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EDITOR OF REDSTATE

Panic Time for Everybody. Sepuku Seems To Be Winning the GOP Primary.

Mitt Romney should win Michigan. It is his for real home state — not one of the adopted or moved in to and bought a big house home states. Michigan is Mitt Romney’s home state as in his father was Governor of Michigan.

He should win it.

He is losing it.

He is losing it to Rick Santorum.

A PPP poll now has Santorum 16 points ahead in Michigan. An ARG poll has Santorum ahead by 6 points.

If Romney pours money in to Michigan to win, he will do it the way he has won the other races — through destroying his opponent, not building himself up. Romney knows the value of negative advertising. Santorum winning will cause abject panic among the powers that be in Washington, DC because they don’t think he can win a general election. They are sure he cannot win a general election. They are sure all the things he has written about women working outside the home, gays, beastiality, etc. will come back to bite him in the general election.

If Romney wins, the conservative base will panic because he will be one step closer to wrapping this thing up and they don’t want him to wrap it up. They want him beaten. They just aren’t sure they want Santorum, or Gingrich for that matter, to be the one to do it.

So everybody sit back and panic. It’s panic time in the GOP. In a race they should be winning against Barack Obama, the only winner seems to be sepuku.

COMMENTS

  • http://www.nighttwister.com NightTwister

    Those seem more important each day, regardless the results of the Presidential race.

  • In The Hook

    There is precious little GOP majorities in the House and Senate can do to stop the full implementation of Obamacare if we don’t win the White House. The best we could hope for is some kind of nuclear stand-off over de-funding but that’s about it. Good luck trying to win the war on that.

    The HHS mandate regarding religious liberty is a small first step. Winning the White House is paramount and frankly it doesn’t matter which candidate does it because all of them have pledged to get rid of at least huge portions of Obamacare. The question is who can win the general election?

    Mitt did a great job of ridding this primary of the disease that was Newt Gingrich. His task is way harder now because while Santorum might be just as unelectable in a general as Newt, it’s for far, far different reasons. I like Rick. I like him as a person. I think he’s a tremendous human being and I appreciate that he speaks his mind. But he’s also a pro-life statist. While his remarks are outside the mainstream of America, few would care a lot unless his record didn’t show he tries to push his personal views into the public sphere… which it does.

    I’m actually 100% with Rick in terms of my social views. I just think it’s terribly unwise and wrongheaded to push them too far into the public sphere. Limiting government eliminates the fear that religious liberty will be curtailed by government and Santorum doesn’t have a record of trying to limit government.

    I’m honest enough to say neither does Romney.

    We need to win this election, but we seem to be well on our way to picking nobody.

  • jaykali

    I am more on the Andrew Breitbart side of things, I think he has his eye on the real enemy. At this point Santorum is alot better than Gingrich, I am glad Gingrich has sunk back down. Santorum finally has a good forum for his so-con values as the contraceptives issue has been perfect for his campaign. It’s an Obamacare issue, a culture war issue, a freedom of speech/religion issue all rolled into one. I don’t mind him or Romney, I am just ready for this deal to be over so that we can focus more on his holiness, Mr. Obama.

  • jaykali

    You need all of them, but we learned after 2010 that you can stop some of the madness but not all of it while the Dems own the whitehouse. They control the agenda.

  • earlgrey

    now that every one has decided they don’t want Romney, you go all in for this being a disastrous move.

    Frankly, I am more comfortable with Romney. I missed where Santorum is conservative. I think Romney would be better, but I am having trouble keeping up with what I perceive to be a change in tune from EE.

  • http://punditpawn.wordpress.com punditpawn

    Only because Reid controls the Senate. If the Republicans control both houses, the President must dance.

  • http://punditpawn.wordpress.com punditpawn

    Romney should go on TV and ask Obama donors for help against Santorum since the GOP leadership must be nearly out of money after destroying Newt.

  • jamesm

    what they are selling. They have no proof that Romney can win against Obama. Most of the empirical evidence points in the other direction. Santorum polls better against Obama then Romney. Establishment is too emotionall invested in their candidate to look at things logically. They might as well get all the panic out of their system now and start backing a more conservative candidate.

  • johnt1977

    pretending like he is an innocent bystander in all of this.

  • RichmondG30

    Our four options at this point are:

    1. Mitt Romney. A man with no core principles with all the likability of day-old movie popcorn

    2. Rick Santorum. A great human being, but as others have pointed out, is a “pro-life statist”. And on top of that he is a senator with ZERO executive experience and what will be about $12 in his campaign account. He’ll be running against a guy with half a billion dollars and four years in the job. The media will paint him as a religious zealot and destroy him.

    3. Newt Gingrich. Need I say more?

    4. The Product of a Brokered Convention. Lots of people seem to be wishing for this. It is only a slightly-less-bad option compared to the above three. We’re going to pick our candidate in a brokered convention and then let Obama’s $500 million campaign and the mainstream media vet him/her?

    God help us all.

  • earlgrey

    best to neutralize the 2nd Obama term. The GOP primary just keeps getting worse.

  • goodgovernance

    Better being the brokered convention, of course.

    Michigan is make or break for Romney. If he loses that contest he will seriously start to lose support from the establishment, and the aura of inevitability (already looking pretty shredded) will be completely destroyed.

    Knowing all that, does anyone think Mitt is NOT going to go completely and abhorrently negative on Santorum? Even if the establishment bigwigs at CPAC were telling him not to go that route?

    Oh, Mitt will try to come up with his own positive message for a week or two. But when it gets down to the wire he’ll choose the low road. He’s not the type to choose to lose honorably.

    Rick, you and your supporters need to brace yourself for what’s coming.

  • http://www.nighttwister.com NightTwister

    And personally, I don’t see Mitt or Rick beating Obama, so we need to make sure we can curb his socialism as much as possible.

  • SteveM

    Months of overblown fears about the “RINO” or “Uberliberal” Mitt Romney have demoralized just about everyone.

    Outfreakingstanding job. Team Obama couldn’t be more happier.

  • baracksolyndraobama

    …who is choice heading into MI?

  • carmen

    It’s clear Perry jumped the gun on stepping aside.

    Now, that said, the ONLY feeling I am left with is this overwhelming sense of, ‘Is this the BEST we can do?’

    Obama is SO beatable. I mean he’s the-Single-A-affiliate-of-the-Kansas-City-Royals-and-we’re-the-New-York-Yankees kinda beatable. And I find it nigh unbelievable that the current crop (and even those, minus Perry, who’ve bowed out) is/was the cream of the crop in our party.

    I swear, if I were into conspiracy theories, I’d think this was all done on purpose to assure Obama’s reelection. Without a GOP implosion (which he’s getting), he’d be low-hanging fruit.

    I’ll vote for ANY Republican candidate over Obama; let me make that clear.

    But with every day that passes in the primary process, I feel less like a valuable voter and patriot and more like a useful idiot.

    It’s absolutely depressing. What scares me most is that I am not alone, and that these feelings will suppress turnout. Which is suicide for the GOP (and more importantly, for the country).

  • blackmarketops

    bestiality, not beastiality

    a helpful mnemonic: “what, you haven’t tried man-on-dog? it’s the best!”

    thank you, please don’t forget to tip your waitress

  • jamesm

    because his he has a good fico score.

  • SteveM

    This site reeks of pessimism. Pessimism is for *losers*.

    Come on, people. You’re doing exactly what Obama wants you do to do – resign yourselves to the inevitability of 4 more years of the Bamster. Just listen to all this crap:

    “None of are candidates are as good as Reagan”
    “The media is saying mean things about us”

    I can’t believe as conservatives we’re acting like this.

  • trelane

    “Seppuku”. The title hurts my brain a little.

  • Change Jar Conservative

    It’s kind of like a game of Risk where you want to damage everyone a little bit so you can make it to the endgame.

    Jindal, Bush, Rubio, Ryan, Daniels, Christie

    Given the tightness of Christie and Romney, I could see Christie as a surrogate.

    Maybe Christie / Rubio or Christie / Ryan

    … Would Christie win New Jersey?

    If so then I think it’s over.

  • littlehouse18

    ..

  • SteveM

    Rick Santorum hasn’t gone negative? The man has been negative in each debate from the start. But set that aside.

    Do you actually think Obama is going to run a positive campaign? At any level? At any time?

    If Rick’s can’t take the mild probing he’s getting now, wait until the media gives him the full prostate exam. Whining about it won’t help, either – they’ll just pounce on him harder.

  • hls87

    Gingrich led in Florida immediately afer SC. He went down in flames anyway. Santorum leads in MIchigan after his hat trick. He too will go down in flames.

    People will have a chance to reflect before the 28th. Just as Floridians noticed when the time came to make a serious decision that Gingrich was an absurd, comic opera simulacrum of a presidential candidate, Michiganders will notice that Santorum is a nonstarter.

    Romney didn’t do anything underhanded to Newt. He just pointed out Gingrich’s liabilities. He’ll do the same with Santorum. The long-time Arlen Specter ally who led the charge in the Senate for the worst excesses of the Bush administration and got tossed out of office by 18 points running against a nit wit isn’t a potential President. When Romney highlights this for Michigan voters, he’ll take back a comfortable lead and go on to win. With defeats in MI and AZ, Santorum will fold and Romney will have a clear path to the nomination.

    Santorum has only done well where he represented a cost-free protest vote against the Romney coronation. If he could win Michigan he would become a real threat to win the nomination, and voters aren’t crazy enough to put him in that position, not in Michigan and not anywhere else.

    Mitt Romney is utterly unacceptable as a GOP presidential nominee. Nonetheless, he’s the candidate we’ve got. Santorum is just the last in a series of ersatz alternatives. He too shall pass.

  • realcountrymusic

    The Obama team must be salivating at the idea of running against Santorum, much more so than Romney. Romney could hang on and win and then credibly do what he would need to do, which is tack toward the center for the general. There is absolutely no way Rick Santorum could do that. He will lose to The One by double digits, and every reasonable forecaster, even on our side, seems to think so as well.

    Rick Santorum is a decent man, but his social views are toxic to large majorities, including a huge majority of women and younger voters. Toxic. As soon as I saw this birth control thing coming, I cringed because I knew it was either a setup or an incredibly lucky break for the dems. By a large majority, Republican women will not support someone who opposes the provision of hormonal birth control, slice it any way you want vis a vis religious liberty, abortion, or Obamacare. That ship sailed in the 1960s and it ain’t coming back. (And frankly, there is a strong anti-abortion case to be made for birth control that persuades most people, myself included, who do not think hormonal birth control is equivalent to late term abortion, or even on the same planet).

    I mean be honest: has anyone on this board never used birth control before? I think RS has more male than female commenters, but how many of you guys are willing to have 9 kids or be celibate? Really?

    Romney is our only hope. It pains me to say it, but I think the voters in Florida saw it pretty clearly. Depressing, I know, but with an R congress and a Romney who knows he has to hold on to conservative opinion to have any chance of reelection, there’s at least some possibility of changing this country.

    Close your eyes and think of Reagan.

  • earlgrey

    waht do you mean by fico score?

  • realcountrymusic

    Great image, or rather, terrible but far too appropriate image. I’m picturing an old fashioned drawing and quatering, with the Tea Party pulling one arm, the evangelicals another, big business one leg, and libertarians the other. It’s ripping the body politic of the GOP apart.

    Lots of political scientists have been predicting that, although generally with a longer demographic horizon. But the sheer force of rage at Obama on the far right of our party has driven the narrative forward much faster. It’s the mirror image of the hopey changey blind faith that the left had in him as a candidate. Neither is true. He has repeatedly won battles by virtue of being underestimated, and yet we don’t seem to learn to respect him as a politician enough to aim our criticism at a more rational target. The birthers and people who accuse him of being a secret Muslim or a communist have done damage to the GOP. Their enthusiasm came at the steep cost of making him look above the fray, more presidential, and more reasonable. It’s allowed a caricature of conservatism to own the national discourse, and Rush and Sean are not helping. (Erick is an exception, reliably smart and rational even when defending an ideologically sharp position.) Sarah Palin and Herman Cain *really* did not help. They seem like clowns to many of my conservative professional colleagues.

    We can prove the political scientists right and commit sepuku or man up and vote for our best shot. The party blew this primary so badly. The nominee needs to be Romney. Believe me I throw up a little in my mouth when I say that.

  • http://pocketchangeproductions.net/ anotherindyfilmguy

    With all the BBQ RINO being torched at each step… mmmmmm. BBQ…

  • Wiseman

    Santorum will be difficult to attack by Romney because HE HASN’T ACCOMPLISHED ANYTHING. He has never led a business, never led a city or state. He has no major legislative accomplishments. He has no resume to be President of the United States. He is just the last man standing against Romney. Santorum should be very grateful to the constant Romney bashing by right wing radio and blogs, who by the way supported Romney in 08.

    In the general election, Santorum would be successfully attacked as a right wing extremist, anti-gay, anti-women, anti-blacks. He would loose hugely to Obama, including Pennsylvania.

  • bonnman

    This is the primary process, as flawed and as imperfect that it is, this is the process so let it play out. Its the opportunity for the candidates to show us what they are made of, those who dropped out obviously didn’t have the fortitude or the vision, I liked Perry but he decided he couldn’t do it. However Santorum, who at the time was performing poorly himself, stuck it out and is now on top. Even Romney, who I don’t really like, has shown that when threatened can viciously attack and crush someone, just ask Newt. I might not like that style but heck Obama isn’t going to play nice. I think the primary is an opportunity for the candidates to grow, they’ll be better prepared come the general and have honed their message. I think a two man race at this point would be a good change for the primary and that Romney or Santorum could mature to be a respectable conservative contender in November.

  • jack0001

    start banding together and focus on the grand prize which is to get obozo out of office, or we are going to cut off our noses to spite our faces and end up with obozo for another 4 years.

  • jon11

    Last i checked, this is who does polling for the Daily Kos.

    Erickson Doesn’t know who he wants or what he’s for, he just knows who he’s against.

    which doesn’t help us beat obama.

    I’ve been watching MSNBC all morning and they are pumping Santorum like crazy…shamelessly…you’d think they were all going to vote for him. They are hysterical with glee.

    Romney needs to be positive but this idea that santorum is some kind of saint who can’t be held to account on his record (which isn’t particularly conservative) is insane.

    Romney can, will and should point out all the unconservative votes and positions he’s taken (which are legion) just as santorum does with mitt romney.

    I don’t think santorum will wear well. He’s a whiner, for one. Romney only wins because he has money…and does those silly little things like get on all the ballots!!! He’s ungracious. Romney wins the straw poll at Cpac because he cheated. Never mind he also won another poll commissioned by Cpac and the maine causus the same day.

    Santoums going to ket killed in Arizona. Im betting the 6 point lead attributed to him in michigan by the non daily kos poll is closer to accurate and 2 weeks from now romney wins there too.

  • streiff

    you’ve crossed the line in your comments.

    1. Santorum isn’t advocating what you say he is, so the substance of your comment is just a garden variety lie.

    2. Your comments about this subject on unrelated posts is tiring and we are easily tired these days.

    I’m sure WhyRomney.com can use your mad analytical skills. Drop them a line.

  • jarober

    I could hold my nose for Romney, and – God help me – even for Gingrich. There is simply no way I could vote for Santorum. The last thing this country needs is a big government conservative who will have his own set of rules for all of us to live under; he’d end up being a lot like Obama, with a different set of rules. I’ll sit out the election rather than vote for him.

  • skorrent1

    Leaves the Pres in charge of legislation. And he remains in charge of the EPA (no more energy industry except Solyndra II), DOJ (more F&F’s to get rid of those “gun-clingers”, more support for voter fraud and intimidation), State (commitment to R2P with what’s left of DoD), HHS (mandates, anyone). Boehner and McConnell will continue to pay the piper while Obama calls the tune.

  • redcal

    And not just wishing for the best, or putting up chickenhawk bravado, in face of contrary data. Instead of critiquing the discussion here, why not contribute to it? How should we be acting in your world?

  • SteveM

    How about my making a positive statement on why one of Not Romneys is a better candidate? This site does not do that. Instead, it’s a constant stream of vitriol to anybody who dares stand up and support Mitt.

    How about we focus on Obama and his weaknesses instead of beating up our own side?

    How about we remember that we’re electing a President, and not holding an ideological beauty pageant?

    How about we remember that in this country we can have a disagreement and not end up as enemies at the end of the day? (At least until Obama gets around to outlawing disagreements with his agenda).

    How about we discuss what we’d like to do to win this election?

    Shall I continue, or is the above sufficient? BTW. My world is called “Reality”.

  • jamesm

    The media will protray this as a huge loss going into super tuesday. He will be on crutches the rest of the way with no sign of a complete recovery. The losses will only pile up from there.

  • Whacker77

    For the longest time, I always held Romney as my fallback choice because I believed he could win. The primary process, however, has lead me to believe he can’t win. I won’t rehas why I feel that way because we’ve all know the reasons.

    I also fee Santorum and Newt can’t win either. Newt is a human train wreck, but Santourm seems to be running for Arch Bishop of America. I’m a Catholic, but he’s too much social issues in a year all about the economy.

    At this point, I think one of two things will happen. Romney will be the nominee or the nominee will be someone not in the race. Not for one moment do I believe the “party” will allow Santorum or Newt to be the standard bearer.

    I hate to agree with Palin, but I don’t believe we need to fear a brokered convention. Al Cardenas laid out how Jeb Bush could become the nominee this past weekend and it makes some sense. Jeb, or someone else, wouldn’t suddenly appear at the convention. They would likely enter the race in June if a brokered convention is assured.

    I think finding a new candidate is now the only way Republicans win in 2012.

  • Bill S

    This IS the primary process. We just tend to forget because it only happens every four (or sometimes eight) years.

    This one has been particularly weird because of this over-the-top and bizarre debate thing. That’s the biggest difference I see this time around. It has given the media even more of a stick to beat Republicans/conservatives with, and it has to stop. Reince Priebus ought to be thrown out on his tookus if he fails to address it.

  • jamesm

    like when someone wants to buy a car or a home. These are used by lending companies.

  • acat

    Worse, it’s primary season without a clear top dog.

    Romney is “next in line”, but it’s a weak claim by an unpopular guy.

    Several better qualified candidates (Barbour, Daniels, Pawlenty, Perry) dropped out early, in part because they couldn’t get traction challenging Romney.

    We’re now left with weaker candidates (Santorum, Gingrich) and perennial loser Ron Paul challenging Romney .. and yet Romney’s still not winning.

    The problem isn’t Red State or bashing, jack0001. The problem is, these candidates stink on ice!

    Mew

  • thosjefferson

    Romney has already won twice as many votes as either Gingrich or Santorum. The only reason he’s not running away with the nomination and leading Obama in the polls is the anti-Romney media on both the right and the left. Once the right gets its head straight, only the left-wing media will be anti-Romney and he’ll shoot up in the polls.

  • 10ab

    I am a woman and a Christian and I would never vote for Mr Santorum.
    I physically cringe during his birth control rants. Mrs. Santorum has been pregnant for the most part of SEVEN years! He finds the Duggards with their 19 kids inspirational. Enough said!

  • kowalski

    It’s been a selfish, hate-filled and destructive primary season thusfar. That’s what this entire debacle has been about. The consultants making the negative ads and pouring millions of dollars worth of acid over everyone. We’re all dissolved. It’s a broken family. Until this point we’ve squandered most of our goodwill and cohesion tearing each other apart. We had better start praying that we can reverse that, and soon.

    The Obama Truth Teams aren’t going to help any of us. The voters are already not coming out to vote on our side because they’re all mututally distrustful and full of bile. I don’t see how we get to victory from here without a serious reckoning and a really enormous change of mentality. Wake up! We’re going to lose!

  • nepanyrush

    I can wholeheartedly support option 2 (Rick Santorum, my first choice) or option 1 (Romney, my default choice). I am delighted by this dynamic. The only choice that I could not enthusiatically support is Newt Gingrich and the brokered convention is too risky.

    Santorum has a much wider appeal than people think. This is an individual that attracted so many Democrats and Independents that he beat a 7-time incumbent in a district that was redrawn to have 3 democrats to every Republican. He won in against two other Democrat incumbents in Democratic leaning areas (a Congressional District and state-wide in Pennsyvania). He attracted Democratic catholics, blue-collar labor people, and numerous other Democratic constituencies. He is strong in his beliefs, but never imposed them via legislative fiat, other than partial-birth abortion, which most everyone opposes. I live in PA and don’t remember hm being depicted as this “right-wing nut” that some on Redstate have claimed. He was the third highest ranking Senator when in office and actually accomplished a lot.

    To say Romney has no core principles is a wild exaggeration. He has always been states rights, opposed socialism, and been pro-family. I think he is much more conservative than people are giving him credit for.

    Actually, I think the battle between Santorum and Romney will strengthen both of them and raise Santorum’s profile as well. I feel confident either can beat Obama. The only one that Obama would destory in a landslide would have been the erratic Gingrich, whom GOP leaders were tired of trying to defend last time he was in office.

  • Melody Warbington (rwm52)

    or Mrs. Duggard abort some of those kids? By all accounts, it appears their children are loved and well cared for. Which ones should not have been born?

    And are you saying that if Santorum is the GOP nominee you will “never” vote for him?

  • earlgrey

    I am an idiot. In my defense, I buy used cars, and just pay outright.

  • MuskegonCritic

    What folks don’t seem to realize is that Michigan’s Conservative base is largely dominated by West Michigan, which is a Dutch Reform brand of Social Conservatives.

    OF COURSE Santorum is going to have a strong base of support here. Betsy DeVos and her Dominionist Brother Erik Prince are from here, you might know him better as the Founder of Blackwater Security or Xe or whatever name they have now.

    Santorum speaks to Michigan’s conservatives.

  • colonelflagg

    …then you’ll give us four more years of Barack.

    The Romneybots and Nootwits that have eviscerated those of us who happen to be social conservatives are now in full on panic mode.

    We’ll say it again: social conservatism is the basis for all conservatism because it teaches the difference between right and wrong, upon which we base our philosophy.

    It is the basis for property rights, states rights and indeed all rights, because they are the gifts of the Creator rather than the state, at least according to our founding documents.

    Is Santorum perfect? Nope. Who is? Is he light years better than Romney, Paul or Gingrich? Absolutely.

  • http://www.hakubi.us/ Neil Stevens

    Close to the election PPP buckles down, stops trolling, and puts out good polls.

  • colonelflagg

    Because it’s wrong. We’re road-testing Romney alternatives and hopefully have finally settled on the best one.

  • kowalski

    That I really can’t think of a single *positive* thing anyone has said, regardless of which candidate it is.

    I know that political contests can be as brutal as high school dating. But they shouldn’t be MORE brutal. Nobody hires multimillion dollar consultants in high school, at least. And in the end, most people have SOME school spirit. We’re dangerously close to having none of that left, regardless of our eventual winner.

    And we’re all going to suffer for that if we don’t get with the program. That’s why I won’t attack anyone’s candidate right now. I refuse to attack them, I’m not getting sucked into the Angry Pool any more than I have been already.

    None of these people are traitors or incompetents or apocalyptic Horsemen. We need to stop treating each other this way. Like it or not, we’re all a kind of family.

  • MuskegonCritic

    her husband billionaire Dick DeVos ran against Granholm in 2006 (and lost) — They’re in Grand Rapids. Very, very, very, very social conservative. Heck, I’m within a stone’s throw myself from a massive bible resort along Lake Michigan.

    Michigan is kind of the Bible Belt of the North.

  • kowalski

    I’m reminded of a lecture by Lester Thurow, talking about preemptive refusals to negotiate in business dealings:

    I’m paraphrasing, but this is the gist:

    “If you can get 70% of what you want instead of 100% of what you want, you shouldn’t foreclose on that possibility and get 0% of what you want instead.”

    It’s pretty clear to me at this point that none of us on this side of the Ditch are going to get 100% of what we want. We’re breaking up into factions that are very hard to hold together as a Party. You’ve talked about some of the reasons why that’s true, but we should all think carefully about how quickly the rifts and separations are appearing. They happen too fast, and you’ve got nothing but cracks and rubble.

  • ctho01

    I have to say, you’re being too charitable. That’s not the “only reason” Romney has brought a lot of the negative press on himself, it’s not just the concerted effort of segments of the press. That and he’s just not a very magnetic guy.

    Having said that, i agree that everyone will join hands and sing Kumbaya when it comes to the general.

  • Agelaius

    I hope they don’t bloody each other too much, because the obvious solution would be a Romney nomination with Santorum as VP. Romney will fare better in the general and Santorum will bring the social conservatives, particularly if Romney agrees to give him some portfoilio with some power to it… perhaps a special advisory council on religious freedom with a mandate to transfer much of health and human services to private religious charities. I’d like to see a reborn faith-based initiative that would have a major role in privatizing HHS and even some of the health institutes. The public will get over the issue with Romney’s money – it is secondary to his management expertise. If there’s a really strong social conservative on the ticket, it might work. Anyway, it’s time for Gingrich to drop out and Santorum and Romney to get along and avoid further bloodshed.

  • RichmondG30

    My concern with Santorum is that he got absolutely destroyed by a nobody (admittedly with a popular name in PA) in his last reelection bid. Yes, I realize that it was a bad year for R’s but for goodness sake he was an incumbent and it wasn’t even close.

    In terms of Mitt if you look at the economic “recovery”, job growth was stopped dead in its tracks the very month Obamacare was passed. This will be as close to a single-issue election I can remember, and the guy carrying our flag created the pilot program. For all his so-called flip flops, the one issue I want to see him flip flop on (Romneycare), he continues to dig in his heels and defend. No doubt I will hold my nose and vote for him but I worry about my fellow Red Staters.

  • joayn

    interesting. Since Romney has been encouraged/asked/told not to attack Santorum as he did with Newt, he has to bring it to the debate on February 22nd. I anticipate Newt, Romney going after Santorum’s record, which has not been the focus of any debates to date. Yep, hope Santorum’s ready for the pile on.

  • kowalski

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5aTYp8-O96M

  • septembergurl

    2012 would be a replay on the national stage of 2010.

    That is, there would be a unity between elites and populists (the elites seeing the populists, TP, etc, as a way of regaining power and therefore buying into, or pretending to, the populist goals and themes). There was a high level of enthusiasm, which translated into funding and turnout. There was a large turnover as RINOS and Democraps toppled across the country. There were many new candidates, some great, some good, some bad. Best of all, the GOP was united, with conservative media and politicos all more or less singing from the same page — NR, Coulter, Limbaugh, et al.

    Surely 2012 would be even better!

    Welll, no. I have suggested that the TP movement is not mature enough to field a national candidate. In fact, there was only one Tea party candidate in the Primary — Michele Bachmann (though other candidates had TP elements, she was the only pure TP oriented candidate). Ironically, the Tea Party did not support her after the first few weeks of her candidacy. They supported Cain, Paul, Perry, Gingrich and now Santorum — a statist social conservative.

    Is the Tea Party finished? Hardly, but they need to focus on more local and state candidates.

    As for our elites, they capitulated to Romney alsmost immediately — despite all the obvious problems with his candidacy. The loss to mcCain, Romneycare, his weak socon positions, his electoral failures in general — he should have been replaced by a candidate with his profile (ie a governor) but without the drawbacks. Romney’s ability to raise money, his name recognition, the business experience, all convinced them Romney would be a good candidate.

    Meanwhile, the popular consrvative media (Limbaugh/Levin etc) wasted a huge amount of time on non-starters like Trump and Cain, simply because they were able to build audience off their candidacies.

    This is how we ended up with four candidates, none of whom are reliably, consistently conservative, and none of whom can win in more than part of the country.

    Consider Michigan: One of Mitt’s home states, but more importantly, a state where Santorum’s rust belt pitch plays perfectly, and where his big union support and big government spending play very well (he has voted against right to work for PA, and supported the auto bailout). It’s also an open primary, and polls show Santorum doing well with Democraps and Inds. In other words blue collar ethnics, Catholics, what were known as Reagan Dems.

    But wait. Consider Georgia, where a new poll has Newt up 14 over Romney and Santorum a distant third. Because those rust belt creds don’t play so well in the South. Newt won SC and the Panhandle of Florida by winning SOCons there, while Santorum fared poorly. The primary calendar coming up is much better for Newt than February was, where there were no Southern contests. So Newt is looking for a strong showing in Georgia, Tennessee, OK,on Super Tuesday. Later that month there are primaries in Alabama, mississippi and Louisiana. So why, NR, should Newt get out now? There’s no indication that Santorum would win those states.

    But wait again. Newt has fared poorly outside the South, in the Midwest, where he loses the SoCon vote to Santorum,, in the Northeast, where Romney and Paul dominate, and the west coast.

    Romney is still struggling in the South. Despite wins in two of the biggest (florida and upcoming VA, where Paul is the only other candidate on the ballot and there are no write ins), he was beaten soundly by Gingrich in the truly southern state of SC. He also has fared poorly in the midwest, losing all the contests there to Santorum. If he loses Michigan to Santorum, wins Arizona, and loses Washington state to Paul, Romney will enter Super Tuesday having won contests only in New England and Mormon-heavy states.

    So far, in other words, the pre-primary system failed to deliver one or more truly national candidates, and we are seeing the result playing out now in the very divided primary electorate. Can we have a do-over?

    That’s what the brokered convention will be!

  • http://www.unifiedpatriots.com/ pilgrim

    Are you suggesting that McCain and Huckabee did not stink on ice? Were they much stronger and better candidates than Gingrich and Santorum?
    I don’t believe that all the candidates left running in 2012 are dirty rotten awful candidates. I think they are better than the final four we had in 2008.

  • 10ab

    I am saying that the vast majority of voters will not vote for Mr. Santorum in a general. Stirring the culture war pot with such zeal is simply pandering to a minority in the party. I won’t have to vote for Mr Santorum because he will not be the nominee.

  • PubliusII

    For 3 reasons:

    1. I disagree that a new candidate would necessarily be vulnerable to vetting by the MSM. Think of it this way: Optons 1-3 (plus nutcase ) already stagger under the weight of their respective baggage, especially Newt. It’s hard to see somebody new emerging with worse baggage.

    2. Obama’s smear machine is going to hurl slime at whoever the Republican nominee is. That is a constant, no matter who we nominate. So why not nominate somebody better? My only quibble: Obama will have $1 billion to spend.

    3. I actually think brokered convention would help us: it would be novel. When is the last time a convention went more than 1 ballot? 1948? The novelty would attract public attention and maybe help our candidate introdice himself to the voters before the Obama smears begin. It might also show voters that Republicans respect the will of the primary voters, who have, in effect, rejected all 4 of the surviving candidates.

  • JSobieski

    (1) All of our candidates are substantially better than Obama
    (2) We will vote R in the general election

    Your concerns are precisely why I have my “rules” below in my signature line. Many statements are contextually limited to the primary season even if strictly speaking, they are not so limited.

    Such as “I would never vote for X”.

    This almost always means “I would never vote for X in a primary”

    One recalls that in 2008 there were a lot of things said about McCain, but 99% of us did vote for him in November 2008.

  • JSobieski

    Moreover, even many on the conservative side of things are so used to losing elections and not getting their way that even more conservative voters are likely to prematurely capitulate.

    In other words, Romney and Santorum both have reasons to think that they will do well here.

    Frankly, if Romney does win, I hope you will be a plesant surprise…. just like our current governor who I strongly opposed in the primary.

  • APA Guy

    I have been watching them all primary season…and the only person they slobber over more than Santorum has been Romney because they know he has more flaws than a fake buffalo nickel.

    I might put a little less stock in what an outfit like MSNBC says and more stock in who can actually excite the base and GOTV. Romney isn’t that candidate, and he single-handedly takes the health care issue off the table in the general. Both Gingrich and Santorum are better for the country than Romney by a country mile.

  • BlueLandRed

    would lead to a disaster.

    First, there is the vetting process. If something is found in the nominees’s past it’s too late. No do overs.

    Second, whoever gets pick will have no cash on hand. Yeah, the SuperPACs can help out with ads, but the first thing the guy is going to have to do is spend all his time fundraising. Unless he opts for federal funds… ensuring he’ll be out spent like 10 to 1.

    Third, because you need money to build an organization – which the nominee will have to build from scratch in three months. (an d which has to go up against Obama’s and he has had 5+ years to build his).

    I suppose if someone new started running now, building an organization now, raising funds now, he’d be ready to step up in August and accept the nomination when the convention deadlocks and have some sort of chance in November.

    But I just don’t see any potential white knight willing to go through all that for the very slim possibility of a deadlocked convention.

    Sadly, it’s too late for a white knight…. we are going into November with one of the candidates we have, not one of the ones we wish we had.

  • acat

    Santorum is Huckabee without guitar lessons or executive experience.

    Ron Paul remains himself.

    Romney is following the McCain blueprint for winning the primary pretty darn closely.

    Gingrich, ironically, appears cast as “flawed candidate to the fiscal right of the front runner” role Romney occupied in 2008.

    The interesting thing is that, as of today, Santorum is doing better than Huckabee. I’m taking this not as a sign of his strength, but rather as a sign of Romney’s weakness.

    I’m also annoyed that Gingrich seems to be stalled. He needs a jump-start soon, or he’s done.

    Mew

  • rtsidedragon

    I’m a whiny little Perrybot. My guy didn’t stay in, so let’s roll the dice and go BROKERED CONVENTION. :o )

  • clintonformccain

    …wait ’til Sarah Palin throws her hat in the ring. You know it’s coming….

  • red_oakster

    The notion that the GOP can simply run roughshod over a Democratic president is laughable.

  • Melody Warbington (rwm52)

    which is IF Santorum is the nominee, will you vote for him or not? It’s a yes or no answer.

    And you might want to read streiff’s comment above in response to the comment you think is a great assessment of Santorum. It’s just not accurate.

    Romney’s far from my first choice, but if he’s the nominee, he has my vote.

  • red_oakster

    Santorum would put Pennsylvania and Ohio in play immediately. That’s a huge headache for Obama. And not withstanding the MSM, gay marriage is a huge loser in most of the states a Republican presidential candidate needs to win.

    Santorum is a family man. He knows his brief. He would be a serious, plausible candidate.

  • Finrod

    The drumbeat will start on the Left that Santorum wants to take all birth control away from everyone, and the independents will flee.

  • streiff

    given the polls and primaries.

    It remains to be seen if Santorum has the staying power to win the nomination but what is equally clear is that over 70% of the GOP do no want Romney.

  • earlgrey

    nt.

  • kowalski

    And I’m pretty much done with criticizing the candidates on our side. In fact I’m completely done with it. I know who they are. I’ve decided I can live with any of them, if they agree to do the same, and I’ve resolved not to say another single negative word about any of them. I am the 70% ;)

    Our country, our economy, our world deserves better than this tawdry streetfight among the people who would presume to replace Barack Obama as the President.

    We could never have won the Battle of Midway – (“The most stunning and decisive blow in the history of naval warfare”) with thinking like this, and in my view this election is every bit as important as the Battle of Midway was in June of 1942. We have to decide whether we’re going to work together despite our strongly conflicting personalities and having come from such different places.

    Who is our Nimitz? Who is our Chester? Who is our Spruance? We need to get them all on the same side.

  • APA Guy

    My wife has been a stay-at-home mom for the 12 years we have been married. She was pregnant for a good long part of that span…BY CHOICE. Are you saying you have a problem with a woman having children within the confines of marriage?

    Some clarity to your sentiments, please, because your below explanation doesn’t cut the mustard.

  • Finrod

    Social conservatism supports the War On Drugs, which is in no way fiscally conservative at all. Social conservatives have not lifted a finger, in general, to complain about Obama putting us all in the poor house by going on a spending spree that makes drunken sailors look like parsons. It took the Tea Party movement to galvanize people into complaining about that, and what did the SoCons try to do? They tried to co-opt the Tea Party movement into social issues.

    To put it bluntly: social conservatives don’t care about federalism or freedom, except where it advances their agenda. Social conservatives have given us Big Government conservatives, and I will never forgive them for that.

  • http://insureblog.blogspot.com/ hgstern

    With all due respect, Erick, you’re quite wrong.

    SMOD2012

    (www.smod2012.com)

  • http://www.examiner.com/x-1597-Charlotte-Law--Politics-Examiner Mike gamecock DeVine

    smile

  • ajsdaddie

    It means we didn’t do our job. Santorum won’t take anyone’s contraception away, he just won’t pay for it. Yes, he thinks all good Catholics should shun contraception, but that’s a religious issue. He’s already shown that he will side with the Constitution even when it is at odds with his faith. He voted for the Aboirtion Clinic Access bill, and that’s about as clear cut a case as I can make.

    It’s up to us to show that a faith-based Conservative message isn’t antithetical to the mainstream. It’s just death to Liberalism.

  • JSobieski

    Romney has more advertising dollars than Patten did, but Patten still got his view points out there.

  • ajsdaddie

    Even people who consider themselves conservative seem to think that a woman having kids and staying at home to raise them is somehow a bad thing. They’ve been brainwashed to equate motherhood with some sort of disease (hence the idea that contraception is “preventive medicine”).

  • kowalski

    nt

  • redcal

    Their numbers have always been near the top in accuracy. It’s the associated commentary (blog posts, etc) that are liberalized.

  • Melody Warbington (rwm52)

    It just depends on who they’re talking to. Except that Paul’s still crazy.

  • acat

    because nobody was taking the empty sweater-vest seriously at the time.

    Mew

  • zachv

    That’s absolutely ridiculous. Social conservatism is solely aimed at the preservation of traditional value whatever those traditional values may be. What’s sacrificed is any adherence to small government, low taxes, limited regulation and free enterprise usually for the ‘greater good’ or the preservation of tradition.

  • SteveM

    Conservatism isn’t about having a fixed set of rules that defines who gets to be in the Super Secret Club. Social cons are one part of the spectrum.

    Let liberals have idiotic arguments over who’s a real so-and-so. We’re better than that.

  • naraht

    Um, I *really* don’t think a redo of 1948 helps.
    The closest equivalent to 1948 would be if the Republicans went into Convention with Senator McCain holding 40% of the delegates needed for the nomination and Governor Palin holding about 25% of the delegates with at least 6 other candidates having delegates. Then on the third round, the convention selects McCain as its nominee again.

  • naraht

    Obama campaign = Taking out the tonsils starting at the back end.

  • WillWong

    The field is pretty much reset for the next debate and my money is on Newt!

  • kowalski

    I’ll give it another two months or so, but after that, if the Republican party cannot start to coalesce around a candidate and cut the crap, my advice is that Redstate should inaugurate a new menu choice at the top of the page and the first post should say:

    “We Look Forward With Utmost Humility and Our Most Greatful Thanks And Supplicance To Working With President Barack Hussein Obama During His Second Term. What May We Do For You?”

  • WillWong

    Romney’s Super PAC spent millions distorting Newt’s relationship with Reagan as well as continued the lie started by Tom Brokaw &NBC about Newt’s so called ethics violation. You must have been asleep!

  • Caleb Howe

    I think the Newt “ethics” ad featuring MSM spin from Brokaw was a bit underhanded. Politics ain’t beanbag, but let’s not pretend Mitt’s hands are cleaner than anyone else’s.

  • okpensfan

    Romney has said he does not support full repeal of Obamacare. That’s hard for me to overlook.

  • bfelger

    I can’t get behind any of our current folks in this primary.

  • Bill S

    And the reality is that Romney is a leftist with great hair and a nice suit.

  • JSobieski

    and conservatism at its core is anti-utopianism.

    One can more easily say that individual rights and the corresponding social contract (see John Locke) is the basis of conservatism than the broad collection of data points referred to as social conservatism.

  • Wiseman

    You do realize that the last time he ran state wide in PA, he was the incumbent and he still lost by 18pts! The people who new him best said no thanks. Obama will destroy him. Just because he is a good family man does not make him a good Presidential candidate. He would lose embarrassingly!

  • gfrgfr

    It’s pretty obvious that Romney cares nothing for the party or the country – he is willing to destroy every decent candidate that we have, just to get elected.

    My first choice is Newt but I COULD vote for Santorum.

    If Willard is our candidate I will vote for obama.

  • gfrgfr

    I’m not voting for any ticket that has Romney on it – in fact I will vote for obama if Willard The Rat is our nominee.

    I don’t think Santorum would agree to be Willard’s VP – he knows that Willard is a liar and Rick has too much integrity.

  • gfrgfr

    “tacking to the center” isn’t going to help our candidate in the general election. This is a center-right country.

    McCain and Dole tried that and it didn’t work at all.

    I wan’t a candidate who is willing to tell the truth and run on what he believes in. After four years of obama the country wants a president who tells the truth more than ever.

  • aesthete

    As far as I know, and from what he’s stated, Santorum doesn’t want to ban contraceptives on the federal level. His personal preference regarding state-level bans is somewhat more fuzzy, but I can piece out that he believes that the states have the authority to institute such a ban, and that he would do nothing to stop it.

    There is nothing wrong with the above position from a Constitutional viewpoint: this is a perfectly federalist argument, regardless of how you feel about Santorum’s personal views on birth control, or even his veiw. The problems are as follows:

    1) This federalist argument that Santorum throws out the window for every other issue, so people who are informed will either think that Santorum is trying to have it both ways, or that he is genuinely stupid and doesn’t see the obvious contradiction between this and his view on federalism when it comes to other issues.

    2) Voters are rationally ignorant: welcome to Public Choice 101. They will not stop long enough to hear the why from politicians who denounce birth control: they will assume that if a politician is talking about something, it’s so that government can create a policy regarding his sentiments. Santorum’s record really doesn’t give them any reason to rethink their inaccurate perception of his view unless they are forced to by evidence: and how many of these people will be in situations where they will be confronted by the evidence?

    3) This is a completely inappropriate, unnecessary, and counterproductive dialogue for a Presidential candidate to be having. It showcases a lack of seriousness and understanding of the job of President, and a lack of priorities. Voters will think, “if I wanted to elect someone who studiously avoided his Presidential duties, I’d pull the lever for Obama!”

  • naraht

    In a debate in late January 2008, Hillary and Obama were both able to say with a straight face that they would consider the other as their VP and Hillary’s actions at convention were choreographed to heal the wounds and Obama, while he didn’t pick her as VP, did pick her for the next highest job he could…

    Thinking about the remaining Republican Candidates…
    First Ron Paul, can anyone imagine either Paul picking any of the other three for VP or any of the other three picking him? I didn’t think so. (Paul isn’t in anyone’s cabinet either)

    I just can’t see Gingrich and Santorum together in either order, not quite sure why and I can’t see Romney accepting the VP slot.

    Maybe Romney-Gingrich, but the only one that I could really see happening is Romney-Santorum.. I’m not saying I support it and it certainly has its issues (what’s the northeast equivalent of 1992′s Double-Bubba)

    I could also see Santorum being willing to take a Cabinet position where his actions would be able to effect the areas that he really cares about (HHS or Education).

  • powertothepeople

    plain and simple.

    Romney is a far cry from being anywhere near even a good candidate, but he is still head and shoulders above Obama. For you to state on a site like this that you would vote for Obama under any circumstances shows us all you are an idiot deserving of our contempt.

    You have my contempt and now you are no better than trash.

  • aesthete

    we are barely winning over the public on a clear 1st Am issue (the Catholic hospital opt-out for contraceptives). Talking about being against contraceptives is extremely damaging for a politician.

  • bonnman

    I think thats the problem, it is very debatable. And not a winning political position.

  • naraht

    that leads to thoughts of Gingrich picking out Fava beans and a nice chianti…

  • SteveM

    Anybody can talk tough and be a great conservative in say, Utah. Or Idaho. Or Texas.

    It’s amazing how you all overlook Romney’s core identity when you make these statements. At his core he’s a business guy. So ask yourself this: Is he a Whole Foods social business type or somebody who’s more pragmatic?

    But even that’s not important. Go tell my why Santorum is better. Because he certainly isn’t qualified to be President.

    Or is he? Open challenge to anybody here. Why is Santorum more qualified to be President? I’m looking for his background, not his ideology.

  • http://www.examiner.com/x-1597-Charlotte-Law--Politics-Examiner Mike gamecock DeVine

    required to determine which remaining candidate is marginally better…cats see better, but only in the dark.

  • lazlor

    That’s not the real thing. It’s Van Hagar. This is better.

    The new Van Halen is the old(ish) Van Halen now with Roth back in the fold.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hrDch-SZ5lI&feature=related

    How does this relate here? The GOP needs someone in the fold from the early 80′s or someone with that mindset lol….. and we don’t have that.

  • jamesm

    look at all the Republicans that stayed home after Romney and his allies went negative in some of the contests. Blame Romney. Don’t blame the messanger. It is worse what Romney has done to Gingrich. He can’t keep throwing his garbage at a legitimate conservative hero and expect them to vote for him? Respect a person’s right to choose. Right now Romney has huge unfavorable numbers. That said–there is no way I would ever vote for Obama.

  • acat

    Save yourself a couple bucks on taxes that way.

    Oh, you wanted a point? Sure, why not?

    Did Gingrich’s HPPA or Santorum’s Medicare Part D (HSA) bill save Joe Sixpack more on heath care costs?

    Mew

  • deVere

    http://thehill.com/blogs/pundits-blog/presidential-campaign/210237-a-brokered-convention-jeb-bush-vs-sarah-palin#disqus_thread

  • WillWong

    Newt’s response to those negative ads as a disqualification for running for the POTUS! I would say that is a whole load of baloney! I only wished Newt had more money and responded earlier!

  • red_oakster

    Guess what? No Republican could have won in 2006 in Pennsylvania. Obama is in big trouble with the Reagan ethnic Democrats. When Reagan ran in 1980, Democrats wanted him to be the nominee because he would be too extreme to win. Santorum is not a Goldwater of 1964. He’s not scary in the least. And 2012 is not 2006. It’s a referendum on a President who plainly does not deserve re-election. Santorum would give Obama fits.

    But my main point, it that all this anti-gay, anti-women accusatory stuff is pure drivel.

  • fightnright

    I keep seeing this claim made on redstate, but current realclearpolitics.com head to head presidential matchups disagree.

  • jamesm

    Romney won the battle but Newt will win the war. His attacks on Newt will most likely cost him the nomination. Newt is highly intelligent. He is not going anywhere even if he does not get the top spot.

  • powertothepeople

    make this little sense or is this just an exception to your normal rule?

    I could give a rat’s ass about people and their hurt feelings. I also do not care about those who keep count on the negative ads and feel good because Newt has a few less, this is politics and negative ads are a part of it. They ALL have used them, they have ALL said “bad” things about the others, Romney just happens to have the most money and can do it more often. None are saints so not sure what you are crying about.

    The reality is, all four remaining candidates suck, period. But what should scare us more is another term by Obama. And for the idiot above, or for that matter any jackass idiot, to state that should Romney win they will vote for Obama is pure BS. They have a right to choose, but I do not have to respect crap. And for someone, who claims to be a part of this party and a part of this nation, to state that if one of our own wins they will bounce over and vote for the most dangerous president to date, I will let them know what a POS they are. The only thing that is keeping me from stating to them what really needs to be said is house rules, and the women and children who read this site.

    So do not think you are the one capable of patronizing me, I guarantee you are not. There is no valid excuse to vote for Obama much less from someone on our own side.

    Anything else to add peanut gallery?

  • http://www.hakubi.us/ Neil Stevens

    In early polling they’ll indulge themselves and ask stupid, tilted questions.

    But later on, they worry more about being right for the record.

  • jamesm

    I have got some peanuts for you. Number 1-You misstated the persons post. Number 2 -a vote for Romney in the primary is in essence a vote for Obama. Obama will destroy him. He is an out of touch elite. So don’t be getting all sanctimonious about Romney. Romney has driven down his own poll numbers by his lies and half truths. He can’t be trusted. Biggest flip flopper I have ever seen. The post was anti-Romney not pro-Obama. Get a clue.

  • redcal

    Are you serious? And then you follow up with “Romney’s core identity”, neatly side-stepping the, er, core issue of his campaign. There are so, so many commentaries on both of these topics — his liberal leanings and his utter lack of a core identity.

    Liberal leanings: Essentially everything he ever did or promised in his political career before 2008. Romneycare, raising fees to close a budget gap, promising to support abortion rights in 1994 and 2002, promising to support gay rights in 1994, implementing 189 special gay marriages directly in 2005 as the MA gov, favoring longer waiting periods for handguns, raising taxes on business property, believed in climate change science, etc, etc. I mean, just go look at the Mitt vs. Mitt video — it’s all right there in his own words.

    Core identity: There’s a new piece of evidence every week. The most recent is ‘severely conservative’. Have you been completely under a rock?

  • jamesm

    Nominate a Not Romney. My first choice was Perry. He is out. Second choice Gingrich. Accomplishments: Contract for America, welfare reform and refusing to raise taxes.

    Romney: Liberal judges, Flip flopper, out of touch elite, etc

    Not Romney Santorum: Not Romney

  • SteveM

    You list out a bunch of social con issues. Fine. To me, that’s a distant 3rd behind economic and foreign policy issues. (Here’s the part where you tell me I’m not a real conservative).

    On guns, let’s look at his record. I’m willing to be open minded.

    But nobody here is making a case for Santorum the candidate. Not. A. One. Of. You.

    Why is he suited to be President? Is this the United States of Social Conservative Issues and Nothing Else?

  • RichmondG30

    who think this is not a 1st Amendment issue.

    If you think that it was a 1st Amendment issue on Wednesday but not on Friday afternoon, then please explain how Obama’s Friday sleight-of-hand materially changed anything at all. (Just ask the Catholic Bishops because they remain unconvinced.)

    If you never did believe that forcing Catholic institutions (and might I add Catholic employers such as myself) to subsidize abortifacients was a 1st Amendment issue, then might I respectfully submit that you have not sufficiently studied the United States Constitution and its Bill of Rights.

  • RichmondG30

    The instant someone posts a comment that contains the following:

    “I will never vote for (the name of any Republican candidate)”

    His User ID should be instantly vaporized and he should be permanently banned from the site.

    Am I the only one who is sick and tired of all the cry babies on all sides of the debate threatening to not vote for the other guy or to actually vote for Obama.

    Can we please stop giving them a forum?

    (Sorry, just frustrated.)

  • powertothepeople

    Let me try to help you out of moronville just this once.

    Here is what the idiot said that you now claim I misstated. Try to keep up here jerky……..

    “If Willard is our candidate I will vote for obama.”

    Hummmm, see dummy, he put it very simply, should Willard be OUR candidate, he will vote for Obama.

    As to your second point, oh boy. I never defend or elevate Romney. In fact, I never do it for any of the remaining candidates. So not sure who you are trying to make your point to, but it is not for me.

    Now if you do not mind looking like a fool in front of everyone, far be it from me to try to stop you. But at least be smart enough to go head to head with someone with you obvious lack of comprehension. The idiots post was quite clear, of course except to you, and it simply meant Mitt wins, the person votes Obama. Not my problem if you are not bright enough to understand that.

    As to the rest of your nonsense, try applying it to someone it fits as you have not nor will ever see me defend any of the current candidates nor will you see me sing their praise or excuse their faults. I simply do not like any of them, but despise Obama much worse.

    Now if I may make the same suggestion to you, get a clue. And do so before you speak to me again. I do not waste my time on clueless idiots.

    PS It matters little who wins this time, the others stand less of a chance beating Obama than the winner. If they are not even capable of winning the primary of this party, they stand no chance at beating Obama. I know that may be hard for a person like you to comprehend, but try.

  • Bill S

    amongst those of us with vaporization privileges. We have not reached a consensus on how long to let it go on. Watch this space.

  • acat

    Sometimes the whole “taking my ball and going home!” thing is just a snit fit, and they get over it.

    Sometimes it’s a serious defect of thought, and .. for those, the moderators will eventually get involved.

    Mew

  • jamesm

    Your quote in regard to the persons post:

    “For you to state on a site like this that you would vote for Obama UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES shows us all you are an idiot deserving of our contempt.”

    The person never said that in their post. The person said: ” My first choice is Newt but I COULD vote for Santorum” Now listen, Moron Romneyybot. I guarantee you cannot compare to intelligence. Your calling people morons and idiots is overblown. It’s people like you that make people puke. People are pissed at Romney. They will need time to think about it after the primary is over. If they say they will vote for Obama it is out of anger toward Romney. Get it?

    Now you say “It matters little who wins this time” Your an idiot.

    By the way fool ,my IQ is tested in the top 1 percent in the nation. Your insults won’t fly.

  • bonnman

    Maybe you can explain to me why Mormons can not practice polygamy. Or why Islamist can not practice female genital mutilation. If your curious read Scalia’s majority opinion in Employment Division v. Smith. Here’s the key part.

    “Respondents in the present case, however, seek to carry the meaning of “prohibiting the free exercise [of religion]” one large step further. They contend that their religious motivation for using peyote places them beyond the reach of a criminal law that is not specifically directed at their religious practice, and that is concededly constitutional as applied to those who use the drug for other reasons. They assert, in other words, that “prohibiting the free exercise [of religion]” includes requiring any individual to observe a generally applicable law that requires (or forbids) the performance of an act that his religious belief forbids (or requires). As a textual matter, we do not think the words must be given that meaning. It is no more necessary to regard the collection of a general tax, for example, as “prohibiting the free exercise [of religion]” by those citizens who believe support of organized government to be sinful than it is to regard the same tax as “abridging the freedom . . . of the press” of those publishing companies that must pay the tax as a condition of staying in business. It is a permissible reading of the text, in the one case as in the other, to say that, if prohibiting the exercise of religion (or burdening the activity of printing) is not the object of the tax, but merely the incidental effect of a generally applicable and otherwise valid provision, the First Amendment has not been offended.”

  • redcal

    Not really a surprise, of course. You asked what made Romney a leftist, and I responded directly. You….demurred, and kept asking me (or anyone, I suppose) to explain what makes Santorum a great candidate. I didn’t mention Santorum. I’m answering your question.

    If you’re not a social conservative, fine. Let’s presume that you’re a fiscal conservative. But why skip over the most obvious (and fiscally irresponsible) case of Romney’s liberalism, and the first item on my list — Romneycare? The inspiration for Obamacare, down to the same three advisors (Jon Gruber, Jon Kingsdale, and John McDonough). He just handed off the baton to Obama. Fiscally liberal.

    And then let’s stroll down to his notion of cutting capital gains taxes (yay!) except if you make 200k+ (wait, what? Who owns most of the capital gains taxes…but capital holders, who often make more — much more –than 200k). Romney essentially just give Obama full credence on where the cut-off between ‘middle-class’ and ‘rich’ is. Somewhere around 200k, both men agree. Fiscally liberal.

    Finally, let’s just listen to the current campaign gaffe-o-meter…where Romney not only supports the minimum wage, but wants to…wait for it…index it to inflation. My, oh my. With Republicans like these, who needs Democrats? As always, fiscally liberal. (Was this guy really in private equity? Or is ‘private equity’ Romney-speak for ‘union boss’? This position is just inexplicable.)

    Romney is terrified of looking fiscally self-serving, “taking care of his own”, and so he’s overcompensating (as usual) into economic policies that are liberal, and daringly so, just as he did as governor. Not centrist, not Blue Dog Democrat, but at the bleeding edge of liberalism. And that’s innate to him…when he looks back at his time running up government obligations and cutting gun rights in Massachusetts…those actions actually look “severely conservative” from his point of view. By those standards, maybe he thinks Nancy Pelosi is also severely conservative; I don’t know.

    Romney is absolutely ashamed of everything that’s true about him. He’s liberal (sometimes center-left, sometimes just left). He’s Mormon. And he’s extremely wealthy. He gets really, really uncomfortable if you talk about any of those things, and tries to evade them in ways that everyone (on both sides of the policial aisle) generously calls a gaffe. He’d be better off being himself, out and proud. Instead, he’s eroded his support on both sides — from the right, with the base rebelling and talking brokered convention; and from the middle, with his polling among independents dropping a few points every week.

    But after all this, I’m sure you want to talk about Santorum. Or something else.

  • jaykali

    He will still do what he does now, which is use executive power to get some of what he wants done. The biggest is with HHS writing all of these health care rules. When he had 60 votes that delegated a ton of the decision making to HHS which is under the control of the presidency. So with another 4 years of Obama you have Obamacare locked in. You will still have NLRB running wild. You will still have domestic energy obstruction like the pipeline and gulf drilling which he can block, etc. He would do eveything he could to work around congress.

  • jaykali

    Sometimes I have heard him say repeal, other times its just this ‘waiver’ deal on day 1 which is only semi-symbolic. The good news is that so much of Obamacare was delegated to HHS that he can stop implementation almost entirely during his term. Fixing is permanently is going to be alot tougher, I think you will need almost 60 votes. Maybe you can get like 3 Machin-types to vote for a repeal but otherwise you have to have all republican votes. ‘Twill be tricky no doubt.

  • jaykali

    He needs to not get cute with nuanced answers like ‘even tho I personally disagree with contraception’ and ‘I support states ability to ban contraception’ – the media constantly tries to get him with gotcha questions. He needs to be completely clear and direct and say I support people’s freedom to choose contraception and NOW he has an easy redirect to say ‘I don’t support the govt forcing religious institutions to pay for it’ and hopefully that can get him out of a bind and onto an attack which is what I think he’ll do.

    I have been in the Romney camp for sometime but I tend to like Santorum a bit. Up to this point I thought it was a 3rd tier candidate but with the fall of the hapless Gingrich (who I can’t believe had so much support on these boards) now Santorum is a 1st tier candidate. He has his own problems but so does Romney so I could be persuaded to go his way.