fact I had resolved to disqualify myself from any actions regarding her career, salary, or promotions.

    Nevertheless, I was told by Human Resources that our relationship could “create an uncomfortable climate” for other female employees.

    IOW, any female employee with a grudge against either one of us could shaft us. And there would be no defense–because how could I disprove that this female employee “felt uncomfortable”?

  • lightspeed

    It wouldn’t be the first time a powerful man had been falsely accused of sexual harassment. Clarence Thomas, anyone?

    Having said that, Cain needs to get out in front of this and handle it quickly. It may very well be true that women filed sexual harassment complaints about Cain. It may also be true that they were looking for a quick buck. Let’s wait until the story unfolds to see what it what.

  • gator_hoo

    I know what you are talking about, and it was his “clarification” in which he says he “misunderstood” John Stossel because he thought Stossel was talking about the President doing something on his own, which he didn’t feel was right. The problem is that in no context could Stossel be seen as making that point, and Cain said the same thing or similar statements in other interviews. Indeed, AFTER that clarification, he told Fox and Friends that abortion should not be a part of the political discussion.

    So, yes Cain said what you are talking about, he also has said things completely in conflict with what you are talking about. Which makes Cain another Romneylike politician, whose views are constantly changing. If he had a record on these issues, it might be easier to dismiss his conflicting statements, but he doesn’t.

  • politicalqrm

    Some women out there can take a look from a man and make it into a sexual harassment charge.

    One thing I’ve learned in the business world that once you are accepted into a group, things get more comfortable. If someone cursed over a situation or said an off-color remark, my response was to come back at them. I knew the men and knew their remarks were not a sexual harassment offense.

    And I have been the victim of real sexual harassment.

    If women in the business world think they should all be treated like the Virgin Mary, start your own business at home. You can’t handle the real world.

    We’ve had a president who’s had a sexual liaison in his private office off of the Oval Office for heaven’s sake and he got away with it. (thanks to weak kneed Republicans)

    I’m not letting this get in the way of a possible good candidate.

  • gator_hoo

    Not to be rude, but in both posts I said I wasn’t sure that anything happened, but noted that the Cain spokespeople have really mishandled the response. I don’t know why you would feel the need to point out the accusations might not be true when I was careful in both posts to make that exact point.

    Nonetheless, for a study in how not to handle this issue if it is not true, you should google the video of Cain’s spokesman on Geraldo, who on multiple questions would not give a clear denial or an explanation.

  • lightspeed

    Assuming the reported details are true, Cain should respond:

    “During my tenure as the head of the National Restaurant Association, there were complaints made against me of inappropriate behavior with female staff. These allegations were completely unfounded. In the course of my professional career, I have always treated members of the opposite sex with dignity and respect. At the time of the complaints, I consulted our legal counsel and was advised to quietly settle the complaints so that these baseless accusations would not distract from the important work I was enaged in at the time. It is regrettable, thought not unexpected, that the media would dredge up a hurtful story that in essense amounts to nothing.”

    Of course, if he doesn’t deny it head-on, maybe there is more to it. And if there is more to it, he had better have a good explaination. Only Democrats get a free pass with a sex scandal.

  • radicalrighty

    Nope. If these women got such packages, there’s your “proof in the pudding.”

    I hope for Herman’s sake, they didn’t.

  • lightspeed

    Complaints like these get handed over to the lawyers in any decent-sized organization. They will often settle cases just to make them go away, as fighting them in court can be even more costly. Plus, even in cases where the allegations are false, you can often have a dim-witted jury find against you.

  • lightspeed

    A separation package doesn’t mean it’s true. It may just mean it was less costly than going to trial and the organization didn’t want to risk an adverse judgement in a “he said, she said” case. It happens all the time. It does look bad, though.

  • lightspeed

    It is easy to hurl an allegation of sexual harassment and very hard to prove a negative.

  • thinkfirst1

    This has to rate as either one of the most ill-informed or intentionally-inaccurate statements in recent memory: “We have never seen a candidate publicly vetted before like this.” Huh?

    The “oppo dump” on Perry came first, only recently on Romney (the likely source of the Cain story), and now Cain. This is nothing new even for 2012.

    Before that was a mini-dump on Bachmann when she surged in Iowa, and before that a tsunami – much of it false – versus Sarah Palin. And how can we forget the John Edwards story?

    The time when this was most-needed was re. Obama about whom there still are massive gaps in his history and reservoirs of unasked and unanswered questions.

    As for Can he needs to avoid pulling the race card, avoid pointing-fingers, avoid playing the victim and man-up. This is either true or it is not true.

    If it is true that he beat one woman in court then another was allegedly paid hush money there is a pattern that implies a possible problem (in law enforcement we would definitely take a much closer look at an accused suspect). OTOH this could be his Clarence Thomas-moment.

    Rather than pretend that there is anything unique about a candidate facing some tough vetting we should celebrate getting this stuff out prior to the Primary and especially prior to the General. Meanwhile, we should demand that Obama face the same scrutiny and that he stops hiding his past at last.

  • bzip

    Amazing! Reading some of the comments and the defense of Cain is shocking. Even reading the beginning of Erick?s thread is amazing. Never seen a candidate vetting like this before, hogwash! Can we say Palin comes to mind, can we say the hit piece by WaPost story on Perry?s hunting ground and the rock? Just amazing.

    Either the Politico story is a big fake, made up by Politico or there is some truth to it. Do you honestly think the Politico is going to publish s completely fake made up story ? I don?t think so. On top of which the Cain campaign isn?t denying it based on Geraldo at Large interview http://youtu.be/gclK_CYyspE

    You do realize that Cain is running to be the next President of the United States, NOT the president if the tooth fairy association. Considering Cain hasn?t ever been fully vetted, never has held public office and is running for the POTUS don?t you think we ought to vet every aspect of this guy?

    Either these allegations will prove to be false, or true or never clearly addressed the fact of the a matter is Cain needs vetting and need to answer to these allegations where you think they are phony or not. Stop feeling sorry for the guy, he is running to be the next POTUS.

  • bzip

    I keep asking:
    For a guy who has never held elected office, has no governing experience could someone please explain to me why I should vote for Cain over someone that has 10 years of consistent conservative governing experience like Rick Perry?

    Could someone explain to me why I should (and all voters) stick their necks out for a guy like Cain?

    Why should we possible endanger our country electing a guy that has no experience, no record to look back and see how he would govern?

    I am not getting answers and surely no substance either.
    If words matter (they are the only way to judge Cain since he has no record) I truly wonder how I am supposed to judge Cain based on what I have heard so far.
    Cain was pro-choice or is pro-life
    Cain supported TARP
    Cain was for an electric fence or not
    Cain is for exchanging GITMO prisoners or not
    Cain is not for auditing the fed or not
    Cain and racial baiting
    Cain fellow blacks are brainwashed

    Cain?s 999 plan that starts a new national sales tax and VAT.
    Cain?s 999 plans that adds empowerment zones (affirmative action).
    Not very conservative proposal and surely leads to bigger gov?t.

    Help me to understand why you want voters to elect Cain?

  • arthurmanger17

    First he is an Uncle Tom, second he is an Oreo who doesn’t feel for his people. Then a sexual predator. So goes the story of Herman….Oops, Clarence Thomas. Watch how this plays out. Thomas fought back, became an excellent conservative jurist. After the lefts model of what a true Black leader is, Cain coming up so close to a presidential nomination after Obama cannot be allowed. We have seen how thin skinned Obama and his supporters are. Now will see how tough Cain is. It will not hurt, (this fight now) and can only help if he gets the nomination. Ted Kennedy lost his fight with Thomas, reason tells me his ghost will lose this one.

  • lakecrazy

    If The Restaurant Association paid the women, Mr Cain knew. He watched Sarah Palin have every part of her and her families life examined with a fine tooth comb. If he and his team were not completely prepared to respond to this accusation then he 1. is innocent or 2. not prepared to be POTUS.

  • Scope

    From an article I read at AT, when the settlement happened everyone involved in the matter is not allowed to talk about it, not Cain, not the womed, not the attorney’s or anyone. That will make it hard for Cain to defend it, as he can’t come out with any proof that this didn’t happen.

    When I heard this last night, I was disgusted that the media does this kind of garbage hit pieces on our candidates. I said I am not a Cain supporter, but this is an awful thing to do to him.

    This morning, reading down the comments, I am seeing Cain supporters, who read some comments on another article somewhere inferring that this was done by the Perry camp. That’s right, just from reading some comments by annoymous people some where. They are as bad and as guilty as the Politico. This is just like Bachmann saying that she “heard” that it was the Perry people who got the Tea Party guy to ask for her to get out of the race. She “heard” it, get that.

    I will never come out in Cain’s defense, or any other candidates for that matter, ever again, simply because some Cain supporters jump right on some comments they read somewhere indicating that it may have been the Perry camp. How about it might have been the Romney camp, with Romney’s supporters blaming the Perry camp. Nope, it was the Perry camp. How about it wasn’t any GOP camp that participated in this, and it was the left doing what they do best, smear tactics. Didn’t the left promise to wage a campaign of personal destruction against our candidates. Nope, it was the Perry camp. Disgusting.

    Let Cain suffer the same consequences by the left that he chose to participate in with the rock story against Perry. Yup, I guess what goes around comes around, doesn’t it.

  • http://www.doctor-bob.biz rsklaroff

    …which is focused:

    http://campaign2012.washingtonexaminer.com/blogs/beltway-confidential/morning-examiner-cain-fails-deny-harassmanet?utm_source=Morning%20Examiner:%20Cain%20fails%20to%20deny%20harassment%20-%2010/31/2011&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Washington%20Examiner:%20Morning%20Examiner

    October 31, 2011 8:05am
    0 Comments
    Morning Examiner: Cain fails to deny harassment byConn Carroll Senior Editorial Writer
    Follow on Twitter:@conncarroll

    On the very same day that The Des Moines Register published their much anticipated poll of Iowa voters showing that Herman Cain was leading the Republican field at 23%, Politico published a story reporting that the National Restaurant Association paid two former female employees five-figure separation packages in exchange for non-disclosure agreements relating to their accusations of sexual harassment against him.

    If left unrefuted, allegations of past sexual harassment will surely sink Cain?s campaign. Cain?s response to the charges so far has been to deflect, not deny them. Reached for comment by Politico, Cain said he would not comment ?until I see some facts or concrete evidence.? Given the name of one of the women involved, Cain said, ?I am not commenting on that.? Asked point blank, ?Have you ever been accused, sir, in your life of harassment by a woman?? Cain only answered with a question, ?Have you ever been accused of sexual harassment??

    Cain?s campaign later issued an official response to the story, but it was a classic non-denial denial. The statement,issued by spokesman J.D. Gordon, calls the Politico story ?thinly sourced? but never specifically denies the charges.

    The Associated Press followed up with Gordon and pressed him for a firm denial. This is the best they got from him: ?These are baseless allegations. To my knowledge, this is not an accurate story.?

    Notice the qualifier: ?To my knowledge.? Gordon did not say that he had talked to Herman Cain and that Cain denied the story. Just that, to his knowledge, Gordon did not think it was true. This is another insufficient response.

    Cain is supposed to visit the American Enterprise Institute to stump for his 9-9-9 tax plan today, and is also scheduled to speak at a luncheon at the National Press Club. Unless Cain wants the rest of his campaign to be about sexual harassment, he must directly answer these charges as soon as possible.

  • Scope

    Do you know those people who are sending out tweets. There have been people posting here since Perry got in that the crap hasn’t hit the fan yet on Perry, and that when all this info. comes out he is done.

    You people make me sick with your speculating, and pointing fingers at things and people you have no idea about. For all I know you are a Romney supporter coming here to spread rumors about the Perry camp to make them look bad. Isn’t that just how bad it has gotten with all of them, including Cain himself.

  • bzip

    Personally I am sick to death of people blaming the Perry Camp for their candidates problems. First Bachmamn wants to blame Perry for her problems now Cain wants to blame Perry for his problems.

    Stop with the blame game and start owning up to your own candidates problems.

  • Scope

    that it was a Perry backer on Twitter. Is it possible it could have been a Romney backer posing as a Perry backer to make him look bad? Is it fair or wise to even speculate on who was the leaker?

  • http://www.doctor-bob.biz rsklaroff

    …but CANDOR is required!

  • lineholder

    about the source that’s already running rampant across the blogosphere this morning, my own opinion is that I’m just going to steer clear of it. This type of attack is far more characteristic of the left, not the right. Onemovoter is right…this is the kind of situation where people could be far too quick to make assumptions and pass judgment based on circumstances rather than solid facts.

  • doncorleone

    That the state-runs and “liberals and progressives” have all of this extra energy to release. Since, they kind of skipped all of that vetting on billy, barry, teddy, jimmy, johnny, et cetera, et cetera.

  • lineholder

    please, leave this one be. Yes, it exists. It’s posted at another website. No, I’m not posting the link. Speculation is already running rampant as it is. I’m trying to keep from feeding into that, okay?

    We need to stay focused on the issues and on beating Obama.

  • avagreen

    >em>”Sometimes I really dislike my own sex…..” </em?

    So do I when I see women do such a bendover backwards attempt to automatically blame the woman in an instance like this w/o any investigation at all on their part.

    My last job was working with a rape crisis center. This attitude is common toward women who are survivors of rape and incest.

    The only reason Clinton "got away with it" , as you say, was this very type of attitude toward the victim, and his Fans not wanting this "to get in the way of a good candidate."

    You'd think we would learn.

  • http://www.doctor-bob.biz rsklaroff

    is in real-time @ MSNBC

    his campaign chief-of-staff expresses confidence in him, even as he avoids any direct-denial lingo

    the AEI event is not yet on-line

    http://www.aei.org/event/100493

  • http://www.doctor-bob.biz rsklaroff

    …his admission that he doesn’t know foreign policy.

  • avagreen

    ….it’s early, not much sleep, and no coffee.

  • libdestroyer

    I wouldn’t put it past Perry’s team. I’m surprised Perry has been going after Romney and not Cain considering Cain took his votes. Might be a reaction to the Iowa poll results showing Herman in the lead.

    Perry is an attacker. It would be no surprise. But then again it could easily be romney.

  • libdestroyer

    Are you living on planet Earth? Every cain story that appears positive is almost ALWAYS appended with “but… “

  • http://www.doctor-bob.biz rsklaroff

    http://www.jsonline.com/watchdog/noquarter/state-firms-cash-to-herman-cain-may-breach-federal-campaign-tax-laws-132898423.html

    State firm’s cash to Herman Cain may breach federal campaign, tax laws

    Oct. 30, 2011

    Herman Cain’s two top campaign aides ran a private Wisconsin-based corporation that helped the GOP presidential candidate get his fledgling campaign off the ground by originally footing the bill for tens of thousands of dollars in expenses for such items as iPads, chartered flights and travel to Iowa and Las Vegas – something that might breach federal tax and campaign law, according to sources and documents.

    Internal financial records obtained by No Quarter show that Prosperity USA said it was owed about $40,000 by the Cain campaign for a variety of items in February and March. Cain began taking donations for his presidential bid on Jan. 1.

    Prosperity USA was owned and run by Wisconsin political operatives Mark Block and Linda Hansen, Cain’s current chief of staff and deputy chief of staff, respectively.

    The authenticity of the records was verified by two individuals close to the firm.

    It is not known if Cain’s election fund eventually paid back Prosperity USA, which now appears defunct. The candidate’s federal election filings make no mention of the debt, and the figures in the documents don’t match payments made by the candidate’s campaign.

    In addition to picking up these expenses at least initially, Prosperity USA also paid as much as $100,000 to the Congress of Racial Equality, a conservative black organization, shortly before Cain was a featured speaker at the group’s annual Martin Luther King Jr. dinner in mid-January.

    Cain, who has surged to a top-tier presidential candidate in the past month, apparently was not paid for the appearance. The personal financial disclosure forms for the former CEO of Godfather’s Pizza list no honorariums for speeches.

    Election law experts say the transactions raise a host of questions for the private organization, which billed itself as a tax-exempt nonprofit, and the Cain team.

    “If the records accurately reflect what occurred, this is way out of bounds,” said a Washington, D.C.-based election lawyer who advises many Republican candidates and conservative groups on campaign issues. The lawyer asked not to be identified because of those affiliations.

    Michael Maistelman, a Wisconsin campaign attorney, agreed.

    “The number of questionable and possibly illegal transactions conducted on behalf of Herman Cain is staggering,” said Maistelman, a Democrat who has represented politicians from both parties on campaign issues.

    Block and Hansen have not returned numerous calls in recent days.

    Late Friday, Block sent an email saying: “Will be able to respond to you, but need to schedule time to review questions. Obviously in the midst of a Presidential campaign I cannot drop everything.”

    For decades, Block worked behind the scenes for several conservative candidates and causes in Wisconsin. He is best known in the state for his role as campaign manager for former state Supreme Court Justice Jon Wilcox in 1997. Accused of election law violations, Block settled the case by agreeing to pay a $15,000 fine and to stay out of Wisconsin politics for three years.

    More recently, Block, 57, ran the state chapter of Americans for Prosperity, a nonprofit cofounded by the conservative Koch brothers that helped organize the tea party movement in Wisconsin and elsewhere.

    It was through Americans for Prosperity that Block met Cain and encouraged him to run for national office. Block’s role with the Cain campaign became a point of national interest in the past week when a bizarre online campaign ad featuring the chain-smoking Wisconsin operative went viral.

    In recent years, Block spun off a handful of organizations from Americans for Prosperity, most of them incorporating “prosperity” in the name. Officials with Americans for Prosperity emphasize that these other groups were legally separate from their organization.

    The largest group founded by Block was called Wisconsin Prosperity Network, which was supposed to be an umbrella organization that would spend more than $6?million a year underwriting a dozen or so other conservative groups in the hopes of turning the state red.

    In the 2008 incorporation papers, Block is listed as the president of Wisconsin Prosperity Network, which was set up as a tax-exempt nonprofit group. That means the charitable organization cannot have direct political involvement. Hansen was the group’s executive director.

    Last year, Block started up Prosperity USA, another tax-exempt charitable group for which Block appeared to be the sole board member. Again, Hansen handled the day-to-day operations.

    Insiders familiar with the groups say the two groups were closely linked and raised hundreds of thousands of dollars from prominent conservatives around the state. One supporter, who asked that his name not be used because he still supports Cain and other conservatives, said he and many others were deeply upset with the groups – and Hansen, in particular – for failing to use the money for its intended purposes.

    Internal financial records show both organizations were operating in the black during the first half of 2010.

    But by early this year, expenses were far outpacing income at the two entities. Balance sheets showed Wisconsin Prosperity Network was more than $62,000 in the hole by early February; Prosperity USA was in even worse shape, with its liabilities exceeding its assets by $110,000.

    In fact, the records indicate Prosperity USA’s biggest asset was nearly $40,000 that it was owed by “FOH,” a reference to Friends of Herman Cain, the name of Cain’s presidential operation.

    A more detailed checking account says the Cain campaign owed nearly $15,000 for an “Atlanta invoice,” about $17,000 for chartered flight service and $5,000 for travel and meetings in Iowa, Las Vegas, Houston, Dallas and Louisiana. The document says the Cain campaign had been billed $3,700 for iPads purchased on Jan. 4.

    A series of small-ticket items for travel and expenses by Block are listed as “not billed to FOH but due from them.”

    The national election expert who works with GOP candidates said it would be a violation of the tax code for Prosperity USA to advance money to the Cain campaign for these items. She said there also are strict federal election regulations on reporting debts and incurring travel obligations.

    “I just don’t see how they can justify this,” she said. “It’s a total mess.”

    The records suggest that Prosperity USA had been underwriting travel for Cain even before he announced his plans to run for president.

    For instance, one document says the group was to be paid $5,000 for the costs associated with Cain’s speech in September 2010 to the conservative Right Nation rally in Chicago, an event that the records say Cain attended at the request of Americans for Prosperity. The Cain campaign later used a segment from that speech in a campaign ad.

    Along with these expenses, the internal records note Prosperity USA paid for such items as Block’s trip to Washington, D.C., to meet with billionaire philanthropist David Koch. Singer Krista Branch, who recorded “I Am America,” the unofficial anthem of the tea party movement, was supposed to be paid $3,000 by the Wisconsin group.

    Cain has adopted the tune as his campaign song. Branch’s husband, Michael, who wrote the song, has been paid $11,250 in his role as the Cain campaign’s Tennessee director and $7,360 as a fundraising consultant.

    More intriguing, the records show Prosperity USA received $150,000 in loans from individuals who could not be identified.

    Sources familiar with the group say Hansen paid much of the loan money earlier this year to the Congress of Racial Equality, a former civil rights organization that now promotes conservative causes. In mid-January, Cain was a featured speaker at the group’s annual awards dinner, which was hosted by controversial conservative blogger Andrew Breitbart.

    The Congress of Racial Equality is headed by Niger Innis, who did not return calls last week. He and his father, Roy Innis, made several appearances at Wisconsin tea party events in the past.

    Several board members for Prosperity USA and Wisconsin Prosperity Network resigned from the organization when they learned after the fact that Hansen had borrowed this money and donated much of it to the conservative group, according to insiders.

    In the summer, the attorney for the two groups, Michael Dean, resigned as the registered agent for Wisconsin Prosperity Network in a letter filed with the state Department of Financial Institutions. Sources say he also contacted the Internal Revenue Service regarding the group’s application for tax-exempt status.

    Reached at home last week, Dean declined to comment.

    Even though there is little or no evidence that the Wisconsin Prosperity Network is still functioning, the group is one of the listed litigants in a case currently before the state Supreme Court.

    The trail of red ink left by Block and Hansen, however, extends beyond the private entities they founded.

    Several conservatives say the state chapter of Americans for Prosperity was left with a stack of unpaid invoices totaling tens of thousands of dollars when Block officially left the organization at the start of the year.

    Matt Seaholm, who replaced Block as the director of the state chapter, declined to discuss the group’s finances.

    “I’ll leave that to the national office,” Seaholm said.

    A spokesman for Americans for Prosperity in Virginia did not return calls Friday.

  • libdestroyer

    Gator, I was disconcerted when I heard Cain say that. That is NOT the candidate I support and I think most of his supporters agree with me.

    That’s why Cain promptly dropped the issue.

  • bzip

    Let the vetting proceed. Its about time for proper vetting. We aren’t electing the president of the tooth fairy association we are suppose to be electing the POTUS don’t you think we ought to vet every aspect of the person…perhaps some don’t believe that.

  • gritsandall

    conservative black man with this type of slander? If he is guilty, why have these women gotten their checks? The same arguments went around when Justice Thomas was being vetted. Proof never emerged; but, it did not bother liberals who cannot stand to see a black man succeed unless they have designed him. I have not made a choice at this point. I like Cain’s economic experience. As far as foreign affairs go, I doubt many candidates on either side of the political spectrum have experience until they get elected. If they are wise they will bring experience into their cabinet and listen. If they are like our President, they just sit there and vaccilate, refusing to take instruction because they are arrogant. I’ve considered supporting Cain monetarily because of all the unfair attacks.

  • circlegranch

    so if there’s anybody in this on the GOP side that has a motive to attack Cain, its Romney. And, yet again, Obama’s state-run media gets a pass. Don’t you think Obama would like to take Cain out and keep Romney on that path to the nomination?

    As sleazy as this issue is, Cain is now in the Big Leagues. THis is how the game is played. We’ll see if he’s fit for the task. Nobody was crying foul when Ron Paul’s people took out ads looking for women that had been intimately involved w/ Perry. Perry was having fun with a relaxed audience in NH on Friday (where he knows he can’t win, so why not have some fun anyway?) and he’s being accused of being drunk. Mika Brezenski on Morning Joe claimed he sounded like he was on Rx drugs and red wine. Nobody mentions his good interview yesterday; only digging for a negative.

    Welcome to politics as usual and politics of personal destruction, Mr. Cain.

  • retire05

    Yeah, I noticed how all the anti-Perry people are quick to jump up and express their opinion how it was probably the Team Perry who leaked it. Now, I’m not going to say that could not happen, but I know that Team Perry had lots of dirt on Tony Sanchez, Kinky Friedman and KBH, but didn’t use it.

    People can say anything in response to an article or a blog such as “I heard that Team Perry people were claiming to have some “dirt” on Cain”, yada, yada, yada, but basically, it is outside the loop people running their mouths and acting like they are inside the loop. They’re not.

    The WaPo article about the “rock” was just one of negative stories that WaPo had been running about Perry, starting weeks before he even got in the race. But a “racist” story is damaging, true or not. People read the headline and get no farther. So in their minds, Perry had a rock painted with a racial slur and that’s the end of that. Don’t think that conservatives are any more logical than liberals. Some of the comments here today prove that to be a fallacy.

    This story has all the earmarks of being a left wing attack. I don’t even think Romney would risk his “nice guy” persona by leaking such a story. And from what I read, it appeared to me that Politico had been working on the story for weeks. The story actually read, to me, more like some of the opposition research put out by Obama about Hillary. At least that is the feel I took from it. Remember when Bill Clinton got so p!ssed saying the Obama administration called him a “racist?”

    I don’t know if the story has legs or not. If it does, it will come out in the next week, or it will disappear like a Texas rock. I do know that the damage is done. The Cain story will become the story of the week, especially after Cain’s campaign managers weak responses to Geraldo. How badly it hurts Cain remains to be seen. But politics ain’t beanbag. Remember, Andrew Jackson fought a duel because a reporter called his wife a prostitute. There is a lot at stake for Team Obama. He has no acceptable record to run on so the only way for him to win is to take out his opponents, one by one.

    Memo to Newt, Santorum and Bachmann: the onslaught is about to start.

  • circlegranch

    Why is everybody missing the obvious source? If you all don’t think Obama’s re-elect team is hard at work on stuff like this on every single GOP candidate, you’re asleep at the switch. Buckle up, there’s lots more to come on all of them. By the time we get to convention, our candidate will have a huge mountain to climb to get to the WH. A billion dollars, and a compliant media is poised to get Obama re-elected.

    Haley Barbour said a few weeks ago there’s still 80% of information that has impact on the GOP nomination still to be rolled out. If Mr. Cain is completely guiltless in this, it’ll be quick and easy to prove. Supporters usually stand even firmer when their person is attacked so he’s going to be ok. This is a test of his strength and endurance for the long haul. This is what he’ll face every single day as the nominee and then as president.

  • retire05

    You’re right; Perry is an attacker. But he is not a gutter fighter. He is straight up, mano e mano. And smart enough to know that if it ever got out it was his team that leaked that information, his goose would be cooked.

    You want to blame another Republican. Why is that? Isn’t it Obama that has the most to lose?

    Perry has been going after Romney because the sure money is on Romney, not Cain. And the fact that Romney has devoted an entire website to attacking not just Perry, but Texas, as well. Charlie Cook, who is great at predicting political outcomes says it will be a Perry/Romney race. So at this point, you are just speculating, or is it wishful thinking on your part?

  • texasroots

    I smell Rove in this. He is known to use “sexual” stories on opponents. In Texas against Ann Richards, Rove accused her of being a lesbian. I am a Perry supporter, but do not like the sexual attacks on anyone, it’s very dirty!

  • circlegranch

    and they were successful in destroying his candidancy. After Ryan, Alan Keyes stepped up (he was the original person that questioned Obama’s birth place) and they destroyed Keyes and he’s never recovered politically.

    Funny how Obama, even back then, could get the records of others opened but still can’t get his own college transcripts, grades, college financing records, etc., opened.

    With this background and history of delving into private records, its obvious who is behind this attack on Mr.Cain. The late night comedy show attacks haven’t worked; he continues to rise in popularity. Time for the WH to play hardball.

  • Warrior

    The left was frightened silly of Sarah Palin because they knew there was no dirt there and she was impervious to ersatz charges of racism.

    Herman Cain is also impervious to charges of racism, but is all to suseptible to the usual smears – like an oh-so-phony “sexual harrassment” charge. Sarah Palin was also impervious to conjured charges of “sexual harrassment” for obvious reasons.

    However, now that the geniuses on the right have convinced her not to run, we must back Herman Cain, whom I happen to like BTW. 9-9-9 would reallly get this country moving again, along with the death of obamacare.

    He’s not my first choice, obviously, but he is OUR only hope now. I would almost rather have Hillary than Mitt.

    Remember how the left attacked Clarence Thomas shamelessly with trumped-up charges by the allegedly mentally unstable law professor Anita Hill. We will just have to endure.

    Molon Labe

  • retire05

    Do you think it is right for people to jump up and automatically accuse another candidate of being the force behind the story? I darn sure don’t. A Twitter follower? Good God, man, how do we know it wasn’t one of the Ron Paul crazies that follow him around? Ron Paul people have been putting out actual lies about Rick Perry for two years since Paul backed Debra Medina in the gubernatorial race last year. Paul is also good friends with another bit of pond scum, 9-11 truther Alex Jones. That should surprise no one considering Paul’s assication with Lew Rockwell that has endured for years.

    So to think that anyone who is anonymously posting on Twitter is definately a Perry supporter is absurd.

  • Finrod

    Do you honestly think the Politico is going to publish a completely fake made up story ? I don?t think so.

    Let me guess, you’ve never heard of the Politico before this story? It’s either that or you don’t have two neurons in your head to rub together. OF COURSE they’ll run a completely fake made-up story. It gets them pageviews, and they, like every other majorish media site, have done it before.

    Your anti-Cain knee-jerk reaction is showing.

  • retire05

    Yes, the judge sealed Ryan’s divorce procedures because of the Ryan kids. It was David Alexrod, who went to his buddies at the Chicago newpaper and had them file suit to release the divorce procedures. The newspaper won the FOA suit, and released the scandal that was the Ryan divorce. Ryan dropped out, Obama ran unopposed and won. But the bottom line was it was David Alexrod behind the whole smear campaign against Ryan.

    That was Chicago politics then and is Chicago politics now.

  • lineholder

    I’m dead serious on this…leave it be. It wasn’t anonymous.

  • 1bunny

    Cain’s campaign is reminding me of Obama’s. This article you posted (and thank you for that) makes me think of David Axelrod and ilk. And does anyone else think of Obama czars when Cain says he doesn’t know about a subject but will hire the best advisors? I have this horrible sinking feeling when I think of the non-vetting Obama got and here we go with a candidate on the Republican side going through the non-vetting too. At the least the Politico bomb will start the vetting process. I think all candidates running for the highest office needs to be vetted. Their records should be looked at and analyzed. I want someone who can and will stand on their record and that their record is a good one. No more amateurs for president!

  • arcjef

    Is Politico and media elite playing the “Dozens” with Herman Cain? Is the Republican power elite playing the “Dozens” with Herman Cain? Better still are the Democrats, Republicans, and Media elites all playing the “Dozens” with Herman Cain? I think they are fearful of the rising Herman Cain……

  • rockymtn1776

    What took the Dems so long to attack Cain ? When he was a relative nobody they could care less, then he becomes well known and people like him ! Anyone who has any chance of winning is going to have every dirty trick in the book thrown at them. True or not , no matter, they have to be destroyed at all costs ! There is dirty politics and cess pool politics…Americans voters hate both !

  • westcoastpatriette

    is that none of these kinds of allegations are made by the men. IMO, when women walk around the office baring so much cleavage that it’s embarrassing or skirts so short they cannot bend over without exposing themselves, that should be grounds for sexual harassment.

    A man would be just as justified in saying “You are making me uncomfortable exposing yourself to me,” as a woman claiming a man looked at her the wrong way. But then, all that would be too politically incorrect to suggest.

  • Scope

    You should have thought about “leaving it be” before posting comments above to go and look at the comments on the McCain article. I just went and read those comments, and many are already pointing the finger at the Perry camp. Shouldn’t you have just left it alone at that point?

    BTW, Robert Stacy McCain hates Rick Perry, and has been on the Cain Train. McCain also carried the Jamie Radtke RedState story for far longer than it should have been in the news. He interviewed Radtke, took her word as gospel, and bashed RedState and kept that story alive long after it should have been dead.

  • http://www.doctor-bob.biz rsklaroff

    …Cain just said that he was unaware of the actions of the Restaurant Association contemporaneously; this will need to be vetted, of course.

  • rightwingmom52

    It’s not only difficult for men in the workplace, but try raising a boy in today’s feminist society. The girls wear push-up bras and short shorts that scream “Look at me”, but the boys aren’t supposed to notice? And it’s like mother, like daughter, because I saw the mom’s dress the same way when my son was in high school.

    I’ve actually complained at my workplace at the way some of the women dress to no avail.

    And I can’t count the number of times my husband has come home and told me of situations he’s confronted with, only to have me advise him he needs to have a witness or can’t say certain things or needs to go through H/R or whatever, to the point that it’s ridiculous.

    It’s to the point now, right or wrong, that when I hear an accusation, I give the benefit of the doubt to the male.

  • skep41

    OK. Let’s see…called an ignorant retard? CHECK! Attempted racial smear-attack? CHECK! Ancient sexual harassment allegations by anonymous accusers who dont have to publicly come forward? CHECK! The test is complete…Cain is a real conservative! Now it only remains for Chuckie Schumer to release his credit card records to the media and hire a bunch of Union thugs to throw Oreo cookies at him when he speaks to underscore the fact. If there isnt one of these babes making the charges with the guts to confront Cain on the record, using her real name and standing in front of the cameras, then this little piece of scum is exactly what it seems to be…opposition research hogwash. Which creep is responsible for this slime attack? Romney? Nah. Too focused on Perry. Perry? Nah. Cain’s not his problem, he’s his own problem. Obama? YEW BETCHA! Anything less than 95% of the black vote finishes him for good. A real conservative unites the country against him. Cain is the Dem’s worst nightmare.

  • Scope

    was there in fact settlement/settlements made by the Restaurant Assoc. on behalf of allegations against Cain, whether the charges are true or not? If there in fact was any settlement, then Cain saying that he is unaware of any actions by the Rest. Assoc., makes him a very untruthful person. If the settlement exists, he knows about it because it involved him.

  • retire05

    comparison of Anita Hill, is that Hill never made the accusations UNTIL Thomas was being vetted for the SCOTUS, and in fact, had actually requested a transfer to be able to follow Thomas in his new position, the one he held prior to nomination for SCOTUS.

    These women, according to Politico, did not remain with the firm but instead, took a payoff to leave and let the issue die. Major differences in the two cases.

    We all suspect that Obama would rather run against Romney than any of the others. That means that in order to do that, the GOP candidates have to be picked off, one by one. Rocks, Confederate license plates, accusations of racism, and women who have been sexually harrassed are death to any candidate. Perry has withstood the rock/license plate accusations. And his answers were solid.

    Cain, unfortunately, is being very evasive. And his campaign manage on Geraldo last night was a major fail.

  • http://www.examiner.com/x-1597-Charlotte-Law--Politics-Examiner Mike gamecock DeVine

    the government. I saw so much ridiculousness esp including settling frivilous lawsuits on that and alleged race discrimination that I just opted out of such situations by remaining a sole proprietor or corp counsel for small companies.

  • redmymind

    I think you make insightful points, rightwingmom52 and westcostpatriette. There is certainly a good deal of asymmetry out there as far as norms in the workplace. Now, regarding this breaking development, we would all be served by getting to the facts ASAP. I am not a Cain supporter, but will stand with his supporters with equal indignation if this turns out to be nothing but pure smear.

  • http://www.doctor-bob.biz rsklaroff

    It would appear that the Restaurant Association would not be gagged from corroborating whether he knew of what transpired.

  • rightwingmom52

    Ridiculous to the point that you can’t do your job for worrying about where the next hit is coming from. Way too much time spent calling H/R departments for advice on situations that used to be handled by the individual.

    Even in a fire at will state like Alabama, it’s astounding the number of hoops an employer has to jump through to fire an employee. I’ve heard of 2 situations recently where the employee was embezzling from the company. One was fired and is now suing the former employer for unemployment benefits. In the other, the company is trying to dot the i’s and cross the t’s before firing.

    And a grudging congrats on your win. Clean game (unlike Arkansas vs. Vandy), and hard-fought. If only we’d had Bray…….

  • carolynr

    You don’t know who did this and already you are blaming Perry. I never thought that Cain was ready for prime time…but..these tactics would benefit one person..Obama. How would the Black vote come down with Herman Cain in the WH and the high unemployment among Blacks and this country is a mess?

  • carolynr

    I don’t know whether these are true or not..but I do know that in some large corporations, they pay off the complainer rather than have it vetted, thus making it look like the other is guilty. I am not a Cain support. I like Perry…but do you see the wisdom in TX program of Loser Pays…it stops this crap. Lots of times people make allegations that are not true…for money…I had a brother-in-law that made a career out of it…and he finally got paid.

    Again, I come back to my statement about Cain. He says A to X, B to Y and the claims he is being taken out of context by both of them when relating to Z. Too fuzzy for me.

  • http://www.examiner.com/x-1597-Charlotte-Law--Politics-Examiner Mike gamecock DeVine

    The fact that the Left/Dems championed the false sex harass/race claims helped start me towards the conservative epiphany…

  • http://www.examiner.com/x-1597-Charlotte-Law--Politics-Examiner Mike gamecock DeVine

    would settle obvious frivilous cases. I never lost a case I was hired to challenge.

  • daniel22

    if you lived in the real world of management then you would know that the point made by renl57 was correct if not downplayed. Firms have been sued and lost when a person was married leaving three other persons not chosen. It was under sexual harrassment laws that these suits were prosecuted!!!
    Cain getting Borkeed is no joke. It is just the possibility of charges that can and will scare off supporters and votes. This benefits the progressives more than anybody. The ways that it can be played are innumerable. So if all you want to do is troll get out.

  • rightwingmom52

    Since you’re the attorney (and I can’t practice law as a paralegal), would you address the issue of non-disclosure agreements being binding on both parties? Some here are stating that only the women are bound by any non-disclosure agreement which, as I have always understood it, is not the case.

    Thanks, and I’ll be crowing for the Gamecocks to win the SEC East , but that’s as far as I can go since they’ll likely meet up with the Crimson Tide.

  • carolynr

    First, I am not a Cain supporter. I am for Perry. However, look at this from a logical perspective. What does our current administration do best…DIVIDE AND CONQUER. They have pitted, white against black, rich against poor, cities against cities, educated again uneducated, gun owners again the Brady Bill bunch, pro-life against pro-choice, gays against straight, Christian against other religions. Get my point.
    So….it looks like a pattern of behavior…it looks like Saul Alinsky to me.

    What do we do as Conservatives…we buy into this dog and pony show because of our picks and then blame OUR VERY OWN CANDIDATES for this story that was leaked. People…look at the evidence…who does this kind of thing? Who funded and started the Arab Spring and OWS…The OBAMA ADMINISTRATION. Yet..here we are blaming our very own people. United we stand, divided we fall…it is that simple.

    Concerning whether it is true, Cain is going to have to give a yes or no answer HIMSELF…not us…himself. If he is guilty of the accusation, then let the people decide. Blaming it on other candidates keeps the focus off the ball…and we all know who does that so VERY, VERY WELL…OBAMA.

    If any of you read my posts, you know I do not like Romney. Do I think he would do this or Perry…or any other candidate…No. Further proof of this is the darn debates..Most left wing moderators…pitt the candidates against each other…AND NO SUBSTANCE COMES OUT…and Obama salivates. Let’s let the chips fall where they may. Presidential candidate aides that read this…SHUT UP. Let Herman explain.

  • tngal

    Um, he did explain. its all over the web. Harrassment charges baseless. Investigation determined baseless. Didn’t know the association he was with chose to pay the women a fee.
    But baseless is in the eye of the beholder. Its up to the women to come up now and tell us what the nuance was. Or the gesture.

    Other women have been quoted as finding him nice to be around. Whose to say.

  • carolynr

    My point is this. Please read by post. Who does this sound like? The tactic?

    I don’t think that any of the Republicans did this of leaked it. I do know who has used this in the past. The problem seems to be a gag order…I am guessing, I don’t know. But if I were a Cain supporter, I would answer it straight forward. Why were these people paid? If I were Herman…I’d find out…QUICKLY

  • rightwingmom52

    with the “gal” thing. That’s exactly the sort of thing some women with no sense would be offended by.

    I, on the other hand, have plenty of common sense, and realize that you are aware I am a happily, married woman who is familiar with the terms of friendship used in the South. At least that’s how I’ve always taken it.

  • avagreen

    First, his response was this:
    Taking a deep breath and throwing the same question back at the reporter.

    He breathed audibly, glared at the reporter and stayed silent for several seconds. After the question was repeated three times,/strong> he responded by asking the reporter, ?Have you ever been accused of sexual harassment??
    http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1011/67162.html

    Now, he’s saying this:
    WASHINGTON ? Republican presidential candidate Herman Cain’s campaign denied allegations Sunday that he was accused of sexual harassment twice while he was the head of the National Restaurant Association in the 1990s.
    http://www.newsmax.com/InsideCover/Cain-Harassment/2011/10/30/id/416218?s=al&promo_code=D5EC-1

    So, which is it? Glaring, breathing audibly (innocent people don’t do this), refusing to answer (3x), and then throwing back the same question to questioner?

    Or, that the allegations never happened? Why didn’t he just say that when asked?

    Can’t have it both ways.

  • kauaicat

    the most trivial potential or actual lawsuits go away. The operative phrase is “cut your losses”.

    It’s a given in the business community that paying $5,000 to $15,000 in immediate settlement will prevent the expenditure of an equivalent amount in legal fees for depositions and filings pre-trial, and then having to settle for a similar amount, not to mention the opportunity cost from being unable to pursue normal business.

    The whole incident could be the sexual harrassment equivalent of a slip-and-fall accident, i.e. the two women could have overheard an off-color joke told by Cain, and seized on the opportunity for some quick cash, which would fall in the five-figure range quoted. The confidentiality agreement would be required to prevent others from getting the same idea to make some quick money.

  • politicalqrm

    at even a smile in the office while primping themselves when a man comes in the office, then screaming harassment if they are approached. Believe me, they are out there.

    No, I was never raped or had incest committed upon me. So my “attitude” cannot be attributed to those horrendous acts. Talk about making a generalization. Just for the record, happily married.

    If you have heard Mr. Cain, he said, yes, there was a charge of sexual harassment, but no, he did not commit a sexual harassment act. Big difference.

    Seeing the PC culture in the business world where workers have to take courses in sexual harassment and sensitivity training, half the time people are even afraid to open their mouths in the work place. I don’t think Mr. Cain would put all that he worked for at the risk of doing something so stupid. He seems too smart for that.

    And, ever think this could have been racially motivated? Some women do not like a strong, black man. I don’t know their race, but it is a possibility.

  • lightspeed

    I was responding to citizenkh. I agree with you and renl57.

  • earlgrey

    the workplace more hostile to women in the workplace.

    I also think women know women much better than men, and yes there are women that will think they are being hit on by just about anything or find a way to claim sexual harrassment over just about anything.

    It undermines the development of a good working relationship between male and female co-workers.

  • avagreen

    Repost:
    First, his response was this:
    Taking a deep breath and throwing the same question back at the reporter.

    He breathed audibly, glared at the reporter and stayed silent for several seconds. After the question was repeated three times,/strong> he responded by asking the reporter, ?Have you ever been accused of sexual harassment??
    http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1011/67162.html

    Now, he?s saying this:
    WASHINGTON ? Republican presidential candidate Herman Cain?s campaign denied allegations Sunday that he was accused of sexual harassment twice while he was the head of the National Restaurant Association in the 1990s.
    http://www.newsmax.com/InsideCover/Cain-Harassment/2011/10/30/id/416218?s=al&promo_code=D5EC-1

    So, which is it? Glaring, breathing audibly (innocent people don?t do this), refusing to answer (3x), and then throwing back the same question to questioner?

    Or, that the allegations never happened? Why didn?t he just say that when asked?

    Can’t have it both ways.

  • avagreen

    This is yet to be determined.

  • earlgrey

    of doubt.

    Of course I didn’t really pay any attention to the allegations against Arnold when he ran for CA GOV, and look how that turned out.

  • bzip

    I think your mind is in the gutter!

    You might try asking Cain some questions, after all it is Cain’s problem:

    Why did his campaign obfuscate the question until today?

    Why did Cain know he had sexual harassment charges filed on him ? but NOT know the NRA paid these women a settlement?

    Why did the NRA pay these women a settlement ? if, as Cain says ? they did an investigation and found the charges to be balony?

    Why did Cain make a run for the Presidency of the United States without digging into this himself ? and coming up with a plan to address it when someone brought it up?

    Did Cain believe this wasn?t significant enough to be brought up? Really?

    If Herman Cain can?t get out in front of the Liberal Media ? how?s he going to get out in front of the Iranian Nuke Program.

  • williamjameson

    in how Politico received the story and how they garnered sealed court documents. Its still a crime to release sealed court docs. Again its a small story, the size of the settlement suggests its nothing worth the witch hunt.

    RACISM is the real issue, liberals attacking the man because of the color of his skin. MSNBC is well known for racism, perhaps Politico is too. Its time to play dirty and start accusing these scumbag using guerrilla tactics!!!

  • http://www.examiner.com/x-1597-Charlotte-Law--Politics-Examiner Mike gamecock DeVine

    I turned down positions with the biggest law firm in ATL in the 80s and with the federal government in the 2000s because I refused to go by less than the Golden Rule.

    And when I took a Corp Counsel job in Charlotte in 2006 I insisted on getting stock and being personally liable for any claims because I refuse to not be my good natured self.

    PERIOD.

  • http://www.examiner.com/x-1597-Charlotte-Law--Politics-Examiner Mike gamecock DeVine

    agree to.

  • http://www.examiner.com/x-1597-Charlotte-Law--Politics-Examiner Mike gamecock DeVine

    are totally bogus, but that timid companies settle to avoid the publicity and legal fees. and the risk of stupid juries and judges.

  • westcoastpatriette

    I pretty much did the same thing–had to pull out of my profession because so much of what was expected of me went against my personal beliefs and conscience.

    Have never regretted it. I have worked as an independent contractor and the freedom is wonderful. So are most people–its the system that creates the paranoia by obsessing over racism, sexism, blah, blah, blah.

  • http://www.examiner.com/x-1597-Charlotte-Law--Politics-Examiner Mike gamecock DeVine

    count are folks like us too.

  • http://www.examiner.com/x-1597-Charlotte-Law--Politics-Examiner Mike gamecock DeVine

    a legal cause of action! Its against nature. Women flirt with men and turn us down. Would I sue over it? Hell no!

  • http://www.examiner.com/x-1597-Charlotte-Law--Politics-Examiner Mike gamecock DeVine

    my experience jibes with yours.

  • Xasteius

    Cain supporters are incapable of at this point. They cannot rationally defend this man and his evasive statements, which put him on the same level as Clinton or Obama at this point. Cain is worse, in my opinion, because I am more and more convinced that Cain is intentionally playing on the sympathies of the GOP to get the nomination.

    I basically consider myself a reformed anarchist, and was attracted to the right because unlike the nutters on the left, they use their brains. At this particular moment, the majority of conservatives (judging by the comments) are thinking with their hearts, and not their head. I am not proud to call myself a conservative at this moment; I’m thinking “rationalist”.

  • creinstein

    I worked at a secret US bank facility where they processed checks and had servers for the ATMs of like a dozen states run to as well as being the offsite backup of the main bank info.

    I was a security guard then, and due to the nature of the work I was supposed to gain an understanding of the different departments so I could a) respond faster and b) identify possible inside malfeasance.

    A lady accused me and I never even heard what the accusation contained, all I knew is that I was banned from one part of the facility from then on…

    I have been shy all my life, until recently, and never could ask a woman out if I tried… and I have no clue what went through her mind or if it was because I came to close to something…

  • redmymind

    We don’t need another “Commander-in-Training” who walks back every other policy statement he makes and tries to “explain away” blatant contradictions with as much force of reason as a first-year philosophy student.

    I’m really tired of “talkers” and frankly don’t understand “conservatives” who evidently hold slickness (or some rhetorical variant of it) in such high regard.

    Our country’s headed for rough seas. I’m going to trust the guy who has the solid, proven record of leadership.

    If it’s THAT “refreshing” and “inspiring” to hear one of Cain’s speeches or THAT cathartic to hear Romney shamelessly blend away his inconsistencies in a clip from one of the debates, audio CDs ought to be made available for their die-hard fans to enjoy again and again from the comfort of their homes or automobiles.

  • bzip

    I can agree with your statements completely.

    It appears that the conservative republican base is more interested in electing the next idol instead of the next POTUS.

    We seem to have lost focus, some in the base are more interested in inspiring speeches rather that resume, experience, creditability, consistent in conservative policies. If Cain doesn’t have any prior reord or has held any office how can you make the assumption of how he will govern and if he can?

    We appear to be doing what the dem’s did back in 2008, looking for that inspiring idol who have woo us with his speeches.

  • johnhandel

    There was a time when the words ‘harassment’ and ‘sexual harassment’ had a very clear definition and set of requirements. In many cases, the legal definition and requirements are still in place, but totally unenforced against the ‘seriousness of the accusation’ (at least in business or Republican circles).

    Sexual harassment in the workplace was either quid pro quo (example: the secretary sleeping with the boss gets the promotions and raises, or being told that sex with the boss is required for those raises and promotions) or required a few very specific conditions to be met.

    1. There had to be advances made. If it wasn’t a case of quid pro quo, then harassment required actual attempts on a person, such as physical contact or bugging about dates. A look, a glance, even a comment that a person was looking particularly upbeat a given day would not qualify, no matter how it may disgust a given person.

    2. The advances must be unwelcome. One problem with issues in the sexual arena are two factors called buyer’s remorse and a woman scorned. (If you have ever heard the phrase, “You can’t rape the willing.”, you get the immediate application here.) By law, if the person is willing, it is nor harassment (unless it is somehow understood that being unwilling will hurt their job/pay or being willing will help it). There are a number of cases, an no knowing what percentage, where a willing person claims unwilling status after the fact, or a willing person claims unwelcome advances when those advances do not appear or did not turn into something.

    3. That the advances are unwelcome MUST be communicated to the harasser. Yes, that is right. The law is that the victim of sexual harassment must clearly express to their harasser that the advances are not welcome. (Again, this is not required in the case of quid pro quo.) So if it is the boss or coworker asking you out or touching you in too familiar a way, you must tell them to stop. If you do not, it is not harassment.

    4. The advances must CONTINUE after it is so communicated. If the unwelcome advances cease upon informing the ‘harasser’ that the advances are unwelcome, then it is not harassment. (Again, the exception here would be quid pro quo, especially if said person got fired, refused promotions, or refused raises after making clear the advances were unwelcome.)

    Oh, yes, there is hostile working environment harassment. The best way to describe that is an example: Picture a cubicle zoo with Playboy calendars and centerfolds pinned to nearly every wall, sexually charged jokes getting tossed back and forth constantly, and inappropriate comments getting tossed at every woman more attractive than Chelsea. That is a hostile workplace, and the employer may be liable for harassment for simply tolerating it. Yes, I present an extreme, but it gets the picture across. The sexual hostility/aggression does not need to be quote so overt, plentiful, nor even broadly spread to qualify as a hostile work environment, but I figure that if you are presented with near-worst-case, you can figure some of the lesser cases out for yourself.

    At least those were the laws when I last studied sexual harassment, which admittedly was some time ago. Even then, though, the actual practice of enforcement, both by companies AND law enforcement were something else entirely. Companies were sued and people were fired on unsubstantiated claims of harassment for the first offense, and the offense did not even have to be significant. A look, glance, commenting that an person looked nice that day, noting that clothes were new, etc. Inappropriate touching accusations got absolutely absurd, to the point that men would get fired for the exact same touch that a woman would initiate without penalty. Predatory women have used harassment accusations and lawsuits as a weapon to get back at men that didn’t accept their advances or didn’t move them up the ladder of success quickly enough. Accusations of harassment have also been used as political weapons where baseless or unsupportable accusations of harassment have been used to try to sink the careers of political opponents. If I hear another statement that it is the “seriousness of the accusation” that is important, not if it is supported by evidence and fact, I may just puke. If it is merely the severity of the accusation and not if it has any merit that matters, then I’d like to accuse Obama of running a cult where he came over and murdered and ate my baby sister after spending all day torturing puppies and kittens and giving cigarettes to toddlers. Get the idea? Absolutely none of that was true, but if all that matters is the seriousness of the accusation, then it should be enough to bury his political aspirations forever.

    Well, in politics AND in business, if it deals with sexual harassment (unless the politician is a Democrat), the first, foremost, and sometimes only thing that matters is the accusation. Lack of evidence, evidence to the contrary, and many other factors are frequently ignored. Someone used the phrase ‘Guilty before proven innocent’. Even that does not go far enough. Guilty even if proven innocent is a little closer to the mark. In the world of sexual harassment, any woman with a grudge owns you, often even without evidence.

    So nebulous doesn’t even begin to touch it. Law doesn’t matter. All that matters is the accusation.

  • johnhandel

    1 So far as I have seen so far, this is merely a politically motivated attempt to assassinate Cain’s character. So long as his accuser(s?) remain shrouded in shadows and hiding behind their lawyers and media spokespeople, it is impossible to determine if there may be any substance to the accusations. So long as they keep preventing us from any information that will allow us to determine the credibility of the accusation, the only conclusion I can draw is the accusations are false and politically motivated. If the accuser actually comes forward and discloses name and additional detains, including date and location of the alleged harassment, I will reconsider that position.

    2. So long as the accusations are anonymous and unsubstantiated, all Republicans should support Cain. (No, I’m not saying they should endorse or vote for him. I’m saying they should stand up for him against the accusation at least as much as I have in item 1. The accuser is preventing us from verifying or refuting any details. There is only one reason to do that, and that is to cause damage.) So stand up for him. If you like Paul or Romney or one of the other candidates, you still need to stand up for Cain here. No candidate should have their candidacy destroyed by a vague and unsubstantiated accusation. If a vague, unsupported accusation that is completely lacking verifiable detail or evidence can sink Cain, no candidate is safe and yours may be next. (Remember that even the worst of the present Republican candidates would be far better than Obama.)

    3. If it turns out after all is said and done that Cain actually DID sexually harass a woman while working running the National Restaurant Association, then he should not be anyone’s candidate. Until we get some evidence other than an anonymous accusation, then he should not be rejected out of hand.

    Oh, yes.

    4. If I were Cain, and if I were innocent of the accusation, I would file a couple defamation lawsuits. Libel against the reporting agencies and slander against the woman. (The news agencies could be subpoenaed for the name of the accuser and could face significant penalties for not disclosing her identity.) You see, Cain can prove that they have printed and said defaming things about him. That he has suffered damage from the defamation goes without saying.. There are only two defenses against a defamation suit. The first is to prove the victim of the defamation has suffered no harm by it. Even showing opinion polls or select blog comments will prove that hard has been done by the defamation. The only other defense is the affirmative defense that the defaming statements are true. In effect, the only way for the media and his accuser to defend themselves against such a lawsuit would be to prove, in court, that he did actually sexually harass the woman. (And yes, you can drag a person’s name, character, reputation through the sewers and streets and hang the mess up for everyone to see, provided that everything you say is true.)