Mitt Romney Tells The Big Lie On Honoring Religious Conscience


what makes your conscience more important than Mitt Romney's whim? Not. A. Single. Thing.

Over the course of two election cycles I’ve expressed extreme discomfort at the idea of a Mitt Romney presidency. I have a lot of, to me anyway, good reasons. Boiled down to two, though, the are 1) a lack of evidence that he would govern in a way that can be distinguished from Barack Obama in the key areas of judicial appointments and controlling the regulatory impulses of federal agencies and 2) that the man has no compunction about lying about anything. For heaven sakes, he may be the first president in history, and certainly the only in my lifetime, to lie about his own first name.

The last (praise the Lord) debate gave Romney the opportunity to demonstrate both points. I direct you to this exchange (h/t to Boston Catholic Insider):

KING (Moderator): Governor Romney, both Senator Santorum and Speaker Gingrich have said during your tenure as governor, you required Catholic hospitals to provide emergency contraception to rape victims.

And Mr. Speaker, you compared the governor to President Obama, saying he infringed on Catholics’ rights.

Governor, did you do that?

ROMNEY: No, absolutely not. Of course not.

There was no requirement in Massachusetts for the Catholic Church to provide morning-after pills to rape victims. That was entirely voluntary on their part. There was no such requirement.”

Let’s take the easy part of this first. Romney states that Archbishop O’Malley voluntarily authorized the distribution to “morning after” pills to rape victims presenting themselves at Catholic hospitals in the archdiocese. He didn’t. No archbishop has done so or will do so. That should be pretty easy to figure out.

This, for those keeping score, is the typical egregious, grotesque, and totally casual lie so familiar to Romney observers.

The governance part is also straight out of the Obama playbook.

Just like Obama, he may personally not like to do something but gosh darn it, that’s just the way it has to be. Obama’s recent actions on forcing religious institutions to provide birth control services to employees regardless of the beliefs of the institution was played out by Romney in Massachusetts.

Read the Boston Catholic Insider article for the blow by blow but the short version follows.

A bill was passed requiring hospitals to dispense the Plan B abortifacient to patients. The bill was passed with the clear intention of retaining an existing law that provided a conscience exemption. In fact, Romney’s own Department of Public Health rendered that decision and Romney agreed.

Dec. 7, 2005: a week before the law was to take effect, the Boston Globe ran an article headlined,

“Private hospitals exempt on pill law“. The article said the state Department of Public Health had determined that the emergency contraception law “does not nullify a statute passed years ago that says privately run hospitals cannot be forced to provide abortions or contraception.”

“The staff of DPH did their own objective and unbiased legal analysis,” Romney’s spokesman told the Globe. “The brought it to us, and we concur in it.”

On the very next day, after the Boston Globe whined about the decision, Romney’s legal staff overturned the decision.

“On that basis, I have instructed the Department of Public Health to follow the conclusion of my own legal counsel and to adopt that sounder view,” Romney said. “In my personal view, it’s the right thing for hospitals to provide information and access to emergency contraception to anyone who is a victim of rape.”

with the Boston Globe reporting:

“Governor Mitt Romney reversed course on the state’s new emergency contraception law yesterday, saying that all hospitals in the state will be obligated to provide the morning-after pill to rape victims. The decision overturns a ruling made public this week by the state Department of Public Health that privately run hospitals could opt out of the requirement if they objected on moral or religious grounds.”

Let’s be clear what happened here. The Democrat controlled Massachusetts House and Senate passed the law with the intent of leaving previous conscience exemptions in place. Based on legislative analysis, the state Department of Public Health declared that to be their interpretation also. The abortion industry and the Boston Globe whined. Mitt Romney, personally, overrode the conscience provision because “[i]n my personal view, it’s the right thing for hospitals to provide information and access to emergency contraception to anyone who is a victim of rape.”

It is hard to see how conservatives can criticize Barack Obama for his decision that his personal desire to provide birth control outweighs any possible objection on the basis of conscience when Mitt Romney says he believes exactly the same thing.



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97 Comments Leave a comment

Well, they do think exactly the same way about "the government's money", streiff

lineholder (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 2:51PM EDT (link)

So it really isn’t all that surprising that they would throw objections of conscience and religious freedoms to the wolves in order to save a few bucks.

Case in point, remember all Romney’s comments about “free riders” and “how they weren’t going to allow it”? Because it’s the government’s money, like I said. That’s how they see it.

We’re just objects to serve the purpose of earning the government’s money. For the sake of fairness and equality and all that stuff. But they manage money so much better than we do, you know. /sarc

 

And It's Not Just Religion Where He Fibs...

Repair_Man_Jack (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 3:05PM EDT (link)

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/24/opinion/krugman-romneys-economic-closet.html?_r=1

He’s now Paul Krugabe’s most favoratist Republican.

Mr. Obama is pretending that an economic “recovery” is underway when he knows damn well that the banking system is just blowing smoke up the shredded *** of what’s left of that economy – James Howard Kunstler

the man is a liar

antisesquipedalion Saturday, February 25th at 10:59PM EDT (link)

he ought to be called that by Rick and Newt often. and have the facts ready when asked to elaborate. also when asked if they will endorse him if nominated they should say “I DON”T ENDORSE LIARS !!!”

 
 

Conflicts with his previous explanation

sethellis Friday, February 24th at 3:05PM EDT (link)

I remember this coming up on an interview with Hannity, and at the time his explanation was that his hand was forced by legal issues. This seems to be a more logical explanation that lines up with the events catholic insider describes. Some might disagree with that analysis of how it went down, but it’s certainly closer than what he said at the debate.

I would like to see the full text of his press conference where he explained his decision to get the full context.

 

Romney won't win

wantthegopback Friday, February 24th at 3:31PM EDT (link)

Romney will not win the general. More than anything else, that’s the arguement to defeat him now. To unseat a sitting prez the independents and swingers need a clear alternative. Romney has never, and will never be able to present himself as an alternative to those voters. Different, sure. Clear alternative, nope.

See Kerry v Bush.

Romney will not win the general in 2012. He mighta won in 2008, he might win in 2016. But this year it will not happen. So why in the hoooznits would we nominate him?

I’m a punk. Email me at ryantboyd@me.com

 

How can you tell when Mitt Romney is lying?....

Vegas_Rick (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 3:47PM EDT (link)

Come on, all together now.

“God is great, beer is good and people are crazy.”- Billy Currington

“Nothing in this world can take the place of persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful people with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan ‘press on’ has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race.” Calvin Coolidge.

There was a joke in the Philippines under Marcos

streiff (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 3:51PM EDT (link)

that went “what is the difference between George Washington, Richard Nixon, and Ferdinand Marcos? One couldn’t tell a lie, one couldn’t tell the truth, and one couldn’t tell the difference.” That is what we’re seeing here.

“What keeps me here is the reek of beer, the ladies and the craic”

 

He Stutters

rightland1111 Friday, February 24th at 4:47PM EDT (link)

When his lips are moving

anjinconsulting Friday, February 24th at 5:14PM EDT (link)

NT

Those who fail to learn history are doomed to repeat it. – George Santayana

No man has any more intrinsic right to offical station than another. Those who hold government jobs for a long time are apt to acquire a habit of looking with indifference upon the public interests, and of tolerating conduct from which an unpracticed man would revolt. – Andrew Jackson

 

When he's awake.

Locked and Loaded (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 6:21PM EDT (link)

He even lies to himself.

No GM, GE, or any GSE for me.

Don’t I have the right to do what I want with my own money? Or are you envious because I am generous?
Matthew 20:15 NIV

 

When he's wearing a tie

texasref (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 6:55PM EDT (link)

nt

“The medical director who performed the autopsy on Trayvon Martin found only two injuries on his body: the gunshot wound and broken skin on his knuckles. Welcome to the Duke lacrosse case all over again.”–Rush Limbaugh, 5-16-12

Next Step: Docket Sounding on 8-8-12
Final Step: Verdict of Not Guilty

 

A conservative, moderate, and liberal walk into a bar...

SoFiMil (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 11:45AM EDT (link)

…and the bartender says, “Hi, Mitt.”

This teetotaler loved that CPAC joke.

www.suvstrategery.blogspot.com

 
 

I sure am glad we are finally focusing on contraception

clintonformccain Friday, February 24th at 3:51PM EDT (link)

as such a major issue facing our great nation today. I was afraid that the 2012 election would get bogged down with all those minor issues like jobs and the deficit.

the issue is not contraception, the issue is religious liberty

streiff (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 3:54PM EDT (link)

if you can’t understand that much of the debate you really need to go someplace else voluntarily because your stupid, ill informed snark is wearing thin on a lot of us.

The jobs and deficit will fix themselves one way or another. Many countries have survived total economic collapse and rebounded — Germany did it twice in 30 years. No one has survived cultural collapse.

“What keeps me here is the reek of beer, the ladies and the craic”

I know what it's about...

clintonformccain Friday, February 24th at 4:13PM EDT (link)

I’m in favor of conscience provisions so that Catholic and other religious organizations do not have to provide services against their teachings.

BTW, I believe the way it works in Massachusetts, as Scott Brown described it when this was a big issue in the last Senate race: Catholic hospitals and or employees can exercise their religious beliefs and not provide contraceptives as long as they have a system in place to refer rape victims to other providers/facilities where that information is available.

It’s just a stupid issue. There is no reason at all that reasonable people cannot come up with solutions that respect everyone involved. Obama is a fool for implementing the policy forcing Catholic institutions to pay for contraceptive coverage. This should be a no-brainer non-issue. Instead, its exactly the kind of issue that politicians raise as a smoke-screen to distract us from seeing that they are robbing us blind. The fact that Obama is such a fool is the reason that I am so interested int the Republicans nominating someone who has a chance of beating him in November.

no, it isn't a stupid issue. It goes to the core

streiff (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 4:18PM EDT (link)

of our national character and the nature of the Constitution.

“What keeps me here is the reek of beer, the ladies and the craic”

It's a stupid issue only because the politicians are too braindead

clintonformccain Friday, February 24th at 4:33PM EDT (link)

to not come up with common sense solutions that respect religious freedom. I mean, is it really that hard to imagine solutions where anyone who wants contraception can get it without making the Catholic Church pay for it or hand them the package? I don’t think that would be that hard. That’s why it’s a stupid issue.

But, that’s the game, isn’t it. Politicians manufacturer hot-button divisive issues that don’t even have to become issues in order to serve as smoke-screen. While we all spend the next two years arguing about contraception regulations, the politicians will continue robbing us blind.

You never learned the first rule of holes, did you?

Aaron Gardner (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 4:35PM EDT (link)

Pull up, pull up!!

conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!

“We’d be much better off if We The People had desired small government enough to keep it.” acat


 

I think anyone who wants it can get contraception now.

Vegas_Rick (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 4:43PM EDT (link)

I haven’t heard that it has been banned for certain segments of our society.

It’s a product that costs money to manufacture and distribute, so if you want some you have to pay.

No solution required here.

“God is great, beer is good and people are crazy.”- Billy Currington

“Nothing in this world can take the place of persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful people with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan ‘press on’ has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race.” Calvin Coolidge.

The totally free kind is always available, as well.

Locked and Loaded (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 6:26PM EDT (link)

You really don’t even need one aspirin.

No GM, GE, or any GSE for me.

Don’t I have the right to do what I want with my own money? Or are you envious because I am generous?
Matthew 20:15 NIV

 
 
 
 

clintonformccain, at least we agree on one point...Obama is a fool

lineholder (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 4:27PM EDT (link)

for addressing this in the way that he has. But he seems to be intent to undermine anything that pertains to traditional values, and to replace it with the “new and improved” government-defined moral values system.

On that point, streiff’s response is accurate…it goes to the core principles on which our Constitution was founded…of respecting, protecting and preserving traditional values that serve a positive purpose in any society.

Also agree with you on the fact that the left is using this as a smoke-screen, although my reasons are a bit different. Obama really doesn’t have much of anything positive to run on that would appeal to people outside his own base (or even within his own base for that matter) Shades of “operation chaos” to serve as a distraction from pointing this out…I can definitely see them doing that much under the circumstances.

Of course he ginned this up as a smokescreen because he can't run on his record

clintonformccain Friday, February 24th at 4:37PM EDT (link)

That’s why I’m so frustrated that the Republican candidates cannot manage to keep their eye on the ball. Making this election about contraception is playing Obama’s game.

I’m hoping that the sooner there is a Republican nominee, the sooner somebody in the Republican party will finally decide to turn the guns on Obama.

Can't blame you for that, clintonformccain

lineholder (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 4:46PM EDT (link)

I want to see the emphasis placed on Obama’s dismal failures myself.

But all things considered, I’m seeing the extended primary in a positive context. Consider this…how vicious was Obama in going after Hilary Clinton? How much progress has been made to the socialistic agenda in three years? And how much more vicious is the left likely to be at this point in order to get more time?

All of this dirty laundry that has come out on Repubs during the past few months…it would have come out anyway, with a vengeance, in the general. At least, having it come out in the primary lets voters get innoculated to it, and hopefully it will be a strong enough dose for them to be immune to the insane, crazy, vengeful attacks we’ll be seeing against any Repub nominee when the general begins. If that takes place, then voters might develop enough resolve to simply ignore any attacks the MSM throws out there and stick with their conviction to vote Obama out of office. That’s what I’m hoping for, anyway.

But in the meantime, I hope they all start focusing on Obama more than they have. He is who have to defeat, ultimately…not each other.

 
 
 

There's *two* separate issues - each important: Religious liberty and Economic liberty.

SoFiMil (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 6:00PM EDT (link)

I don’t even think a business should be *required* to have open heart surgery covered in any health care plan they wish to provide. That’s should be the business’s call. And then the potential employee’s call whether to accept the terms of employment.

www.suvstrategery.blogspot.com

 
 
 

streiff beat me to it

Vegas_Rick (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 3:58PM EDT (link)

IT IS NOT about contraception, it is about religious liberty. The only people I have run across who cannot make this obvious distinction, are progressives.

“God is great, beer is good and people are crazy.”- Billy Currington

“Nothing in this world can take the place of persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful people with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan ‘press on’ has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race.” Calvin Coolidge.

serious risk of over-reaching on this one, though...

retrocon87 Friday, February 24th at 8:54PM EDT (link)

There’s a difference between the church not wanting to be forced to pay for contraception as part of insurance plans and the church refusing morning-after pills to frazzled women in hospitals who were just raped– which I think most people would generally consider to be just flat-out cruel… even if we think they should have the right to do it, championing the rights of religious organizations to do things that 90% of the electorate consider to be blatantly cruel isn’t necessarily a winning campaign issue, and we should probably acknowledge that while Obama screwed up as far as insurance coverage goes, if we try to take this thing too far it could wind up backfiring VERY EASILY.

It is not cruel

jdw4america (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 12:09PM EDT (link)

to not further victimize a woman who has already been victimized by a rapist.

Abortion is not a simple solution, ever. The best of intentions do not make the actions noble or even neutral. The “morning after” pill is an abortifacient which does not prevent pregnancy, it prevents implantation. The myth of the compassionate abortion needs to die.

555

MikeG (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 1:00PM EDT (link)

“The myth of the compassionate abortion needs to die.”

Amen!

 

hmmm

retrocon87 Saturday, February 25th at 2:14PM EDT (link)

Like most conservatives I am pro-life with exceptions for rape, incest, and life of the mother, and I support contraception. The extremely vast majority of woman do not feel in the slightest bit “victimized” by the morning-after pill, and the idea that it’s “noble” to force a woman to deliver her rapist’s child is something that even most conservatives disagree with you on… this message will win in November how exactly?

Are you paying attention?

Locked and Loaded (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 6:14PM EDT (link)

The only ones being forced here are the religious objectors to abortion delivery. Let the woman get it from someone who doesn’t mind dispensing it.

No GM, GE, or any GSE for me.

Don’t I have the right to do what I want with my own money? Or are you envious because I am generous?
Matthew 20:15 NIV

 
 
 
 
 
 

NO! The Issue is Lying!! Only Gingrich Supporters in Michigan Can Stop Him.

quill67 (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 4:03PM EDT (link)

Romney has a habit of lying. He is hiding his liberal record.

He did it to Gingrich in Florida and now he did it again last night.

If we stop him in Michigan, he is done. So if Gingrich supporters vote for Santorum in Michigan, we can fight it out on Super Tuesday without fear of LYING Romney.

not a habit a hobby

streiff (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 4:05PM EDT (link)

nt

“What keeps me here is the reek of beer, the ladies and the craic”

Funny :)))

quill67 (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 4:09PM EDT (link)

I think I get it…

poor==crazy…..rich==escentric
poor=habit ……rich==hobby

 

stre, try this one, not a hobby, just not important to him.

demsaresatanic Friday, February 24th at 4:21PM EDT (link)

So what if he lies to the unwashed masses so long as he can get away with it, he sees nothing wrong in it.

 
 

Of course he lies....

clintonformccain Friday, February 24th at 4:15PM EDT (link)

He’s a politician. That’s what politicians do. They twist their records to make them look good when they are running for office.

…. for Pete’s sake….

yeah, you got it, clintformccain!

goodgovernance Friday, February 24th at 4:27PM EDT (link)

It’s okay for our leaders to lie to us, and it’s our job to love it and get in line!

Look, while most politicians may exaggerate, stretch their records, or tell the occasional lie, with Romney you’ve got a difference of several orders of magnitude in terms of the whoppers he tells us.

This guy would lie, lie, lie and deny all throughout this campaign to get to the White House. And he’s avoided telling us why he really wants to be president like the Plague. So how can any of us believe he’ll behave even remotely like a conservative in office? And if he won’t even behave like a conservative in office why the heck would we nominate him? Who cares if he can get elected if he’s just going to act like Obama the Second?

IMO Obama is probably the worst President in the history of the US

clintonformccain Friday, February 24th at 4:46PM EDT (link)

So, It would be hard for me to imagine that Romney would not be an improvement.

I wish there were a better candidate. I’m not happy with the Republican field. But, it is what it is. I’ve got to go into the booth and vote for one of them a week from Tuesday. It is what it is. Those are my choices. You aren’t telling me anything I don’t know about Mitt Romney. He was my governor… for Pete’s sake. He’s slippery as they come. There’s no point in arguing the issues because he’s been on both sides of all of them. But, given the field, I don’t have any other choices. He’s the only one left who has even a remote chance of beating Obama.

He’s not crazy as a loon. He doesn’t have enough baggage to sink the Queen Mary. He has the gravitas to at be plausibly Presidential. And, the’s the only one left with a demonstrated capability to run a big league national campaign with big league national fundraising and big league national organization.

Looks like you've bought into

goodgovernance Friday, February 24th at 5:01PM EDT (link)

the “it’s about competence, not ideology” argument both Dukakis and Kerry made. Worked real well for them. I expect it will work as well for Romney in the general.

What is it about these politicians from Massachusetts?

I've never voted for John Kerry, the do-nothing gigalo

clintonformccain Friday, February 24th at 5:34PM EDT (link)

Not for President. Not for Senate. I don’t buy into any argument he makes.

As for Romney in the general election, I don’t think his chances are great. Maybe 50-50. Maybe 40-60. The Republicans are making a pretty big botch of this election cycle. But, again, it’s not about an ideal candidate. It’s about chosing among the candidates we have. I put Ron Paul’s chances of beating Obama at 0%. I put Newt Gingrich’s chances of beating Obama at 0%. And I put Rick Santorum’s chances of beating Obama at 0%. So that leaves me with one option to have any chance of beating Obama.

I’m not interesting in sending any messages to any establishment. I’m interesting in one thing and one thing alone: beating Obama in November. I’m under no illusion that Romney would be a great President. All I know is that he would be better than Obama who has a very bad combination of crazy loon lefty ideology and incompetence.

No, I don't think he would be better than

oldphart Saturday, February 25th at 3:58PM EDT (link)

Obama… and that’s not an endorsement for Zero either. It’s just that Mitt’s not that much different from Obama. Frankly, bad as Obama is, I’d rather keep him – an evil I already know and can provide for – than elect an evil I know little about – except that he lies, often when the truth would serve him better.

We need someone different – someone who tells the truth and isn’t afraid to face the MSM when it does all it can to discredit him… or her. We allowed the MSM to torpedo the campaign of the best candidate we’ve had in a couple of decades. Prior to that we sat on our hands in the past six or eight elections and let the media tell us who to vote for. We have been remiss in caring for our country and Romney won’t cure that.

I know there are those who feel Sarah Palin wasn’t a good candiodate for President… But who among the remaining four is better? I wouldn’t trust Romney to run a used car lot. Gingrich is more like Romney that he is different, desite his recent attempts to change. I honestly don’t know much about Santorum — except that he’s a politician. Ron Paul has some good ideas but I’d have to worry every time he dealt with a fireign leader.

Sarah dealt with foreign leaders without embarrasing us and she didn’t let political issues keep her from cleaning up the corruption emtrenched in the Alaska state government. And we let her slip away.

Well, I guess it’s true that we get the government we deserve.

 

How will Romney beat Obama, clintonformccain?

lineholder (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 11:36PM EDT (link)

And this is actually a sincere question. I don’t see him as having a path forward to win, and I mean none whatsoever.

If people do see a path forward for him to win, I wish they’d spell it out, in plain English, the what, why and how of it.

I am not a Romney supporter. That said ...

acat (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 11:49PM EDT (link)

it seems clear to me Romney’s plan is to do exactly what he’s done to the GOP contenders…

Be courteous but dominating in the debates – and there will be debates.

Attack the administrations’ positions, not the people (Obama) holding them.

Conduct a massive hit-piece-and-mudslinging campaign – via proxy, with enough cut-outs to leave the Romney campaign with some cover.

This could, if the economy stays south and *especially* if there’s enough of a revolt against another increase to the debt ceiling, push Romney over the top.

If the economy turns – I don’t see how it could, but … – Romney’s toast.

Mew

——
self-portrait

Caveat Suffragator

 

The fact that he is a squish makes Romney a dangerous general election candidate

clintonformccain Sunday, February 26th at 12:55AM EDT (link)

You have to understand that the broad center of American politics is very, very unhappy with the Obama administration. They can be peeled off if — and this is a huge if — the Republicans can offer a candidate who is

a) not scary
b) seemingly competent

In other words, the very things that make Romney insufficiently firey to the conservative base make him more attractive to the swing voters. He’s not a firebrand.

Look at it in the flip side. Would a centrist Democrat (if there were any left, but let’s say an Evan Bayh or an Ed Rendell) have a better chance of getting some votes from right-center swing voters or a hard core lefty moonbat like Nancy Pelosi?

Combine that with the ability to raise massive amounts of money from the business community and the fact that Romney has proven pretty effective at brass knuckles political attacks and I think there’s a possibility he could beat Obama. Generally speaking, whoever can seize the middle ground will have an advantage in a Presidential election. Unlike 2008, it is going to be pretty tough for Obama to fool anyone into thinking he’s a moderate.

The biggest downside? I ‘m afraid that the Republican base is more interested in making statements than winning elections. The sooner the party can get off this primary battle and turn the guns on Obama (which will unify and fire people up), the better. Romney needs to be on-message with a daily talking point hammering Obama — Fast and Furious, Solyndra, all day every day. The sooner the better.

 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

You can set your watch by Romney's lies now

goodgovernance Friday, February 24th at 4:21PM EDT (link)

This is infuriating, and depressing. How are we supposed to defend this man in the general when he’s caught lying then? I just wind up feeling dirty at the thought of supporting this phoney.

I don’t know about Michigan anymore. Momentum seems to be drifting back Romney’s way and Santorum didn’t even do the basics in deflecting the attacks. I’m still hoping for a Santorum win next week but even then, it won’t mean Mitt’s completely finished. It’ll just mean the playing field has at last been leveled, and Romney’s not the frontrunner anymore.

A Michigan victory might also mean the establishment Republicans decide to start bailing on him. In which case the establishment folks stop being a hindrance to the base and instead may work with us to achieve an acceptable outcome to all.

agreed. The thought of supporting Romney

streiff (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 4:23PM EDT (link)

makes me want to shower with scouring powder and battery acid.

“What keeps me here is the reek of beer, the ladies and the craic”

Eat your hearts out!

johnnyappleseed Saturday, February 25th at 7:43PM EDT (link)

Romney will win by 6-10 points in Michigan.
The reason most of you Romney haters don’t like the man is he is a Mormon.
So next Wednesday you will have to find some other long drawn out lie about him to chew on, keep making it up, no one is listening to the lies you left win bloggers are throwing out there

“The truth isn’t anything, it just is”….anon

Are you implying streiff is a left win(g) blogger?

Melody Warbington (rwm52) (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 7:57PM EDT (link)

And a liar and a bigot? As well as the rest of us who support Not Romney? Have you been here long? Have you read many of streiff’s diaries?

For the record, we don’t like Romney because he is a moderate and not a conservative. He refuses to disown Romneycare, and based on his judicial appointments as governor in MA, I don’t trust him to appoint justices like Scalia, Thomas, Roberts and Alito. Doesn’t have anything to do with his religion.

The woman saith unto him, I know that Messiah cometh (he that is called Christ): when he is come, he will declare unto us all things. (John 4:25)

 

have a nice life

streiff (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 8:35PM EDT (link)

be sure to tell us how it turns out.

“What keeps me here is the reek of beer, the ladies and the craic”

 
 
 
 

streiff, could it be that Romney actually grew even MORE pro-choice over time?

texasref (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 7:02PM EDT (link)

I mean, it’s a leap to the LEFT, if anything, to go from being pro-choice to mandating Christian health care providers to administer non-surgical abortions that violate their conscience. It’s the ultimate example of the phenomenon you’re talking about. I would just call it “Mittens Knows Best” (apologies to Robert Young).

I’m not supporting a nominee who in his most recent stint in public office shoved abortion pills down the throats of Christian hospitals and who would lose to Barack Obama in the general election ANYWAY (see numerous EE articles for the cite on THAT).

“The medical director who performed the autopsy on Trayvon Martin found only two injuries on his body: the gunshot wound and broken skin on his knuckles. Welcome to the Duke lacrosse case all over again.”–Rush Limbaugh, 5-16-12

Next Step: Docket Sounding on 8-8-12
Final Step: Verdict of Not Guilty

Romeny isn't pro-choice, he's pro-Romney

streiff (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 7:24PM EDT (link)

we’ve spent way too much time assuming this man actually believes in anything.

“What keeps me here is the reek of beer, the ladies and the craic”

5!

SoFiMil (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 8:23PM EDT (link)

NT

www.suvstrategery.blogspot.com

 

streiff, very recently he was BOTH

texasref (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 11:47PM EDT (link)

and I wouldn’t be surprised if he still is.

“The medical director who performed the autopsy on Trayvon Martin found only two injuries on his body: the gunshot wound and broken skin on his knuckles. Welcome to the Duke lacrosse case all over again.”–Rush Limbaugh, 5-16-12

Next Step: Docket Sounding on 8-8-12
Final Step: Verdict of Not Guilty

 
 
 

Come on Streiff, acknowledge the facts

AndrewHyman (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 7:08PM EDT (link)

I don’t care if you call Romney an arsonist and wife-beater if you can present the facts to back it up. But here you don’t present the facts, only the ones you like.

How about letting folks know about the VETO?

the veto is irrelevant

streiff (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 7:19PM EDT (link)

why is it irrelevant? Because the bill that was signed was the one the House, Senate and DPH said had the conscience exemption.

Nothing is hidden. The links, are provided.

I’lll leave the impulsive fellating of Romney to others and I must note, not even Romney’s stenographer at NRO, Katrina Trinko, have defended this. Send your commment to NRO, they’ll probably hire you.

“What keeps me here is the reek of beer, the ladies and the craic”

Thanks for the reply

AndrewHyman (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 7:32PM EDT (link)

Regarding fellatio, maybe it’s best to stick with contraception for the time being. I have not seen the text of the legislation that he vetoed, so I’m in no position to say whether it actually included a conscience exception or not. If it did, and Romney slanted it the other way, then your criticism is valid. Otherwise your criticism is not valid. Surely it matters what the text of the legislation said.

but you feel free to accuse me of hiding facts

streiff (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 7:41PM EDT (link)

this is why I’d rather crawl miles over broken glass than vote for Romney.

Obviously you are either unable of unwilling to read. If Romney said the following my critique is true.

.

“In my personal view, it’s the right thing for hospitals to provide information and access to emergency contraception to anyone who is a victim of rape.”

“What keeps me here is the reek of beer, the ladies and the craic”

Yup, it's always best to include facts

AndrewHyman (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 7:51PM EDT (link)

If you include facts and say why you don’t think they’re important then you would avoid thus kind of problem.

You’re blasting Romney for interpreting legislation in a way that omits a conscience exemption. Yet you failed to mention that he vetoed that legislation, which would have preserved the conscience exemption. That’s nit just relevant but extremely relevant.

Regarding your quote, it stated a PERSONAL view about what he thinks a nice hospital should do. Notwithstanding his PERSONAL view, he vetoed legislation that would have made his PERSONAL view into law.

Cheers.

that is such a pantload

streiff (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 8:15PM EDT (link)

1. Nothing was omitted. The oinly chronology that is important starts when he signed the law.

2. Read the story. I’m tired of you critiquing something you haven’t read. He overrode the legal opinion of his DPH to impose his personal view.

I’m through being baited on this. Take that for what it is worth. I’m sure you still have posting privileges at My Man Mitt or Why Romney.

“What keeps me here is the reek of beer, the ladies and the craic”

Romney Probably Was Wrong

AndrewHyman (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 8:43PM EDT (link)

Based on what I know, Romney probably adopted a bogus interpretation of legislation that passed over his veto.

The Boston Globe admitted: “The legislators failed, however, to include wording in the bill explicitly repealing a clause in an older statute that gives hospitals the right, for reasons of conscience, not to offer birth control services.”

If the Boston Globe’s admission was correct, then Romney’s interpretation was probably wrong. But I haven’t looked at the text of the statute, and this blog post does not discuss the issue.

I found out quick that sticking up for anything Romney has done is dangerous, because there 10 things out there that proves he is deceiving us

center77 (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 9:05PM EDT (link)

and for me, how can I ever go to bat for someone who will not even admit his crime to me. Romney is not worth anything to the cause, and his past action are a glimpse into a horrid future he would embark on if elected president. I must agree, this was a pantload, which I must confess is more colorful than I’m used to.

My name is Timothy Bladel. I’m from Davenport, Iowa. I am a Undergraduate, Double Majoring in Journalism & Mass communication, with my other major being political science. I am conservative in nature, sometimes a tad bit libertarian; the Tenth Amendment is vital to changing this country for the better.

Mitt Romney 2012, but not without the truth of who he is.

www.timothy-bladel.com

“We the people” tell the government what to do, it doesn’t tell us. We the people are the driver, the government is the car. And we decide where it should go, and by what route, and how fast.” Ronald Reagan’s farewell address (January 11, 1989)

 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

Thank you Streiff!

krish (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 9:12PM EDT (link)

for exposing exactly what happened! Lot of informed people on our side do not know the extent of Mittens liberal record in MA! Even, when he had the support of the people, he took the easy liberal route to please the Globe & Democratic members of the senate & representative. There are so many instances such as these in his record.

When Romney knew he was not going to run again in MA, hetried to move to the right because he knew he wanted to run for the President of USA! Also you have the facts correct & Romney told another (too many to count now!) whopper in the debates & Rick or Newt should have called him on it….frustrated with Rick & Newt for not pressing on it more! It is time to call Romney a liar to his face!

I have posted so many times on how conservative media (Rush, Hannity, etc.) & republicans will not call out Romney’s flip flops while Obama gets mentioned for flip flops every time!

Romney = John Kerry! He wil face the same fate!! Since there is no big difference between Romney & Obama – we should not feel so bad when Obama beats one more RINO! We should have our spirits up since a conservative did not lose to a socialist!!

I don't think it's a secret that Romney ran as a moderate Republican in MA

clintonformccain Friday, February 24th at 9:33PM EDT (link)

and tacked hard to the right when he started laying the groundwork for a national campaign. This is is a well-established fact. It’s not a new revelation. :)

 
 

Burning through campaign $$$, negative ad carpet-bombing, pairing up with Rue Paul

redmymind (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 9:26PM EDT (link)

Romney’s “ingenius” nomination strategy. People have GOT to wake up and see this fake for what he really is! Him and his anarchist lapdog pretending to be a libertarian of all things! Instead, what do the mindless masses do? They keep giving him a free pass.

The conservatives will AGAIN lose the nomination IF they don’t unite under ONE candidate but continue in their self-serving “go-it-alone” approach.

 

I'm shocked, shocked...

paulrobert Friday, February 24th at 11:19PM EDT (link)

…that Mitt Romney offered some insincere, dishonest account of his past and present for political gain.

Did I mention that I’m shocked?

I’m a not very clever retread.

paulrobert, 5

texasref (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 11:44PM EDT (link)

55555

“The medical director who performed the autopsy on Trayvon Martin found only two injuries on his body: the gunshot wound and broken skin on his knuckles. Welcome to the Duke lacrosse case all over again.”–Rush Limbaugh, 5-16-12

Next Step: Docket Sounding on 8-8-12
Final Step: Verdict of Not Guilty

 
 

Government should just leave people alone

dajeeps (Diary) Friday, February 24th at 11:36PM EDT (link)

There’s been a lot of talk lately about honoring religious conscience, but to me, Obama’s latest attack on the Catholic Church is just one more symptom that the Federal gov’t has usurped too much power from the states and the people, and wields it for mere political purposes. Unconstitutional dictates are just that, regardless of who or what is being attacked.

Romney has never voiced an opinion that most of the things government does are quite a stretch out of the bounds of enumerated powers. And so it really wouldn’t change much in the grand scheme of things if he should gain the oval office. He might just shuffle around the targets, but there’s always going to be someone getting slammed. The power is there to use, and it really shouldn’t be.

ObamaCare is a big one that really needs to go, as we’ve already seen the rehashing of the birth control debate when that’s just not government’s business, and it shouldn’t be be making medical choices for every man, woman and child in the country with a flick of the wrist, but there are plenty of others that need to go that have a huge impact on our personal liberties and carry subsequent economic effects, like the EPA, the NLRB, NTSB and many others. That’s not even mentioning what these do to the 4th and 5th amendments, and how people are harried and harassed for political reasons, like Gibson, for example.

Romney has been too busy sliming other candidates to even talk about these, except when he was cornered on ObamaCare. If you’re looking for someone who is going to get rid of the huge heavy hand of government, Romney probably isn’t the guy. For me anyway, it isn’t just about religious institutions, although I do not want them harassed either, I would really like to see most of that going away for everyone, no matter who they are.

…”I would quarrel with both parties and with every individual of each, before I would subjugate my understanding, or prostitute my tongue or pen to either.”
–John Adams

 

"Romney is..."

paulrobert Saturday, February 25th at 12:56AM EDT (link)

Flip Romney obviously is not in politics out of conviction. He has no ideology or convictions of principle, judging from his opportunistic positions and related rhetoric (including an abundance of fake passion and commitment, when on one side of an issue when politically advantageous, then on the opposite side when that is politically advantageous).

So what drives him? It could be a combination of patriotism and a belief that what we really need is a smart technocrat. But more likely it is simply pure ego derived from power and — perhaps even more importantly — the winning of power by gaining the approval of the public.

And that’s the biggest concern we should have about Romney (other than the sad commentary and example it would be for our society that such a blatant phony could be elected our leader). As soon as he is in office, he will make decisions based primarily (and to a much greater extent than with past presidents, even Clinton) on how deciding one way vs. another will affect his chances at re-election, because re-election will be the ultimate test and potential ego-feeding remaining for him in his life.

So, to a lesser degree than with any other candidate in history can we use his campaign positions and rhetoric as a reliable guide to how he would act as president. It all depends on how the political winds blow.

As Forrest Gump would put it, “Romney is like a box of chocolates. Ya’ never know what yer gonna get.”

I’m a not very clever retread.

 

The point is, every time he takes a money dump . . .

redmymind (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 2:32AM EDT (link)

the idiot voters fall in line for him like a bunch of mindless zombies. Are people really THAT stupid and incapable of critical or independent thought? Can’t they really see the piece of slime that Mr. Silver Spoon/Big Businessman truly is when they come across his negative ads? Have these folks no backbone or conviction, such as that of never settling for the Massachusetts liberal who wouldn’t last a second against a conservative in a fair fight?

If Romney and his unmanly, cowardly tactics make me sick, the folks who actually fall for him make me even MORE sick!

 

Hannity is right. Media is Dead and I need a foil hat.

trutexan Saturday, February 25th at 8:58AM EDT (link)

Question. Why didn’t King call him on the lie right then and there? Here was a perfect opportunity to point out the truth to all. Because unless King didn’t do his homework, he allowed the lie to stand as stated fact.

This just goes to show that if elected, Mitt will be allowed to say or do anything, truth or not, and the media will take a pass just like they do with Obama. Could it be that those companies (people) that own media outlets, and the souls of their employees, are forming the narrative of their version of the truth and vision for the world? The politicians and subsequently reporters, are just pawns in the game.

Ted Cruz (R) for Texas Senate.

Obama – Forward!
Proverbs 4:12-15
A naughty person, a wicked man, walketh with a forward mouth. He winketh with his eyes, he speaketh with his feet, he teacheth with his fingers; Forwardness is in his heart, he deviseth mischief continually; he soweth discord. Therefore shall his calamity come suddenly; suddenly shall he be broken without remedy.

Mitt gets a "pass" everytime because . . .

redmymind (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 11:14AM EDT (link)

1. The establishment thinks he’s the most electable.

2. The BHO machine thinks he’s the most beatable.

The way things are, we’re letting the lib media and the establishment rig this whole nomination for us . . . AGAIN.

Didn’t we vow that we’d never let this happen again in 2012? Have another McCain or a Dole run up against BHO?

Well, it’s happening, and the mindless masses are okay with that . . . AGAIN!

The constant message that is being spread is that a conservative can never be elected to the WH. The masses buy into this and start internalizing it into their core belief system, eventually shaping what they can expect and how they should respond: “Accept a fake like Romney because there is no other choice.”

Call it brain-washing or learned helplessness.

WHAT HAPPENED TO THE “FIRE IN OUR BELLY”???

 
 

Pretty mean spirited

kowalski (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 11:40AM EDT (link)

First he vetoes a bill, and his veto is overriden. Then he supports a new law that preserves the religious exemption and it doesn’t pass the Legislature. Then his legal counsel advises him to change course and he does, taking the advice of his lawyer. And then he makes a misstatement picked up by — of all places — the Boston Globe and you tar and feather him for it.

Maybe you should ask Nielsen why he advised the Governor that the “grandfathered” exemption didn’t apply. It could very well be that Romney really does believe that women who have been raped should have access to Plan B. I believe that, too.

If your daughter is raped tomorrow, what would you want?

Does the Catholic church

kowalski (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 11:42AM EDT (link)

I mean this sincerely, Streiff:

Does the Catholic Church talk about what happens when a woman who is raped is forced to carry the perpetrator’s child to term? Or is that a forbidden subject?

 

But I guess there are people who are very strict

kowalski (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 11:46AM EDT (link)

Who think that even rape victims – single rapes, gang rapes, multiple rapes, even young women held captive and raped – should be forced to carry the child to term. And on that basis, you’re right – Romney is a bad guy from their perspective. He wants their victims to have access to the morning after pill. What a horrible man he is.

 

I think you're failing to distinguish between policy and constitutional law.

SoFiMil (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 11:51AM EDT (link)

(Leaving aside the policy question.)

www.suvstrategery.blogspot.com

I probably am

kowalski (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 12:11PM EDT (link)

But what’s also missing from this condemnation is why Nielsen advised the Governor to change course. The articles that I’ve read, quoting people who most assuredly don’t like Mitt Romney, are also missing what the content of that legal advice was and taking the relatively easy route.

You know, he did veto the first bill (and it was overridden) and then he supported a second religious exemption measure (which didn’t pass.) But nowhere do we find the actual content of what Nielsen’s objections were except a relatively partisan accusation that they were “unprecendented and novel.”

The fact is that I don’t know the reasoning behind Nielsen’s advice to the Governor on this matter after two failed attempts to preserve the conscience objection. I’d like to know more about that. To my knowledge, nobody has interviewed Nielsen, they’ve just made statements about his interpretation second and third hand.

And I also find it puzzling and abhorrent that even at this late date, we can’t agree on the idea that if a woman is raped and requests Plan B she should have it. This all occurs, presumably, at a hospital where doctors can make a determination about whether or not she was, in fact, raped. I don’t know many women who would visit a hospital and claim rape just so they could get a pill when they can so easily get it in other ways.

Or how about this: the hospital arranges an ambulance to take the woman to a non-Catholic hospital so they wouldn’t be directly dispensing the drug?

This is one of those really tough areas, but it seems to me that in order to avoid the most harm to ourselves we should think about it some more.

Fair enough.

SoFiMil (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 12:28PM EDT (link)

You’re a good god-fearing man.

www.suvstrategery.blogspot.com

God is working on me

kowalski (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 12:54PM EDT (link)

I’m not an expert in anything, but it seems to me that there’s enough medical and religious knowledge involved here that accomodations can be reached that don’t cross people’s lines in the sand. I’m not an expert but I would be interested to hear Nielsen’s reasoning as to why Romney should have reversed his stance. Obviously it was a persuasive argument, and I’ll guess – just a guess – that it wasn’t some trifling or absurd example of legal reasoning. Given my experience here in the Commonwealth, it was probably well thought out and persuasive.

Now, Romney saying that it was always “optional” or “discretionary” is a clear misstatement on his part. I’ll agree with that much. It could be that in his “heart of hearts” he really does believe that women who are raped should have access to Plan B. I’m one of the people who agrees with that in general terms.

I have to say also at this point that just as a practical matter, women who want to abort a pregnancy have a lot of other options than just going to a hospital. With a little internet searching, any woman can find websites that offer advice about “traditional” abortifacients and techniques for inducing abortion in a recent pregnancy. Lots of fertilized embryos never implant because of what the mother/parents ate the night before or the night after.

God is going to judge them, too. And He will judge me. More surely than any doctor, lawyer or indian chief – or politician – will.

But what do you tell a 15 year old girl who was raped in the back seat of a car driven by her gangbanger boyfriend (or even better, by her uncle) when she comes to the hospital and requests Plan B? “No, sorry, you have to carry the child because we won’t give you because of Catholic doctrine. We’ll fix up your bruises give you something for the black eye, but you’re going to have that baby, miss.”

I can’t believe that’s what God would want.

Nielsen

AndrewHyman (Diary) Sunday, February 26th at 1:40AM EDT (link)

It would be interesting to see Nielsen’s opinion.

 
 
 
 
 
 

The child of the rape victim is a separate life . . .

redmymind (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 1:03PM EDT (link)

THAT is why he or she should not be aborted. Therefore, it is not a question of a woman’s right to her own body, which nobody questions. It’s the new human life within who is conceived through no fault of his own, regardless of the unfortunate circumstances, such as rape. The Catholic Church as always taught this . . . OPENLY.

What about the embryos

kowalski (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 1:11PM EDT (link)

What about the embryos that are conceived through a deliberate act of their parents and fail to implant into the lining of the uterus and are flushed down the toilet during the menstrual shedding? Does our religion therefore require us to collect menstrual ejecta and scrutinize it for unimplanted embryos that occured because someone forgot to mark the right date on the “rhythm cycle” calendar? I can tell you that those happen all the time, thousands of times a day across the world.

Does the Catholic Church

kowalski (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 1:15PM EDT (link)

Say those people who allow an embryo to be destroyed because it doesn’t implant go to hell as well? Even if they know the possibility exists with almost mathematical certainty? I know they do. Ron Paul knows they do, too. So does Rick Santorum.

So what does the church chalk that up to, bad luck?

 
 

And this is a very important question

kowalski (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 1:18PM EDT (link)

And what you’re really reaching for here is a very strict definition:

*EVEN* in the cases of rape, even in the most egregious cases of rape and abuse, the most disgusting, stomach churning and revolting cases on the books that we can find, we will not allow Plan B to be dispensed.

Frankly, I think that’s pretty sick. Particularly since a lot of fertilized embryos don’t implant *all on their own*.

kowalski . . .

redmymind (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 1:57PM EDT (link)

Looks like you’ve already made up your mind about the Catholic Church. No need to mask your resentments in the form of “questions.” It’s obvious where you’re taking this.

I’ll be glad to explain the Church’s position when you’re ready to have a serious discussion. Now, obviously, is not the time.

I'm ready when you're ready

kowalski (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 2:13PM EDT (link)

In fact you should discuss it here and now. I haven’t made my mind up about anything, I’m stating my opinions. If you have more persuasive opinions or things that you think I should read, by all means place them in the diaries. I’ll read them.

I'm neither a chauvinist for my...

kowalski (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 2:25PM EDT (link)

I’m neither a chauvinist for my Roman Catholic background nor am I a denier of it. In fact I enjoyed my religious background and later in life when secular education told me it was time to repudiate it, I reached more deeply for it. That doesn’t mean I can’t criticize it or state my opinions based on what I’ve really seen. And examples like the two I cited above with the gangbanger and the uncle aren’t figments of my imagination: they are real cases.

The real world is not an abstraction.

Just interjecting something here, kowalski,

westcoastpatriette (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 2:43PM EDT (link)

hope you don’t mind. Because I have a tendency to think like you are thinking in terms of the cruelty (my choice of words) in forcing a woman to carry a child that was conceived through rape–sometimes a rape that was brutal and horrendous in nature.

I have to add that I am not a Catholic and that is one of things I like about non-denominational or Protestant leaning churches is they tend to be less “top-down” in terms of making the rules for the faith. Instead, you are encouraged to study the scriptures for yourself and the primary burden is upon the individual to conduct their life as their conscience and scripture would instruct.

A few years ago, I came across a ministry where the pastor, who is Baptist, shared his life story. And he poignantly told of how his mother had been raped and that was how he was conceived. He never new his father but needless to say, he is very grateful that his mother did not abort him. Stories like this can help one to see that no matter how the conception occurred, there is still a human being that will be deprived of life through no fault of their own if the mother chooses to abort. Just some more food for thought as you struggle with your conscience.

Praise ye the Lord. Sing unto the Lord a new song, and his praise in the congregation of saints. Let Israel rejoice in him that made him: Let the children of Zion be joyful in their King. Let them praise His name in the dance: let them sing praises unto Him with the timbrel and harp. Psalm 149:1-3

Thanks WCP

kowalski (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 3:33PM EDT (link)

And I really mean that but under exactly the same conditions, physiology does this to people every day: it causes fertilized embryos not to implant and it also, on almost a random basis, causes embryos that might be fertilized not to be fertilized. I don’t have any troubles with my conscience.

Improving the chances of embryo implantation is a well-established branch of medicine. They’re doing that because they know a lot of them don’t. My conscience doesn’t struggle with that at all.

My conscience struggles with people who advocate that people don’t have control over their reproductive organs. They most certainly do.

If you'd like to read more about

kowalski (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 3:36PM EDT (link)

Some of the state-of-the-art in successful embryo implantation, you can have a look at this doctor’s website in Canada (there are many others.)

http://www.fertility.ca/2008/06/improve-your-chances-for-embryo-implantation/

Transvaginal ultrasounds, all kinds of interesting stuff. People want this kind of knowledge because of the fact that a lot of successfully-fertilized embryos do NOT implant and carry to term, just naturally. The way God intended it.

And I don't mean that as a joke against God

kowalski (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 3:45PM EDT (link)

At all. The fact is that lots of viable embryos – human lives, natch – don’t ever begin to grow because they fail to implant for a large number of reasons. Who knows which Mozarts and von Neumanns we’ve lost? Nobody. God knows. And God knows there are a lot of them.

 

I'm not sure what you are suggesting.

westcoastpatriette (Diary) Saturday, February 25th at 3:58PM EDT (link)

Is it that there is no difference in your mind between a spontaneous failure of the embryo to implant and preventing the same through contraception? Surely you see the difference. And I’m not sure why that would be offensive to you if any medical practitioner objected to administering abortifacient drugs on the grounds of conscience.

The medical practitioner or organization is not victimizing the patient by refusing to engage in procedures against their conscience and their needs should be respected as well as the victim of the rape.

It sounds like you are angry at the church for taking that position. But I am not sure why.

Praise ye the Lord. Sing unto the Lord a new song, and his praise in the congregation of saints. Let Israel rejoice in him that made him: Let the children of Zion be joyful in their King. Let them praise His name in the dance: let them sing praises unto Him with the timbrel and harp. Psalm 149:1-3

What I'm suggesting

kowalski (Diary) Sunday, February 26th at 2:50PM EDT (link)

Is a little bit more of a respectful discussion of what the realities in reproductive options are at this point in time vis-a-vis our religious obligations.

If we have medical techniques that improve the ratio of embryo implantation it’s clearly an act of human intervention to preserve an embryo that would otherwise have been destroyed.

We also have medical techniques that are designed specifically to prevent an implanted embryo from developing to term.

In each case, they are interventions – specific and clearly premeditated interventions – on what would have happened as the result of “accident” or as the result of God’s Will.

We don’t consider both sides of the problem even though we clearly act on both sides of the problem. Isn’t helping an embryo implant that would have been naturally destroyed absent intervention an affront in some way to God’s will? You cannot say that God wanted that embryo to live a-priori because you simply don’t know. In that case the doctors who improve embryo implantation rates are just as guilty of violating God’s will as those who provide Plan B.

And since the control of those options

kowalski (Diary) Sunday, February 26th at 2:53PM EDT (link)

Is only going to improve, we’re wrestling with a lot worse problem than juvenile attacks on people’s character.

Finally to bring one other thing up

kowalski (Diary) Sunday, February 26th at 3:33PM EDT (link)

There are a lot of people who read this blog who would look at the perpetrator of a rape (and especially one of the really egregious cases we don’t have to fully describe) who would say, with a completely straight face:

“The State should impose the Death Penalty. Kill that person.”

Which is the ultimate form of State power over life and death.

And in the same breath, they would say: “But the fertilized embryo cannot be subjected to Plan B.”

Which leaves us with the absurd result that we kill the individual who created the living embryo we are forced by religious conscience to preserve at all costs.

And yes I realize the embryo has no choice (nt).

kowalski (Diary) Sunday, February 26th at 3:41PM EDT (link)

Now you've gone over the edge, kowalski...

westcoastpatriette (Diary) Sunday, February 26th at 6:47PM EDT (link)

You are mixing up more than just apples and oranges….you’ve thrown in a few bananas and maybe a kiwi or two.

For starters, I thought it was understood from the getgo that God is very pro-life. The very first commandment given to mankind was to be fruitful and multiply…as in have lots of children.

Next, it is a given from scripture that God really, really, values life insomuch as letting us know that we are created in His image and that we are wonderfully made.

So, you are really twisting things to imply that it may be against God’s will to assist in the implantation of an embryo that might otherwise have naturally sloughed off to no end. That just doesn’t make sense.

Then to throw in references to the death penalty and try to compare that in any way to the discussion at hand has to be the all-time most scandalous straw man argument I have ever heard.

You seriously need to go back to the drawing board on this one.

Praise ye the Lord. Sing unto the Lord a new song, and his praise in the congregation of saints. Let Israel rejoice in him that made him: Let the children of Zion be joyful in their King. Let them praise His name in the dance: let them sing praises unto Him with the timbrel and harp. Psalm 149:1-3

 
 
 
 
 
 
 

Eve had "control" over the apple too

oldphart Sunday, February 26th at 10:50AM EDT (link)

and look where that’s brought us. God makes rules and leaves us to either obey or not. Which way we choose determines how he will treat us in the afterlife. It’s that simple. He gives you life. You control how it is lived. Choose wisely.

 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

Romney is the Presidential equivalent of Souter

disintelligentsia (Diary) Sunday, February 26th at 7:35PM EDT (link)

George H.W. Bush was told by Sununu that Souter would be a home run for conservatism but he was an unknown. Now the GOP insiders want to pretend that Romney is conservative and tell primary voters to ignore the man behind the curtain. They’re counting on voter ignorance to get someone who has no principals other than political gain in the White House.

I fear what kind of justices a President Romney will appoint. Romney stands against conservative positions on gay marriage, gun rights, and Obamacare (each issue will be on the Court’s docket in the next year or two) and I’m sure he’d vet any potential justice so they’d be people who will vote in conformity with his positions. We have three justices that will be 80 in the next Presidential term so who we have as President will have a huge impact on the composition of the Court for decades. We’ve already seen the kinds of people that Obama would appoint. Can we risk Romney?

“Our peculiar security is in the possession of a written Constitution. Let us not make it a blank paper by construction.” –Thomas Jefferson to Wilson Nicholas, 1803.