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EDITOR OF REDSTATE

The Media and Barack Obama’s Pauline Kael Moment on Gay Marriage

If you listen to Barack Obama’s statement to ABC News yesterday you’ll hear something not reflected in all the transcripts that went out yesterday. He said his administration gave up the legal fight to defend the Defense Against Marriage Act. It’s actually the Defense Of Marriage Act.

Obama claimed DOMA made marriage a federal issue and it should be a state issue. That’s a gross mischaracterization of DOMA, but for now that’s besides the point. Two days after major gay donors said they’d withhold funding from his campaign and one day before his swank $40,000.00 a person fundraiser with George Clooney, Barack Obama publicly reversed course on gay marriage. The Washington Free Beacon’s headline says it all: Gay For Pay.

Obama looks weak and under duress. He looks weak because he would not come out before the North Carolina vote and under duress because he only did so now as his donors held his campaign hostage. Now President Obama might as well be called President Dick Cheney. In addition to GTMO still in use and warrantless wiretaps still being deployed, Obama comes out in favor of the states’ individually deciding the issue while supporting it himself. It’s the gay marriage equivalent of being personally pro-life, but supporting a person’s right to choose. It is also, like GTMO and warrentless wiretaps, Dick Cheney’s position — a position the much maligned former Vice President held even after Obama went from being for gay marriage, to against gay marriage, to evolving on gay marriage.

But there is another angle to this as well.

Barack Obama and the Washington Press Corps, aligned perfectly on this issue, are oblivious to one overwhelming data point.

Consider National Journal’s Hotline from the other day:

Pro-marriage activists have considerable leverage at the moment: About 1 in 6 Obama donors are gay, according to a Washington Post estimate. We’ve said it before: Obama will be the last Dem nominee to be publicly against same-sex marriage. No future candidate will be able to afford to oppose it.

I had to read that a couple of times to understand that pro-marriage means pro-gay marriage. I consider myself pro-marriage, which is why I don’t want its several thousand year old definition changed to accommodate people who do not qualify for it.

But beyond that, it is telling that National Journal would characterize one side as “pro-marriage” and it happens to be the side wanting to change marriage as we know it.

The media fundamentally is ignoring what is staring them in the face as are the Democrats.

What’s staring them in the face? Well, consider the always excellent Ron Brownstein in National Journal:

In the Pew survey, half of college-educated white men, a resounding 65 percent of college-educated white women and 68 percent of whites under 30 backed the idea. (In 2001, just 52 percent of younger whites backed gay marriage.) African-Americans, Hispanics and other minorities are much more closely divided on gay marriage, with the Pew survey finding just 40 percent of non-white men backing the idea. But it attracts support from 54 percent of minority women and retains plurality support among minorities overall.(That itself represents a major increase from as recently as 2007 when only about one-third of minorities backed gay marriage in Pew polling.)

According to pretty much every poll, everybody supports gay marriage. Nobody wants to be labeled a bigot. But while liberals keep referring to history on the move and the ever growing consensus for gay marriage, they ignore that 32 states have put gay marriage to a vote and it has failed all 32 times.

It is one thing for voters to tell pollsters they support gay marriage. It is quite another thing to actually get it passed at the real polls. Perhaps pollsters should stop asking people if they support gay marriage and instead ask people if they think their neighbors would support gay marriage.

For all the data that political scientists, Democratic strategist, and even a growing number of Republican strategists look at, the data they miss is that gay marriage does not actually win when put to the voters.

The media chooses to ignore this because, like Pauline Kael being shocked by Nixon’s re-election, they know no one who opposes gay marriage. In fact, the Gang of 500, mostly creatures of the Northeast, live in the only area of the country to embrace gay marriage. The Northeast, on cultural issues, is increasingly detached from the rest of the country — even California.

Just last month, the Supreme Court heard oral arguments in the Obamacare case. Conservatives have, for three years, insisted Obamacare is unconstitutional. When Justice Anthony Kennedy spoke skeptically about the constitutionality of Obamacare, it was like a nuclear bomb had gone off in the legal pundit community the press relies on. Not one of them had, for even a minute, thought the concerns about Obamacare’s constitutionality were valid.

And yet . . .

The media really needs to get out of the DC/NYC Corridor more often.

COMMENTS

  • davesinsanantonio

    they won’t!

  • dabeall

    Well, two names actually — Sodom and Gomorrah. The United States is not quite to the same level of evil decadence as those two damned cities of old, but, we’re closing in on it. It doesn’t matter what Dear Leader Obama and his deviant supporters say, homosexuality is morally wrong, is biologically wrong and is culturally wrong. Every individual is free to do as they please. They are not, however, free to force me, or anyone else to approve, much less sanction it.

    This decision is going to hurt Obama’s already flagging chances at re-election, not help them.

  • dvdmsr

    I am pro marriage. I don?t know what two men or two women do together, don?t care either, but it is no more a marriage than my sitting in the sun is photosynthesis. I only wish they would not insult the rest of us by calling it marriage. Next thing you know they?ll want to call the religion which believes sexual activity between two men or two women is NOT a sin Christianity. Cats are dogs, slavery is freedom, war is peace, murder is birth control; in a debate over ideas, I guess they have adopted the philosophy: If you can?t beat them, redefine them.

  • qualityguy

    The administration is scared to death. They know November is going to be ugly and they are pandering to their base – the only ones left who still believe “all is well”. Let them believe what they want. I believe in November that we will take our country back!

  • lcmslutheran

    I wish I had written that.

  • circlegranch

    and thus, it was a smart to take the political risk—according to MSNBC’s Jonathan Capehart, of course. The Gang of 500, the Complex, the Drive-by’s, the Lame-stream’s, whatever the label–they’re doing a victory lap today because once again, the president has pulled off a slick counter move. After resounding defeats to his policies during Tuesday’s elections, polling data that continues to show him to be in trouble, and the above-noted threats from Big Hollywood to withhold the millions, he needed a diversion tactic to dig himself out. He does this all the time. After the CIA prostittue scandal, the subject needed to be changed so the media eagerly complies by releasing TMI on the latest underwear bomb attempt. Name the Bad News Item of the day for this president, and the media will eventually find a way to follow up with something to make it all better.

    The results of Tuesday’s elections in states outside the Beltway reveal that the average media consumer in America can’t be bought and sold quite so easily anymore. Keep up the essential work, EE.

  • jlsankot

    “Every individual is free to do as they please. They are not, however, free to force me, or anyone else to approve, much less sanction it.”

    Of course, there are limitations as to how much a person can freely do, but to force others to feel, act, or believe the way each individual feels, acts, or believes is really a stretch. However, that is exactly what this administration is doing. I pray that people are smarter than to fall for it.

  • gmscan

    …. that I have never seen any data — nothing — on what happens after gay marriage is adopted. How many actually get married, how long do they stay married, and so on. It suggests to me that almost no one really does it. So it is — like the War on Women — a fiction. A big brou ha ha over nothing.

  • josephine

    If I had a wand I would leave my safe haven here in the deep south, transport myself to DC, slowly and accurately spread my dust over the entire area and freeze them as they sit down to breakfast this morning. never to move or cause me pain again.
    I can only compare them to a nest of “chiggers” ready to attack the innocent at any given moment. relentless and tenacious in their mission to destroy harmony and tradition.

  • http://my168project.com Batman

    The reality of the situation is that Obama is attempting to ignore the facts, in hope that they go away. I just hope and pray that the polls in November read the same way as your 32/50 statistic above.

  • SoFiMil

    “I have a gift.”
    -Barack Obama

  • renl57

    When ballot questions on banning same-sex marriage are put to the voters, it’s usually the activists opposing same-sex marriage who are motivated and organized to turn out in large numbers at the polls. Because they’re the ones who got the question on the ballot in the first place.

    Look at Proposition 8 in California. Does anyone believe that a majority of voters in California (a highly Blue state these days) oppose same-sex marriage? Or did those who favor it just not bother to vote on Proposition 8, because they feel more strongly about other issues like jobs and the economy?

  • http://www.ajharaldson.com lakeworthcane

    Obama doesn’t have the media in his back pocket; the media have Obama in their collective back pocket.

    He has no message or plan beyond enriched and empowering himself and, more emphastically, pandering to that eternally insatiable vacuum inside of himself, where an actual personality is supposed to reside, to which he must feed more and more attention and the cheap, meaningless “you’re-so-special” accolades that propelled him into politics in the first place.

    He didn’t get elected by proposing solutions. He got elected by repeating symbolic terms that people want to hear. He doesn’t know what they mean; he lets his audiences decide that.

    That’s a key to this man: he doesn’t know what he means. He doesn’t stand for anything. All he’s ever had to be to win is dark-skinned.

    Is he a Marxist? He probably doesn’t even understand Marxism, but he knows that pro-Marxist policies, publicly stated, seem to make his voters happy. Does he believe “taxing the rich” is a good idea? He probably hasn’t even thought about it, but he knows that publicly supporting the idea seems to please his voters.

    Similarly, does he support marriages between gay people? He doesn’t know. He probably hasn’t even thought about it. All he knows is that his supporters seem to like the idea, and he’ll get positive press coverage if he publicly supports it.

  • almas

    The intrinsic beauty of human marriage is that it results in a face-to-face expression of love along with providing for continuation of the human race, the creation of another human being, as opposed to the methods of the animal kingdom in which it is generally expressed front to rear?and that is what the homosexual expression emulates, after having received the blessings of the nogods residing at the Whitehouse.

    Albert Maslar
    amaslar2@yahoo.com

  • http://www.doctor-bob.biz rsklaroff

    …for his Marxist roots have been growing for decades, now blossoming for all to fear.

  • http://www.doctor-bob.biz rsklaroff

    …because it eliminates interpretive ambiguity.

    The key-concept ["mar?t?re meaning to provide with a husband or wife"] is buried within, recognizing that the definitions of “husband or wife” are undoubtedly sex-based….

    Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marriage

    Etymology:

    The modern English word “marriage” derives from Middle English mariage, which first appears in 1250?1300 C.E. This in turn is derived from Old French marier (to marry) and ultimately Latin mar?t?re meaning to provide with a husband or wife and mar?t?ri meaning to get married. (The adjective mar?t-us -a, -um meaning matrimonial or nuptial could also be used in the masculine form as a noun for “husband” and in the feminine form for “wife.”[11] The related English word “matrimony” derives from the Old French word matremoine which appears around 1300 C.E. and ultimately derives from Latin m?trim?nium which combines the two concepts mater meaning “mother” and the suffix -monium signifying “action, state, or condition.” “[12]

  • http://www.doctor-bob.biz rsklaroff

    …so just replace”?” with a long-”A” to avoid distraction]

  • http://impudent.edublogs.org/ kyle8

    The majority of Gay people are not behind this movement. They may be happy if gay marriage is made legal but it is not important to them.

    It is pushed by a small group of activists. So support may be broad, but it isn’t deep.

  • edintexas

    OK, you have apparently quoted someone, but yours is the only source to come up on Google. Where/who is the source of your quote? I do like it.

  • bob570

    Apparently we’re going to spend the next 6 months on side issues shoring up Obama’s base. When we should be in a discussion about our Debt, our Economy, our Unemployed, our Housing problems, Etc, etc, etc. Let’s not let Obama, and his Leftist Propaganda machine lead us by the nose into bogus side issues. Focus people Focus.

  • edintexas

    Has been going on for about a century (perhaps more). It is a favorite tactic of the Left, particularly employed by Communists, Socialists, and National Socialists. Oh, and Democrats.

  • http://www.ajharaldson.com lakeworthcane

    The lack of diversity among those who work for news media organizations has for too long defined and ultimately restricted the flow of information in this country.

    Most of the people who tell us what’s news live and work in the same place: the northeastern United States, specifically, New York City and Washington, DC. Their perspectives are colored, and limited, by where they live; their surroundings.

    It’s important to a lot of people to see themselves as “citizens of the world” and “open-minded.” But that notwithstanding, most of what’s important to us, and most of what makes us who we are, happens within a relatively small geographical area: our homes, our communities, our places of employment. As “policial animals,” we tend, chameleon-like, to take on the characteristics of our surroundings and to see things, and to live, as those around us do.

    This isn’t necessarily bad; it’s just the way people are. Beliefs, attire, behavior and even language are dfferent in different parts of the the same states, let alone different parts of the country.

    If you visit Buffalo, you’d never know you’re in the same state as New York City.

    If you visit Oklahoma City, you’d never know you’re in the same country as Los Angeles.

    If you visit Washington DC, you’d never know it’s the capitol of the United States of America.

    If you visit Miami, you’d never know you’re on the same planet as the rest of the United States.

    That’s why, in order to be more effective, our news media organizations must diversify. They must move their headquarters from New York City and employ people from other areas of the country: the northern Midwest, the northwestern Midwest, the deep south, the sub-tropics, the southwest, the far west, the northwest.

    They must also hire more politically diverse workforces. It’s unconstitutional to discriminate according to race, gender, age, et cetera. But most major news media organizations have for a long time got away with discriminating according to political beliefs. Just try to be an unabashed conservative and get a job with a major news organization; the chances are slim to none, and leftists will defend that. “Who,” they will ask, “wants to hear news from the perspective of a conservative?”

    I’ve for a long time thought that the first major news media organization that realizes this, starts thinking a little bit outside the “it’s-all-happening-in-New-York-City,” and “New-York-City-is-where-the-money-is” boxes, and starts presenting a news & information format that reflects more perspectives than just those restricted to the northeast, will dominate the news & information market. I think most Americans are hungry for a news & and information format to which they can relate, and most of us do not live in or near New York City or Washington, DC.

    We have to decentralize more than just our political system. We have to decentralize our perspective, too, and seeing as most of us get our perspectives from the media, that means we have to decentralize our media: make it representative of all America, not just those who live in the northeast; make it representative of all Americans, not just those who side with the political left.

    If we decentralize our news & information system, I do believe that our political system will follow because politicians tend to pander to perspectives as stated by the news media.

  • doctorcynic

    Each adult in this country has an exactly-equal right to marry, right now. You may marry one person of the opposite gender who is not a blood relative. Homosexuals and sodomites who clamor for “equal rights!” as if they don’t already have them actually wish to remove one of three existing moral and societal barriers to marriage that currently exist. My question to them is: why are you not in the streets marching for incestuous and polygamous marriage as well?

  • Racist

    dabeall, I think you’re missing Erick’s point, which is the same point I (and 61% of NC voters) have recently reiterated. The media and the Democrat Party (redundant, I know) insist on trading away every last shred of credibility they once had, to project the illusion that Americans support the Homosexual Agenda. But the facts and the numbers don’t lie. Americans, even Californians, DO NOT SUPPORT GAY “MARRIAGE”! Period. While The Obama, and his ilk, may want you to believe they do, it is obvious they don’t. North Carolina voted something like 61-38% to actually amend our Constitution to clarify and solidify the fact that Marriage is, and can ever only be, between ONE MAN and ONE WOMAN! All this talk of “Progress’ and “Fundamental Transformation” is the same play the Demoncrats have used for decades… Repeat the LIE until it is accepted as truth. Only problem is, it is much harder to convince a person or people, that their own personal beliefs are something different than what they actually are. The media can tell me a million times how much my neighbors support gay “marriage”, but that doesn’t mean they actually do. America is no Soddom and Gomorrah. We are the Shining City on a Hill, that happens to have a small but vocal infestation of Sodomites, who happen to be in charge of reporting the “news”… for now!

  • dabeall

    at least not intentionally so. That was just my initial gut feeling when I read this posting as I sipped my coffe this morning.

    At any rate, I’m glad you agree.

  • jaykali

    I think SSM has been normalized enough in our society over the last couple of decades that we are only delaying the inevitable. The libertarian side of me says that people should do what they want to do. I tend to think that ab a lot of things. I do think the moral fabric of society is falling apart. In the end I think we are in a free society and people should live how they want to live. I realize that the normalization of SSM like many other things also means brainwashing of the youth and so I am not thrilled about that angle. I don’t like how Christians are constantly attacked and other groups are heralded, I wish we could treat everyone as free people who can do what they want to do when it doesn’t affect anyone else.

  • dabeall

    I was merely addressing the erroneous argument that same-sex marriage proponents espouse; that “marriage equality” is a civil and moral right. It is neither. I have no quarrel with Eric’s (or your) point that the media and same-sex proponents are deliberately misleading the public as to the level of public support for their abominal proposal. Clearly when a majority of voters in a majority of states reject such proposals, the level of support can not be a majority of the population.

  • jaykali

    To normalize the behavior, we already have a TLC show for polygamy, we just need a sitcom and a couple famous celebs going that way and then you will see protests.

  • vamoose

    Evidently the “after the election I’ll have more flexibility” line didn’t work with his gay supporters.

  • edintexas

    It is primarily about legitimizing what has historically been viewed as an aberrant behavior by most societies. Simple “live and let live” status (also “what you do in your bedroom….) would not suffice for the activists, nor would Civil Union status which confers equal legal status in state activity (inheritance, hospital visitation, etc.)*. They wanted, and still want, positive societal approval of their lifestyle and only “Marriage” would do. The fact that this also denigrates traditional marriage means nothing to these activists. And there are those on the Left who see this as a positive aspect of their continuing attack on religion (which has been the definer and arbiter of marriage for millennia).

    * Civil Union status could actually be a financial benefit for Federal Income Tax purposes. If the Bush elimination of the “Marriage Penalty” expires (as Democrats want), married people will again pay more Income Tax on equal income as two “single” people living together.

  • funwithknives

    girls and boys, and nothing else matters.

    Thesis, Antithesis and Synthesis works, and this is why they use it so very often.
    Creating a new normal takes time, but like the North Vietnamese fighting the French and then us, they got the time and casualties {metaphorical, moral and actual} are of no consequence.

    We’re all in the way, guys….

  • evilbloggerlady

    You are spot on with this. I would vote to have same sex marriage, but I am an exception among conservatives (there are a few of us). But I know many liberal people who are opposed to it. They will support civil unions but have a problem having marriage re-defined in this manner.

    Now do I think this will change over time. Sure. Give it at least ten years or so. Even then, it may not be universal. Obama’s hand was forced by his donor base and Biden’s gaffe so he did this. This will probably hurt him more than help in the general election. Which is why he lied about his position back in 2008.

    And I have a major problem with this lie that the 14th amendment was intended to give gays the right to marry. If you think it is a good policy idea, pass a law, but if you are trying to argue the constitution supports it, try passing an amendment first.

    I updated this to link you…

  • funwithknives

    and it is here and now. See it for what it is: Your mortal enemy.

    …and mine……..

  • halo

    about this notion same-sex marriage is a ?civil right? needs to be fought back on. No civil rights are being denied. No one is denying gays from marriage. They have the right to marry just like I have the right to marry. They have the right to marry the opposite sex just like I have that right. Preference is irrelevant. Unless you live in a state that says same sex-marriage is okay, then you have every right to marry someone of the opposite sex in states that enact their laws.

    Their response back is, “well you don?t want to marry the same sex.” Yes, and it doesn?t matter. I can?t marry the same sex in those states just like you can?t. Just because that is not my preference is irrelevant.

    The argument needs to be brought back that it is about equal opportunities, not equal outcomes.

  • http://www.doctor-bob.biz rsklaroff

    …should be definitional and realistic.

    Once the above “wikipedia” etymology is recognized, it is clear that the word “marriage” integrates an “opposite-sex” core with whatever else has been superimposed culturally thereafter.

    Therefore, recognizing the distinction between “marriage” and whatever laws constitute “civil unions” is pivotal, notwithstanding the trenchant promotion of “gay rights.”

    The definition of “marriage” has properly been codified in 30 states by the voters and, thus, should be perceived as “settled law.”

    The level of application of this quasi-religious designation can be individualized without disturbing efforts to encompass the other 20 states via DOMA.

    Thus, a “libertarian” viewpoint, when codified legalistically, need only focus on inheritance, visitation, etc.

  • jasonva

    The precise number of decades would be 5 – unless you consider his roots to start before his birth. In which case, it’s hard to know how many generations it goes back in both sides of his family.

  • jasonva

    I used to work with a lesbian who was married to a gay man. Now, granted, this particular arrangement was to obtain a green card for a gay friend’s partner, while her friend married her foreign girlfriend also for the sake of a green card. But what’s a little immigration fraud between friends? The point is, they excercised their equal right to marry.

  • jasonva

    One point of disagreement, however: It is inaccurate to say that “(t)he fact that this also denigrates traditional marriage means nothing to these activists”. This current issue is part of a larger movement to unravel the moral fabric of our society. As such, denigrating traditional marriage is crucial to the achievement of their true goal.

    Gmscan makes a good point in referring to gay marriage as fiction. Rank-and-file homosexuals, by and large, have no burning desire to get married. It’s just the activists who, again, have the goal, not of getting married, but destroying the traditional values of our culture.

  • Jack_Savage

    First, he sends Biden out to signal his intentions and to help bolster opposition to Amendment One in NC. He doesn’t come out himself because:

    “At a certain point, I’ve just concluded that– for me personally, it is important for me to go ahead and affirm that– I think same-sex couples should be able to get married. Now– I have to tell you that part of my hesitation on this has also been I didn’t want to nationalize the issue. There’s a tendency when I weigh in to think suddenly it becomes political and it becomes polarized.”

    In other words, he knew the pro-marriage amendment in NC would pass, he didn’t want to be part of the defeat, and didn’t want yet another referendum on poor ol’ Barry.

    But that’s not the end of the cowardice. Think the President will fight for his beliefs? Maybe change things? After all, he is the President and could make this an issue if he wants to…

    Nope.

    “And what you’re seeing is, I think, states working through this issue– in fits and starts, all across the country. Different communities are arriving at different conclusions, at different times. And I think that’s a healthy process and a healthy debate. And I continue to believe that this is an issue that is gonna be worked out at the local level, because historically, this has not been a federal issue, what’s recognized as a marriage.”

    I’m for it, but won’t fight for it, because heck, it’ll work out.

    Coward, coward, coward.

    Pro-gay activists need to realize he is as much of an ally to them as he is to Israel. Both need to protect their back, and be aware that when the going gets tough they will be suddenly fresh out of friends.

  • streiff

    of those problems would win on the scale the NC Amendment 1 did? Hardly. And for a lot of us on this list, this is a much more important issue than anything you mentioned. Those problems are self-correcting.

  • http://www.nighttwister.com NightTwister

    and just move on. Because that’s what’s happened. The increase and acceptance of homosexual behavior is the sign of a society that has already declined, not one that is declining (Romans 1).

  • kmpesq

    it all comes down to money. Although there has always been a few activitsts who wanted gays to have the right to get married, I believe that the fervor with which the liberal intelligensia has pushed for it began with the adoption of the Bush Tax Cuts. When the Tax Cuts were enacted, suddenly it paid to be married. Gays, who were in a committed relationship, wanted their tax cuts too (so much for paying one’s fair share). Add to that inheritance rights (Gays are the wealthiest subsegment of the population) and what you have is a push by a subset of people who “are gone get theirs.”

    Personally, if the majority of people in a state want gays to get married, then that’s fine as I’ve always believed that marriage is a state issue. I also believe that education and most other functions of government are essentially state issues, under the 10th Amendment. However, let’s not pretend that this is about anything other than a group of people that want their financial goodies.

    The one potential positive out of this, however, is that once gays are allowed to marry and realize how screwed up the tax code is for married folks, we might be able to win some converts toward a fairer, flatter tax system.

  • Viet71

    No surprise.

    Here in Connecticut, where the Supreme Court ruled gay marriage was lawful, it’s hard to see any consequence of SSM. No clamor for gay rights either. Same in Massachusetts and Vermont. SSM, no clamoring. Ditto as far as I can see in New York.

    Am personally against SSM on historical and cultural and biological grounds. But while I prefer not to have gay activists in my face, literally or figuratively, I have to admit the adoption of SSM laws in CT, MA, VT, and NY has quelled all pro-gay clamor in these states, as far as I can see.

  • johnt

    But if sex is private, the bed room thing etc, why should who you bed with confer a special carved out designation? Why should, how,does homosexual acts offer employment protections for example? You actually have to make it known that you are homosexual in order to be,possibly, discriminated against. This is not like a black person trying get on a bus in Selma in the 50′s. Even for today’s twisted, sick, leftism this is bizarre.
    But then we’re a dying nation so anything goes.

  • uncmike

    The gay community is not happy with civil unions, even if they do confer the same benefits as marriage. They want to force the use of the term “marriage,” a Christian sacrament, as a way of forcing people of faith to disavow their religious convictions. They’re always “in our face” and we’re tired of it. I think Obama was outed (Gay for Pay) by the threats of his big donors. But instead of it being a good thing politically (the polls and all that), I think it will be a major liability in many battleground states such as NC. If this has been such a big political winner for the left, Obama would have been in favor of gay “marriage” from the git-go.

  • artaustria

    The economy in its doldrums, 15 trillion dollars in debt and still counting, new record deficits every year, alarming signals from around the world. What is this about? Caring about gay marriage under these circumstances reminds me of the driver headed for the cliffs, worrying his left sock goes with the right one.

    Once the economical big bang is here, it will make not much difference if there is something like gay marriage or not. Even gays know that. I’m pretty sure they prefer having a job, being able to pay the price at the pump, knowing their costumers can still afford the products they are offering to them. And if they prefer small and/or local government, free entrepreneurship and religious freedom, I bet they can vote for a Republican president and Congress as well. Sometimes the cake is worth more than the icing on it.

    I seriously hoped, Team Romney could ignore the bait. Well maybe that was naive. But they got to stay on message. There is little that can prevent us from the things that arrive once the crypto-socialist-in-chief is elected again.

  • streiff

    isn’t a great argument.

    Giving into bullies always makes them quiet until they find something else they want.

  • barron44

    Oftentimes, a politician does not tell you the truth about himself because the truth could hurt him politically. In his very carefully crafted, staged, televised ?announcement? of his support for gay marriage yesterday on ABC-News, you could say that Mr. Obama handled his announcement in a superb, intelligent, politically-correct manner. It was almost flawless. Except it was not flawless. The key focus was when he admitted that in America, we, as Americans have always held a traditional view of marriage founded on morality and Christian values. But, then he slipped into his magical mode of explaining why he now has ?evolved? into supporting gay marriage. There you have, if you, as viewers, as readers of the news, as Americans, are willing to admit it. The President has just announced that he is in opposition to ?traditional America.?
    The Media will not point this out. We, as informed Americans, will have to point it out to ourselves.

  • kmpesq

    Any of you who listened to Mark Levin last night heard this, but for those who didn’t, Mark had a gay, african american republican call in to his show and he had the best line on this issue, which was “before you can have a gay marriage, you have to have a gay job.”

    Can’t really improve on that

  • bobbie227

    I agree with you about Sodom and Gomarrah. However, the United States is “at the same level of evil decadence”. Why? Because it is a fact that our Country and Constitution were founded on Christian principles. Many other cities of old were destroyed because of sexual deviancy. Christianity has declined in the United States and that is a very sad fact as well. The Bible clearly states that sexual deviancy is an “abomination”. Every person will have to stand before God and account for their actions whether Christian or not.

    Sadly, I don’t believe that Obama is a Christian as he says. He has taken Bible terms completely out of context. And, in his statement yesterday, he was simply WRONG with his reference to Christ.

    As a Christian, I feel I must speak out about this issue since I believe what the Bible says. I believe because some of it has actually happened already. As a friend of mine used to say, “It is not my responsibility to convince anyone that Christianity is the right thing. It is my job, however, to TELL them about Christ”. Hopefully, today, I am doing just that.

  • dabeall

    “The United States is not quite to the same level of evil decadence as those two damned cities of old, but, we?re closing in on it.”

    You are right, though on our obligations as Christians, bobbie. WE are only required to share the Gospel with others. If they choose to ignore The Word, then we should “shake their dust from our feet”, as hard as that may be.

  • flguy

    Dabeall, I believe that Edintexas was referring to the comment above his by Jlsanksot that contains a quote, but no source.

  • dabeall

    was quoting me from my initial post.

  • celador2

    Polls can foster a sense of inevitabilty and serve as ads by media. They have been inaccurate and do not line up with ballot box results on gay marriage. The headline went from NC bans gay marriage to O supports it as do polls. Inevitable?

    A recent example of flawed polls is the reelection of Jesse Helms now retired. There was a media and DNC darling black mayor of a big city running for NC Senate against the incumbent Helms, Polls showed mayor Harvey Gnatt, I think, ahead. Polls were over time and by more than one pollster They made front page news of an upset as if poll predicitions were actual events. Helms won.

    SIx years later the pollsters moved into NC one more time and got similar results in a match up between the same challenger Gnatt the popular icon and Jesse Helms the long time choice of voters, The freenzy was at a pitched level as this time polls showed dear Jesse going down to defeat yet again. They lied. Jesse won.

    After Senator Helms was once again reelected and made some delicious remarks about media and Dan Rather being WRONG at his victory spech, the media driven polls had little choice but to label their polls tainted., tained by the polled who lied.

    No one wants to be labeled a bigot and not everyone likes or trusts pollsters. Afterall polls are news topics and their coverge of i’nevitablity’ serve as campaign ads for issues and candidates mostly DNC.

    Polls like we see as tools for gay marriage no longer cover or measure opinion as much as their coverge serves to form opinion.
    imo.

    cel

  • barleycorn

    The “quote” in Jlsanksot’s comment was from Dabeall’s comment above it. So I assume Dabeall should get full credit for “the quote”.

  • hayekwasright

    While this is a serious issue and clearly part of the concerted effort to fundamentally change the values that are central to this nation and its greatness, I believe it is currently being deployed primarily as a distraction. The left can demagogue and snipe far more effectively in this arena than they can about the administrations failed policies and massive and untenable expansion of debt. I think it will be a mistake to let this issue dominate the discourse.
    Don’t misunderstand me, I am not in the camp that suggests that we need to run for cover in the high grass whenever “social issues” come up. I think it is appropriate to stand up for traditional marriage and its importance to our society, as Erick has done. Just don’t let it dominate the discussion to the point that the devastation this administration and its policies have wrought on our economy and recovery potential are neglected.

  • celador2

    Beware of polls on gay marriage. Their purpose is to form opinion not measure it. There is far less coverage on real time ballot results on gay marriage as there is on polls that show a split or more in favor than who oppose. Headlines read that polls says gay marriage is inevitable.

    The news topic narrative on a quik blurb I saw— Piers Morgan talk show was to throw conservatives on a panel on defensive and push gay marriage as inevitable instead of actually looking at real time ballor box results. Obama and his support for gay marriage was the topic’s direction or lead not that NC voters went big in favor of a ban on gay marriage and civil unions.

    Yes NC repudiated civil unions. What does that tell us about voters views on nonmarriage arrangements?

    NC voters may also have registered a strong protest against O in primary. O had a big and bad day as did his policies and leadership at the ballot box.

    Bill OReilly’s guest Charles Krauthammer did the same as Morgan, He framed the narative in terms of gay marriage is inevitable based on polls and Obama not voters , even NC strong message.

    Charles is libertine/inevitable on abortion and he says gay marrrige is inevitable and will not be an issue in ten years. How does he know?

    I see no inevitablity unless the public can be brainewashed into thinking it is so.

  • califgal

    writer, I have to start attacking Hollywood’s and the entertainment industry’s influence on the Oval Office and on this President in particular.

    YOu won’t lose votes in toss-up states by pointing out the unhealthy link between the two and you’ll gain votes by pointing out that people in the industry don’t live the kind of lives the rest of us do, yet they seek to force things down our throats. (ahem–as in Obama not only assumed a position yesterday–he swallowed too.)

  • jaykali

    Now this is a lot more divisive an issue whereas women is much more tame. Nobody wants to go to war on women. My guess would be something like WarOnTolerance. This would be a much trickier play, the branding is very important. This could be a live grenade for the left. I would think the really far left would do something like WarOnTolerance if that can goat someone into saying something off-color. Hopefully Rush Limbaugh and some of others won’t fall for this trap this time. As long as everyone repeats ‘I believe marriage is btwn a man and a woman’ that’s not controversial enough to launch the WarOnTolerance campaign which will only be to motivate the really, really far left people.

  • jaykali

    If it takes you that long to explain marriage I think it’s a losing argument in the sense that the way things are trending people I think will believe people should be able to marry who they want to marry. So I certainly agree with your definition of marriage I just think that the populace is trending towards ‘live and let live’. It’s kind of moot point in the sense that most ppl are fine with civil unions just so long as it’s not called ‘marriage’. It’s a distinction without a difference. I am certainly in favor of traditional marriage and I would vote for upholding the traditional view of marriage but it’s only going to be a matter of time before the thing flips. Look how much times have changed since DADT. You can see the way the winds are blowing.

  • adair

    which I’m thinkin’ wasn’t. His saying he was comfortable with SSM when everyone knew that Obama was still evolving his position was, I think, deliberate. It was the Obama administration’s signal to the gay donors to, in fact, wait til after the election when he’d be more flexible.

    He’s more dependent on gay money this time because the union funds are tied up in Wisconsin’s recall situation and states that are considering Right to Work. With unemployment high, even among union workers, those dues just aren’t rolling in they way they usually do.

    He’s already thrown a sop to the Hispanics, from whom he doesn’t demand contributions but just votes, by interfering with the immigration laws to keep as many illegals here as want to stay.

    The young African-Americans who are grossly unemployed still aren’t making the connection that his policies are responsible for their situation. They just see the bennies he’s providing for them, what many have lived their whole lives receiving.

    The spectacle of non-Dem-donor auto dealerships being closed down lingers in the memories of many other money sources, who now know better than to come up short in their tributes.

    How any of them, including Putin, can believe in his promises of post-election “flexibility” after the history of these past 3 years is stunning.

  • Viet71

    n/t

  • Kyle-MI

    The CT Supreme Court forced gay marriage on the state. There was no vote for gay marriage.

  • rightlane1111

    You wait and see…mark my words…what EE had to read twice will be repeated and the everyday Joe that doesn’t follow politics will NEVER catch on…Pro Marriage is Pro Gay. Again…rewrite the words…give the subject new meaning and go sell it to the public.

    We better watch these people…they are soooo sneaky. By “these people” I mean the Obama Administration and their minions.

  • clintonformccain

    the economy and Obama’s failed leadership.

  • soljerblue

    being forced to jump the gun on his support for gay marriage before the election, rather than after, might also lead him to “evolve” on his plans for the Second Amendment. That is to say, come out before the election and tell us where the mine fields are being laid in enough time to really scare those gun owners who aren’t yet paying attention. Those who are already know some of what’s in store. A helluva lot more of us need to wake up.

  • shanecroach

    The problem is that we have been under a blizzard of unopposed pro gay propaganda. The same people telling us that homosexuality is similar to race nevertheless fully understand that there is no scientific ground for speaking directly to the issue of will, emotions, and so forth. We can tell what part of the brain is involved, but whether it is spiritual emotions driving the brain, or emotions as an emergent phenomenon created by chemistry, is completely impossible to tell. The will and emotions cannot be seen, smelled, felt, heard or tasted from the outside, and are therefore outside the scope of scientific inquiry.

    Nevertheless, the lie goes on unabated, I think with tepid resistance because uninformed conservatives have a hard time dealing with that community. The illusion of the moral high ground could be crushed by pointing out the myriad abuses of the profession of psychology from its inception, including current abuse of military veterans using the “personality disorder” diagnosis to deny benefits.

  • californiasquish

    Civil Unions and marriage aren’t the same.

    In legal terms, getting married confers over a thousand rights, some state and some federal. They deal with things like taxes, health insurance, power of attorney, child protections, etc. Some of those rights can be assigned by hiring a lawyer, but others can _only_ be granted by getting married, and there is currently no path to grant federal rights to your same-sex partner.

    It gets confusing when talking about this issue because the word ‘rights’ is thrown around with two different meanings. Oftentimes when gay people say ‘I just want the same rights as everybody else’ they are speaking about the actual enumerated ‘rights of marriage,’ and not that ‘marriage is a right,’ tho sometimes they say that too. Haha.

    Here’s some info on the differences between Civil Unions and Marriage from FactCheck.
    http://www.factcheck.org/what_is_a_civil_union.html

  • MF

    Does anyone believe that a majority of voters in California (a highly Blue state these days) oppose same-sex marriage?

    Yes, I do believe that. I live in CA, and it’s true. A majority of the black population (who vote mind-bendingly Democrat) oppose it, as do a high percentage of Latinos.

  • cbartlett

    The Marxist roots are just a way to feed the most narcissistic personality that has ever held elective office in this country. He (and the wife) are just simply enthralled by getting enough attention to actually be elected so they can play with taxpayer money in the White House and Air Force One and get attention from late night TV and the lame-stream media. I don’t think he has any idea that everything he is doing is making his re-election less likely and will be the one that is most surprised when it doesn’t happen.

  • justperhaps45

    The subjects of homosexuality and editing the Holy Scriptures are very clearly addressed in God?s word. This is one area where the fundamentalist Muslims are pretty close to the literal meaning of the Word.

    Socrates asked as a test for the greater good. ?What would the outcome be if everyone did it??

  • justperhaps45

    The subjects of homosexuality and editing the Holy Scriptures are very clearly addressed in God?s word. This is one area where the fundamentalist Muslims are pretty close to the literal meaning of the Word.

    Socrates asked as a test for the greater good. ?What would the outcome be if everyone did it??

  • justperhaps45

    The meaning of critical words can be changed for the purpose of winning the argument. I’ll give means You’ll give up (taxpayers) and loan means gift (present a present). Does that help you understand?

  • gwbramhall

    Why is it such a reach that, for the sake of the perpetuation of
    the species, we have marriage as between a man and a woman?
    This is the way it has always been and the family unit and our
    code of morality has been passed down through the ages by
    this framework. Sure gay couples can manage to raise
    children through adoption or artificial insemination, but I’d like
    to see some numbers on how that is going before I place the
    future of civilization on the line. If the democrats want all the
    bells a whistles of their entitlement programs they so adore, we
    will at the very least need a stable if not growing population.
    The third world is not encumbered by this issue and their
    fertility rates are more of a threat to us (long term)
    than terrorism and their possession of the nuclear bomb. All
    they really need to do is wait and, in a few generations, the
    world will be theirs. The whole of the industrial world will
    be a declining population of mostly old people.

  • ihateliberals

    “People may doubt what you say, but they will always believe what you do”. North Carolina, Tennessee, Alaska, California just to name a few of the 33 states so far where alleged polls say they are in favor but in reality when it was put to vote at least 68% of the population voted it down and made state constitution amendments that state “Marriage is between one Man and one Woman”.(From Wikipedia) So it would seem that someone is lying what a surprise.

  • trimulchio

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702304203604577396221780005972.html?mod=WSJ_Opinion_MIDDLETopOpinion

  • lineholder

    I was just snooping around at some polling websites, trying to find some date for another question entirely, and I came across a few of these recent polls that the media keeps putting out saying that the general public is now more in favor of gay marriage.

    Well, I can’t find the breakdown on any of them. You know, where they ask “are you D, R or I” and how many they asked of each category. They have %s showing for each category, so they must have this information somewhere, right?

    Sounds like a Neil Stevens challenge to me.

  • http://impudent.edublogs.org/ kyle8

    Fears that the Republican party will somehow be punished for this are unfounded. Since the public secretly votes contrary to the way they report to pollsters.

  • jpmhofct

    Marriage!! what is it? How it been defined? For how long? What is it that the gay couples require that makes it necessary to redefine Marriage?
    IT SEEMS TO ME ALL THAT IS NEEDED IS AS FOLLOWS:
    A simple law that says a Same Sex Couple may enter a Legal Union that provides each partner all rights and benefits under the laws of these United States as any man and woman married legally in any State in accordance with the Laws of that State.

    Hence a Legal Union can be established to be legally equal to marriage without redefining what a marriage is.

    Just as non religious men and women are able to marry in civil ceremony that does not require any religious approval so can a same sex couple enter a Legal Union before any civil authority authorized and willing to approve the Legal Union.

    It would save us all some nonsensical controversy.

  • SoFiMil

    .