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Blaming the Messenger and Blaming the Victims

oh, don't mind that, it's just rain on your leg

By: streiff (Diary)  |  November 4th, 2011 at 08:27 AM  | 

RESIZE: AAA

The whole Herman Cain story has caused me more disappointment in my political allies than any other event in my time as a blogger. As I sit here, mouth agape, I am watching a number of people I respect, like Andy McCarthy at NRO, become indistinguishable from Lanny Davis and James Carville during the Clinton-Lewinski scandal.

The fact that we have a story that was reported by Politico, or Pravda for that matter, is irrelevant because we know what they reported was correct. At some point in his tenure as president of the NRA, Herman Cain was the subject of two complaints of sexual harassment that resulted in settlements in the $35-45K range being paid to the complainants and the parties are bound by an non-disclosure agreement. The fact that we don’t know anything about the substance of the complaints is the responsibility of one man: Herman Cain. Through a period of four days Cain has engaged in evasions and outright lies over the events. But no one on the right seems to care very much about that as honesty is now a bug rather than a feature in our candidates. Because Politico.

Already people are lining up to accuse the women involved of being dishonest and predatory. We’re told they are anonymous allegations. We’re told that Cain can’t respond to unknown allegations. This is just crap on its face The women aren’t anonymous. The allegations aren’t unknown. The women and allegations were sufficiently known to allow the NRA to cut them checks. We, the American public, are kept in the dark because Herman Cain won’t ask the NRA to release all sides from the non-disclosure agreement. Because Politico.

Herman Cain’s pattern of lying about these incidents began in 2003, by his own admission, when he told his campaign manager there was one incident while he knew there were at least two settlements. This isn’t important. Because Politico.

We’re told that most sexual harassment claims are frivolous and people who make them are just paid off, willy nilly, to leave because of the expense of litigation. Is that true in your company? How many of you have wives, daughters, etc., who have sued their boss for sexual harassment just to collect the money? Can I have a show of hands? But we KNOW these cases are frivolous, even though Cain refuses to cooperate in getting the details out. Because Politico.

Cain and even ordinarily sensible guys like Rush Limbaugh are claiming that Cain is the victim of racism over this, do we really think any WHITE Republican would have received this level of support in a similar circumstance? No. But the allegations are racist. Because Politico.

This is just ridiculous.

Unlike my colleague Leon, I don’t see where anyone but Herman Cain has a responsibility to be concerned about Cain’s future political viability. A career which I have to note has not extended to actually being elected to anything in the past. He has created this mess and it is incumbent upon him, alone, to get out of it. We have enough bored dilettantes running for office out there as is so I find the loss of one underwhelming.

Herman Cain is running for president. It has been reported, quite accurately, that he has been the subject of two sexual harassment settlements. Yes, we all know that this particular accusation has been abused but we also know that sexual harassment does take place. It is incumbent on Cain to come clean on the facts and circumstances and let the voters judge. If he doesn’t he deserves whatever treatment he gets.

Regardless of the actual facts in the case, Herman Cain’s total absence of honesty and integrity since Sunday should be a clue as to the character of this candidate. It also serves as a clue to the truth of the allegations.

This is not a case of letting “the liberal media” choose our candidates. This is a case of a man who wants to be president having over a decade to prepare a response to an obvious question and refusing to do so. And when he is confronted, rather than candor and truthfulness he engages in attacks, lies, and evasions. We’ve elected two men like that to the White House in the past two decades and in both cases we’ve found that their behavior in office is, unsurprisingly, the same as it is out of office.

There is no way under the sun this man gets my vote for any office at any time.

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  • cajungirl2012

    He’s a dirtbag. Go away cain and give the gop back its dignity.

    • limbchicken

      Dignity, what Dignity. The Republican establishment does not know the meaning of the word.

      • Scope

        It’s just wonderful to have a GOP presidential candidate running out with the sue threat because they printed a story that has embarrassed him. I wonder how many other media outlets will be threatened with lawsuits because they print negative stories about Cain. Isn’t this what one would consider a frivilous lawsuit threat? Isn’t that part of what is wrong with this country?

        • bzip

          Of course he is suing, hi=e is a buffoon who has to blame everyone else and Can’t Except taking responsibility himself for his own actions.

          • libdestroyer

            now we’re REALLY making headway!

          • jakeofalltrades

            And I am NOT a Cain supporter, though I did like him before he shot way above Romney’s flip-flop rate.

          • retire05

            this woman, He will be hit with a counter-suit so fast it will make his head swim. And unlike Cain, the woman has Cain on video from Greta’s show disparaging her work ethics and her reputation as an employee.

            Yeah, Cain, sue!!!!! Discovery in civil cases are very interesting creatures.

          • jakeofalltrades

            I’m trying to create a meme that he should sue, so that later, people will ask why he doesn’t sue, concluding that he has something to hide.

            Which is where I’m at already.

          • jakeofalltrades

            Why try this issue in the Court of Public Opinion, when you can try it in Federal District Court?

          • Scope

            Please answer why you think Cain should sue now. Is it because you want the details out now rather than later when it could hurt the Republicans in the general. I think your answer will be instructive to all of us.

          • jakeofalltrades

            (and if he can plead malice), then whoever he sues has to prove that whatever they said is true, or they have to shut up. It’s one of my favorite parts of the Common Law.

          • jakeofalltrades

            So that Cain can win or get the heck out of the way.

            I’m in a hurry, because Romney is not.

        • txbonniebelle

          How on earth can you sue anyone for printing a true story? Cain knew this was in his past (as did lots of others from his Senate campaign and Restaurant Association). He didn’t prepare to address it as is evidenced by his reactions and lies when the story first surfaced. That is what turned me against Cain – poor judgment on his part. I don’t care to know the details of any of the allegations I’m solely concerned with how Cain handled it and it did a piss poor job of handling something he knew was going to come up.

          • jakeofalltrades

            they have to PROVE it’s true. Get it?

            If Cain sues, out comes the evidence (as long as he pleads a single fact that’s probative of malice).

        • rechts

          He could always launch a civil rights suit against Politico, since according to some ‘conservatives’ publishing a legitimate story about sexual harassment allegations constitutes ‘racism’ and a ‘high-tech lynching’.The so-called ‘right’ is starting to sound a lot like the ‘left’ in its knee jerk racial rhetoric.

          • gekster

            high tech lynching.
            Did he violate his own civil rights then.
            See how dumb that sounds.

          • gator_hoo

            I understand, as the defenses of Cain get more tortuous and the goalposts keep moving, it is harder to tell sarcasm from a genuine defense. I’m going with recht as being a bit satirical.

          • gekster

            I probably would have seen it clearer if I had more coffee.
            coffee, coffee, coffee.

            But Cain did coin the phrase, and he is using it on fellow Republicans.

          • Scope

            I believe the phrase “high tech lynching” was coined during the Clarance Thomas hearings. I’m not sure, but Ann Coulter, who called this a “high tech lynching” may have used the term first, and Cain picked up on it.

          • rechts

            It was sarcasm, but as gator pointed out, the dialogue has gotten so ridiculous with ‘high tech lynching’ I can understand how someone might think I was being serious.

        • jakeofalltrades

          We need the evidence.

      • eabjr

        Here’s a link to Wes Pruden’s observations from the Wash Times today: like Leon Wolf’s articles on Red State yesterday, this brings some reality and objectivity to counter the hysterical opinions masquerading as facts from folks like “streiff” from above.

        http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2011/nov/4/pruden-herman-cain-and-innuendos/

        • eabjr

          In addition to the Wes Pruden column and Leon’s reasoned articles yesterday, here is a link I forgot to add above from CBS, citing the Lawyer of the “unknown woman”.

          http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-57318500-503544/cain-did-not-sign-settlement-accusers-lawyer-says/accusers-lawyer-says/

          All I am saying is that it is always wise not to bear false witness before you have all the facts, and then you can make a reasoned assessment…

    • Flagstaff

      Got any proof that what you write is true? It’s a pretty harsh description.

    • federalfarmer1

      If you say you won’t supportive GOP nominee on election day if Herman Cain or mitt Romney, as I think you did in another comment about his annoying supporters,then you are objectively helping elect Obama.

      I thought that the rules here required banishment for those who refuse to support the gop nominee, like most paultards.

      Rick Perry is polling terribly and has massive unfavorable nationwide. He will not the nominee. Maybe you and other perrybots who refuse to support the gop nominee should start to reconnect to the rest of the gop, rather than ostracize yourselves further.

  • bzip

    I fully agree with you on every point i n your post, including the statement “There is no way under the sun this man gets my vote for any office at any time.”

    Cain has proven to be unqualified, dishonesty, a liar, a walking gaffe machine, has no busy even running for the next POTUS.

    Cain is a total embarrassment to the GOP and what ist stands fpr.
    If is isn’t clear Cain is trying to bring Perry down with him. Cain is trying to ruin a fine proven conservative and for anyone to stand there and support the lies coming out of Cain is pathetic

    “Regardless of the actual facts in the case, Herman Cain?s total absence of honesty and integrity since Sunday should be a clue as to the character of this candidate. It also serves as a clue to the truth of the allegations. ”

    I completely agree with this and all your assessments. I will never vote for a dishonest person who is unqualified.

    Anyone who support a guy that is clearly trying to bring down another campaign based on NO evidence needs there head examined.

    I am tired of asking and asking legitimate questions as to why I as a voter should support Cain and never being answered but always based for asking.

    • jackdaniels11

      his wife, and his family.

      If he wants to stay in the race, that is his right. But once his poll numbers go down to single digits (if that happens) he should drop out.

      Allegations like these would cause any other candidate to drop out, especially if they were true and the acts were truly repugnant.

      If Cain is right and he did not actually sleep with one of his subordinates, then he is still fit for office.

      • bzip

        I disagree, he is unfit to be the POTUS for his out and out lies, dishonesty and clearly unqualified.

        If you feel the need to support the “R” version of Obama do so at the country’s sake,

      • Flagstaff

        did “sleep with one of his subordinates.” Who claimed that?

    • ohmanny

      so I can get some perspective.

      • ohmanny

        So your are biased. Because anyone who is following Herman Cain objectively sees a principled person who is getting harrased with unsubstantiated and unconfirmed allegations. Everybody who knows Herman Cain personally vouches for his integrity. But your opinion comes throught Rick Perry colored glasses so its understandable why you believe the way you believe.

        • Tbone

          There is nothing unsubstantiated. Two women were paid to settle lawsuits. The only reason we don’t know the details is because Cain is a lying sack.

          • Flagstaff

            Maybe not even “the” reason.

            The two (now three) women (I suppose they are women) involved can just come forward and describe what they are leaking about. Then we would all know the details, and Cain could respond freely. So far, we have only heard from lawyers, some of whom have claimed that because Cain tried to answer the charges early he abrogated the original agreement.

            The only reason this will hurt Cain is if it shows (as it seems to be doing now) that he doesn’t handle the PR part of being a public figure well. Some of that is lack of preparation, some is absence of a good PR crisis person on retainer, some is his tendency to want to do it all himself. All of that is not good in a President.

            I give him a pass on the early confusion, even if he was given ten days to prepare. Prepare for what? If his statements (some of them incoherent, I agree) are generally true, this isn’t the kind of thing he could head off at the pass with a pre-emptive statement. But during that ten days he should have spent some money on crisis management advice, and followed it.

            I don’t give him a pass on the more recent mistakes. Should not have accused Anderson, Perry, or anybody else of telling tales, even if the tales are true, and frankly, even if Anderson is the leaker. Should now have the proper responses to defuse the situation and what it may turn into if he is innocent. It’s nearly as bad in this situation to be innocent and look guilty as it is to be guilty.

            I repeat, this is very similar to the tactics used by Obama in his 2006 Senate campaign in Illinois. Doesn’t mean that Obama is behind it, but it’s similar. How it turns out may depend on the facts behind the accusations, or maybe not.

          • libdestroyer

            It is called a non-disclosure agreement.

            If you have any experience with business you are familiar with it. But since you are a perry supporter it’s possible you don’t.

            Basically someone signs an agreement not to talk about something. They are LEGALLY BOUND by this document. Both Cain and his accusers are not allowed to talk about the details.

            Doesn’t it feel good to learn new things? :)

          • center77

            because we have no idea if Cain signed it. The facts are, cain has lied about the situation, and every time he gets caught on the lie, he changes the story and says he did not understand. You mean to tell me this guy is that dumb where he cannot understand what people are asking of him, so either Cain is lying or he is dumb, and either one of these makes him a no for president.

            His supporters want to figure out a way not to believe this, but that facts are their, its looking more and more likely he did it.

          • theone3434

            it’s been reported that he signed the first non-disclosure and not the second because he had already stepped down from CEO. In either instance, the accuser would not be allowed to speak so the very idea of the accuser trying to remain anonymous due to their own free will is preposterous. If Cain would plead with the NRA to release the non-disclosure (assuming they would) then we would probably get the full story. Unfortunately, Mark Block has stated that dropping the non-disclosure is up to the NRA (Cain campaign will not fight for it). This, in and of itself, should signal that Cain is not interested in having his accusers’ stories coming out.

          • Scope

            and we all learned that you got the blam stick just a bit ago. Yes, it is wonderful to learn new things.

          • Tbone

            public and private companies. Since you are a Cain supporter you do so either because you have so much white guilt you are willing to overlook his lying, incompetence, inexperience, ignorance, race baiting and poor judgment, or you are just a frickin’ fool of little consequence. Take your pick.

          • theone3434

            …really, we have come to this level of name calling on our own? C’mon. He can support whatever candidate he wants for whatever variety of reasons that he wants but to say that it is white guilt is utterly ridiculous. I, personally, feel that Cain was/is unqualified to be president due to a TON of substantiated reasons (gaffes on abortion, hostage negotiations, China, electrified fence, ability to get 999 passed, 999′s overall effect on the economy). However, by lobbing the reverse racism (actually straight racism) card you open yourself up from attack the other way (i.e. you don’t support Cain because you are racist). Both of which are far from true (speculating).

          • Tbone

            people bailed out on Perry just because he was less than brilliant in a cooked up , 7 on 1 press conference run by leftwing scumbags.

            Yet, Cain stumbles all over himself, has a closet full of skeletons, has no experience, plays the race card when challenged, blames everyone but himself and a whole bunch of supposedly sentient Republicans are willing to give him a pass.

            So, Sparky, you tell me why that is?

          • rec0n

            5′s.

        • hermas42

          “getting harrassed with unsubstantiated and unconfirmed allegations”????

          Herman Cain himself confirmed there were allegations against him. TWO (2) settlements were paid to TWO (2) different women and shortly after Herman Cain left the Restaurant Association after a VERY VERY SHORT tenure there. Where is your common sense?

          • Flagstaff

            He says he originally signed on for two to three years.

          • center77

            and not one of them is wondering why today. I understand why you feel we should not hold this against him, but there is a certain level of decorum we should expect from out conservative candidates and president. Cain is making us look like a joke to many, many, people.

        • center77

          what you just said, its because they chose to ignore the facts, the man has been lying sense this things broke, then he starts blaming everyone else. He even said more information would come out, and he said a while a go, that someone would make something up, but he said that in may, long before he had reason to feel that, unless he knew about this.

          Flaunting ignorance like a badge of honor is what Cain has been doing, The implication that understanding of complicated issues is somehow elitist and that mere conservative credentials make someone worthy of the office.

          Vain, oops, I mean Cain has done everything but what he should have been doing, plus yes we want a outsider, but not at the expense of competence.

    • defenseconservative

      I am no fan of Rick Perry, but I agree with this statement about Herman Cain.

      It doesn’t matter one iota if the sex harassment allegations are true or not.

      Cain’s baseless accusations against a fellow Republican, first on the rock issue and now on the leak source issue, constitute a true testament to Cain’s honesty and integrity, or rather, his total lack thereof.

      I’ve voted Republican in every presidential election since 1968, when I was first eligible to vote, but I will NEVER cast a vote for such a person.

      • bzip

        You are more than welcome to copy and use the signature disclaimer as you wish.

        For the record I didn’t start out in Perry’s corner. Before Perry got into the race I serious consider Tim Paw. then moved over to Bachmann and Cain. It wasn’t till I seriously look at all the candidates and did research that I finally came to the conclusion Perry is truly th best of all the candidates.

        • gekster

          Actually reaserch the candidates before commiting to them.
          To many people go with ‘he’s the most electable’ (McCain)
          or ‘the media likes him’ (McCain), or so many other lame excuses, ‘he can debate good’ Romney.
          Do reaserch before you pick. Don’t go with what others say, go with the ones that is the closest to YOUR principles and convictions.
          If people would have done that, we wouldn’t have Obama now.

          • 1bunny

            do your research is great advice. With the internet it is easier than ever to do research and really leaves one no excuse for not doing it.

            When I came of voting age the contest was Carter vs Reagan. I was in college and all I heard was if Reagan wins we would all be sent to war, that the draft would be coming back so vote for Carter. When I told this to my mom she was incensed that I was not doing my own investigating into the candidates and just listening to others.

            She always argued good naturedly with her dad to vote the candidate and not the party. He never listened and always went with a straight party ticket vote. Republican fortunately : ) He was a farmer in the south and looking back I am amazed he was not a democrat.

            I learned my lesson way back when and started formulating my own way of looking at a candidate and not just accepting what is fed to us through the candidates and the media and yes other people.. And yes I voted against Carter. I found out the unemployment rate, the high interest rates (18% on a home loan for my parents) and lack of gas (never enjoyed waiting in line to buy gas).

            I did the same thing with all the candidates this election. I liked Cain, he does give a heck of a Tea Party speech, even was on board for having him as our candidate against O, but when I did a little research I saw he was not as conservative as he plays it on abortion and then further listening to him and his gaffes made up my mind. The handling of this “crisis” whether the allegations are true or false makes me even more sure he would be an abysmal president. I know Hillary used the 3 am phone call, and I can’t see Cain responding well when that phone rings in the WH. So now I am for Perry because I can see him handling a crisis well and I like his record.

          • supergirl2911

            I am not delusional about Perry’s faults but he has enough conservative principles and experience to win.

        • libdestroyer

          you should try supporting someone with a chance of winning. LOL

    • eabjr

      Here?s a link to Wes Pruden?s observations from the Wash Times today: like Leon Wolf?s articles on Red State yesterday, this brings some reality and objectivity to counter the hysterical opinions masquerading as facts from folks like ?streiff? from above.

      http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2011/nov/4/pruden-herman-cain-and-innuendos/

      • libdestroyer

        let’s give the perry people time to look up the word first.

        **ugly comments below**

  • gjohnson

    If it is sealed by the courts, then he can’t do it. simple enough. I like Cain, but sooner or later he’ll have to announce his running mate as Tiger Woods.

    • streiff

      that is just not true. It is sealed by contract and Cain has said he will not ask the NRA to waive that even though the accuser seems willing to do so.

      • red_oakster

        The “third woman” never filed a complaint and she is not willing to come forward.

        And the woman who wants the NRA to release her from the NDA wants to make an anonymous statement. That’s not good enough either.

        I’m a Perry supporter, but I think there needs to be more concrete tangible evidence against Cain before these allegations start to bite. And I believe his poll numbers demonstrate that many folks won’t abandon him without more than anonymous accusations.

        • clowngirl

          but it appears Cain’s poll numbers are already dropping a little:

          An ABC News/Washington Post Poll has it at Cain 23, Romney 25 (ugh), Perry 14 and Gingrich 12

          So that’s not a large move for Cain — but it’s a start (as much as a 7 point drop) and it’s the highest I’ve seen Perry in a while.

          There are people who don’t follow politics everyday – and haven’t seen every development in this story — and, as many have pointed out, the bigger problem for Cain isn’t the allegations – it’s how he’s handled the situation. And news of that will take awhile to get around to everyone. It’ll probably spread by word of mouth and people who don’t avidly read political news will hear from friends.

          I’m not sure how it would help if the (alleged) victims came forward publicly. The people who are calling them liars would still be calling them liars — but then they’d have the option of doing it via nasty hate mail rather than just on political blogs. And then they’d probably claim they were just seeking publicity. If they accepted any monetary compensation for sharing a story that would change their lives and possibly affect their future employment prospects, they be painted as just looking for another pay day.

          No, I don’t see how the women coming forward would help anything.

          • Flagstaff

            Then there would be real people asserting real charges.

            Now there is just a story that some accusations were made years ago, accusations that were insignificant enough to be settle with only “five-figure” settlement amounts.

            The Politico story was not news; it was a hit piece intended to hurt Cain rather than to provide useful information.

          • libdestroyer

            because it’s technically libel unless it’s substantiated.

            The media needs to be held accountable. I hope Politico DOES get sued for being so irresponsible.

            It’s not up to Cain to provide facts that would potentially hurt his candidacy. Jeeze, is it April fools day here?

          • Scope

            I know I am responding to a ghost (thankfully), but if Cain brought a lawsuit against Politico for defamation, he would have to prove that either Politico reported a story that they knew was false, or that they printed a story with reckless disregard for the truth. From what I understand it is very hard to legally prove the second option. Politico had reported that they had 6 sources for the information they printed. Currently no one knows who the sources are that Politico has, and no one knows what copies of documents Politico has, including Cain. First of all, Cain would have to prove that the story was untrue, and in order to do that he would have to be deposed in a public court, and all of the details of the charges/settlements would be made public, which Cain is currently trying to squelch. Cain has already admitted himself that there were in fact settlements. Where is Cain’s case? He doesn’t have one, and is simply just blowing smoke yet again. The guy is not qualified to be the POTUS.

          • Flagstaff

            Good explanation for why anything like a lawsuit is a terrible idea.

            I disagree with your final sentence. He is well qualified, better qualified than was Hillary Clinton back in 2008 when she was expected to become the Democrat nominee.

            But whether he gets the nomination or not is the question to be settled by this campaign. Until something concrete is revealed that is damaging to him, I don’t think this will hurt him badly or change the final result.

          • clowngirl

            Reporters use anonymous sources all the time. This is the first time I’ve heard that it’s grounds for a lawsuit.

          • clowngirl

            You say that if the alleged victims publicly released their identities “Then there would be real people asserting real charges”

            First off, there are “real people” who asserted “real charges” when they filed the allegations more than 10 years ago. Real people who left actual jobs and started over elsewhere.

            It’s not just “a story that some accusations were made” the fact that there were official accusations made years ago has been confirmed — and a total of $80,000 was paid out in settlements.

            I keep reading a lot of people calling for the alleged victims to come forward — but they are still, at this point, bound by a confidentiality agreement. They would not be allowed to come forward and tell their story even if they wanted to. It would be ridiculous for them to publicly reveal their identities when they can’t even tell their side of the story.

            One alleged victim is trying to get permission to give an overview of her complaint. I believe the NRA’s board is ruling on that today.

          • Flagstaff

            Analysis:

            What brought this “story” to the attention of the Politico? Someone from the NRA, not the women themselves. In doing so that person, if a board member, may have breached the non-disclosure agreement himself.

            In one case, POLITICO has seen documentation describing the allegations and showing that the restaurant association formally resolved the matter. Both women received separation packages that were in the five-figure range.

            This documentation is the most solid part of the story, but note that it apparently relates only to the settlement. Again, someone seems to have
            breached the NDA to show Politico the documents.

            On the details of Cain?s allegedly inappropriate behavior with the two women, POLITICO has a half-dozen [unattributed] sources shedding light on different aspects of the complaints.

            The sources ? including the recollections of close associates and other documentation ? describe episodes that left the women upset and offended.

            This is a bit like an elephant described by a committee of blind men. Everybody describes something different.

            The entirety of the article strongly implies that the women themselves didn’t make this information public, but that it came from other sources. It’s unclear whether that was with or without the blessing of the women but it appears to be “without.”

            Given all these sources, why is the description of the allegations left so vague by the Politico? Why are the episodes described by them not relayed to us? Finally, why are the informants left unnamed? They aren’t party to a non-disclosure agreement. Are they embarrassed by their own behavior?

            …There were also descriptions of physical gestures that were not overtly sexual but that made women who experienced or witnessed them uncomfortable and that they regarded as improper in a professional relationship.

            What in the world does that mean?

            **”It?s not just ?a story that some accusations were made? the fact that there were official accusations made years ago has been confirmed ? and a total of $80,000 was paid out in settlements. “**

            So the story is only that some accusations were made and the accusers were paid a nominal amount to go away. Until there are some names attached and some offensive actions described, that’s all the story is, and its purpose is transparently to hurt a Republican candidate rather than to provide any real information about him.

            **”I keep reading a lot of people calling for the alleged victims to come forward ? but they are still, at this point, bound by a confidentiality agreement. They would not be allowed to come forward and tell their story even if they wanted to. It would be ridiculous for them to publicly reveal their identities when they can?t even tell their side of the story. “**

            I agree, with the reservation that I don’t know the details of the agreement. Somebody has already talked about something, and at this point it would be to Cain’s benefit if the whole story came out (assuming his innocence). Since the origination of the public story seems to come from the NRA Board, it could be that somebody on that board has some unknown motive for releasing just the innuendo but not the details covered by the NDA. In which case, they might not grant permission to go public, or they might release the women but not the NRA itself from their mutual vows of silence.

            **”One alleged victim is trying to get permission to give an overview of her complaint. I believe the NRA?s board is ruling on that today.”**

            Where would that leave things? It would leave the woman able to say whatever she wants, us ‘publicans with no access to the contemporary records, and Cain forced to defend himself without any documentary defense. Not exactly fair to Cain.

            I don’t know what happened or didn’t happen. I just know this smells like a typical Democrat dirty trick, which usually work best if just a bit if it is true. And just to gild the lily, I suggest that it was planted now because it would have much less impact against a Democrat in the general campaign. After all, to Democrats, “it’s only sex.”

          • avagreen

            I’ve been following the polls to guage the change in attitude after Perry’s ads and interviews were released, and have been noticing a slight increase for Perry, but haven’t seen a decrease for Cain until today as you pointed out.

            So, Romney is in the lead again, eh?
            See my post about my theory about that (?):
            http://www.redstate.com/realquiet/2011/11/03/its-now-down-to-gingrich-or-perry/#comment-1895

          • jrmax13

            I beg to differ. The latest Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey of Likely GOP Primary voters shows Cain with 26% of the vote over former Massachusetts Governor Mitt Romney?s 23%. Former House Speaker Newt Gingrich draws 14% support, with no other GOP contender reaching double-digits.
            Read it an weep. Perry has sunk so low, the writer does not even mention his name. Oh, the glee !!!
            What is the point at which the networks begin dis-inviting candidates from the debates? LOL

            Perry/Crist 2012 !

      • Flagstaff

        that if Cain does call for the records to be released by the NRA, he will then be accused of “exposing a woman to public scrutiny of an embarrassing event in her distant past.” The cad! And after agreeing to keep it secret, too.

    • lucasblack

      His ideal running mate would not be woods, but Charlie Sheen. Just imagine the bumper stickers; Cain/Sheen #winning!
      And imagine how much it would wind up liberals to have a Sheen running on the GOP ticket!

      • libdestroyer

        lol.

  • bzip

    I further ask that anyone and everyone call out and reject the racial baiting taking place within our own party.

    We must not use double standards or being look upon as hypocrites. We must stand for our principles.

    • Xasteius

      no loitering

  • radicalrighty

    Another sickening part of this is the comparison to Clarence Thomas’s ordeal. There is NO comparison.

    You folks attacking these women, stop for a second, and put your wife, daughter, sister, mother in their place and consider these events.

    It’s easier to accept when it’s a faceless victim, huh?

    • bzip

      His supporters aren’t even giving the women a chance to tell theire side of the story. Don’t you think they deserve a chance to tell their side or are we to the point we only listen to one side of the story now?

      Just how far have some of you gone in giving up on principles?

      We yell and scream about Obama and dem’s using the race card yet it is okay for Cain and his supporters to pull it out all the time.

      Dishonest, Double standards and Hypocrite sure come to mind when I hear Cain.

      Victim and Race Card what has become of the conservative principles.

    • sadams

      It was Cain’s decision to run for President, not theirs, and now they are being dragged into a matter which they and the Restaurant Association agreed to keep private. And I agree, there is no comparison to the Clarence Thomas situation.

      • libdestroyer

        These women are still anonymous and can remain so as long as they like. No need to feel sorry for them.

  • josephine

    I don’t agree with any of this junk. I didn’t get my morning email from redstate. This is screwy. this is @occupyredstate.
    I won’t waste my energy on any of this.

    • bs61

      I’ll be skipping anymore stories of Cain on either side… due to boredom!

      • macbookben

        …I could’ve just cut and pasted this as I am repeating myself. Here goes: do you plan to vote for the Republican nominee on November 12 2012 regardless of whether you supported/attacked that candidate? If not, do you plan to vote for any other candidate, including BHO? Or will you sit out this one out and just stay home and watch the election results come in.

        If you answered yes to the first question, it would be logical to conclude that you will vote for Herman Cain, whether he’s on the top or bottom of the ticket, because that is one of dozens of indisputable scenarios that may become reality.

        If you answered yes to either of the remaining two questions, well… you figure it out.

        Folks, my point is this. No matter what happens to Herman Cain, or any of the other candidates, over the next several months, it is inevitable that the mission to remove BHO from the White House will depend on how you will answer these questions.

        O.K. please continue fighting now.

        • kcdude

          With one caveat. I want the truth to come out at this point in the process.

        • bs61

          I just am literally sick of this same story, day in and day out with no details. :)

      • libdestroyer

        streiff’s hit-pieces are so ::YAWN:: exciting and ::YAWN:: informative.

        Don’t you think?

        • bs61

          with your “I started insulting site moderators!”

  • ohmanny

    Your gleeful headline yesterday showed you were enjoying the Herman Cain accusations a little too much. I listened to every speech Herman Cain gave since the scandal broke and I only heard his consistent message of knowing of one accusation and that he made no settlement (as in legal settlement). I never heard say there were two setllements. You assume in your article that the second allegation is true and therefore he must come clean. Maybe it isnt true and maybe he didnt know about it, why do you assume he is lying? And for not asking the NRA to release the non disclosure agreement, its not in Herman Cain’s hands. He never signed the agreement. If the NRA wants to release they may. That is all I heard from Herman Cain say that the policy of the NRA is not release it and that he will not ask them to change their policy which is understandable.

    • gekster

      of Cain saying it had to have come from Perry, with no proof whatsoever.
      Does he know about the second allegation the same as he knows about Perry releasing the info.

      • jackdaniels11

        We know that some more is going to leak out this week. Let’s just see what comes out of the tap.

        We’ve heard nothing about the second accuser so far.

    • Donald Ayotte

      “There is no way under the sun this man gets my vote for any office at any time.”

      The democrats look for easy target like you to prey upon. You fell for their line of crap, hook, line and sinker.
      You can now dig the hook out of your mouth if you didn’t swallow it.

      • tnguy

        Cain’s racebaiting destroyed any notion that I was ever going to vote for him. This latest escapade is just another nail in the coffin.

        When it comes to my vote, his campaign is dead to me.

    • supergirl2911

      If there is nothing to hide to say – the NRA policy is to not disclose however I have nothing to hide and they have my support in whatever they want to release. I am not asking for anyone to withhold any information or keeping anyone from speaking.
      Instead what he did was ‘predict’ that others would come forward. I believe the double standard is with republican torch bearers. I do not think we should so quickly pull the trigger and defame someone’s character however if this were Clinton or Edwards his behavior and word would receive a much different spin from Hannity, etc. I believe they would call it hiding suspicious and too coincidental (Predicting other women would come forward) I do not know anyone accused of this but I imagine if there is ‘nothing there’ a person would be shocked if someone else came forward. I get it that this is serious politics but it comes across as damage control and I am SHOCKED that Rush, etc do not air that.

  • shinglejim

    I couldn’t agree more.

  • jrhode2873

    Is your complete lack of objectivity in covering this story streiff. You have been complicit with the mainstream media in the most outrageous character assassination of a public figure I have ever seen. Every bit of this story is based on anonymous sources and innuendos. Not one person has come forward to state their case. As a matter of fact, every body who does come forward has nothing but great things to say about Herman Cain including the former Chair of the NRA who called this smear campaign a ‘hatchet job’. So you know why you find yourself on the other side of an issue from Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, Mark Levin, Andrew McCarthy and others? It is because you dislike Herman Cain so much that you cannot see straight. There’s not been an ounce of objectivity in your columns about this. And, if this was happening to your preferred candidate you would be screaming bloody murder. I’m sick of this smear campaign and don’t have anything else to say about it.

    • bzip

      So you think it is okay for Cain to blame Perry without any evidence?

      You think it is okay for Cain to change his story how many time during this week long scandal?

      You think it is okay that Cain has handled this the way he has?

      Don’t you think Cain’s handling of this shows us how he would possible handle a crisis in the white house or govern?

      Talk about blinders on.

      • ohmanny

        even though there a lot of arrows pointing in that direction. I’m not going to blame him for not handling it like a real politican because he is not one. He handled the story in my opinion like someone who is innocent. A guilty person would not have put himself out there like Herman Cain did. He would have got Crisis Managment groups and High Powered lawyers involved. But in his innocence he beleived that just telling his side of the story would be enough. Thats is why I like and will vote for him if it makes a difference by the time the primaries arrive in NY.

      • Vaughn Harold

        nt

        • bzip

          You just don’t get it;

          Cain Must Take Responsibility. This is Cain’s mess and only his mess.

          If Cain had never had some settlements with these women and that is admits to and if Cain hadn’t tried to lie about it and change his story – than NONE of this would be here for anyone to be talking about.

          It is therefor Cain’s mess and only Cain’s mess. Start asking Cain and asking him to take responsibility.

          • Vaughn Harold

            I agree that Cain made this into more of a mess than it had to be, but he did not create the mess, it was a hit job. My bet is that the dem’s are behind this to accomplish the very thing that you are playing into, divide/destroy the republican party.

          • gator_hoo

            I mean, he is the one that made a direct and baseless accusation against another candidate. I guess he is trying to divide and destroy the Republican Party.

          • Vaughn Harold

            I say double standard.

          • Xasteius

            My guess is that the people will step out into the light with a breaking headline Sunday to divert attention from the Cain-Gingrich debate. A really juicy morsel will come out sometime Monday or Tuesday just in time for the debates.

          • Xasteius

            no tex-t

  • mich22

    You nailed it. We are witnessing some serious hypocrisy on our side, and I am utterly disappointed. I can hardly watch Hannity or listen to Laura Ingraham anymore. These women came forward when Cain was a nobody (comparatively speaking to his status now). They bear no resemblance to Anita Hill. They are being maligned by our own and it’s flat out wrong. Cain is the one who bears the blame here, not them. If he was innocent, he shouldn’t have paid money to hush them up. And, my goodness, Cainiacs, we are talking about multiple allegations. Get real and get your heads out of the sand! Anyway, great piece, streiff…my thoughts exactly.

  • tngal

    Expected a little better..

    “There is no way under the sun this man gets my vote for any office at any time.”

    Really?

    Cain gets the nomination and you don’t pull the lever ????

    At least Cain is willing to pull the lever for Perry albeit begrudgingly.

    In talking with Hugh Hewitt at the beginning of the month he was asked specifically if he would support/not support Rick Perry.

    ________
    HC: I?ve got to answer that two ways. Now that?s an entrapment question.

    HH: (laughing)

    HC: I did say, Hugh, that based upon Governor Perry?s positions on some of the things today like being soft on securing the border, providing tuition assistance for children of illegal aliens, I have a heart, but I happen to believe you cannot basically provide incentives for people to keep doing the same illegal behavior. And based upon a number of other things, I can?t support him today based upon his position on things. That being said, I don?t think he?s going to get the nomination. Now if it?s one of those other candidates up there, I am going to support them 100%. If Governor Perry gets the nomination, I will still support him, but it won?t be 100%.
    _____

    So he’ll hold his nose and pull the lever for Perry, but you won’t do it for him if he wins the nomination???

    Stay classy Streiff.

    http://www.hughhewitt.com/blog/g/05446fb9-ebac-44e3-b373-a2213ecf916e

    • bzip

      ?There is no way under the sun this man gets my vote for any office at any time.?

      streiff is totally right in saying that and I agree.

      To vote for a person who is dishonest, unqualified without any principles in no better tha voting for Obama. How can anyone hold to principles and willing vote for this person.

      Stay home, that is what I will do if it comes down to Cain. I can not with holding to my principles vote for this person. It is called sticking to your principles.

      • Vaughn Harold

        that fit into the equation of your principles.

        This is Redstate if you haven’t noticed

        • bzip

          Who said Obama is appealing, if you want the R version of Obama than go with Cain.

          I myself will stick with my principles and will NOT give up on my principles – I will stay home.

          • Vaughn Harold

            understand how that fits into the whole principle thing you got going on.

          • bzip

            If you can live with voting for someone that is unqualified and is dishonest – do at yourself but I can not.

          • Vaughn Harold

            more honest. Sorry, but he doesn’t have to give you more ammo to continue the attack that you have been enjoying all week.

            Again, this is Redstate, not Perrystate. If Cain is the nominee, Redstate will support him. If you can’t, I would suggest moving on.

      • rightwingmom52

        the GOP nominee, how is that not in violation of redstate’s Rule #6? If you stay at home and refuse to vote, how does that not translate into a passive form of supporting the Democratic party?

        6. It is forbidden to promote or give any kind of support for parties other than the Republican party, or candidates running against Republican primary, caucus, and/or convention nominees. Exceptions to this rule are granted when announced prominently on the front page of the site.

        http://www.redstate.com/posting-rules/

        As we say in the South, the Lord willing and the creek don’t rise, I plan to vote for the GOP nominee in November 2012.

        • bzip

          Give it up RWM you are sounding as screwy and unprincipled as your candidate., Cain.

          • rightwingmom52

            That’s what you do best, isn’t it? Bless your heart.

            This one’s just for you.

            In an interview with The Daily Caller, former National Restaurant Association board chairman Joseph Fassler offered a firm defense of GOP presidential front-runner Herman Cain, along with an explanation for how Washington?s best-kept secret ? the identities of Cain?s sexual-harassment accusers ? was also kept from the association?s board.

            ?The accusations? It?s a hatchet job, in my opinion,? Fassler told TheDC from his Phoenix, Ariz. office. ?My gut tells me it?s a hatchet job. He gets a lead, he gets some traction, and the next thing you know, here come these allegations. It?s sad.?

            Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2011/11/03/national-restaurant-association-chairman-during-cain%e2%80%99s-tenure-its-a-hatchet-job/#ixzz1ckVH1cQY

        • tngal

          See, lets pretend Karl Rove runs for representative of the State of Disillusion, our 59th state. Somehow, he wins the primary. I gotta say, I’d be look hard at sending money to an independant.

          (The folks in the state of Disillusion are pretty goofy rwm. No wonder they picked someone like Rove)

        • macbookben

          n/t

      • macbookben

        I guess.

      • littlehouse18

        I now have very little respect for Cain, but if he were to be the nominee, I would still vote for him over Obama. That’s because the other option is to let Obama win and have our country’s future destroyed.

        I do believe in principle, but if there’s nothing left to save, how have I helped make the world better?

        Cain would sign a repeal of Obamacare, and that is vital to me (along with protecting us from Iranian nukes).

    • aeternalis

      The fact that Herman Cain still considers allowing the children of illegal aliens who (by no fault of their own) are in Texas and willing to better themselves through higher education (as well as work toward citizenship) to pay in-state tuition rates to be “tuition assistance” further leads me to believe that this man is not willing to face up to facts even when presented with them. The Hemanator fails horribly for continuing to parrot this meme incorrectly.

      I guarantee you, the main motivation for 99.9% of all illegal immigration into this country is NOT to attend the University of Texas at an in-state rate. The incentive to come to this country is a JOB. Not a school.

    • irishgirl

      It’s ambiguous statements such as these from Herman Cain that are head-scratching, i.e. ….I will still support him, but it won’t be 100%….what the heck does that mean? At least streiff is honest about his intentions and was probably talking about primaries anyway. At the end of the day, HC has not handled this whole incident well at all. He simply could have acknowledged the situation(s), explained as best he could and then forcefully tried to move on. And in my opinion, he has not done that. And how any candidate handles “scandals” such as these whether he’s a seasoned politician or not is very telling.

      • tngal

        If one’s candidate either drops out or doesn’t win the primary, you’re pretty much just left with the person who did win the primary. You may not like their policy or anything else about them, but because they have that r by the name you’ll pull the lever. Much like with most of us and romney. While many don’t support him due to Romneycare, illegal imms, whatever – if it turns out he wins the primary, yea we’ll pull the lever but don’t really back him 100 percent as candidate,

        We’re not jumping up and down cheering yeah Romney’s my fav.

        Make sense?

        Cain’s not ambiguous. He just says it shorter. That’s how he is with a lot of things, but when you read through longer articles or listen into the longer interviews where he can expound you understand what he says. Much like with Fred, you have to get the entire answer.

        As for streiff…” There is no way under the sun this man gets my vote for any office at any time.”

        –At any time— is the kicker. He is adamant. not in the primary not in the general not in anything. Which tells me, if Cain and Perry were on a ticket together, Streiff wouldn’t pull that lever either, even if it helped his candidate.

    • supergirl2911

      I am not a politician but I know the answer to that. “I do not believe (fill in the blank) would be the best choice, however I will support any Republican nominee in the defeat of one of the most misguided and destructive administrations this country has ever seen.”
      The question is NOT entrapment. It is very likely the interviewer would ask the next logical question, “What specifically makes you say that Perry would not be the best choice?” This would give him an opening to criticize Perrybwhich he loves doing.
      What does Perry say against Cain? Nothing
      So who is the front runner? Why all the Perry hate when he is polling 3rd and 4th? Single digits? Things that make you go hmm?

    • clintonformccain

      Cain gets the nomination and you don?t pull the lever ????

      No way. I can’t vote for he man. Putting aside all this brouhaha, He doesn’t know that China has nukes and he can’t, despite mulitple attempts, make a coherent statement about basic policy positions.

      I’m not picky. Mitt Romney was my governor and I can’t stand the man. He makes my skin crawl, but I would gladly vote for him over Obama. As long as the Republicans nominate someone even marginally qualified for the office, I’ll be the first in line at the polls. But, if the part self-destructs and nominates Christine O’Donnell, or Sharon Angle, or Herman Cain, I’ll have to stay home on election day.

      Just for the record, I am absolutely disgusted with the Republican Party and the way this nomination process is being treated like its some kind of a joke.

  • radicalrighty

    You know, the contracts that legally keep the women from talking?

    • radicalrighty

      jrhode2873 (Diary) Friday, November 4th at 9:09AM EDT (link)

  • Vaughn Harold

    Even if true, don’t you think the women would have taken his butt to court if that’s the justice that they wanted. They chose to settle.

    Obviously, every candidate for POTUS is guilty until proven innocent in your book just because of any smoke that someone wants to start. Good grief I hope no one starts some smoke on Perry’s past/record.

    And no, just because he’s running for POTUS, he doesn’t have drag out all the details of some settlement that the women agreed to.

    Oh by the way, I wonder, just wonder, if Cain ends up being the nominee if you will lose your front page/moderator status for that last sentence since this is Redstate, not Perrystate.

    • aeternalis

      The media really tried with the whole N*head rock story. Cain even got in on it and hopped onto the race card boohoo bandwagon. It flamed out quickly because it had no legs and was a non-story to begin with.

      That and the Perry campaign handled it swiftly and competently. Which is more than Herman Cain’s campaign can say about this whole mess.

      • Vaughn Harold

        Nobody’s perfect

        • aeternalis

          “Nobody’s perfect.” IMHO this would be the perfect line for anyone to use with you whenever you feel like putting the screws to Perry for his debate performances as you are so apt to do.

          I wonder if you would accept that simple two-word rejoinder just as glibly from Perry supporters when you question them about their choice of candidate.

          • bzip

            Actually I don’t think Perry is bad in debates, in fact he is really good pending on the type of format. If you saw the Iowa forum debate Perry would make any conservative proud.

            Check out Moe’s post on it;
            http://www.redstate.com/moe_lane/2011/11/01/gov-perry-at-the-iowa-republican-presidential-forum-on-manufacturing/

            or watch the YouTube;
            http://youtu.be/FeKKY-sVLgU

          • Vaughn Harold

            their own candidates faults.

        • Tbone

          How do you think he will handle pressure in the General? Better? LOL

          • Vaughn Harold

            than any of the other candidates, with the exception of Newt.

          • Tbone

            Get you head out of whatever it is in.

    • supergirl2911

      I think any money paid is indicative of something there

      • Vaughn Harold

        that the women and the NRA came to. If there was more to it then, it would have came out.

    • jackdaniels11

      That’s the only way I can explain it.

      He claims that he’ll never vote for Cain. He thinks that it’s great that Free Republican has declared war on Romney. He won’t consider Michele Bachmann.

      Either Perry gets the nomination or Streiff stays home. Scorched earth.

      I can play this game, too. Rick Perry will never get my vote. I will leave the presidential part of my ballot blank if Perry gets the nomination.

      His executive order regarding Garasil shots shows that he is a buffoon who takes orders from the Merck Corporation.

      It’s so sad that we have a moronic Democrat in the White House, an electorate that is ready and willing to send him home, and the only Republican (Romney, not Cain) who can do it is hated on by guys like Streiff and Moe Lane who continually rail on the guy with disingenuous attacks.

      If this were 1979, they’d be calling Ronald Reagan “Ronnie Tax Hike” because he raised taxes as Governor of California. They’d sink the Reagan campaign and allow Carter to cruise to re-election against Jack Kemp or whoever their perceived conservative Messiah would be.

      • acat

        Just to include a fact here, the so-called Merck payoff was a tenth of what the Restaurant Association paid to settle Cain’s debacles.

        “Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. Three times, it’s enemy action. ” – Ian Flemming

        Mew

        • rightwingmom52

          there are a few more to add to that list. More than one saying they will “never” vote for Cain. As said before, I’ll vote for becker’s dead cat (ouch, did that hurt? sorry) before I’ll vote for Obama or stay home which is a passive vote for Obama – in my opinion of course.

          • acat

            “Mikado”, of course,, although I’m more partial to “Sweeny Todd”.

            Mew

            (who still refuses to vote for Ron Paul, but will support any other nominee including Becker’s dead white cat, thus proving even a dead cat is more useful than the congressman from Texas)

          • rightwingmom52

            Does it matter what color the cat is? LOL. Wouldn’t want anyone to accuse you of suffering from a case of white guilt.

          • acat

            As it’s a bit late to petition to get on the ballot, I don’t see where I have any other feline candidates to choose from…

            Mew

        • rkcurtin

          NT

          • tngal

            Its just not a word used in mixed company. Could cause some to get the vapors. In fact it could open up a whole can of worms. Maybe not now, but say 12 years from now. And the fact that you said it to a cat, well, that’s just depraved.

          • acat

            On the internet, one never really knows, y’see.

            Still, being a tomcat, I do prefer “handsome” to “pretty”.

            Mew

          • tngal

            allegation if rkcurtin is a cat.

            I didn’t know you were a tomcat. Its hard to tell with all the smoke and these dim lights.

          • rkcurtin

            How observant and true.

            The left has the whole society painted into a corner on everything so no innocence remains, no one is allowed to be human (or a cat, maybe) anymore.

            I am a cat though, an Arizona Wildcat.

        • jackdaniels11

          When I think about what would happen to this country if Obama gets re-elected, I seriously consider voting for anyone whose name is not Barack Hussein Obama.

          But Perry’s tactics of using Romney’s religion against him have infuriated me. If Romney had been Jewish or Catholic, Perry’s campaign would have imploded by now.

          So, I appreciate you letting me know that Merck’s contribution to Perry was less than the NRA’s payouts to Cain’s victims, but Merck is just one of many problems that I have with Gov. Perry.

      • Repair_Man_Jack

        It’s better than seeing you at an #Occupy protest demanding that the rest of us pay for your student loans.

        • gekster

          They can always use another idi…..well, never mind.

      • supergirl2911

        I am passionately supporting Perry and I am not being paid.

  • davidpw

    I agree with everything you have said in your post. I’m shocked at how many conservatives are behaving. I’m also very disappointed in Rush, Levin and Hannity for their part in this. The blame game needs to stop with Cain.

  • mkozikowski

    Mr. Cain has fallen from grace in my eyes. He is trying to ‘slick Willy’ his way out of this problem.
    But, his actions on the subject of the harassment allegations are totally within the parameters of all of his previous actions.
    Whether it is defending his 999 against the accusations of getting the idea from a computer game.
    OR
    His side stepping all the other gafaws he has made.
    BUT
    the real issue I have, that no one seems to be questioning, is his statement declaring that we (The U.S. of A.) should keep our eyes on China. They appear to be making moves to become a NUCLEAR power.

    HUH?

    did he just wake up from a long sleep. Perhaps his real name is Mr. Van. Winkle!

    THAT is my beef with H. Cain.

    • jackdaniels11

      categorical denial.

      He called the allegations “false”. He said that there is no truth to them.

      Guess he was out of the country when Clinton gave his categorical denials and was nearly removed from office because the American public could no longer believe anything he said.

      Luckily, Clinton’s party had enough votes in the Senate to guarantee that the impeachment trial was a kangaroo court in which he was allowed to raise such intricate defenses as “I know you are but what am I?”

  • http://www.FranBaker.com frankieb

    Cain needs to clean up his mess. A mess he apparently created. If that means he drops out of the primary race, so be it. We have too many problems in this country and a clueless clown in charge. We don’t need another clown. We need someone with the knowledge and the ability to take on the lamestreamers’ and their candidate.

    • tngal

      Politico’s elusive anonymous source created it. Someone scoured for the poo. Politico flung it.

      A matter 12 years in the past settled by everyone including the women, who only wanted a severance package to get out. They got so little because the accusations were puny . If they were seriously egregious there would have been more than severance pay.

      If the women wanted to bring him down they would have done it back in 08. For them its over. For Herman its over. For the Association its over.

      So, the women didn’t create this mess Sunday night, Mr. Cain didn’t, the mess was created by whomever dredged up this smelly 12 year old limburger and gave it to politico.

      Fred Thompson smells a rat behind the cheese. He suspects this came out due to some handiwork within the Republican Party. Whoever “that” is, that’s who created this mess. Because everyone else had gone on with their lives.

      • Vaughn Harold

        stop blaming people within the party, even if that’s where this all came from.

        It doesn’t make since that someone in the Republican party would intentionally want to fracture the party, but I suppose anything is possible in politics when your guy is losing.

      • gekster

        everyone pretty much agrees that this is a non issue, and agrees with what you say here.
        It is the way that Cain has handled it is more to the crux of the matter.
        If he had just come clean with it at the beginning, we would have moved on by now.
        It would be a non issue, but Cain has made it into something it never should have become.

        • tngal

          handled the matter as others would. He hasn’t brought out a huge spin machine. He hasn’t handled this the way a politican would.

          Perhaps its because he’s not a politician. its one of the qualities many find so appealing. Name me five things about his campaign thus far that are normal. Little staff, weird ads, repeating answers for reporters too stupid to understand what he said, getting everyone off of GOP talking points and shifting dialogue to taxes.

          He is so unconventional, it flies in the face of all that is “politically” holy.

          I’m giving him time to get this all straightened out in his own way.

          • gekster

            but his lying and changing the story is typical politician.
            He really isn’t that much different.

      • Tbone

        what a dishonest buffoon Cain has turned out to be. Face it, your black messiah is a fraud.

  • http://www.planettron.com NickDeringer

    Back in March he trumpeted “I have no skeletons in my closet”. He has changed his story more than 5 times. Herman came into this to sell books and yes I do believe to feed his ego and prop up his brand. He has become the Howard Dean of the GOP.

    If this is our “savior” you better get ready for 4 more years of One-bama.

  • morristhewise

    Being honest and coming clean would not be in Cain?s interest, he cannot admit that after a few drinks he becomes an obnoxious flirt. His confession would bar him from parties where married women were present and alcohol served.

  • NeoKong

    Boo hoo…
    Is your little crusade is falling apart…?
    So sad.

    Herman is obviously a sexual predator if you could only get him to admit it.
    Apparently he is not doing enough to help you smear him.
    If he could only wave his hand and nullify by the will of his presence negotiated legal settlements he was not a party to then we could get to the bottom of this.
    Do you have any other legal contracts you want him to cancel…?
    The Panama Canal Treaty perhaps ?

    You forget that the Politico supposedly has all the facts as they know who everyone is.
    Just like your little buddy Roger Simon.
    That is of course when he is not issuing corrections to the most damaging details of his story.
    Why don’t you whine to them to release the details…?
    They are under no NDA and can publish all they know at anytime.

    Here you are ready to try and convict and then sentence Herman Cain and you don’t have one damn fact other than someone was “sexually harassed” and they were paid money.
    Other than Herman Cain you have no idea who is involved.

    OK Columbo.
    Lay it out for us.
    Who did Herman Cain “sexually harass” and what happened ?
    Tell us all the juicy details you know.
    This is your little trial after all.

    Come on Mr. Prosecutor.
    Spell it out.
    Tell us all the most serious and damning charges that you are personally certain of.

    Your adoring fans breathlessly await your response.
    .

    • ohmanny

      …A little sanity in one of the most biased and venoumous posts I have read on Redstate in the past four years I have been reading this blog.

      • daveoconnor

        You and we deserve answers to your questions, but I don’t think we’re going to get anything but bald assertions.

        • NeoKong

          Ruuaaacckkk weehoo

          RedState want a cracker…?

          • Tbone

            He has omitted. His people are incompetent. He has played the race card. He has falsely accused Perry. He has blamed everyone but himself. He is Obama.

          • NeoKong

            In fact I said he is doing a terrible job.
            But that is Cain’s problem and the consequences will be his.
            If his campaign folds well then it folds.
            We’ll all move on.

            Whatever happens in the next few days will determine the outcome of his campaign.
            It’s all in motion and we will see how it plays out and then in Jan. the voters will weigh in.

            That is not enough for some people here however.
            They want to humiliate him too.

          • Tbone

            point and say “Behold”. He”ll do the rest.

          • iidvbii

            nt

  • tnguy

    One thing conservatives conveniently overlook in the rush to compare Herman Cain to Ted Kennedy, Bill Clinton, et al, in that those men got past their scandals, is the difference between them and us. Their reasoning being that even if there is something to this sexual harrassment issue, it’s ok, because hey, Clinton and Kennedy got away with it.

    But we don’t hand out such free passes on our side. What we’ve heard and Cain’s reaction to this suggests that there is something to it. Even if there is, that doesn’t make Herman Cain worthless and unforgivable as a human being. But it does make him unfit for office, especially this office, in my opinion.

    Just as disconcerting to me is that conservatives willfully overlook Cain’s own racebaiting of those in his own party, of his own political ideology. Further, Cain claims to be a Christian, as does Rick Perry. What sort of man attacks a Christian brother, accusing him first of racism, then accusing him of bringing to light this story, even while admitting they have no evidence of such?

    I can only conclude that Herman Cain is not just unworthy of being President, but is also untrustworthy and of questionable character as a whole, and that”s probably being generous. That so many on our side are eager to overlook such things troubles me greatly.

    I’d sooner vote for the Bolshevik currently in office than vote for Cain. The reality is that if he (or Romney, for that matter) gets the nomination, I won’t be voting for any of them.

  • nativetexan41

    Cain has not been able to tell the truth about this whole situation and now we know how he would be in office. We already have an accuser-in-chief in the WH. I would not vote for him.

  • Christian_Reppie

    I heard Jay Sekulow from the ACLJ ( American Center for Law and Justice, a Christian Org.) tell Hannity that they have no proof..WHAT????? Isn’t somebodys word good enough for them?

    As somebody else wrote..They are sounding too much like Lanny Davis defending Clinton..Next thing we will hear from the Cain camp is …depends on what the meaning of is…. is..

    • tnguy

      A number of conservatives have disappointed me on this.

      Fact is, there is plenty of evidence. The NRA paid off 2 women. An attorney for one of the women says she wants the NDA waived so she can talk, and the Cain campaign has flatly said it would not agree to waiving the NDA.

      Time was when we held our candidates to a higher standard than the left. I hope that time hasn’t come to an end.

    • joayn

      was that Politico has produced no actual documentation, names, dates, etc., for Cain and Co. to directly respond to.

      This was actually a very good segment on Hannity. He had Jay and Lanny Davis on and they both agreed that the way for Cain to make this go away is to:

      1. Hold a press conference
      2. Be truthful and state clearly the allegations and circumstances that Cain has knowledge of and what’s he’s learned from the NRA regarding this matter.
      3. Apologize to the woman/women for anything that he may have said that may have been miscontrued and made them uncomfortable.
      4. Emphatically state that he, in his opinion, has never knowingly sexually harassed anyone and would never, ever intentially partake in such a heinous act.
      5. Take questions for a specific time period and stay on message.
      6. Make it perfectly clear that this is the end of this subject, then get on with campaigning.

      Jay and Lanny both said that Cain is playing defense when he should go on the offense and end the whole discussion on his terms. Not let information drip, drip, drip out and react to it piecemeal. They said that this whole process had been particulary hard on his supporters, and that he should take the upper hand for their sake as well as his campaign’s.

      They also stressed that he should be clear in his statements, no waffling around, etc. Stay on message.

      Of course Hannity wanted to try to make this about the press and their double standard with Obama, but Jay and Lanny wouldn’t let him go there. It was pretty good and I agreed with their advice.

      I really, really wish he would do this. ‘Cause I’m sick and tired of arguing about this. It does none of us any good.

  • ohmanny

    Its seems that you formed an opinion about Mr Cain based on Media Reports of so called amnonomys allegations. But all the people who know him personally throughtout his 40+ years in Business vouch for his integrity and professionalism. Who should I beleive?

    I believe it would be best if you throw out all your preconceived notions of who Herman Cain is. Than go meet him and talk to him if you can. Listen to his speeches. Listen to the people who know him “Personally” and than reform your opinion.

    • Vaughn Harold

      n.t

      • bzip

        Don’t talk to me about Perry Blindness.

        You Cain supporters have the Messiah Complex. You just can’;t face, accept and acknowledge that your guy has lied and lied and lied. He has played the race card, the victim card and is doing his best to bring down another campaign without any evidence.

        The Messiah Complex of Cain

        • Vaughn Harold

          acknowledged Cain’s faults.

          Obviously, you’ve drank the same kool-aid that streiff has.

        • rightwingmom52

          for a change, and have yet to answer it.

          If Cain is the GOP nominee, will you vote for him? I believe you said in another comment that you would never vote for Cain. Is that correct? If that’s the case, will you be sitting at home, voting third party or voting for Obama?

    • gekster

      Mr. Cains actions and ever changing story on the matter.
      No, that can’t be it.
      Cain changing his story several times since this broke has nothing to do with it.

  • http://www.itsaboutliberty.com IronDioPriest

    “There is no way under the sun this man gets my vote for any office at any time.”

    I thought the in-stone RedState policy was “conservative in the primary, Republican in the general”.

    I’ve heard this ad nauseam from front-pagers, diarists, and commenters alike, any time anyone dare proclaim that a vote for this or that particular candidate breaks the covenant of personal accountability.

    Now we have a RedState front-pager unequivocally proclaiming that he intends to break the RedState policy?

    Tell me: Who here gets to decide which candidates are unworthy of their vote, and who needs to fall in line with RedState policy?

    • tngal

      Upthread. And showed where Cain is the bigger man, because he will vote Perry if push comes to shove.

      But Streiff is either:

      A) going “lalalalalalal I can’t hear you.” with his fingers in his ears.

      or

      B) He’s trying to pull in lots of eyes to the site today, getting both cainiacs and perry supporters, as well as the lurkers, and a few trolls. Never hurts to pump up the site hits.

      or

      C) He’s miffed at Leon.

      I hope its B.

  • mach5

    If his premise is right. Perhaps we need some keen legal minds here. I would think, if HC was accused of SH at the NRA, then any settlement would have to include his signature, correct? If the answer is no, then of course he would not want the settlement to become public, b/c he has no knowledge of the actual accusations.

    If he did sign it, then there is no excuse for him to not know what is in it, b/c it would demonstrate his own ignorance.

    Either way, it reveals a perhaps fatal flaw in his candidacy. He is either ignorant, irresponsible, or both. If he does not know the accusations against him, it is still in his best interest to let it out into the sunlight, where it can wither and die. If he does know the details, and it’s bad, he’s cooked.

    Herman Cain has handled this poorly. No one is w/out warts, it helps to have 1. Honesty/Integrity, and 2. Competent, Trustworthy people around you. Having 2 helps with 1. Cain may have #1, but it does not appear to me he has #2 right now. And perhaps that is what his opponents meant to show w/this “scandal”, more than anything else.

  • mach5

    If his premise is right. Perhaps we need some keen legal minds here. I would think, if HC was accused of SH at the NRA, then any settlement would have to include his signature, correct? If the answer is no, then of course he would not want the settlement to become public, b/c he has no knowledge of the actual accusations.

    If he did sign it, then there is no excuse for him to not know what is in it, b/c it would demonstrate his own ignorance.

    Either way, it reveals a perhaps fatal flaw in his candidacy. He is either ignorant, irresponsible, or both. If he does not know the accusations against him, it is still in his best interest to let it out into the sunlight, where it can wither and die. If he does know the details, and it’s bad, he’s cooked.

    Herman Cain has handled this poorly. No one is w/out warts, it helps to have 1. Honesty/Integrity, and 2. Competent, Trustworthy people around you. Having 2 helps with 1. Cain may have #1, but it does not appear to me he has #2 right now. And perhaps that is what his opponents meant to show w/this “scandal”, more than anything else.

  • uncmike

    This commentary by Streiff is absolutely right. Those who like Cain seem unwilling to face reality and have, indeed, indulged in Lanny Davis-like tactics to dismiss issues that are clearly serious. What’s worse is Cain’s own behavior in this matter. Instead of offering up the real facts, he has obfuscated, prevaricated and tried to deflect blame to others for things he alone brought about. Too bad, because at one time I liked Cain. He’s not my man, but I thought he was probably a decent guy. Now, like so many others, I wonder.

    • billymorris68

      “In 2008, I could not bring myself to support McCain so I stayed home.”

      • tyman

        landslide in 2010 wouldn’t have happened.

        I don’t absolutely advocate sitting out an election, but McCain truly failed to rally conservatives. However, the sleeping giant was awakened last year.

        I, too, am disappointed in Limbaugh, Hannity, etc. How do they absolutely know that this is a nothing story?

        To completely shut off the other Republican candidates this week to focus on this has been disappointing, to say the least.
        Are they only doing this because they want to support someone that they FEEL has been wronged? Would they be doing this about a bottom tier candidate? Just because Cain is polling well now doesn’t mean a whole lot to me.

        Frankly, I’ve felt that Cain’s campaign would start to fall off anyway as people realize that he does not have the experience to be POTUS (remember how excited people were about Ross Perot, until they realized that he was all talk?). I say that as someone who has said over and over that I was excited when Cain first announced, but I realized that he was really missing some things.

        Did it really take Rick Perry to get in and have a few bad debate performances for people to take note of Herbcain? I remember the gaffes that Cain committed in the early days of his campaign, because I was a supporter and realized that he just didn’t have it.

  • daveoconnor

    for Perry either. That’s because Perry’s name won’t be on the ticket. Perry fans point to past candidates with low polling numbers early in the process. They note Thompson was doing well before he fell off the cliff. Well Perry did well till as Brit Hume said, “He threw up on himself” Every poll shows Perry firmly in the second tier,
    This latest post notes that Cain was the subject of a sexual harassment complaint by two women who received money from the NRA. So far so good. Then we jump to such things as blaming the women etc. The women signed the NDA. Cain didn’t make them. As a conservative I believe actions have consequences. If the womennow want to come forward they can. They will be violating a contract they signed. Cain has from the start denied sexual harassment. Yesterday the poster gloated over the nebulous PJ story. If I were Cain I wouldn’t ask for the lifting of the NDA either, If people want to draw a conclusion about that so be it. My conclusion is that Cain is being smeared just as Perry is on the NH speech.

    • tnguy

      It has nothing to do with the 2 women and whether they want to come forward, or whether they’ve forfeited anything. It has everything to do with Cain.

      Were it me, I’d be screaming my innocence from the rooftops, and there’s no way I’d have let it be settled in that matter, whether I had political aspirations or not. Of course, since frivolous sexual harrassment claims are so common (even though there have been none against me in my 20 years as a professional, nor any of my colleagues, clients, friends, acquaintances, or anyone else I know), why pay them any mind?

      I mean, who hasn’t paid off women for not harrassing them? There is no way on this planet I would sign any sort of agreement for hush $$$ for something I wasn’t guilty of, and I can’t imagine that anyone of character would either.

      Fact is, politically, all of this needs to come out now anyway. Obama would destroy Cain with it next year. If Streiff is like me, he’ll be voting for Perry in the primary, and if Perry is not in the general, so be it. All the people protecting Cain right now are accomplishing is ensuring Mitt Romney the nomination.

  • angryguy77

    was peanuts. I’m not defending the way he’s handled this, but I don’t think he did anything wrong either. It’s been said here before, if these women had a legit claim, they would have walked away with a hell of a lot more money.

    It’s not comparable to the claims against Billy

  • radicalrighty

    There are at least three, and one is ready to make a statement:

    http://www.newsmax.com/InsideCover/Cain-sexual-harassment/2011/11/03/id/416797?s=al&promo_code=D6D2-1

    I guess Herman will sue Newsmax, too?

  • http://scipio62.livejournal.com/ scipio62

    This is not an endorsement of Herman Cain. It is purely a rebuttal to this post.

    Yes, we know for a fact there were two separate allegations of sexual harassment from two women against Herman Cain. We know for a fact they were settled by the NRA and the settlement was contractually sealed. We know for a fact that Cain wasn’t involved in the settlements or in having them contractually sealed. So how is it Cain’s responsibility to come clean when he doesn’t know exactly what to come clean on? That is what everyone has tried to do. Therefore, it is right to blame the messenger when the messenger refuses, and that is the point here, to provide all of the necessary facts to prove their case.

    Cain denies he sexually harassed anyone. Nothing that has come out from anyone refutes that based on the facts that have thus far been released. On that point, he hasn’t lied, and that is the only point that matters.

    How Cain and his campaign handled the matter is a separate matter. It should enter into our determination on whether he should be President. But, I question anyone that has said the campaign has repeatedly lied over this matter. As the original Politico story said, the campaign didn’t respond to questions about the settlements, and never really denied the settlements existed. But that doesn’t mean they lied.

    Remember that Barack Obama’s only management skill is to run a campaign, which is the only thing he has ever successfully managed (even here, that is questionable). Along with his incompetence as President, Obama’s management of the Executive Branch has been equally as incompetent.

    streiff, I think you’re jumping the shark on this. If you don’t believe Cain would make a good President, fine. But don’t contribute to the feeding frenzy by making this a story about Cain where in fact, it is a story of an irresponsible media not doing their job.

    • gator_hoo

      “We know for a fact that Cain wasn?t involved in the settlements or in having them contractually sealed.”. We do? Where did we get that? Because Cain certainly hasn’t said that. We know that the settlement was with the NRA, right now we don’t even know if it was a joint settlement or not. If the settlement agreement didn’t involve an agreement not to sue Cain in his personal capacity, that would strike me as odd. Even so, he was also was the CEO of the NRA and the person accused of the allegations, so to say that he had no role in the settlement agreement borders on preposterous.

      Wait, wait… “The campaign never really denied the settlements existed?” Because he said he wasn’t aware of them, when it is rather clear that he was? Is that what you are getting at? And that is somehow exculpatory?

      Wait, wait…. You note that Cain may have at most slightly more relevant experience than Obama, who you describe as incompetent, and that translates to well-qualified? Interestingly, you point out that at least Obama ran his campaign well, when everyone concedes that Cain’s campaign has been disastrous. So does that mean he is showing less executive skill than Obama?

      • http://scipio62.livejournal.com/ scipio62

        ?We know for a fact that Cain wasn?t involved in the settlements or in having them contractually sealed.?. We do? Where did we get that?

        It is a fact the settlements and the non-disclosure agreements are between the women and the NRA, not between the women and Cain, and not between Cain and the NRA. The lawyers for the women are going to the NRA to release their clients from the non-disclosure agreements, not Cain.

        Wait, wait? ?The campaign never really denied the settlements existed?? Because he said he wasn?t aware of them, when it is rather clear that he was? Is that what you are getting at? And that is somehow exculpatory?

        Neither Cain or the campaign ever said they weren’t aware of the settlements. Here is what is quoted in the original story:

        In a series of comments over the past 10 days, Cain and his campaign repeatedly declined to respond directly about whether he ever faced allegations of sexual harassment at the restaurant association. They have also declined to address questions about specific reporting confirming that there were financial settlements in two cases in which women leveled complaints…

        Cain spokesman J.D. Gordon told POLITICO the candidate indicated to campaign officials that he was ?vaguely familiar? with the charges and that the restaurant association?s general counsel had resolved the matter.

        Do you see anything here that shows Cain or the campaign denying the existence of the settlements? No.

        Wait, wait?. You note that Cain may have at most slightly more relevant experience than Obama, who you describe as incompetent, and that translates to well-qualified? Interestingly, you point out that at least Obama ran his campaign well, when everyone concedes that Cain?s campaign has been disastrous. So does that mean he is showing less executive skill than Obama?

        No. Managing a campaign is not like managing something concrete like a business or part of a business. My point is that Cain has shown plenty of competent executive experience in running something concrete and not been competent in running a campaign (I won’t dispute that). Conversely, all Obama knows how to do is manage campaigns, and is a complete incompetent in managing anything else.

        • http://scipio62.livejournal.com/ scipio62

          Neither Cain or the campaign ever said they weren?t aware of the settlements. Here is what is quoted in the original story:

          In a series of comments over the past 10 days, Cain and his campaign repeatedly declined to respond directly about whether he ever faced allegations of sexual harassment at the restaurant association. They have also declined to address questions about specific reporting confirming that there were financial settlements in two cases in which women leveled complaints?

          Cain spokesman J.D. Gordon told POLITICO the candidate indicated to campaign officials that he was ?vaguely familiar? with the charges and that the restaurant association?s general counsel had resolved the matter.

          Do you see anything here that shows Cain or the campaign denying the existence of the settlements? No.

          Wait, wait?. You note that Cain may have at most slightly more relevant experience than Obama, who you describe as incompetent, and that translates to well-qualified? Interestingly, you point out that at least Obama ran his campaign well, when everyone concedes that Cain?s campaign has been disastrous. So does that mean he is showing less executive skill than Obama?

          No. Managing a campaign is not like managing something concrete like a business or part of a business. My point is that Cain has shown plenty of competent executive experience in running something concrete and not been competent in running a campaign (I won?t dispute that). Conversely, all Obama knows how to do is manage campaigns, and is a complete incompetent in managing anything else.

        • gator_hoo
          • gator_hoo

            You said, we know for a fact that he was not involved. Your statement then supports a conclusion that he was not legally a party. There is a huge gap between knowing the agreement was between the women and the NRA and that Cain was not involved, which is the statement I protest that we do not know as fact.

          • http://scipio62.livejournal.com/ scipio62

            I haven’t changed my statement. I said it’s a fact Cain wasn’t involved with either the settlements or the non-disclosure agreements. Nothing I’ve said after contradicts that. That means he couldn’t have legally been a party to any of it.

            I don’t have a dispute with how people see Cain and his campaign handling this; it hasn’t been good, and your link to what he said on Fox hurts him. I believe Cain’s handling of the situation should factor in people’s minds about whether or not to support Cain. But the fact remain it is up to the accusers to present evidence of wrong-doing, not the other way around. That is the problem I have with the post from streiff.

          • gekster

            Cain knew of settlement

            excerpt:
            Herman Cain, who spent Monday denying that he sexually harassed two women while he headed the National Restaurant Association, late in the day offered details of an incident with a female colleague that led to allegations of inappropropriate behavior. Also, for the first time, the 2012 presidential candidate acknowledged that he knew about a settlement that was offered to one of the women.

            So now I am confused.
            Did he know, or didn’t he know

          • gekster

            …….

  • gator_hoo

    Cain may be innocent of sexual harassment, and therefore is the best qualified candidate to be president.

    • bzip

      It isn’t about the sexual harassment charges. It is about Cain, his lies his changing of the story, the blame game, the race card, trying to pull down another campaign without evidence – that is what it is about. That makes him unqualified, unfit to ever be considered POTUS – in my opinion.

      • gator_hoo

        Bzip, Take a moment to spot sarcasm. I like your energy, but you have gotten too knee-jerk recently. Go catch a movie. I promise that the website will be here when you get back.

        • rightwingmom52

          Three different posters in the last few minutes have said they will not or will never vote for Cain.

          How does that not violate the rules of this site? Same thing goes for any Cain supporters who won’t vote for the GOP nominee or any Ron Paul fans who go third party or whoever.

        • bzip

          Do me a favor – make sure it isn’t over run my the messiah complex. We must unite against the unprincipled bunch for the sake of our country :-) .

          • gator_hoo

            Really though, go watch a movie or Fox News or something. It’s not good to replace quality with quantity.

            I promise, there are enough Perry supporters here that the site won’t be renamed CainState in your absence.

  • gator_hoo

    Mark Davis, here in Dallas, who is generally good has been shilling hard for Cain.

    • gator_hoo

      Darn IPad

  • BA Cyclone

    The fact that we don?t know anything about the substance of the complaints is the responsibility of one man: Herman Cain. Through a period of four days Cain has engaged in evasions and outright lies over the events. But no one on the right seems to care very much about that as honesty is now a bug rather than a feature in our candidates

    This has zero basis in actual fact.

    I could lay it out for you, but you would probably ignore it, deny it, or impugn my intelligence.

    Suffice it to say, the law being what it is, you are falling into the trap of naivete that many other conservatives have fallen into. Saying “he should just come clean and lay it all out for us!” is based upon a complete lack of understanding of how the law works in cases like this. Cain is legally bound to respect an agreement which technically he was not party to.

    Cain is also guilty of misunderstanding — or understanding too well — what “settlement” really means in legal terms compared to layman’s terms.

    If we cast presidential candidates off the island solely on this basis, we would only have Mitt Romney left.

    • gator_hoo

      Even if the agreement is with the NRA, the agreement could be modified. It won’t be modified as long as Cain withholds his consent. If Cain gives his consent for release, the NRA is not bound to release, but they should be made to give a valid reason for not doing so.

      So, your point rests on a technicality and doesn’t address the issue that one of the main roadblocks, if not THE main roadblock, is Cain’s refusal to consent to the release.

    • retire05

      I do not believe for one minute that Cain never signed the confidentiality agreement. It would have to be between both parties involved, to protect both parties, in the future. Cain not signing it would do two things: it would allow Cain to speak of the settlement (as he has) without legal repercussions, and it would show a total ineptness on the part of the NRA lawyers who handled the settlement.

      Cain tried to lead from behind on this issue, and we know that excuse only works for the current resident in the White House, not for Republicans.

      Not withstanding the horrible way that Mark Block has handled this whole bru-haha, and probably should be fired, and replaced, Cain has jumped the shark with a couple of his statements. For one, he disparaged the reputation of one of the women involved by saying on Greta’s show Monday evening that the woman was a bad employee. That, buddy, is slander which is a legal issue.
      By saying the woman was a bad employee, he jepordizes her chance of getting another job, and has finacial ramifications for her. Slander cases are based on financial harm, and is the reason Valerie Plame had her case thrown out of court; she could not prove financial harm since she had made tons of money accusing the Bush administration of outing her.

      Cain has also slandered Curt Anderson. And yesterday, I was listening to the one hour interview between Hannity and Cain. Cain, once again, blamed Curt Anderson as the leak, with the new caveat that he told Anderson of the allegations against him, in private. Imagine my shock to come home and see on RS where Block had been on TV approx. the same time, offering a mea culpa to Curt Anderson. It is clear that Team Cain is not on the same page with each other.

      Do I know that Cain is guilty of the charges? No. Do you know he is innocent of the charges? No. One of the women involved wants to be able to make a statement through her attorney. There is NOTHING unusal about that for someone who wants to remain in the background. Do you think it would not be embarassing for her to have everyone she works with, and everyone she is friends with, to know she is the woman who accused Herman Cain of sexual harassment? It would be. Would you want your daughter, or wife, or sister, to go through what would come after she went public against such a high profile candidate? I don’t think so.

      But Cain also said on the Hannity radio show that if anyone has any proof of wrong doing on his part, let them provide documentation. But why is no one, none of the supporters of Cain, demanding that he provide the very documentation that would support not only his claim of innocense, but his claims of Curt Anderson being responsible for the leak to Politico, and his accusations that the women he discussed on Greta’s show was a bad employee. Block has said on Fox that Cain will NOT request the NRA documents be released.

      There is a simple resolution to all of this: Cain, through his attorney, who I understand is now Bopal Coale, the husband of Greta Van Sustern, and an infamous tort lawyer who sued his own tailor, could request the NRA documents be released, and make an agreement with the women involved attorneys to redact their names, protecting their identity. Block has been firm that Cain will not do that. Why? We know who one party is to the allegations; Cain. If the women’s names and identities are protected with redacted documents, no harm, no foul, and Cain is proven to be truthful that the accusations were found “baseless.”

      There have been claims on the part of Cain supporters that companies generally settle these cases out of court. Yet, not one person has named a company who has that policy. Opinions are not facts.

      Now Team Cain is threatening to sue Politico. For what? The claims made by Politico have been proven; Cain WAS accused by two women of sexual harassment and the NRA did pay them off. Does Cain not realize in a civil suit that suing Politico would be, the women would be required to testifiy and the NRA would be required, under disclosure rules, to release the documents they have on the “internal” investigation that was done, or so Cain claims? Filing a civil suit against Politico would serve only one purpose; keeping this on the front page for months, perhaps even going into the general election.

      Team Cain needs to regroup, get their stories coordinated between Cain and Block, and handle this a lot better than they have so far. The longer this goes on, the worse it will be for Cain as eventually, even his most ardent supporters will begin to think where there is smoke, there is fire.

      Now, I have begun to think that there is more here than meets the eye with the Cain tactics. The story broke Sunday night, Monday morning, on Fox, Cain was pretty much dening everything. But on Monday, it was announced that Hannity was going to intervew Rick Perry on Tuesday, and that the interview would air on Wednesday. On Wednesday, prior to the Hannity show, Mark Block was on Bret Breir’s show, blaming Perry for the leak and demanding an apology from Perry. Block’s performance was dismal, to say the least, as he read his answers to Brier from pre-scripted notes. You don’t read responses to questions in an interview. But what Block achieved was to take the attention away from the Hannity/Perry interview and put the attention back on Cain. Mission accomplished.

      Cain can end this today and prove he is being truthful; just request the NRA release all the documentation on the accusations with the women’s names redacted. One and done.

  • tricianc

    I believe the story should come out. If there’s nothing to it, wonderful! But if there is, we the voters have a right to know. Cain, or any candidate for that matter, is asking us to give him the highest office in the land. I do not want to sit through these primaries waiting for that shoe to drop, wondering, wondering if it will. Face it, the women’s names are already known. All we have to have is one leak to come out from somewhere.

    Additionally, if the rest comes out later and it’s bad or contrary to what Cain said, we’ve already gone through some primaries, then Mr. Cain also would be preventing another candidate from winning the nomination or splitting the vote to give Romney the win. He is putting himself above the good of the party and the country.

    It could also be done in a way where we can protect the women and Mr. Cain too. Don’t put the women in the public eye. Just put out all the notes, papers and information from when it occurred. That also stops anyone from lying, embellishing or adding additional information that wasn’t originally reported.

    What if Cain does win the GOP nomination? I worry if it doesn?t come out now and Cain wins, this will come back in the General. I?d rather have it now in the friendly fire path of supporters of Republicans than in the bombing of the General with Obama, Independents and Democrats.

    One of the women whose apartment the interviewer went to, was full of Obama love. Said Obama pictures and memorabilia everywhere and confirmed she was a Democrat. She could decide to come out any time and why wouldn’t she consider it when Obama is obviously her guy?.

    As far as Cain keeping the story alive:

    One hour after Cain camp said would stop blaming Perry, Cain himself blamed Perry AGAIN on both an Atlanta radio show and the Sean Hannity show.

    Now the Cain campaign is out there saying they might sue Politico. For what? Cain himself confirmed the story as true. I don’t believe they plan on suing. I think it’s just a diversion and they put it out there as a threat to get media to stop reporting on it and to make the public think there’s no there there.
    If the Cain camp was serious, then Politico and others would defend themselves getting permission to reveal the sources and further details.

    Is that the kind of President we want? One that puts threats out to shut people up and one that says he wants to face his accusers and then puts out they don’t want the women to talk. A President that doesn’t want people to speak out on allegations? We have that in the White House now.

  • libdestroyer

    look it up.

    • gator_hoo

      We can’t know for certain how innocent or guilty Cain is until his accusers come forward.

      His accusers can’t come forward until Cain releases them from the NDA (simplified version)

      Cain, one of the few people to know all of the facts, refuses to release the accusers from the NDA.

      And you don’t see any problem with this at all?

  • TSquared

    Cain and even ordinarily sensible guys like Rush Limbaugh are claiming that Cain is the victim of racism over this, do we really think any WHITE Republican would have received this level of support in a similar circumstance?

    Here here… I too have been disappointed by Rush, Sean, Mark etc. They do remind me Lanny Davis and James Carville etc. in the willingness to give Cain and pass and attack his accusers. I think it’s premature to come down either way. Too many facts are unknown.

    What’s is known, however, does not bode well for Mr. Cain. He and his team has handled this abysmally. His inconsistencies (putting it nicely) from his initial statements to later statements (ie. knowledge of settlements etc.) and his all too common need to “clarify” previous statements are troubling. Has this guy been able to state any position on anything without having to walk it back (“clarify” or complain about being taken out of context)) later in the day? Cain’s all too frequent claims about being taken out of context are B.S. I’ve heard his statements in context, and for him to suggest that I didn’t here it right is insulting – whether is was about Gitmo prisoner swaps, waffling stances on abortion, Right of Return, Electric Fences, etc. I think Cain has given plenty of fodder for any reasonable person to question whether Cain is ready for prime time.

    I found Rush’s insinuated attacks yesterday on those of use who are questioning Mr. Cain’s fitness – in light of his handling of this story, his many past statement/gaffe’s, and his apparent lack of depth on many issues (ie. foreign policy) – to be a low mark in Rush’s career.

    • gator_hoo

      I understand the initial reaction by Rush, et al., because we have seen so many false or overblown smears. But not every smear is false or overblown, I.e. Mark Foley.

      The problem is that Cain began with outright denials of everything, including the settlements, and they began their defense on that basis. Now he has had to retract and walk back his denials, but the pundits still have to defend him on the basis of outright falsity, because they will look inept for running with the defense prematurely, as the campaign appears inept.

      Who knows what will happen in the future, but if it comes out that these allegations are even partially true (using the new standard of partially true involving the underlying story, interestingly the original story regarding settlements is fully confirmed), then we are going to see a lot of credibility lost among the pundit set.

    • radicalrighty

      Rush even went into an imaginary “what if” on the story of the 20-something woman who said, “he took advantage of me.”

      It was sickening and I told him so in an e-mail.

      Wondering if he keeps that up today.

      • tyman

        I e-mailed Rush, too. And I did NOT like how he treated Saidy. She’s more representative of conservatives than Rush knows.

        Gator, I’ve thought the same thing that Rush, Levin, et. al are going to get it from the media if there is something, all the while they’ve wasted a WHOLE WEEK on this without airing anything good about any of the conservatives in the race.

        Herb voted for Clinton in ’92 for crying out loud. What real conservative did that even then? Even I knew that Clinton was a Marxist and a womanizer well before election day. Theses guys are basing their support that Herbcain is a real conservative.

        Tsquared, right on with your whole post! Truly a low mark in Rush’s career. I wish I had his super secret secret e-mail address.

        Oh boy, Rush is comparing how Cain’s handled this with Obama’s handling of the economy. Doesn’t even compare. If Cain can’t handle this, he can’t handle a crisis in The White House.

        • tyman

          I bring this up because I heard someone say (can’t remember what channel) that a President was never more conservative than his wife. Well, I just read that Mrs. Cain has voted 5 TIMES IN DEMOCRATIC PRIMARIES AND RUNOFFS SINCE 2004. She did, however, vote for him when he ran for Senate.

          Sorry, I just don’t buy into all this that Cain is so conservative.

          I always thought that W was pulled to the left by Laura, too.

  • Tbone

    victim in the White House. Why do you people want to replace him with another just like him?

    • tnguy

      Exactly. I couldn’t have said it better.

      • radicalrighty

        .

  • tnguy

    Too long have we held our nose and voted for GHWB, Bob Dole, John McCain, and regrettably, GWB.

    At some point, conservatives have to draw a line in the sand, and stop soiling the republican and conservative image by voting for democrate-lite.

    That could be the one big positive of Obama getting a second term.

    • tailfins1959

      This isn’t ideological any more. Too many of us have taken a beating from the Obama recession. I was gobsmacked how people in Tennessee tolerate their own poverty. ALL of the GOP candidates understand the Federal government spends too much money. I will take any of them over Obama, that includes Cain, Paul and even Huntsman.

      • tnguy

        The only reason a marxist could get elected in the first place is because we have repeatedly allowed our own party to blur the distinctions between them and us.

        Much like Cain has done with his quizzical abortion views and his sales tax. And his racebaiting.

    • clintonformccain

      …were objectively qualified to be President of the United States. They all had long careers of service including the highest levels of public office (governors, Senators, Vice Presidents, etc.)

  • Russ Martin

    For me, this issupe is just another in a long line if things that have turned me off about Cain. I am willing to believe that the two NRA settlements were no big deal (if nothing else, because of the relatively small dollar amounts). I am not prepared to believe that Cain is a serial sexual abuser – there simply isn’t enough substantiated evidence against him.

    I had already decided against supporting Cain before this thing broke, because Cain has already proven himself to be a walking gaff machine. He’s our version of Joe Biden, for goodness sake.

    And unlike the Cain supporters, I’m not willing to spin this continuous string of communication mistakes off as some sort of “positive” by throwing out the “he’s outside the political mainstream” excuse. It is becoming tiresome.

    I do, in fact, like the idea of electing a candidate that isn’t a career politician, but the guy’s (or gal’s) knowledgeable on the issues will become all the more important and he will need to be a GREAT communicator – not one who can’t put a complete sentence together without making pathetic errors.

    For the Cain supporters out there, I have a question: Are you ready to have this guy speak on the national, or international stage, and embarrass himself, and our country, by trying to bluff his way through a press conference?

    Cain isn’t ready. He wasn’t ready before this story broke, and his actions and statements since this story broke have simply highlighted this.

  • Marcus_Traianus

    that does not make the charges legitimate or factual. Mr. Cain obviously had knowledge of the allegations. But is still not completely clear how much and what his role was. Slightly in his defense, it does not sound like he was party to the agreement or knows all the details.

    So let’s review;

    - Did he create this mess? Really, how do we know that? I would think that only a judgement we can pass once all the facts are known. And they are not. Does he know all the facts? I dunno, but he has done a very poor job of methodically and consistently explaining the limits of his knowledge and why there are “limits”.

    - Anonymous sources says they know something about allegations of sexual harassment made against Cain. Really? Are they factual?

    - Who was Politico’s source? Democrat or Republican? I certainly want to know. Why now? Was it a public service to save us from the wrath of Herman Cain? Goodness of heart?

    - Those allegations are not certified as factual. Why? Because they have faced no scrutiny to determine if there is basis in fact. Nobody has been deposed or questioned under oath to the best of our knowledge.

    - At least one party to the agreement and her unethical, publicity seeking lawyer who revealed various clauses, which indicate even the existence of the agreement was not to be discussed wants to make a statement. That would be a one-sided statement to continue this public tom-foolery, charade.

    So why not release everyone from the agreement, make the agreement public (so Cain can actually read it), make any witnesses public, make all the facts public and let everyone judge for themselves? I’ll tell you why not, because this charade is mainly for political reasons. They don’t want anyone to make their own judgment on facts they can read and are happy to keep this going. Forever.

    I will be the first to condemn Cain and ask him to get out of the race if there is any merit to these charges. The problem is all information is coming mostly from people with a dog in the fight. I don’t trust any of them. That includes Cain.

  • Christine (Trelaina)

    At some point in his tenure as president of the NRA, Herman Cain was the subject of two complaints of sexual harassment that resulted in settlements in the $35-45K range being paid to the complainants and the parties are bound by an non-disclosure agreement.

    I’ll add:
    * Cain knew this attack was coming. Regardless of his innocence or guilt, regardless if he knew the accusations or settlements happened, he knew this was coming. He had at least 7-10 days. That is more than enough to find out anything he didn’t know, pull together a crisis team and develop a game plan.

    * His team either didn’t do the above, or didn’t do it well.

    * He and his team have looked like MORONS in their reactions to this.

    At this moment, my biggest concern isn’t the truth of the matter, it’s his handling of it. They are IDIOTS if they weren’t ready for a personal attack. It is a part of running for office. If they can’t find real stories, they make them up, or attack intelligence. Didn’t any of the organizations Cain led over the years ever have to deal with a crisis of bad press?

    They should have been prepared.

    I am not sure I want to put my money, or my vote, in the hands of a man who can’t even put together a decent response to a news story…who can’t even put together a consistent but poor response. “No comment” even, guys…what is up???

    I am waiting this out, but so far, I’m not happy with what I see. They need to get their [act] together fast, or it won’t end well, no matter what the truth turns out to be.

    • satchman3

      We really don’t know much about the 10 day notice. Maybe politico goes to Herman and asks for a comment about sexual harassment and he ignores the request.

      Maybe he thinks no reputable news organization will go to press with a story sourced only from an unnamed third party with no comment from the accused or the accuser or any specific details. What does he gain with a blanket denial when the facts aren’t really known?

      Maybe he thinks no one would take such a story for more than a hack attack.

      I don’t see how he could have been better prepared to rebut unnamed charges from an unnamed source.

      I’m not a Cain supporter but this witch hunt bothers me. I don’t think it’s fair or reasonable. If somebody comes out with specific allegations of bad behavior that changes.

      • Christine (Trelaina)

        We really don?t know much about the 10 day notice. Maybe politico goes to Herman and asks for a comment about sexual harassment and he ignores the request.

        Okay, I’ll give you that. IF it turns out that what has been reported as 10 days notice that this report was coming is not true, then some of my comments fall flat. That said, it’s now been…how many days since it came out? That crisis team should have been started, day 1.

        I don?t see how he could have been better prepared to rebut unnamed charges from an unnamed source.

        You’re missing my point. I’m not saying he should have had a response to the charges ready. I’m saying he should have had a consistent message ready for the media and a team researching the truth. Even if the crisis team decided “Mr Cain knows nothing of this, so our message will be NO COMMENT UNTIL WE GET THE FACTS” – it would have helped his cause. He’s in more trouble with people like me because of his sophomoric handling of the attack than for the attack itself.

        Ever worked for a company that suddenly got a lot of press? What’s the first thing they tell you? *Don’t talk to the media, refer them to our PR department”. Sometimes, they give you a sheet of talking points. Why do they do that? So there is a consistent message from everyone representing the company.

  • dfaith

    Too many in the GOP have gotten caught up in the “who leaked the story” and “blame Politico” side-shows rather than focus on the important questions, which are “Are the allegations true?” and “Did Cain demonstrate Presidential mettle in how he responded to the situation?”

    I don’t know the answer to the first question yet, but the answer to the second is a definite no.

    • clowngirl

      I agree on every point.

      dfaith, you are very succinct in pointing out that the relevant question here is “Did Cain demonstrate Presidential mettle in how he responded to the situation?”

      That IS the point. We’re trying to determine if Herman Cain is ready to be President. Prior to this he hasn’t had any really tough questions. He has the advantage of no record to scrutinize, nobody to say he’s imperfectly conservative. He sounds conservative, speaks well, and promotes a few ideas (some maybe good, some outright goofy) without ever going into detail.

      This is the first time we’ve seen him deal with something difficult — and his reaction is telling. Losing his composure right off the bat, lying, changing his story, attacking Rick Perry? Rahm Emanuel?? Politico?? Threatening to sue them for a story that’s true??? Playing the race card???? Calling “witch hunt” because he’s getting vetted???

      How anyone can watch all of this and still think this man should be President is beyond me.

      What makes it so much worse is that — as Streiff pointed out– he’s had at least 10 years to prepare for this! and after the 10 years — 10 days notice before they printed the story. This never should have been a crisis. How would he respond in an actual crisis?

      The other thing that bothers me — Cain knew about both these allegations — and yet he was willing to run for Republican Nomination for President of the United States, in an election cycle when Republicans desperately need to win and was willing to try and win the primary and go into the general election with this time bomb that could very easily be leaked at the most damaging moment and cost the Republicans the White House.

      • http://www.gmsplace.com/ civil truth

        Especially as it confirms a pattern of response to challenge and criticism which can be summed up as “L’eta c’est moi”. Not what we want in a President – or haven’t we learned anything from 2008.

  • proud2btexasmom

    about the original accusations.

    It’s not about who leaked the information.

    What they meant for evil has been good for the GOP.

    IF they are smart and think with their head and not with their disgust with the media, Washington and polititcians.

    It’s has revealed a real flaw with Mr Cain…. his inability to handle a crisis.

    As President the consequences of fumbling a national or international incident could be disater for the US or the world.

    On a personal level I like Mr Cain… but he is not ready to be President.

    I hope and pray the voters step back from the emotion of coming to his defense and realize the stakes are way too high to let loyalty to a particular candidate determine who our nominee will be.

  • johnt

    In any case, wake me up when you get to the part where Cain mangled the face of his rape victim.
    You say “the truth of the allegations”, really! What, that the allegations exist, or you know the details? Absent the details what is there to know about the allegations, how henious the action or how vague? Not to worry, judge anyway.
    You boldly state,”we know sexual harrasement exists”, nothing like going out on a limb Strieff. But the vacuity of the the statement cannot by it’s generality add credence to the particular case. Again, don’t let that stop you.
    Particularly repulsive is your whiney reference to other men’s wives and daughters, a vulgar play on naked emotion, establishes nothing other than your reliance on soap box hysteria.
    You say is total lack of honesty is a clue to the truth of the allegations, but you know that is a non sequiter, not least because we have no details on the allegations, other then the settlement which we already are aware of. And why in your certainty do you even need clues?
    “This is not a case of the liberal media”. At this point may I ask, are you nuts? The same media that buried the Juanita Broderick/Clinton rape story? That media? The media that is suppressing, minimizing Fast and Furious, the media that gave us, that created, Obama? What is interesting is the influence on febrile minds this media has.
    Let it all, ALL, come out, then I’ll judge. And given the stakes, depending on what we know then, and the nature of the threat posed by Obama,Democrats, and a vile media, who knows, if Cain I may still vote for him.

  • tpnoga1

    is the Perry campaign paying Redstate? This site is quickly becoming a shill for Perry. Your disappointed????? So am I.

    P.S. – I am not decided on who I support, but the more I read this site, the less likely I am to vote for Perry.

    • tpnoga1

      I am not accusing Redstate of getting paid, meant as figure of speech.

    • tailfins1959

      From what I see they are convinced that it’s Romney versus Perry. RS and Freepers have deemed support for Romney a non-starter. I think it’s just Perry by a process of elimination.

    • gator_hoo

      I’m not sure you should be voting to begin with.

      • acat

        I don’t see why basing them on internet comments is significantly worse.

        Mew

        (Cat once proposed requiring the IRS to issue one-time Voter ID cards to everyone filing a 1040, and requiring surrender of those cards to vote in a Federal election … )

      • tpnoga1

        voting based on comments. It just drove me nuts back in 2008 when Townhall (i.e. Hugh Hewitt) was in the tank for Romney. I mean Perry announced at a RedState function. Just too cozy for my liking. How can I trust the writers when they have an agenda.

  • Xasteius

    resting my case.

    • runner12

      We must ask ourselves this question in order to ensure that our viewpoint on this issue is based on some notion of objectivity. In our defense, the MSM has a long, sordid history of fabricating baseless hit pieces on Conservatives. In the past few months, we have seen hit pieces on Sen. Rubio and Gov. Perry that were full of lies and false allegations. We know it happens, and it happens often.

      Given this history, it is only natural and wise to be suspect of these allegations surrounding Cain. I know that I certainly am and I hope that most Conservatives are as well.

      HOWEVER, there is a fine line between reserving judgment until the facts come out and a). Claiming with certainty Cain is innocent and/or b). Slandering these women.

      The former assertion is something that cannot be known at this time. Just as one cannot claim they “know” Cain is guilty, one cannot claim absolute knowledge
      of innocence either. The latter I find equally as disturbing, especially as a woman. We do not know for certain these women were “out to get money” nor do we know if they were telling the truth. Until they tell their story, no one knows the truth with certainty.

      Unfortunately, many have crossed the line both ways in claiming absolute innocence and absolute guilt. But I must say that too many prominent conservatives have put their eggs too much in the absolute innocent camp for my comfort. Not only that, but they have glossed over Cain’s vicious attack against Perry. If they are truly for the Conservative cause, they should have called him out on that action. They should have remained balanced on this issue and let the facts come out. Or just stick to some of the inconsistencies in some of the reports. But I fear some are staking their reputations on this man’s innocence. It is not very wise.

  • smagar

    “Catch-22″ is so dated…we need something fresh.

    Mrs. Smagar Honey, why didn’t you take out the trash?

    Smagar Because Politico

    Mrs. Smagar ??????????? (Exhibits puzzled look on her face, as she looks for frying pan to inject into the exchange)

  • jmcmd

    If he can put together a rational, factual explanation for what happened and show that Politico and the MSM are inflating this beyond what the facts warrant then I will give him the benefit of the doubt (IMO very unlikely). Otherwise he needs to get out of this race. While the length of time this has stretched out hasn’t been good for the GOP, it is much better that it happened now. If/when he does get out, we can get down to the business of picking the anti-Romney. If Perry can pick up the lion’s share of his supporters It becomes a two man race. However, If Newt gets a bump he could stick around as well.

    • radicalrighty

      I’m thinking the facts are coming out, and soon.

      http://www.newsmax.com/InsideCover/Cain-sexual-harassment/2011/11/03/id/416797?s=al&promo_code=D6D2-1

      • jmcmd

        Personally I think Cain is toast, mostly for the way that he has handled this. But that leaves a second part which needs to be addressed which is the media’s handling of this. Republicans need to call them out on the double standard. If this is the way a nominee gets treated, the general election is going to be a nuclear war. If we simply turn our ire on Cain and don’t make the media pay a price, we are only inviting more of the same.

  • ohmanny

    Maybe true afterall. What will Streiff say now????

    http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-57318500-503544/cain-did-not-sign-settlement-accusers-lawyer-says/%20http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504564_162-57318500-504564/cain-did-not-sign-settlement-accusers-lawyer-says/

    • rightwingmom52

      Let me post part of it. The bolded emphasis is mine.

      The settlement agreement between the National Restaurant Association and a woman who accused Herman Cain of sexual harassment was reached in September 1999–and was not signed by Cain himself, according to Joel Bennett, a lawyer for the woman.

      Bennett, who has a copy of the settlement agreement, said four people signed it: the woman, two lawyers representing the association and Bennett himself.

      Bennett said the agreement was resolved relatively quickly, about two or three months after she complained.

      That means it may have been reached after Cain left the association, and Bennett said it’s conceivable that Cain didn’t even know about it.

      Bennett also told CBS News Friday morning he is hoping to issue a public statement reaffirming the accuser’s claim within hours, if the restaurant group agrees to ease the confidentiality agreement that was part of the deal.

      Bennett plans to issue the statement in his name, not in his client’s name. It will not identify her, nor will it detail specific events of sexual harassment or the amount of settlement.

      “It will insist the complaints were in good faith, and she’s going to stand by her complaints,” Bennett told CBS News. “It’s her response to Herman Cain’s statements that the complaints are baseless.”

      Cain told Fox News this week that he left the association in “the middle of 1999.” Under that timeline, Cain would have been gone when the settlement was reached–and may well have been gone when she filed the complaint.

      Cain has insisted he only knew of one complaint, and says he knew of no legal settlements–only what he calls a severance agreement with one woman. This timeline could well bolster his claims.

      When Cain ran to represent Georgia in the Senate four years later, he told his advisers there was one complaint against him at the Restaurant Association, and that it was “baseless.” One former staffer on the Senate campaign told CBS News that he and other advisers in the campaign knew about that complaint and believed it was meritless, but thought it could crop up in possible opposition research.

      Again, the full story is here.

    • tricianc

      This doesn’t mean he doesn’t know what’s in it? Nor does it mean, the allegations aren’t factual.

      He considered running for a Senate office in 1998. Instead he said he would run for President in 2000. Do you really think someone who had this intention wouldn’t find out what was in it? Or know what was in it just for the mere fact he was he and his reputation? Or that someone’s arrogance or curiousity wouldn’t drive them to look especially when you’re in the position to be able to? He was the President. He also didn’t need to sign it to know what was in it. He could do that by either looking at the paperwork or asking the counsel he had take care of.

      I would most certainly want to know what was in them whether I was considering running for an office or not. If And Cain was in the position to see it or ask about it at any point.

      Addtionally he kept the board out of it. Several of the board members stated they didn’t even know of it.

      • 1bunny

        not 7 years but 11 years (if you don’t count knowing about this since 1999) to prepare for this to come out and what kind of response to give. Ran for president in 2000, senate in 2004 and running for president again in 2011. How incompetant can you be if you are not prepared for this.

        Has Cain been living in a bubble not to know how politics can be dirty, hard and downright nasty? I don’t mean from just other candidates but from the media that exists to crucify conservatives/republicans. You have to be prepared, to have a strong stomach to run for office in America. If you are going to run you can’t be naive on how to run a campaign. I have to say as a businessman Cain should know these things.

        He keeps saying he would hire the best advisors but we see he does not have a clue on this. Wouldn’t someone who is serious at least hire a campaign finance expert so there would not be the finacially allegations that have surfaced. I have to wonder about this “sex” story. I can’t help but remember Wag the Dog. Cain is raking in the money but he owes or will need to make restitution for the illegal contributions etc that he has taken in. Wag the Dog created a war to take away from a scandal for a candidate. Maybe a “sex” scandal takes away from a campaign money scandal. Because for sure we are hearing nothing on financial wrong doings it is nothing but sex sex sex!

    • clintonformccain

      Sounds like Cain resigned his positiion at the NRA almost immediately after the two women made their allegations of sexual harrassment and months before the settlement agreements and payouts were finalized.

      I wonder if his resignation was precipitated by these events?

      • tpnoga1

        You’re willing to ruin a man’s career based on guesses and possibilities? I thought that’s what the left does. I am not going to hold the allegations against him. Now how badly he handled the situation, that’s another story. If he doesn’t get his A game on for this situation, I may have to scratch him off my candidate list, right next to Perry.

        • clintonformccain

          So, I take it that you think the charges of sexual harrassment from a second employee and a second legal settlement involving a full-year severance package had no role in Herman Cain’s resignation from the NRA?

          • tpnoga1

            That’s my point. We don’t know any facts, just allegations. I am not willing to trash someone because of some allegation. And IMO the settlements were go away money. I am inclined to believe the allegations were not strong based on the relative small size of the settlement.

    • tyman

      Based on what I’ve heard all week, this was settled after he left, and I read somewhere that he left rather abruptly after the incident.

      However, the way his story has changed (he didn’t remember the incident in the beginning, but he remembered that he remembered to tell Curt Anderson when he was running for Senate) is what the concern is.

      If I had 10 days notice of something, you’d better believe that I would get all my ducks in a row before spouting off on national media about how there was no settlement because the charges were baseless and if there were a settlement I hope it wasn’t for much (that’s what he said).

      If I had been accused of something I hadn’t done, you’d better believe that I would be calling every day to see if there was a settlement and what were the terms. Because if I didn’t do it, I certainly wouldn’t want that rap following me around to make it look like I did it by my silence.

  • cwilson

    Conservative in the primary, Republican in the general. I *loathe* Romney, but I will RUN to the polls to vote for him if he wins the nomination, because four more years of Obama will destroy the country I love.

    Streiff, a front-pager, and several others believe differently:

    “There is no way under the sun [Cain] gets my vote for any office at any time.”

    I voted for Cain in the Florida straw poll that launched his current popularity, but I have been very disappointed by his performance since then: the n—–head rock thing, his total inability to articulate a slam-dunk position on abortion, the general impression that he’s just “winging it” (and badly) when he reaches the edge of his (apparently limited) knowledge. Very disappointed. And now this — his inability to devise a strategy to counter a hit he KNEW was coming — for ten days in specifics, for seven years in general. (Hint: “Tell ALL of the truth, as quickly as you can; preferably before the story breaks”) But nooooo…we get a week (or more) of this, and yesterday his campaign manager says “No we won’t be releasing the women from their confidentiality agreement” WTH? I know that $35k is peanuts, and any midsize to large organization wouldn’t blink at that size payoff even for the most unsubstantiated accusation, but DUDE! Yer acting guilty!

    Forget the behavior of everyone else in this story, and the underhanded nature of the hit right before your big week-o-publicity in D.C. Forget who fed Politico the tip: YOU are responsible for your (current) behavior, and it ain’t pretty!

    So, yeah, disappointed, and taking another look at soft-on-illegals Perry and ignore-the-ex-wives-behind-the-curtain Gingrich. But Cain is not a frakking Marxist intent on “remaking this country” to “spread the wealth around” so if he wins the primary…I will run to the polls to vote for him in the General because I love my country.

    Obama delenda est. That’s my principle. It also happens to be one of the posting rules of this site — conservative in the primary, Republican in the general.

    • gekster

      but that would be a threadjack at this time.
      When a Perry diary or article comes up, I’ll ask you then.
      Don’t reply, I will let you simmer in your misunderstanding until then.

    • notpropagandized

      Your comment about Perry being soft on illegal immigration is just plain wrong and you’re echoing mistakenly or dishonestly. Texas legislature and citizens preferred educated innocent kids of illegals rather than wards of the state foisted on them by Fed wonton inaction on law enforcement.

      Name one person that has spent more money, effort, technology, etc on border enforcement and security than RickPerry. Don’t include FedGovt that just shrugs its shoulders at the border while misappropriating massive taxpayer funds in useless enforcement effort.

      OK. Tell me how you build a fence in the middle of the RioGrandeRiver and all the massive lakes between the Gulf of Mexico at Brownsville all the way to the Texas/NewMexico border. That’s why Perry opposes building a fence on the border b/c it’s all water and river sand bars.

      You can’t build a fence this side of the river without destroying farm, ranch and other huge commerce along the river. Further, doing that would constructively cede USTerritory to Mexico and drug cartels.

      Why the hell RickPerry cannot communicate that is frustrating. No thanks however to shreiking Romney Bachmann Santorum and others when Perry was trying to speak at the debate.

      Then later Perry was roasted for returning the favor on Romneys yard-illegals.

      Good grief. Get the word out, please. Perry is THE strongest on illegal immigration of the whole lot and more. He just has to deal with the centuries old condition of Anglos and Hispanics working a way to live with one another when the river has historically not been a political hot potato. It is now and he’s not to blame.

      • cwilson

        the fact that Gingrich’s daughter said last week that the long-repeated story about Newt serving her mother divorce papers while she was in the hospital with cancer was totally false.

        My point: these statements represent, like it or not, the public perception of those two candidates in the GOP primary electorate. It is up to the candidates to DO something about it, not you. About 27 people will read these comments — millions will watch Perry’s press availability and debate performances. Guess which one is more effective: John Q. Commenter explaining the intricacies of Texas border relations on a blog comment, or Perry calling anyone who disagrees with him “heartless” on national TV?

        Perry’s got a big hole to climb out of, mostly of his own making…and HE needs to start doing it. Ditto Newt.

        See *I* have already heard all the arguments you bring up. Some I find…unpersuasive — but I’m a political obsessive, like the rest of us on this site. The other 50 million registered Republican voters, not so much: “Perry’s pro illegal. Plus there was something about some vaccine, right?. And I’m tired of Texans.” “Newt…wasn’t there some book scandal thing? And he faxed his cancer-striken wife divorce papers in the hospital? And that Global Warming ad on the couch with that ugly shrew whatshername…”

        • notpropagandized

          The real pitfall was Perry atrocious communication performance. I thought I was looking at Hollywood movie portraying profound injustice and misunderstanding by convergence of circumstances and political opponent opportunism.

          Perry was perfectly lined up for a sweep into the nomination and election despite his accent, Texan-persona, etc. Reminds me of that 2-foot putt 30 years ago to win a big private golf tournament – missed it and ultimately quit the game. Hope Perry performs up to his reputation and wins despite the odds.

  • notpropagandized

    So true. So true. With Cain nearly a year. Left for 2 weeks and came back. Now looks like I’m gone for good. This is so strange and implausible. Either Cain is in locstep with Romney or his whole campaign is based on clown-logic.

    Looks like Cain was shill for Romney and got to point of actually beating Romney so had to do a little suicide and then help Romney even more by knotting Perry’s head in the process.

    What is most outrageous is that the millions of people taking this nomination very seriously are getting tooled around. I’m thinking Romney campaign is behind it all. Hearing that he’s spreading money around to buy support. If so, hope the People wise up to this possible scam.

    Full disclosure: My support now shifted from Cain to Perry. Don’t trust Romney one iota.

    • gator_hoo

      Has a post saying about the same. He doesn’t like Cain because he doesn’t think that Cain really ever had a plan to win, and now is throwing the whole primary off kilter.

      • notpropagandized

        Hah! That’s funny. Can we possibly say that great minds think alike. It’s nice to fantasize about that…
        Thanks for tip on posting.

  • wbf

    I have to say this is funny!

    http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1111/67627.html

    • tricianc

      Even if he left before the agreement was signed, obviously he is aware of what the woman was saying. There is no way, the NRA would have just taken the woman’s word without asking Mr. Cain about it.

      My understanding is that there was an investigation and several meetings with the parties involved. It’s highly unlikely they just talked to the woman and not to Cain.

      Addtionally, I do understand how the woman left due to other’s change around her. I was employed at a place where 3 women came out on 2 men at the office. The others treated them like a pariah. All 3 were treated differently after this happened. It even got out to outside vendors and around the company. They were treated terribly.

      When the case originally was reported, the boss and Human Resources talked to all of them on several occasions, including the men. The reason for this is you don’t take the word of one side without finding the other. For example, to fire someone you cannot just take the word.

      One was the Administrative Asst of my boss. He always had her come in to take dictation and get her take on issues all the time. After she made her claim, he always asked me to come in and sit in whenever he needed her. He didn’t believe her until he actually walked into the copy room one day and saw one of them pressing her against the copy machine while the other grabbed her breast. She ended up leaving and so did the other two so I can understand. They didn’t leave just because of the harassment. They left because they were not believed and for the shame and humiliation others put on them.

      The only reason this got around further was because after being fired, both men filed for unemployment. All parties involved had to testify at a hearing at the Unemployment office.

  • redmymind

    You’ve put into your excellent words my every thought, feeling, and gut feeling about this issue . . . and the candidate in question.

    You’re right. We can’t trust someone with infinitely bigger responsibilities if he can’t be trusted to man up to these allegations and come clean, one way or another.

    So far, Cain’s strategy has been to evade, attack, blame, and admit to convenient memory lapses–being selective with what he remembers.

    He’s also got a nasty habit of kicking a man whilst he’s down, i.e., attacking Perry about the “N” rock controversy before getting all the facts in and now trying to cast suspicion on him for letting the cat out of the bag–again, before getting to all the facts. In both cases . . . “WALK BACK” . . . but damage done to the opponent, nevertheless, . . . as calculated.

    I believe in creating an “unfair advantage” just as much as the next guy in the area of campaigning, which to me translates into: delivering the best message; excellent preparation; formidable funding; and getting the best team money can buy–even legitimate oppo research to expose grave inconsistencies in the opponent’s ideas and practices.

    Yet, none of this has anything to do with acts of sleaziness and dishonor, such as making baseless attacks on an opponent who is already hurting, just for the sake of getting ahead. That’s pure mean-spiritedness, regardless of how a candidate smiles or acts all warm and friendly . . . or even touts himself as a fresh and innocent “outsider” to the political scene.

    “Fresh”???

    Yet, no doubt, there will be intellectually numb die-hards out there who will no doubt “nominate” Cain even if he were to show a spark of decency by quiting.

  • congressworksforus

    Have you actually bothered to listen to what Cain has said?

    You state: “Herman Cain?s pattern of lying about these incidents began in 2003, by his own admission, when he told his campaign manager there was one incident while he knew there were at least two settlements.”

    Really? How is this a lie? Cain state on Greta’s show that one was a TERMINATION settlement. The fact(???) that this (anonymous) woman is now alleging sexual harrasment doesn’t mean Cain lied. As far he knew it was a TERMINATION settlement.

    Do I need to spell out TERMINATION again for you?

    Everyone I see throwing around the words “liar”, “dirtbag”, “scumbag” etc. are either (a) shills for another campaign (and, sorry, RedState is FULL of them), of (b) not bothering to actually LISTEN to what Cain is saying and are simply regurgitating what the media is saying.

    And then getting uppoty when Rush, Levin, etc. stand up for Cain. (Gee… maybe those folks actually LISTENED to what he said.)

    Streiff, not sure who you are shilling for, but you’ve had a burr against Cain for some time now. I’ve yet to see you write anything close to as disparaging against any other Candidate as you’ve gone after Cain, even though, frankly, they’ve all done plenty to warrant it.

    As for me, I’ll wait for this to play out. There may be something to all of this, but at this point NONE OF US should be playing the media’s game on this. This is a test folks; they’re seeing how much unsubstantiated mud they can throw at a Republican so that the we turn on each other, force a candidate (whomever it is; Cain today… but who’s next?) to step down, so that the idiot in the WH (or whatever office is up for grabs) gets re-elected by default.

    IF allegations prove truthful, Cain is done. But no amount of pontificating by self-proclaimed pundits like yourself, or party/candidate shills like those commenting on your posts, is going to make him done.

    Only FACTS will.

    I disagree with a lot of Leon’s posts, but on THIS subject, he’s hit the nail on the head.

    • http://teapartisan.wordpress.com Loren Heal

      Cain was not a party to the settlement agreements, and not a party to the investigations. Assuming he knows some damning bit of evidence in them is to assume that he did something wrong in the first place.

      Now, he may have been confronted with these accusations, but as these were termination settlements it’s also possible that he was not confronted with them, or not all of them. He may not have known about one of them at all.

    • gator_hoo

      When it is clear through his statement about Anderson that he did know at least one settlement existed.

      So… He said something, and at the time he said it, he knew it wasn’t true…. Hmmm….if only there were a word that encapsulated such behavior….

      • congressworksforus

        He initially said he didn’t RECALL.

        Geez people, get a grip. You’re playing right into the other side’s hands!

        • gator_hoo

          ?Cain: Outside of the restaurant association, absolutely not. If the restaurant association did a settlement, I am not ? i wasn?t even aware of it and I hope it wasn?t for much, because nothing happened. so if there was a settlement, it was handled by some of the other officers that worked for me at the association. So the answer is absolutely not.?

          But thanks for playing.

    • onemovoter

      termination settlements in the amount of a FULL YEAR’S PAY? And not just one, but 2 women who got that settlement? You only get that kind of settlement if there was something there but no one can prove anything. Most people who are terminated don’t GET SQUAT for a settlement.
      Also….
      He claims he only told Anderson of 1 woman and a settlement, yet somehow Anderson told Politico of 2? Anderson says Cain never told him of these “settlements”, so is Anderson lying or is Cain? Both can’t be telling the truth.

      This business of blaming someone else is worse in my book. That smacks of… Obama.. and his blaming everyone but himself. You still have a negative story out there about yourself but you blame others for it getting out? COME ON… seriously?

      The key here is that Cain bungled this. He could have handled it by holding off on any response until they had an official story, which he got around to, just saying he was falsely accused and that he didn’t have any control over the payoffs. People know it happens a lot and would then have seen this story as just another smear and it would have gone away.

      • congressworksforus

        My reaction, actually, was “only one year’s pay?”

        Obviously we move in different circles. Remember, when one year’s pay is $30k, it’s nothing…

        Now, if we were talking about $400k a year employee…

  • Scope

    release of the NDA for the accuser. It appears the one page statement that may be released today by her attorney will have to be approved by the NRA. That’s what I just heard on CNN. The accuser doesn’t want her name released, but it seems obvious that the NRA is going to be responsible for how much and what information can be released. In other words, the NRA will be withholding any information that may harm their reputation, or that of Cain.

    This will keep the story very much alive for the foreseeable future. It doesn’t appear that much of anything will be answered. After all, one of their people has already claimed that this is a hatchet job against Cain. There you have it.

    • http://teapartisan.wordpress.com Loren Heal

      The release of partial information either involves spinning the story with the release of selected details, or evokes the suspicion of doing so.

      This is all crap.

  • gawken

    Other hot dogs use pork, and fillers. Ours are 100% beef, and KOSHER!

    WE ANSWER TO A HIGHER AUTHORITY!!

  • sedentaryactivist

    This whole discussion is depressing.

    I am seriously asking: Can T-Paw get back in the race? Our current choices are discouraging. I could not take the position that streiff takes here (never vote for Cain) because, if faced with Cain vs. Obama, I would vote Cain, just like I would vote Romney, though I don’t like him either.

    How about bringing Timmy back??? Is it possible? Marco? Where be thou Marco?

    • acat

      are as gone as the Halloween candy.

      No, I didn’t eat it all, I donated it to a worthy outfit.

      Mew

      • sedentaryactivist

        …have already filed these?

        • acat

          I suspect we would have heard in Erick’s Horserace.

          Mew

  • center77

    I sometimes wish I had an outlet such as this to vent, and this case is really starting to make me feel sick. Its seems to me that Cain is trying to hide something, or at least he is trying to take somebody else down with him when sinking.

    I find it funny that the new polls shows Cain below Romney again, and suddenly Perry is back to third place. Cain has some serious problems here, and because this story is just now starting to sink in, I suspect it only gets worse for him.

    I am wondering how these women must feel, because they know for sure if Cain is who he says he is. If Cain did this, then Fox News and half of the right owes them an apology.

    I’ve been blogging about this for three days because I want to see a higher standard from conservative. The whole Cain thing has always reeked of hypocritical assumption.

    Cain gets away with fumbling almost every question asked of him, he gets away with using his race as cover for saying racist things about his OWN RACE. He claims ignorance when challenged.

    Many of these things conservatives like myself criticized president Obama of doing, and the left would use the race card when something like this broke. I was shocked to see so many conservative use the same card when this story broke about Cain.

    Just because others have decided to let their principles go, does not mean it is right. Cain has acted like a guilty man, whether or not he is does not matter as much as he is acting like it, and what about the women.

    • uncmike

      I completely resonate with your comments. Rush was on again today blasting the baseless charges against Cain. I say Rush and many others have lost their way and, as Streiff puts it, they’re no better than the spinmeisters who made their excuses for slick willy. The women with whom the NRA settled have probably gone on with their lives since the confrontation with Cain, and may be married or whatever today, maybe even with children. I can understand why they might not want to go public with their stories. If they did, we might well see some of Cain’s defenders digging through their lives to look for something that would allow them to denigrate these women as Bimbos or worse. I recall too well what the Clinton victims had to endure. In any case, I think Cain and his handlers have really botched this, especially given the fact they had over a week to develop a sensible response if there is really no there, there. This episode, along with the way many of the other Republican candidates have trashed Perry from the gitgo over social security, Gardisil, in-state tuition breaks for children of illegals, the rock with the supposed “N-word,” and on and on, have really turned me off and changed substantially what I think of many so-called “conservatives.”

  • rightwingmom52

    This I mean:

    This is a test folks; they?re seeing how much unsubstantiated mud they can throw at a Republican so that the we turn on each other, force a candidate (whomever it is; Cain today? but who?s next?) to step down, so that the idiot in the WH (or whatever office is up for grabs) gets re-elected by default.

    .

    • rightwingmom52

      . .
      .

    • tnguy

      Every candidate has something like sexual harrassment hush money in their past? We’re not talking about something that Cain was involved in while in college. This happened in his mid-50s.

      Funny after Cain helped to destroy Rick Perry’s name by labeling him a racist, Cain apologists weren’t so concerned about what the press was doing. They were silent while their man piled on with the leftist media on top of Perry.

      Cain’s just getting a helping of what he dished out himself.

      • congressworksforus

        If they can get away with allegations (and with “victims” that want to remain anonymous), they can get away with TOTAL FABRICATIONS!

        Wake the hell up people!

        • tnguy

          Total fabrications? What has been fabricated? Perhaps something has that I am not aware of, but from what we’ve heard, the basic story is true: Cain was accused of sexual harrassment and the organizatoin he worked for paid off the 2 women in question and required them to sign an NDA in return.

          Blame the media all you want, but I want to hear the truth of that, no matter which candidate it was.

          Shame you didn’t wake up when Cain was hurling racism stones at Rick Perry.

          • congressworksforus

            Re-read what I said. I said if they can get away with allegations from anonymous victims, they can get away with total fabrications. After all, is there really any difference?

            Next time, they can completely make up two anonymous victims, fabricate the story, and still get away with it.

            Overton Window in full view of everyone here folks.

            As I said elsewhere, I’ll wait for real evidence before jumping on anyone…

          • Xasteius

            nt

      • rightwingmom52

        Not all Cain supporters have piled on Perry. Just like I’ve seen a couple of Perry supporters who haven’t piled on Cain.

        Accusations of sexual harassment doesn’t mean they’re true, nor does a settlement always constitute “hush money.” An attorney on Mark Levin the other night (Gail from Birmingham) pointed out that in the ’90′s, there was very little standard for what was considered harassment, sexual or otherwise, Having lived through and fought the feminist agenda in the ’70′s and ’80′s (Equal Rights Amendment ring a bell?), it was no secret that feminists pushed the men are bad, let’s punish them train of thought in every way they could. They still do. She went on to say that she had represented both sides of the issue, and that during that time frame, if a complaint was made, it was filed with the EEOC at which point it was not unusual for a company’s insurance carrier to get involved and settle the case rather than go through the headache of litigation. Further, that often the accused was never even aware of the complaint if the case was settled until after the fact. They never even got around to hearing the accused’s side of the story.

        I can’t count the number of training sessions I’ve had to sit through on how to report harassment if I ever even feel “uncomfortable.” Sorry, but a slap in the face, a well-placed kick or a simple knock it off has always worked for me. While I realize there are some legitimate cases out there, I’ve also seen good men suffer the indignity of being accused of looking at a woman the wrong way. How many training sessions have you ever had to train you how to deal with women in the work place who have no hesitation in baring their cleavage or wearing skirts up to there? I see women every day where I work that don’t think twice about what they wear despite our “professional” dress code. Our firm does nothing other than an occasional reminder of the dress code because it’s the women, and they might file a complaint.

        A personal story if you’ll allow me. In the mid ’80′s, I worked for a mid-size law firm in Atlanta that was pretty well known in the retail/shopping center world. One night after work, our attorneys threw one of our attorneys a birthday party (it was a milestone like 60th or 70th) to which staff was invited. They brought in a stripper, and it was one of the most disgusting displays of vulgarity I’d ever seen. No doubt I could have filed a complaint, but I just left.

        Doesn’t it make you wonder the least little bit that it’s most often the women who sue? Our liberal, feminist driven society has demonized men to the point that you can’t even watch 30 minutes of TV these days without being bombarded with commercials in which men are the stupid, bumbling idiots who have to be saved by women or children. I’m not buying it. I know too many good and decent men.

        Several have said that they worry about their daughters joining the workplace. Well, join the club. I worry about my son despite knowing he has been taught how to treat women, both by the example of his father and other men in his life and by us teaching him. None of that will matter if some woman decides to target him.

  • hunter

    And your post is full of assumptions.
    We in fact do not know if the claims in POlitico are correct.
    $45,000 in go away money to settle frivolous claims, is sadly, not unusual. I have seen more than one or two in that range. One by the same person making false claims to two different companies.

    One thing I know for sure is that at this point in the Republican part of the election cycle we are forming the all too predictable Conservative Circular Firing Squad and blazing away.

    Another thing I know is that as of today, Republicans are being blamed more than the democrats for the state of the economy and are at this point likely to lose seats, not gain them, if the election were being held next week.

    Another thing I know is that the least competent President since Jimmy Carter is pulling ahead against Republican challengers, especially in swing states.

    From this I conclude: If you want to make certain we have four more years of what we have had the last three years, a damaged political process and a weakened nation, don’t change a thing. Keep up the relentless, ridiculous, infantile and self-destructive faux purity tests. Keep with the never-ending searches for the purest of the purest of the pure Conservative- who has never nor ever will- exist.

    One of the toughest things about being a life long Conservative and Republican is watching these tediously predicatble, always sincere outbreaks of Circular Firing Squad Syndrome.

    • gator_hoo

      Let’s not act like any of the candidates might not have any problems whatsoever. Let’s all just overlook every potential negative. We know that the Deomcrats are very honorable, and that if a Republican candidate wins the nomination because we were willing to overlook that negative, the Democrats will respect that decision, and will also not consider those potential flaws.

  • tricianc

    One of the women’s statement may not have been signed until 9/99 but it doesn’t explain this other woman:

    “The woman left the NRA in May 1998, and received a settlement of one-year?s salary.”

    http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1111/67621.html#ixzz1cklaGgow

    This has to be the other woman as there’s no way the settlement would have been done almost a year and a half later.

    • congressworksforus

      There was apparently one whose work wasn’t up to par and was terminated. If she then cried “sexual harassment” or some other bogus BS, it’s cheaper to pay her off than fight the claim.

      None of which means anything to Cain as that level of payoff wouldn’t have required his agreement, whether the charge was against him or not…

      (Really have to wonder if some of the pontificators on here have any clue how HR works…)

      • tyman

        Maybe, maybe not but isn’t it starting to show a pattern?

        I’m trying to be objective…why would women make the same claim with that amount of time between them? Why against Cain and not some other high up or somebody else? Why make a claim against the top man?

        If this is a pattern at the NRA (and not just Cain), I wonder how many other settlements they’ve paid out for accusations against others.

        Do women who work there just think, “I don’t like this job so I’ll file a sexual harassment lawsuit?”.

        Rush is talking about 9/99 now and a story in Politico. Where have we heard those three numbers before?

        That’s just too funny!

        • congressworksforus

          Gee… maybe they talked in the break room?

          Who knows.

          Maybe one got wind of it?

          Maybe one was fighting termination and threw in the sexual harrasment because she knew someone else had?

          I have no idea… still waiting for real facts and evidence here people…

      • tricianc

        You can’t have it both ways. You can either assume none of the story is true until you know the details or it is true.

        How do you know the woman’s work wasn’t up to Par? Those are Cain’s words. You have no basis in fact to say that. Yet, you give Cain the benefit of the doubt and you should. However, then you should also give the woman the same.

        • congressworksforus

          I am giving them the benefit of the doubt.

          What I’m doing is giving EVERYONE the benefit of the doubt. “Cain’s a liar!” But… where’s the proof?

          “Cain’s a pervert” … where’s the proof?

          Still waiting for facts. Just trying to empahsize to the circular firing squad here that maybe everyone else should do the same.

          Not that hard to understand. Really.

  • gator_hoo

    Shilling for Cain again. Losing respect for him by the minute.

    • tyman

      nt

    • congressworksforus

      Shilling for Cain, or raving against the drive-bys… which he’s been doing every day for years.

      Cain’s just the latest example of the drive-bys in action as far as Rush is concerned.

      And, whether you think there’s anything to this story or not, there’s some pretty blatant hypocrisy here from the media in how the R is being treated vs how they treated, oh, I dunno, Anthony Wiener (D).

      • gator_hoo

        Hypocrisy by the media don’t mean nothing happened

        • tyman

          He’s still talking about Herman Cain at 2:30.

          Other callers have tried to tell him, but he’s wound up cutting them off.

          So, I wound up cutting him off.

          That’s right Gator, unless Rush knows what happened, it doesn’t mean that nothing did.

          Cain’s not the only one that’s the media has piled on. I haven’t heard Rush defend Perry against the media saying he was drunk, etc. when the folks that were there said he wasn’t.

          Cain’t figure that out.

          • gator_hoo

            The one moment wher I thought, ok, Cain is done now, was when he lashed out at Rick Perry and accused him of the leak. At that point, Cain was engaging in an even more baseless attack than he was defending himself against.

            For some reason, nope, not an issue. If you are against baseless attacks against Republican candidates, be against all of them.

            Thanks for the update Tyman, I couldn’t make it past his opening today.

          • tyman

            Regardless of whether Cain thought it was credible or not, he shouldn’t have aired that. There IS such a thing as restraint.

            I read today that Perry said he would fire anybody in his campaign that made that leak.

            Rush is probably talking about football now…

  • tngal

    Could be.

    __
    “Block also said during the interview Friday morning that the Cain campaign is considering its legal options and may sue the news outlet over the as-yet unsubstantiated allegations.

    ?This is the last time that I?ll be addressing the issue that has swirled [around] Washington and the nation this week ? We?re not going to play by the rules that the media has established,? Block said.”

    ?The media, this week, has been a cesspool,? Block explained. ?And we?re not going to swim in that cesspool anymore.?
    _______

    Well, this should bring some stuff out in the open. I say go for it Herman. Politico deserves it. Then maybe we’ll find out who started this mess. They’re trying to crucify you over this garbage. If you’re going to be nailed up high, make sure there are a couple others that get nailed too. Quid pro quo.

    I am definately in his camp, but I am getting in serious revenge mode.

    http://dailycaller.com/2011/11/04/cain-campaign-manager-if-politico-had-standards-theyd-fire-people-over-harassment-story/#ixzz1ckm98pam

    • gator_hoo

      I agree, go for it Herman. Sue the heck out of Politico! Make sure you depose the heck out of those women and force them to come forward!

      • tyman

        That’s funny right thar.

      • tngal

        The women weren’t the ones who gave it to politico. Someone else dug it up. Politico might have called the women to see if they existed and they know who they are. But the women didn’t hand it over to politico to begin with.

        The women were and are trying to get on with their lives. Cain is having to defend himself while trying to respect privacy. He’s not going to give out a name even if he could. Tough to do.

        No, the lawsuit, I suspect would involve politico reporters and the persons who provided them with the information, as well as any organization which may be affiliated with the leaker.

        • tnguy

          Sue reporters or those who leaked a story? For what? Dredging up an unfortunate situation?

          Cain has already said the women were lying, so now he’s trying to respect their privacy?

          From Newsmax:
          One of the women said earlier this week that she wanted to talk publicly about accusations that Cain had sexually harassed her, but she has since changed her mind and wanted to make a written statement through her lawyer.

          The woman’s lawyer, Joel Bennett, gave the statement to the restaurant group, said Sue Hensley, a spokeswoman for the restaurant association.

          The trade group’s lawyers were reviewing the statement to decide whether to lift a confidentiality agreement that she signed when she left the association. It is likely to conflict with Cain’s version of events….

          So is Cain going to sue Newsmax now, as well?

    • retire05

      for one, the disclosure rules in civil court are much more strict than in federal cases.

      Cain, if he sues Politico, is going to have to prove that the allegations by Politico were false. How does he do that when he has a) admitted that there were two women who accused him of sexual harassment and b) that they were paid off. Those were Politico’s claims, and Cain has substantiated them.

      Also, as I told BA Cyclone, there are a number of things that will happen in a civil case. First, the women will be required to testify, and second, the NRA will be required to produce the documents from the internal investigation and the pay outs, Cain claims they made. This will not just be a case of Cain suing Politico over the sources. This will be a case of full discovery, and that means that the documents, and the payouts, will be revealed. It will also mean that everything that Cain, and Mark Block, have said, that originally disputed the Politico article, will be repeated in court. It will also serve to keep the story in the headlines until well after the primaries. These cases move slowly, and Cain needs this to go away, not add more fuel to the fire.

      If it is true, as has been rumored, that Cain has hired Bopal Coale, Greta Van Sustern’s husband, that also makes a connection between Cain, Coale, Van Sustern and Fox. I doubt that Roger Ailes wants that noose hanging around his neck. It also means that Cain has hired an attack dog tort lawyer who has lost as many cases as he has won and who has a reputation for being an opportunist.

      The problem with Block’s statements are that he, and the rest of Team Cain, allowed this to get out of control by not getting in front of it after Politico advised them the story was going to run. I suspect that the threat of suing Politico is just more smoke and mirrors. If Cain, and Block, think that by keeping this on the front pages is going to garner Cain even more sympathetic votes and consequently, more campaign donations, they are both fools. This claim of innocense on Cain’s part only has a certain shelf life. And that shelf life is rapidly coming to an end, especially with independents who will move on to another candidate who is not involved in a serious scandal.

      Perry lost support (as shown by RCP polls from the time) over the rock issue. It took a week or so for that to happen, and if Cain keeps this front and center, and doesn’t regroup and try to kill the story now, and by now, I mean TODAY, he is going to suffer the same repercussions in the polls.

      • tngal

        nice and cogent response. You didn’t “go off” on my candidate and I appreciate that.

        I can definately see how NOT dragging this out is something they are looking at. As Block pointed out he’s not taking any more questions because he’s tired of the cesspool and tired of the media dictating the narrative.

        But its Herman Cain’s reputation that’s getting slandered. One minute an intriguing sex story is out there, then the next minute the story has to be corrected and fixed because they got all the sex part wrong. One guy says he saw Cain act inappropriately at a dinner, but then someone else at the same party said No Cain didn’t.

        The girls aren’t slandered. They’re not even named. Politico’s not damaged They’re getting more hits than ever on this. Or tweets as they like to point out. Its Cain getting dragged and he should be able to fight back not just play defense.

        • retire05

          I believe the primaries are a time to vet all candidates. It is how they handle that vetting that tells us a lot about them. Each one brings something to the table, and the thing that Cain brought was the fact that conservatives are not racist.

          But two points you need to accept:

          Block cannot just walk away from this now. It has gone on too far and for too long. He should have nipped this in the bud Monday. That’s his job. But he didn’t, and saying now he (and Cain) are going to just walk away is not going to make it go away.

          Yes, one of the women was slandered by Cain himself when he told Greta the woman was not a good employee. Basically, Cain gave that woman a right to sue HIM for slander. He should have said that if there were any misunderstandings between him and her, he apologized for it a long time ago and wishes her well. End of story. But he didn’t do that, did he tngal? No, he smeared her employment reputation. And it is only a matter of time before the women’s names surface. Once that happens, if I were the woman Cain claimed was a bad employee, I would file suit in civil court for slander. Like I said before, slander involves financial harm, and saying on a national TV show that someone was a bad employee can create future financial harm.

          What is odd about all this was last summer, I was squarely in Cain’s camp. But even before Perry got in the race, I did my own research, and it was Cain’s record, or really the lack of it, and comments he had made on his radio show, that made me think he was not suited to be the candidate that would reverse the harm done by the Obama administration. I am not willing to go on blind faith, based on what a candidate says, and not what they have done, to think I should support them. Unfortunately, we now have an example of how Cain will handle serious problems as POTUS, and he, and Mark Block who like David Axelrod, would have a powerful position in the Cain administration, have handled this situation miserably and if you can’t see that, then you have closed your eyes and I am sorry that you are not more open to reality.

          • tyman

            I was a Cain supporter when he first announced and I used to LOVE to listen to his show (although looking back, it was kind of boring).

            However, I realized that he just didn’t have any record and I felt that the experience was lacking.

            I was happy he was doing well at the Florida straw poll, until he started singling Perry out and then after he said what he said about Perry and the rock. When he joined with Mitt and the misrepresentation about Perry as governor was over the line. Calling Perry soft on immigration was hard for me to take.

            The way he has handled this has shown me that he is unfit for The White House.

            Now, we find out that Cain supported Clinton in ’92. When did Cain all of a sudden become such a conservative? For everyone’s knock at Rick Perry for supporting Algore, remember that he was picked as Clinton’s running mate to balance the ticket with what Clinton lacked (more conservative and family values).

            And today, I read that Cain’s wife has voted 5 times in GA Democratic Primaries and Runoffs since 2004. As I said in another post, I heard someone say that a President is never more conservative than his wife, and I believe that is true.

            Suffice to say, Herman may talk conservative, but he does NOT have a record to go on, and he does not have judicial appointments, etc. that shows how he’ll govern.

            I just don’t want another President in training. We need someone who has the experience and record to run on.

          • gator_hoo

            Until he says something dumb and his handlers give him the “right” answer

          • retire05

            In 1988, Al Gore was not Clinton’s running mate. Gore was running as a Southern Democrat in the primary against the left wing, Michael Dukakis. Most Dems in Texas supported Dukakis, except for two long standing Democrats, Gib Lewis and Bill Hobby. Lewis and Hobby recruited 25 more Texas Dems to declare their support for Gore in the primaries. Perry was NEVER Gore’s campaign manager in Texas for the simple reason Gore did not have a campaign manager in Texas in 1988. Lewis and Hobby simply were trying to gain support for a Gore nomination against the more liberal, and far left Dukakis.

            Do you not think if there had been campaigning for Gore by Perry, those articles would have not surfaced by now? I have also read Cain supporters make the claim that Perry did not support Reagan. But look at the dates Reagan ran and what Perry was doing at the time.

            Perry, like a number of Texas Dems, switched parties in 1989 due to the nomination of Dukakis and the seemingly far left lurch the Democrat party was making. But Perry wasn’t the first to see what was going on with the Dems. John Connelly, who was governor, and in the car with JFK on that fateful day in Dallas, switched parties in 1973. John Tower was gaining stature in Texas, as a Republican. It has been reported that it was Tower, or perhaps Phil Graham who had also switched to the GOP, that influenced Perry who was already known as a fiscal hawk, opposing big spending bills of the Democrats. That is where he got the nickname “Pitbull” because he sat in the pit of the floor of the Texas Congress lobbying for fiscal restraint.

            As to Cain, he was the one who actually turned me off of him by some of the statements he made on his radio show and the fact that he claimed to not be running on race, yet he made mention of his skin tone almost constantly. I was leaning toward Newt then, but Perry got in the race, and say what you will, he has governed Texas with a light hand knowing that less government is better. Deny that tactic all you want, but it has proven to be successful in job creation and fiscal responsibility.

          • tyman

            If I made you think I believe that Perry really supported Algore then I wasn’t clear. I was just using that to illustrate that folks knock Perry for supposedly supporting Algore: so, do the same folks give Cain a free pass for supporting Clinton? A known liberal, pro-choice womanizer?

            I have NO doubt whatsoever that Perry is the real conservative in this race! No one but a conservative would say some of the things he’s said, as well as put them into practice.

            Folks can spin the Gardasil and in-state tuition all they want, but the ultimate goal was conservative: it costs less to vaccinate against a virus than it does to treat cancer at the state’s expense and it costs less to educate and create productive taxpayers than it does to create generations of dependent ne’er-do-wells (never mind the fact that we have plenty of American citizens in that ship).

    • uncmike

      Filing a law suit would open Cain up to all sorts of under-oath affidavits, interrogatories, fact finding, and never ending legal wrangling. No suit like this would ever be resolved in short order, so this would leave Cain dangling in the wind with this issue until November 2010. I say, bring it on Block–show us you are really a blockhead.

  • texasroots

    Thanks for your honesty I, too, will not my vote for Romney or Cain.
    I will stay at home and encourage others to do the same. Romeny and Cain = Obama. No thanks!

    • macbookben

      No Romney and No Cain = Obama

      • macbookben

        No Bachman = Obama
        No (gulp) Paul = Obama
        No (no way!) Huntsman = Obama

        No Republican = Obama

        No vote = Obama

        Please choose wisely.

        • tnguy

          Voting for non-conservative candidates brought us Obama. It is our side repeatedly compromising our principles that has us in this condition to begin with.

  • tricianc

    What’s disgusting is our OWN party is pulling the race card.

    Coulter, Ingraham, Hannity, Rush, and especially Cain.

    Come on, we all know what the “Lynching” part is about. Cain has been in the political arena for decades and a black man even longer. He knows exactly what he’s doing.

    Playing the race card is awful, no matter which side plays it.

    He’s using it to stop media from reporting anything about him. And because he and his camp are STILL blaming Perry, is he calling Perry a racist AGAIN? Me thinks so.

    • Scope

      Here is the ad that has been put out by the Cain super PAC. I am sick to death of this coming from the Republican party. It is shameless and disgusting.

      • izoneguy

        by the color of his skin instead of the content of his character.

      • Xasteius

        I got a sense of Clarence’s personal character, and Cain does not share this quality. He’s acting like a 5-yr old who has misplaced his favorite toy and is accusing everyone in his family of ‘stealing it’.

        • mich22

          I read that book last year, and through it, Clarence Thomas became a hero in my mind. He is all class, all character, all intellect. Herman Cain is none of the three. Oh, I do hope we nominate someone else!

      • retire05

        Conservatives have been gritching for decades that the Democrats trump the race card for convenience. And while I don’t hold Cain liable for what his PAC does, they are not helping him, and he needs to tell them to pull the ad.

        Cain has run on being an American, not a BLACK American, although he throws out the “black” comments when he thinks it is convenient. We can see what his skin tone is as we are not blind. Cain told Hannity yesterday on the radio show that he was being attacked because he was a BLACK conservative. There is absolutely NO reason for him to do that, or for his PAC to try that liberal tactic. He should have just eliminated the word BLACK from his lexicon. It serves no purpose, and the fact that conservatives did not discuss his skin tone, was clear proof that skin tone is not important to conservative. Cain, and his PAC risk losing that perception now.

        Rove, like a broken clock, is sometimes right. He said Cain is being attacked because he is a top-tier candidate in the GOP primaries. Rove is right. Can we say that the WaPo attacked Rick Perry because he was white? No, it was because Perry was doing well in the polls. No other reason.

        I was hoping Cain, and his team, would show some wisdom in dealing with this issue. Cain, as all other candidates, brings debate to the issues, and that is a good thing. But so far, all I have seen is an inexperienced campaign grasping at straws and making claims of their own to divert attention from Cain’s problems.

        In the end, that won’t work.

    • congressworksforus

      “He?s using it to stop media from reporting anything about him.”

      Or is he simply allowing the general population to see how the media works, and how they are inherently biased.

      I have had one very goo, very long-time friend tell me in the past week “you were right about the news media; I can’t believe I didn’t see how biased they are” BECAUSE of they way they’ve gone after Cain.

      Whether he’s the nominee or not, if he wakes regular people up about this, he’s done us alla HUGE favor.

  • unclefred

    Pure anonymous she said he said.

    I doubt very much that anything approaching the legal definition of sexaul harassment occurred for two reasons:

    1: The board, technically Cain’s superiors at the company were not informed of the suits nor the settlement. Had the charges had merit, the board would have been informed. We have statements from a board member that they were not informed.

    2: Cain continued in his role long after when the alleged incidents allegedly occurred and after the suit were brought and settled. Had the cases had merit, Cain would have left his position.

    All comments from the NRA indicate that both of these matters were handled administratively, without the involvement of the board. It is utterly absurd to think that would have happened had the charges had merit. The company elected to treat them as nuisance suits, probably for business reasons.

    As for comments about a third suit/charge, as far as I can find there is even less information about it, than the two that first broke. If someone has a link to substantiate basic information about a third suit/charge like date, circumstances, etc I would appreciate a link.

    While I am concerned about the ineptness demonstrated in Can’s campaign’s handling of this issue, until real evidence shows up I judge the charges to be without merit.

    Streff – I appreciate that you are committed to Parry’s candidacy, but your rush to judgement on this matter serves you poorly.

    • uncmike

      I’d like to examine them in context.

  • congressworksforus

    While many of you repeatedly talk about Cain’s “gaffes” and “inability to handle a crisis,” I believe this has been played quite brilliantly by his campaign.

    Remember, he promised from day 1 an unconventional campaign. He also suffered from a big problem that some of the other candidates did not: name recognition.

    Political “experts” keep saying he needs to get in front of this and move on; I beg to differ; all of this attention is making people look at who he is. And I mean look for the first time. People who have never heard of him. People who then realize “hey, he’s not a politician.” People who then support him for precisely that reason.

    If there’s truly nothing to these allegations, it’s a brilliant strategy because eventually it goes away. It also focuses ALL the attention on him, and NOTHING on his competition.

    Remember the outrage over first the book tour, then the smoking video while Perry was trying to roll out policy plans? Who got more attention?

    Who leads the polls? And who is languishing in single digits?

  • daveoconnor

    NeoKong challenged streiff awhile back. The questions were straight to the heart of the matter. The questions remain. What is streiff hiding? What does he know? Wait. let me rephrase: What doesn’t he know?
    I am a recent member of RS. Some of the anti-Cain rants here are what’s disappointing. I’m not a Perry fan, but wrote a post in his defense today re: the he was drunk smear.
    If he is the nominee, I doubt it, but if he is I will volunteer to work for his ticket and give him a donation. Same for the rest of the field. Re: Herman Cain I believe he would be a huge improvment, superior in every way to the current chief executive.

    • notpropagandized

      This nomination has become total chaos. The reason is that in short order the CainCampaign is a comedy of errors where logic fails to offer a reasonable explanation for anything.

      The only logical explanation for this campaign’s behavior that I can see is that it’s a hidden-agenda, secret subsidiary Romney campaign. This may be wrong, but as a highly ardent Cain supporter until this week, his statements simply make no sense.

      He has said he cannot support Perry, but that he can support Romney. He could be Romney’s VP, but he cannot be Perry’s VP. This is all coming from an anti-establishment, core-values conservative??? He criticized Perry for insensitivity over the hunting lease painted rock with no evidence of Perry’s culpability or oversight of any kind. He says of the harrassment settlements revelation that Perry’s fingerprints are all over it and ignore’s Anderson’s disavowal of participation. This guy is cocked to take out Perry, and it looks like it’s in service to Romney.

      The first little trace of question was when Cain surged and surged big-time after FloridaStrawPoll and his facial countenance revealed complete surprise and unpreparedness for the phenomenon he became. It looked like it was not part of the PLAN. Disregarded that, but look at all this strange stuff happening!

      Long and short is that I suspect that in addition to all the various Republican county groups that I’ve “heard” (yes, hearsay) have been bought by Romney, that maybe Cain and possibly Bachmann have also been bought by Romney. They both cow to him now. It’s disgusting. Cabinet appointments?

      Dear Red State – Please deal with this issue possibility and put it to bed if doesn’t hold water. This nomination is becoming a joke and it is existentially important to America’s salvation in the 21st century. We cannot allow this mellow coup d etat to progress for another 4 years.

  • http://www.flaliberty.org scorpio0679

    streiff,

    Seriously? This has got to be one of the dumbest things I’ve read. I don’t have the time or inclination to respond point by point to your ridiculous contentions. Let me only say this:

    1. By all accounts, the ANONYMOUS *allegations* (yes, they are anonymous — can you tell me who the accuser is?) are of “untoward” verbal comment to a then-30yo employee. And yet you compare this to receiving a blowjob in the oval office from a 22-23yo WH intern?

    2. If Cain recused himself from the situation, and was not a party to the “settlement” or “severage” agreement, which was then completely confidential, HOW SHOULD HE KNOW what it is about? Especially if, as he claims, HE IS INNOCENT OF ANY WRONGDOING?

    3. You’re an idiot.

    scorpio0679

    • gekster

      Cain came out and said he did know about the settlement.
      He said that last Monday afternoon, right after he said he didn’t know of any settlement last Monday morning.

      • http://www.flaliberty.org scorpio0679

        And I also heard his explanation, which I accept, because it is how I would characterize it if I were him.

        He explained that he viewed the agreement that was reached as a “severance” and not as a “settlement” of a harassment case. I understand why he would make this distinction, if in fact the internal investigation cleared him of any wrongdoing, as appears likely.

        I really hope the “NRA” and the two accusers release the confidentiality agreement and we can get a full airing of what the accusation was and the results of the investigation.

  • tnguy

    If Cain doesn’t know anything about it, then what did he confide in Curt Anderson about it?

    Cain said that he confided in Anderson about his sexual harrassment charges while at the NRA. So, your #2 is completely false. Not to mention that there is no way on earth that Cain, as the head of an organization, was completely divorced from the settlement of an issue that directly involved him. That’s requires a suspension of common sense that I simply can’t relate to.

    “You’re an idiot”. Hopefully, your banning is soon to follow.

    • http://www.flaliberty.org scorpio0679

      He knew there was an accusation, but according to Cain, he didn’t know the details of what was alleged. Give me a break, man. And yes, there IS a “way on earth” that he could be completely divorced from the situation if he RECUSED himself of the situation and delegated responsibility for dealing with it to a subordinate or a committee.

      That is a COMPLETELY legitimate way to handle something like this, and it is completely believable and understandable why he wouldn’t know any of the specific details of the allegations in the complaint as well as the terms or specific details of the settlement (it being confidential).

      • tnguy

        So they’re going to settle accusations against him, without divulging to him the actual settlement. No red-blooded, innocent, American man would tolerate that, and you know it. You’re just carrying his water.

        It’s not hard to see what happened here. He was accused of sexual harrassment, the women were paid off, and he resigned from the association soon thereafter.

        But continue to live a delusion. If by some miracle he gets the nomination, Obama and the media will bring out the gritty details of these episodes and utterly destroy his campaign.

        • http://www.flaliberty.org scorpio0679

          I don’t carry anyone’s water in this campaign. I’ve gone from supporting Pawlenty, to Cain, to Perry, to Cain, and after the abortion debacle now I’m in the “anybody but Romney” category. A quick survey of my comments will reveal that I am no “water carrier” for anybody, tyvm.

  • tjms

    someone tell me if they have seen politico stating that it was the Perry campaign that “leaked” this story as the headline on Gretawire states http://gretawire.foxnewsinsider.com/2011/11/02/gov-rick-perry-supporter-and-pollster-for-a-superpac-that-supports-gov-perry-is-the-herman-cain-source/

    • tnguy

      Google the Politico story.

      Wilson – who does not work for the Perry Campaign- stated that he is not the source for the story, but that he has observed Cain’s behavior in the past. Greta – as usual – gets it all wrong.

      At some point, people are going to wake up and realize this is just a bad guy, and that their support of him was a horrible mistake. I hope that comes before it’s too late.

      • tjms

        know that all the articles I had seen never stated that he was the “leaker” . I just think it is some kind of conflict that Greta’s husband works for Cain and she posts a headline stating that politico published an article stating that Wilson is the leaker. I feel she should have to take that down if there hasn’t been admission by politico that he was their source. Otherwise, her headline leads people to believe that politico has said that is where they got the info.

  • swamphermit

    …what the sexist pervert did to poor abused Madeleine Albright.

  • tpnoga1

    I am reading my fellow conservatives trash a fine conservative man. I may not be voting for Herman Cain, but I will be danged that he should be trashed by so-called “conservatives”. I am very familiar with Mr. Cain as I live in Atlanta and have occasionally heard his radio program. He has more class in his pinky than Perry has had his whole life. He is a great man and I do hope he will be our Governor or Senator one day soon.

    All I can say is if we elect an Aggy yell leader like Perry, America better guard your sheep. J/S.

    • seth90212

      Since others are declaring who they won’t vote for, let me state categorically that I will never vote for Rick Perry. Surely there’s something terribly wrong with him if he attracts these kind of supporters.

      • tpnoga1

        disagree. Hopefully we will unify after we choose a nominee.

    • onemovoter

      Seriously talk about foot in mouth hypocrisy. I don’t like dirty laundry anymore than the next person. So WHY the hell is Cain dishing out the same crap blaming others for something he finally admitted in part was true?

      Come on Cain.. MAN UP and get a PAIR! Good Grief!

      • tpnoga1

        Please forgive me, I do not mean to trash Perry. I am sure he is a good man. I went to Baylor University, we dislike where Perry went to “college”. I just do not think Perry is right for the job. I would never trash the man, I don’t know him personally.

  • seth90212

    He has always acknowledged knowing about an Agreement. The media tried to conflate Settlement with Agreement. He said he knew nothing about a Settlement. Settlement is a legal term.. Only if the case had been adjudicated outside of the company through the court system could you describe the final arrangement as a Settlement. The matter never went that far. It was resolved internally with a Severance Agreement. It’s the same type of agreement most of us sign in exchange for a severance payment. My own severance package from a couple of years ago incorporated the very same type of language pertaining to non-disclosure and confidentiality. You don’t have to be involved in a sexual harassment case to be required to keep your mouth about the company in exchange for severance.

    • onemovoter

      With the kind of legal-eez you just posted. So a few questions….

      Why did Cain leave his position early? Only having 2 1/2 years in on a 3 year commitment, the rest of the board was surprised to learn of him quitting his position.

      If he knew about this issue back in 2003, and supposedly told Anderson of this ONE case, how did Politico know about TWO cases, if Cain’s claims are true about Anderson spilling the beans on it?

      If Anderson said he wasn’t told of this in 2003, but Cain claims he told Anderson of this in 2003, who’s telling the truth and who isn’t? Both can’t be telling the truth.

      How much was your severance package? Of the people I know who were let go either because of reductions in workforce ( one lady who worked for 26 years only got 3 months pay plus her 6 months of vacation) NO one got anywhere close to a YEAR of severance pay. Then to have TWO women get that? For $80k total?

      Trying to explain this away like Cain has, is only dragging this on longer than it should have. A simple explanation of that he was falsely accused and then shut up about it, would have done wonders for Cain instead of changing stories and blaming others for LEAKING it.

      As it’s been said, if you want to find out what you have and haven’t done in your life… just run for higher office.

      Cain should grow up and use the pair he has.

      • seth90212

        I have no idea why Cain left and neither do you. But if, as you’ve confirmed, the rest of the board was surprised by his departure that means he wasn’t pushed out over the harassment allegations.

        Perhaps if Politico found out about the one case from Anderson, they would dig deeper to try to find a pattern or at least to try to corroborate their case. What they found were 2 cases that didn’t even rise to the level of a court proceeding. 2 cases that, given all the available evidence, appear to have been nuisance cases. Mind you, sexual harassment is whatever the accuser says it is. So a smile or a glance or a tap on the shoulder could result in a sexual harassment complaint. And, by law, it has to be treated the same as a groping incident or an explicit invitation to exchange sex for favors.

        Anderson now works for Perry. You’re asking me who’s telling the truth? Think about it. Unless Anderson is under oath I’d be skeptical of anything he says on the matter.

        I won’t divulge the details of my severance package but I can assure you that what these women received was puny. And a severance of 1 years salary is not totally unusual. Some people receive that plus a lot more. I’m not suggesting that the allegations didn’t impact their severance, however.

        Cain is under the microscope because he’s the frontrunner and he could be president. As of right now, Romney is the only other Republican who could be president. I think Cain expects attacks, but not smears driven by innuendo and anonymous sources. If you allow this to stand, how many anonymous sources will crawl out of the woodwork to defame Perry should he become a serious contender? Surely the homosexual rumors will be brought up and I’m sure lots of anonymous “male lovers” will be allowed to describe their liaisons with Perry.

    • gator_hoo

      If the accusers were threatening to bring sexual harassment charges, I can darn well guarantee you that what you call a “severance” includes a covenant not to sue. Ergo, it was a settlement.

      • seth90212

        You can’t have both. You have to file suit to get a Settlement. That wasn’t done, therefore Cain didn’t lie when he denied knowing about a (court ordered) Settlement.

        Every severance agreement incorporates verbiage that would enjoin the former employee against speaking ill of the company. Unless we see the agreement and see specific language pertaining to a specific harassment incident, we can’t make the jump you are suggesting. The severance agreements in and of themselves would have sufficiently constrained these women such that specific language would be superfluous.

        • Scope

          The accusers lawyer was specifically asked in the presser if it was a severance agreement, or a settlement. He explained the difference between both types and said definitively that it was a “settlement” that was reached because of the sexual harassment charges. He said that there were several instances of harassment and unwanted behaviors from Cain toward the accuser. The NRA also put out a statement that said that Cain denied the allegations at the time, and the lawyer answered that in his 40 years of representing clients against sexual harassment he never heard of one that was accused that said “yes I did it.”

          • Scope

            That Cain knows exactly what the charges were, which of course he would have had to to deny the charges. He also said that Cain did not sign the settlement, and therefore he is not bound legally from discussing the case. Of course he won’t. His camp put out a statement that they want to move on and get back to discussing 999. Of course he wants to drop it. The lawyer also reiterated that the settlement was signed 9/99.

          • Scope

            when the settlement was signed. Wonder when the charges from the second accuser were brought and settled by the NRA.

      • 1bunny

        was on CNN a little while ago. Says his client stands by her original allegations of sexual harassment of which there was very specific behaviors and unwanted advances made by Cain. And it was not a severance agreement but a settlement agreement for sexual harassment.

        • seth90212

          You people are quoting a lawyer representing his client as though he’s an unimpeachable source. I am still not convinced that it wasn’t a simple severance agreement. Cain’s lawyer has not looked at the agreement and drawn his own conclusions.

          I bet the reason for the lack of specificity in this has to do with the fact that these were “feelings” this woman had more so than any tangible provable incidents. Again, as someone familiar with sexual harassment law, all a women needs are “feelings.” And by saying this I don’t mean to disparage women who have legitimate complaints of workplace harassment. But this accuser makes life harder for women under real duress with this nonsensical document her lawyer put out. Let me ask you, why can’t she specifically state what it is that Cain is alleged to have done? It’s a joke. I hope she has enjoyed her 15 minutes, now she should get back to her psychotherapy and stop wasting our time.

  • onemovoter

    It is a poll that was taken mid October showing Mitt around 30% and is a PDF file. It was posted here on RS a couple of days ago when comparing Cain’s rise and Romney’s polling numbers.

    I think it was either goformitt or ryan or someone that supports Mitt.

    I forgot to save the link to the poll. I’d really appreciate any help in finding it.

    Thanks.

  • wilgolden

    You don’t like Herman Cain.

    Fine. Your perogative. I won’t object.

    But obsessing over, what are STILL anonymous accusations seems, to me, anyway, to be counterproductive, in the long run.

    I would like to remind you – Herman Cain’s poll numbers are still about where they were before the noise. That may change, but not yet. Further, his fundraising seems to be actually increasing.

    You go ahead, take the essentialy unsupported word of failed Washington Compost bloggers, who established Politico to say things that even the Compost though was over the top.

    Play into the hands of the Demoscum, and eat one of our own. That IS what they threw this out for.

    (As an aside – They will ALWAYS tell you who they fear most. Think on that, for a bit.)

    Never mind that, in an actually sexual harrasment suit, a SITTING PRESIDENT settled the case for over 3/4 of a million after he was acquitted. Folowing that, a settlement of 35 to 50 K is just “go away” money.

    Never mind that, if indeed, all the allegations actually made by these anonymous accusers were eventually proved true, they still don’t amount to much.

    Never mind that, the mouthpiece for the “lady” can’t get her to actually come forward.

    Never mind that this is all a fairly obvious “second bite” shakedown. One that is faling apart as we watch.

    We get it. You don’t like Herman Cain.

    But he seems to be still alive, and fighting back.

    Whatcha gonna do if he still manages to secure the nomination, hmmm?

    Gonna keep throwing red meat to the other team?

    Well?

  • boonerdan

    WOW, your favorite candidate must really be in trouble if you are competing with the Politico for the number of “hit pieces” on Herman Cain this week.

    Sure hope you are never accused of anything by “anonymous” accusers and need people to cover your back.

    To quote you, “There is no way under the sun this man gets my vote for any office at any time.” Please share with us who your chosen savior of the GOP is. Inquiring minds want to know. I wouldn’t vote for my own brother if you were supporting him.

  • traversecityconservative

    that I took Politico off my “bookmarks” list. Today it’s Redstate. I am really, really tired of the Cain bashing when none of you know any real facts about anything that happened. Like Mark Levin said, no names, no sources, no evidence and no documents. But that doesn’t stop your pro-Perry, anti-Herman posts every day. Reading Redstate is like reading the Huffington Post lately – I really can’t tell the difference. You’ll find out soon enough that no one wants Perry to be the candidate so have fun spinning your tales. Meanwhile, the “real people” out here who care about the principles of the Conservative movement will stick to people who won’t sell us out on illegal immigration or health care. Just like the Palin bashing this site relished in, now you’ve moved on to Cain. It was predictable, really. A lot of you say you stand for principle, but you don’t. You just stand for the slickest, best “packaged” candidate who won’t embarrass you. Cain and Palin embrace what we embrace and understand that our government needs to be of the people, by the people and for the people. Good luck with your shallow perception of what the country needs and who can bring it to us. – and don’t miss me too much because I certainly won’t miss you – well except Cold Warrior, because he’s the only one around here who gets it. Put up or shut up. If you’re not a precinct committeeman or woman, what exactly ARE you doing for the country except bitching?

  • horse

    Here’s a napkin, you got some spit on your lip while screaming for the lynching.

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