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Turns out I was wrong on filibuster ‘reform’…

…when I said that the only result would be a symbolic gesture towards ‘reform’ with no real changes.  It turns out that progressives didn’t even get that: their precious attempt to deny the Great Shellacking was quietly choked to death in a narrow, dusty room* Tuesday afternoon… and nothing was put in its place.  Tim Noah of Slate is kind of upset about it all -  which is kind of odd, considering that there was never a reasonable chance after November that the Democratic leadership would have made it easier to pass an Obamacare repeal bill.

Yes, that would have been the immediate result of this scheme.  Let me spell it out for those folks on the Other Side who are having difficulty following along (which apparently include some of their Senators).  When you control both Houses of Congress, but the opposition party has enough votes in the Senate to win cloture fights, you want filibuster ‘reform’ to make it easier to pass your legislation.  When you only control the Senate, the Senate opposition party wants filibuster ‘reform’ to make it easier to pass their legislation – particularly when it looks likely that the opposition party will be the majority party after the next election.

This is not particularly difficult to understand.  I’d say that I’m sorry that progressive politicians are too steeped in twinned warm delusions (first delusion, that progressives are popular; second delusion, that the November elections can be negated by an act of Will) to really comprehend this… except that I try not to lie to people.

Moe Lane (crosspost)

*Yeah, that’s a G.K. Chesterton referenceBecause that’s how I roll.

COMMENTS

  • http://www.800cart.com Ron Robinson

    The full value of this life can only be got by fighting; the violent take it by storm. And if we have accepted everything we have missed something ? war. This life of ours is a very enjoyable fight, but a very miserable truce.

    – G. K. Chesterton

  • mattice44

    I was listening on Cspan this morning, and Reid and McConnell have apparently reached an agreement not to use the Constitutional option either this Congress or next.

    Anybody with more historical knowledge know if this has ever been done before? And is there a chance that in two years, McConnell just laughs it off and uses it anyway?

  • Spiral

    Moe,

    I know you are hoping that within two years the Republicans will be in the majority in the US Senate (in addition to having a Republican in the White House and having a majority US House). So am I.

    So, I’d would be interested to know how you think the Republican Senate majority should handle a resumption of Democrat filibustering of conservative judicial nominees in 2013.

    Or perhaps your position is, “We will cross that bridge when we come to it.”

  • Spiral

    Anybody with more historical knowledge know if this has ever been done before?

    I believe this type of “agreement” has been made many times, although not in so many words.

    And is there a chance that in two years, McConnell just laughs it off and uses it anyway?

    The US Constitution in Article 1, Section 5 gives the majority of the US Senate, not a supermajority, the power to set its own rules. No “agreement” between Reid and McConnell can liquidate a Constutitional Right of the majority of the Senate to change old rules or establish new rules. Thus, Rule 5, which attempts to bind future Senates to the old rules, would not hold up against a desire by a Senate majority to change Senate rules, the 2/3rds cloture requirement in Rule 5 notwithstanding.

    This is what Majority Leader Robert Byrd and the majority of the Senate did several times from 1977 through 1987. They used the Constitutional Option to “interpret” Senate rules without actually changing the text of them.

    This is why it is a mistake for conservatives to view the filibuster as something of higher importance than enacting the conservative agenda.

    I personally hope that (a) the Republicans win the White House, the majority of the US House and the majority of the US Senate in the 2012 elections and (b) that the Republican Senate majority uses the Constitutional Option to nullify the Democrats’ option of filibustering conservative judicial nominees and conservative legislation.

    I would like to see the cloture requirement for Rule 22 reduced to 50 votes on a 2nd cloture vote (while retaining 60 votes on initial cloture votes).

  • sharonmcp

    there’s a lot of things I can think of to call Harry Reid, a gentleman is not one of them.

  • Finrod

    News reports this morning were saying 400,000 without power in MD/DC/VA.

  • mattice44

    I basically agree with your strategy, and I wonder why they just didn’t go ahead and agree the change from 60 to 51 now. It’s not like any legislation that squeaks through the Senate with 51 instead of 60 is going anywhere in the House this session.

    I understand that McConnell will be able to use the Constitutional option next year regardless of any gentlemen’s agreement made. I just wonder if he’ll actually do it. Even if 2012 goes very well, it doesn’t look like the Republicans will get 60. So, even assuming the election goes well, the fate of health care lies with a) McConnell finding the guts to reneg on his ‘agreement’ or b) convincing some Democrats to go along with repeal.

  • http://www.buckforcolorado.com bjwilson83

    As soon as Dems saw Obama Care repeal was on the table they turned tail and fled. Funny how the realization that the opposing party controls the House will change one’s thoughts on filibusters.

  • http://moelane.com/ Moe Lane

    - I honestly hate to say that, but at this point I don’t even know who the front-runner is for the Republican nomination. I’m also not really impressed with the GOP’s ability to fight for judges anyway… and I consider that to be a failure from all the way to the top to all the way to the bottom.

  • http://moelane.com/ Moe Lane

    A couple of inches. The kid liked the (melting) snow.

  • Locke

    “When you only control the Senate, the Senate opposition party wants filibuster ?reform? to make it easier to pass their legislation – particularly when it looks likely that the opposition party will be the majority party after the next election.”

    And aside from that, while passing opposition party legislation may have strategic or symbolic importance, it does not approach the importance of passing legislation that will become law if not filibustered.

  • Locke

    We can live with temporary (ie., recess) conservative appointments far better than lifetime liberal ones.

  • Adjoran

    Glad they didn’t. The whole point of the filibuster, and indeed a good part of the design of the Senate itself, is to restrict legislation that can only command a narrow majority of support. That’s not a bad idea.

  • Spiral

    Wait a minute.

    The Left never sees their judicial nominees blocked by the filibuster.

    Why do conservatives continue to place a higher priority on maintaining the filibuster than making sure the federal courts become more constitutionalist and more conservative?

  • Spiral

    Back in the 2003-2004 Senate, the Democrats (numbering 49), defeated 10 conservative nominees to the federal courts of appeals, including Miguel Estrada and Carolyn Kuhl.

    My question to all conservatives is this.

    If Republicans end up with the 2003-2004 situation again:

    Republican in the White House

    Majority Republican US Senate

    Conservatives nominated to the US federal court of appeals

    Democrat minority in the Senate filibusters all constitutionalist/conservative judicial nominees.

    Should the Republicans use the Constitutional Option? Or should they just ask the conservative judicial nominees to withdraw their nominations and then have moderates nominated in their place?

    Historical background. Miguel Estrada and Carolyn Kuhl both withdrew their nominations for the federal court of appeals after repeated filibusters by the Democrats.

    In other words, which is more important? The federal courts or the filibuster?

    Pretty soon we might face “a time for choosing.” The Democrats will force the issue.

  • Spiral

    By retaining the filibuster, we could end with a situation where a Republican president is forced to replace Scalia with a temporary, recess appointment. Then, when the next Democrat is elected, they could choose the permanent replacement and move the US Supreme Court further to the Left.

    Is this really a victory for conservatism?

    Clearly the Democrats do not see the 60 vote cloture requirement (the filibuster rule) as a barrier to getting liberals confirmed to the federal courts.

    But the 60 vote cloture requirement has been a barrier for conservatives getting to the federal courts.

    I think before celebrating this Reid-McConnell agreement on the filibuster, all conservatives should consider the implications of this for our federal courts, including the US Supreme Court.

    The 60 vote requirement might make it impossible to turn this country around, even if the Republicans sweep the elections in 2012, if they fall short of 60 in the Senate. And 60 in the Senate would require a net gain of 13 US Senate seats. Not impossible, but probably unlikely. Even during the Reagan wave election of 1980, the GOP gained 12 senate seats.

  • rbdwiggins

    Win the debate in the arena of ideas, secure victory at the ballot box and protect both — Senate Rules and the federal judiciary.

    There is no magic wand. The requirements are clear and straightforward.

    Sixty conservative Senators, a conservative Executive and a nominee with a strong commitment to constitutional jurisprudence and the rule of law.

  • Spiral

    I’d like to see 60 conservative US Senators.

    But realistically, by January 2013 we might have a conservative President and about 55 or 56 Republican US Senators, not all of them conservative.

    If Scalia, who turns 77 in 2013, decides to retire and the Democrats decide to filibuster his replacement, you won’t demand that the Republicans use the Constitutional Option?

    Remember, in 2005-2006 many Republicans threatened to use the Constitutional Option if the Democrat minority filibustered John Roberts or Samuel Alito.

    Announcing to the Democrats that we will never use the Constitutional Option to bypass the Democrats’ filibusters is really an open invitation to the Left to block conservative nominees.

    Notice, however, that liberal judicial nominees get confirmed, despite the filibuster.

    The Left loves the filibuster rule. That’s why Reid wants to retain it. The filibuster rule will allow the Left to eventually win complete control over the federal courts.

    Unelected Leftist striking down conservative legislation as unconstitutional. No wonder the Democrats were not in a hurry to change the filibsuter rule.

    The filibuster rule benefits the Left.

  • Spiral

    Maybe the reason why Harry Reid didn’t want to tinker with the filibuster rule very much is that he remembers how the Democrats used the filibuster to sink the nominations of conservatives Miguel Estrada and Carolyn Kuhl to the federal court of appeals and how in the future the Democrats might sink the nomination of a conservative US Supreme Court nominee.

    Maybe Harry Reid didn’t want to tinker with the filibuster rule because he remembers how

    (a) the filibuster rule made reform of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac prior to the financial crisis impossible.

    (b) the filibuster rule didn’t stop TARP from sailing through the Senate.

    But the filibuster rule is supposed to be good for conservatism. Hmmmm….

  • Spiral

    There are those times when the 60 vote cloture requirement gets in the way of the Left’s agenda.

    That’s when the Left uses the Byrd option. The Byrd option is when a simple majority of the Senate creates a new Senate Precedent that contradicts the written Standing Rules of the Senate.

    Byrd did this 4 times during his 1977-1987 tenure as Senate Majority Leader.

    The Democrats didn’t let the election of Scott Brown in Massachusetts in January 2010 stop them from passing Obama-care.

    But Republicans continue to believe that simple-majority rule is a bad idea.

    This creates a “heads the liberals win; tails the conservatives lose” situation.

    This explains why entitlement programs like Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, SCHIP get passed by the Senate. But repeal of these programs never happens.

    The result? Well, you are seeing it right now. The United States is nearly bankrupt.

    But wasn’t the 60 vote filibuster rule supposed to prevent the advance of socialism in America?

  • earlgrey

    the option of splitting into several states. I think that may be the only way we can get a filibuster proof majority in the Senate.

  • gekster

    my last post on the subject.
    There were enough Senators to see how foolish a rules change would be.
    You always forget, or are just to blind to see the other side of the coin.
    No one side should have that much power, whether it be thiers or ours.
    Get conservatives elected who have a pair to actually do filibusters.

    Whup…whup…whup…whup…
    Come on Silver, get up!
    Whup…whup…whup…whup…

    I’m done on this subject.

  • rbdwiggins

    Progressivism/Liberalism was on full display for all to see, and the ruling class was rejected by the American electorate in 2010. Conservatives should exploit every opportunity to help Obama expose the lie.

    The pace at which current events are overwhelming the Obama Administration gives every indication that 2012 can be expected to produce similar results.

    Twelve in 2012…

  • Spiral

    You can keep your fantasy about electing 41 conservatives who have the guts to filibuster Leftist legislation and Leftist judicial nominees.

    But while you indulge in that fantasy, the nation continues to drift and lurch to the Left.

    Under Lefty presidents like Clinton and Obama, liberal judicial nominees get confirmed to the federal courts.

    Under GOP presidents like George W Bus, conservative judicial nominees like Miguel Estrada and Carolyn Kuhl get defeated by the filibuster.

    Under Lefty presidents Congress enacts Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, SCHIP, Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac.

    Under GOP presidents Democrat filibusters prevent conservative legislation from passing.

    What a deal if you are a Lefty.