I have a very quick question for Sen Chuck Schumer regarding his desire to create a list of people who are not allowed to go on Amtrak… no, really: the Senator from NY apparently got a little scared by reports that al-Qaeda was thinking about debating about targeting American rail lines. There’s no real indication that there’s an active terrorist plot to do that – not malignantly sexy enough, apparently – but, well, Democratic politicians panic easily.
Anyway, let’s set the scenario: I am in the Newark-Penn Station train station located in New Jersey. I wish to take an Amtrak train to the Trenton, New Jersey train station*. Please note that both locations are fully within the confines of one state: please also note that Amtrak tickets may be purchased with cash, which traditionally does not require providing ID. So here’s my question: under what authority is Congress allowed to either restrict or regulate my intrastate transportation? Please be specific, including the underlying Constitutional clause.
No, I’m being perfectly serious. Do-not-fly lists cover international flights, not national ones; if the need to regulate the latter ever came up, you could possibly stretch the Commerce Clause to fit (we do it for everything else involving interstate activities, apparently). But even then, the default domestic flight crosses state lines, except in the very largest states; Amtrak provides services to people who travel inside states, and I’d like to know precisely where the federal government would derive its authority to regulate such activity.
Aside from its tacit “We’re the ones with the automatic weapons, artillery, armor, and air support” authority, of course. But that’s a well that the federal government can’t actually draw from too many times before people start getting cranky about it.
Moe Lane (crosspost)
(Via Hot Air Headlines)
*Cheaper to do NJ Transit, yes. Not faster, but cheaper. Now hush.
Neil Stevens
Moe Lane
Erick Erickson
Jeff Emanuel
Steve Maley
Caleb Howe
Schumer is being more stupid than usual here...
acat (Diary) Monday, May 9th at 12:09PM EDT (link)Maybe he’s seen “Silver Streak” a few times too many?
Mew
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Caveat Suffragator
I heard his little announcement to the press this morning.
Flagstaff (Diary) Monday, May 9th at 2:08PM EDT (link)He said that they should check out the names on the manifold, just like with air travel.
Manifold? Let me count the ways.
Manifest, Chuckles.
Buffett Rule #1: “Tax rates don’t matter if you don’t pay your taxes”
– Unnamed tax adviser to Warren Buffett, Leavenworth, KS, 2011
Buffett Rule #2: “A parrot in every pot and two Volts in every garage”– Jimmy Buffett, at a seance in Margaritaville, 1977
Having ridden Amtrak across the northern plains...
acat (Diary) Monday, May 9th at 2:36PM EDT (link)one thing I can tell you is that hiring TSA agents for all those little middle-of-nowhere-North-Dakota whistle stops is going to get really expensive…
Maybe *that’s* some of the jobs Joe “Amtrak” Biden is going to create?
Mew
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Caveat Suffragator
I also heard an explanation that high-speed rail
Flagstaff (Diary) Monday, May 9th at 3:53PM EDT (link)along the East Coast would rejuvenate the economy because industry and commerce would spring up along the route. I wonder just what the effect of that would be. Seems to me that for the railway to have that effect, it would have to STOP for those industrial sites, thereby becoming LOW-speed rail.
Buffett Rule #1: “Tax rates don’t matter if you don’t pay your taxes”
– Unnamed tax adviser to Warren Buffett, Leavenworth, KS, 2011
Buffett Rule #2: “A parrot in every pot and two Volts in every garage”– Jimmy Buffett, at a seance in Margaritaville, 1977
You beat me to it on his "manifold" comment. -nt
bk (Diary) Monday, May 9th at 5:38PM EDT (link)I have to admit
Flagstaff (Diary) Wednesday, May 11th at 12:31PM EDT (link)that I had to think about it for a minute to figure out what was wrong. That silver-tongued orator made the wrong word sound right.
Buffett Rule #1: “Tax rates don’t matter if you don’t pay your taxes”
– Unnamed tax adviser to Warren Buffett, Leavenworth, KS, 2011
Buffett Rule #2: “A parrot in every pot and two Volts in every garage”– Jimmy Buffett, at a seance in Margaritaville, 1977
He can put me on the list, I've been on it since 1978.
steve010 (Diary) Monday, May 9th at 12:19PM EDT (link)nt
My guess is that the justification for the Commerce Clause
blooch Monday, May 9th at 12:28PM EDT (link)would be that the tracks themselves cross state lines, and/or some trains come into NJ from yards or stations in other states. Weak sauce, maybe but I’m sure they could funnel it down our throats if they wanted to.
“Lieutenant Dike wasn’t a bad leader because he made bad decisions. He was a bad leader because he made no decisions.”
your answer
nycrepub Monday, May 9th at 12:38PM EDT (link)The train is an instrumentality of interstate commerce. Constitutional Law 101.
That said, Schumer’s idea is idiotic.
For once I'm in agreement with Chuckie
Next93 (Diary) Monday, May 9th at 12:43PM EDT (link)Please, please PLEASE create a “no ride” list for Amtrack, and then simply copy the census database into it. In other words, put everyone in the country on this list.
Given the per-passenger subsidies that the Feds give Amtrack, the cost savings would be enough to fund all of the TSA kibuki at the airports, and we’d probably STILL come out ahead.
Sounds like a great plan to me.
Obama was The One in 2008.
He’ll be a BIGGER one in 2012.
Let's see
steve010 (Diary) Monday, May 9th at 12:43PM EDT (link)Amtrak, USPS, Chevy Volt, TSA
Is there anyone out there that just wants to say NO.
Good ol' Chuckles. Once again tops the
Tbone (Diary) Monday, May 9th at 12:48PM EDT (link)“Do Not Think” list.
Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.
Chuckie wants to increase driving miles again.
Cargosquid (Diary) Monday, May 9th at 12:56PM EDT (link)Don’t you know that gas tax receipts are down?
As Tam at http://booksbikesboomsticks.blogspot.com/ says, “(Besides, I already have a list of the people who don’t ride Amtrak: I call it “the phone book”.)”
How about we finally kill the Amtrak subsidy and save everyone the trouble of making up the stupid list?
I am delighted
baserunr (Diary) Monday, May 9th at 12:58PM EDT (link)to see such questions get seriously asked. If only we could get them seriously answered.
In looking at ObamaCare, I could ask the same question:
By what authority do you regulate the activity between my doctor and I? We both reside in the same state, do not cross state lines to engage in commerce with each other, utilize no other method for payment of services than cash, and generally operate without the interference of the Federal government. So by what authority do you propose to restrict and regulate my activities?
“The day you think you know it all is the day your trouble starts.”
Someone Should Put Joe Biden On The List As a Joke.
Repair_Man_Jack (Diary) Monday, May 9th at 1:48PM EDT (link)I swear. Honestly. Just kidding…
Mr. Obama is pretending that an economic “recovery” is underway when he knows damn well that the banking system is just blowing smoke up the shredded *** of what’s left of that economy – James Howard Kunstler
I think that is what is behind Chuckle's idea.
Flagstaff (Diary) Monday, May 9th at 2:05PM EDT (link)He’s still PO’d that he isn’t VP, so he’d love to inconvenience Biden. (OK, I made that up.)
Buffett Rule #1: “Tax rates don’t matter if you don’t pay your taxes”
– Unnamed tax adviser to Warren Buffett, Leavenworth, KS, 2011
Buffett Rule #2: “A parrot in every pot and two Volts in every garage”– Jimmy Buffett, at a seance in Margaritaville, 1977
Not really that much of a stretch ...
alchemist17 (Diary) Monday, May 9th at 3:26PM EDT (link)You work on a website that is seen in multiple states, therefore anything that affects you can be considered to “affect” interstate commerce. Is this a gross perversion of the original intent? Sure. But so is claiming that a farmer growing food within the confines of his own state and on his own property for personal use “affects” interstate commerce and thus can be covered by Federal law, even if the food is not actually for sale.
This isn’t an issue of courts, or even of Constitutions. The government will claim as much power as we allow it t
Dead meat.
whiskey_sierra Monday, May 9th at 4:02PM EDT (link)>Constitution
Hahaha.. You actually think that peice of TP has any worth now? It’s been used to wipe so many backsides you can’t read it without shooing the flies off.
It’s a worthless peice of trash. Next time, lets write it in crayon and 3rd grade english so even liberal judges can understand it….actually next time how about we not leave it up to judges to read it and leave it up to the PEOPLE to decide what it really says.
At this point its a worthless piece of junk.
Cheaper to do NJ Transit..
jamesrileyjr (Diary) Monday, May 9th at 4:35PM EDT (link)…. and only faster because Amtrak throws its weight around and forces NJ Transit trains to the side in order to make their express trains reach those speeds.
Honestly, privatizing and de-regulating both NJT and Amtrak would be a fantastic idea. Let them all operate on private funds and we’ll be good to go.
As for safety, privatization and deregulation would allow both companies to de-unionize their workforces and spend more money on security than on union BS. You know Amtrak is still paying Penn Central employees, right? Like the government will still be paying GM employees until we get them off the public teat.
Don't have to get ON a train to bomb the tracks.
carolina Monday, May 9th at 5:06PM EDT (link)The plan was to ‘destroy’ some tracks. Shumer is now a bigger idiot than he was.
THAT i find hard to beleive...
Next93 (Diary) Monday, May 9th at 8:03PM EDT (link)…about Chuckie being a bigger idiot. Don’t see how that’s possible in any animate object.
Don’t have any problem with the rest of what you said, though.
Obama was The One in 2008.
He’ll be a BIGGER one in 2012.
Echoes of Ollies Barbecue
fortcollins (Diary) Tuesday, May 10th at 9:41AM EDT (link)“So here’s my question: under what authority is Congress allowed to either restrict or regulate my intrastate transportation? Please be specific, including the underlying Constitutional clause.”
Schumer likely would argue that Article I, Section 8, cl. 3, as interpreted by Katzenbach v. McClung, 379 U.S. 294 (1964) supports his quixotic quest. This case held that the Commerce Clause allowed Congress to enforce the Civil Rights Act in matters purely affecting intrastate commerce. At its core, the reasoning was that withdrawing from interstate commerce to engage in purely intrastate commerce affects interstate commerce. Translation: result-oriented opinion.
Kindly refrain from shooting the messenger. Please don’t read this as indicating any agreement on my part with hyper-expansion of the Commerce Clause.