Which is fine by me – but before the Left starts screaming, maybe they should talk to their own side. The final cloture vote was 55 to 41, with the following Democratic Senators voting against the DREAM Act:
Mark Pryor
Jon Tester
Max Baucus
Kay Hagan
Ben Nelson
Where I come from, 55 + 5 = 60, or enough to pass a cloture vote. Three Republicans voted for cloture, so there was enough of a margin for Democrats. Guess Harry Reid didn’t want this bill badly enough…
Moe Lane (crosspost)
PS: Hot Air says add Joe Manchin to the list.
Moe Lane
Dan Spencer
Dan McLaughlin
Jeff Emanuel
Pryor hears LOUD footsteps
DerKrieger (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 12:14PM EDT (link)I called Lincoln’s office all through the Obamacare and Cap & Tax debates and warned her that her support of those bills would result in her getting creamed in Nov. After the election I called to gloat.
I also called Pryor during the same time periods and have been calling his office religiously saying he’s going to get the Lincoln treatment if he doesn’t start voting like an Arkansan instead of a Leftist.
I can’t wait to vote against him. He comes from a political family which is about enough for me to oppose him on principal because it creates a sense of entitlement.
“In questions of power, let no more be heard of confidence in man, but bind him down from mischief by the chains of the Constitution.” – Thomas Jefferson
“I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents.” – James Madison
Whenever the legislators endeavor to take away and destroy the property of the people, or to reduce them to slavery under arbitrary power, they put themselves into a state of war with the people, who are thereupon absolved from any further obedience.” — John Locke, 1690
are you by chance?....
loupgarou1317 Saturday, December 18th at 6:36PM EDT (link)glad to see another Arkie in here!! Pryor better heed the warning, shape up or get out…….and time to remove the “family” from the political teat……
But how did Pryor vote on the repeal of DADT?
minister_of_war Monday, December 20th at 1:43AM EDT (link)I think that it’s a bigger deal than even the Nightmare Act. And I believe that Republicans need to make sure that values voters know how people voted on whether or not to allow openly gay people to serve in the military.
With religious conservatives, who make up a huge chunk of the Republican base, this issue will stick. It’s not something that you could make a TV ad on, but the mailers to households identified as religious could be very affective.
And radio spots by groups like the Family Research Council, attacking people who voted for this bill, will be very affective on Christian radio at least. Then the word-of-mouth campaign will help everybody know which members of Congress wanted to socially engineer our Armed Forces.
It’s bad policy & it’s bad for the safety of our men & women in the military.
If they really wanted this to pass - they would drop the college provision.
jeffreywturner (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 12:14PM EDT (link)This bill would pass with at least 90 votes if it was directed only at people with honorable military service. Any punk can take a class or two at some college, but honorable service to America in our armed forces is something actually deserving of reward.
“Life is too short, can’t we all just eat pork and kill some terrorists?”
They already have this.
Woo_girl Saturday, December 18th at 12:31PM EDT (link)They have a fast track to citizenship after they have served honorably. They only put this in the bill to tug at heart strings, it wasn’t needed.
I'm even more Heinlein-ish..Heinleinian(?)...
mriggio (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 12:35PM EDT (link)and would favor awarding voting citizenship ONLY to those possessing an Honorable Discharge.
**ducking & covering**
mriggio
SMSgt, USAF (Ret)
Precinct Committeeman (R)
Tazewell County, Illinois
Save the
CheerleaderParty, save the World! (Heroes, ed.)Deployed units have periodic Citizenship Ceremonies.
nessa (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 1:58PM EDT (link)It is a moving event to attend knowing what those new citizens have endured and risked to become American Citizens.
“If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams
Contributor to Unified Patriots
teh twitter
How are undocumented aliens even allowed to enlist?
thurman Saturday, December 18th at 11:15PM EDT (link)I am all for legal immigrants serving in the military and being granted a fast track to citizenship, but how on earth are we even considering illegal immigrants being allowed in the military in the first place?
The whole logic of that aspect of DREAM just baffles me– illegal immigrants have no business anywhere near our military from a security perspective in the first place
Sorry thurman, I didn't give any details...
nessa (Diary) Sunday, December 19th at 1:27AM EDT (link)Normally, a non-citizen wishing to become a United States Citizen must have five years of legal permanent residency (Visa) in the U.S. to apply. Non-citizens married to a U.S. citizen for at least three years can apply after three years of residency.
However, special provisions apply for members of the Armed Forces:
They can’t enlist until they have a Visa, but once they enlist the minimum time requirements are waived. The military provides them the required training, Once the standards are met and they have passed the associated tests they are sworn in as naturalized citizens.
“If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams
Contributor to Unified Patriots
teh twitter
It is sad
mikerazar (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 12:17PM EDT (link)that we can do nothing for children brought here at a young age and who have been model residents. I reluctantly oppose the Dream Act, but with a heavy heart. It is not a view I would like to defend before the Highest Court of all.
We have a nation to save, people.
The act could have passed
DerKrieger (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 12:21PM EDT (link)…if all of the obscene provisions were removed. The real goal of this legislation is, as with all amnesty proposals, is to add Democrat voters.
“In questions of power, let no more be heard of confidence in man, but bind him down from mischief by the chains of the Constitution.” – Thomas Jefferson
“I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents.” – James Madison
Whenever the legislators endeavor to take away and destroy the property of the people, or to reduce them to slavery under arbitrary power, they put themselves into a state of war with the people, who are thereupon absolved from any further obedience.” — John Locke, 1690
Yes, I understand all that but
mikerazar (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 12:27PM EDT (link)any bureaucrat who tries to deport a man who has put his life at risk to defend my country deserves to be shown the true purpose of the Second Amendment.
We have a nation to save, people.
We can do something for Mexican children brought here illegally
mbecker908 (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 12:25PM EDT (link)at a young age who have been model residents.
Deport them.
I part ways with you here.
NightTwister (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 2:45PM EDT (link)But only partially. I’m opposed to this DREAM act for many reasons.
However, a narrowly defined bill granting amnesty to long-term model residents that came here as young children is something I could support, but ONLY after successfully securing the border so we wouldn’t have to continually address this issue every 20 years or so.
“Baseball fits America well because it expresses our longing for the rule of law while licensing our resentment of law givers.” ― Major League Commissioner of Baseball A. Bartlett Giamatti
Cutting off the flow
aesthete (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 3:32PM EDT (link)is much more important than what we do with existing stock, IMO. If we were able to figure out an immigration/border defense solution that would let the good ‘uns in while keeping the bad ‘uns out, it doesn’t really matter long-term what we do with those already here.
The problem is that (as is typical) politicians are going about it in entirely the wrong way.
“It is a popular delusion that the government wastes vast amounts of money through inefficiency and sloth. Enormous effort and elaborate planning are required to waste this much money.”
-P.J. O’Rourke
The rule of law still counts for something.
the_invisible_hand (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 12:27PM EDT (link)Jeff Sessions may have been harsh on it, but amnesty cannot be abided.
The Democrats are the party that says government will make you smarter, taller, richer, and remove the crabgrass on your lawn. The Republicans are the party that says government doesn’t work and then they get elected and prove it.
-P. J. O’Rourke
this form of 'reparation' was not the answer
tngal (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 2:43PM EDT (link)I agree that the children were brought through no fault of their own. That was their parent’ s fault. While here, these individuals have already received an American education, access to healthcare, and other privileges. I would argue that is reparation enough, when the only thing we should apologize for is not enforcing our immigration/deportation laws earlier,.
Its as if we’re saying..–”Yes, we didn’t deport you when we should have. and yes you and your parents have enjoyed what makes our country great. And we apologize for all you’ve received while being here illegally. So now we’re going to make it up to you and your parents by allowing you even more benefits. “
I do think that there's a case
aesthete (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 3:41PM EDT (link)to be made that children who have behaved as model citizens, been brought up in American schools, etc are American in all but name, and that they are being “repatriated” to a country utterly foreign (and very hostile) to them. Mexican children of mixed blood who speak English better than they speak Spanish aren’t exactly treated great in Mexico, and it seems like a waste to me to condemn them to the fate of living under a quasi-dictatorial government, when they could be productive citizens in the US (and when we have already spent tax dollars getting them to the point that they’re at). The views of mbeck, et al (I do live in AZ, after all!) are understandable, but are, IMO, a bridge too far when it comes to kids who are by any metric more American than they are Mexico. There are certainly a great number of people with the US flag on their passports who are anything but.
“It is a popular delusion that the government wastes vast amounts of money through inefficiency and sloth. Enormous effort and elaborate planning are required to waste this much money.”
-P.J. O’Rourke
Build a three tier fence/wall,
mbecker908 (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 3:56PM EDT (link)make it illegal – with significant penalties – to hire illegals and rent them housing, start deporting back to Mexico en-masse (I’m not advocating National Guard round ups) and we’ll talk. Until then, I don’t care how badly they’d be treated in Mexico.
I agree to some extent
aesthete (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 4:16PM EDT (link)I think that it’s wiser to focus on resolving the flow problem that we have than it is the stock problem: arguing about this issue strikes me as akin to fighting over how many civilian rights we should sacrifice if the US is invaded by China: one that can and should be left mostly as a hypothetical if we are doing national defense right. Limiting future incidences of Mexicans coming illegally with children in tow is more productive than concentrating on what to do with our existing population of Americans in all but name (which, as things stand, is a fight that will not be won by those who want to toss them over the Mexican border).
“It is a popular delusion that the government wastes vast amounts of money through inefficiency and sloth. Enormous effort and elaborate planning are required to waste this much money.”
-P.J. O’Rourke
Sorry, but it is not our fault they are here.
america1st (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 9:18PM EDT (link)They were brought here, illegally, by others also here illegally. For the past however many years, they have mooched on the American tax payers for health care, education and more. Other than those who serve / served in our military honorably, the sooner they are back in their home countries – or at least out of this one – the better.
It’s not about Latinos, although they represent by far the largest segment of the illegal demographic. There many illegals from Asia, the Caribbean & Eastern Europe. Plus there is at least one from Kenya – and possibly her nephew. Deport them all.
Logic in the mind of a liberal is like a snowflake in the desert: lost, alone and soon destroyed by a hostile environment.
Many, if not most, of the children brought here
aesthete (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 10:13PM EDT (link)are de facto Americans: they have been raised and schooled here their entire lives, and the US is, for all intents and purposes, their home country. What purpose does it serve to send a net taxpayer (which a 20-year old will likely be) “back” to a country that she doesn’t remember or associate with in any practical sense, and that will assuredly treat her like s**t? It’s certainly not practical: rounding up aforementioned taxpayers is most certainly a loss for government coffers and involves several opportunity costs, as well. It’s not particularly ethical, unless there’s been a development in moral theory that excuses the US government’s forcible “relocation” of thousands of people while condemning Soviet deportation of various ethnic/national enclaves. There is really no reason to support such a venture: it is costly (both in actual costs and opportunity costs), rather cruel (you are condemning Americans to serving life sentences for their parents’ crimes in some of the worst kleptocracies out there), and inconsistent with conservative thought on Cuban immigration policy, or their preferred policy on refugees who have no choice in the matter.
“It is a popular delusion that the government wastes vast amounts of money through inefficiency and sloth. Enormous effort and elaborate planning are required to waste this much money.”
-P.J. O’Rourke
aesthete, "it's a big s#*t sandwich and we're all going to have to take a bite."
nessa (Diary) Sunday, December 19th at 2:09AM EDT (link)(I can’t bear to pass up an opportunity to use a quote from FMJ.)
I agree with mbecker and not only because I consider him a friend and my favorite curmudgeon.
As I see it the Bottom Line Up Front is where do you draw the line? If you allow children under one set of circumstances a group under another set of circumstances will ask for the same allowance, then another and another until you have 26 year olds still wanting to mooch off my health insurance. Or as this POS bill desired, 29 year olds attending college on my dime. When faced with the question of where to draw the line it must be sone justly and we must be seen to be administering it justly. To me that means it must be drawn on a solid foundation, the law provides that. If we change the current law, the one they broke getting here or their parents broke for them bringing them here it presents the appearance of impropriety. It may actually be the christian thing to do but it doesn’t look right. If it doesn’t look right, no matter how good it sounds it isn’t right. So, IMHO we can’t do it. Draw a hard line on a firm foundation and then stand by it.
Full Disclosure: My son-in-law is here illegally, has been long enough to give me 3 beautiful grandchildren. He had balls enough to come to my house and face me while my 17 year old pregnant daughter lived with me. He owned up to what he had done, asked my forgiveness and made several promises to me that night. I listened, looked him in the eye and decided against killing him (it could have gone either way in the early minutes) and he has lived up to those promises ever since. We’re working on changing his legal status but its challenging for myriad reasons, not the least of which is daughter #1. He knows I won’t turn him in but neither will I raise a finger to stop him from being deported if it happens. Daughter #1 has told me she and the kids will go with him if it does happen, that’s her choice to make, not mine.
Maybe those who leave could be moved to the front of the line for Visa consideration but I can’t see much more than that without opening the flood gates.
“If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams
Contributor to Unified Patriots
teh twitter
The line can be drawn where it generally is:
aesthete (Diary) Sunday, December 19th at 3:14AM EDT (link)Young children who have no choice in the matter. We allow for several exceptions that we would never allow adults for that very reason (we pay for their education, ensure that they are fed, place stewardship of their rights in the hands of their parents, etc) I understand, sympathize, and generally agree with rule of law arguments, but they are being taken to an unhealthy extreme here: current law has illegal border crossing as a civil infraction (same class as violating the speed limit), and we are guilty of violating such statutes several times over (and on occasion, getting away with it). IMO, sending children and young adults who are Americans in all but name to potentially get thieved, raped, and murdered in a civil war and country that’s not theirs as penance for a crime that they didn’t commit (and that they weren’t able to cognate intuitively at such an early age) is barbaric and utterly stupid.
I don’t see anything inherently immoral about sending adults who knowingly violated the law back to their home countries, provided that it is not a situation wherein they will be done significant harm by the powers in their home countries (though I do think that we should let them keep whatever wealth they earned legitimately during their stay): though I sympathize with anyone who sees something of worth in America, they made the decision, have contacts in their home countries, and know a life outside of the US that they can return to. I can even understand sending young children back with their parents: while it was not of their doing, they will be with their parents and can resume their lives in their home countries. I cannot see how it is moral to send someone who is, essentially, American “back” to a country that he has never been to and that he is not connected to simply because he has the wrong stamp in his passport. Sending these Americans in spirit to “home” countries that will chew them up and spit them out when these self-same people could easily become value-adding members of society just doesn’t strike me as moral or intelligent (we have, after all, already invested quite a bit in these kids in terms of years of schooling and the like).
As I’ve said above, the best thing we can do is reform immigration law (which, as it stands, is a blatant tool of labor unions and some corps) and then enforce. If we do that, the problems with immigrants still in ur borders are somewhat trivial.
Interesting about your son-in-law. I have more than a handful of those stories myself. I’m sure that with your experience with your son-in-law, you’ve experienced some of the frustration that immigrants trying to play by the book experience. I know that I have in trying to help friends and acquaintances, and I will admit that the subject is somewhat personal for me for that reason. Though obviously, policy should not be based on emotion, conservatives should at least be sympathetic to the difficulty that one faces in dealing with lachrymose bureaucracy more concerned with getting a reach around from a union rep than with serving its clientele (the American people and potential immigrants, respectively). Immigration bureaucracy is many times worse than even the worst bureaucracy that has to answer to citizens, precisely because immigrants have few ways to register their dissatisfaction and frustration with the system, and the stakes are much higher for immigrants than is the case in most of the interactions that citizens have with their government. IMO, any conservative who has seen a Western and rooted for the gunslinger battling a corrupt sheriff, or who supported Solidarity, the black market for Bibles and food in the USSR, or any number of “illegal” actions in Communist countries should at least have a modicum of respect for illegals who come here to make better lives for themselves and their families — but even if they don’t, they should at least understand that sending de facto Americans “home” would be heinous in the same way that sending African-Americans to Liberia to live out their lives would be. Thanks for the respectful nature of your post, but I can’t agree with you, mbeck, or several others who I like on RS who have made similar points.
“It is a popular delusion that the government wastes vast amounts of money through inefficiency and sloth. Enormous effort and elaborate planning are required to waste this much money.”
-P.J. O’Rourke
You may have the key to the entire mess...
nessa (Diary) Sunday, December 19th at 12:41PM EDT (link)That is probably THE explanation for so many of an otherwise honest hardworking group to fall for the left’s socialist bull crap. A drowning man will grasp whatever he see’s that may keep him above water. We could draw more to the conservative side with a better option. What that might be I don’t know and it cannot be given for free. It must be earned. Like a project in the inner city, if its free it isn’t respected.
Things to think about. Thanks.
“If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams
Contributor to Unified Patriots
teh twitter
Americans, by and large, won over
aesthete (Diary) Sunday, December 19th at 4:36PM EDT (link)Irish, Italian, Eastern European, Jewish, Cuban, Japanese, Chinese and Greek immigrants to our ways, and both we and they are the better for it. I have no doubt that we could win over Hispanics through tough but fair policies that make it easy for immigrants to acquire and keep cash through their own hard work, but that make it difficult for the criminal to get through or thrive. IMO, that is the piece that is missing from comprehensive looks at border security and immigration (though enforcement is definitely important).
“It is a popular delusion that the government wastes vast amounts of money through inefficiency and sloth. Enormous effort and elaborate planning are required to waste this much money.”
-P.J. O’Rourke
Here's what I don't understand:
jlsankot Monday, December 20th at 6:47AM EDT (link)We have illegals who have been in the US for years, decades–young and old alike. I have yet to hear, during an interview, that any of these folks have applied for citizenship.
I understand it isn’t easy to attain citizenship “the old-fashioned way”, but, if they have been here for years and not applied, and they want to be citizens, why haven’t they already applied?
It seems to me they are expecting something for nothing and are just waiting for a mass declaration so they don’t have to work for it.
And, if the road to citizenship is long and complicted, maybe that process needs to be revamped—and I don’t mean mass amnesty!!
I mean complicated
jlsankot Monday, December 20th at 6:48AM EDT (link)nt
Don't give Democrats all the credit!
the_invisible_hand (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 12:25PM EDT (link)Do I smell a hint of running from this, Moe?
Don’t worry about the optics. This is a winner for us politically. People don’t support amnesty.
Jeff Sessions was out front killing this bill. The Democrats that wilted did so under his righteous fury.
Believe it. We fought amnesty and the law won. Republicans killed DREAM of amnesty. Own it.
The Democrats are the party that says government will make you smarter, taller, richer, and remove the crabgrass on your lawn. The Republicans are the party that says government doesn’t work and then they get elected and prove it.
-P. J. O’Rourke
No, you don't. [nt]
Moe Lane (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 12:38PM EDT (link)nt
The Kim Kardashian of blogging.
Check out my blog at http://moelane.com/.
http://moelane.com/filthy-lucre-filthy-lucre/
http://twitter.com/moelane
My (combined) wish list.
I guess we'll see in 2012 if Hispanic voters are stupid or not
bk (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 4:09PM EDT (link)2008: Dems promise to pass amnesty bill.
2009: Dems can do anything they want in Congress, and they spend virtually the entire year on ObamaCare. Zip zero zilch nada on immigration.
2010: Dems blame racist GOP for failure to pass amnesty bill.
2012: See 2010 and 2008.
lame duck Bennett of UT gets in 1 more parting shot. nt
pilgrim (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 12:25PM EDT (link)Just goes to show: The Utah !GOP Convention made the right choice! nt
audax (Diary) Sunday, December 19th at 3:51AM EDT (link)Audeamus pro audere est facere
When the dust settles. . .
msctex (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 12:28PM EDT (link). . .and we look back on this Congress, it will prove difficult to find words to express the scope of its failure. Near-absolute power: the Presidency, both Houses of Congress in strength, yielded them nothing on which they will be able to hang their hats. It not only failed to accomplish anything worthwhile, it even failed in accomplishing its own destructive goals. Its greatest and only
“success” — the Healthcare Fiasco — will eventually die with a whimper, starved of funds and methodically defanged by the grownups, as Federalism and common sense combine to undo the potential damage.
We will soon have survived the greatest object lesson in modern politics imaginable. We can only hope just enough damage was done to compel people to pay attention, learn and remember.
I agree for different reasons.
the_invisible_hand (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 12:31PM EDT (link)This Congress was a disaster in all the damage it has done!
Are you kidding? If you ask me, this idea that Obamacare will die is wishful thinking.
We are going to be stuck with it for a long long time. The way they snuck more government control into Wall Street and big business with financial reform is not going anywhere. The Stimulus damage is already done.
The problem is that this Congress was a bull in a china shop.
The Democrats are the party that says government will make you smarter, taller, richer, and remove the crabgrass on your lawn. The Republicans are the party that says government doesn’t work and then they get elected and prove it.
-P. J. O’Rourke
Please don't spread defeatist stuff like this around.
avgjo (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 12:39PM EDT (link)We have enough to worry about with people undermining morale.
Ceterum autem censeo, Obamaecuram esse delendam.
It’s the morality, stupid.
I think and hope. . .
msctex (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 12:52PM EDT (link). . .that you may be making a mistake that is (ironically) easy for an intelligent person to make. That of ascribing the virtues of one’s own side to that of the oppostion. There is no reason whatsoever to assume that the Healthcare Bill is in any way properly constructed from a legal standpoint, or even were it fully implemented, that it would function in any way whatsoever. The thing is a car with water in the gas tank, and an ever-growing majority are aware of the fact.
As for Wall Street, the same concept holds: someone who knows what they are doing with efficacious intent will, in time, undo whatever damage was done by those of destructive intent working with shoddy design. It may take a while, granted, but their failure will be complete in the end.
Who were the 3 Republicans who voted for cloture?
takemccain2 (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 12:32PM EDT (link)Going to make certain and donate to their Tea Party challengers next time around.
I think, therefore I am not a Democrat. I fight, therefore I am not a Republican.
3 R Senators who voted for Dream Act cloture
pilgrim (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 12:34PM EDT (link)lame duck Bob Bennett – UT
Lisa Murkowski – AK
Dick Lugar – IN
Need to Clarify
rcov092 (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 12:39PM EDT (link)it is Murkowski, AK (RL) Rino Liberal from Alaska.
“Not One Red Dime for the NRSC or NRCC till they stop trying to elect liberals”
Join the RedState Strike Force
I Repeat - I Predict Murkowski Will Leave The GOP Caucus Within The Next 6 Years...
IJB Saturday, December 18th at 12:43PM EDT (link)…Likely to caucus as an Independent, a la Lieberman.
But all of Murkwoski’s recent lame-duck votes *scream*: “I’m leaving this party soon, suckas!!”
Wish she would have the integrity to leave tomorrow
rcov092 (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 1:06PM EDT (link)at least then we would not be rewarding her with Committee posts she would not get on the other side. But then, Mitch McConnell is too dumb to realize she is Harry Reid’s girl.
“Not One Red Dime for the NRSC or NRCC till they stop trying to elect liberals”
Join the RedState Strike Force
They will not let up on this. WE need to start calling it what it is Dreamnasty
rcov092 (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 1:07PM EDT (link)n/t
“Not One Red Dime for the NRSC or NRCC till they stop trying to elect liberals”
Join the RedState Strike Force
You really think they have ANY chance of bringing it up
janis (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 1:17PM EDT (link)in the next year or next two years and have it pass? We won the House, remember? And the House ain’t touching this with a ten foot pole.
Yes, Murkowski -
minister_of_war Monday, December 20th at 1:47AM EDT (link)Please leave the Republican Party & go join your Democrat friends where you belong. You are a disgrace to humanity by voting for the Nightmare Act & for the repeal on DADT. You really suck at life!
weirder than the 3 voting for cloture was...
bk (Diary) Sunday, December 19th at 6:25AM EDT (link)Burr and Ensign voting AGAINST cloture but then FOR the bill. Maybe others have a different opinion, but that seems to me to be a complete chicken-’stuff’ maneuver.
I can see in the more traditional sense where voting for cloture but against the bill makes sense – i.e. “It deserves debate but I am not in favor of passing it.”
oops never mind I was thinking of DADT -nt
bk (Diary) Sunday, December 19th at 6:26AM EDT (link)Wow!
edstate Saturday, December 18th at 12:42PM EDT (link)As a socially “liberal” but very financially “conservative” fella… I’m going to send each of these Dem Senators a thank-you note. They did the exact right thing.
Wherever Senator Webb goes to politik...
JadedByPolitics (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 12:50PM EDT (link)I will carry a sign that says, “I DREAM of a Senator who supports AMERICANS”
Unified Patriots – How-To:
Activists Taking Action
If you want the Dems to run from amnisty,
gekster (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 12:52PM EDT (link)Make any law giving amnisty have these provisions in them.
1. Can not vote at any level for ten years. Local, state, or federal.
(there goes the main reason right there)
2. Can not accept any Government aid in any way at any level,
with the exception if earned UI, for ten years.
3. Can not recieve any public housing or housing assistance from any level of Government, ever.
4. Can never apply for Social Security, and not be required to pay into such.
(could probably get a bunch of regular citizens to jump on that one)
5. Apon conviction of any felony, must be deported, with the rest of the immediate family, immediatly.
I could add more, but you get the idea.
They say Republicans are for the rich, Democrats are for the poor.
If they need more voters,
then they have to make more of who they are for.
We are there in the various Tea Party groups, leaderless, but not rudderless.
We steer always toward the Constitutional principles this nation was founded upon.
Erick Brockway
I’ve gone from
“Hope and Change” to
“Hopeless and Changeless”
Would be OK only on the basis of Military Service
rcov092 (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 1:10PM EDT (link)And no criminal convictions. We have to stop, in all instances the right to bring the entire extended family in.
“Not One Red Dime for the NRSC or NRCC till they stop trying to elect liberals”
Join the RedState Strike Force
The message of the mid-terms was not lost on Wrong Way Kay... nt
rbdwiggins (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 1:12PM EDT (link)“Well, the trouble with our liberal friends is not that they are ignorant, but that they know so much that isn’t so.” – Ronald Reagan
Lugar
melbedewy (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 1:18PM EDT (link)Assuming Indiana has closed primaries he must be primaried. Don’t care how much of a “legend” he is.
New DREAM Act of 2011
melbedewy (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 1:21PM EDT (link)Who will be the first to introduce it?
Direct
Removal (of illegal)
Europeans
Asians (and)
Mexicans (and all others)
Wow, the future of the Republican Party
georgeinla (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 1:29PM EDT (link)rescued by five Democrats.
Hi. I am a moby Greenie lawyer from Los Angeles who was not nearly smart enough to hide my tracks. Please assess my opinions accordingly.
I just sent Kay Hagan a thank you note
snopercod Saturday, December 18th at 1:36PM EDT (link)Maybe we can get her trained to listen to her constituents?
Doubt it
Christine (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 5:30PM EDT (link)but we at least might see her slide right for the next two years knowing it’s her only chance at re-election.
Nice to know there’s a chance she ain’t stupid. I had my suspicions. We shall see if she continues to prove them wrong…
The primary process is FLAWED. Two states should not decide our candidate.
“I would be a poor Commander in Chief”
– Barack Obama, July 3 2008
Looks like Dapper Dick Lugar did it again!
grandma Saturday, December 18th at 1:52PM EDT (link)What a piece of work! Didn’t like him and didn’t trust him from the day when I learned he was getting ready to play us Indianians back in the ’70s.
One wonders what kind of deals he made in the cloak room to allow the Dems to own him.
Just for the record, the Reps voting for cloture were
Locke (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 2:36PM EDT (link)Bennett, Lugar and Murkowski.
The Dems voting against were Baucus, Hagan, Ben Nelson, Pryor and Tester.
The four not voting were Bunning, Gregg, Hatch and Manchin.
http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=111&session=2&vote=00278#position
Interesting...
minister_of_war Monday, December 20th at 1:27AM EDT (link)Was Orrin Hatch hiding from his support for amnesty or did he call in sick? I know his colleague from Utah used this vote as a parting shot at the voters of Utah. But I assumed that Hatch would try to prove his conservative bonafides before he faces what could be a hostile Republican nominating convention for him in 2 years.
Ummm, I think the DREAM Act may be hidden in another bill
jstjoan (Diary) Saturday, December 18th at 6:16PM EDT (link)H.R.5281 which Reid just referred to Committee on 12/1610 http://is.gd/iYrkk
Is that what this looks like to anyone else?
Three questions that destroy most Liberal arguments according to Thomas Sowell:
1. Compared to what?
2. At what cost?
3. What hard evidence do yo have?
Every one of those Democrats are toast anyway
victrola Saturday, December 18th at 7:24PM EDT (link)I expect everyone of those Dem Senators to be replaced by Republicans in short order, despite their savvy vote on this.
Amnesty is a political loser. If Republicans were smart, they would start chasing blue-collar Reagan Democrats for votes instead of illegal aliens.
Lisa Murkowski - votes quid pro quo
Just_Saying Sunday, December 19th at 12:20AM EDT (link)The November write-in campaign was paid for by corporations to which Murkowski is beholden. She will be voting any way her paid supporters want her to vote for the next 6 years.
She’s a disgrace to Alaska and America.
.
Has anybody heard about this?
groveratt Sunday, December 19th at 12:29PM EDT (link)http://www.fireandreamitchell.com/2010/12/18/dream-act-hidden-in-h-r-5281-aka-removal-clarification-act-of-2010/#more-19879
I mentioned it above
jstjoan (Diary) Sunday, December 19th at 1:42PM EDT (link)but I guess no one saw it so I’ll say it again here:
THE DREAM ACT IS HIDDEN IN ANOTHER BILL (H.R. 2581) THAT HARRY REID JUST SENT TO COMMITTEE ON DECEMBER 16TH.
http://is.gd/iYrkk
Three questions that destroy most Liberal arguments according to Thomas Sowell:
1. Compared to what?
2. At what cost?
3. What hard evidence do yo have?
And that can now be disregarded
jstjoan (Diary) Sunday, December 19th at 1:54PM EDT (link)The link has been updated to reflect yesterdays cloture vote. My apologies for shouting.
Three questions that destroy most Liberal arguments according to Thomas Sowell:
1. Compared to what?
2. At what cost?
3. What hard evidence do yo have?
Excuse my ignorance please....
groveratt Sunday, December 19th at 2:45PM EDT (link)But are you saying this was already voted down?? or is it still possible for The Dream Act to be hidden in this bill and to be voted on??
Apparently, yes
jstjoan (Diary) Sunday, December 19th at 7:32PM EDT (link)If you click on the link that takes you to the thomas.gov page for HR2581, it was updated overnight to reflect that cloture was not invoked on12/18/2010 in a vote of 55-41.
Three questions that destroy most Liberal arguments according to Thomas Sowell:
1. Compared to what?
2. At what cost?
3. What hard evidence do yo have?
Has anybody heard about this?
groveratt Sunday, December 19th at 12:29PM EDT (link)http://www.fireandreamitchell.com/2010/12/18/dream-act-hidden-in-h-r-5281-aka-removal-clarification-act-of-2010/#more-19879
FIRE the RINOs!
TrueConservative Sunday, December 19th at 2:39PM EDT (link)Let’s start scouting for Tea Party Candidates to challenge the RINOs that voted for this monstrosity!
Let's also fire those two morons from Maine...
minister_of_war Monday, December 20th at 1:30AM EDT (link)The DADT vote was even worse than voting for the Nightmare Act & the 8 Republicans who voted to allow gays to serve openly in the military need to pay.
Let’s start by taking out Olympia Snowe & then going after Ensign in Nevada too.
Talk is cheap
Neil Stevens (Diary) Monday, December 20th at 2:15AM EDT (link)Find us a credible candidate for each seat that can win both the primary and the general, and then you’re getting somewhere.
Because you know who’s never ever going to vote our way? Chris Coons.
RS contributing editor and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
Read the RedState Posting Rules
Unlikely Voter: Poll Analysis, Election Projection.
“I rejoice that America has resisted.” – William Pitt, the Elder
If they never vote our way on the important issues...
minister_of_war Monday, December 20th at 10:06AM EDT (link)What’s the point of having them there at all.
What’s more dangerous: a frontal assault on the castle or a Trojan Horse allowed inside the gates while we are sleeping?
Get a candidate. (nt)
Neil Stevens (Diary) Monday, December 20th at 8:25PM EDT (link)RS contributing editor and “a hardy variety of crabgrass.”
Read the RedState Posting Rules
Unlikely Voter: Poll Analysis, Election Projection.
“I rejoice that America has resisted.” – William Pitt, the Elder
I don't think this is over....
groveratt Sunday, December 19th at 2:42PM EDT (link)I don’t think this battle is over yet….. Check this out!
DREAM act hidden in H.R. 5281 aka Removal Clarification Act of 2010
http://www.fireandreamitchell.com/2010/12/18/dream-act-hidden-in-h-r-5281-aka-removal-clarification-act-of-2010/#more-19879